全 43 件のコメント

[–]Arab Worldkasem64 10 ポイント11 ポイント  (0子コメント)

LOOOOOOL that is so pathetic from them.

Here is a nice read on the subject

http://observationdeck.kinja.com/no-egyptians-arent-white-but-they-arent-black-eithe-1665322870

Tell them to read their own history and stop trying to steal other people's history. Africa does not equal black. Tell them Berbers aren't black to piss them off further (actually don't you'll escalate the issue).

The right thing to do is to send a complaint to somebody in the University. They harassed and bullied you.

[–]AlgeriaGhaazii 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (0子コメント)

LOL even if you consider the Nubian dynasty as representative it has literally nothing to do with these Afro Americans who are descendants of west African slaves and slave masters. Nubians are an East African people. Stop being racist and say all black people are the same because they are not.

[–]لئن كسر المدفع سيفي فلن يكسر الباطل حقيMatari_of_Mnifa 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

The saddening thing about this particular issue is that there are - and have been - so many interesting and sophisticated cultures and civilizations in the African continent besides the Egyptian one. It's ironically kinda falling in line with Eurocentric thought to be focusing on Egypt as though it's the sole source of civilization in the continent.

[–]United Arab RepublicBedouinMau 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Does this theory of an ancient Egypt made up of sub-saharan africans hold legitmate ground in the minds of any true historians?

cackles

No.

[–]PoeticBeetle 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

First of all, we need to understand what they mean by black. Ask them if South Asians are black just to fuck with them because it's obvious that they mean Negro when they say black. Just because the Ancient Egyptians had dark skin does not mean they are Negros, infact they were Caucasian. Again, Caucasian does not mean white but it is based on skull shape and physical features. The anthropological Caucasoid splits off into several branches one of them being Hamites. Ignore the biblical meaning of the word and let's look at the actual science. "Beginning in the 19th century, scholars generally classified the Hamitic race as a subgroup of the Caucasian race, along with the Semitic race – thus grouping the non-Semitic populations native to North Africa and the Horn of Africa, including the Ancient Egyptians" That was from Wikipedia and you can do a simple copy+paste to verify. Anyways, Ancient Egypt was a cultural hub as we all know and they engaged in trade with a variety of people. As a result people from other ethnicities intermarried with the ancient Egyptians(Greeks, Turks, Persians etc,). Finally, Egypt was Arabized by conquest and trade. In that way, it is hard to find an Egyptian of pure descent and very ridiculous to call you an occupier because they have no claim over you. These are the type of people that believe that all Africans are black and look like Nigerians. The reason why they claim other people's culture is because they are ashamed of their own culture or lack theirof.

[–]Egyptdj_from 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Meh, either way you don't live in Egypt so you are no longer an "occupier" so why is that bothering you?

[–]Grand MaghrebSoefianB 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (37子コメント)

It holds no weight. The native inhabitants of North Afica, from Morocco to Egypt are, and have always been, Berbers. Berbers have been in North Africa for 1000s of years, and there was no point in human history that North Africa was ever occupied by "Zanj".

North Africans have always had more contact with Europe and the Middle East than with Sub Saharan Africa.

At one point, the Vandals, ethnical Germans, lived in North Africa. Though not for long, they only lived there for like 150 years before being defeated by the Byzantine.

Not proven or anything but I personally think Tariq ibn Ziyad might've been a Vandal. Like the picture shows, he looks really German. But like his name proves, he was born after the Vandals dissapeared, atleast as a culture, so I really think he was a descendant of the Vandals. I guess not.

Romans, Phoenicians, Byzantine Greeks etc have at one point or another lived in North Africa. But Sub Saharan Africans? Never.

With people like the Romans and Vandals, there have literally been more white people in North Africa than black people.

Here you can see Ramesses II defeating the Nubians. Note how the Nubians are obviously darker than Ramessess and his army of actual ancient Egyptians. Also, due to the quality, the Egyptians actually look darker in that picture vs how that tablet looks in real life.

Here you can see an Egyptian killing a Nubian. Again, note that the Egyptian is shown as overtly lighter than the Nubian, who is black.

In the Ancient Egyptian 'Book of Gates', we see a repressentation of ancient Egyptians and those they had contact with.

Here you can see them. The black ones repressent Nubians, the white ones in the top right repressent Greeks (afaik) and the other's are ancient Egyptians. Again, they heavily emphasized the difference.

Hope this helps a bit.

Want better proof?

During the Greek/Hellenic period of ancient Egypt, there were actually portraits of ancient Egyptians made.

They're called the 'Fayyum mummy portraits'.

Female, male and another male.

They're obviously not much different from modern Egyptians and if anyone ever claims ancient Egyptians as being black, chinese, russian or whatever - just show them those Fayyum mummy portraits. They proof that ancient Egyptians weren't black.

Furthermore, those same Nubians did rule one dynasty of ancient Egypt.

For 80 years.... while ancient Egypt has more than 3000 years of history.

And virtually no Nubian tribe ever moved into Egypt. Not during those 80 years and not afterwards. And neither before.

Hell, the Greeks ruled Egypt for longer. Yet no one is claiming ancinet Egyptians as Greeks.

I mean, Cleopatra was actually part of the Greek dynasty, yet she is claimed as black aswel.

And you're from the US I presume? If so, were these Africans or African-Americans?

I ask because the whole "ancient Egyptians were black" thing is more heavily followed by African-Americans than actual Africans, and my point is that African Americans originally come from West Africa, where they were defeated by other west Africans and subsequently sold as slaves.

So if they were African-Americans then they are the last group to claim North Africa or ancient Egypt, the distance between west Africa and Egypt is more than the entire length of Europe. They can't even claim Nubians, who actually were black because of the distance.

It would be like an Italian claiming the Vikings because they're both white.

Don't take them seriously - they're a joke.

Edit: Also, Ramessess II had red hair. His mummy has small strains of hair still intact and after DNA testing it was proven that his hair was red when he was alive.

Red hair is virtually non-existent in black populations.

Edit 2: Okay maybe not "from Morocco to Egypt" but there are Berbers in Egypt though. My point was to illustrate that Berbers were always native to North Africa and that ancient Egyptians simply weren't black. And yes, I do realise that some Berber tribes are darker, espescially the ones in Mali, Mauretania etc etc but those are most commonly from, like I said, Mali, Mauretania etc etc. I'm talking about the Berber tribes that aren't black. Those are just as ancient as the darker ones.

[–]فيروزdareteIayam 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (12子コメント)

The native inhabitants of North Afica, from Morocco to Egypt are, and have always been, Berbers

احا انا طلعت امازيغي وانا مش عارف. قشطة نيك زغرتي يامّا

[–]FLNmehdi19998 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (3子コメント)

lol, it 's worth mentioning that the year one in the Amazigh calendar (which is 2967 this year BTW) is when a Berber became the pharaoh and ruled Egypt also i mean since pretty much all political ideologies that were tried there only ended up in failure, my new proposal for Egypt is, wait for it Berber Nationalism, now shout proudly with me Make Egypt Berber Again i think i finally cracked the code to the new era of Egyptian enlightenment, you're welcome.

[–]فيروزdareteIayam 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (2子コメント)

[–]FLNmehdi19998 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

First North Africa and then the WORLD. (not Israel though Zionism is a licit right)

[–]لئن كسر المدفع سيفي فلن يكسر الباطل حقيMatari_of_Mnifa 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (5子コメント)

Welcome to the fold, brother.

[–]فيروزdareteIayam 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (4子コメント)

ⵜⴰⵏⵎⵉⵔⵜ

[–]لئن كسر المدفع سيفي فلن يكسر الباطل حقيMatari_of_Mnifa 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (3子コメント)

Good, you are already assimilating. You are now more than ready to join us in the restoration of TAMAZGHA >:D!

[–]Egyptdj_from 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

umm why is Egypt included? I'm p triggered rn!

[–]لئن كسر المدفع سيفي فلن يكسر الباطل حقيMatari_of_Mnifa 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

LOL I was waiting for this.

The map is an exaggeration of course, because that's how ethnic nationalists roll.

There are however, still a few Amazigh folks in Egypt. A great example would be the peoples of the Siwa Oasis. They are super interesting in particular because they've developed quite a unique culture due to their isolation.

Nothing to be triggered about... you should be proud :)

[–]FLNmehdi19998 [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

Like the picture shows, he looks really German.

That drawing was made in the 19th century and the artist was German.

[–]Grand MaghrebSoefianB [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

Really?

I tried google but couldn't find a source.

So, what exactly is your source on that....?

Not saying you're wrong but I'm really interested here, since I didn't find anything.

[–]FLNmehdi19998 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

It's literally in the Wikipedia page i'm not sure how you missed it.

[–]Grand MaghrebSoefianB [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Oh wow.

Now I feel stupid lol.

Well, that somewhat shatters the theory of Tariq being a descendant of the Vandals lol.

But thanks for the correction, I mostly use the English Wikipedia because it has more information.......

Except in this case lol.

[–]لئن كسر المدفع سيفي فلن يكسر الباطل حقيMatari_of_Mnifa 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Those Hellenic portraits are so interesting. I mean, it shouldn't be surprising that the folks in those portraits look like people I know, but there's just something so surreal about it.

[–]Grand MaghrebSoefianB 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Yeah, it's crazy lol. Very realistic.

They've always intrigued me. Espescially since these portraits were unkown until they were rediscovered in the late 1800s.

They literally dissappeared and stayed hidden for over 1800 years until people found them. They're probably the most realistic repressentations of ancient Egyptians. Man, those archeologists must've assumed they were fake or joke.

[–][削除されました]  (1子コメント)

[removed]

    [–]Arab Worldba6oo6[M] 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Comment removed until you remove the personal attack.

    [–]لئن كسر المدفع سيفي فلن يكسر الباطل حقيMatari_of_Mnifa 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

    I don't think it's accurate to refer to the people of Egypt as collectively being Amazigh, though.

    [–]Grand MaghrebSoefianB 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (2子コメント)

    Agreed. Though I did adress that at the end;

    Okay maybe not "from Morocco to Egypt" but there are Berbers in Egypt though. My point was to illustrate that Berbers were always native to North Africa and that ancient Egyptians simply weren't black.

    [–]لئن كسر المدفع سيفي فلن يكسر الباطل حقيMatari_of_Mnifa 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

    ancient Egyptians simply weren't black.

    I think this is a generalization too.

    [–]Grand MaghrebSoefianB [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

    Nope. Look at my examples.

    Ancient Egyptians made sure to emphazise the difference between them and black people.

    [–]Ghaath 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (4子コメント)

    I honestly had it with this Berber stuff. There so many holes with the Tamazight narrative, I could use it to dry my Lebna).

    [–]Grand MaghrebSoefianB 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (2子コメント)

    What did I say that's wrong?

    There are Berbers across North Africa...

    Libya has Berbers.

    As does Egypt.

    And Berbers are native to North Africa, or aren't they?

    [–]Ghaath [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

    I am Libyan with one grandma half Berber and another grandma half Turk. The rest of me is Arab. My hair is curly black and my eyes are black but I am light skinned and "white looking."

    Some of my cousins have green eyes, light skin and curly hair while others have Pakistani hair, dark skin and hazel eyes.

    Although I am mixed, I identify as an Arab and I have no desire to speak the language of the caves and mountains--"Berberbbebeber" it's not even a real language.

    I like my Arabic thank you!

    [–]Grand MaghrebSoefianB [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

    Okay?

    I'm not Berber if that's what you think

    And My point still stands though....

    [–]fearnote 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

    Copts are indigenous to Egypt's Nile Valley. Berbers are indigenous from the Siwa Oasis to Morocco.

    [–]Grand MaghrebSoefianB [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

    True.

    Though the Siwa oasis is in Egypt but I get what you mean, and I agree.

    [–]PoeticBeetle [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

    The last portrait looks more like an actual Greek and maybe it was but the other two seem legit.

    [–]Arab Worldkerat [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

    The native inhabitants of North Afica, from Morocco to Egypt are, and have always been, Berbers. Berbers have been in North Africa for 1000s of years, and there was no point in human history that North Africa was ever occupied by "Zanj".

    While I generally agree with you, this is an exaggeration. Berbers are not some primordial national group from the beginnings of time. They are a heterogeneous mixture of people who identify as berbers today, just like Arabs are a heterogeneous mix of people who identify as Arabs today. There are several Berber groups who cluster closely with central african groups. Though I take your point that north Africa was not “occupied by zanj" and north Africans in general cluster closest to middle easterners.

    Also Egypt does not really belong to this group, as it was populated by Nilotic people, though a large portion of Egyptians share the same east african origins as berbers do. (Humans populated north west Africa from the east).

    Edit: also wanted to point out that the Fayum portraits are very late in egyptian history. By their time Egyptians could very well have changed in their appearance.

    [–]Ghaath 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

    نارن لهيبن حارقة, افريقيا أفريقيااااا.

    I applaud these brave young men for keeping it real.

    [–]fearnote 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (2子コメント)

    Copts are the indigenous inhabitants of Egypt's Nile Valley, while Berbers are the indigenous inhabitants from Egypt to Morocco.

    Nubians are indigenous to the southern part of Egypt where Lake Nasser is, and Sudan.

    The Coptic language is a direct descendant of the Ancient Egyptian language and Copts look like ancient Egyptians.

    Copts have largely avoided mixture from new migrants since the Islamic conquest because the majority of new migrants were Muslims, so new admixture went into Egypt's Muslim population and not the Coptic population.

    [–]Arab Worldkerat [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

    Copts have largely avoided mixture from new migrants since the Islamic conquest because the majority of new migrants were Muslims, so new admixture went into Egypt's Muslim population and not the Coptic population.

    This is a false narrative started by the Brits during the Victorian period when they tried to separate copts from Muslims in their racist theories on the spread of civilizations.

    There was a study of Sudanese Copts that found significant intermixing with the Levant. Moreso than in the rest of the Sudanese population. And that’s the only genetic study of copts that I know of and indicative of egyptian copts as well.

    [–]Ghaath [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

    You forgot about the people who live in Alexandria, they're the descendants of Alexander the great. Also, people who live in Sinai are just Jews who got the directions wrong when Mosses tried to flee the Pharaoh, if only they turned left instead of right :(