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Do women's issues exist? (self.MensRights)

vivienta が 投稿

I'm honestly wondering. I'm female, and I can't really think of a single disadvantage I have in life. Every superficial disadvantage (e.g. reduced physical strength) is more than made up for by society (e.g. people will rush to my defense far faster than they would for a man), and actually results in more of an advantage than a disadvantage. Plus, many so-called "women's issues" are more men's issues than women's issues. Take abortion rights. Even if abortion were totally illegal, women could choose to give the baby up for adoption. Men don't have that right. Plus, men have zero say when it comes to abortion currently.

I'm curious to hear your opinions. Is there an issue out there that could reasonable called a women's issue?

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[–]William__F0ster 18 ポイント19 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Is there an issue out there that could reasonable called a women's issue?

I would say there are all manner of issues that women could rightfully claim as their own and which should be taken seriously.

Maternity leave is just one example - I live in a country where there is what I (and I guess most people) would consider fairly generous provision for this, but I know that in other countries - notably in the US - this is not the norm at all. More controversially perhaps, sexual assault and violence against women from intimate partners are both very real issues which affect women. I could go on (FGM, abortion, childcare issues, flexitime working ...), but I will leave it there.

The point for me at least is not that women do not have issues - they do, of course they do - but that those issues have, in my honest opinion, been hijacked by people with radical politics who have been and still are shamelessly exploiting real women's issues and trading it for political capital.

Not only that, but I think it is well worth reiterating the point that while many feminists are women, women are not feminists - at least not by default.

Feminism is a political stance that grew out of a heady mixture of Marxism, Maoism, Trotskyism on the one hand, and the wilder shores of psychiatry and mysticism on the other (think R.D. Liang's 'primal scream' and all that nonsense about Goddesses and Wicca etc.).

One of feminism's greatest successes - if not the greatest - has been in convincing not only adherents to feminism, but the wider public as well - that it is by, for and about women.

I disagree - it seems to me entirely possible to distinguish between issues affecting women and issues affecting feminism.

[–]TryhardPantiesON 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I kinda agree with what you said.

I wanted however, to point that while women do have issues, some of those issues are not EXCLUSIVE to women.

Let's say domestic violence, i saw statistics published by a well known organization in the US, the statistics where something like 55% women experience domestic violence, while 47% of men experience domestic violence, so clearly domestic violence isn't a women's issue, it isn't exclusive to women if men experience this too, and at a very close rate as women. Women are as violent as men, thinking otherwise is dangerous.

Rape, sexual abuse, sexual assault. I don't have the statistics but women can and do commit sexual abuse, assault and rape, but cases where females are the perpetrators are usually swept under the rug, they don't make headlines. This isn't a women's issue at all, this issue affects both men and women.

Wage gap is a fucking myth, there is not even point to talk about it.

Maternity leave should be mandatory on every company, at least 4 to 5 months.

Let's talk suicide, the suicide rate is ridiculous, women are only 25% of all suicides, men do the other 75%, and while we could consider this a men's issue, it would be neglectful to turn a blind eye to an issue like suicide which affects both genders.

[–]hbest195 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Access to abortions is a huge issue. You can't say that you can just give up a baby. The woman would still have to go through the pregnancy which is painful and expensive. I understand the frustrations that come from men not having as much of a say in pregnancies, but it is ultimately the woman that has to go through the pregnancy.

[–]igotfoundout 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think society as a whole struggles with men's and womens issues regarding sex. The thing is there's really no equivalent for men in this scenario.

[–]OnTheSlope 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yes there are women's issues.

  • Many drugs and medical treatments are tested only on males.

  • Women are sometimes excluded from proper consideration in scientific pursuits. For example Lawrence Kohlberg theorized a popular set of stages of moral development which was developed using only male participants and doesn't take into consideration that women have a different moral system than men, it simply concludes that women are impaired as moral agents.

It's hard to find legit women's issues, if you google women's issues all you'll find is either: issues men also face (sometimes to a higher degree), issues that are entirely made up (wage gap), or petty issues like manspreading, but there are real issues that only women face in society.

I wish I knew more but the real issues get swept under the rug.

[–]Aureolin9861 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Uh, I think people are more likely to buy books written by men. That's why J.K Rowling uses a fake name. That's one

[–]igotfoundout 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Just pointing out that JK Rowling, while a fake name isn't the male name, she also uses "Robert Gallbraith" as a pen name

[–]Meyright 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (6子コメント)

I, so far, only heared of one genuine right women don't have in regards to men, which is that they're not able to show their nipples in some states. I'm open to add more to that list.

There are many women's "issues" though. But as you said, most of them are just the downside of having an advantage in some area. Take catcalling for example. I get it, it's anoying and can get scary. But its just the downside of being the prefered, sought after gender when it comes to reproduction, which I would call having an advantage in life. Men offer themselfs to women, and women chose. The downside is getting offers you don't want. And now we have feminists fighting to make an "anyoing and sometimes scary" thing illegal.

[–]vivienta[S] 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (4子コメント)

I, so far, only heared of one genuine right women don't have in regards to men, which is that they're not able to show their nipples in some states. I'm open to add more to that list.

Women can't show their sexual organs in public. Neither can men. Seems equal to me.

[–]Meyright 10 ポイント11 ポイント  (3子コメント)

The breast is not a sexual organ. Its not necessary for reproduction.

I personally don't get why its illegal to be naked to begin with. We are born naked, its completly natural and there is nothing offending about the naked human body.

[–]vivienta[S] 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I personally don't get why its illegal to be naked to begin with. We are born naked, its completly natural and there is nothing offending about the naked human body.

I agree with you there. I imagine part of it is antiquated religious conservatism.

[–]igotfoundout 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'd be fine seeing tiddies in public

[–]howaboutyougetfucked -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

The breast is not a sexual organ.

yes it is and has been considered so for thousands of years

Its not necessary for reproduction.

it most certainly is, children cannot survive without the nutrition of their mothers milk, to say nothing of its medical and intellectual benefits.

[–]Returnofthemack3 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

honestly, attractive men deal with it just as much. I've had some seriuosly attractive male friends who had killer physiques/faces get harrassed in public hardcore. Some of them really dont like it, because lets be real, many of the women aretn that attractive. A lot of them get super touchy if you have visible muscles too. Ive even seen girls grab the crotches of hyper attracitve men. It's just bullshit to act like this doenst go both ways if youre attractive. I

I basically had a girl give me a titty twister at a festival not long ago, and she just laughed. I mean, im not one to make a big stink, but that was pretty uncalled for but it's accepted so what can you do?

[–]Il128 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (8子コメント)

I'm being serious here.

  1. Women obviously face some discrimination in macho careers and feminine careers, such as the military, police, fire, auto racing, health care, teaching, child care and etc..

  2. Women also face discrimination in social situations and work situations of sexual freedom. I'm talking fetish clubs, sex parties, porn, advertising, marketing, the arts and sales, etc..

  3. It's not just men who cause these problems of course, women are more than happy to discriminate against women as well.

[–]vivienta[S] 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (4子コメント)

  1. Is there any evidence to back that up? Genuinely curious.

  2. Is there any evidence to back that up? Again, genuinely curious.

  3. Agree with you there.

[–]Meyright 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Women face discrimination in child care and teaching because they're women?

[–]Tarsen1 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

  1. I feel like the macho careers are more about the underperformance of the person than a gendered issue. Firefighting is reliant on top mental and physical performance that work in tandem. If you can pull a child out of a building after giving them your respirator and a beam has shattered your leg, then it doesn't matter your gender. Gender and healthcare is too complex to through in with the rest. Teaching and childcare favors women.

  2. Not sure about fetish clubs, seems like men are at the disadvantage. Porn, women make more and the supply for them is greater, they often are cast with their face and men's are framed out. Talk about men literally being an object. Advertising, which sex has a better opportunity to sell their image? Models and Instastars tend to be women. That one is just me expanding out into general media, sorry. Sales, if you are trying to correlate corrupt abuse of talent, then please remember that these actresses tend to get paid better than many college graduates. What is an hour of your time compared to theirs?

  3. Ya it works both ways and men have some disadvantages that tend to create an overall advantage like with women.

But in all reality, please feel free to let me know what I may be overlooking and am wrong on. I welcome the criticism. Everyone is disadvantaged in ways, but may focus on the woes and forget their privilege.

[–]ThePigmanAgain -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Are you sure you are being serious? Because if you are, you are seriously retarded.

[–]Sad_banker 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (3子コメント)

What is your opinion on cat-calling? Yes, it does happen to men occasionally, but in my experience it happens more to women.

[–]rymden_viking 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (2子コメント)

I'm a man, and I was catcalled once. I found it weird, so I can m imagine what it must feel like if it happens to you more frequently.

[–]Sad_banker 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I'm a guy, too. I've been cat-called once only. Most of my friends are women, and I've been with them when it happens/heard plenty of stories.

Sorry if the original post was misleading.

[–]rymden_viking 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I was only commenting on your post. I wasn't actually trying to argue anything.

[–]Kiefinater 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I am 100% sure that you are a man. Go find something productive to do with your life.

[–]conrad_w 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

There are some laws about pensions that assume a male breadwinner that come out unequal. Women also have higher health insurance costs.

Most "women's issues" affect men as well. Most "men's issues" affect women as well. Rather than the usual "what about XYZ" you get when an issue is raised, we should be seeking to recognise our common purpose.

Take for example feminists raising awareness for how homelessness affects women. We could say "yeah but it affects men too!" Or we could say "YES! This affects men too - we have a common enemy in homelessness!"

[–]PeachPy53 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

One area I would like to point out is the bias against women reaching the upper echelon of most professions. I have heard of the term "glass floor," but there is also a "glass ceiling." I heartily believe that society is trying to keep women thoroughly in the middle: not too successful, and not overly victimized, either.

[–]Kingramses94 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Women's issues exist. Men's issues exist.

The problem: Currently women's issues are more important than men's issues. In fact, a male fighting for men's rights would get largely castrated--however a female fighting for women's rights would get largely praise.

[–]grasshopa 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (4子コメント)

To be fair, the men and adoption is a murky area. Generally speaking, if the father is known ( or assumed, in the case of marriage ) then they will make at least a superficial effort to get him to sign off on the adoption.

Which is not to say that mom is obligated to reveal who dad is. Slut shaming and all that. Even when dad is aware of the adoption and attempts to stop it, it can be forced through if some judge somewhere doesn't feel dad is interested in being dad.

Which kind of makes it worse than what you said, truthfully.

[–]vivienta[S] 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

if the father is known ( or assumed, in the case of marriage ) then they will make at least a superficial effort to get him to sign off on the adoption.

Is this true? Even so, I'm guessing that it's not like his signature is required for her to go through with the procedure, right? I'm assuming that she still basically has absolute power when it comes to a fetus conceived by both of them.

[–]grasshopa 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Varies depending on state and agency, as well as her marriage status. If married, then I think there is a greater onus to get dad's approval for the adoption. Unmarried fathers, however, are not given much rights in this arena, and you'd largely be correct; mom has absolute authority.

I wouldn't be the least surprised to learn that adoption agencies advise mom to explicitly not reveal who dad is so as to streamline the process.

[–]vivienta[S] 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Wait, in your initial comment did you type "abortion" when you meant "adoption"?

[–]grasshopa 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

ha! Yes, I did mean adoption. I had been commenting on another thread regarding abortion and the keys kind of got away from me.

Doh!

[–]howaboutyougetfucked -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

sometimes there are complications with a foetus and it might result in an extremely unsafe birth or a disabled child. no women should have to raise a mentally disabled person who cannot care for themselves or provide anything of value to the equation

aslo the woman might have been raped and so no rational person would say she has to go through the ordeal of birthing her rapists child.

thats about it really, beyond abortion women dont have many problems in our society.

oddly enough there is one huge issue that i believe women are facing, they are either just too brainwashed or dense to comprehend it

i am talking about demographic replacement. western caucasian women should be averaging 2.1 births per woman in order to keep the population of caucasians stable.

they are averaging well below that. as a result the globalist leaders in the west only care about keeping hte ball rolling (making money) and so they are opening the borders to foreigners of any and all kinds.

most of these foreigners are coming with anti western value systems, cultures and practices. women today dont fully grasp just how critical the situation is becoming and will become over the next few decades...

see how women are treated in africa and the middle east? yeah the west importing millions of those people every year to come and have 4-7 babies in our countries. these groups are predicted to become demographic majorities shortly and anyone who says they will just adopt our value systems is either wilfully ignorant to the statistics or intentionally misleading, the numbers just dont support that argument enough.

in a few short generations the women here will be treated the same as the women in africa and the middle east are currently being treated. saying this earns you the nazi racist badge though. oh well i guess thats me then...