(cache) Diablo 3 Necromancer (Class DLC) Skills and Passives Overview : Games

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Diablo 3 Necromancer (Class DLC) Skills and Passives Overview (eu.battle.net)

glorkcakes が 5時間前投稿

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トップ新着論争中古い順 Q&A

[–]glydy 60 ポイント61 ポイント62 ポイント 4時間前 (122子コメント)

[–]LG03 78 ポイント79 ポイント80 ポイント 4時間前 (109子コメント)

Is there any new content coming with this update?

Nothing substantial. Couple new monster types, couple new rift tilesets. This is the core of the problem that people have with this necromancer being a paid DLC. They're not offering any kind of value for it (and being Blizzard you can be damn sure it'll cost in the region of $20USD). All you're doing is essentially paying for a reskinned Witch Doctor (even down to the similarity of some skills) for the privilege of doing the same thing you've always done.

I find it heavily disappointing that this is what we're getting after so long. To get condescending for a minute, it's pretty pathetic how desperate people are for anything over on the Diablo subreddit. To the point where people over there are convinced that Blizzard needs to sell stash tabs and cosmetics so they can afford to fund development of actual content (as if D3 isn't already one of the best selling games ever).

[–]Pianoman1092 [スコア非表示] 3時間前 (16子コメント)

[–]IamtheSlothKing [スコア非表示] 2時間前 (10子コメント)

[–]Pianoman1092 [スコア非表示] 2時間前 (9子コメント)

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[–]illredditlater [スコア非表示] 1時間前 (4子コメント)

[–]Pianoman1092 [スコア非表示] 1時間前 (1子コメント)

I agree that Blizzard is in no way obligated to continuously support a game that is just a one-time purchase (two-time if you count the expansion). But Blizzard as a company gives the impression that they continuously support all their games, evidenced by a marketing push and general enthusiasm any time a game patch comes out. I suppose my real beef with the Necromancer is that by asking players to pay for content that does nothing to solve the stale gameplay of Diablo 3, they are sort of implying that they don't think the gameplay needs fixing, which, in my opinion, makes them either out of touch or greedy to make another sale to Diablo 3 players.

Game was fun while it lasted just like any other game you can buy. The game doesn't need to last forever, just needs to be fun while your playing it.

I agree with this - the game was fun while I played but the end-game just seemed too min/max-heavy for me, so I dropped off pretty soon after reaching max level and doing rifts for a while. I don't regret purchasing the game at all, I guess I sorta wish they just skipped the necromancer altogether and either did something to mix up the endgame or brought us the next installment of the franchise a bit sooner. I'm sure plenty of people will buy it, it just seems like a waste to me personally, and that they aren't addressing the real issues of the game.

[–]illredditlater [スコア非表示] 56分前 (0子コメント)

[–]Sca4ar [スコア非表示] 1時間前 (1子コメント)

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[–]SharkyIzrod [スコア非表示] 1時間前 (4子コメント)

Just wanted to come by and say you got unlucky with that being your first Blizzcon, I feel for ya. It was an off-year that could be smelled from a mile away. Doubly so since the year before had to be an off-year but the insane amounts of Overwatch hype carried I, while it was also a Blizzcon with no big announcements. It's just that 2016 was a Blizzcon with no big announcements and no crazy hype to push it through. It makes some sense, however, since Blizzcon 2014 was probably the most insane one they've ever had (on top of what is now the guaranteed HS expansion, it had WoW:WoD, SCII:LotV, and fucking Overwatch). Off-years are only really worth it for those that are generally Blizzard fans and interested enough in the eSports stuff going on, whilst years like 2014 have more universal appeal.

But if you are planning on going this year, since 2015 and 2016 were both varying degrees of off-years (2016 to the point of having just the Overwatch short by Blizzard Animation and nothing else by them), you can expect some crazy shit.

[–]Pianoman1092 [スコア非表示] 1時間前 (1子コメント)

[–]SharkyIzrod [スコア非表示] 38分前 (0子コメント)

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[–]ChillyWillster 45 ポイント46 ポイント47 ポイント 4時間前 (77子コメント)

[–]gamefrk101 54 ポイント55 ポイント56 ポイント 4時間前* (13子コメント)

It really depends on what kind of ARPG experience you want.

Diablo 3 has the most fluid combat and has growth but it is fairly easy to understand until you wish to min-max to the fullest. If you hate trading this game is rewarding to play self found and is designed for it.

PoE has the greatest character development if you enjoy theory crafting and creating your own hero. Though realistically there are a few archetypes for builds but there is a wide variety of different skills to fit those archetypes. If you're someone that is excited by the idea of complex characters that take a lot of research to min-max this is for you. Also, if you are someone that likes trading and playing economies this is the only real option for that aspect.

Grim Dawn fits somewhere in the middle. It doesn't have the best combat or the best character customization, but it is enjoyable and a spiritual successor to Titan's Quest. If you wish to play solo off-line it is one of the best choices out there as both of the bigger games require online.

[–]ahrzal [スコア非表示] 3時間前 (0子コメント)

[–]SnookDog [スコア非表示] 1時間前 (1子コメント)

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[–]Clyzm [スコア非表示] 1時間前 (9子コメント)

[–]gamefrk101 [スコア非表示] 1時間前 (7子コメント)

Does PoE let you respec your entire character?

Technically yes, but realistically no. It costs an item to repec a single point of the passive tree so respeccing a high level character is more expensive than just speed leveling. You do get about 15+ free respec points so there is some leeway for mistakes though.

Am I able to level up and then later redo skills once I've acquired more knowledge about the game?

Skills you can change at any time because those are tied to items not the passive tree. However, the passive tree does specialize you into certain skills working best.

Honestly my personal path, and the best advice I could give is to look up a build guide that sounds fun and follow it. It is far too complicated to "guess" what is good and unless you enjoy rerolling and lot trial and error; it takes a lot of time without a guide.

[–]Clyzm [スコア非表示] 1時間前 (6子コメント)

[–]gamefrk101 [スコア非表示] 1時間前 (4子コメント)

Maybe I'm just a niche player, but I'd like to be able to apply knowledge I've learned from my mistakes without rerolling a new character. If I have to look up a guide to make something good, then what's the point of having so many options.

This was exactly Blizzard's reasoning for their design decisions in D3. It is definitely not niche it is probably the most dominate viewpoint (Reddit is more hardcore than the average player base of a game).

The upside is it allows natural exploration and curiosity without "feeling punished". The downside is if you are someone that enjoys the complexity and experimentation you get bored by the "simplistic" style.

The forced choices make the character yours and "unique". It is just a matter of what you enjoy in a game. Which is why it's a great time to play ARPGs so many options and styles to suit your tastes.

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[–]RealZordan [スコア非表示] 3時間前 (6子コメント)

Having played both game an embarrassing amount, I can assure you, Diablo 3 is ten degrees more grind than PoE. After you know your way around the game a little bit (and everything story related is pretty much garbage in the game) it is nothing but grind. You grind to level 70 (which, as of now, is done in a single area), grind bounties for the act specific mats, grind rifts for blood stone, grind greater rifts to level up gems. The only part that is not a grind is pushing grifts and to do this you have to fish for specific procedurally generated map layouts. So more grind. And then more grind in between grind. The only working builds are invented for you by the developers and most of them do not work until you have all the parts.

PoE has a lot of strategy attached to leveling. Your build is constantly evolving and you need to adapt on the fly. Since the 4th act was added you rarely spend extended time in a single area, the exception being short bursts of leveling in the Dried Lake (which people generally enjoy.) I agree that it gets a bit rough playing through the areas on four difficulty settings, but on the plus side: this will be removed in the next patch where we will have 10 consecutive story acts on a single "difficulty". Yes there are a few fun builds that require very rare items like Mjöllnir or Void Battery and a lot of high performane builds are based a Six-Linked armor or Shavronne's or both. But at the same time you can do many builds that are 100% super-duper endgame viable and don't need any specific items. There is an infinite amount of them, that can be easily customized to you specific play style. Even the very endgame has been pretty much ridden of any grind.

PoE also does "season" (called "leagues"), but they always add something completely new to the game. The seasonal rewards are offered in Tiers, with the lowest ones are about easy to obtain as they are in Diablo.

There is nothing that Diablo does better than Path of Exile.

[–]omgwtfwaffles [スコア非表示] 1時間前 (1子コメント)

Diablo does nothing better? That is complete bullshit.

Now let me first say that I have played A LOT of PoE, and quite a bit of D3 as well (not as much as PoE though). There are a lot of things that Diablo does better. Here's a few examples:

Much more satisfying combat animations
Better progression to endgame
Rewarding loot for actually playing as opposed to having to trade for everything
Much simpler skill setup

I'm not saying D3 is a "better" game per se, but to act like it has no strengths is just wrong. After playing many hours of both, I just can't stand playing PoE anymore. Every time I want to try a new build, I have to level through the obnoxiously long leveling process that is just plain and simple, not fun. Diablo at least gives you some options to get past it. My biggest beef with PoE though is how it forces you into trading with other players to get any kind of gear worth a shit for your build. You almost NEVER get drops that actually benefit your build. Not only this, but PoE has no decent internal trading system, so you are forced into looking at external websites where PoE players have done more work to facilitate the trading that the game may as well require than the devs have done themselves.

Now maybe you like "Gear trading, the game", but for me it was just an endless hassle that was not fun at all. I loved the mechanics of PoE, I loved how complex the skill system was. In fact I like most aspects of the game. What I really hate though is never getting a single drop that's worth a fucking shit, constantly having to monitor drops that might be useful for SOMEBODY ELSES build so that I can sell it in order to buy gear for myself. I hate having to spend stupid amounts of hours leveling a character every time I want to try a new build, that chances are won't even be end-game viable anyway, wasting hours upon hours just to figure that out.

Honestly, nowadays I just have more actual fun playing Diablo. Neither are perfect games, and I wouldn't say one is necessarily better than the other, but Diablo is a good ARPG with strengths and weaknesses, as is PoE.

[–]AHiddenFace [スコア非表示] 1時間前 (0子コメント)

[–]ShuQi [スコア非表示] 2時間前 (2子コメント)

The grind you mentioned in D3 after reaching max level is correct, but at that point you will most likely have your seasonal reward gear set already, so at least you are playing the build you were grinding up for (unless you are looking for a non-seasonal set), whereas in PoE it takes ages to just reach that point. Not to mention seeing players running around with builds that look like a ridiculous amount of fun but knowing that you'll never be able to play that unless you make money via trading or grinding for hours & hours with a build you are not even interested in playing.

Then there's the constant brick walls you will hit, depending on your current build. There were fights in PoE that I simply couldn't do, like getting 1-shotted upon entering the boss instance without even being able to hit a single key first, whereas all the other content was like playing on easy mode. It's just too frustrating an experience for me to enjoy.

I get it, PoE is the spiritual D2 successor, but after playing it for quite a long time I came to realize that I'm just too casual for such a game. Diablo 3 serves me better, as I can put in a few hours every now and then, which is enough to get you going with your preferred build(s) and start enjoying the game.

In my opinion, PoE is the game you want to play if you're willing to put in a lot of time into the game and the player driven trade market. However, if you're looking for a more casual experience, where you can achieve everything by yourself within a (relatively) short amount of time and without having to rely on trading with other players, then I'd still recommend D3, even though that one has its flaws too, but it's still my go-to game whenever a new season starts, as it's just too much fun blasting through the hordes of enemies with all the flashy skills.

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The best fun builds require unique dropped gear which you have to either get lucky to get or earn a bunch of money and then trade for it.

The game only really opens up when you get a lot of skill synergy which is after you've invested 20+ hrs in a single character.

As you can't really re-roll your character, you have to either follow someone else's build or plan the shit out of your build before you even start, right down to the correct starting class. You might not know you've fucked up until you've put 30+ hrs in and are at the end game lvl 80+ and can't complete anything.

The game really needs a casual mode where you can Respec much easier so people can start playing that and experiment on their build before committing on the real servers (although the economy here would be fucked). As it is, there is a real noob deterrent because of the issues with builds.

[–]LG03 [スコア非表示] 2時間前 (1子コメント)

Sure.

Let's start with the obvious, microtransactions. I am very firmly against them in any iteration, I would much rather pay a box price and own everything then have the game for free and feel like I need to open the wallet for every little thing.

In PoE it bothers me because of two reasons. First off is that everything cool looking is behind a paywall (and a fucking massive one at that). As such you have everyone running around in bed sheets while leveling (Tabula Rasas) because the majority of people won't pay for transmogs. Cosmetics aren't merely cosmetics and it bugs me when people dismiss that as such, there's a lot to be said about the cool factor for your enjoyment of a game.

Second with regards to microtransactions, stash tabs are mandatory period. You only start off with 4 and it's just not enough room considering how much bullshit the game throws at you and the size of some of it. If you want to trade you need at least one premium tab so an out of game resource can pull your API, if you want to organize one of 17 various currencies you need a tab for each. It's just ridiculous.

So that was one point, on to the rest.

Trading and economy, I am not a fan of a game where you have to spend more time staring at your web browser for a bargain on an item than actually playing in an effort to find that item. In PoE the 'meta' builds all require obscenely rare and difficult to acquire items. This is contrary to D3 where you find your build's items then the grind is in perfecting them. You're basically prevented from playing your desired build unless you're willing to play the trading game.

Next there's the permanence. I like fiddling with builds, changing sometimes, that is exceptionally difficult to do in PoE. Things like the permanent passive tree (prohibitively expensive to respec in large quantities) and your ascendancy being stuck behind a difficult dungeon anytime you want to change it...quite honestly I don't want to spend weeks leveling a new character just because I want to try something new or because a build didn't work out the first time.

Itemization is another one, it's just hard for me to make heads or tails of and I like to think I'm no idiot. How certain stats relate to each other, how much of what you need for your build, etc. It's just hard to determine when an item is good.

Community, I won't go much into this one but the PoE community can be extremely hostile towards D3 and people that play it. Probably just a byproduct of being F2P but I swear you can't go in game or on their forums/subreddit without someone bashing D3. It's just annoying, like focus on your own game and quit trying to validate your enjoyment of it in relation to something else.

Aesthetics/UI, just not a fan. I understand it's trying to hit some nostalgia beats but that shouldn't be at the cost of usability and visuals.

There's some other things no doubt but to close on a positive, I am a big fan of the skill gems system and the links in gear.

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[–]strifecross [スコア非表示] 1時間前 (1子コメント)

Nothing substantial. Couple new monster types, couple new rift tilesets.

They're not offering any kind of value for it (and being Blizzard you can be damn sure it'll cost in the region of $20USD). All you're doing is essentially paying for a reskinned Witch Doctor (even down to the similarity of some skills)

Uhm, there's a lot more to it than that. The challenge rifts alone add a ton of replayability. And come on, saying he's a reskinned Witch Doctor is straight up bull. Visual design alone differentiates them so much. Gameplay wise some skills have slight overlaps, I will give you that. But Necromancer has a ton of room for interesting builds and we still haven't seen the sets.

I know that Diablo 3 has a rocky reputation, but it's still a good game that's getting a ton of support past launch. The expansion alone changed a ton and was more than worth it. Saying that a new class that will definitely shake up the meta isn't worth it for 20 bucks is definitely gonna vary from person to person. I personally don't mind giving that much because I wanna support the game despite its many flaws.

it's pretty pathetic how desperate people are for anything over on the Diablo subreddit

What's funny here is that the PoE community said the same things when it didn't have anything substantial added to it. Or you know...people can just like what they like and decide for themselves if it's worth it. Quantity and quality of content can be debated ad nauseum though. What I'd like to see is a bit more understanding, something I haven't seen a lot in this sub in a long time.

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[–]gamefrk101 2 ポイント3 ポイント4 ポイント 4時間前 (0子コメント)

Well if you are expecting a massive change no. It will still be the main gameplay as previous patches though depending on when you last played a lot could have changed as they have patched the game every few months.

The biggest new gameplay feature is challenge rifts that give you a new rift each week. These are going to be a set layout with specific monsters that you tackle with a specific class and build.

So one day it may be a rift with the sewers tile set the monsters may be skeletons and succubus and you have to play it with a Demon Hunter marauder set with grenades (it's a rift someone completed with the build they used chosen by Blizzard).

This is a new leaderboard that removes RNG and focuses on mastering the layout and skills that week.

Other than that it's still doing random bounties, rifts, greater rifts, and completing your season journey (if you play seasonal).

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[–]Overrwatcher [スコア非表示] 1時間前 (1子コメント)

I feel as if Blizzard unknowingly shot themselves in the foot by their "no microtransactions" statement years back. As much as /r/games loves to shit on MTX, it gives something to spend money on after you buy the game, and gives a reason for devs to keep updating the game. It lets you only pay the base cost if you want, or drop hundreds of dollars, compared to a subscription/season pass which is fixed. There is literally no reason for Blizzard to keep updating D3 when everyone's already purchased the game and can't spend money on anything. There isn't really any money coming from D3 any more.

Every constantly-updated game nowadays either has microtransactions or two forms of monetization. WoW has multiple but the main ones are the base cost and a subscription. Overwatch has the base cost and microtransactions. Your average CoD/BF game has base cost + season pass. Path of Exile has only MTX, which works because of whales. Competitive multiplayer games like Starcraft II are the exception, because they generally do not need new content, just balance changes and bugfixes with the occasional expansion. Diablo 3 has only the base cost, but because of its PvE nature they need to constantly develop content for it. After season 5 it's clear they just gave up.

[+]time-lord スコアが基準値未満のコメント[スコア非表示] 1時間前 (0子コメント)