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The Beard 5 Jun @ 1:22pm
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Roaring Knight fight needs balancing
As someone who has beaten all other secret bosses in Undertale and Deltarune, someone who greatly enjoys challenges and difficult things such as Souls games, dotAGE, hardcore raiding in MMO's, etc; the Roaring Knight fight is INSANELY imbalanced.

A character can be taken from full HP to -999, WHILE defending AND wearing the supposed "mandatory" cape from an attack that they have previously in a different attempt, taken regular amounts of damage from.

Not to mention that the Soul's hitbox is completely different IN EVERY SINGLE ATTACK. Every single one of Roaring Knight's attack patterns has a completely separate and unique hitbox to the Soul in regards to every other attack. Some attacks it's Center Pixel. Some attacks it's Outer Outline. And some attack's it's the entire 'near miss' zone.

Out of nearly 100 attempts, I have yet to discover any pattern, recognizable counter, or discernible defense against an RNG % change of "you get taken to -999". If you expect people to reliably do that entire fight without taking ANY damage whatsoever, that is straight up insanity. Either make every single attack take you to -999, demanding absolute inhuman perfection; or balance everything to do more damage and *not* have a #% chance to just remove you.
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Showing 1-15 of 313 comments
MortalMercury 5 Jun @ 2:18pm 
I just want them to make the sword tunnel more clear to see, the sword trails get mixed with the safe space
#1
DANK3RER 5 Jun @ 2:31pm 
well i mean you're not supposed to win.. unless...
#2
Pigunter 5 Jun @ 2:32pm 
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you quite literally not supposed to beat him in your first playthrough
#3
skirt pissing expert bonjuballs 5 Jun @ 2:34pm 
i never noticed that about the soul hitboxes, no wonder ive been feeling like a total idiot trying to dodge. HoldBreath helps a little but definitely not enough, and why is it that we dont get access to RedBuster or DualHeal during this fight?? ive also noticed that -999 only happens on ralsei for some reason, which is unfair because he just becomes a revivemint sponge. this fight NEEDS rebalancing. either that or make the shadow crystal just drop from the knight if you have the shadowmantle equipped.
#4
skirt pissing expert bonjuballs 5 Jun @ 2:36pm 
Originally posted by Pigunter:
you quite literally not supposed to beat him in your first playthrough
for people who beat jevil and spamton their first playthrough, its a real kick in the teeth to hear "youre supposed to die here and not get the thing youve been getting. sucks about your save file". no hate, im just saying its poor design.
#5
YumpKick 5 Jun @ 2:46pm 
controversial take but its fair. like, it was really fun to figure it out. i just needed a break after i got to the last phase and came back and did it. max our your tp gain so u can rude buster more often, and just let ralsei stay dead bc hes squishier than kris after the third wave of dark stars. hold down the button to move your soul slower during the scary sword ring. its super doable. shadow mantle on susie ofc
#6
Ｋａｔａｎ 5 Jun @ 2:54pm 
Originally posted by skirt enjoyer bonju balls:
i never noticed that about the soul hitboxes, no wonder ive been feeling like a total idiot trying to dodge. HoldBreath helps a little but definitely not enough, and why is it that we dont get access to RedBuster or DualHeal during this fight?? ive also noticed that -999 only happens on ralsei for some reason, which is unfair because he just becomes a revivemint sponge. this fight NEEDS rebalancing. either that or make the shadow crystal just drop from the knight if you have the shadowmantle equipped.


Regarding -999 hp, this happens to everyone except Kris, because Kris and the Roaring Knight have some sort of alliance.

I've never noticed any differences in the soul hitbox, do you have any actual proof?

In my opinion, the boss is fair enough. He literally has a couple of attacks that change slightly as the battle progresses. This boss forced me to put in a lot more effort than other bosses in Deltarune, and I was satisfied with that.
#7
Ｋａｔａｎ 5 Jun @ 2:57pm 
Originally posted by YumpKick:
controversial take but its fair. like, it was really fun to figure it out. i just needed a break after i got to the last phase and came back and did it. max our your tp gain so u can rude buster more often, and just let ralsei stay dead bc hes squishier than kris after the third wave of dark stars. hold down the button to move your soul slower during the scary sword ring. its super doable. shadow mantle on susie ofc


I only found out about the shadow mantle after defeating the knight. You have no idea what my 10 hours of playthrough looked like (literally no clue that a shadow mantle is needed to fight him).
#8
YumpKick 5 Jun @ 3:02pm 
Originally posted by Ｋａｔａｎ:
Originally posted by YumpKick:
controversial take but its fair. like, it was really fun to figure it out. i just needed a break after i got to the last phase and came back and did it. max our your tp gain so u can rude buster more often, and just let ralsei stay dead bc hes squishier than kris after the third wave of dark stars. hold down the button to move your soul slower during the scary sword ring. its super doable. shadow mantle on susie ofc


I only found out about the shadow mantle after defeating the knight. You have no idea what my 10 hours of playthrough looked like (literally no clue that a shadow mantle is needed to fight him).
ok yeah but seam directly references it in chapter 2 and its hard and obscure to get but dats da fun of it!!
#9
Ｋａｔａｎ 5 Jun @ 3:09pm 
Originally posted by YumpKick:
Originally posted by Ｋａｔａｎ:


I only found out about the shadow mantle after defeating the knight. You have no idea what my 10 hours of playthrough looked like (literally no clue that a shadow mantle is needed to fight him).
ok yeah but seam directly references it in chapter 2 and its hard and obscure to get but dats da fun of it!!

I thought it would be exactly as the fans suggested: a battle in green soul mode and without the mantle, we don't have a shield, so we can't win. There was no way I could have expected this to be a reduction in boss damage from 200 to 80.
#10
kikinak 5 Jun @ 7:48pm 
So far my strat has been:
Kris and Ralsei exist to guard for TP and distribute heals
Susie exists to rude buster
If you can keep Kris and Ralsei up that's great, more TP for more busters. If Kris goes down it sucks a lot, if Ralsei goes down it sucks slightly less because his guards don't enable a redbuster that turn if you're just shy. If both go down before Susie's out of voice lines you should probably just start over. If you can last that long though see if you can edge out a win anyway. If susie goes down, revive her. If she's down and you don't have revive items, just start over. It hasn't worked for me QUITE yet (Basic box cutter is easy, intermediate box cutter can be bs, advanced box cutter IS bs) but it's gotten me further than anything else I've tried
#11
boasterty 5 Jun @ 11:11pm 
Originally posted by Pigunter:
you quite literally not supposed to beat him in your first playthrough
its like my 2nd i have 2 hours its hard af it needs a nerf
#12
boasterty 5 Jun @ 11:15pm 
not to mention that fact that even with the mantle the defense is random toby fox needs to nerf this guy like how can attack 1 susie shadow mantle go from 15 no defending TO 60 in a diff attack the swords are EVEN worse with random hitboxes and its hard to see where to go im stuck on chapter 3 still cause of it needs a nerf
#13
qrtzero1 5 Jun @ 11:20pm 
Originally posted by DANK3RER:
well i mean you're not supposed to win.. unless...
He has the cape he said it himself
#14
qrtzero1 5 Jun @ 11:21pm 
Originally posted by kikinak:
So far my strat has been:
Kris and Ralsei exist to guard for TP and distribute heals
Susie exists to rude buster
If you can keep Kris and Ralsei up that's great, more TP for more busters. If Kris goes down it sucks a lot, if Ralsei goes down it sucks slightly less because his guards don't enable a redbuster that turn if you're just shy. If both go down before Susie's out of voice lines you should probably just start over. If you can last that long though see if you can edge out a win anyway. If susie goes down, revive her. If she's down and you don't have revive items, just start over. It hasn't worked for me QUITE yet (Basic box cutter is easy, intermediate box cutter can be bs, advanced box cutter IS bs) but it's gotten me further than anything else I've tried
Yeah why the hell does shadow mantle only work for one character when all three are pretty much needed to stand a chance against the roaring knight like what the hell
#15
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DELTARUNE > General Discussions > Topic Details
Date Posted: 5 Jun @ 1:22pm
Posts: 313

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