"Yet another Jedi survivor..."
I think people are taking Obi-Wan's "Luke is our only hope" line way too literally. Every time a new Jedi survivor is introduced, people are angry that is seems unrealistic and they quote the Obi-Wan line.
Obi-Wan is a character with limited information. Why would he know exactly how many Jedi survived Order 66? I think it makes perfect sense that more than a few Jedi survived. There were around 10,000 Jedi before Order 66. Even a 99% success rate for the purge would leave roughly 100 survivors. That's not unrealistic.
But were there any Jedi left who could defeat Vader and Palpatine?"
By the time of the Battle of Endor, most surviving Jedi were either dead, in hiding, cut off from the wider galaxy, or otherwise unable to challenge the Empire. To explore that question, I put together a list of known survivors of Order 66 who were still alive up to the Battle of Endor. (including jedi trained after Order 66, force users, inqisitors and dark side users)
The list is probably incomplete, and every name was sourced from Wookieepedia. Feel free to point out anyone I may have missed.
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💜 - Jedi trained after Order 66 or Force Users
💚 - Jedi probably surviving up to Battle for Endor
⚫ - Jedi that left the order
🔴 - Jedi and dark users, that survived the Order 66, but died up to Battle for Endor
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💜Ezra (Not available at the time)
💜Sabine (Not jedi at the time)
💜Youngling Grogu (Still a baby)
💜Leia (Not trained)
💜Omega (Still a force user but not trained)
💜Luke
💚Ahsoka (Not available at the time)
💚Reva Sevander
💚Lyn RakishVelerie Tide (4th Sister)
💚Padawan Devon Izara
💚Ventress
💚Padawan Lyco Strata
💚Padawan Gungi
💚Cal Kestis
💚Master Oppo Rancisis
💚Master Coleman Kcaj
💚Master Kelleran Beq
💚Master Quinlan Vos
⚫Knight Baylan Skoll
⚫Shin Hati
⚫Youngling Mill Alibeth - Became Bounty Hunters
⚫Youngling Vivert Stag - Became Bounty Hunters
🔴Darth Maul
🔴Master Eeko-Dio Daki
🔴Grand Master Yoda
🔴Master Eno Cordova
🔴Master Prosset Dibs
🔴Master Kirak Infil'a
🔴Master Obi-Wan Kenobi
🔴Master Taron Malicos
🔴Master Vanzell Mar-Klar
🔴Master Jocasta Nu
🔴Master Klefan Opus
🔴Master Elan Rast
🔴Master who became the Seventh Sister
🔴Master Tera Sinube
🔴Master Luminara Unduli
🔴Master Uvell
🔴Knight/Jedi Temple Guard the Grand Inquisitor
🔴Knight Iskat Akaris
🔴Knight Bode Akuna
🔴Knight Dagan Gera
🔴Knight Grandea
🔴Knight Cere Junda
🔴Knight Pablo-Jill
🔴Knight Charlin Plaka
🔴Knight Tensu Run
🔴Knight Masana Tide
🔴Knight Tualon Yaluna
🔴Padawan Ryza Ayre
🔴Padawan Ferren Barr
🔴Padawan Caleb Dume
🔴Padawan Nedriss Narr
🔴Padawan Trilla Suduri
🔴A Rodian youngling
🔴Ahmar
🔴Zubain Ankonori
🔴Dante
🔴Pan Delesec
🔴Eighth Brother
🔴Eleventh Brother
🔴Selrahc Eluos
🔴Fifth Brother
🔴Khandra
🔴Ka-Moon Kho
🔴Marrok
🔴Mususiel
🔴Nari
🔴Nuhj
🔴Jed Uhron
🔴Unidentified female Inquisitor
🔴A human Jedi
🔴A Jedi
🔴An Unidentified Jedi
🔴A Zeltron Jedi
🔴Bil Valen
🔴Former Master Eeth Koth
🔴Former Knight Barriss Offee
🔴Former Padawan Heezo
🔴Former Padawan Naq Med
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So, this list gives you approximately 70 Order 66 survivors. By the time of Battle for Endor, most of them are hunted down by Vader or Empire. You get maybe only 13 survivors. Out of Those 13, only 2 are certain to have survived up to the Battle of Endor. Rest probably died sooner, but we dont know their fate.
💚Reva Sevander (Probably dead by time of Endor battle)
💚Lyn RakishVelerie Tide (Probably dead by time of Endor battle)
💚Padawan Gungi (Probably dead by time of Endor battle)
💚Master Oppo Rancisis (Probably dead by time of Endor battle)
💚Master Coleman Kcaj (Probably dead by time of Endor battle)
💚Master Kelleran Beq (Probably dead by time of Endor battle)
💚Master Quinlan Vos (Probably dead by time of Endor battle)
💚Padawan Devon Izara
💚Ventress
💚Padawan Lyco Strata
💚Cal Kestis
⚫Knight Baylan Skoll
⚫Shin Hati
So when Obi-Wan talks about Luke being the only hope, he just does not know about the 2 to 13 surviving jedi. Is that not realistic? 13 surviving Jedi does not ruin stakes of ROTJ. Most of those were weaker and could not defeat Palpatine or Vader. So Obi-Wan was right!
Comments Section
Obi-Wan just thought the others were ineffective weaklings that didn't stand a chance.
That makes sense
I don't know that Obi-Wan think of Quinlan as weak, but that guy has other things going on. Not to mention his last assassination mission didn't exactly go well and probably left traces...
I don't think he think of Ventress as weak either but Ventres is crucially not a Jedi.
Obi-Wan also had no idea Ventress was alive.
Last he knew she was killed by Dooku and buried by Vos.
Maybe, we all interpreted like Obi Wan was saying Luke was the last one, but what he meant was that he was the only one who could match Vader's power and defeat him. He knew about Leia obviously, for some reason... he didn't consider her.
Maybe he wasn't considering other possible Jedi that were around.
It still kinda weird that none of those Jedi got really involved with the Rebellion. I don't know many of those mentioned in the list. But still. It's not Obi Wan's quote that irks me, it's the fact that them being around and not doing anything is kinda strange.
Yeah, Ahsoka feels most weird being absent around time of ESB or ROTJ. but rest of them not so much, they were most likely dead by that time.
I think it's possible that many people of the Galaxy dont exactly trust the Jedi. Even if they are against the Empire, they were still wary of the Jedi coming back and interfering in Galactic affairs, as they did before. So it's no wonder they might be generally skeptical of any surviving Jedi being among the Rebellion ranks.
There was certainly the Path and what Cal Kestis and Quinlan Vos did, but it's also likely it was liquidated by the Inquisitors and Vader
Perhaps some did try to offer joining, but Bail probably advised them to stay out because of the growing heat
I took it that at the point where Obi-Wan remarked that Luke was their last hope (ESB), Luke had already had around 3 years of informal Jedi training by Obi-Wan and Yoda, while Leia had obviously had zero. Given that the Empire had already managed to complete a working Death Star 3 years prior, and were about to finish a second one, attempting to "start from scratch" and begin training Leia in the Force may have been way too late before the Empire consolidated ultimate power over the galaxy.
They need to bring Kyle Katarn back.
Somehow Kyle Katarn showed up.
It's that easy.
I would love to see that badass again!
I don’t understand why we would think that a purge is instantaneous. Of course some survive. And as you say, most die at some point. So they don’t actually survive the purge.
Yeah, Jedi were all across the galaxy. It makes sense, that they cant kill everybody at the same time
Yeah, it's not as though Obi-Wan and Yoda had, I don't know, some kind of psychic Force that might give them information...
Maybe they used Space Facebook and saw, that no other friends were active anymore, haha
Well Obi Wan probably didn't know and most of them refused to continue training in fear of the empire. They hid themselves among nlrmal people changed theri names and stopped fighting.
I always thought it was a reference to Luke / Leia being the only ones with the potential power to stop Palpatine and Vader
The problem here is intent. George Lucas didn't made the original movies with the intent that there is a galaxy chock full of Jedi. Of course over time while working on something, things can change but the three movies still made it very clear that the viewer should know, that Luke is the Alpha and Omega, the last of the old order, the first of the new.
It's not exactly great to retroactively say the characters either lied or had no clue. You can do that once with Obi-Wan and Vader but it's not great if it becomes a theme. Suddenly you have to question everything originally on-screen, instead of just one scene.
Its also Lucas who came up with the number of Jedi being at around 10,000 by the time Order 66 happens. So even IF there are 70 Jedi/active force users around by Endor, that's still a tiny amount in comparison, and they'll be each doing their own thing.
Also, Yoda knows that other Jedi are alive, but he understands that keeping their secrets keeps them safe, so he may not have shared that information with anyone. He may have told Force ghost Kenobi, because who is he going to tell? Or they may have agreed that this was a job for the Chosen One, of whom, they had two candidates.
The "only hope" is not because Luke is some Rey in the Force. The meaning of the line is that Luke is Vader's son. Luke is the only being, other than Leia, who could crack Darth Vader and bring out Anakin.
Why is Maul and Darth Maul on the same list?
Oh, my mistake
It's about the bloodline
“When gone am I, the last of the Jedi will you be” -Yoda
“…except the other dozen or so ones running around, and Ashoka but she isn’t in the Jedi order anymore so she doesn’t count anyway. Yea. Besides them. The last you are”. -Yoda probably
The obvious problem with all of this is that there is plenty of other stuff added to the canon in recent years that make it so Obi-Wan definitely SHOULD have known about the other Jedi.... and eventually it gets to a point where there were easily enough survivors for them to have regrouped and attempted to defeat Palpatine, instead of all just running off into hiding.
We just have to accept that at the time of the OT, the Jedi weren't supposed to be a massive "Order" with many thousands of knights... they were supposed to be semi-nomadic space monks that were few in numbers. Lucas changed them into more of an established organization as time went on and now Disney has decided that a somewhat comical number have survived over the years. Each individual story is fine... but it's really best not to think too much about if it all makes sense together.
Nobody address the retirees and Jedi training washouts no doubt scattered all throughout the galaxy and beyond. All still force sensitive and still able to pass on what they have learned.
In my opinion, Lucas should never have made the Jedi extinct.
Sure, their numbers could take a hit under the Empire's reign. But, imagine if there was a score of Jedi Knights in the Rebel Alliance. Luke could train with them, but still seek out Master Yoda for advanced knowledge and wisdom.
The problem was making them a religious sect, a police force, and a de facto branch of the government. They should have been a small group that would mostly go unnoticed. They should have been loners mostly, sort of like a cowboy or samurai. Once Lucas introduced all of the lore and rules accompanying what a Jedi is it lost a lot of its magic. Imagine how great a smaller story of Anakin and Obi-Wan as friends could have been. Obi-Wan as the straight shooting Luke Character and Anakin as a bad boy Han Solo. Introduce Padmé as the woman they both fall in love with.
Jesus Christ.
Yeah even Jesus will end up on this list.
Rahm Kota and Starkiller?
I included Canon, not Legends, that would be hard to do 😃