If there's anything Microsoft Build 2024 will be remembered for, it's the introduction of the controversial Windows Recall on its new Copilot+ PCs. Pitched as a "photographic memory" for your computer, this feature works by constantly taking screenshots of your activity to build a detailed and searchable timeline of everything you have ever seen or done.
Almost immediately, critics and security researchers labeled the feature a privacy nightmare, pointing out that a single piece of malware could gain access to a user's entire digital life. In response to the backlash, Microsoft promised that users will be able to filter which apps get recorded, but some developers are not waiting around.
Just about a month after the feature became generally available for Copilot+ PCs (it is now rolling out to users in Europe), some app developers took matters into their own hands to protect their users.
One such company was Signal, which implemented an opt-out feature called "Screen Security" to prevent its chats from being captured. It cleverly uses a Digital Rights Management (DRM) flag to black out the application window during a screenshot attempt, using the same technology that streaming services like Netflix use to prevent people from recording movies.
Now, Brave Browser has joined the party, announcing on X that it will block Recall by default with its v1.81 update, which is expected in the coming weeks.
While Microsoft stated that Recall would not capture content from private browsing windows, Brave's new update just tells the Windows operating system that all of its browser windows are private. This prevents Recall from snapshotting anything you do in Brave, not just the activity in a designated private tab.
In its announcement, the company did give Microsoft some credit for making changes following the initial public outcry, such as making Recall an opt-in feature. However, the company still feels that giving any application unrestricted access to a user's browsing history is a huge risk.
If you, for some reason, like Windows Recall, you can disable the upcoming protection by navigating to Settings, then Privacy and Security, and toggling off the "Block Microsoft Recall" option.
Good stuff Brave. Hopefully MS respects user choice with this. They don't have a great track record but time will tell.
Users do have a choice with Recall and it's off by default. I think Recall is horrible and no one should enable it but if the user does why are apps taking making the choice for the user themselves to block it? It should be opt-in just like Recall.
It's a toggle in Brave. You can turn it on or off
Did you not understand what I said in my comment at all?
Well, I did understand your commend, and I disagree with you. Blocking recall should be enabled by default.
From what I have read in the article it is, it is opt-in.
I don't why people are getting uptight about recall, Windows had something like it before. It is not a thing I would enable even if I used a copilot machine, which I don't
Than you should have said that instead of providing a "fact" that could be concluded I knew from my comment. Sure we can degree on needing an unnecessary features on by default.
Microsoft regularly changes settings without notice or consent if they want you to use their products. I've disabled CoPilot in the Outlook mobile app 3 times in the past few weeks because every time the app gets updated they revert that one setting to "on".
I would trust Brave long before I would trust Microsoft.
Microsoft is not just going enable Recall on people's PCs one day. That would be a PR nightmare and a lawsuit. Do you think Microsoft makes money with Recall or something? LOL
Could a bug turn it on my accident? Sure anything could happen I suppose but no one will die if that happens. You will just disable it and delete it's recordings.
If one is really worried they can simply just turn on this feature in Brave. There is no reason for it to be on by default if one is not using Recall. That's my only point here. I get it... Recall is a very divisive feature (for good reason) and Brave is using that to promote their browser with this "feature".
Please, get lost and have a life away from insulting people. Thank you.
WTF? Follow your own advice. Good bye...
I certainly hope you're right, but I put nothing past Microsoft these days. Writing Microsoft with a dollars sign used to be a joke because they charged for their software, but now they charge for their software "and" shove ads and recommended products down your throat at every turn, revert settings changes after updates, etc., so perhaps it's time to start spelling it Micro$oft again, :-p
You don't have to convince me I had been a Windows user since version 2.0 (Microsoft OS user since DOS 4.0) but last year went Linux full time. That leads me to another pet peeve of mine... The people here that complain about Microsoft daily and don't trust them in any way let using Linux is just a crazy idea.
I do not consider it a choice telling Microsoft that I don´t want the Edge browser and them harassing me every week to try to make Microsoft Edge my default browser without me realising. That is what they will do with Recall.
Weird I don't recall really ever being harassed to set Edge as my default browser except the odd time I opened Edge. LOL In my scenario one is not using Recall and it's not enabled. I am not sure how getting theoretical notifications in the future is really relevant to my point.
There is reasons why Microsoft would want you to use Edge but I am not seeing it for Recall.
Microsoft is not just going enable Recall on people's PCs one day.
But their plan was exactly that. Microsoft's well publicized initial plan was to have Recall "on" on all PCs.
That would be a PR nightmare
Yup. And so it was . . .
June 7, 2024, Wired.com:
Microsoft Will Switch Off Recall by Default After Security Backlash
After weeks of withering criticism and exposed security flaws, Microsoft has vastly scaled back its ambitions for Recall, its AI-enabled silent recording feature, and added new privacy features."
https://www.wired.com/story/mi...ff%20by%20default.%E2%80%9D
(paywall, sorry)
Thanks for confirming because of the intense public backlash Microsoft will not be turning on Recall. There was no need for a link as it was covered everywhere.
The fact we need to have apps doing this dumb BS is insane. How about not shoving this nonsense down our throats in the first place? I literally know NO ONE that ever said "gee I wish I had a feature that screenshots everything I do on my computer, including sensitive, compromising or heavily private stuff every 2 seconds and neatly catalogs it somewhere on the drive". NO ONE. EVER.
Nobody is "shoving" anything down anybody's throats. The feature is turned off by default, so the user needs to explicitly enable it. How is that "shoving down" anything?
Again: this is OPT-IN. If you don't like the feature for whatever reason, just ignore it or turn it off if you already enabled it.
As is typical Microsoft fashion, one day it will be opt-in, and next day with Windows updates, it will be enabled automagically. Sure they say you need a CoPilot+ PC but with modern compute, it's not a huge overhead
I have to agree with you here. Recall is an anti-feature but it's opt-in so this seems like more like pandering to a certain user and some good PR. It should be off by default.
NEVER going to happen.
Now it might be opt in, but so where Microsoft accounts for Windows Home. What in 2 years? Either fully enabled by default or "let user enable" with dark patterns?
Is it? Mandatory Microsoft Accounts for Windows Home also weren't supposed to happen but they did.
That is a problem with Ms and Windows, the stuff I used to disable and found it back on an update.
Saying that, Apple was no better with their AI on Macs, I disabled it and found it turned back on updates. The last couple of updates it stayed off, so maybe Apple got the message from users, not to do that.
Fed up with companies pushing stuff I don't want to use. Sure, tell me about it, but once I said no or disabled something, then that should be it.
Even pro is mandatory now, there are ways to get around it, but for how long and why should people find ways to get around it?
No. This BECAME opt-in AFTER Microsoft was scorched for, not only having it enabled by default, but also for saving the data UNENCRYPTED. In typical Microsoft fashion, they do something sensible AFTER they get blowback by the users, not by design.
And secondly, as others mentioned, it is opt-in NOW. Microsoft's goal is to improve its AI features, which means data collection. Data collection comes with usage. It, almost certainly, will NOT be opt-in in the future. It will be on by default.
So, yes. They tried shoving it down our throats, they got blowback, they "retreated" a bit by making it opt-in and they will enable it again in 1-2 years (at most). This is the tactic they always use. The most prominent example is the telemetry. Initially it was only in the Insider builds of the Windows versions, then it became mandatory with Windows 10 and then they started reenabling features and telemetry after updates, even if the user had disabled them.
Yes, we need apps to block this BS by default because we cannot trust Microsoft to uphold her end of the deal.
I kinda forgot they did announce it as forced on all "Copilot+" devices.
So? The only thing that proves is that public oversight works? The fact is that despite the timing and the reasons, IT IS OPT-IN NOW, and that's all that matters NOW.
No. You specifically said "Nobody is shoving down anything". Microsoft is shoving Copilot down our throats. They tried to do it by default and completely unencrypted, they got blowback. They just backtracked a little for a moment and, their track record has shown that it will NOT remain opt-in. This is just temporary. It's better for apps to block it by default, than rely on a company that, again and again, reactivates features that the user has specifically disabled, just to get more data.
And Copilot is the holy grail of data collection. Are you, really, that naive to believe that it will remain opt-in in a year or so or just trying to stretch it to paint MS in a nicer picture?
Hopefully someone soon will come up with a decent deletion of Recall from your system, including registry and Windows parts/Control Panel items that get deleted.
Who’s waiting for this feature with no Copilot+ PC? Better save than sorry to make sure this piece of crap isn’t on your system. At all.
Don’t turn it on.
Do you not know who you replied to there? Thinking rationally is not a known quality of the OP. LOL
Don't buy a co-pilot computer, simple.
No Copilot PC is no Recall installed at all?!
Yeah, I know, so if you don't buy a Co-pilot machine, there is no recall to delete.
Co-pilot machines are arm based, not sure what it is like now, but Windows used to run slowly on an arm based machine.
There's no deletion, but can it be installed?
It requires a neural processing unit (NPU) so unless the CPU has one then in theory no, but in reality there have been some people who have installed it on non-NPU CPUs, but how well it runs is another thing.
AMD are producing x86 CPUs with NPUs, but I don't know if Recall will work on them.
I remember not so long ago, timeline on Windows, which more or less does what Recall do, and online as well. I don't know what problems people have with Recall, maybe it is the AI side of it.
I would not use it to be honest, like I never used Timeline
I liked Timeline a lot in Windows 10, it was quite nice. I am in the minority I suppose, but I also used something similar on Ubuntu in the past, Zeitgeist: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeitgeist_%28free_software%29
When assistants began appearing I thought they would be the future, I still think they could be, especially now with better recognition of human languages, but nobody seems to be working on them anymore.
For me, I'd like them to be more integrated. If Google's could interact with the other apps on my phone, that would be great. Right now, depending on what it is, I need to unlock the phone first which defeats the purpose of me talking.
Timeline was good in some ways, I did not like the online side of it, not that I ever used it as I don't have an MS account, recall is a good thing in some ways as well, but from what I have been reading, the data can be grabbed by malware. So can anything, i suppose.
Ubuntu is owned by Canonical, they seem to be the MS of the Linux world.
When I was younger, I was interested in AI and what it could do for us and liked the idea of it and still do, I have 5 Alexas in the house, not that it is real AI as such, what ever real AI is
. As I have got older and technology have got better, we have seen data being grabbed in shed loads over the years, even our supermarkets want to know every thing about us. It may not worry the younger ones, they used to machines and companies knowing what they do. But I do like a bit of privacy.
the main problem with AI is the companies behind them, large Amrican corporations, a country that have no idea what Privacy is, that is why I don't use any cloud storage as most of the servers are in the U.S.
Saying that, the U.K is getting as bad.
So I don't trust the people and companies behind AI.
I understand, I never gave much thought to it because I liked the convenience, but it sure is hard to trust. Some companies let us know how they use our data, but even then, how can we really be sure?
I haven’t followed much about Recall because none of my devices support it, but I assume it stores data like browser cookies or passwords and if that’s the case, I’m not totally convinced it’s secure enough.
My understanding is limited, but cookies and saved browser passwords are protected by a Windows feature that uses our login credentials to encrypt them. Even administrators in the same computer can't access them unless they know our password. But when we are logged in, any program can access them without any interaction from us! So I enable any protection I can, malware doesn't need to be ran as an administrator to get to them, I would expect the same to happen with Recall.
For services, there is a website that shows some alternatives to the popular ones that are based in the EU or privacy respecting places if you are interested: https://european-alternatives.eu/
Still not using Brave. It feels like the browser of choice for cult members.
The recall feature is not turned on anyhow.
That would be firefox nowadays.
Firefox, and its forks, are the only browser that can use full Ublock Origin. I wouldn't call that a cult.
Cryptobros on the other hand...
I kind of like Brave, there are some things I don't like about it, shoving their AI in, but that seems to be the norm for most browsers, also their Rewards thing, but at least they can be disabled.
I want a browser that is simple like they used to be and allow me to add in stuff via extensions I want.
A crypto browser with ad rewards is always meant for a cult. For crypto lovers and teenagers who try to make pocket money by watching ads. It can never become mainstream.
I use Brave and the full UBlock works just fine.
So does Ublock for a lot of people. But Google started disabling Manifest V2 in the past few weeks, seems to be A/B test. If Google takes it out from upstream Chromium I highly doubt the Brave team can keep it in for more than a year.
Brave blog stated they have no intentions of allowing manifest v2 so we'll have to see.
Did you mean they have no intention of removing Manifest V2?
Don't people realize that all processing of Recall data is done on the machine itself? Nothing is sent up to Microsoft's servers.
Malware a-holes are fine with that.
And the local database is incredibly easy to break, at least it was a year ago when the first Recall previews rolled out
https://www.wired.com/story/microsoft-windows-recall-privilege-escalation/
That's not the case anymore. They've done a good bit of work to lock it down since the first preview.
I think it is a useful feature for many average users who don't explicitly micromanage things on their systems. If they can find things quick with it, then good, job done.
I don’t like the idea of practically have a mandatory sign in on Windows 11 - and (all) data going to Microsoft - whilst having a local Recall option?
For some reason this sounds unbelievable & fishy, and indeed easy to break.
The only use case i have for recall is to spy on my kids. They should market it as a parental control.
If you are privacy concerned yet use Brave, you need to have your head examined.