Imagine thinking like this while oligarchy governments like Russia exist.
It's been amusing seeing people try to sell that the oligarchs of Russia are the same as the wealthy of the U.S. They have no idea, lmao.
There was a paper claiming the US was an oligarchy that went viral, here's a vox article rebutting it, https://www.vox.com/2016/5/9/11502464/gilens-page-oligarchy-study
But still, if you said the US was an oligarchy like 8 years ago most "intellectuals" would say "well of course it is"
'No, you liberals don't get it! Russia spent decades branding itself as a socialist country, therefore their country can't possibly be more right-wing than America or any west-European nation!'
That would make Sense if the US or any nation didnt have billionares and millionares without political Influence. The only difference is the terminology.
I doubt travel would help tbh, not like their claims were based on anything in the first place.
Travel to new country, don't read local news, talk with locals, or look into research about government corruption, "Yeah, well I didn't see anything in my 7 days there! Of course America is the worst!"
Yeah this reminds me of some friends who I was telling Putin was a really bad dude to(years ago). Someone said something about american propaganda and another friend said "yeah I went to Moscow last summer and had some drinks w some russian guy and they love Putin there" and everyone took that at face value and acted like I was the ridiculous one because the guy had actually been there and talked to a Russian. That's essentially how itd go if the "America is the root of all evil" types traveled. Anecdotal confirmation bias.
(Ironically now all those friends talk about how bad Putin is and it takes all my nerve to not bitterly be like "told you so" but then I'd come off as asshole for being petty🙄)
My complaints about this country are frequently about public infrastructure and I am very jealous of european cities being so walkable. I don't know if it says anything about governments though because they existed long before the car and so are not so car based by default.
If you travel to a country like Egypt, it will be abundantly clear that the government is authoritarian and corrupt no matter what you while you’re there
This is like reverse American exceptionalism
To anyone who says that America is very corrupt please go to any LATAM country, you are in for a shock
These type of people blame the failure of LATAM countries exclusively on the US
Well as a tourist the highest level of corruption you'll be exposed to is a bad cop or border official shaking you down. Maybe.
But the "soft anarchy" of life is pretty present everywhere. Illegal building, businesses that definitely don't pay taxes, under the table labor, lower safety standards.
The ACAB crowd would love Central and South American police who only work for bribes.
Yep. Less than a week ago I was pulled over in Mexico City and extorted by the cops.
You are nothing but an ultranationalist if you don't hate everything about America on a knee-jerk.
Bolivian here, yes. But I must say the city of Chicago could teach the Bolivian government a thing or two about corruption, and show em how it’s really done.
Sources am Bolivian, and live in Chicago for 6 years.
I was in Mexico and with our guide we wanted to climb in a national park and you're not supposed to drive to x-place and park. So he claimed he had a "special relationship" with the park ranger and basically slipped him a bunch of pesos to shave a couple of miles off our climb. I couldn't imagine a US park ranger doing something like that, lol.
My impression of Chile was that it wasn't exceptionally corrupt, but all the incentives were fucked up in the government and market system.
My first shock was crossing the border into pre-maidan Ukraine and my guide blatantly explained that he needed to bribe the border guard otherwise we'd be held at the border for a couple days.
Imo I'd put money on it we kind of over corrected in sight of the hyper patriotism after 9/11. There's also a lot of bullshit they've passed between then, I'd argue the root cause of polarization is Americans have a lack of faith problem. Two prolonged messy wars will do that, throw in online propaganda and in my bullshit two cents I think it's always better if we fight defensive wars.
To anyone who says that America is very corrupt please go to any LATAM country, you are in for a shock
tourists probably won't have to deal with much corruption either, tbh.
Not only them. Don’t forget the idiots that don’t realize that America good actually.
My tour guide literally said he bribed the official to get a driver's license.
I've seen things you wouldn't believe... Border agents asking for money to process my visa. I helped translate for a man trying to buy a licence from a government official, to have the government official tell me we can inflate the price and split the difference *wink wink*. I've watched a ministerial official working on marijuana legalisation finish a call with government deputies and smile that his newly created marijuana business would be a front runner with no problems. All these moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain... Time to die.
(all true stories; Eastern Europe is amazing)
Border security at the land crossing from Israel to egypt will try to steel small things from you, and if you manage to keep your eye on them they will ask for stuff.
Every cop I've met in rural India takes bribes, and isn't even ashamed of it.
Don't get me started on the Philipines.
I have read most of the EU for that matter doesn't even have laws against foreign corruption by their citizens
This also applies to anybody who insists that the Democratic party in the U.S. is basically right wing compared to the rest of the world.
These same people think socialism is when the government has welfare and the more social safety net the more socialismer it is.
Despite the nordic countries largely having more 'free' economies for businesses than here afaik
Every time I see someone say that on reddit I die a little inside.
People who have never had to pay a bribe once in their life: "Our society is so corrupt bro!"
Oh, God, if was to sit down and tell to you the extent of corruption in my country, you wouldn't even paying attention and my comment would be useless because would care to how long it would be. It's really depressing how much of your potential was lost in the corruption....
Saludos do Uruguay, e sorte nas próximas eleições. A gente vai lá-necessitar.
I'm venezuelan and I would fully read it
I mean we have Americans here in jail for just refusing to pay bribes for twenty years ago
The people who need this perspective are only going to travel to first world instagram places. The kind of person who spends a weekend in Cancun and thinks they’ve traveled to the third world.
Whoa whoa. I mean... I went to both Myanmar and North Korea, and all I saw were happy people during my combined 10 days there. Clearly, those countries are squeaky clean. /s
I WILL NOT UPVOTE LOW QUALITY MEMES
I scream, as they take me away
LOL I howled at this comment. I am the king of low effort memes. I’ve got kids, ain’t got time to spend an hour (or more than 5 mins) on a meme 🤣
This is so timely because I just had an incredulous argument with a pair of Redditors on here about whether the United States is the only country with police brutality.
No no, the internet told me American cops are basically cancer made human, I know what I'm talking about.
Literally even just talk to someone from a different country if you can't travel. Gives you so much perspective on how the world is. And there's no excuse not to do that if you have an internet connection these days!
Corruption is obviously still sometimes an issue in developed countries (As an Australian looking at the Liberal party it's still got some staying power) but pork-barelling and revolving doors are not the same as being able to hand over cash to avoid tickets (As a Malaysian friend told me) or having to pay the police to get them to investigate a crime (From Myanmar). Still though- Federal ICAC now!!!
ive been arguing with wumaos for a while now, and a lot of them just further shown me how bad the ccp is.
the smartest ones will ask for a source, and discredit it with another article, drawing a wild goose chase to show how my source is funded by the cia. they always forget that their article is either from an rt journalist or chinese state owned media. i can always at least throw their argument back at them, at most point out that the accused ccp wrote that article.
the dumber ones try to bring up us government crimes that i already knew about (tfw free speech free press). i come back with some they didnt know about, and show them how we handle thugs in our own government.
When folks tell me the US government is corrupt, I laugh.
I come from a country where a speeding ticket has two price tags. The one you pay the officer on the spot, or the one you pay to the government at the station. The former is usually 1/6 the official ticket.
America is one of the least corrupt countries on earth. If you don’t believe me try bribing a cop next time you get pulled over.
It's a weirdly bad example of "least corrupt in the world". Try bribing a police officer here in the UK or most of Europe and see how far it gets you.
Even worse when they praise Russia while doing it. As if there wasn’t an attempted political assassination and foreign invasion just for support from oligarchs.
When your ancestors took huge risks to move to the land of opportunity, but now as a grifter you cannot move out of it with less of a barrier to do so.
Mfw when Americans tell me that they live in the corrupt place on the planet because parties don't always nominate outsiders but I'm literally from Bangladesh where two women have been fighting for power since before I can remember.
America has some corruption/inefficiency issues at the top, but the most is way way way too far to take it.
Luckily I have traveled a lot since I was a child. I’ll never forget being in Mexico and seeing a truck full of people driving around the city openly toting automatic rifles. I was then told that those were the police and to stay away from them.
At 8 my whole world perspective shifted and I’m grateful for that.
This is a white thing where 'the world' is Western Europe or [insert carefully crafted tourist destination]
Large amount of people never move outside their hometown or home state, let alone travel around the world to experience this. Their view is just colored by the traditional media and social media they consume and regurgitate.
I learned that lesson speaking to my South African relatives. Basic example:
Uncle is caught speeding. Doesn't deny it, admits he was in the wrong (in fairness I've been on the roads there and they drive like maniacs).
Police pull him over, usual shtick "do you know why we've pulled you over?" Etc.
Then policeman sighs, explains it's a hot day and he could go for a nice cold drink. Should only cost him 50 rand. He might even forget the ticket.
Absurdly low (it was about £1.50 at the time), but the policeman wanted to pocket it.
My uncle, to his credit, asked for the ticket. But realising how endemic and persistent that is was a shock coming from the UK.
LOL in Kenya the they literally say “buy me some tea man”. The bribe culture is deeply ingrained.
What’s that saying?
People who think America is the worst country in the world and people who think America is the best country in the world have something in common: They haven’t left America
what’s nice about Latin America is that you know exactly who’s going to rob you because they’re wearing a police uniform
Funny, none of the guys who pointed guns to my face inside the metro station to steal my phone were wearing uniforms. Do you think it was their day off?
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime." - Mark Twain
Literally anywhere south of the US in the Americas except like maybe Uruguay and Costa Rica.
You have to be pretty willingly stupid to believe the US is among the corrupt nations of the world, let alone the most.
The US isn't even the most corrupt country in North America. Hell the US isn't even the most corrupt English-speaking country in North America.
It's because our media is so good at exposing problems, while the worst places don't have a free press to inform people of their problems. So the freest places end up looking the worst.
You have places that score higher than you in both press freedom and low corruption.
This is why I love watching travel vids that go and actually interview people in third world countries- I feel like I’ve gained so much perspective watching people like indigo traveller on YouTube
I feel like some people twist the definition of corruption to describe anything that is morally questionable and not the literal corruption as in a public official using their powers and privileges to enrich themselves and their associates.
But I thought capitalism was the ultimate evil? And that it was the only system under which exploitation had ever occurred.
How do we actually alter this perception though, because it is gaining ground, and it starts to become a self-fulfilling prophecy.
I hate how college kids discover that America has a lot of problems, and automatically jump to the dramatic answers. I could rattle off 100 nations which would be inarguably a worse place to live.
ok but PLEASE do not travel without knowing what youre in for.
take for instance, ever supported hong kong? taiwan? have you spoken up about the uyghur genocide? ever spoken against the ccp? if you have, stay out of china or its up to life in chinese jail.
im not gonna stop you, but if you wanna travel, you gotta know what youre in for. as soon as youre on corrupt soil, its corrupt government can do nearly anything to you.
Our corruption is baked directly into our legislative process and we still aren’t the most corrupt
I put aside my career in Washington, DC to get away from politics for a while and go to an American accredited grad school in Hungary
Then that year my grad school was targeted by Viktor Orbán to be exiled from the country out of the kind of political persecution that hadn’t been seen in Europe since Nazism
I kinda whiffed on that whole avoiding politics thing
The US is clearly not the most corrupt country on earth, but lobbying is still a problem though.
Seriously. I'd even include western Europe in that. I've seen petty corruption in countries as "progressive" as Portugal.
Do you think your bottom scenario doesn't happen in those countries?
I would rather have them believe it’s corrupt than say “oh it’s worse other places, so I’m going to be totally apathetic about what happens here”.
It's hard to have correct solutions when you're targeting the wrong problem.
I mean that’s even more delusional than thinking the US is uniquely corrupt
I dont like US but still it is NOT the worst country there are so many far worse countries you can visit out there its insane
Agreed. I feel like the U.S. might even be in the less corrupt 50%.
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