全 163 件のコメント

[–]HauntedFurnitureTurboautist 254 ポイント255 ポイント  (98子コメント)

Why is TRP in the sidebar?

Excellent question, especially when most subscribers were against it. A user tried asking on r/Conservative itself, and chabanais's response was to nuke the thread and report them to the admins. I don't see how any political subreddit can be taken seriously (even before considering all the Trump drama) when it links to politically irrelevant cancer like that.

[–]postironyWarning: may create drama 88 ポイント89 ポイント  (7子コメント)

You have been reported to the admins for attempting to create cross-subreddit drama

That's not against site rules, sport.

and for vote manipulation

That's not what vote manipulation is, sport.

The admins barely give a shit about subs that are actually illegal, Chabanais. I don't think they're too interested in dipping their dicks into drama that your own moderators caused.

[–]PM_For_Soros_Money [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

The admins are a joke. TD was calling for actual genocide but "bash the fash" got threats of shutdown

[–]bushizsomethingawfuldotcom agent provocatuer [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Liberals hate socialism more than etc etc etc

[–]KadexeThis cake is like 9/11 or the Holocaust [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

He didn't say why he suspected vote manipulation. Maybe the post was getting upvoted too fast, maybe he saw the post linked to from another subreddit, or maybe he's just making excuses to remove the thread.

[–]Jiketi 127 ポイント128 ポイント  (16子コメント)

It seems to be turning into a dictatorship/cult of personality, just like T_D.

[–]Mister_Jay_PegPopcorn is my 5th major food group 158 ポイント159 ポイント  (15子コメント)

That is what being a Republican online is now, in a nutshell. You're either a rabid cultish worshiper, or you're going to be shoved out into the wilderness to fend for yourself.

[–]thaw12I don't care if her vagina melted. 72 ポイント73 ポイント  (6子コメント)

Basically the equivalent of the authoritarian dad saying to a 10 year old kid, "If you don' like this family, you can get the fuck out ya hear!?"

[–]postironyWarning: may create drama 81 ポイント82 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Meanwhile, Log Cabin Republicans are the one kid who went off to university, who keeps coming to Christmas, desperately seeking the approval of his family despite the fact they all take the opportunity to make fun of him.

[–]Bathysphere710 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

The LC republicans had a booth at my city's Pride fest this year. It was manned by one guy who looked like a sweaty ball of shame and defensiveness. No one went near the booth, and he didn't make eye contact or smile at anyone. I felt bad for him.

[–]FilipinoPhil [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Don't, he's the one who chooses to stand with people who despise him, nobody forced him to.

[–]TheRealRonSwanson0 15 ポイント16 ポイント  (6子コメント)

Tbh that's pretty much what it's been like to be a Republican since the passage of the Civil Right's Act. Before the southern strategy gave rise to the religious right, conservatives were just political moderates who played RealPolitik.

[–]johnnyslickHer age and her hair are pretty strong indicators that she'd lie [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Before the Civil Rights Act, when they marched behind Joe McCarthy in outing the millions of communists hiding in major positions of authority in America, until it became clear that there weren't really any of those?

[–]BrokenBuckets [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

Not really. Romney, McCain, Jeb!, pre-election Chris Christy and John Kasich all represented what the old Republican party used to be, before it totally went off the rails.

[–]mystikalhereigo [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Lindsey Graham surprisingly has been one of the most ardent anti Trump GOPers

[–]Puggpu [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Not really surprising, he has an extremely safe seat so he can afford to be vocal about it.

[–]Medical_Droid [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

All of those people are awful, they're just more polite than Trump.

[–]VanFailinVote Hindsight 2020 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

John McCain at least expresses his sincere concern about things a normal person would be concerned about. Doesn't stand up for much, but he is concerned.

[–]mystikalhereigo [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I am the opposite of a conservative but grew up in a rust belt town which impacts all who lived there and the conservative people I know hate Trump. However, online you wouldn't know these people exist. There isn't a shortage of conservatives who disagree on Trump that appear on the news and media either. But I simply cannot find nor do I see conservative anti-Trump people with much of an online presence

The GOP in general seems to waffle between enabling Trump outright and discussing wether they should drop him.

[–]johnnynutman [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

It was also created by a GOP representative.

[–]4THOTIt's really about games journalism if you think about it... [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

A member of the GOP created TRP? Well... that really wrinkles the raisins doesn't it...

[–]VanFailinVote Hindsight 2020 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

State representative, which hardly counts.

[–]isetmyfriendsonfire [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

ayy lmao in the linked thread in that thread

are you fucking kidding me? They took it down for a while after we made that thread. I didn't even realize it was back up. TRP is a liberal subreddit and absolutely disgusting.

LIBERAL SUBREDDIT

[–]Bluest_waters [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

you have to understand the mindset. ANYTHING that these people ultimately disagree with becomes "liberal" by definition

"Liberal" is just anything anywhere anytime that these people find offensive or distasteful or wrong. It's part of their continuing project of creating an entirely new alternative reality

[–]jamesjwalking [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Whenever I hear anyone mention red pill I instantly just think of hopelessly romantic losers that need to go to those dating seminars only to become more creepy and sexually aggressive... I mean MAYBE there's some small truths here and there, but overall making it into a way of life is beyond cringey. Anyone successful with women will tell you it didn't happen because of red pill philosophy.

[–]KhaelgorPopCorn lover 90 ポイント91 ポイント  (5子コメント)

I'm starting to think it's a conspiracy theory. The Admins put TK in charge to run the sub like shit to make conservatives look bad.

Just like the USA's Admins plan to put Trump in charge to make republicans look bad.

[–]manwithaflanOver simplifies everything, as is the yank way 42 ポイント43 ポイント  (4子コメント)

Now that's a deep state conspiracy theory I can get behind.

[–]Amelaclya1 [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

There was a conspiracy theory during the primaries that Donald Trump was only running at the behest of Bill Clinton to make it easier for Hillary to win, and to make Republicans look bad.

Life would be so much better right now if that had been true. At least he's succeeding at the latter even if it's not intentional. Unfortunately he's also making the entire country look bad at the same time.

[–]Andy_Liberty_1911 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Yup I used to think that, though to be fair there isn't much difference what has happened if that wasn't true. Trump won and doesn't want the job but if he resigns he'll feel like a loser and he hates that.

[–]premeddit [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

That's not a deep state conspiracy, that was proven by a leaked Wikileaks document of John Podesta outlining a plan to secretly support extremist Republicans during the primaries, with the understanding that they would muddle up the GOP field and make the party more toxic and therefore unelectable.

Friends,

This memo is intended to outline the strategy and goals a potential Hillary Clinton presidential campaign would have regarding the 2016 Republican presidential field. Clearly most of what is contained in this memo is work the DNC is already doing. This exercise is intended to put those ideas to paper.

Our Goals & Strategy

Our hope is that the goal of a potential HRC campaign and the DNC would be one-in-the-same: to make whomever the Republicans nominate unpalatable to a majority of the electorate. We have outlined three strategies to obtain our goal:

1) Force all Republican candidates to lock themselves into extreme conservative positions that will hurt them in a general election;

2) Undermine any credibility/trust Republican presidential candidates have to make inroads to our coalition or independents;

3) Muddy the waters on any potential attack lodged against HRC.

Operationalizing the Strategy

Pied Piper Candidates

There are two ways to approach the strategies mentioned above. The first is to use the field as a whole to inflict damage on itself similar to what happened to Mitt Romney in 2012. The variety of candidates is a positive here, and many of the lesser known can serve as a cudgel to move the more established candidates further to the right. In this scenario, we don’t want to marginalize the more extreme candidates, but make them more “Pied Piper” candidates who actually represent the mainstream of the Republican Party. Pied Piper candidates include, but aren’t limited to:

Ted Cruz

Donald Trump

Ben Carson

We need to be elevating the Pied Piper candidates so that they are leaders of the pack and tell the press to them seriously.

Given this memo, plus the fact that Bill Clinton called Trump in a lengthy phone conversation a few weeks before Trump's election announcement... and you can pretty easily envision a scenario in which the Democrats nurtured and supported Trump's rise to the primaries in the hopes that he would crash and burn in the general. Unfortunately that's not the way it panned out.

[–]Amelaclya1 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Oh yeah, I know all that. But the conspiracy included Trump being in on it rather than just a useful pawn. Afaik, there isn't any evidence of that being true.

[–]xjayrooxNote to self:stop wasting time with atheists, they're all trolls 176 ポイント177 ポイント  (12子コメント)

So as a feminist and as a social conservative

It's gotta be pretty goddamn hard to reconcile those two identities at times

[–]IgnisDominiEthnomasochist 46 ポイント47 ポイント  (5子コメント)

Maybe they're a second-waver who never moved on with the times.

[–]OMGWTFBBQUE [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

"Feminism means I get to help decide what kind of washer and dryer my husband buys!!!"

[–]IgnisDominiEthnomasochist [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

I was thinking more along the lines of "Sexism is bad but marriage is between a man and a woman and black people need to get over themselves and solve their own problems."

[–]OMGWTFBBQUE [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

0 wave feminism.

[–]ironiclegacycalling memes a hobby normalizes incompetence [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

actually, wasnt the thing about black women a second-wave feminism thing? I remember a lot of black women in the 70s or so being angry at the feminist movements of the day

[–]da_fuuuuuq [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

My dad was a woman's rights activist. Not my mom, no, dad wouldn't allow that.

[–]DMforGroup [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

I mean. They just can't be right? You can't be those two things. It bugs me that r/conservative is just now acting like there's hatred in their ranks thanks to the Donald. This political party has been railing against social progress as one of their major talking points for decades and now that, that hatred has come home to roost they throw their hands up and say "Hey! You guys are being way too obvious about this!" As if their bullshit hadn't created the perfect environment for this thinking to form.

[–]tj1271 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

To be fair (and I'm saying this as a left leaning individual), the left has been pretty damn hateful too. Ever since Obama's second term, it's become normal to call anyone who disagrees with you a bigot, or to get a college professor fired for not adhering to the core tenants of intersectional feminism, or to demand safe spaces and the criminalization of free speech that offends people. Until the left takes some responsibility for helping create Trump, we're pretty much unfortunately guaranteeing he gets a second term.

[–]Medical_Droid [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Trump is literally the perfect embodiment of modern American conservatism, he's the gestalt id of our nation's racist uncles who own a flooring company and yell at the TV.

[–]tilmoph [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

I thought about it, and I came up with a possible set of beliefs that satisfy the criteria.

Before anyone has a meltdown, I am neither endorsing or critiquing these, nor asserting these as gospel truth. I just wanted to play at figuring out a socially conservative feminist, and this is purely speculation.

-Women are equal to men, and should have all the same rights, options, and opportunities, and should be paid the same amount for an equivalent amount of work. Not compensating that way should be punished by fines/should be a civil tort/both

-There are only 2 genders, defined by the 2 standard sexes. Being intersex physically does not eliminate the 2 gender system, as there just aren't enough such people to merit creating a gender category for them.

-Abortion when the mother's life isn't threatened by the pregnancy should not be legal. A women's right to control her body does not trump a child's right to life. Unborn children are children/a category that approximates to children for legal and philosophical purposes. The currently living woman's life does take precedence over an unborn child;s in the case of medical emergency, however.

-Women should have a right to divorce for cause, and should have the right to marry or not marry any man or no man at their own discretion.

-Marriage is a institute between one man and one women (maybe toss God in here if we're assuming a religious bent); man-man and woman-woman pairings, open relationships (whether mutual or one-sided), and polygamous relationships are invalid and should have neither legal nor social recognition.

That's just the ones off the top of my head that I could see coexisting in someone's head fairly easily, there's probably more.

Also, to reiterate, this post has no bearing on my own beliefs. I am neither condoning nor critiquing any of the ideas posted.

[–]12-juin-3049If you follow gaming culture you'd know where im coming from [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

I mean that abortion belief isn't in line with feminism at all, and it's definitely not modern intersectional feminism.

[–]tj1271 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I've always thought that there's no good reason why feminism must include Pro-Choice. Like, I understand that in practice that's how it goes, but why? Can't there theoretically be a feminist who philosophically believes that life becomes human at conception?

[–]Billlington 75 ポイント76 ポイント  (6子コメント)

I've followed r/conservative for a while and the sub turning on chab is inevitable. Chab running that sub like his own demented kingdom has rubbed people the wrong way for a couple of years now.

That sub could actually be a decent sub for conservative discussion but chab and some of the other mods blanket the sub with low effort memes and purge rational discussion for t_d/conspiracy level garbage that, as far as I've seen, a lot of people don't like.

[–]Illogical_BloxI will take my win in this conversation with that ad hom attack [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

Isn't he literally a teenager, too?

[–]dabaumtravisI am euphoric, enlightened by my own assplay [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

No thats CaptQuestionMark iirc

[–]choob_ [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

chab was like 14 when he started. Mentally not much has changed.

[–]Brover_ClevelandAs with all things, I blame Ellen Pao. [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

There's a bunch of theories. For a while he was so active that it was assumed a bunch of people were sharing the account.

[–]Andy_Liberty_1911 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Chab banned me and told me that his America doesn't have people like me, sort of terrifying if you ask me.

[–]Billlington [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

The implication being that the United States should be a single party authoritarian state. These people are unhinged.

[–]postironyWarning: may create drama 31 ポイント32 ポイント  (3子コメント)

Chab appears a lot on /r/MC which would make you believe he's a powertripping rogue mod.

Unfortunately, he's actually a longtime mod and a fixture in that sub. I think he was like 15 or 16 when he first got moderator privs, and he behaves appropriately. I don't know how old he is now.

[–]dirtygremlinyou're clearly just being a fastidious dickhead with words 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (2子コメント)

what's an r/MC?

[–]IratusTaurus [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Presumably metaconservative

[–]dirtygremlinyou're clearly just being a fastidious dickhead with words [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Thank you, I should have pickup on that.

[–]Jiketi 52 ポイント53 ポイント  (12子コメント)

So, it seems obvious that if you're anti-Trump you're not welcome in r/conservative.

This kind of manichaean "You've either with us or against us" view is dangerous and proliferating across the political spectrum. Bipartisanship is a faraway dream now.

[–]Anlashok2016Killer Klown Popcorn Gun 56 ポイント57 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Bipartisanship is dead. We killed it by treating our politics like like we do our sports.

[–]PrivateIdahoGhola 38 ポイント39 ポイント  (7子コメント)

Bipartisanship isn't dead when the GOP is willing to work with the other side. This year, Kansas managed to finally get past the disastrous tax cuts because Democrats and moderate Republicans worked together to defeat the teabaggers. Also this year, Democrats and moderate Republicans in the House came together for the continuing resolution which kept the government from shutting down, and increased funding in the short term for agencies Trump & the national GOP are trying to kill.

The problem, in the past 8+ years, has mostly been with the Republican Party and their decision to obstruct Obama and Democrats at every turn. Obama tried countless times to work with the GOP and was usually rebuffed. He kept trying long after any other reasonable person would have quit. It wasn't until his final year that he slipped into "give no fucks" mode.

It's ok to dislike the Democrats. I'm not saying they're perfect. But the death of bipartisanship is not "both sides". The Democrats will probably be less willing to cooperate in the future because of the hostility they've faced from the GOP. But they're not the root cause in the slightest.

[–]gokutheguy 48 ポイント49 ポイント  (2子コメント)

The problem is that the "moderate Republicans" aren't in power anymore and have completely caved.

You can't work together for good policy with people who don't think climate change even exists, for example.

[–]PrivateIdahoGhola 19 ポイント20 ポイント  (1子コメント)

At the state level here in Kansas, the moderates have essentially become their own party. They're at war with the radicals led by Brownback and Kobach, and have openly rejected much of the GOP's current nihilistic view of government services. It's an interesting situation that I think is a harbinger for how the national GOP will evolve.

But yeah, they've mostly caved for now nationally. If the moderates had been in charge of their party, the country would be in a better place.

[–]toastymow [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I've been saying this for a while, but the GOP party will cannibalize itself the "Tea Party" continues to threaten to primary republicans who don't vote hard right 100% of the time.

[–]Amelaclya1 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I hope Democrats will be less willing to cooperate in the future.

Not because I think bipartisanship is wrong. Or that I don't like compromise as a general principle.

But look at how far right the political discourse has shifted in this country on both sides (for economic issues). This is a result of the Democrats continually being willing to compromise with Republicans who give no concessions in return.

Look at Obamacare for example. It was based on a Republican plan, and Republicans were part of the process of drafting it, with hundreds of amendments added at their request. Even that wasnt good enough and now they are drafting bills behind closed doors without even allowing any Democrats any input at all, or even being allowed to read the damn thing before it's released publicly.

The GOP has proven for decades that they are unwilling to compromise, and now we are in the place where it's not political suicide to literally say that children don't deserve healthcare and old people don't deserve food.

Fuck compromising with those fucking assholes. It's time the Democrats (when they hopefully get the opportunity) stop bending over for the GOP, because it's the whole country that gets fucked in the ass.

[–]Anlashok2016Killer Klown Popcorn Gun -3 ポイント-2 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Yes it is. I live in Illinois and both sides are perfectly willing to let the state burn to the ground rather than compromise.

[–]PrivateIdahoGhola 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I have no idea what's going on at the local level in Illinois. I haven't followed it. I'm mainly talking about national level pollitics, with a dash of Kansas politics.

[–]Sebaceous_Sebacious [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Isn't it convenient that you don't know anything about Illinois; it's a state that is in utter ruin because of single party rule by your political faction.

[–]InMedeasRage 15 ポイント16 ポイント  (1子コメント)

There's always been bipartisanship!

Between the Tea Party and the GOP rank'n'file. badump tish

[–]AvengerMKII 59 ポイント60 ポイント  (8子コメント)

Trump and the Tea Party ruined the conservative part of the US. You can't even have a serious discussion about anything negative of Trump without someone saying fake news or being called a shill.

[–]topicality [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

He and they are like the id of the Republican party.

[–]936535898 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

The conservative part of the US are the Democrats, the Republicans are the fascist part.

[–]Medical_Droid [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Trump and the Tea Party ruined the conservative part of the US.

When were they ever good? The only thing that's changed is that now they're less polite.

[–]Felinomancy 20 ポイント21 ポイント  (0子コメント)

So we're finally seeing the beginning stages of the formation of a spine from r/con users? Good for them, although it's long overdue.

[–]superfeds [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

The same battle is being fought in /r/republican and /r/metarepublican.

There are large portion of Romney/Kaisch type Republicans like myself that feel that Trump is just a bridge too far. It causes a lot friction with the pro-Trump wing of the party.

I don't really follow /r/conservative anymore since getting banned from it, but it doesn't surprise me. Any kind of moderate or centrist thinking gets you on a watch list.

If you don't show enough support for Trump you get booted, usually for breaking rules specifically made to protect Trump.

Happened to me in both subs now.

[–]theironlamp 10 ポイント11 ポイント  (0子コメント)

He's also put in requests to take over the much smaller /r/neoconservative

[–]virohmYour Reddit karma is just a reflection of your life [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

Got baned from conservative for anti Trump comments detailing how he wasn't conservative. This After multiple post submissions to the sub that were upvoted.

Really annoying to see that sub pro Trump when he's not conservative fiscally.

Edit: the sub also has r/kotakuinaction on the sidebar, listed as "ethics". What a fucking joke.

[–]HAN1776 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Same. Got banned for saying how emulating rThe_Donald isn't helping win anyone over. They even link to the fucking RedPill, a sub where rapists talk freely about their crimes and gives shady advice on how to have sex with strangers. How is that conservative??

[–]GeneralRipper101YOUR FLAIR TEXT HERE [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

a sub where rapists talk freely about their crimes

I like how they only give a shit about the "rule of law" when it comes to Latinos.

[–]ngwooNo one knows you're a furry under a burqa. [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Ever noticed how the meta versions of liberal subs are batshit insane, but then you go to conservative subs and the insane versions are the non-meta ones?

I wonder what this could ever possibly mean?

[–]SnapshillBotShilling for Big Archive™ 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I know now I'll never have any flair again and I've come to terms with that.

Snapshots:

  1. This Post - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, snew.github.io, archive.is

  2. /r/metaconservative - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is*

  3. /r/conservative - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is*

  4. /r/the_donald2 - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is*

  5. /r/ConservativeMeta - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is*

  6. Chab should be removed as moderator... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, snew.github.io, archive.is

  7. Should Chabanais be removed as a Mo... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, snew.github.io, archive.is

  8. Quality of the sub at an all-time l... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, snew.github.io, archive.is

  9. Just got banned by Clatsop (mod) fo... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, snew.github.io, archive.is

  10. (Link here) - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, snew.github.io, archive.is

  11. Banned for "rationalizing censorshi... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, snew.github.io, archive.is

  12. Banned because chabanais posted a f... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, snew.github.io, archive.is

  13. Is it just me, or has the main sub ... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, snew.github.io, archive.is

  14. Why is TRP in the sidebar? - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, snew.github.io, archive.is

  15. there was a thread asking whether o... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, snew.github.io, archive.is

  16. /r/con - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is*

  17. Hell it looks like it's spreading t... - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, snew.github.io, archive.is

  18. /r/Conservative - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is*

  19. /r/ConservativesOnly - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is*

  20. /r/MC - archive.org, megalodon.jp*, archive.is*

I am a bot. (Info / Contact)

[–]HAN1776 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Also you're not seeing even half the real complaints since the same mods run both conservative and metaconservative.

[–]Smeshoj [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

As a conservative I'm staying far away from that sub. I'd love to discuss with American conservatives to see why they like Trump but it's impossible there. Can't criticise one thing!

[–]Choppa790If we didn't take his airbase we'd be cucks. [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Why is TRP in the sidebar?

Because it is the distillation of conservative social issues to its core.

[–]superioritysmug grandstanding agendaposter 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

/u/BigB69 please do not use np links they suck and the rules do not require them.

[–]boshaus [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

/r/askaconservative is a joke as well and will delete comments/ban users critical of Trumps policies.

[–]Enthused_Llama [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

There are currently no subreddits for conservatives where they can safely openly criticize Trump.

But freeze peaches!