How Trump Humiliated Netanyahu, Rewarded Qatar and Quashed the Messianic Right's Fantasies

This is all true. Except might doesn't make right. Might wins always. But Israel will always have lost. The 8th decade is coming.

My first point is Bibi got what he wanted from Trump.

My second point is that people like you need to stop talking about colonialism in Palestine. We all live on land that has been colonized.

The Irih in Northern Ireland feel the English and scots colonized the North . The Danes colonized much of Eastern England. And of course the UK colonized and reshaped America and Canada. Anyone insisting these people return to twhere they came from? I think not. All these people living in glass homes and they need to stop throwing rocks at Israel.

The Scots 'dinna colonize Eire. The English did, Ahole... ...

I live in Canada. A native Canadian has all the rights that I have, plus several more. They can either join mainstream society and work for a living like the rest of us, or they can live on a reserve and get welfare and never work a day again in their life. And the country is so big that if they really wanted, they could walk off the map into the wilderness and never see a white man again as they live as their ancestors did. None choose this last option, though they could. We don't hold natives in guarded enclosed areas like Gaza, and slaugher (mow the grass) them whan they complain about it. Maybe if we did, Canada would be as hated as Israel is today.

It is a fact that the English and the Scots colonized Northern Ireland in the 17th century. You can look it up in the Encyclopedia Britannica among other sources. And by the way my point was that all countries were created through colonization--without exception. A-hole.

Got it. Your point boils down to: the modern world has been shaped by violent conquest, therefore violent conquest today is fine and we should give Israel a break.

In return I would say that many of us would prefer to hold today's nations to different standards than, say, those of England of the 17th Century - to take your example. Nobody today thinks Drogheda was legitimate. GB was forced to unwind its Empire by many forces, one of which was the moral revulsion of the world and of its own people. The real difference of course is that Israel's acts of violent conquest are not even history, they are happening as I type. They are stealing land and killing people every single day. The fact that British racists did the same thing 300 years ago doesn't make this okay.

By the way, the end point of your own example (17th century ango-scottish colonisation in Ireland) has not even been reached. You ask: 'anyone insisting these people return to where they came from?' and the answer is yes. People in Ireland were calling for 'Brits Out' throughout the last century, and thousands on both sides were killed in the long struggle for peace that has barely just concluded, over 300 years later. The lesson for Israel is that without a just settlement for the people it has brutalised, it too will probably still be fighting 300 years from now. Which is of course why it is trying to kill and remove as many Palestinians as it can.

I suggest (I hope you smiled) looking further back into history of the region.... Ahole.

I used England as one example. In the US, much of the country was emptied of the indigenous people at the same time that many Jews returned to the Holy Land. You may not be aware, but a significant Arab population was moved to the land by the Turks at the same time as Jews started to come. This happened because the Turkish Empire was contracting, thus many from elsewhere. How far? Algeria? Bosnia, Crimea, and elsewhere. The notion that the Arab population has lived here from Canaanite times is a fiction. The violence that accompanied the creation of the state of Israel did not have to happen; it was triggered by the Arab states (not the Palestinian Arabs), who came in and hoped to wipe out the nascent state of Israel--that did not work out. The standards today are no different than yesterday; Ireland is a good example. Just because you resolved the issues yesterday does not make you more advanced.

Both parties do the brutalization. In the West Bank, I tend to agree with you that Israel is carrying out a campaign of terror with a goal to get the Arab population to depart. But the history is a sorry case of Arab refusal to accept the Jewish State, and please do not respond to the idea that Israel is an ethno-state in the Middle East, all are ethno-states, and once upon a time, so was all of Europe. And all of Asia are ethnostates including Japan, China, and Korea. The history is that a so-called right of return has stopped numerous agreements from being carried out. Outside the 5 million Palestinians, there are more than 130 million refugees, none of whom have a multigenerational right of return. The insistence that the 5 million Palestinians should be allowed to return to Israel in addition to having their own state is a non-starter.

You seem to forget that the natives were mostly killed. Easy to give rights to the remnants but not the land that was taken from them!

At the time of the Crusades, the Holy Land was mostly Muslim. There were also some Jew living there. You could call the Muslim population of the time Palestinian or whatever.

So, if those who were expelled absolutely cannot come back to claim their land, would you be willing to pay compensation, so they could start new lives elsewhere?

Part of the UN resolution 194 that requests that Palestinians be allowed to return if they would live in peace with their neighbors, offers to alternatively compensate them. I am absolutely in favor of that. I am sure if that was acceptable (it has never been acceptable to Palestinian rulers), the Israeli government and everyone else would run to compensate them if that would end all hostility.

Ref: The Scots 'dinna colonize Eire.

No-one can deny Scotland´s major influence on Ireland and especially the north. Most of the Protestants in Ulster have Scottish, not English, names, and there are lots of Presbyterians. England can take a great deal of blame for all sorts of things but this was a joint effort, pushed not least by James VI of Scotland.

The Celtic/Rangers hate fest is far more intense than the genteel rivalries between Man City and Utd or Everton and Liverpool. The reason is because of the enduring issues between Ulster and Scotland.

@RK

https://www.haaretz.com/jewish/2013-10-29/ty-article/this-day-ovadiah-goes-to-jerusalem/0000017f-f42c-dc28-a17f-fc3f97f50000

@RK

In his 1488 letter, Ovadia estimated that overall, Jerusalem's population numbered some 4,000 families. Among them, he wrote, only 70 were Jewish families, "of the poorest class."

https://www.haaretz.com/jewish/2013-10-29/ty-article/this-day-ovadiah-goes-to-jerusalem/0000017f-f42c-dc28-a17f-fc3f97f50000

@RK

« the history is a sorry case of Arab refusal to accept the Jewish State, and please do not respond to the idea that Israel is an ethno-state in the Middle East,..»

The PLO recognised Israel implict in 1988 (PNC ALGIER) - explicitly in 1993 (exchange of letters Arafat / Rabin.

The original English imposition of dominion over Ireland was under Henry II in 1172-3. Ireland was under the English yoke for literally 750 years until a portion of it achieved a modest degree of self-determination with the creation of the IFS in 1922. The history of the English abuse and dehumanization of the Irish is one of the longest and among the most brutal sagas of what would ultimately be called colonialism in history.

Well said, UK.

The Zionist terror state is unable to defeat the Palestinian resistance and thus deliberately uses the daily massacre of between 50 and a 100 Palestinian civilians to bludgeon it into surrender.

Harel does not even bother to discuss what benefits the US/Israeli scheme has for the Palestinians. He blames those who point out that this is a surrender document for having no consideration for the desperate situation the Palestinians in Gaza are in. This is the height of Zionist hypocrisy. Who can believe the Israeii state after so many previous treacherous violations of cease-fire agreements, either with Hamas or with Lebanon?

I see, a somewhat sanitized version of "the Jews control the world". Just more rampant antisemitism.

That the senators most vocal against Israel right now are Jewish.

A much better target of ire is the Christian Messianic Evangelist movement. Yes, they invite the Kahanists along and I blame the latter too but this is much less about Israeli influence than religious influence. Oh, and of course oil.

In some alternative universe where the Arab world had been less hostile to a Jewish state, Israel would not have accepted military aid money in exchange for being a US proxy to influence oil prices.

Listen to Norm Coleman, former US senator and current national chairman of the Republican Jewish Coalition at a recent speech at the Jewish News Syndicate: "The majority of gen Z have an unfavourable impression of Israel. And my friends I think the reason for that is that we're losing the digital war. They're getting their information from TikTok and whatever it is. And we're losing that war. When you think about it, the masters of the universe are Jews. You know we've got Altman from OpenAI, we got Zuckerberg [Facebook], we got Sergey Brin [Google], we got the whole group across the board, Jan Koum who founded WhatsApp. It's us. And we have to figure out a way to win the digital battle". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Caq1EfHDZOA&t=95s And, coincidentally, under much pressure from Trump, Tik-Tok America has just been sold to a consortium led by a passionately pro-Israel Jewish billionaire.

Of course, the Jews do not control the world, but many Jewish leaders appear to believe that they do. Do you have any idea how dangerous this is for the Jewish people?

All but 10 congress people take AIPAC money. Bernie Sanders speaks out against Israel's genocide and that's it. Yahoo is on camera boasting about how America is easy to move. AIPAC brags about unseating congress people. It's not about Jews control the world. It's a demonstrable fact that the Israeli lobby's influence in the government is outsized. You know how many states have states that make it illegal to engage in BDS? It's just facts.

How many USA congress have Israel flags in their offices? No other country. Brian Mast wears his IDF uniform to work. 250 congress just spent an all expenes paid trip in Israel. They don't do this in other countries. NYC mayoral debate all but one fell over themselves to say the first country they'd visit as mayor NYC is Israel. Why would that even be a topic. We're sending money to Israel and not our own disaster victims.

AIPAC in fact has the vise-like grip on American congressmen, as others here explain. It has very strangely distorted the American political system. There is such a thing as a too-powerful "lobby" acting effectively as a foreign agent. Stating these facts is not "antisemitism." In fact, your trying to smear it as "antisemitism," is exactly what AIPAC does to politically assassinate any congressman with a conscience and unwilling to prostrate himself to Israel. Behaving like an AIPAC operative is not a good look for denying the obvious public work of AIPAC operatives. This dishonest game those like you play is working less and less these days, though.

The State of Arkansas, under Sarah Huckabee, purchased some millions of dollars of Israel bonds while at the same time claiming to have no money to rebuild decrepit infrastructure, improve education or improve healthcare.