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Why Are Neoliberals So Hated

255

Why Are Neoliberals So Hated

Why is everyone on politics YouTube always telling me to blame neoliberals for all my problems. Yet I find myself agreeing with like, 90%+ of the stuff you guys are saying. Like, your positions are shockingly reasonable despite everything BreadTube has told me.
Why does it seem like both sides of the isle demonize you (us? am I turning into a neolib) as the bad guys?

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User avatar
level 1
· 14 hr. ago · edited 14 hr. ago
r/place '22: Neoliberal Battalion

I can't speak for this whole subreddit, but from what I've gathered, neoliberal means something different to every person. Some people associate neoliberal with Ronald Reagan, which is far from this subreddit. Some people associate neoliberal with Augusto Pinochet, which is even farther from this subreddit.

But there's also the fact that people on BreadTube really don't know what they're talking about most of the time. I wouldn't take anything they say seriously (in fact, I already don't).

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User avatar
level 2

Some people associate neoliberal with Ronald Reagan, which is far from this subreddit. Some people associate neoliberal with Augusto Pinochet, which is even farther from this subreddit.

Well those two are what neoliberal classically meant and what it still means in large parts of the world. It was just this sub that decided to co opt it.

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level 2

The association with Ronald Reagan is far removed from this sub because it has been overrun by succs.

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· 6 hr. ago
David Ricardo

Speak for yourself on Reagan!

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Neolib is so complex

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level 2

I think this is 100% it. No one really seems to be able to define "neoliberalism" except as something they don't like. I've heard neoliberalism blamed for "greedy insurance companies bleeding people for healthcare!" even though this sub is very pro-national healthcare.

I've also seen it blamed for environmental pollution, even though neoliberals are very adamant that companies be responsible for their negative externalities.

So I think it really has become a catchall word for anything bad, much like "capitalism" seems to be on Reddit.

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level 1

This sub was formed by offshoots of r/be that was tired of being called neoliberal for mild political opinions.

It’s perfectly reasonable to hate neoliberalism because neoliberalism is defined as everything you don’t like and the more you don’t like it the more neoliberal it is.

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· 12 hr. ago
Michel Foucault

The heck iswas "r/be?"

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· 14 hr. ago
Paul Krugman

Right now it is popular to be edgy and anti-establishment. "Neoliberal" is just a word you use to signal that you're part of that club. It has 500 definitions depending who you ask.

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· 13 hr. ago · edited 13 hr. ago
YIMBY

Yeah and calling yourself a neoliberal is a way of signalling that you actually believe in institutions and incremental change rather than a desire to just blow up the system. And most Americans are more or less in this camp, but it's considered really cool now to be a radical (either on the left or right depending on which group you want to be cool with).

The reason I come to this sub (aside from the excellent shitposts) is that the consensus here isn't around societal overhaul but around ways to improve the system we have and to appreciate that tradeoffs and unintended consequences do exist. And when people here challenge what might be considered NL orthodoxy (as long as no one dares question LVT or YIMBYism) it doesn't result in a flood of downvotes all but ensuring that alternative viewpoints are missed. Instead, the result is usually an honest debate. And honestly, this sub is much more fun and interesting for it. Other political subs can get boring when the top comment is always pithy dig at the other side that doesn't illuminate anything.

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level 2

Right now it is popular to be edgy and anti-establishment.

Seems it's been that way all my life and I remember when Carter was President. Narcissistic cynicism is a fun way to feel superior when you have little knowledge or control in the world, and I'm ashamed to say that it's something I've engaged in when I couldn't figure out what's going on. Admitting that is painful though and I don't expect there's a line of people who are excited to tell everyone how wrong they were.

I mean, I enjoy it because I hope I can convince other people it's okay to change your mind and admit you were wrong about something but it seems most people don't want to do that and there are a lot of social pressures to never admit fault ever.

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Yeah. I must say I when really lost on my political views, and this group is really different from what o read about the neo-liberal meaning and I must say it’s the place I agree the most…

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· 10 min. ago
r/place '22: Neoliberal Battalion

All of them amplified by Putin’s bots seeking to drive more extremist views in the US and poison democracy.

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· 14 hr. ago
Ben Bernanke

Literally every neoliberal is extremely repulsively evil

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Worms

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· 10 hr. ago · edited 10 hr. ago
Paul Krugman

I thought it was because were all just so handsome. They jelly.

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Am I turning into a neolib?

Based.

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Because neoliberalism is the status quo. If there is any issue in the world then neolibs take the blame.

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This sub is a bit different from the politics of Reagan and Thatcher

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· 13 hr. ago
Milton Friedman

Speak for yourself, a Friedman flair is here.

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From what I can see, this sub would highly approve of the economic liberalisation that these leaders implemented after the stagnation that both countries suffered. And rightfully so.

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Not all that different. This sub is a big tent. But when it comes to the globalization of populations and the spread of capitalism and free markets through trade deals and diplomacy is pretty universal among the Reagans, Bushes, Clintons and Obamas of the world.

There is just disagreement over how much should be left to the market and how much should be taken up by the government.

But we can all agree that common markets and global corporation is key for a more peaceful and prosperous world.

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Which is exactly why "Neoliberal" is a terrible choice of branding.

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Are they even neoliberals? I don't think they would agree with much of the stuff here.

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· 4 hr. ago
r/place '22: Neoliberal Battalion

I think people would probably balk at NPM and other austerity methods.

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It's basically saying "i generally support the establishment and center left/center right candidates" My SIL almost shat when I told her this.

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· 9 hr. ago · edited 8 hr. ago

The neoliberalism of the 1980s did have serious problems, especially since it was merged with Conservatism. Many people here are just Obama Democrats or something and got so sick of being called neoliberals by Bernie Bros in 2016 that they kept the label and ran with it.

Most people here are just technocratic social liberals.

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· 13 hr. ago
Milton Friedman

r/Neoliberal and actual Neoliberals are 2 seperate things. r/Neoliberal is socially progressive Hayek Flairs or Extremist Third Way Clintonites. Actual Neoliberals vary from Libertarian Friedmanites and Hayekists who want a completely Laisez-Faire Economy to Neoconservative Reaganites and Thatcherites to Centrist Obama Moderate. The big thing is Free Trade, Markets, Private Enterprise, etc. The big debate is how extreme we should take those policies.

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Most ppl on this sub believe there is a role for government and at times it needs to be a strong role. Sometimes people confuse us for libertarians, but they would say we are "statists". We are typically pro-Fed for example. However we are strongly anti authoritarian and believe in the separation of powers.

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· 14 hr. ago
Buttigieg

Hate us cause they anus.

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Well there’s your problem, you listen to BreadTubers.

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But bread is delicious

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Because neoliberalism is the establishment. It's how the world has worked for the last four decades.

And the internet (like breadtube) is filled with extremists who hate the status quo.

Dislike neo liberalism? Just look at the trainwrecks that happen when you try the political systems advocated for on breadtube

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Breadtube is mostly political systems that haven't been tried though...

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· 14 hr. ago
I love Holland 🇳🇱🇳🇱🇳🇱♥😍🥰🌷

Because they are

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Mr Chizzbizz back again with the facts and logic

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· 10 hr. ago
European Union

Neoliberals are hated because they have a reputation of having policies that enable inequality formation.

No support for western labour, all the support for western capital.

That's the reputation

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Probably the most realistic reason in this post. When people feel like they haven't reaped the benefits of policies built around free trade, globalization, and market-based solutions, why would they support them today or in the future? Politics is where the rubber meets the road for policies.

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Because they see us as the ones who are in power. We basically built the most successful countries on liberal values and this drives them totally insane because it goes against everything they believe in. While they built nightmare societies like North Korea we built success stories like South Korea.

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Eh south Korea does have its problems, namely overwork, declining productivity and birthrates, dangerously lopsided sex demographics, etc

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It's more that they see you as the ones in power, and therefore responsible for everything that is wrong with the modern world.

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Equating the people on Bread Tube with the policies of North Korea is extremely disingenuous.

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House Harkonnen did nothing wrong.

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House Corrino rules the Imperium by divine right

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Like not really us, people who know what they’re talking about just think we’re weird dorks with odd aesthetic preferences

But imagine if you were personally committed to the ideological assertion that there was such a thing as History. There is a teleological progression of society mediated by the relationship between the means of production invariably trending towards greater public control of the economy.

And then some egg heads convinced everyone this was bullshit, cut taxes, slashed welfare, raised tuition, sold off state enterprises and instituted bed time, trashing your heart and soul ideological project for two generations

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Because neolibs live in reality and reality scares people.

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· 10 hr. ago
Noahpinion-Medlock Liberal

People on this sub are not neolibs in the way most people use the word. People here are mostly social liberals and socdems

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· 12 hr. ago · edited 12 hr. ago
John Locke

Because... Neoliberals are just liberals. So is just leftist attacking the political view they've always attacked: liberalism (or fascism, same thing)


The serious answer: because it's perceived to be the ideology of western countries establishments... And who doesn't hate the status quo?

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Welcome to the bad guys😎

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· 9 hr. ago
r/place '22: Neoliberal Battalion

The status quo is the “neoliberal system.” The more you find things wrong with how things are, the more you hate neoliberalism. Whatever let ideology you pick doesn’t have any of the problems inherent in doing difficult things in an imperfect world. Instead you get to live in a fantasy that if only everyone was as intelligent and enlightened as you there would be no societal problems.

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This sub is literally just the Democratic Party. It even has its own Progressive wing and Conservative wing that hate each other but for the most part people here are just mainstream democrats. I really wish that this sub could move away from the Neoliberal title though because Neoliberal has a very real meaning and it is NOT what most of this sub is supportive of. Neoliberalism as it’s understood in academia and in countries that underwent reforms that were labeled “neoliberal” is associated with the likes of Ronald Reagan and Margaret Thatcher.

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· 12 hr. ago · edited 11 hr. ago

I always thought this place was created in direct response to the breadtube types. Like they made neoliberal a dirty word so we're reclaiming it. I may be wrong though. Anyways, here neoliberal basically just means "anyone left leaning who isn't a socialist", and even that is enough for some of the more ideological of the breadtubers to hate us

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I think it was less about 'reclaiming' the word neoliberal and more about just using it ironically until around about 2019 people started unironically calling themselves neoliberal.

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I think that definition is fitting for the largest group of the sub: the succs. But we also have libertarian leaning people, center right people and even people who are just more in the center really.

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Neoliberals do have specific positions that are often viewed negatively, or with which many on the political left disagree.

So briefly, I would define neoliberalism as a market based view of social outcomes, and free trade oriented policies, albeit with some degree of regulation to ensure fair play.

One example that people might point to, with regards to negative effects of neoliberalism, is the European Union. Especially going back to around 2012 or so, there was massive unemployment in smaller european countries that were less competitive in terms of trade. In greece the youth unemployment rate reached 50%, and many blame neoliberal oriented policies like a common currency, removal of trade barriers, austerity politics, etc.

Obviously many populist/nationalist movements whether brexit or trump dislike many neoliberal ideas, free trade and immigration.

I don't want to get into my own views or critiques. But while I may agree with many neoliberal goals, values, and the practical aspects(big tent, willingness to compromise), I think that some of the prevailing neoliberal principles are flawed in their applications.

But the biggest thing you have to understand is just the mentality of leftism, its a very "us vs them" attitude. Even when I agree with specific left policies, I may not like the approach. For example, if a policy is wildly unpopular with 40% of the country, I would rather not implement it, even if I personally like the policy. I generally think that most social programs should have broad support so you aren't playing this crazy tug of war with legislation.

While I may support free college, student loan forgiveness, universal health care, I don't want to see a program pass just to "win", I want to see programs that have broad support that don't require tons of compromise and fandangling. I'm not set on one specific solution. Aside from some basics like civil rights, I generally don't like to see controversial policies shoved through.

Many left people do not have this attitude. They want their policies implemented at all costs, and view any resistance as an offense that is actively hurting people. They rightfully point to negative labor or healthcare outcomes as harm, but at the same time, the solution is always some specific policy, even for very complex issues like healthcare or education.

Finally, specific politicians seen as neoliberal may be particularly unpopular, especially with the political left. Is it any wonder with the recent presidential primary politics? It may seem like some of these politicians are rich and out of touch. Or it could be said they are only protecting corporate interests or the status quo.

I mostly just follow this sub because it is so active and actually has real discussions. I am more policy aligned with left people, although perhaps in a practical sense I am neoliberal in terms of the political process. I don't see politics as something to be won or lost for your cause, but something that just takes work so that you can balance competing interests. So I am more interested in compromise, just as part of the political process, than most people on the left.

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· 11 hr. ago · edited 10 hr. ago
Richard Thaler
  1. Strident idealism generates passion.

  2. Dogma prefers purity and generates hostility towards the heretic.

  3. Pragmatic, step-by-step, feedback driven, objectively measurable politics doesn't inspire youth.

  4. Applying the scientific method to government pops idealistic bubbles.

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· 6 hr. ago
Unflaired Flair to Dislike

Don't mistake this subs opinions for the opinions of neoliberals

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[deleted]
· 12 hr. ago

The reason this sub in particular gets demonized is because its full of hawks that glorify violence. I don't just mean against dictators but against civilian populations as well. Hence why they added no toxic nationalism rules.

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This is a big part of why I argue that Neolib is a (mostly) right leaning sub.

When it comes to LGBTQ and all that good stuff, neolibs are quite clearly in the progressive camp.

But when it comes to war and violence, the cross over between what hits 1K+ upvotes here and what hits the top of R/ Conservative or Republican is a bit alarming.

The stories about stuff like "Raytheons knife missile" - that was a 1k+ upvoted thread here, and in all the right wing subs - they have the exact same comments and everything, it's wild.

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Other people like to explain what's wrong. We like to explain what's right. That gets annoying.

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· 10 hr. ago
r/place '22: Neoliberal Battalion

Its cool to be contrarian. It doesn't take much to realize that people just hate the establishment and use the word "neoliberal" to describe anything they do not like.

Ignore them steer away from them and join the dark side. I welcome you the center-left, center, or center-right. Welcome home fellow shill.

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· 9 hr. ago
Pacific Islands Forum

They use a different definition of neoliberals. We’re basically open minded r/politics

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They hate us cuz they ain't us

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· 9 hr. ago
Immanuel Kant

Because the people doing the hating are populists. Singling out a group and blaming them for all your problems is a prerequisite for populism.

We're really just... normal people in here that like memes worms.

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· 8 hr. ago
r/place '22: Neoliberal Battalion

Me whenever someone starts hating on Neoliberals: "Bruh i LITERALLY just want Taco trucks cmon man, what you're doing is malarkey"

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The Neoliberal term is usually associated with people like Kissinger, Reagan, and Thatcher. For some reason the left center pro-globalism movement has adopted the term. We make fun of the far left for terrible slogans and branding (Abolish the police), yet make the same mistake.

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· 7 hr. ago · edited 6 hr. ago
United Nations

Capitalism = bad, neoliberalism = capitalism hence neoliberalism = bad

Or more complex reasons would be:

- atomisation of society

- corporate greed and market logic

- commodification of culture and tradition

- destruction of traditional communities

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· 5 hr. ago
r/place '22: E_S_S Battalion

Because neoliberalism is a buzzword that basically means “thing I don’t like that isn’t extremism” to most people. Sometimes Neoliberalism is Reagan and Thatcher -ism and sometimes it’s Clinton (both of them) and Obama -ism. It depends on who you ask and what they’re criticizing.

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· 4 hr. ago
Henry George

The name of this sub is mostly tongue in cheek. Don't describe yourself as neoliberal based on what you see here. Neoliberalism mostly describes Reagan, Thatcher, etc out in the real world.

The sub's name is an inside joke, don't take it too seriously. We're all basically just some sort of Liberal and more than anything, polysci and econ nerds.

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Because we win

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The name of this sub is a recuperation of centrist liberal aesthetics, but with moderately centre-left policy and outcome preferences. But because irony is always lost on fools, there's a few pockets of neocons and right-wing libertarians, too.

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"But because irony is always lost on fools"

Or you know big tent go brrr. I mean can you name a single non conspiratorial, trumpist centre right political subreddit?

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Read the comments from people who have Reagan or Thatcher flairs, some of the NATO guys can be pretty egregious too, but some are good lads.

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· 14 hr. ago
Bisexual Pride

Reagan, thatcher, pinochet....

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The first two are only explain it when reddit is your medium. Unless things have changed over the past few years, Reagan is still polled as a very popular President. Margaret Thatcher still consistently polls in the top 3 greatest UK PM's today depending on whose poll you use.

They didn't leave an impact by being unpopular...

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Leftists want to blame someone for their incompetence.

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The line was going up real good when we ran the economy, now it doesn't go up at all, correct yourselves.

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from what i've gathered

leftists: see neoliberals as "fake liberals" and "traitors", since liberals i feel have gone more left, neoliberals are probably just "liberals" at this point. (some people think neo liberals are the same as neo-cons)

rightwingers: they read the second part of the word "neoliberal", that's it.

most of them don't even know what neoliberals actually stand for


idk i just think neo-liberals have the most "moderate" opinions, since moderate opinions are quite rare now (either advocating for a revolution or going back to 1956)

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· 9 hr. ago
European Union

Ok I confess, it's my fault. I slandered our Liberal opponents as neoliberals for their proposed tax cuts.

If you didn't find out already, I'm a proud Succ.

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This sub taken a “bad” label and formed a big tent ideology around it to identify as neoliberals.

The worst neoliberals were the Chicago Boys of Chile. Definitely neoliberals and definitely bad guys, but they were bad guys for reasons other than the core tenets of neoliberalism. They probably wouldn’t automatically be “bad” neoliberals, but they worked for a ruthless and conniving dictator, so ipso facto, bad dudes.

The second “bad” batch of neoliberals are Reagan and Thatcher. Now a lot of people on this sub won’t say they’re “bad”, which is a fair take in and out of this sub. But I think most self-identifying neoliberals would consider themselves “garden variety American liberals” and Reagan and Thatcher formed the ideological roots of modern Anglo conservatism, so you will see criticism of their “bad” policies and admittance, reluctant or otherwise, of the “good” policy they enacted at the expense of the “bad.”

Thus, the tent pole of this sub is Third Way American liberalism, defined by the Presidency of Bill Clinton. It had core neoliberal principles at its center, but also traditional Democratic Party ideals like a social safety net. Importantly Clinton had strong foreign policy and free trade objectives, but, importantly, also a willingness to work across the aisle and work with Republicans who were (and still are) flying high off Reagan.

So this sub is mainly centrist and moderates from different party backgrounds who buy in to the core tenets of neoliberalism (e.g. free trade, open(ish) borders, globalism, strong institutions, free market, data driven public policy, loosely regulated mobile ethnic food vendors) and are at least tolerant of a more more progressive social policy (e.g. social safety net, civil /gay/trans/etc rights, immigration reform.) But it also includes a variety of others who are less moderate but still interested in the core tenets when it comes to economics and foreign policy, especially. The bigness of the tent is manifold.

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· 5 hr. ago
Jerome Powell

If you're looking for neoliberals, you've come to the wrong place.

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· 12 hr. ago · edited 12 hr. ago
IMF

People use the term neoliberal in different ways. I imagine most of breadtube use the term "neoliberal" to mean the status quo, and since breadtube consists of left wing content creators the status quo to them is bad.

Conservatives using the term neoliberal is new to me though. Usually with them it's the "radical left", "communists", "marxists", and "socialists".

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I can't really speak for right wingers (though I suspect it has something to do with giving rights to minorities), but as someone more on the left, I think most leftists dislike neolibs because it's the ideology of capital (and capital being the driving force behind most of the worlds ills), and for their penchant to compromise with and work with people who should absolutely be givven no ground.

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Nobody cares about neoliberals. Most even don’t know they exist

The only way for others to take notice is to ask such questions.

Wait. Maybe that also didn’t work. Because the only ones commenting here are also neoliberals.

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Neoliberalism is seen as the status quo and people who don’t like the status quo are louder

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Because many portrays of neoliberalism essentially use a marxist lens where the capitalist class implement neoliberalism as their ideology, which is effectively diametrically opposed to socialism. So neoliberalism becomes a by word for things you don't like or things you associate with the wealthy.

I think this way of portraying neoliberalism has caught on more widely and become intertwined with other ideologies and viewpoints. To some, it's the status quo. To others, it's something slowly being implemented.

I always thought about this sub as basically a space for liberals of differing varieties to use the term neoliberal in a way to wind up others.

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because supply and demand doesn't apply to [insert particular topic of discussion]

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· 6 hr. ago
European Union

Neoliberalism died in 2008

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Welcome! We are anti-populists. That means we’re mostly right all the time and everyone hates us

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I like this group because they are pragmatic. There are a lot of extremist groups that talk about ideologically perfect worlds that sure, I would love to live in, but they’re impossible to attain. This sub focuses on what can ACTUALLY be done to improve our situation, instead of pipe dreaming about overthrowing every government in the world & eliminating the existence of rich people.

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Saying you’re a neoliberal is saying you have faith or trust in the institutions. Others don’t share that trust and have distain for those institutions so they see you us as the enemy.

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We did have a guy yesterday calling for the US to make regime changes in Venezuela, Cuba and Chile for not voting in favor of Russia's expulsion from the UN Human Rights Council.

Even if it was ironic, someone lurking the sub might not have seen it that way. Not hard to demonize that.

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Neoliberal is a catchall buzzword thats short hand for “people i dont like” in extremist spaces

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It's "popular" right now to argue that the "system" is broken.

When arguing this, your "opposition" are people who believe that the system as it is probably represents at least a somewhat reasonable balance point between a lot of complex and competing challenges.

To them, Neoliberalism represents an admission that the "system" can't make a perfect utopia, but instead is just our best effort to balance competing needs.

Fundamentally, I think to some degree, this philosophy tells them that "utopia is a fantasy".

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· 4 hr. ago · edited 4 hr. ago
Scott Sumner

Blamed for the policy of Reagan->Obama. The theory is that relaxation of market regulation, and taking a neutral to negative stand on unions has immerserated the poor and lower class, led to offshoring of jobs and a degradation in the quality of other work.

Neoliberals are blamed for standing in the way of implementing universal healthcare, accepting the status quo with military spending, wanting to privatize Social Security.

Neoliberals are blamed for being pro-intervention militarily. This goes along with Shock Therapy theory where the military will intervene, or CIA will instigate or exacerbate a crisis in order to open up a country to US markets.

Neoliberals are blamed for compromising themselves on climate issues. For example supporting gas pipelines and natural gas in order to phase out coal. The left believe that climate change can be tackled by targeting corporations while they see neoliberals wanting to make life harder for poorer people with higher taxes on carbon, and user fees like paid parking and congestion fees.

I should add: neoliberal ideology feels dominant. Other ideologies get tacked on to it. Consider woke capital and the presence of banks and military contractors at pride.

There are some personal grievances as well, I don't think people on the left will forget the efforts to stop Bernie from winning the primary in 2016 and 2020.

I've mostly been focusing on the left, since they actually have principled objections. The right don't like neoliberals either in part because of the pro-globalism anti-nationalism stance and support for open borders. But mostly for the elitism. The right consider themselves to be true Americans and so are aggrieved to be largely shut out of major institutions like academia, the media, Hollywood, and now corporate board rooms.

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Hate them back. Works for me.

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Neoliberals have been de facto in control of the western world for decades, they hate us ‘cause the ain’t us.

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· 3 hr. ago
John Keynes

While neoliberalism is used a lot in horrible ways, it's most used to define austerity policies against welfare, against worker's right and the belief the state is a inherently a evil that can only things like trials, security and publich schools. These things are complex -- austerity in public despenses can help economies during post recession periods or in fiscal crisis - but were did in horrible ways in many countries and resulted in a lot of problems, especially in more disadvantage people.

While most people here agree with privatizations and global free trade -- with free trade being also defended by Social Democratic parties -- that these neoliberal politicians also defend, we don't agree with the harshest politics that I said above. Not that we think that the state should run the economy, but has more to do than the above, the most notable being healthcare.

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Sounds like maybe you're just a neoliberal. I'm not sure which people you watch on BreadTube but I find most of the people pretty fun and interesting to listen to. If you don't I'd suggest just not watching them.

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Because having realistic reasonable positions isn’t popular enough you need to be an extremist and like it these days

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· 2 hr. ago
United Nations

Everyone on politics youtube is not everyone in real life. It's a bunch of losers with nothing better to do.

Same as all those Twitter nobodies on Rose Twitter.

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rose twitter

HOLY FUCK GO OUTSIDE

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· 2 hr. ago
A permutation of particles in an indeterminate system

They hate us because they anus

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The people who win and are successful are always disliked and hated by those that are not

Hatred of liberalism and neoliberalism is almost entirely cope from extremists like communists and fascists who are upset that neoliberalism doesn’t work for them

Why do people hate Tom Brady? Because he wins, he’s good at what he does, everyone hates the guy who is hot shit and knows he’s hot shit.

People hate liberalism because it won. Hate us cuz they ain’t us man. Everybody likes an underdog, nobody roots for the guy who always wins

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· 2 hr. ago
Paul Volcker

Because "Intention Based Policy" is A LOT more popular than "Evidence Based Policy."

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· 1 hr. ago
Paul Krugman

Its more of a chicken and egg problem. This became a popular ideology for the terminally online after the term neoliberal had been hated for years. Since neoliberal is often a catch all term used by populists and extremists on both sides for things they don't like, people thought reclaiming the ideology to piss those people off would be funny.

1
level 1
· 1 hr. ago
George Soros

r/neoliberal is the old Shitposting/Circlejerk board of r/badeconomics. It was an ironic name, since people online/Bernie-bros had a habit of calling everyone who wasn't an absolutely insane communist a "neoliberal".
The sub has gone through several cycles of sanewashing, especially after the 2016 elections where people supporting Hillary Clinton flocked here because this board was openly supportive of her. Then there was a general explosion of popularity in the Trump years and especially during the 2020 elections. Nowadays, online, people use "neoliberal" to mean "establishment liberal", moderate left wing, or progressive with an incremental change mindset.

In the real world, outside of twitter and reddit, it means someone like Reagan or Thatcher.

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level 1

People don’t know what neoliberal means but half of them have been trained to salivate hatred when they hear the word ‘liberal’ and plenty have a vague dislike of the prefix ‘neo’ on like anything so …. there you go. Who cares about ideas when you can be triggered and self righteous instead

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level 1

They basically represent (at least in perception) the status quo in many ways and many people are dissatisfied with that. Also they tend to be dismissive of peoples struggles and will instead use a graph or something to explain away their problems.

There's a lot more that can be said but I don't wanna write a whole essay about this.

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level 1

Because they've been the ones in charge since Carter, and well, gestures vaguely, look around. It works great for the owner class and professional class, but not so much everyone else.

-3
level 2
· 2 hr. ago
A permutation of particles in an indeterminate system

If you're looking for neoliberals, you've come to the wrong place.

TIL that neoliberalism isn't a coherent ideology but a collection of all events that occurred since 1980, even if they were completely at odds

2
level 1
· 9 hr. ago
Michel Foucault

When people say neoliberal they either mean Thatcher or the DNC. There's good reasons to hate both especially Thatcher if you're gay or a minority, and to a lesser extent the DNC for their control of any and all remotely centrist or leftist political stances in the US. The DNC is clearly the better party but I also think that the two party structure stifles true democracy and ends up killing off anything that is remotely left in favour of centrist policies and contributing to the 'ratchet effect'.

-2
level 1

It depends on where you are in the world. Americans have the working definition of NeoLiberalism to mean things like the Washington Consensus and things like that.

That's actually pretty bad. It screwed a lot of countries in Asia and Africa.

More domestically, a lot of the neoliberal policies went into high gear and you're seeing the results now with extreme income inequalities, bailouts, etc.

Economically it makes a lot of sense but the American sense of it is an extreme.

Now, if you're mentioning more the social dynamics of it, that I feel would be more classical Liberalism

0
level 1

Largely gets attached to their social policy and personal beliefs of some leaders as other commenters have mentioned, which absolutely should be addressed. Essentially contemporary politics and culture seems to get in the way.

When I was in university, academia then was pushing a more critical lense of earlier progressive minded political figures and identified much of their liberal policy as more of a facade for neo-imperialism that was emerging in the wake of the world wars and events of the cold war only made it worse. In particularly from the American academy there has been more criticism of figures like Woodrow Wilson as being the hypocrite to his own ideology of outspoken neo-liberalism with his equally out spoken racist beliefs, despite writing a whole poltical treatise on the idea of self-determination a fundamental belief for neo liberalism.

I think a lot of neo liberal (and many political beliefs) get compartmentalized with their contemporary culture of the time which distorts its innate system of beliefs. In American history at least its hard to really appear as the "hero" or "savior" when the background of political undergoings or external cultural phenomena is the Centerpoint of focus and criticism.

0
level 1

Neoliberals today are different from neoliberals five years ago. Five years ago they were all advocating for bad economic policies.

0
level 1

Neoliberalism is the status quo and a lot of people arent doing so hot under it

0
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Created Apr 14, 2011