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all 159 comments

[–]phoenixmatrix 253 points254 points  (6 children)

"As usual, prioritize gender fluid (?) cats, keep an eye on the Bi, and shun the gays. Prioritize horny cats and cats younger than 15, punt the celibates immediately." 

Damn that paragraph is cursed.

[–]dangerouslyreal 56 points57 points  (1 child)

I knew it'd be cursed when I read "incest is the way..." I was like WTF?? Then I saw the sub I was like... well... ig

[–]roguealex 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Should see the crusader kings subreddit lmao

[–]Yum-z 32 points33 points  (2 children)

This is nearing /r/shitrimworldsays levels of degeneracy and I’m all here for it.

[–]TheAhegaoFox 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Wait this isn't rimworld?

[–]Wild_Marker 7 points8 points  (0 children)

No silly, it's Crusader Kittens.

[–]CptSpringareHunter 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Sounds like a classic crusader kings of dwarf fortress post. So a sign of excellence.

[–]DotaWemps 32 points33 points  (9 children)

Nice guide thanks!

I just unlocked act 2 by throwing random cats on adventures. Would you say its smarter to start thinking of breeding more now, or keep on playing with what I have?

Is it better to grind more furniture and items in act 1 or bang head to wall in act 2?

[–]Meowonita[S] 29 points30 points  (7 children)

Depends on how much you tolerate grinding, tbh. I’ve been grinding act 1 just so I can get breeding sorta out of my way (and makes act 2 easier), but it sure gets boring farming Dybbuk over and over again…

I can’t sleep without having them kitty bones playing in my head and I hate it aaaahhh

[–]mama_tom 8 points9 points  (4 children)

Ive only just started grinding at 2 and going the sewer route definitely felt better. I fucking hated killing Dybbuk.

[–]king-hunter420 0 points1 point  (3 children)

i’ve heard quite a few people complain abt him but i seriously didn’t have an issue at all with him. killed him quite fast by stacking bleed and thorns on him with my tank and thief took him out in like 3 rounds

[–]SchwiftySquanchC137 -2 points-1 points  (2 children)

I dont get the frustration with this boss either. Ive never even thought about building around him. Worst case you literally just surround him. And are you telling me not a single character has some kind of friendly spawns or AOE or tile effects or something to deal with him? Sounds to me like people are making generally bad build decisions if you dont have any of this stuff, having some way to deal with groups of small enemies or blocking enemy movement is kinda a must. You cant just focus giant single hits on every single character.

[–]mama_tom 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If I have an hunter on my team, please tell me how to both surround him an also attack him with that unit. I guess hunters arent great for Boneyard, but then you are building around him. Additionally Wizards are also probably not great since they have big aoe spells that will hurt your team.

Ive wiped against him once because the unit that killed him was absolutely cracked when taking multiple turns and the units I had spawned to help were beating him up, meaning he got killed with the rest of my team.

My annoyance with the boss doesnt stem from difficulty in the sense I have a hard time killing him period. It's just a pretty annoying process to corner him and hit him for 6 before his ass hops away the next turn.

[–]MixDistinct1932 0 points1 point  (0 children)

cornering him is annoying but usually manageable, the real frustration is when he jumps into one of your cats and manages to wipe your whole party before you can do anything about it

[–]Substantial-Crazy441 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I just usually grind spinerette, I've found chubs and nubs a bit difficult to handle.

[–]FullMetalFiddlestick 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You dont know how long I thought the lyrics were "Punch that kitty " cause boy do i wanna

[–]RaspberryFormal5307 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I would suggest starting work on getting a breeding stud with all or mostly 7s and ignore mutations/skills for now and just work on that as you progress act 2

[–]homeskilletsam 36 points37 points  (8 children)

More Bane plz

[–]Meowonita[S] 55 points56 points  (7 children)

<image>

My queen!

[–]Meowonita[S] 48 points49 points  (2 children)

[–]Yum-z 6 points7 points  (1 child)

Omfg the fluff ear extenders are so cute! Is she a Maine Coon?

[–]Meowonita[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yeah :D

[–]Pandelol 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Oh my god she is majestic

[–]maggyneverforget 5 points6 points  (0 children)

oh wow what a unit of a cat

[–]MyNameIsSkittles 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Now that, that's a cat! Goddamn what a majestic beast!

[–]Kidneythump 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That is only big boy/girl, maine coon?

[–]Drowsy_Deer 62 points63 points  (43 children)

I just got wiped by Guillotina 3 for the third time, maybe I’m not meant to be a mewgenicist.

[–]Meowonita[S] 52 points53 points  (27 children)

Try do some runs with less cats (or use the Neverstone, which you are guaranteed to get from halfway cats). It will give you stronger veteren cats with higher levels. Also - Hunter and Cleric. Hunter and Cleric are the strongest class of the game.

[–]deadrebel 24 points25 points  (17 children)

Once I discovered 3 cat runs, I never did 4 cat runs. I know they say it's arguable which is best, but I don't buy it 3 cats trumps 4 everytime.

[–]CalligrapherExtra138 6 points7 points  (1 child)

What’s the comp, Tank Cleric Hunter?

[–]S417M0NG3R 10 points11 points  (0 children)

I do hunter, thief, cleric, tank, neverstone on the worse of the cleric or tank. Cleric or tabk are usually tanky enough with items at level 1 to take fire while the DPS take out the other team. I usually use the neverstone as an off tank.

[–]beardyblue 7 points8 points  (9 children)

Why is a 3 cat run so much better in your opinion?

[–]UnlitBlunt 18 points19 points  (5 children)

They level up more/faster. The exp is split 3 ways instead of 4.

[–]JudgementalMarsupialCleric 1 point2 points  (4 children)

Is it enough to get fully upgraded all abilities? Or would you need even fewer cats for that

[–]BulbaThore 6 points7 points  (3 children)

If you want to pump levels. as an example. I had a beanies side quest item that I accidentally gave to my tank. it was cursed and only he could level. I finished the boneyard with 3 dead buddies and and one lvl 22 tanky boy

[–]Kidneythump 1 point2 points  (2 children)

What happened at the end of the run when your tanky boy got possessed?

[–]JudgementalMarsupialCleric 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Dybbik damages it a bit then jumps back out

[–]kilowhom 1 point2 points  (0 children)

First, if his level ones were just dying every fight and not dead dead, the tank wouldn't get possessed at all, because Dybbuk prioritizes possessing dead cats.

Second, if the tank was really alone, Dybbuk will jump into the lone cat, take one turn, then jump back out and can be killed as normal. I've done it a couple times

[–]Hugogs10 2 points3 points  (1 child)

With 3 cats you can improve almost all abilities passive you care about. I think 2 cats you could basically max them out.

[–]The_Irish_Hello 0 points1 point  (0 children)

There are 20 guaranteed levels from alley through caves easy path. I think the hard path gives an extra fight each (idk)

[–]deadrebel 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It's not only the higher levels from more concentrated leveling, but that is a big reason.

Other reasons are with less cats, you have less random issues - all the RNG/chaos in the game that can come into play, with less cats you have more controlled outcomes.

Also you have better cats at the end of the run, so can defend against Lettie easier - I always take 4 cats to defend the house, and each of them are stronger from a 3-cat run than they'd be typically.

I think a lot of people struggling to progress should try out a 3 cat run to see if that'd help them feel more control.

[–]AdmiralBKE 1 point2 points  (4 children)

The game does keep on giving me a 4th car halfway during the run.

[–]deadrebel 6 points7 points  (2 children)

Typically they come with a neverstone which can stop them from levelling - if not, nothing wrong with murdering them. :>

[–]Meowonita[S] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

4 cats + 1 neverstone is even stronger than 3 cats. I very often bring an unfortunate stray out just to murder them so I can keep a neverstone in stock ;-)

[–]deadrebel 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Now this... I'm going to try. I had a neverstone once, but the stray that had it died and I've not got another since. Never thought to bring a sacrificial lamb. >:)

[–]Geageart 1 point2 points  (0 children)

that's because one of your starters died

[–]Drowsy_Deer 7 points8 points  (4 children)

I had an overpowered leech build but those damn maggots are too much man.

[–]OmegaXesis 4 points5 points  (3 children)

I went into the Guillotina #3 fight with a level 22 Necro cat and 3 level 1 cats. It was still hard as hell, because my level 1 cats couldn't hold their own for long.

If I brought higher level cats with my necro it would've been a lot easier. I finished that fight at Turn 17 of exhaustion just barely. I ended up killing Guilotina, needed to take out that giant maggot.

[–]frvwfr2 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Why did you fight Tina with 3 level 1s?

[–]OmegaXesis 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I was being a dummy and sent my veteran cats to retirement so I could get the next room unlocked.

And I saw some posts on here where they said they were able to solo Tina with a high level cat.

Except what I failed to realize is that they solo’d either Tina 1 or Tina 2.

Tina 3 fight is even harder.

Even though I took 4 cats into it, it was really just a battle of attrition with my level 22 necro cat who was putting 4x sleep on the main body, while summoning leaches.

While my other 3 attacked the head.

But then momma maggot came out and killed my 3 cats.

So then I moved my necro cat into summoning corpses and continued summoning leaches while I used “mothers knife melee” with a trinket that let me use melee 2x times.

That let me finish off the body and head. But I was around exhaustion 14 at that time. And now had to take out momma maggot and her kids.

And finally around turn 17 I finished off momma maggot, with just a sliver of health remaining. Then her remaining kids “fled” the fight after momma maggot died. So I got lucky because if I had to finish the kids too my necro wouldn’t have survived the exhaustion damage.

[–]Drowsy_Deer 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I simultaneously hate and love Mama Maggot at the same time because her design is hilarious, but her mini-boss gimmick is extremely annoying.

[–]Substantial-Crazy441 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Hunter at lv 12, and Necromancer at lv 16 are broken classes. Ofc the grind is all the more difficult for a good necromancer I usually don't care enough, as 2 lv 12 is usually enough

[–]Soulfreezer 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Cleric? Really? What makes you think that?

[–]Meowonita[S] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

The fact that it’s the only real healer of the game with much more reliable cleanse and revive, can do insane damage with certain combos, and allows for some infinity strats team with some other combos. Cleric will wipe the floor for you in a good run and save your ass in a bad one, all the while the rng pool being mostly useful skills unlike say… mage and tinkerer.

[–]Wild_Marker 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Also Wrath of god is a very consistent map-clear for when you have to fight lots of things which having less turns yourself can be a big issue.

[–]smshing 11 points12 points  (0 children)

You can send in a stray or shitcat and concede the fight, the rest of your "colony" is fine.

[–]Ok-Store-3742 2 points3 points  (8 children)

I recommend having a necromancer with Soul Link or Soulbond. It is a huge damage multiplier.

Hunter is almost a must as it has the highest DPS.

Cleric is obvious, get him Healing Aura passive and stack regen items on him or have a ranged healing ability and high mana regen.

Tank is good just from how much health it has. It is better if you have knockback.

Make sure every cat has at least 28 basic hp, more if you can. If they have less they could die before you manage to heal them.

[–]Drowsy_Deer 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I’m currently beginning to breed 7 Con into my cats consistently, but I think I should focus more on getting my furniture improved.

[–]Ok-Store-3742 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I managed to do this with my cats that had average starting Con of 5, they were one of my earlier cats. It is definitly doable with right abilities and items.

Give items with brace on cats with low HP.

Cleric, tank and I think necromancer get Constitution on level ups. You should just prioritize picking Constitution in level up upgrades on the classes that don't get on it level up itself, like hunter. Or give those classes to cats with high starting Con and classes that give you Con to cats with it starting low.

If you are concerned with stats, just do a 3 cat run in The Alley. That way you also have a better chance to get good abilities.

I beat The Moon recently with cats 5,5 starting stats average. I have no knowledge of breeding and was just doing things my way. I joined this sub today and finally figured out what I should be doing.

[–]ImpossibleEstimate56 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Spina Bifida Hunter with, Marked + Heavy Shot/Scatter Shot and Teleportation ability is goated.

[–]Ok-Store-3742 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Bulls Eye is also good with Heavy Shot. Rubber Arrows would be OP on Guillotina 3. Though it all depends on luck. It is easier to get one strong passive then get a synergy on the same cat.

[–]i_706_i 0 points1 point  (3 children)

How does the soul link/soul bond build work? Do you have to have some other ability that lets you down yourself to combo with it?

[–]Ok-Store-3742 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Soulbond gives soul link status on your basic attack. Soul Link is a spell that gives a soul link status effect.

Whenever a soul linked character loses health, all soul linked characters lose that health as well. You don't have to have anything else to activate it or combo. You just put units under the effect and all units take the damage the other unit takes.

I put the status effect on both the head and the main body of Guillotina and dealt damage to them both at the same time. Damage from soul link on the head doesn't activate main body charge like if you hit it directly. Later I soul linked the body with the maggot boss.

Edit: It basically doubles your damage output, you can also put more units under the effect to deal with the upgraded maggots while still dealing damage to the bosses.

[–]i_706_i 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I get it now, thanks. I for some reason thought it soul bonded them to you, so then any time they took damage your cat would take damage too. So you'd have to have some sort of self damaging combo or very tanky cat that could take it.

[–]Ok-Store-3742 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You can technically do that. I almost lost a run on the desert because my necromancer was charmed by Marshmallow and soul linked 2 of my cats and they were soul linked to the boss.

[–]cyrusjhames 1 point2 points  (0 children)

i did it with 2 hunters,cleric and tank

A hunter- fire shot+ with curse item that gives you 4 additional turn in first round but never moves again in subsequent rounds.

B hunter- hunter's boon+, rubber arrow and scatter shot+

cleric- circle of protection+

tank- pincushion+, chew, flip flop

[–]Substantial-Crazy441 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I always take lv 11-12 kitties for Guillotina, Unless the run is royally fucked by stupid events, these are usually stacked with broken abilities that when paired together can anhilate any home boss

[–]SchwiftySquanchC137 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I had a guy with the passive that does 50 damage to the boss, plus a mini me, so I got 100 damage off before the battle even started. He picked up the head once and then I killed it.

[–]Drowsy_Deer 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I finally managed to beat the boss by using Soul Link and a thief with built in poison basic attacks.

[–]Ok-Recover977 47 points48 points  (10 children)

did you know that inbreeding between cousins isn't even that bad and there are several US states where it is legal to marry your cousin?

[–]Meowonita[S] 59 points60 points  (6 children)

I mean, inbreeding is exactly how we get domesticated animals and plants with desirable traits. It enforces positive traits as well as negatives. The issue with human inbreeding is just that we cannot get rid of the breedjects as… ethically…

[–]Manoreded 23 points24 points  (5 children)

Yes, that is why pure breed dog and cat breeds very frequently have specific health defects that are common across the entire race.

[–]phoenixmatrix 13 points14 points  (3 children)

On the other end of the spectrum, standard issue cats in real life (the standard tabby kind) are damn near immortal. 

[–]Yamidamian 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Hybrid vigor in action!

[–]Manoreded 0 points1 point  (1 child)

That is also true with dogs. If you want a dog but don't want vet bills, just grab yourself a mixed race generic puppy from a shelter.

[–]phoenixmatrix 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's a little trickier though because bred dogs are so much more common, and 98% of shelter dogs are pits or mix mixes, which have their own challenges 

[–]Yamidamian 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Like how Scottish Folds, while adorable, are basically all cursed to develop agonizing arthritis when they get older as a result of the same unique collagen that causes the titular fold.

[–]Manoreded 20 points21 points  (0 children)

First generation incest between cousins is unlikely to produce genetic defects.

The problem is, if the same family keeps doing it across multiple generations, eventually their first cousins will be much more genetically related than normal, and defects will start appearing.

This is basically what happened with those european royal families that became very inbreed over time. They did cousin marriages, uncle and niece marriages, etc, by themselves not very problematic, but after doing it for many generations, everyone was too closely related to everyone else and people with severe defects started appearing.

[–]toomanybongos 15 points16 points  (1 child)

Did you happen to write the incest episode of community?

[–]Grouchy_Elephant 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Now here's a man who knows how to marry his cousin!

[–]daymeeuhn 9 points10 points  (17 children)

A whole sub-section could be written on how to inject strays in to your bloodline breeding to increase purity and eventually eliminate inbred downsides. I consistently go back to creating fully clean kittens in my bloodline by having parallel breed lines going with strays - it can take time and you kind of need multiple going at once, but it's doable.

Also, do not downplay the importance of Stimulation. My current 80 Stim room seems to make the genetic inbred mutations happen less frequently, while simultaneously generating very consistent high grade kittens that pull the best from both parents all the time.

Lastly, not sure if it's a bug or what but it's a real shame that kittens in the wild can get double mutations on their legs / arms / eyes / ears / eyebrows, while only being allowed 1 per in breeding. Not sure what the deal with that is, would be cool to have both in bloodline breeding but I digress.

Mutation rooms can be a blessing or a curse. I used one to get almost all of the Best in Slot mutations I wanted originally, by mutating strays to then inject in to the bloodline - it killed two birds with one stone in that it allowed me to mix in a stray while also mixing in a new desired mutation. Also, by using things like Cancer or the Uranium Rod, you aren't JUST bringing home the one mutation you want, you're bringing home a ton of them... which can be harder to mix out and pluck the desired ones; by using the strays, typically the ONLY mutation they have on them is the new one you want, making it much much easier.

All in all, good guide - nothing I'd remove in it, just stuff I'd add.

OH, PS: No mention on parenting.

Each cat will bond with the first cat they have intercourse with - you will see this as a "Loves" icon on their stat sheet. Ideally, you want to try and separate out a new pair you plan on mating to guarantee their first sexual act is with the desired partner, to kind of "lock them in" with that parent.

From that point on, they will USUALLY sleep with their partner. I say usually because...

The Low/Medium/HIgh Aggression trait directly impacts the likelihood they will try to sleep with other cat's partners. High Aggression can be very bad for this - they will actively mark their territory by banging other mates.

When this occurs, a "Hates" icon will appear - this means someone cheated on their spouse. If you want to avoid fights (and possible deaths in your bloodline), you need to be monitoring this and separate out the problem couples when affairs occur.

Additionally, the "?" intersex cats seem to just sleep around outside of their matching without even needing to be aggressive. I typically have to separate them out or just keep them out of the bloodline entirely.

In short, with an attic penthouse maintaining good Comfort rating and the highest Stimulation score possible (it has the most real estate available, so it should be your default highest-Stim goal) you can comfortably manage 3, 4 or even 5 happy couples without much issue. Have them mate in a lower score room below before moving them to the penthouse to ensure they are mate bonded, and try to avoid having them be "?" or High Aggression. This will ensure a happy life for all couples as long as the Comfort score remains high enough.

This is all vital for efficient bloodline breeding.

(https://imgur.com/a/2OiOUGF Just to show that I've efficiently bred out and hunted for specific mutations I wanted from the master list to combine them in to god tier cats, etc - I have a fur mut too just not on this particular one during a farming run)

[–]APForLoops 2 points3 points  (1 child)

where’s the mutations master list? oh my god your mutations are amazing 

[–]daymeeuhn 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Just check the mutations section on the wiki!

[–]Meowonita[S] 2 points3 points  (5 children)

How do you maintain all 7 base stats if you are constantly mixing in the strays? I guess, by having 80 Stimulation? I am currently rather early in the game (not much time to play unfortunately), so I don’t have many rare furnitures. Do you consistently get all 7 kittens with all the good mutations if you have a room with 80 Stimulation?

[–]daymeeuhn 3 points4 points  (3 children)

Mainline stats are the easiest to breed best-of from Stimulation, but aside from that, it isn't necessarily mandatory for Stray Side-Breeding to maintain all 7s while aiming for purity. The only goal is to have the FINAL product be as close to all-7s as possible, meaning as long as the stray lines running parallel eventually lead up to all 7s when they meet back up, you're fine. (You usually have two parallel stray lines going to then mix back in as the final product.)

Appeal scores will naturally rise as you're progressing too, I think mine right now is around 100 or just a little under. I consistently get 2 to 3 7s on my strays, with sometimes 4 and I've even seen a 5. So the strays can pull their weight eventually as well and aren't a super hindrance.

All in all, as long as you're getting 4 to 5 of the 7s on each of the purity lines, it's pretty easy to combine them back up at the end and re-achieve full 7s. Same goes for the mutations - each new iteration of stray lines do not need to maintain all 10 mutations, you just need to make sure all 10 are represented between the two lines as you go, and of course... the more the better as it makes it easier to recombine.

Essentially you have to envision the breeding process as a two-step process - creating the mainlined breed pairs that generate the final product adventure cats, and the sideline stray parallel lines that aim to clean up purity to get back to the point where you have worthy parents ready to create adventure cats, rinse repeat. You can do both of these at the same time, or one after another as a back and forth process, that's up to you - a fully realized house with 5 rooms and lots of furniture really helps.

There are times where I've wiped out a majority of cats in my house and reset down to sub-10 total to kick start a fresh wave of stray purity breeding, purely because with some coin and sending kittens to Tink, you can essentially infinite-breed by cycling in food from Tracy and kittens to Tink. It's self sustaining, so long as you're at or below 10ish cats to replenish daily from Tracy's supply. This allows me to spam breed a bit to fix bloodlines if I need to.

You can also kind of "save scum" this process too by taking advantage of your backup save files but that's a separate topic entirely. While it's available as an option, I've rarely ever even had to do it / considered doing it and only use it as a failsafe to make me feel more comfortable with taking huge risks in my bloodline management; it's never been an issue and I've never had to fall back on it, but it's at least comforting to know it's an option in case a worst-possible scenario occurs where breeding 20-30 of a given vital parenting match would not produce a single worthy offspring. (It's never happened)

[–]AvesAvi 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Maybe I'm just envisioning it badly but that just seems like so much micromanaging. Right now I'm struggling to get a continuous 7/7 not inbred line going. Feels like it's a massive gamble if I can manage to produce one with a stray before death from old age occurs. My bloodline was just recently wiped out because they just weren't producing good kittens. What exactly does your process look like?

[–]daymeeuhn 2 points3 points  (0 children)

High Stimulation mostly avoids this. I didn't focus on high mutation min/max bloodline breeding until I had at least 25-30 in each room. Now that I'm at 75-80 in my penthouse attic, it's pretty easy to keep it consistent.

[–]Steallet 1 point2 points  (0 children)

thanks for the insight

[–]BarcodeCutter 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Would also like to know the answer to this question

[–]APForLoops 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Your basic attacks inflict soul link and bleed. Do you not run clerics and druids ever?

[–]xavopls 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It's actually insane on druid if you use it strictly offensively as an aoe soul link but yeah need a separate bloodline for clerics.

[–]daymeeuhn 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Oh I'm well aware ;) It's broken on Druid

I do so much damage right now so quickly that I almost never need it, though. I've been strongly considering switching it for the legs that prevent knockback

[–]Spirited_Salary8041 1 point2 points  (1 child)

hi, is it possible to savescum nights by force closing should the result be bad (stud dies randomly, mating with wrong partner etc?)

[–]daymeeuhn 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yes. Go in to your saves folder, you can copy paste your save file in to a different backup folder and if the night doesn't end well you can just exit to menu, delete your original save and copy paste the backup in its place and when you re-enter the game it'll be back to where it was. You don't even need to close the game you can just go back to menu to do it each time, it's pretty easy.

You can technically do this for anything if you want to avoid Steven altogether, too.

[–]matrium0 1 point2 points  (3 children)

Great addition, but you loose out on mutations, right? Or do you really go on a full "mutation run" every time you want to introduce a new stray? That seems like a lot of "work" I personally would not enjoy. Also all the required items are pretty rare. I have only ever seen one uranium rod in almost 80 hours or so.

Right now my attic is breeding room and mutation room in one. When a kitten is born it will mostly have one birth defect, but it will usually be treated within 1-3 days and then the kitten can go down into the adventure-ready-room.

This way all my adventure cats are now perfect 7 (baseline) and have 10 mutations. Though there is some variance with mutations, since the birth defect is random and it is "cured" by a random mutation. So not ALL kittens have the most important mutations (e.g. I really like the body where they get an extra basic attack), but they will only ever NOT have 1/10.

This game - crazy :)

[–]daymeeuhn 2 points3 points  (2 children)

I separate my mutation room from the rest because I do not want to add new mutations that overwrite my current mutations, since 99% of the time new mutations are downgrades.

And no, as mentioned I do not need a "mutation run" as I have the mutation room for strays. They come in and chill in there until I either need them for breeding, or they mutate. If it's an upgrade mutation, I move them in to breed - if it's a downgrade, they get the can!

[–]matrium0 0 points1 point  (1 child)

But then they will surely not have 10 mutations, right? What happens when a cat with 10 mutations breed one with 2?
Does Stimulation really work in this case too? I know that stimulation works on the base stats, but what about "body parts". Is the mutated body part (e.g. "legs") seen as superior and affected by stimulation? So does the offspring has a high chance to have lots of mutations?

[–]daymeeuhn 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, with high stim its easy to carry over mutations. I can breed a 10-mut with a stray and get all 10 sometimes! 6 or 7 very commonly, 8 or 9 a few times in the life cycle.

[–]CorvusOnStream 5 points6 points  (2 children)

I see that you adress actual % that house stats affect, especially stimulation

Do you have (or know where to get) detailed info about actual hard and soft caps of all house stats? And about how each 1 point in a stat actually affect the chances

[–]Meowonita[S] 5 points6 points  (1 child)

No, unfortunately I’ve only seen one instance of here-say about the actual number of percentage. I’ve been trying to find the so-called source but no luck on that yet. Will update you if I ever find a trustworthy source.

Currently I’ve seen multiple people saying that 30 stimulation is the soft cap with no noticeable differences above that, but then another comment in this post stacked to 80 Stimulation with rare furnitures and it’s been giving them good results, so I’m not sure.

My current conclusion is that rare furnitures are goated and just stack up on the stats with what you have lol

[–]CptSpringareHunter 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah it's a lot of anecdotal knowledge. Like I have two breeding rooms with both stimulation around 15 and both keep working. But it's just like 15-20 kittens where around 5-7 are ok so I could just be luck 🤷

[–]Cloakedbug 12 points13 points  (5 children)

Lots of great information here. But I think the approach is fundamentally flawed. You end with a narrow amount of cats breeding (so production is low) and you are all but guaranteed to have defects that must be “healed” again by mutation. Then you have to burn many turns over and over to purify, move cats around, etc. 

I’ve simply created 4 breeding bloodlines (4 members each + 4 strays at a time) and produce multiple usable cats rapidly while maintaining lack of defects. This also allows pumping tons of cats into the fight room for chances to spike their stats and send truly strong cats out to adventure. And less micromanaging. 

[–]Meowonita[S] 11 points12 points  (0 children)

To each their own, but personally I think it’s less micromanaging to manage 1 bloodline vs. 4, while having to keep analyzing and introducing strays…

You cannot get perfect cats from strays, so no guaranteed all 7s, and you are micromanaging a lot of imperfect kittens to keep the bloodline good, and probably can forget about keeping mutations… imo, mutations (not the ones i have in the picture, the one I mentioned in text, like +1 turn at battle start) are much stronger than mere stats.

Most of “defects” are something like -2 random stat, which is not detrimental at all and I can totally throw that cat straight into the battle. The mutation room is for keeping spare cats and for getting the next perfect breeding pair.

Nothing stops you from throwing adventure-candidates into fighting room.

[–]matrium0 4 points5 points  (0 children)

you "simply" created 4 bloodlines that you keep track of? That does not sound simple at all, compared to this strategy where strays or keeping track of lineage is not even required at all.

[–]AvesAvi 0 points1 point  (1 child)

How many rooms does this take up? I imagine you have to keep each line separate to avoid too much micromanaging tossing the inbreds?

[–]Cloakedbug 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You can start with the 20 or so breeders in one room, tagged as 4 shapes. New kitty takes the shape of whichever parent has a longer bloodline. As stats get much higher but also bloodlines converge you buy time by trickling in strays that don't need to breed an improved replacement, but just a refreshed blood cat. I mark the donors as poop emojis and after they refresh a bloodline they get tossed.

Later when you have the furniture, you can separate into an A/B rooms and toss the spawn from each room into the other room after birth, replacing a 'converged' bloodline cat from the other side. At this point you don't really get inbreds anymore.

Each turn you are putting out like 6 kittens, probably 5 go to thunderdome to fight it out and get improvements before adventuring. One probably gets kept/promoted/tagged as a shape. I keep 30-40 cats at a time (generally lower end) and only need to process kitten births for maybe 2-3 turns between adventures.

[–]Spirited_Salary8041 0 points1 point  (0 children)

once you have an all 7 bloodline you will have dozens of inbred semi perfect cousins and uncles you can send off for stupid experiments like this, or keep as backups incase your experimentation kills your main stud. i have more cats with 5 7s that are too inbred to be studs than i know what to do with and sending them to NPCs is a waste, i let them do crater hard path for Shimmer and if they come back with good mutations i let them breed. ofc doing what OP does without a surplus of backup studs is asking for trouble

[–]Cool-Call-8381 5 points6 points  (1 child)

i have 70 hours and havent seen any of the 3 things you mention lol, no uranium, no cat with cancer, no tainted genes

[–]Natuchna 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I have 30 h and saw cancer :|

[–]LordSuteo 5 points6 points  (0 children)

10 mutations and all 7s in stats

6 CON

To the trash bin it goes!

[–]smshing 4 points5 points  (0 children)

so let my cats incest?

/s

[–]Seeingisbeeing 7 points8 points  (2 children)

If I am breeding my cats to intentionally have a certain defect. (-Stat +10% doge chance, or -stat can take level ups from x class) Does it stay that defect?

[–]Meowonita[S] 7 points8 points  (1 child)

It should, i think birth defects actually have a higher chance to be inherited than mutations

[–]Spirited_Salary8041 0 points1 point  (0 children)

just to clarify, defect = red mutation, good mutations = green? I've seen a good red mutation (trample) before

[–]throwaway_name12 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Hi Bane!

[–]Cautious-Figure-3725 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Top-tier post

[–]darkneslso 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Note with uranium rod and cancer if you have parasite set you can get 3 mutations per round

[–]Substantial-Pin-9549 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I would like to add stacking health in the breeding rooms. Its common to live to 30plus if you do with my highest being 57 on a stud I bred that set up my entire line of 3 headed cats establishing a good male and female rofl. 

You can also send a good atud on a run with a kitten rib and kill its body then it will return a kitten young again. Those are gold for good studs 

[–]Substantial-Pin-9549 2 points3 points  (8 children)

You can get all 7 reliable without in breeding and stack mutations lol. I don't like my family tree looking like a fire escape ladder personally rofl

[–]Meowonita[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Mutations are stronger than stats though (not the ones I have right now). I know at least one that let you start with an extra attack, one that let you reroll level-ups, one that gives flight… ideally you’d eventually collect all the best mutations.

For pure stat, just throw in the fight club tbh.

[–]Substantial-Pin-9549 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Here is from a few minutes ago. I haven't had a chance to mutate new spawn yet as I just did a purge and base battle. 

These are the ones you reference lol def must haves. The one that adds a basic attack is a dominant gene as well and stays over 50% of the time. I've had it for a long ass time so far. Must have IMHO. 

https://imgur.com/gallery/stats-mutations-U4hPFbZ

[–]AvesAvi 0 points1 point  (5 children)

How? I have a hard time continuously producing 7/7s with strays without the stud dying of old age. I only have 29 stimulation though and can't really figure out how to breed more than a single pair at a time without it being way too cumbersome.

[–]IlliterateBastard 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Have more furniture with Appeal. You don't need to do inbreeding for 7/7. The only time where inbreeding is encouraged is when you want to pass down mutations

[–]AvesAvi 0 points1 point  (2 children)

I see. Is there a way to see total appeal anywhere or do I just need to add up all the appeal in each room?

[–]Substantial-Pin-9549 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I'm running 60s appeal right and you get strays with triple 7s sporadically and 7/7 fairly often. Its not super hard to reliably have 7/7/7/7 cats reliabl. Once you have four rooms you can split brother and sister and "inbreed" 3 2 pairs down with a new stray and get a run of 5 or 6 7s cats then split and repeat. 

I only run four 7 cars min atm and they all have ahead mutations for extra attack and the brother or sister line keeps the other head mutations for a extra move. Its pretty op. Duos thru the sewers make bosses  cake 

[–]IlliterateBastard 0 points1 point  (0 children)

At the top of the screen with the house icon. It doesn't matter which room you placed it in, it takes every room into account for the total.

[–]Substantial-Pin-9549 -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Also a female can be a stud also. Just stack males that have her low stat category with good stimulation

[–]CorvusOnStream 0 points1 point  (4 children)

Thank you for a deep dive, love that!

Right now I'm hardly focused to avoid inbreeding but your guide kinda makes me changing my mind

What about disorders? Does inbreeding force disorders to appear and how do you avoid that?

[–]Spirited_Salary8041 0 points1 point  (0 children)

certain disorders like the one that maxes charisma and crashes int, the dwarfism one are all very strong in the right build. they can be mana batteries with the mana brain yellow item, thieves, crit archers etc. just a matter of itemization and if the other stat penalties aren't too crippling. a lot of things can be worked around, just that some things are complete bs (looking at you, depression) and can't (even mega fart cats can be tossed by tanks for giga damage into enemy packs)

[–]Meowonita[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Inbreeding does increase the rate of disorder appearing, but it’s not guaranteed and I find many disorders interesting to work around (for example, Dawn’s syndrome vs. a certain Fighter skill…)

[–]CorvusOnStream 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Do kids get disorders from their parents too?

[–]Meowonita[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I don’t keep the disordered one as my breeding pair, but I’d assume so.

[–]S417M0NG3R 0 points1 point  (4 children)

Tip for storage locker, I combined it with the side quest that gives you random class abilities and that seemed to overwrite the rare item selections, so it was like the storage locker was a free side quest item.

[–]Meowonita[S] 0 points1 point  (3 children)

But you want to use Storage Locker tho. To stock up on easy rare items, before a tough house invader fight or something. Why would you want to overwrite it, just for $200?

[–]S417M0NG3R 0 points1 point  (2 children)

I've always been much more tight for good cats than items myself, so I would prefer the cats to get abilities. I get lots of items just running through the levels, I have a hard time cutting them every run.

At the time needed the money as well, but now I'm swimming in it. I make 3 or 4 all 7 cats with 3-4 mutations a day with my breeding program, at this point I just need to figure out how to get 10+ mutations on them outside of going act 2 or something.

Maybe that changes later, I'm currently going through act 3 so we will see.

Unless if you are talking about getting the uranium rod and cancer, then I guess that makes sense to sacrifice some of the cats.

[–]mattnotgeorge 0 points1 point  (1 child)

If you do a storage locker run you'll probably see a lot of cool "red" rarity items you've never seen before, they're normally quite rare.

[–]S417M0NG3R 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well, I accidentally sold the item so the sidequest should come around again so I guess I'll check it out but I'm a bit dubious.

[–]Simmonolas 0 points1 point  (1 child)

"As usual, prioritize gender fluid (?) cats, keep an eye on the Bi, and shun the gays. Prioritize horny cats and cats younger than 15, punt the celibates immediately."
Can you tell me how to check those? Because rn i can only see their gender

[–]Meowonita[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Send lots and lots of kittens to Tink

[–]APForLoops 0 points1 point  (0 children)

good to know mutations will prioritize helping out 9-1 cats!! my incest club has lots of troubled cats 

[–]SillyBitlod 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Naaaaah, incest will only ruin your full stats cats with stats down defects. Had some inbreeding issues when start the grind, now has only one but op mutation - dice eyes. Want to save that for future generations but breed that traut with the strays in breed room 50 stim Mutation room where you can leave you cats in are better for getting 10 evos. Slower, but controllable

[–]Spirited_Salary8041 1 point2 points  (0 children)

dice eyes is better than 90% of flat stat mutations lets be real. rng control is so massive in this game, d6 and the multiclass pins make every shit hero into gods. envious that you got it early

[–]ChaosWraith 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Is 30 the "stat cap" for furniture?

I've been wondering when to stop.

[–]Sed59 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So Crusader Kings but with cats. Deus Vult!

[–]Pticmaje 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Does that mean you don’t even need stimulation by the ends with your strategy? Because you always inbreed cats with 7/7 stats and 10 mutations, so no matter what you will get full 7 and 9 good + 1 bad mutation.. right?

[–]Nobody-Particular 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Can you just have two families and just keep breeding the cousins together, or does it eventually lead to highly inbred?

[–]matrium0 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Great guide. I am almost through the game now and I went in mostly spoiler free, but I ended up with a very similar idea.

Though my problem always was inbreeds and birth defects. So I would throw away even 8/1 (mutation / birth defect) cats to not spread it further and rotate strays into the pool in a room with 40 stimulation. Though that still would lead to imperfect stats (not all baseline 7) sometimes and only a random amount of my mutations, as the stray has none.

Also I would have body parts I REALLY love (e.g. "start with an extra attack), but only half kittens would get that, creating a problem downstream.

Your concept of controlled inbreeding, where you embrace birth defects and "fix them in post" is awesome.

Can't wait to try it out!

Good stuff!

[–]Cassp3 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Big thing is not keeping too many cats, if you just keep good breeding pairs in each room. Tink will pay you more for the babies than it costs to upkeep. Unironically infinite gold. I had full 7 stat cats by around my 5th run.

But yeah. Inbreeding is just such a non issue as long as you don't get annoying shit like blind or immoblised. Just inbreed the fuck out of your cats. Once you get them to where you want it's extremely easy to get rid of the shitty mutations with strays.

[–]Darkhealerth 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Great guide but too complex for my wrinkle-averse brain. The way that I do it is to just keep all cats in the attic with max comfort and stimulation, then throw all inbred cats into the other 2 rooms, one for male one for female. Then put strays of the opposite sex in the rooms to fix the inbreeding.

I know it's not a great strat since I'm missing out on mutations, but it heavily reduces the headache of keeping up with all the min-maxing while also adventuring

[–]ikuzou 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I've gotten to and beaten the sewers, but I have a few questions on progression. When should i really start trying to actually try to target and breed my cats? Should I mostly just aggressively try to donate the cats at this point to get the vendors/npcs to around lv2? Should I not really worry about holding items/cats until i can get some furniture and more rooms?

Also, I love the Bane pics.

[–]Meowonita[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I would say focus on progression for now, but hold on to the items and traits i mentioned (cancer, uranium rod, bulletproof vest, play dead trait, bare minimum trait) as those can be rare to come by. You need the npcs a lot more than lv2.

[–]SonOfMcGee 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This guy cats.

[–]beaubeaubeaubeau 0 points1 point  (0 children)

How often do the inbred kittens come with disorders? Do you try and cure them with the health stat in your mutation room?

[–]CorvusOnStream 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Do kids copy parasites from parents?

[–]Borschik 0 points1 point  (2 children)

All those guides basically tell you "Take strays with 7 and crossbreed them, and then take a stray with a different 7 and also breed them". Yeah, amazing advice, but strays with 7s show up like once in 20 raids. And razing appeal is expensive.

[–]mh500372 2 points3 points  (0 children)

They show up very commonly for me. I think they are 80% of the time having at least one 7. I have 40 appeal though, which I’d imagine is key.

[–]APForLoops 1 point2 points  (0 children)

you’ll get more appeal by playing more

[–]Dreadmaker -1 points0 points  (0 children)

This guide in a nutshell: stepcat what r u doing??

[–]maggyneverforget -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

That's cool but I'm just gonna not read this and figure it out on my own.