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r/nvidia
11.2k
5
RTX 4090 Adapter burned
95% Upvoted
level 1
You ran it hard into detonation caused from a lean condition. Richen it up a bit, just a quarter turn.
2
level 1
· 34 min. ago · edited 26 min. ago
5800X3D/RTX4090
Asus 4090 TUF / Phanteks Evolve X / Be Quiet! Straight Power 11 850W / Be Quiet! Adapter Cable:
https://i.imgur.com/umEwT7J.jpg (closed side panel without force on cable possible)
https://i.imgur.com/JJ2GmXQ.jpg
450W @ 48,5° (119,3F):
https://i.imgur.com/Db1CaiB.jpg
And still, I don't like the 12HPWR Connector at all. Silly little fragile connector.
3
level 1
This happened - at the time - with my GTX1660. Out of the blue, same conditions as always, no load, simply 'puff'. Fire. The retail said it was my fault somehow after I've sent photos, descriptions and offered to pay to have it sent to a technician of their choice. They basically told me to give up. And that's how I lost a new GTX 1660 after 5 months of upgrading. /rantoff :'(
6
level 2
It's a simple plug connection, unless there was liquid damage of other signs of tampering I'd ask them to prove it. Absolute scum
6
level 1
This connector was supposed to be in the back of the card, so that you don't have to bend it in order to install it in the direction of the card. It should came out from the back of the case directly on the back of the card, and this would be very useful. This idea with 4090 because this card is long and larger than the board, so there was a great opportunity for this idea to be applied because the board will not remain an obstacle. sorry for my bad English.
2
level 2
· 3 hr. ago
RTX 4090 MSI Suprim Liquid X
No chance in hell he/she will tell you that. Especially after the nvidia mafia got to him. Probably sending him a whole ass new rig with a 5090 to keep him/her quiet.
13
level 1
Huehuehue glad I decided to hold off on getting it until these things are figured out, without fail there has been issues with each generation for early adopters. Guess i'll stick with 2080 Ti for now. It looks like this has happened to other people as well.
5
level 2
· 3 hr. ago
RTX 4090 MSI Suprim Liquid X
If i gamed on a 1440P display i would have kept my 2080ti also, but im playing on a 55" C1 OLED and HDMI 2.1 is needed for all the features.
2
level 1
What is your gpu and what's the TDP on that card and what was the power limit set at while you were gaming at that moment? If you can answer that it will help a lot of people. 4090 ought to be undervolted.
1
level 1
Looks like AMD changed their mind.
I wonder how far into the production stage AIBs are for 4070s, 4060s and 4050s. Maybe they can still change the design, or would that be too late? After all they would have to alter the production line as well.
10
level 1
Another thing crossed my mind. Would a 90 adapter solve anything? It really is just moving the problem down stream when you think if it.
Sure, you can now put the side panel on but it does not eliminate this issue. If anything it adds additional points of failure. There are now two pinned connections at the ends of the 90 adapter. Furthermore, once the 90 routes this nvidia adapter down, you need to bend it down and under the gpu. Then you need to bend it sideways again to go around the motherboard.
The 90 adapter technically will shorten the distance of allowance on these bends since the adapter will now snake tighter to the underside of the gpu.
2
level 1
Praying this is only an adapter issue lol, ATX 3.0 PSU looks like it was a SOLID choice to purchase in hindsight instead of reusing my old PSU.
4
level 2
You're going to be fine, no extreme bend on the connector is the key to success and you have got enough space.
On this topic, there are literally thousands of people who are arguing against Nvidia in bad faith instead of providing actionable advice and steps that one can take to ensure a safe build. I despise this behavior on Reddit and in Tech Youtube sphere right now. Fearmongering instead of being helpful.
2
level 2
· 4 hr. ago · edited 4 hr. ago
Given where the melting is occurring, combined with the fact that this connector is putting up to twice as much power through the same number of slightly smaller pins compared to the 8 pin connectors its replacing, it's more likely to be either a design flaw with the standard for this connector or connectors not manufactured fully up to spec rather than an adapter-specific issue.
0
level 1
I wonder if this can be fixed via a software patch?
If there are sense pins, the card can obviously monitor each leg of the strand, in turn monitoring each pcie connection.
If it can monitor various data points such as voltage and current draw maybe it can detect discrepancies that arise that indicate increased draw. There undoubtedly would indications something was going wrong based on the gpus power consumption curve prior to it melting.
1
level 2
Unless they can monitor the current through each individual wire, I doubt it. a bad connection only adds a bit of voltage drop that can very well be outside the precision of the conection sensor.
1
level 1
I’m going to wait until ATX 3.0 PSU’s release now before biting the bullet on a 4090, and get a custom 16 to 16 pin connector from here for better flexibility:
2
level 2
I just bought/received my ATX 3.0 MSI MPEG A1000G PCIE-5/ATX 3.0 PSU -- it's great. I still don't understand, though, if I should be concerned since I am not using the included adaptor -- rather just plugged the 16 to 16 pin provided by my PSU to my ASUS TUF OC 4090.
2
level 2
+24V would be possible with a two or quad rail PSU by just wiring them serially. But most modern PSUs don't use multiple 12V Rails anymore as a single rail can be implemented more efficiently and has better load balancing.
Adding a +24V Rail will not happen because the CPU is +12V and it makes sense for load balancing issues and price/size of PSUs that GPU and CPU share the same voltage. A PSU with just 24V instead of +12V would not be backwards compatible with any hardware, not even Hard drives.
If they drop backwards compatibility, they will go directly to 48V because this is already a standard for a lot of server hardware including CPU VRM, OAM Accelerator GPUs like H100 and Mi-250X as well as network equipment like switches, Nics etc.
But why not stay with +12V for a while? It is not that there are hard connector space constraints in the PCIe Format, considering how big a 4090 actually is and how little area the connector occupies. There is ample space for better connectors, nothing wrong with multiple 8P PCIe Cables and or a possible uprated 12P or 16pin variant for ATX 3.1. It is just important to ditch the stupid Micro Fit 3.0 Crimp contacts and return to the the tried and tested 4.2mm Mini-Fit which offer much higher Current rating and lower heat density than the 3,0 Connectors.
1
level 2
24V brings other issues, and inside the gpu in this case. Higher voltage mosfets have higher RdsON and switch slower so you will have more losses in them. And increasing the input voltage of a buck converter decreases its duty and adds ripple to the inductor current so you now have more losses in the inductor, too.
A higher current just needs more copper and better connections, which are more cost effective and give a better overall performance.
2
level 1
[deleted]
· 8 hr. agolevel 1
Had this with a 3090 back when I bought it.
The reason IMO was the contacts inside the plug had been to wide (these tubes out of metal) . So there was a small space between some of the pins and the tube in the plug. This cause a spark to appear and the plug and socket melted on the surface.
The card is still working though and never had a problem after that (new cables).
1
level 1
· 8 hr. ago · edited 8 hr. ago
All it takes is 0.001% of the customers out of a million to have a fire risk and you now got housefires.
Time for power mods - replacing the socket with a soldered extension board with 3x PCIE (or directly solder thick cables to the GPU and move the plug somewhere else).
2
level 1
Why are they insisting one using one connector instead of splitting into say 2 cables and spreading the current\load and bending moment of the cables ? as with previous generation cards. When looking at the cable braiding it almost comes across like it's multiple grouped anyways. Medium pcb with large heat-sink
8
level 2
It simplifies the assembly and cuts on the only cost that doesn't really drop with scale; the price of assembling it and testing everything; every extra pin is an extra point of failure, every extra soldering point is another point of failure, every single additional separate component is another step in the assembly.
The better way to put the question is why are they so desperately tying to save cents on a $1600 product that they chose to run at 450 watts stock instead of 320 watts with 92% of the performance preserved and didn't leave worrying about trying to shove space-heater wattage through on AIBs selling souped up versions and overclockers accepting liability.
2
level 1
What's even stupider is this stupid cable didn't even need to exist they just did it to save a few mm of space. Make a GPU 2-3X bigger but don't have an issue with that but have an issue with how much space they need for cable ports.
12
level 2
Lol no doubt. You see how they reacted to Jayz2cents when he mentioned a concern about the new adapter?
6
level 1
Y’all got me worried about my card melting my entire new build, or worse my house 😂. My bend is more aggressive than OP’s.
8
level 2
Show us the build! Lol hope nothing crazy happens with your stuff, dude.
1
level 1
https://i.imgur.com/eLfCBhe.jpg Dumb shit engineers at nvidia if you can't design a good connector then at least use readily available XT90 or XT150 connectors !!!!!
10
level 1
level 2
· 10 hr. ago
AMD
My dude, have you never cable managed a pc before? Literally one of the first things when cable managing gpu power cables is making a 180° harsh bend backwards to get the cables out of the way and through the chassis holes. Making a power connector that will fail catastrophically in the use case of 90% of pc builders is an epic fail. I lucked out to grab an evga 3070 last year. Normal 8 pin connectors and the last gen of THE best add in partner there ever was. Rip.
7
level 2
Here is the thing though. Cables in DIY PCs are often heavily abused. They should be designed with this in mind.
The old 8 Pins can take crazy bending. PCBs are usually hardened to withstand some level of dropping and smashing unscathed.
This adaptor on the other hand is designed with requiring care in how it's being used. That's just no bueno for the DIY market.
9
level 2
· 11 hr. ago
5800X3D/RTX4090
He is using an ATX 3.0 PSU without an adapter. How is this helpful for the current cases?
8
level 1
what is even more problematic is this user have the GPU vertical mounted where the cable seems to have least amount of stress and still got burnt out.
15
level 2
how does tension on a cable effect heat. It got burned because there was to much output power and too much resistance. Reducing tension shouldnt effect this
-2
level 1
Now I am thinking about adding 2 thermal sensors around the 12VHPWR connector with a Buzzer.
11
level 1
· 12 hr. ago
RTX 2080 FE | i7-10700k | 2x16GB DDR4 | 1440UW
The card that runs twice as fast...
10
level 2
level 2
[deleted]
· 13 hr. agolevel 1
Imagine it went worst, not only gpu but psu+mobo+ram....
easy 1000 more usd! :I
6
level 2
And the entire apartment building with multiple families going ablaze in the middle of the night because someone left PC rendering overnight and went to sleep.
3
level 1
· 13 hr. ago · edited 12 hr. ago
People should send full specifications of their new high end graphics card and ask their home insurance companies how they judge the fire safety of these things. Especially if they have any heat damage at all at the connector. Temperature measurements at the connector would be great if possble.
If you don't want to risk your insurance fee to rise, contact the local fire marshal.
Then include the responses in a class action against Nvidia.
Edit: Some people seem to not understand. If your house burns down and your insurance company finds out that high power electrical installations have not been done by a professional, they will give you the finger and let you suit yourself.
The same applies if you use stuff that has been widely known for constituting a high risk regarding fire safety.
The power cable for the 4090 is marketed as totally safe, which it is not. It is also meant for an appliance which is very much meant to be able to be left running unattended for days. Some renders take days to complete, and the 4090 is one of the most fitting products for these uses performance wise.
1
level 2
Then include the responses in a class action against Nvidia.
The license agreement for the nvidia driver package includes an opt-in to arbitration.
1
level 2
At this point there is not much you can do at those power levels.
Probably soldering 1cm thick wires directly on the PCB won't cut it either at those amps.
I think somebody will push for 24V or 30V for graphics so they can reduce the current delivered and make the VRMs work with that.
1
level 2
It's amusing that you think the insurance staff will even know what a GPU is, let alone have the risk considered and rated within their systems and underwriting.
4
level 2
Class action for a single failure?
What are you smoking?
They will replace this single card that failed, look into what caused it and test to see if it's a hardware fault and then determine if they need to put out a recall.
Your first response is to suggest a class action for a single item failure? Thats not even possible..
Are you high bro?
7
level 1
Out of curiosity, and really hope this didnt happen, but did the gpu set on fire while playing or did it just turn off?
4
level 1
Those wires and pins are so thin. No way it can handle the wattage. Personally I wouldn't buy any card with that kind of connector until ATX 3.0 PS comes out. But even then I still wouldn't...Just doesn't look good .(Wires are way too thin to handle the wattage, especially if you are going to run it all day and night) a Triple 8 pin or Quad 8 pin would have been much much better. since you are already plugging 4 8 pins to THAT..!!!!
5
level 2
The wires are likely fine - 18AWG can do up to 10A 12V for short runs ~100W.
But when clustered together they heat each other up and any weak points massively increase resistance at those points.
2
level 2
People should collect the exact specs of wire thickness and wattage, preferably get a power draw per pin if they have the equipment to measure it. The send it to the local fire marshal and ask if it's a fire hazard.
Include the responses in a class action against Nvidia.
2
level 2
I have to agree with that. And hate it when ppl say its 10wires . Its the same as a thick wire! But its not . Many wires next to each other create more heat. Induction exists.
4
level 2
like the old back draft ride at universal studios. Feels like real immolation!
2
level 1
That's a shame. But really, these cards are sucking like 600W through those little pins, if the connector's the slightest bit loose, you're going to get significant heating. That's the kind of issue that causes electrical fires in house wiring.
9
level 2
connector needs improvement. But the last 90 watts is basically just current for 1% better performance, two stupid decisions in one.
If they hadn't reinvented the wheel, or been more sensible on TDP, this would be easier to solve. Yet here we are..
1
level 1
I wonder if the adapters for the other 30xx series cards could have this issue too? I believe i bent my 3060 Ti Adapter less than 35 mm.
1
level 2
No lol. This is a combination of fragility and the amount of power being pushed through. Your little 3060 will be just fine.
1
level 2
Maybe 🫤 EVGA used this connector on the 3090ti and it pulls nearly as much power (especially if overclocked). 😬
2
level 1
· 14 hr. ago · edited 14 hr. ago
Those wondering after looking at all the cards out there, only one has that silver square slither and Geforce RTX logo stacked over one another. (OPs machine https://ibb.co/1L7H0b )
https://www.gigabyte.com/Graphics-Card/GV-N4090GAMING-OC-24GD#kf
Also worth noting:
Unlike some other custom designs today, Gigabyte is giving you the whole 600 W maximum power limit adjustment range, the default out of the box power limit is still the same 450 W as on the Founders Edition.Oct 12, 2022
That said, we don't know if the OP cranked it up to 600w. I think 450w (out of the box on all 4090's) should be safe and generate a significantly amount less of heat and obviously current vs max power. Everyone should take a deep breath.
10
level 2
The cable spec is 600w, if he cranked it it still shouldn't happen, end of story.
3
level 1
Little sidetracking here, but I do car audio. A 600 watt amplifier requires 8awg power wire. The 4090 recommends something like 850w. How are these pins able to deal with the heat generated? Is this why the plastic has started to melt?
2
level 2
In addition to what everyone else said, it's the connector that melted, not the wire. This connection is meant to handle 600W max across all 12 pins (so ~8A per pair of pins).
The fact that only one row of pins melted suggests to me that the connector was under sideways strain. If the pin and socket aren't making a solid connection with each other, it'll act like a thin wire and heat up.
The worrying thing is that almost all of these connectors will be under side strain in people's PCs, especially with such a massive card
2
level 2
Amps are what really matter not watts. But i think these things run off 12V like a car does so you can compare.
1
level 2
· 14 hr. ago · edited 14 hr. ago
It only requires 8awg because of the distance from the battery, 10awg easily handles 600w at shorter cable runs. With these smaller cables, you have the power split across several, so you need to add up the total cross section area to compare to a single wire. 10awg is around 5.26mm2, 8awg is around 8.37mm2, so for 6 cables to match 10awg they don't need to be more than .87mm2, and to match 8awg they'd each need to be around 1.4mm2. 16awg is 1.3mm2, so 6 pairs of that would handle only slightly less current than 8awg, and 6 pairs of 14awg would handle more. The wire itself is plenty large, and shouldn't heat up with 600w of draw.
The issue here is probably bad connection at the pins, which causes heat to build up. Each pin needs to handle like 8.5a, which isn't a huge amount, but with such small pins they need a really good connection to handle that. Bend things around or even just not fully seat it, and you'll have heat problems.
10
level 2
Because the power is distributed between all the cables. Not each pin needs 850 w. It is likely that they are still under gauged.
3
level 1
Hope the RMA is smooth sailing, lame issue but it is a new cable... Looking forward to some investigations on YouTube on this
6
level 2
level 1
If it was a MSI card they'd just say it wasn't installed by a professional and wipe their hands clean of it like they did to my 1k card
5
level 1
If it's a MSI card... I must say it literally got afterburned!
Jokes aside, I hope the OP can resolve this situation as soon as possible!
21
level 1
I'm happy with my 4080 MSI Gaming Treo, at 1st I was bummed it's not an overclock card, but now I'm happy it only has 3 8 pins like my 3090ti. Where are the pictures of the installed card before the fire. Not blaming the card owner however, makes you wonder about other parts like the power supply quality and how tight/sharp the cable was strung.
7
level 2
You can still just connect three cables to the adapter with four headers and it should limit the power to 450W. Not sure if that would prevent things like this, though.
1
level 2
I’m assuming you mean 4090? The 4080 isn’t in the natural wild yet.
2
level 1
You would think for the kind of money NVIDIA is asking for its flagship that it would be bulletproof.
15
level 1
Moore's law, and your $1699 month old gpu, are dead! Fun times
12
level 2
I just got a 3080ti because they went on sale and I don’t want a full size brick for a GPU🤣
4
level 2
level 1
just put some BGA solder balls into the slots and let it fuse to the board.
3
level 1
lol I'll bet you Nvidia is asking OP to remove the post in exchange for a paycheck or something.
37
level 2
Nah. Too late for that.
They're going to try to replace the card and get the borked one so they can do some analysis and see if they have a big problem on their hands.
This honestly looks like a bad pin connection due to the adapter design. They SHOULD redesign the adapter cable to have more hard material to keep the cables from bending to the point where the barrel and pin don't have a secure connection anymore.
An angled plug would do nicely.
2
level 2
· 16 hr. ago
12700KF | AORUS MASTER 4090 | 32gb DDR5
The post is out there. They can remove it all they want but that image isn’t going away lol.
4
level 2
No, you’re insurance company will ask for a list of peripherals within your personal computers and then raise for your rates if you have an RTX 5090. If you don’t disclose, then they will charge you the rate for 1x RTX 5090 for every individual in your house hold. Also, you can install the new Insurance Adjuster browser plugin that automatically forwards any and all purchases to your insurance provider for policy review! You’ll save $100 a year on your premium!
2
level 1
Someone have to make a better connector and cable for power hungry card, looks like those tiny pins cant take the amp
9
level 2
nothing to do with it, there was a contact failure resulting in excessive resistance.
a problem that could and did affect the molex mini fit 8 and 6 pins too.
7
level 1
· 17 hr. ago · edited 17 hr. ago
Why they (Nvidia) cant put the connector in a not shitty spot Ill never know.
12
level 2
· 16 hr. ago
Ryzen 5 3600| RTX 3080
Why can't they just put 3/4 8pins on the thing and just move on. They like the small pcb too much.
3
level 1
Pretty crazy, but it doesnt suprise me really, when I saw that 3090 destroyed their own vram this kind of problems where just a matter of time
9
level 1
level 2
Jay is all clickbait content who has no actual knowledge about anything.
-2
level 2
I'm in doubt because the connector is tiny. Not sure it can handle the ampere.
2
level 1
Is this the adapter for connecting to the non-ATX3.0 PSUs? Or does this issue exist with the 12V connector (for ATX3.0 PSU) as well?
6
level 2
Yes the adapter is for PSU's that are not ATX 3.0. The atx 3.0 psu's have the 12vhpwr cables and deliver the 600w of power properly but those cables should not be bent either because they are still liable for causing strain on the connector.
3
level 2
level 2
That what I bacially said in another comment here and got down voted to obviation.
I fixed bad connector like that when I repaired coin operated devices(games) that was a common problem.
1
level 1
· 18 hr. ago
NVIDIA
Aparently Nvidia reached out to op, according to a mod.
But what did the nvidia representative say?
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I borrowed a thermal imaging camera from work to take a look at the temps of my connector after seeing the melted one. I ran Superpostion Benchmark for about 20 mins and then took the images while the benchmark was still running. The GPU was pulling around 400W during the runs. This is the MSI Gaming X Trio with only the 3 8-pin adapter. The connector averaged 120F. That doesn't seem too hot to me, but I cant really find any temp specs for the connector either. I am curious to see what the community thinks.
https://i.redd.it/0p56wqeizvv91.jpghttps://i.redd.it/8rn4treizvv91.jpghttps://i.redd.it/dkpwxreizvv91.jpghttps://i.redd.it/54ao2yeizvv91.jpg526
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Problem: The 12VHPWR cable is allegedly prone to heat issues if bent incorrectly. Cablemod did their own testing while developing their cables and reported that "bending the wires too close to the connector could result in some of the terminals coming loose or misaligning within the connector itself. This may lead to an uneven load across the other wires, increasing the risk of overheating damage. The risk of this is substantially higher if the bend is done horizontally in relation to the connector orientation (left to right)."
If you check their guide on this, they discourage bending the cable at all any closer than 35mm from where the cables meet the jack:
So, obviously a power cable MUST be bent to route it from the PSU to the GPU, no matter how you orient your card and no matter where the PSU is located in whatever case you have, but let's focus on just the bend you have to make where the cable meets the GPU when oriented traditionally (horizontal, directly into the motherboard) and how that factors into the clearance that's required of your case when it comes to DEPTH. Case manufacturers will typically publish this dimension as cooler clearance.
Here's the total clearance required for several 4090s on the market when factoring the 35mm of additional cable space required to perform a bend safely without removing your side panel.
Caveat: I'm ignoring the fact that some cards have recessed power terminals. The Cablemod guidance doesn't factor the width of the jack itself, so it's a wash. I have a MSI Gaming Trio 4090, and the end of the jack is flush with the outer edge of the GPU's backplate. Other cards without recessed power terminals will actually have MORE effective depth than I'm listing below.
| GPU | Total Depth | GPU width |
|---|---|---|
| NVIDIA FE | 172 | 137 |
| MSI GAMING TRIO | 175 | 140 |
| MSI SUPRIM | 177 | 142 |
| ASUS STRIX | 184 | 149 |
| ASUS TUF | 195 | 160 |
| GIGABYTE GAMING OC | 185 | 150 |
| GIGABYTE WINDFORCE | 185 | 150 |
| GIGABYTE AORUS | 198 | 163 |
| ZOTAC AIRO | 185 | 150 |
| ZOTAC TRINITY | 200 | 165 |
The required clearance ranges from 172mm - 201mm.
Now, let's look at some cases
| Case | Cooler Clearance |
|---|---|
| COOLERMASTER HAF 700 EVO | 166 |
| CORSAIR 5000D AIRFLOW | 170 |
| ASUS HELIOS | 190 |
| LIAN LI O11D | 158 |
| LIAN LI O11D EVO | 167 |
| LIAN LI O11D XL | 167 |
| FRACTAL MESHIFY 2 | 185 |
| NZXT H7 FLOW | 185 |
| FRACTAL DEFINE 7 | 185 |
| PHANTEkS P600S | 190 |
So, as you can see, a lot of these cases, even some of the big boys that you'd just assume could easily fit a 4090, actually can't fit many of the AIBs horizontally without bending the 12VHPWR tighter than Cablemod is stating is reliable. I keep seeing posts with people showing off their new 4090s with the 12VHPWR adapters pressed up against the glass, then you see posts about these same cables melting.
I'm sitting here with my MSI Gaming Trio in my Lian Li O11D with the glass off. There are 2 things that can save us: (1) a Right Angle adapter that's compatible with all 4090s, while still not protruding more than about 20mm. The adapter Cablemod is about to release tacks on an additional 23mm, and will not fit on a lot of these 4090s that have their 12VHPWR terminals recessed into the radiator. NVIDIA really should have provided a RA adapter from day 1. (2) Case manufacturers need to start making deeper cases.
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