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California Senate OKs statewide immigrant sanctuary bill (hosted.ap.org)

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[–]Macarogi 23 ポイント24 ポイント  (4子コメント)

"The bill, SB54, advanced after Senate President Pro Tem Kevin de Leon, a Democrat from Los Angeles, amended it to let state and local law enforcement notify Immigration and Customs Enforcement federal agents before convicted serious or violent felons are released from custody."

"let", not 'require' ? Sounds like they can use their discretion in deciding.

[–]nexico 26 ポイント27 ポイント  (3子コメント)

So after they've been convicted of a crime serious enough to receive jail time, CA will be gracious enough to let ICE finally deport them! Imagine if they had been allowed to deport them before committing the crime in the first place, since they are already breaking the law by being here illegally!

[–]ramonycajones 20 ポイント21 ポイント  (0子コメント)

They can't stop ICE from deporting anyone, which is what you're implying. ICE can do whatever it wants.

[–]TimeKillerAccount 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (0子コメント)

ICE could already deport them dude, no one is stopping them. What the hell do you think was happening?

[–]StingAuer [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

"Sanctuary" in this context means that illegal immigrants are allowed to go to the police if their belongings are stolen, for example, without ICE showing up to bust them for it.

It keeps organized crime down, because illegal immigrants can go to the police if their car is stolen, instead of needing to get help from gangs or form vigilante enforcement groups.

If they themselves get arrested they're likely to be handed over to ICE. it just means that if they won't be punished for coming to the police for help.

[–]BoatsInCaves 177 ポイント178 ポイント  (92子コメント)

These actions are portrayed as helping the poor, but really this screws over poor citizens. Tons of people moving into an area willing to work for less drives wages down, hurting everyone but big companies. It's a seriously screwy logic they are playing with.

[–]LA_SoxFan 63 ポイント64 ポイント  (3子コメント)

but really this screws over poor citizens

key word

[–]facepoppies 19 ポイント20 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Conversely, we see what happened in San Fran where tons of people moved into the area for super high paying jobs and are forcing out the poor and middle class citizens.

[–]CoryTheDuck 65 ポイント66 ポイント  (13子コメント)

And the whole two classes system, the poor who can break laws, and those who can't.

[–]Gbcue 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Sounds like a Ninth Amendment violation for US citizens. How wacky.

[–]SatanBunny 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (4子コメント)

In Los Angeles, the police chief has banned the impounding of vehicles driven by suspected illegal aliens with no driver's license, insurance, or registration. He states that it's an undo financial burden to immigrants who are just trying to get by.

....citizens will still get their cars impounded.

Meanwhile, when California legalized drivers licenses for illegal aliens, hit-and-runs and dui's skyrocketed.

From an article linked below in an attempt to disprove me:

"Hit-and-runs rose in 2014, 2015 and 2016, he said, but declined by 3% in the first three months of 2017."

[–]MarmeladeFuzz 20 ポイント21 ポイント  (2子コメント)

when California legalized drivers licenses for illegal aliens, hit-and-runs and dui's skyrocketed.

cite? Because I've heard the opposite, at least for the hit and runs.

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-illegal-immigrant-drivers-licenses-20170403-story.html

"California law giving immigrants here illegally the ability to get driver's licenses appears to have helped decrease hit-and-run crashes, according to a Stanford University study." (dated yesterday)

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      [–]Distind 25 ポイント26 ポイント  (32子コメント)

      Almost as if that's not what they're concerned about in anyway. These things are aimed at addressing the defacto underground illegal immigrants find themselves in and the resulting resource that represents to criminal organizations and the destabilizing effect it has on society.

      Also, not like anyone is actually doing anything about the people giving these guys jobs. If you want to stop them from coming and having jobs, stop the people giving them to them. Till then I'd rather they don't fear all public services.

      [–]wave_theory 20 ポイント21 ポイント  (14子コメント)

      Also, not like anyone is actually doing anything about the people giving these guys jobs.

      Yeah, here's the thing: the jobs are not so much being given so much as only being taken by migrant workers. The agricultural owners DO offer the jobs to American citizens first; by law they have to. They place advertisements; they go to employment agencies, but it doesn't matter: nobody applies. So when faced with the choice of hiring no people and hiring people that may be of questionable immigration status they choose the later because the work isn't going to do itself.

      The true issue is that we need to get over this idea that illegal immigrants are somehow the cause of economic stagnation. That's nothing but a bullshit lie spouted by Republicans that creates an easy target with which they can rile up the ignorant and uninformed mass that forms their base.

      [–]Revydown 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (2子コメント)

      Maybe the reason americans are not applying for those jobs is because they don't pay enough. Hence the argument that illegal immigration stagnates wages.

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        [–]SuperTiesto 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (14子コメント)

        stop the people giving them to them

        What's your suggestion?

        [–]Enozzir 12 ポイント13 ポイント  (12子コメント)

        Five years mandatory minimum for any owner or CEO of any firm that has been caught hiring illegals and a mandatory fine of 500k per head.

        [–]CadetPeepers 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (8子コメント)

        When so many illegals commit identity fraud, how to you prove that anyone (The owner/CEO is very rarely even remotely close to the person doing the hiring) knew that the person was illegal?

        [–]Enozzir 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        National e verify, if they can pass a social security/birth certificate/ID off then sure the employer doesn't get a fine

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                [–]SaintVigilance 17 ポイント18 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                I know it has been said countless times, but it amazes me just how extreme and out of touch both political parties have become in the past 4-5 months. The saddest part is that this is just going to get worse.

                [–]CoryTheDuck 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                Maybe the Independents will rise to the top out of this mess.

                [–]19Kilo 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                You should share the mescaline you're clearly hoarding.

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                  [–]CrissCross98 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (9子コメント)

                  its the employers fault. why are we blaming people, that if any of us were in the same position, would do as well?

                  [–]hoi4champ 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                  its the employers fault. why are we blaming people, that if any of us were in the same position, would do as well?

                  It's the government fault. The people coming over just want a better life, the employers have to use cheap labor or the they go under because their competition does. The people who should stop both groups is the government.

                  [–]42aaac71fb3f45cc60 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                  its the employers fault.

                  And if an illegal alien presents "valid" forms of identification (stolen SS number, ect.) at the time of employment there is nothing an employer can do without fear of being sued.

                  [–]cheertina 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                  And in that case they're not driving wages down any lower than minimum wage.

                  [–]jt42352 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                  Prison for identity theft then deportation.

                  [–]WaidWilson 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (6子コメント)

                  This is CA, they would allow in every refugee on the planet if they could get away with it

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                    [–]keepitwithmine 268 ポイント269 ポイント  (354子コメント)

                    Not having all those folks to exploit would really hurt their state economy. Lot of rich people out there would also really be hurting to pay maids min wage. Nothing like claiming the moral high ground to drive down wages and pay people 50%+ less than the min wage.

                    [–]Slaewchi 130 ポイント131 ポイント  (183子コメント)

                    An alternative title in a different lifetime, "South OKs Regionwide Slavery Sanctuary Bill, Plantation Owners Rejoice. 'Who else will we get to do these jobs at these prices? Slaves are willing to do the work our citizens are not.'"

                    [–]Jkeets777 76 ポイント77 ポイント  (164子コメント)

                    Once again the dems threaten civil war so they can keep their cheap labor.

                    [–]CaptnCarl85 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                    My landscaper fled San Diego two weeks after inauguration. Now, I have to clean up the litter thrown on the ground by the valley girls in the front apartment.

                    [–]skilliard7 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (6子コメント)

                    Right, business owners are forcing the illegal immigrants to work. It's not like they come here to seek mutually beneficial employment that isn't available in their own country. /s

                    [–]Awayfone 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                    So you fine with business pay what ever the market will support?

                    You fine with no minimum work age either, child labor is mutually beneficial after all

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                        [–]SDResistor 26 ポイント27 ポイント  (9子コメント)

                        Rich people's tears from having to pay more for indentured servants are delicious

                        [–]unbannable02 45 ポイント46 ポイント  (8子コメント)

                        An illegal immigrant crackdown and new H1b restrictions? No wonder California hates this new Administration, they're taking away all the unfair advantages they built they're "8th largest economy in the world" on.

                        [–]linussy 75 ポイント76 ポイント  (57子コメント)

                        A certain segment of the left must be so confused with what to do. On one hand they champion a "living wage", but then claim we can't go after illegals because increasing wages to a living wage for legal workers would hurt the economy and thus we need illegals to pay poverty wages.

                        Must be painful doing all those mental gymnastics.

                        [–]Gbcue 31 ポイント32 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                        > Costs won't go up if you increase the minimum wage to $15/hr.

                        > Costs will go up if you deport all the illegals because Americans have to be paid more.

                        Pick one.

                        [–]Isord 18 ポイント19 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                        Except that's not what "sanctuary" means at all. It just means the State isn't going to waste their resources enforcing Federal law, and they will work to ensure the integrity of their own criminal proceedings so as not to discourage illegal immigrants to report to court as witnesses or defendants.

                        [–]rossimus 40 ポイント41 ポイント  (39子コメント)

                        I think its just as interesting watching segments of the right try and reconcile their support for states rights with their disdain for how states like New York and California do things they don't like.

                        [–]unbannable02 55 ポイント56 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                        That one's easy, at least regarding this particular issue: border control is and always has been a Federal issue. In fact it's one of the few things that should be a Federal issue, much of what the Feds oversee today are things that, from a States' Rights/Small Government perspective, they shouldn't.

                        [–]skunimatrix 24 ポイント25 ポイント  (8子コメント)

                        Immigration and border controls are one of the things the State Rights people generally agree is in the domain of the federal government and should be...

                        [–]ramonycajones 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                        California isn't stopping the federal government from doing any of those things, they're just not actively participating, since it's the federal government's role.

                        [–]drmctesticles 35 ポイント36 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                        Immigration is not a state issue. Immigration is under the purview of the federal government.

                        [–]ramonycajones 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                        Which is why the state is not putting resources into enforcing it. Feds can do it if they want to do it; no one's stopping them.

                        [–]Iz-kan-reddit 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                        Exactly, which is why the state is staying out of it.

                        [–]Seeattle_Seehawks 16 ポイント17 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                        Hey now, you'd have to take a basic high school civics class to know that!

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                          [–]marmorset 46 ポイント47 ポイント  (13子コメント)

                          It's interesting that you buy into the "lose-lose" system.

                          When States tried to manage illegal alien problems on their own, the president sued and Federal courts said that immigration was an entirely Federal issue, the States had no jurisdiction. Now that Republicans are running the executive, the Federal judges say that the president can't enact the immigration powers granted to him by congress and reinforced through precedent.

                          You can't have it both ways. For many years the Democrats have been lucky in that the Republicans complained that the rules kept changing but adhered to whatever whims the Democrats instituted. Now the Dems are in a panic because there's a president who's taking advantage of the system the Democrats designed for themselves.

                          Don't corrupt the government and alter the rules to screw the other party, if you don't want someone else to act according to your own guidelines.

                          [–]TimeKillerAccount 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                          you are incorrect, and mischaracterize the different issues.

                          States can't determine immigration laws because it is a federal issues. Democrats ran that to the courts citing the constitution giving the feds the right to determine immigration laws and the court agreed, siding with the constitution.

                          Republicans recently tried to pass several unconstitutional laws unrelated to state rights, primarily illegal executive orders regarding immigration that failed to meet constitutional requirements for both intent and application. The courts shot them down, because again, the constitution is still a thing.

                          Republicans currently complain that immigration is a federal issue, and have tried to force the states to enforce federal law. The states said no, that is against the constitution, and the courts once again sided with the constitution.

                          See the difference? Democrats say that immigration law is a fed issue, therefor states can't make law about it. Republicans are now trying to claim that immigration being a fed issue means they can force the states to use state resources to enforce federal law. That is unconstitutional. Two different issues that are not the same.

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                              [–]Mendican 22 ポイント23 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                              Nobody said any of that garbage.

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                                [–]Beazlepup 53 ポイント54 ポイント  (25子コメント)

                                California is really bizarro land. Northeast USA is liberal too but not in the same batshit progressive way California is. California is a land where your leaders replace you with foreigners that have no regard to assimilate because they want cheap labor, and then retreat to their billion dollar gated communities at the end of the day.

                                It's also funny that the state is plagued with all the problems Liberals say would happen when Conservatives take over despite being under near total Democrat control for decades: a dysfunctional housing market, rampant income inequality, homeless everywhere, AIDs epidemic, crumbling infrastructure, awful public transport (partially due to every subway elevator being on constant shutdown because aforementioned homeless shitting and pissing all over them.)

                                But at least they're not racist.

                                [–]unbannable02 18 ポイント19 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                rampant income equality

                                I'm assuming you meant "rampant income inequality"; rampant income equality would be a good thing and not something California's known for.

                                [–]Zoltar23 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                Throw in draconian gun laws as well. Dems say they are for the people and yet have no problems with disarming them.

                                [–]ambivalentbystander 25 ポイント26 ポイント  (14子コメント)

                                California's economy is doing great. Maybe visit sometime instead of relying on Fox News. If you want to see what happens when conservatives are in charge, look at Kansas

                                [–]goldrogue 28 ポイント29 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                                Idk man, I feel like we're in a bubble sometimes. Our economy is good because we're heavy on agriculture and tech which currently relies heavily on cheap H1-B labor. Take that away and the bubble might burst.

                                [–]BobbyRobertson 22 ポイント23 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                Considering the massive profits of both those industries it would probably be better for the economy if more profits found itself in the hands of the workforce instead of the shareholders.

                                Cheap labor is good for the company itself, but isn't good for the purchasing power of the people who live there

                                [–]ambivalentbystander 14 ポイント15 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                And entertainment, defense, tourism, universities

                                [–]goldrogue 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                Energy, manufacturing, real estate trade as well.

                                Wasn't really trying to imply those two were the only, just that they are a ones that use cheap labor. Not to mention they will have ripple effects throughout other industries.

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                                  [–]heavenlytoaster 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                  California economy is great like we recovered from the financial crisis.

                                  I'm good because I work in tech, but rucking lol

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                                    [–]rolabond 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                    The homeless thing is really unfair, it doesn'tget cld enough here for our homeless to freeze over and families/cities bus their homeless to California. A wall to keep them out could be helpful.

                                    [–]Damn_Dog_Inappropes 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                                    foreigners that have no regard to assimilate

                                    Uuuhhhh, you do know that California used to be part of Mexico, right?

                                    [–]facepoppies 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                    Well, conservatives apparently are against internet privacy, so if that's what it takes to be a conservative y'all can fuck right off.

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                                      [–]Jkeets777 27 ポイント28 ポイント  (48子コメント)

                                      Who would have guessed that 150 years after the civil war, Democrats once again are threatening civil strife to keep cheap labor.

                                      [–]Mendican 16 ポイント17 ポイント  (5子コメント)

                                      Immigrant sanctuary protects a population from being victimized. It exists so that immigrants can report crimes without being deported for doing so. It exists so that a person can't rape immigrant women and girls with impunity, because those women are afraid to report it. This is America dude. Aren't we better than that?

                                      [–]thatoneguy889 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                      It's already happening. There has been a sharp decrease in reported sexual and domestic abuse in the Latino community in Los Angeles because people fear getting deported just for interacting with the police.

                                      http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-immigrant-crime-reporting-drops-20170321-story.html

                                      [–]nexusnotes 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                      This. I don't think people realize this would do very little to change immigration practices. This is not a labor issue. This is allow people to go to the cops if they are victimized issue. There has been a sharp decrease in illegals reporting crime b/c of fear of being deported.

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                                        [–]nexusnotes 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                        I think you are misinformed. This is not a labor issue. This is allow illegal immigrants to go to the police to report crime issue, and to stop them from being victimized. There is a sharp decrease in them reporting crimes, if they are not guaranteed the ability of not being arrested when they do so. I have yet to see any evidence that being a sanctuary city increases illegal immigration.

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                                          [–]TeslaAddict 157 ポイント158 ポイント  (87子コメント)

                                          Get ready for a massive inrush of low income individuals and uninsured motorist accident claims.

                                          [–]Orfo48 42 ポイント43 ポイント  (10子コメント)

                                          Illegals can get licenses and auto insurance in CA

                                          [–]Bray4ever8 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                          That's one of the reasons Brown gave illegals licenses in CA, so they could get insurance.

                                          I was inquiring about insurance for my son and brought that up with the Progressive agent. He told me that as long as you had a license you could get car insurance.

                                          [–]SDResistor 71 ポイント72 ポイント  (66子コメント)

                                          You only have to pay for insurance if you're a citizen. It's only fair!

                                          [–]Orfo48 75 ポイント76 ポイント  (65子コメント)

                                          Illegals can get licenses and auto insurance in CA

                                          [–]SDResistor 82 ポイント83 ポイント  (62子コメント)

                                          can

                                          can is the keyword. do, often not.

                                          [–]BoatsInCaves 72 ポイント73 ポイント  (33子コメント)

                                          They have zero incentive to. Being in the country illegally means you're probably not showing up to civil court either. You don't have credit to ruin.

                                          [–]OssiansFolly 68 ポイント69 ポイント  (31子コメント)

                                          CA has one of the lowest uninsured driver rates in the country hovering between 10-12%. Compare that to OK which sits around 24-26%...

                                          [–]rustinlee_VR 15 ポイント16 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                          But I feeeeeel that Democratic policies should hurt CA! Why are they statistically better than every other state? My fragile worldview!!!

                                          [–]Joseplh 24 ポイント25 ポイント  (23子コメント)

                                          Mind providing a source? I think your right, but for different reasons. By example California also requires annual inspections , while Oklahoma does not. There are differing rules and punishments from state to state. I could speculate that Oklahoma has a lower insurance rate, because they do not do annual inspections, which has other people inspect your car and note(or fine) that you have no insurance.

                                          [–]OssiansFolly 55 ポイント56 ポイント  (13子コメント)

                                          You can use the III or CarInsurance.com. I'm in OH and our laws if you get caught without insurance are FAR worse than CA, but we are in the top 5 states for uninsured motorists...if you're caught here it is a mandatory license suspension, $1,000 fine (not counting court costs), and then you have to carry a special bond and high risk insurance for 3 years which increases average insurance costs by 100-150%.

                                          (I'm an insurance agent licensed in quite a few states, so I study this stuff.)

                                          [–]Joseplh 10 ポイント11 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                                          Thank you very much. I very much appreciate that it is also a direct source and not a link to a news article. The III has some interesting thinks I'd like to note. It appears that Oklahoma is an anomaly by comparison to neighboring states Texas(13.3%), Kansas(9.4%), Arkansas(15.9%), Missouri(13.5%), Colorado(16.2%), and New Mexico(21.6%). New Mexico is the closest to Oklahoma and the large disparity between Oklahoma and neighboring states makes me wonder why?

                                          • Difference in insurance requirements?
                                          • Difference in reporting?
                                          • Difference in culture?
                                          • Difference in enforcement?

                                          You got my interest and I'll be looking these things up. I am not familiar with local automotive laws across the country.

                                          EDIT: there does not seem to be a trend based on location in the top TEN, we have Rhode Island, Washington, and New Mexico, which are clear across the country from each other. Although, for the bottom TEN, there is a strong correlation with northern states and insurance rates. Perhaps this is due to weather and people expectations(which does not always meet reality) on using insurance more in ice climates with slick roads than in warmer climates where there is little ice.

                                          [–]OssiansFolly 14 ポイント15 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                                          Difference in insurance requirements? Difference in reporting? Difference in culture? Difference in enforcement?

                                          All of these!

                                          Kansas in a No Fault State, so that helps keep their numbers down...different ball game when you are basically only covering yourself and not the other guy.

                                          Dated, but article on OK uninsured motorist rates.

                                          [–]19Kilo 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                          It appears that Oklahoma is an anomaly

                                          This is pretty much a true statement for anything.

                                          [–]loves80085 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                          don't forget mean incomes as a possibility. more people might be foregoing insurance if they have less money, overall.

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                                            [–]Gbcue 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (8子コメント)

                                            By example California also requires annual inspections

                                            As a resident of California, my cars have never required any sort of inspection (as I've read of other states, like headlight checks, tires, brake checks, etc.).

                                            [–]Joseplh 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                                            I guess I was mistaken, it appears you do have a smog check every 2 years, Excluding stuff like old cars and electric cars.

                                            [–]Gbcue 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (5子コメント)

                                            Yes, and it's strictly an emissions test. And it's the simplest test. The tech plugs into the OBD port, does a visual check of the exhaust system, and if the machine says Pass, it passes. Takes less than 5 minutes.

                                            No checking of anything else.

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                                                  [–]Orfo48 19 ポイント20 ポイント  (18子コメント)

                                                  Got a source?

                                                  I know over 800k illegals got DLs right away when it was first implemented. It was backlogged for weeks and you can assume they would skip out on the insurance.

                                                  We do have low numbers of uninsured drivers from insurance company reports

                                                  [–]SDResistor 20 ポイント21 ポイント  (17子コメント)

                                                  Getting into an accident as an uninsured motorist can easily end up costing tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars. Faced with the prospect of deportation, the situation is even more precarious for undocumented immigrants. Unfortunately, to make a living, many immigrants take on the risk of driving uninsured anyway.

                                                  http://www.huffingtonpost.com/robert-harrow/getting-car-insurance-as-_b_11459930.html

                                                  In the push to grant illegal immigrants driver’s licenses, Californians had been assured that doing so would spur them to get safety training and insurance coverage. Nearly a year-and-a-half later, there’s no evidence it worked. “It is hard to pinpoint whether the bill has had an impact or not,” said Jeffrey Spring, spokesman for the American Automobile Association’s California chapter. “We have no way of knowing.”

                                                  http://www.foxnews.com/us/2016/05/21/evidence-scant-californias-licensed-illegal-immigrant-drivers-getting-insurance.html

                                                  A liberal news source and conservative news source both agree - most illegals don't buy insurance. Even with the illegal DL.

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                                                      [–]INGWR 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                      RIP every California hospital

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                                                        [–]Chappie47Luna 22 ポイント23 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                        "The bill, SB54, advanced after Senate President Pro Tem Kevin de Leon, a Democrat from Los Angeles, amended it to let state and local law enforcement notify Immigration and Customs Enforcement federal agents before convicted serious or violent felons are released from custody."

                                                        [–]KaiserPhil 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                        I don't think most people commenting read the article.

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                                                          [–]BaptizedInFire_ 112 ポイント113 ポイント  (79子コメント)

                                                          California is truly retarded. I say this as a California resident. These people only care about being able to pay someone under minimum wage which in turn makes More people file for an EBT card. Also these fucks are protecting sexual predators and they know it.

                                                          "This is an acknowledgement of the cultural and economic contributions made to our great state by immigrants from all over the world," de Leon said outside the Senate chamber after the vote.

                                                          Even some Democrats said they are concerned the bill still bars state and local officials from turning over criminals convicted of certain sexual or violent crimes.

                                                          [–]Slaewchi 65 ポイント66 ポイント  (34子コメント)

                                                          This is why people use the buzzword "Democrat Plantation." Keep people from being able to survive on their own while pushing welfare incentives in their face to make them reliant on those programs.

                                                          [–]Bobbo93 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                          Right but they'll make leftists have an easy majority once granted amnesty, and then we can push hard left and into Socialism, becoming a great utopia like Venezuela where we permanently have all the power! So it's justified!

                                                          [–]SeaGrim 10 ポイント11 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                          Yep, Californian born here. Moving to Washington state at the end of summer temporarily for a few years, then off to N. Carolina for good. Good riddance.

                                                          [–]Damn_Dog_Inappropes 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                          As a Californian currently residing in WA, good luck with that. Seattle is super duper liberal, the rest of the state is libertarian at best. The end result is a very regressive tax system and not enough money to do anything. Shit, I dodged the same pothole in the far left lane of the 405 FOR FIVE YEARS. We also chronically underfund our k-12 education systems, so much so that the state Supreme Court has enacted a $100k/day fine on the state until the funding increases. The initial SC ruling was in 2012, and the fines were placed in 2015, and we still haven't gotten our shit together.

                                                          [–]SeaGrim 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                          Which is why I am not gonna be there permanently. The housing prices there are not much better than the Bay unless you really want to be out in the sticks. N. Carolina, I get to work in my industry, lax gun laws, FIBER INTERNET, and housing which I don't have to pay $1 Million+ for a shack.

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                                                            [–]SDResistor 61 ポイント62 ポイント  (32子コメント)

                                                            Mexifornia, here we come!

                                                            [–]arjun1967 26 ポイント27 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                            Too late, we're already there, we've already named all of our major cities with Spanish names /s

                                                            [–]lostsoul34 21 ポイント22 ポイント  (29子コメント)

                                                            This is a disaster.

                                                            It's basically saying open borders this is really really stupid someone who is living here this really bothers me

                                                            [–]takata_ 22 ポイント23 ポイント  (12子コメント)

                                                            Who do you think votes for.democrats? Once majority is achieved you're done.

                                                            Shoutout to neoliberalism

                                                            [–]jerryTcunt 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (11子コメント)

                                                            But then liberals argue "How can undocumented immigrants vote?"; unaware of the fact that illegals have children who vote in favor of Dems to protect their parents.

                                                            [–]takata_ 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (9子コメント)

                                                            Not an american but wasn’t there proof that a couple of illegals voted?

                                                            [–]jerryTcunt 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (5子コメント)

                                                            I'm not sure of any here in California, but an illegal immigrant did vote in texas, though she is facing consequences. I'm sure there's plenty of others who voted without anyone noticing.

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                                                                [–]Hbd-investor 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (9子コメント)

                                                                someone who is living here 

                                                                You voted for the Democrats in every election, you reap what you sow

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                                                                    [–]libbylibertarian 99 ポイント100 ポイント  (37子コメント)

                                                                    This is an example of why the Democrats lost the poor in America, and why their party is heading to oblivion. They've chosen to assist illegal aliens rather than American citizens.

                                                                    [–]SJW_Queefs_Stink 58 ポイント59 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                    That is exactly how Trump got elected. The teevee mocks populism, but people are getting fed up with endless oligarchy.

                                                                    [–]OrpheusV 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                    And we've seen how populism plays out every single time. Left untempered, it spirals into authoritarianism or empirically worse outcomes, creating more problems than it sets out to solve. Ask venezuela and their former president Chavez how that policy worked out. Ask 1930's Germany how that worked out. Ask Russia how that worked out in the 50s/60s particularly.

                                                                    Populist sentiment can work well, but it absolutely must be tempered or it spirals out of control. This goes on both sides of the aisle too.

                                                                    [–]DoubleADeep 23 ポイント24 ポイント  (8子コメント)

                                                                    Wouldn't this be an issue of states refusing to do the federal governments job? If the fed wants to send in ICE to deport people that's fine but they're paying it for it and using their own man power. Why do local law enforcement have to do a job that isn't theirs?

                                                                    Why are states rights always such a big thing with non-democrats until democrats use them.

                                                                    [–]skilliard7 10 ポイント11 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                                                    Because they refuse to hold illegal immigrants in their own state jails/prisons. So ICE would have to transport them out of state just to process information

                                                                    [–]Isord 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                    If ICE would get warrants this wouldn't be an issue.

                                                                    [–]oblication 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                    But that isn't what people are angry about. Look at the thread, they're mad because "California liberals are "helping" illegals rather than helping citizens."
                                                                    If this is boring a matter of who pays for incarceration, then why all the vitriol?

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                                                                        [–]InvalidKoalas 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (19子コメント)

                                                                        The Democrats haven't lost the poor. The Democrats have always had the poor urban population. Republicans have the poor rural.

                                                                        And I would argue that many liberals are more in favor of treating everyone as equal because who the fuck cares where you were born?

                                                                        [–]42aaac71fb3f45cc60 27 ポイント28 ポイント  (5子コメント)

                                                                        And I would argue that many liberals are more in favor of treating everyone as equal because who the fuck cares where you were born?

                                                                        Well the funny thing is that the communities that are disproportionately impacted by illegal aliens are legal hispanic immigrants and African Americans.

                                                                        [–]GeneralRipper101 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                                                        Well the funny thing is that the communities that are disproportionately impacted by illegal aliens are legal hispanic immigrants and African Americans.

                                                                        Yet they overwhelming vote for democrats.

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                                                                          [–]libbylibertarian 32 ポイント33 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                          And I would argue that many liberals are more in favor of treating everyone as equal because who the fuck cares where you were born?

                                                                          The law cares, and so does every American citizen marginalized by illegal immigration.

                                                                          [–]pokebro1992 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                                                                          It definitely affected peoples views, I refused to vote for either Trump or Hillary because of hypocrisy on both sides of the camp. I got tired of people's craziness, you only like illegal immigration because that's what your party says. Michigan came to within 20000 voters and I know of three besides myself, young people who chose not to leave work on election day to vote for a candidate that didn't represent us. Hilary should have shit stomped this election but she didn't because of the horrible turnout. I don't want to be lumped in with people that support illegal immigration which leads to shitty areas/schools and crimes. Like honestly outside of a 3rd grader answer how does illegal immigration benefit this country? I'm mostly liberal so you know, but illegal immigration I will never understand

                                                                          [–]arjun1967 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                          Neither parties actually "have the poor". Poor Americans by and large don't vote, because neither party really represents their interests.

                                                                          [–]throwaway03022017 19 ポイント20 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                                          It's not about immigrants.

                                                                          It's about illegal immigrants. If you come here without going through proper channels you do not deserve to be here and have zero right to stay. Anyone we allow to stay we do so out of the kindness of our hearts. If you're here illegally and commit another crime, fuck you it's time to go back.

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                                                                              [–]Darkmerl 83 ポイント84 ポイント  (231子コメント)

                                                                              How Californians are ok with the taxes they are paying for 2.5 million illegal aliens and their kids is astounding.

                                                                              That's besides the criminal element from the murder in San Francisco to the drug trafficking and upward crime trends after proposition 47.

                                                                              For such a moral high ground state they are a bunch of imbeciles.

                                                                              [–]CoryTheDuck 51 ポイント52 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                                                                              We hate it, and hope that the feds raid Sacramento.

                                                                              [–]Tiels_4_life 17 ポイント18 ポイント  (13子コメント)

                                                                              How Californians are ok with the taxes they are paying for 2.5 million illegal aliens

                                                                              You do realize that Californians seem to be ok with the entire nation (except NY and Texas) leeching off their economy and having their election votes count the least in the US.

                                                                              I don't think this, what really is a small issue, will effect their economy or people at all.

                                                                              Cali has the 5th or 6th largest economy in the world.

                                                                              [–]moredeltav 27 ポイント28 ポイント  (49子コメント)

                                                                              Yeah, I'm okay with this. I have no problem with paying higher taxes so less fourtrunate people can have basic amenities. Legal or not.

                                                                              The Supreme Court ordered California to reduce prison populations. We're all ears for your great ideas on how to accomplish that...

                                                                              Every state has horrible laws and representatives, why are you so sour towards California? I'm sure your wonderful flyover state has plenty of backwards laws.

                                                                              [–]poochyenarulez 32 ポイント33 ポイント  (43子コメント)

                                                                              I have no problem with paying higher taxes so less fourtrunate people can have basic amenities. Legal or not.

                                                                              if you want illegal people to have your money, then donate to a charity. People who don't participate in the system shouldn't get the benefits of the system. How do you see that as being fair?

                                                                              [–]foreverphoenix 25 ポイント26 ポイント  (41子コメント)

                                                                              Undocumented workers pay $12b in taxes every year. They pay in to a system which is now actively seeking to jail and deport them.

                                                                              [–]poochyenarulez 12 ポイント13 ポイント  (35子コメント)

                                                                              If you are undocumented, you aren't paying taxes besides sales tax. They aren't fully in the system.

                                                                              now actively seeking to jail and deport them.

                                                                              Aww, those poor people. Can you believe we are jailing criminals? How awful!

                                                                              [–]oblication 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                                              If you are undocumented, you aren't paying taxes besides sales tax.

                                                                              hahah what?

                                                                              [–]OperIvy 21 ポイント22 ポイント  (15子コメント)

                                                                              They pay income tax. Undocumented immigration is a civil, not criminal, crime.

                                                                              [–]pilkunnussija-k 10 ポイント11 ポイント  (9子コメント)

                                                                              Wrong; if you are undocumented you are paying taxes and get no chance of a tax return. Below is one source, but please google this.

                                                                              https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2016/09/undocumented-immigrants-and-taxes/499604/

                                                                              Jailing criminals... When they actually trespass against someone, sure, no reason to be overly sympathetic. But the crime of not bothering other people and trying to make a life for ones self?

                                                                              These people PAY taxes. They add value to the community. Where you find concentrations of illegals you also find lower crime.

                                                                              The idea that you get some rights because you were born here is asstarded.

                                                                              [–]poochyenarulez 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                                                                              The idea that you get some rights because you were born here is asstarded.

                                                                              you get your rights and benefits of the system once you come here legally. Otherwise, go away and stop complaining that things aren't fair to you.

                                                                              [–]pilkunnussija-k 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (6子コメント)

                                                                              What is your logic for that assertion?

                                                                              Reality; you have the rights you take and can maintain or that others can take and maintain for you. Your assertion is not grounded in actual logic or reason. They are based on an arbatrary belief that the universe does not care about.

                                                                              Stop complaining that things are fair to you? By what observation do you think that is even just? The real world works like this; if where you live sucks either move or change it. Your government sucks? You want more for you kids? This 'well, follow the law' shit is garbage. You break the law; as law is not ethics. It's just a bunch of man made rules. If things arent fair you dont just shut up and take; you do something about it.

                                                                              These people come here because where they live sucks. I value freedom and the rights of others to be free and to seek happiness and so on as long as they do not trespass against another... You value where someone was born... But reality doesnt care what we value; people have the rights they take and can maintain.

                                                                              Have to love what I assume are republicans and libertarians (I'm a centrist libertarian) who are supposed to be about less government in our lives wanting the fed to come down hard on illegal immigration, or fuck with states rights. Pretendacan is more like it. Not actual republicans, just xenophobic protectionists talking about mexicans taking their jobs inside while they scream about the free market.

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                                                                                    [–]JohnnyOnslaught 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                    Economy of scale and things of that nature. Everyone paying into a group pool that sometimes doesn't directly benefit them still comes out cheaper and more efficient than everyone being forced to fend for themselves.

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                                                                                      [–]SeaGrim 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                      We are not. Keep in mind, many people who moved here and voted for this are not even from California at the first place. My mom was born in Long Beach, and is not okay with it either, and her family (legally, and spent many years), immigrating from a third world dictatorship shithole to live here. Its insulting to them, because they had to learn the language, work hard (uncle was a limo driver), and spend thousands of dollars to eventually become citizens. Thankfully im moving to Washington state at the end of summer, after my 25 year stint here. The only reason Kevin De Leon keeps getting elected is because the people in LA keep putting him there, otherwise most sane Californians want him gone....much like: "Gun control for everyone but me Yeeland Lee"

                                                                                      [–]Agastopia 20 ポイント21 ポイント  (35子コメント)

                                                                                      4th largest economy in the world. Think they're doing alright.

                                                                                      [–]SDResistor 52 ポイント53 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                                                                      4th 6th largest economy in the world

                                                                                      FTFY

                                                                                      The state now ranks as the sixth largest economy in the world, behind The U.S., China, Japan, Germany and the United Kingdom.

                                                                                      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_California

                                                                                      [–]Darkmerl 36 ポイント37 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                                                      The economy is not really related to individual taxpayers standard of living.

                                                                                      Case in point China.

                                                                                      [–]thisisATHENS 24 ポイント25 ポイント  (6子コメント)

                                                                                      4th largest economy in the world. Think they're doing alright.

                                                                                      Is that why the middle class is fleeing?

                                                                                      There's more to life than GDP.

                                                                                      [–]IveGotaGoldChain 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (5子コメント)

                                                                                      The middle class is leaving because it is expensive to live here. It's expensive to live here because highly talented people want to live here so there is a lot of demand

                                                                                      [–]Enozzir 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                      No because of zoning laws and a break in equilibrium in supply and demand of housing.

                                                                                      100k in California gets you now where but in Texas oh hell yes

                                                                                      [–]1BadassStoryteller 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                      It's expensive to live here because highly talented people want to live here so there is a lot of demand

                                                                                      Try insane taxes and insane rental rates. And forget about trying to buy a house.

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                                                                                        [–]Rogunz 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                        They also have the nations highest poverty rate when you look at how much it actually costs to live there.

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                                                                                          [–]Mendican 15 ポイント16 ポイント  (43子コメント)

                                                                                          Because they pay property taxes and sales taxes and income taxes and every other tax that you pay.

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                                                                                            [–]Owl02 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                            Well would you look at that, Democrats vehemently defending the exploitation of laborers in the name of profit. When have we seen that before? The more things change, the more they stay the same.

                                                                                            [–]Awayfone 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                                                                                            "prevents law enforcement from cooperating with federal officials", isn't something you general want to see in a bill.

                                                                                            Also regarding the senatora quoted who treated this as being an insult against President Trump . Laws shouldn't be made to figuratively flip off some one you disagree with, so petty.

                                                                                            [–]Kilofix 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                            So it won't even take effect until Jan 1, 2018? Or am I reading it wrong?

                                                                                            [–]moredeltav 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                                                                                            Ha, fair? The real world isn't fair. We all must do things we don't like or agree with. I value humans over a little extra money taken out of my pay check. If being a "welfare state" means a better quality of life for thoes in need, then that's a-okay with me. I agree uncontrolled immigration is a problem, but calling Californians imbeciles is ignorant and shows a complete lack of understanding of the issues.

                                                                                            [–]Darkmerl 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (6子コメント)

                                                                                            Well there's 100 - 500 million plus in Africa and South America and Asia that would gladly come and start a new life as an illegal immigrant in California.

                                                                                            Are you ok with paying for them knowing that some cannot even write therefore cannot be a taxpayer (real tax not loan to government paid back by Irs) since they never get over 35000/ year with a janitor salary?

                                                                                            The reason they are not there? Threat of immediate deportation.

                                                                                            It's this kind of short emotional thinking and logic that makes me think some Californians are not very intelligent people.

                                                                                            That's the truth

                                                                                            [–]moredeltav 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                            I highly doubt the threat of deportation is why people in countries on the other side of the planet are afraid to come here. I never said we should let people flood in California. We are geographically isolated from most of the world. Not a very good example.

                                                                                            Plenty of Americans make less than 35,000 a year not sure what your point is. You assume they're all janitors? How incredibly ignorant of you.

                                                                                            [–]Darkmerl 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                            No that's not what I meant.

                                                                                            I worked as a janitor for a summer before getting a masters in accounting/tax then going to the Feds.

                                                                                            The threat of deportation is real.

                                                                                            BP has 60% drop in apprehensions since trump got elected.

                                                                                            http://investmentwatchblog.com/trump-decreases-illegal-immigration-by-60/

                                                                                            Second most people don't really pay taxes in outflow at lowest income, depending on where they live.

                                                                                            I chose 35000 because that's where they realistically start paying income tax depending on how many kids they have and investments/exemptions.

                                                                                            They get back the money with the tax refund from the irs. They are not net contributors they just lend money to the fed government until tax season

                                                                                            [–]KimJongOrange 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                            A lot of the people who think that live in states that literally voted Donald Trump for president. Obviously, no one should ever care what they think.

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                                                                                              [–]thisisATHENS 16 ポイント17 ポイント  (23子コメント)

                                                                                              When California tried denying illegals benefits: struck down by a so called judge

                                                                                              When they becone a sanctuary state: probably nothinv

                                                                                              [–]lostsoul34 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (11子コメント)

                                                                                              You're kidding me so by law illegal. Immigrants can get benefits in California? Holy fucking shit I'm moving from here this is bullshit crazy

                                                                                              [–]thisisATHENS 13 ポイント14 ポイント  (10子コメント)

                                                                                              The citizens voted to stop it and one single judge said "no".

                                                                                              https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_Proposition_187

                                                                                              The judiciary has become anti American

                                                                                              [–]vanilla_coffee 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                                                                                              In November 1997, Pfaelzer found the law to be unconstitutional on the basis that it infringed on the federal government's exclusive jurisdiction over matters relating to immigration.

                                                                                              judges job is to prevent unconstitutional laws imposed by the mob

                                                                                              [–]Enozzir 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                              If they had a voucher system that only parents could sign up for...

                                                                                              [–]timescrucial [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

                                                                                              "a day with illegals" was the best day ever. freeways were clear as fuck in LA. i wish they have those everyday!

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                                                                                                [–]ifeeltired26 15 ポイント16 ポイント  (23子コメント)

                                                                                                So basically CA decides what laws it will follows and ones it wouldn't. I wish I could do that. Gee officer I know the speed limit is 65 but I felt like going 100 mph today, because the 65 mph speed limit is unfair. I wonder how that would go over with the officer?

                                                                                                [–]source_of_randomness 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                Or you know, it is how Colorado, Washington and California have decided not to enforce marijuana-related federal laws. But that is obviously not an issue to you, right?

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                                                                                                  [–]nate_paper 27 ポイント28 ポイント  (13子コメント)

                                                                                                  Good. All illegals across the US > go to California and get the fuck out of my state.

                                                                                                  [–]Thenidhogg 20 ポイント21 ポイント  (20子コメント)

                                                                                                  This thread is cancer, turn back now.

                                                                                                  [–]Resistir 18 ポイント19 ポイント  (18子コメント)

                                                                                                  The shills are out in force in this thread trying to sell you on the idea that Californians didn't want this. That California has higher taxes because of this(They don't).

                                                                                                  California is literally the strongest state in the entire nation and has 13% the population of America. Nothing would make me happier than the entire country starting shit with Californians and watching them get fucked when we stop spreading our money outward.

                                                                                                  [–]vanilla_coffee 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                  I noticed that too

                                                                                                  [–]StaplerLivesMatter 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (5子コメント)

                                                                                                  Local law enforcement are not immigration cops, nor should they be. Immigration is the federal government's problem, and they have no right to demand that states bear the expense of arresting and jailing people for a civil violation.

                                                                                                  [–]Rogunz 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                                                                                                  This bill goes far beyond that.

                                                                                                  It prevents law enforcement from communicating with ICE in basically any way outside of where they are required to by law or for people who committed specific felonys.

                                                                                                  [–]darexinfinity 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                  In other news, ICE opens up offices all over the state. Thanks the Californian government for becoming a sinkhole for all of the illegal immigrants and making their job easier.

                                                                                                  [–]Seeattle_Seehawks 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                                                                  It's been called the "Fuck It, The Borders Are Made Up & The Law Doesn't Matter" Bill

                                                                                                  [–]Serenikill 13 ポイント14 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                                                                                                  If anyone is actually curious about the science on immigration this is a great show: https://gimletmedia.com/episode/immigration/

                                                                                                  Most the comments I'm seeing on this post aren't informed about the actual studies.

                                                                                                  [–]EmptySmoke 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                  Tl;dw: immigration only causes wage competition if you're a highschool dropout or very educated(scientist/professor). Even then many American dropouts won't even apply to the jobs immigrants work because of how shitty they are.

                                                                                                  Otherwise, immigration helps you by boosting the economy via growing the population(thus creating jobs) and keeping prices on produce down because of cheap labor.

                                                                                                  Before arguing or dismissing these points please listen to the show.

                                                                                                  [–]Isord 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                  Most the comments I'm seeing on this post aren't informed about the actual studies.

                                                                                                  Basically a summary of conservatism.

                                                                                                  コメントをもっと表示する (4 返事)

                                                                                                    [–]GetOutOfBox 10 ポイント11 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                                                                    Bye bye federal funding

                                                                                                    [–]VicFatale [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                    Yeah, it would really suck if CA stopped paying into everybody else's fed funding.

                                                                                                    [–]teeejaaaaaay [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                    Considering their GDP would be the 7th biggest in the world if they were their own country.

                                                                                                    [–]Mendican 20 ポイント21 ポイント  (5子コメント)

                                                                                                    This thread is malignant. Mexican and immigrant hatred aside, "sanctuary" just means that immigrants can report crimes without fear of being deported for simply contacting the police. Without such an assurance, innocents will be victimized, meaning if a woman or girl reports being assaulted or raped or robbed, they get deported for reporting it to the police. This makes them easy targets for victimization. That's what this is about. The "sanctuary" is to protect a population from exploitation. If an immigrant commits a crime, then the justice system will see them deported anyway. Let's not pretend that deportations weren't already occurring.

                                                                                                    Edited.

                                                                                                    [–]Nunya-Business-Man 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                                                                    That is not what a Sanctuary City is at all. Who ever sold you that line of BS is lying their ass off. This is about local officials holding illegals until ICE can come get them, plain and simple.

                                                                                                    [–]Mendican 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                    Instead of telling me what it isn't, could tell me what you think a sanctuary city is?

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                                                                                                      [–]CoryTheDuck 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                      I really don't want to move.

                                                                                                      [–]Manaakii 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                                                                                                      It's like most people here aren't even residents of CA or ever met an immigrant much less an illegal immigrant.

                                                                                                      Sure a lot of illegal immigrants hopped the border as a adults, but a sizable portion were brought here as kids of 5 or 6 and spent their entire lives here. They were educated in US schools, learned US history, and speak English as their first language. Most of them even did better in school than their native counterparts because they understood the importance of education and didn't just take it for granted. I've tutored them for SATs and AP tests, and taught them music after school. They deserve to be citizens more than 90% of the native US tweakers and potheads a few counties down.

                                                                                                      They would love nothing more than to become legal citizens. They're even willing to join the military and serve just to prove their devotion.

                                                                                                      Some of them even attended US colleges and graduated. You want to deport them back to a country they don't even feel attached to? A place where they probably can't even speak the language? How is that fair? They didn't have a choice in being brought over as kids.

                                                                                                      I've campaigned, phone banked and went door to door in support of the DREAM act ever year it was brought up for consideration. Sanctuary Cities are a good blanket protection for those kids who are probably teens and young adults by now.

                                                                                                      If people had any sense, citizenship should be determined by knowledge and ability to contribute to the country rather than what patch of land they were born on.

                                                                                                      [–]CBoy321 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                      If people had any knowledge and sense then the immigration system would have been reformed 30 years ago and we wouldn't even have this problem. One one hand it's not the usa's responsibility to provide opportunities for people in other countries but on the other hand the immigration system needs reform and we are missing out on a lot of talent if we deport everyone. Most legal immigrants had to wait and spent thousands of dollars to get into the us. Complete amnesty is not fair to the people who come here legally

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                                                                                                        [–]toml3030 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                        Didn't we have a war already to settle whether local government can override federal law that they didn't like?

                                                                                                        [–]cichlidassassin [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                        how would the state require local law enforcement to do anything if it conflicts with the interests of the locality that hires them. This is bill is nothing more than grandstanding

                                                                                                        [–]norwegianparrot [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                        This is not about morality or low wages. It is about demographic replacement.

                                                                                                        The Democrats do this because they know that it enshrines them a guaranteed and reliable voter base in the hispanic immigrants, illegal or no.
                                                                                                        They are selling out american citizens to replace them with people who are more likely to vote for their party, and who end up as slaves to the party because if they ever vote against them they could be deported.

                                                                                                        Absolutely disgusting on the part of the Dems.

                                                                                                        [–]RoobikKoobik 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                                                                                        Feds not welcome? Close all DEA and FBI offices there. You want the criminals, you can have them.

                                                                                                        [–]Lawsnpaws 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                        I'm in one of the rural areas that's flipping out over this. It does screw with wages for low income residents (easier to pay an illegal under the table than a citizen properly) and the bill only permits violent felons to be removed...but not say drug traffickers or those in possession of narcotics with intent to sell (kind of an issue when you're sitting in a hub of cartel trade routes). Oh and violent is redefined as of last year so assault with a deadly weapon no longer counts as "violent."

                                                                                                        So yeh, at the moment the local chief has pledged to circumvent the rules best he can and the town has a feeling of, "Feds should pull out of LA/SF and let the place go to hell."

                                                                                                        [–]cheertina 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                        Then crack down on businesses that pay them under the table. If the only reason they can work is that they're willing to take less than minimum wage, then taking away the option to pay them less than the minimum wage means they won't have jobs, or a reason to come here.

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                                                                                                          [–]511patrol 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (9子コメント)

                                                                                                          I can't wait to retire and get the hell out of California. What a shithole of a state.

                                                                                                          [–]eorld 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                          The comments in this thread are ridiculous and misinformed, using normal police to target people with undocumented status is not productive and hurts everyone.

                                                                                                          [–]jjg57 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (25子コメント)

                                                                                                          I support California. Please form your own country. Send lose 45 electoral votes, we lose a financial cesspool and can avoid the rebuilding cost you will someday face after the big one hits. Cu, CA. Let's vote!

                                                                                                          [–]KaiserPhil 15 ポイント16 ポイント  (21子コメント)

                                                                                                          we lose a financial cesspool

                                                                                                          One that sends more money to the federal government in taxes than it receives back. Also, the 6th largest economy in the world and the source of over half of the country's fruits, nuts, and vegetables.

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                                                                                                            [–]Drozz42 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                            Get fucked California.

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