No.1423498
Democracy was a mistake: https://www.np.reddit.com/r/socialism/comments/5wdiv8/new_mods/
It's almost indistinguishable from rightist parody, except that the name-dropping is too extensive.
TFW that one mod didn't end up Petrograding everyone and introduced free application of mod membership.
No.1423504
>>1423498
Are they actually new mods or just new accounts?
No.1423521
>>1423504
Can't tell yet. I'm not a big ledditor so I wouldn't be able to tell myself but if they are it'll become apparent to the anti-r/soc subs like r/shittankiessay, r/leftwithoutedge and r/shitleftistssay (none of these subs are free from one form of cancer or the other and especially the first two fall for idpol in one form or the other, but they're decently engaged against the r/soc-r/fullytriggeredism hotbed of AIDS).
No.1423524
>>1423521
Does crossposting on those get you instabanned on rsoc?
No.1423532
>>1423524
Yes. Notably the latter will get you banned at an even faster pace, which will also get you banned on r/anarchism as well because it's communists that make fun of all left wing modern and historical clown fiestas out there, including anarchism.
No.1423536
>>1423532
Damn I wanted to shill my video in all possible places.
No.1423537
>>1423524
Leftcoms got purged a while back, dont know about leftwithoutedge though
No.1423540
>>1423498
>1. i hope to play a role in /r/socialism becoming a sub for fierce feminist discussion among our femme comrades
>2. My political influences are Marx, Engels, Lenin, Stalin, Hoxha
>3. I consider myself an orthodox Trotskyist
>4. I am Genderfluid and Bisexual and have a particular interest in LGBT+ socialist politics
>5. I am a Trotskyist
>6. I'm a Marxist-Leninist-Maoist
>7. I'm an autistic, bisexual Marxist feminist
>8. I'm a Trotskyist … I want very much for relevant and stable leftist orgs (SAlt, DSA, ISO, PSL, SPUSA, IWW) to catapult the left forward during the next few years
>9. I was a Bernie Sanders supporter, but it was really Richard Wolff and this actual sub that cemented my ideology in socialism/communism/anarchism.
No.1423548
>using anything on Reddit other than exclusively /r/Communalists
No.1423556
>>1423498
>I am a Trotskyist situated in Australia, came from a working class / poor background. Marxism and Socialism to me have been an empowering experience that gives me a great deal of hope, and a certainty in action, that I wasn’t afforded growing up. There is no doubt in my mind that the road to liberation from poverty, oppression, from class and capitalism, is through the mobilisation of the working class. I’m personally invested in issues of disability, abuse, and mental health, and try to bring that unique perspective from the ground to my politics and discussions.
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
why do uni wanker petty-booj trots need to LARP as poverty stricken chimney sweeps out of a fucking Dickens novel.
No.1423559
>>1423536
Make an alt and use it with a VPN when you link your videos. Protip for this: install Opera as a secondary browser for this purpose; it has a completely free built-in VPN nowadays and you can strip the browser of most of its privacy-intruding bullshit if you want.
>>1423537
Leftcoms have a hard time on r/leftwithoutedge too, but that's because they're smug, not because of what they believe.
A place where leftcoms really got purged recently (outside of the Social Justice Tankie sphere on reddit) was RevLeft, where one of the main website owners was a NOLA member shilling hardcore for its users to vote Hillary under lesser-evilist excuses.
No.1423562
>>1423498
look for one second
>feminimarxi
>Angela Davis flair
nope its still trash
No.1423564
>>1423548
>r/communialists
It's not bad.
Ya'll niggas need to mingle with r/leftcommunism and the other non-tankie Marxist subs like r/marxism_101 tho; we could use a challenge.
No.1423571
So Trots are still a cancer to the left and all need their throats slit WHO KNEW
No.1423581
>>1423559
People still post on RevLeft? I thought the leftcom groups got ran out when rooster got banned.
No.1423584
>>1423559
Meh my videos are so obscure that they would probably cotton on, those subs hardly seem that busy anyway.
How about fullcommunism, can I post on there and rsoc? I can't keep their interboard wars straight.
No.1423586
>>1423540
It's a parody of itself, especially that last one.
No.1423588
>>1423540
LMAO is that one person?
No.1423591
>>1423588
No, it's every single one of the mods. 1 is quoted from the first mod's introductory post and so on.
No.1423592
>>1423559
holy shit, RevLeft is actually still around?
I used to post on there when I was like sixteen (6+ years ago) and it had already gone to shit, with one of the admins who held a lot of sway being revealed as a petitbourgeois politician who ran on a pro-small business platform, while the owner is/was a German Zionist nerd.
last I heard back then the mods were purging anyone who disagreed with them. everyone theoretically knowledgeable (mostly leftcoms, the odd Trot and occasional ML or anarchist) was fleeing to other boards like RedMarx, which I have no idea about the status of presently.
there were some really funny, but also many really autistic mother fuckers on there. the silver lining was that I met a friend who lives across the country on there whom I've met a few times and talk to regularly on normiebook now.
No.1423596
>>1423586
funny that the bisexual autistic Marxist manages to come of as the absolute most normal person and least tryhard of them all.
No.1423598
>>1423592
also, when I think of how many Stalinists and Maoists were on there, it makes /leftypol/ look ultraleft in comparison.
there was this one cunt called Ismail who used to answer literally everything with a quote said by Enver Hoxha, I suspect he's the one behind /marx/ here.
No.1423600
>>1423556
>>1423571
>>1423586
Reminder to check out PDF related: largest Trot circus in the US's 2017 document. They are literally measuring their success in newspapers sold in it. I wish I was kidding.
>>1423581
Not anymore, no, and rooster's ban preceded the much larger purge of anything even remotely communist after the NOLA shill I mentioned did its thing.
>>1423584
r/soc and r/fullcommunism are fully allied. r/fullcommunism is the "edgy" "ironic" "shitposting" sub where r/soc users go to post really "funny" memes.
No.1423609
>>1423592
RevLeft's still around, but it's nothing but a hotbed for SocDems in various colors now. There's a small amount of people with practical communist ideas, but they're far and few and whenever they get too antsy for the website administration they get shadowbanned.
Also, right around the rooster ban started a new type of policy that explicitly advocated not working to unionize workplaces because "the time wasn't right". They'd rather have us be turned to their proxy honeypot orgs like SAlt or one the CWI's sister orgs and go to protests.
I posted there for two years until Roost and the Gang got NKVD'd for not supporting Dear Comrade Hilarin, so I probably don't have as much connections with you.
No.1423612
>>1423598
>there was this one cunt called Ismail who used to answer literally everything with a quote said by Enver Hoxha, I suspect he's the one behind /marx/ here.
That's literally Ismail. Go to Marx and you'll see that there's one namefag called Ismail who does nothing but gloat over 20th century SovDem and, as you said, can't help himself from accompanying every single post with either a picture of a Stalinist or quote of a Stalinist.
No.1423614
>>1423600
Why do Trots like newspapers so much when they're an increasingly outdated medium which wasn't even effective at convincing people at its height?
No.1423623
>>1423609
Wasn't Rafiq a pretty decent poster apart from being constantly triggered? Is he still there?
No.1423628
>>1423614
Because they have a voluntaristic concept of how to achieve revolution. To them, things don't start with organizing workers and their workplaces, to have them be involved in the class struggle intensively, but to first convince everyone of their idea of what things are really like. This naturally leads to them trying to infiltrate SocDem orgs in an attempt to radicalize them but it has the consequential effect of turning their ideology SocDem too. Therefore, what better way to cushion this process than to play the info wars and sell newspapers or, as they actually do end up realizing, modernizing this to a digital outlet (e.g. wooswoos)?
They borrow a lot from Trotsky, who was a comrade but a very stupid and delusional one at times too.
Here's a passage from Dauvé on Trotsky (from: http://www.theoryandpractice.org.uk/library/notes-trotsky-pannekoek-bordiga-gilles-dauvé-jean-barrot-1972, which also includes notes on Pannekoek and Bordiga):
>After he joined the Bolsheviks, Trotsky clearly showed that he hardly understood what was going on. He had formerly identified socialism with workers' power; he now identified workers' power with party power. From this he concluded that Russia was building socialism. In Communism and Terrorism he stated that the duty of the worker was to obey the (workers') State and that socialism meant discipline and high productivity of labour. Lenin acted the same way, but he was at least aware of the notion of communism. He more or less realised that Russia was not socialist and could only be socialist with the help of Europe.
>Trotsky took a very active part in the suppression of all opposition which had some communist content. His own opposition was opportunistic (alliance with Zinoviev in 1926) and he was afraid of becoming a threat to the State. He organised his own defeat. How many people know that in 1925-6 he refrained from all political activity for about a year and a half? There is no need to insist on this.
Interjecting again: Dauvé omits the more obvious crushing of the anarchists in the Ukraine which, as much as I disagree with their praxis, was utter bullshit. There's also Kronstadt.
Here's the most important part:
>In fact he had no program. He must be regarded as an active militant, full of activity and ability, lacking a communist theoretical background. He was excellent in the midst of a rising movement, as in 1905, but he went completely wrong in a declining movement. Then he could become the worst bureaucrat if he was in power, or a troublemaker if he had no power. It is doubtful that he ever had a theory of his own, except for the theory of permanent revolution - and we do not know exactly what role Parvus played in the creation of this theory.
No.1423637
>>1423623
Rafiq was basically as you describe him and he still posts, but not frequently at all and his attempts to weed out idpol and other left-wing weaknesses are not well received.
No.1423639
I was hoping AprilMaria would be a new mod
she actually has common sense, and is a rural farmer (as opposed to college dipshits)
they obviously looked her over for a reason, either because she's not a tankie or because she's criticised the existing mods before
No.1423648
>>1423637
From what I remember a while back when leftypol had a bit of a Rafiq phase he seemed pretty based. Would tolerate as tripfag.
No.1423658
>>1423648
>>1423637
Is Rafiq the Althusserian guy?
No.1423661
>>1423540
>there are unironic hoxhaists moding r/Socialism right now
Holy fuck my sides!
No.1423664
>board users permitted to select nominees of their choosing for the new mods
>get a decent-ish variety of policy stances, ideologies, and backgrounds involved
>unsatisfied with the notion that new moderators might change anything with the sub's status quo, all candidates had to be approved by existing mods
>candidates with any variance were thrown out of the running
>we're right back to the old Leninism + idpol sausagefest
Subreddit vanguard my ass. What a fucking joke.
No.1423666
>>1423658
Can't really remember much beside him being an amusing drunkposter.
No.1423667
>>1423639
April is one of the only chill people on r/soc I don't know why she puts up with that shithole
No.1423670
>>1423639
>AprilMaria
Her or that other guy: cometparty, who despite being a SocDem had promised to one day purge the cancerous mods and start a new membership process, but never did.
TFW fell for the liberal alliance meme again by keeping my hopes up.
>>1423658
Not aware of him posting much Althusserian or structuralist arguments or citations, no.
No.1423673
>>1423664
>>unsatisfied with the notion that new moderators might change anything with the sub's status quo, all candidates had to be approved by existing mods
Seriously? What the fuck was the point then? God that place is pathetic.
No.1423674
>>1423664
literally stalinist tactics
No.1423677
>>1423670
cometparty is just as bad, he just uses an alt account to do most of his worst shit
No.1423681
>>1423670
Cometparty is actually a FC mod btw
No.1423689
>>1423612
mfw my suspicions are true and there's a whole board where Autismail jerks off over Hoxha and Stalin
>>1423623
my buddy sent me a thing where he gets triggered for an entire thread, writing paragraphs in large font text cursing at some guy who said something he mildly disagreed with. otherwise, he didn't catch my eye.
I'd still welcome him here.
is Children of the Revolution/Bitch X (aka Deborah somethingorother, the mod who was revealed to be a petitbourgeois local political candidate) still around RevLeft?
I don't remember the names of many posters from there, but there was one orthodox Trot I really regret getting out of contact with called Kleber. dude's knowledge on the Russian Revolution was pretty crazy.
No.1423690
>>1423681
He's not that guy's alt if that's what you're referencing.
No.1423693
>>1423598
Im pretty sure /marx/ guy is anti-Hoxhaist hes just a KKEfag
No.1423694
No.1423696
>>1423664
>he thinks you can escape this with promises of horizontalism and META discussion
r/anarchism proves that it doesn't matter at all if you set things up horizontally; wherever possible some cunt will utilize the opportunity to create or simply infiltrate structures and ruin it all.
r/anarchism actually had a brief period where it functioned with some kind of, while chaotic, space in which proper, varied discussion could take place in conjunction with r/metanarchism functioning as power check if mods were to ever walk over things, but none of it mattered whatsoever.
The solution is organic organization TBH, not innately pretencious electoralism or innately pretentious horizontalism, but I can only think vaguely of how that could work on a website like leddit which is literally structured in every way to be co-optable by private interests when things gain momentum against the dominant ideology.
>>1423677
>>1423681
I feel like I might be mistaking cometparty for someone else, but there was a pretty big cheese on r/soc that talked about going full posadism on the mod team.
No.1423703
So, are we going to be able to see the vote totals that all the candidates received? Did the vote totals have anything to do with the moderator selections at all? I notice April Maria isn't on the list, and she seemed to have accrued many dozens of endorsements from socialists of all stripes.
EDIT: Here are the vote totals for the moderators that were chosen, since I don't really expect the mods themselves to count. I could be off by one or two on occasion.
Femimarxi: 34 Support, 10 Oppose
Lovelybone93: 42 Support, 18 Oppose
CrumblyButterMuffins: 25 Support, 2 Oppose
CommunistPenguin: 39 Support, 4 Oppose, 1 Abstain
VanityObscene: 17 Support
Nudelburk: 27 Support, 14 Oppose
AnesthesiaRomanov: 18 Support
ZorreX: No actual votes; this user didn't publicly run for election.
ARedIt: 6 Support
TheSutphin: No actual votes.
Let's take a look at some people who didn't make this arbitrary cut:
AprilMaria: 67 Support, 8 Oppose (It's worth looking at what the opposition was in this case, in my opinion. Link here.
YoungBagelian: 40 Support, 1 Oppose (Hint: It's only VoteAnimal2012 that opposed this.)
PerfectSociety: 18 Support, 1 Oppose (VoteAnimal2012.)
MoonMouse5: 10 Support, 1 Oppose (VoteAnimal2012.)
RedKiev: 21 Support, 2 Oppose (VoteAnimal2012 and one new mod, Nudelburk.)
Zellfire: 24 Support, 4 Oppose (I took out the replicates of one user's votes, if I counted correctly. VoteAnimal2012 and one new mod, VanityObscene, plus two regular users voted in opposition.)
I have no clue why VoteAnimal2012 appears to have such undue influence, considering that almost every single vote on this user's mod application was an oppose. By my count:
53 Oppose, 17 Support. Notably, the "supports" here are a lot of current, former, or new mods.
I'll stop there, because it's easy enough to see that these weren't elections; they were appointments made on an arbitrary basis, and there's no hope for libertarian socialist/anarchist representation here.
EDIT II: Added a bit above and the following permanent link to the Ceddit version of the Moderator Election Post, just in case. This link is an archive of the regular Reddit link.
No.1423704
>>1423696
>I feel like I might be mistaking cometparty for someone else, but there was a pretty big cheese on r/soc that talked about going full posadism on the mod team.
That was him. but it was all talk. he's just as idpol and pedantic as the rest of them and will defend almost all of the stupid shit that happened.
No.1423705
>>1423703
>even the "democratic elections" are rigged
No.1423706
>>1423696
>Hello, my name is /u/theSutphin , and I am very eager and happy to be joining the mod team here. Full disclosure, I was a Bernie Sanders supporter, but it was really Richard Wolff and this actual sub that cemented my ideology in socialism/communism/anarchism. From a very young age, I knew there was something… off about our political and economic system, and it was a fantastic relief to find out WHY I felt that way. Some personal stuff, I LOVE space, it's something I could talk hours about. Hoping to work in the field, but not looking forward to the hierarchy that is capitalism or the pseudo-bureaucracy that is NASA. I also thoroughly enjoy movies and TV. I am currently making my way through "Che Guevara: A Revolutionary Life" and have Prof. Wolff's "Capitalism Crisis Deepens" on the backburner, but often listen to audio books while driving.
Everyday i just want to kill myself more and more
No.1423707
>>1423556
>>1423706
what's wrong with them?
No.1423708
>>1423706
nobody even voted for the guy, it's hilarious
No.1423711
>>1423689
True visionary.
>>1423693
Ismail is literally touting and defending everything from the PPSH's party line in a thread as we speak: http://8ch.net/marx/res/4811.html.
>>1423704
Have you ever seen what a thread looks like because of shit like this? Give it a guess if you haven't, or anyone else ITT that wants to play a game of knife throwing.
No.1423712
>>1423707
That /u/theSutphin person is literal SocDem capitalist moderating a supposedly socialist forum.
No.1423714
>>1423703
The person with the most votes (AprilMaria) didn't get the job because she used the word "cunt" years ago, while some people that didn't even nominate themselves got the job.
Really makes you think
No.1423716
>>1423707
They are 16 year olds LARPing as revolutionaries who are barely educated into even the most lukewarm leftist literature.
Also this is the largest English speaking socialist forum on the net
we are doomed
No.1423720
>>1423711
got him confused with the Stalin tripfag
No.1423721
>>1423708
Not even no votes, no opposition either. They've given a tin of beige fucking paint a moderation position.
No.1423724
>>1423711
>Have you ever seen what a thread looks like because of shit like this?
Shit like what? They're not even mentioning any policy they're for.
>>1423712
They said they were a SocDem, but became further radicalized over time.
No.1423726
>>1423674
No, it's organic centralism. Praise Bordiga.
No.1423727
>>1423726
r/Socialism confirmed for Bordigist paradise
No.1423728
>>1423724
>They said they were a SocDem, but became further radicalized over time.
By listening to Wolff, a SocDem with a coop fetish. It's literally this picture. >>1423586
No.1423729
>>1423716
>Also this is the largest English speaking socialist forum on the net
Is it? Subreddits have hugely inflated user counts because every subscriber is counted. They don't have all that many regular posters.
No.1423732
>>1423728
I became radicalized by Papa Wolff, and then went on to read further left wing literature. You shouldn't deride people just because of how they came to socialism.
No.1423733
>>1423729
Im pretty sure you can get too web traffic somehow on reddit (not sub count), anyway the /r/soc mods were bragging about them being the most popular and throwing around a screencap of their traffic stats or some shit so i guess i just accepted it.
No.1423737
>>1423716
>Also this is the largest English speaking socialist forum on the net
Maybe not. From what I understand subscribers doesn't equal posters and from what people here tell me r/soc has very few regular posters compared to subscribers. I think we probably have more regular users than they do. Still it's on the most popular forum and will likely be curious faggots first exposure to socialism.
No.1423738
>>1423724
I asked what threads ended up looking like with people like that on the moderation team.
>They said they were a SocDem, but became further radicalized over time.
You have to prove that with either rhetoric or action. Simply saying "I identify as high-stage dialectician with the spirit of Bakunin inside me with armchairean characterics" doesn't fucking make you that. When idiots like that person say they became "radicalized" it's easy to check what it means to them, and what it means is social democracy at the stand of a newspaper.
>>1423726
>>1423727
Ebin.
Literally the only people ever purged under Bordiga or "Bordigism" were the Italian PSI, which purported itself "liberal socialist" and actvely worked to suppress the PCd'I's striking and insurrectionist plans, itself purging all communists years before the PCd'I even was formed during this transition away from communism towards "liberal socialism".
Not kidding: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_Socialist_Party.
No.1423741
>>1423732
>my ideology in socialism/communism/anarchism
He can't even clearly identify his ideology (because his actual ideology is Social Democracy but he can't admit that).
>have Prof. Wolff's "Capitalism Crisis Deepens" on the backburner
This is a SocDem text talking about capitalist economics on their own terms, unlike Marx's Capital which is essentially an analysis of why liberal economics is a load of crap.
This is a moderator, mind you. Why should a guy like this be curating discussion between radical leftists?
No.1423748
No.1423753
>>1423737
>subscribers doesn't equal posters and from what people here tell me r/soc has very few regular posters compared to subscribers. I think we probably have more regular users than they do
We absolutely do, and it's what scares the redditors so much. They have nothing whatsoever but the high ground in their moderation clique, while we're a rising board that, while varied ideologically, stands principally against everything they stand for.
We're coming bucko.
No.1423756
Some very obvious tankie trickery is afoot
>So, are we going to be able to see the vote totals that all the candidates received? Did the vote totals have anything to do with the moderator selections at all? I notice April Maria isn't on the list, and she seemed to have accrued many dozens of endorsements from socialists of all stripes.
>EDIT: Here are the vote totals for the moderators that were chosen, since I don't really expect the mods themselves to count. I could be off by one or two on occasion.
>Femimarxi: 34 Support, 10 Oppose
>Lovelybone93: 42 Support, 18 Oppose
>CrumblyButterMuffins: 25 Support, 2 Oppose
>CommunistPenguin: 39 Support, 4 Oppose, 1 Abstain
>VanityObscene: 17 Support
>Nudelburk: 27 Support, 14 Oppose
>AnesthesiaRomanov: 18 Support
>ZorreX: No actual votes; this user didn't publicly run for election.
>ARedIt: 6 Support
>TheSutphin: No actual votes.
>Let's take a look at some people who didn't make this arbitrary cut:
>AprilMaria: 67 Support, 8 Oppose (It's worth looking at what the opposition was in this case, in my opinion. Link here.
>YoungBagelian: 40 Support, 1 Oppose (Hint: It's only VoteAnimal2012 that opposed this.)
>PerfectSociety: 18 Support, 1 Oppose (VoteAnimal2012.)
>MoonMouse5: 10 Support, 1 Oppose (VoteAnimal2012.)
>RedKiev: 21 Support, 2 Oppose (VoteAnimal2012 and one new mod, Nudelburk.)
>Zellfire: 24 Support, 4 Oppose (I took out the replicates of one user's votes, if I counted correctly. VoteAnimal2012 and one new mod, VanityObscene, plus two regular users voted in opposition.)
>I have no clue why VoteAnimal2012 appears to have such undue influence, considering that almost every single vote on this user's mod application was an oppose. By my count:
>53 Oppose, 17 Support. Notably, the "supports" here are a lot of current, former, or new mods.
>I'll stop there, because it's easy enough to see that these weren't elections; they were appointments made on an arbitrary basis, and there's no hope for libertarian socialist/anarchist representation here.
No.1423760
https://www.reddit.com/r/LeftWithoutEdge/comments/5wioow/rsocialism_held_mod_elections_it_went_as_expected/
made a thread to discuss this on Reddit – next /r/socialism exodus incoming, many users spotted the obvious fuckery
No.1423773
>>1423753
We have 160 post per hour and 1000 active users in the last 72 hours. No way they are this active, I just checked https://www.redditlater.com/analysis/#/r/socialism and they have 160 posts on their best days
No.1423774
>>1423773
wait I actually fucked that up
No.1423788
>>1423738
>Literally the only people ever purged under Bordiga or "Bordigism" were the Italian PSI, which purported itself "liberal socialist" and actvely worked to suppress the PCd'I's striking and insurrectionist plans, itself purging all communists years before the PCd'I even was formed during this transition away from communism towards "liberal socialism".
It's disingenuous to say the PSI was all liberals. Lenin did want the left wing faction to join the communists, that is, Serrati's people. While Serrati was mistaken to side with the reformists in the split, and made many other tactical errors, when he did offer his support, it should have been accepted.
No.1423794
Are the new mods replacing the old ones, or are they simply new additions?
If they're just new additions, I'd like to compile a list of the ideological backgrounds of the current moderation team. As I'm not as intimately familiar with the internal politics of /r/socialism, any info on what mods lean which way would be helpful.
No.1423818
>>1423794
They are just getting added to the list
/r/soc internal mod politics primarily revolve around discord cliques so if you ever want to figure out what they are up to you'll have to bs your way into their.
The controlling faction of the sub is Trot particularly aligned with the CWI, secondary faction is tankie primary from the reddit tankie meta warrior groups like /r/SLS and /r/FC.
Alot of the mods cycle accounts now to try and throw people off so figuring out whos who is also another game to have fun with
No.1423826
>>1423794
mods are all tankies + idpol
No.1423837
>>1423540
it's like a /pol/ shitpost given life holy fuck
No.1423841
>>1423837
I want Reddit leftism to end. I'd rather support a fascist uprising than these people. I don't know what's happening to me
No.1423847
>>1423841
Healthy young socialist goes to /r/socialism, gets pumped with massive shot of COINTELPRO, doesn't feel good and changes - FASCISM. Many such cases!
No.1423852
>>1423847
I wouldn't be surprised if this actually happens.
>wow liberalism is total shit. maybe socialism will make things better?
>NO STRUGGLE BUT THE TRANS LESBIAN CHICANO STRUGGLE
>wow that is fucking retarded. maybe I should try the alternative…
No.1423867
>>1423661
>that image
my fucking sides
No.1423873
>>1423841
just embrace titoism and all will be well comrade
No.1423925
>>1423788
>It's disingenuous to say the PSI was all liberals.
It was their party line.
>Lenin did want the left wing faction to join the communists, that is, Serrati's people. While Serrati was mistaken to side with the reformists in the split, and made many other tactical errors, when he did offer his support, it should have been accepted.
>muh Lenin
Lenin also wanted Stalin to supersede him.
Listen, I like Lenin and many of his ideas, but an appeal to authority and using hindsight to say "it was the choice to make, even though it turns out they all betrayed any form of communistic politics precisely for the reasons outlined by the PCd'I, which was already purged from the PSI for being communists"?
>>1423661
>this fucking image
It's got to be ironic. I mean, I know SJTs are capable of being this autistic, but I need proof.
No.1423931
>>1423925
its an old reddit rage comic that got memed because it was so shit.
No.1423934
>people actually defending cometparty
cometparty was the reason /r/soc became garbage and uses two insane alts that have posted death threats to start arguments with people with his "ironic" stalinism and then bans anyone who retorts. at one point he was the only active mod and it made it perfectly clear who was behind this retardation.
No.1423940
>>1423934
I wasn't defending cometparty. I just thought they were one of the few decent ones from my limited knowledge of leddit affairs, which included seeing them promise they'd purge the current mod team after the catgirl incident.
No.1423950
>>1423940
Only shot you got of nuking the leddit mod team is kc_socialist but he could be the one behind the whole shit show.
He is at least knowledgeable and somewhat amicable to left communists and shit and he isn't part of the discord vanguard idiocy but hes a lmaoist so it is a wildcard gamble.
No.1423951
>>1423925
>It was their party line.
Members of a party don't have to agree with the party's line. I'm sure if you asked most democrats, they wouldn't agree with may things the party's done. The party line almost always is the result of a small clique.
>Lenin also wanted Stalin to supersede him.
Lenin wanted Trotsky to supersede him, but that's hardly relevant.
I trust Lenin as far as his judgment in the tactics and strategy for achieving revolution. That was the only thing he was actually good at.
The PSI had several factions in it, and though Serrati did choose the reformist faction over the communist faction during the first split, he did eventually come around in the 11th hour of 1924. Not that Serrati's praxis was that much worse than Bordiga's, for both didn't do much to try to unite the working and peasant class against the bourgeoisie and failed to organize an effective resistance against fascism when it was most needed.
No.1423959
>>1423950
>discord vanguard idiocy
lmao what
No.1423974
>>1423818
Just looked into it. Apparently one of the mods already compiled the ideologies of the moderator staff (questionable reliability mind you, but let's assume it's true for the moment). When comparing the mods to the ideologies of the users as determined by the last survey, here are the major findings (sorry about the bad charts):
>Maoists and Trots receive around double the representation in the mod team than they do in the userbase
>Leninists overall make up 38% of the mod team despite only 25% of the userbase subscribing to such tendencies
>Many members listed as "unknown/other" in the mod ideology report have had leanings towards Leninist tendencies even if they don't explicitly identify by such labels
>Despite being 16% of the user population each, both ancoms and demsocs/socdems (not the sum of, but each individually) only represent 3% of the mod team
>"Libertarian socialist" broad data between the two charts is unreliable due to differences in the specificity of the ideologies available between the mod report and the user survey
Not as bad as I thought it would be (assuming the mod data wasn't fudged), but still indicative of a prevalent representation problem that the recent mod election only widened.
No.1423975
>>1423959
you have to apply to get into the official Discord and then apply some further to get deeper
yes its really that bad
No.1423980
>>1423975
Quality over quantity.
No.1423982
>>1423959
The discord is a locked up club for the active mods and suck arse users.
You can't get in with out ideological screening and basically an interview from the mods, the current crop of cancer that run the sub basically used the discord to create an internal sub clique and usurp the mod team.
They frequently bomb comments and work together to smear users aswell. You'll see in the linked thread that their is a hitjob being led against April-Maria who was the most popular candidate and arbitrarily excluded.
Cyridius who is leading the charge against April is one of the head honchos of the Discord group and the prime agent of turning /r/soc into a mouthpiece for the CWI, he is also the one who led the purge of leftcoms from the sub.
No.1424001
>>1423950
>kc_socialist
>Maoist
If he's not already appearing insufferable, there's a small chance he's not your typical western Maoist, but part of the post-Maoist strand which is basically faithful Leninist with an emphasis on local conditions of capitalism and subjectivized subcategories of proletariat like the precariat, which is way different from bullshit ideas like third-worldism that place the revolutionary subject exclusively on the third world's (a fucking useless descriptor on material terms) working class.
>>1423951
>Members of a party don't have to agree with the party's line.
Agree or not, they follow it or work to change it and, like with most democratically organized parties, this either means factionalism or purging. The PSI's leading faction, which nearly nobody inside it opposed, because everyone was outside either in Bordiga's PCd'I or the later PCI of Gramsci, both for actual communists.
>Lenin wanted Trotsky to supersede him
I used to eat that narrative up too, but then I found some sourced theories that suggest otherwise: https://www.quora.com/Did-Lenin-mean-for-Trotsky-to-succeed-him.
>but that's hardly relevant
I'm glad you agree that appeal to authority is worthless without an appeal to intelligible rhetoric.
>I trust Lenin as far as his judgment in the tactics and strategy for achieving revolution. That was the only thing he was actually good at.
Well, aside from theorizing a whole lot about capitalism, imperialism, the party, the post-revolutionary vanguard form, his particular brand of practical politics ("unraveling the contradictions") and executing them successfully and writing a very good critic of the left communist faction of the Comintern. I'd imagine a Titoist doesn't really value those things, but most of the communist movement does and has built some pretty hard to argue with stuff from his contributions.
>The PSI had several factions in it, and though Serrati did choose the reformist faction over the communist faction during the first split, he did eventually come around in the 11th hour of 1924. Not that Serrati's praxis was that much worse than Bordiga's, for both didn't do much to try to unite the working and peasant class against the bourgeoisie and failed to organize an effective resistance against fascism when it was most needed.
We've had our spergfest over this in another thread and I'll line things up again for you:
>Bordiga didn't "do nothing"; during fascist insurrection he organized the PCd'I and Gramsci's PCI together with all the trade unions and workers they represented
>he directly saw in Germany and Russia the consequences of compromising and allying with liberals against fascism, and wrote mounds upon mounds of theory as to why this is, namely that the conflict between liberalism (bourgeois democracy at its voluncy) and fascism (bourgeois autocracy at its neecessity) was a false one
>he correctly saw the invariant failure of fascism to change anything but the national character of its bourgeoisie and its state apparatus and, after fascism failed, waned and was defeated it was not merely defeated by communist-liberal alliances under a prevailing bourgeois nation, but by internaitonal coalitions that put things on such terms that the only form of betrayal could come redrawing the map post-victory (which it did, without mentioning the character of the "communist" side in the whole affair)
>united fronts had continued to fail after Bordiga refused to ally with the ADP, essentially and especially the exact same kind of alliance as the International Brigades which ended up betraying the CNT-FAI at every crucial moment where it could change things and would ally with the Spanish Republic
Now, I'd like to keep our sperging out of this thread for now.
No.1424004
>>1423974
All those MLM shit-for-Brians.
No.1424008
>>1423974
>Maoists and Trots receive around double the representation in the mod team than they do in the userbase
Fucking knew it. It's the only way for that place to be so awful.
We need an Ultra Express to chug into those fuckers.
No.1424020
>>1423559
Funny. Leftcoms were also purged back in late 2012 on revleft. I don't know her handle now, but CotR ran on a liberal small business platform in Louisiana and I have her campaign video saved on my external harddrive. Also have a bunch of old mod forum leaks.
No.1424022
Can someone give me the short of what's so shit about Maoism? Never really looked into the details of it.
No.1424037
>>1423592
I was also in that purge. Was chill over on redmarx, but I swore off leftist forums and decided to just stick with to 4chan.
No.1424038
Can't we do some slick entryism next election?
No.1424045
>>1424038
nah they are sham elections
if someone wants to apply their autistic energies to taking down /r/soc embed yourself silently in the discord and leak shit to STS.
No.1424049
>>1424001
>Agree or not, they follow it or work to change it and, like with most democratically organized parties, this either means factionalism or purging. The PSI's leading faction, which nearly nobody inside it opposed, because everyone was outside either in Bordiga's PCd'I or the later PCI of Gramsci, both for actual communists.
Well, that's probably why Sattari pushed the PSI to the left and had them join Comintern and support the third Internationale. As well as why he attempted to join with Gramsci once again in 1924.
>Quara
kek.
>Well, aside from theorizing a whole lot about capitalism, imperialism, the party, the post-revolutionary vanguard form, his particular brand of practical politics ("unraveling the contradictions") and executing them successfully and writing a very good critic of the left communist faction of the Comintern. I'd imagine a Titoist doesn't really value those things
Oh no, I quite appreciate his critique of leftcoms. As for the rest, I find some merit in his theory of imperialism and his theory of freedom. Beyond that, his own actions in Russia beyond the October revolution and what they devolved into are hardly confidence inducing.
>repeats the same dumb argument that got btfo twice by his own admission
kekX2
for those of you out of the loop
https://8ch.net/leftypol/res/1409304.html
https://8ch.net/leftypol/res/1416986.html
I'll have you know my spurging knows no bounds
No.1424055
>>1423504
All of the new mods have long post histories but one.But there's still more old mods than new mods.
No.1424057
>>1424008
oh yes, let's replace idpol autism with ultra autism. I'm sure that will end well.
No.1424058
>>1424022
Vanilla Maoism is to be seen as per Mao is a full set of his theoretical convictions.
Like in Russia, Mao took power in a place barely familiar with the capitalist mode of production and as a result, most of its citizens were peasants, others only a primitive proletariat. He used a popular revolution to emancipate the two together and modernize China; advancing it from young feudalism to a state capitalism.
This constitutes the first part of his theory: peasant revolution, which today is taken as a sort of theory of subjectivized relations within capitalism. The "precariat", a group of workers usually coming from underdeveloped countries to engage in wage labor illegally in the first world (or by outsourcing in the third world); they are in an extrajudicial bourgeois situation, where their function as labor is appreciated by the system, but not by the traditional bourgeoisie, which operates nationally and wants to see back their labor in taxes from the firms that hire them without doing so. In a sense, they are like the peasants obviously in every way in capitalism, but in their own way. Hence, their relations to work are different and they need to be emancipated in a different way, one obviously still along class lines but taking into account their different natural interests in their position and especially that of the system.
Second part is the unity of opposites, which is the Confucian-Taoist concept of mutuality applied to dialectical materialism (Marxism): that any contradiction under capitalism is a contradiction not overcome or spat out by the system, but a contradiction that ultimately forms the unitary basis of capitalism itself. This is what Badiou takes from Mao: that Mao's thinking is effectively "endless" in this way, and that he in effect offers a proper response to why most traditional Marxists keep thinking a new economic crisis will kill capitalism. Mao gives them a newsflash: you underestimate a contradiction's innate property of being born from unity with another. Capitalism has no qualms with amputating its excesses, killing its own hosts, etc. as long as its existence is assured.
Finally: cultural revolution. Don't agree with much of it, but the general gist of it is that as long as we follow the principle of Leninism: unraveling the contradictions through action and reform, we must also develop sociocultural relations alongside it, because these sociocultural relations will end up shaping the form of new developments under capitalism and consequently make performing a real revolution outside of capitalism when conditions are right (this bullshit right here is what irks me: social change necessarily pushes the system to function better and puts it out of our control more and more, as it is the most deceptively developing, and that's why China looks the way it looks today as top dawg porky nation, more efficiently capitalist than traditional neoliberalism).
Then there's post-Maoism, which builds upon various other things and is generally a French left thing mostly pushed by Badiou.
No.1424062
>>1424008
I'mma be honest, I wouldn't walk 5 feet to save Maoist's life.
No.1424064
>>1424058
>dialectical materialism (Marxism)
No.1424067
>>1424058
Doesn't seem that bad.
No.1424079
>>1424049
>for those of you out of the loop
There's also that one thread that ended up with you posting that pic comparing one Bordiga quote with a Luxemburg quote with the subject of democracy somewhere in them both, which I replied to with another OC but you or nobody else ever replied to again.
>I'll have you know my spurging knows no bounds
Curb it, though. I like the discourse but I ain't wasting my time on our spergfest outside of dedicated threads.
>>1424064
Technically, dialectical materialism starts with Feuerbach, materialism proper with Descartes and Rousseau and discourse analysis with Hegel, but Marx develops both and combines them to such a point that it's synonymous with the general Marxist philosophical method, which is the last "update" all of them have had, while Heidegger developed metaphysics to basically be synonymous with his name.
>>1424067
But it is.
See, western Maoists, like Trotskyists, don't really read much Mao whatsoever and proceed to use his epics like symbolatry similar to how tankies take Marx and Lenin without reading them or being honest about what they've read (whichever it is, I welcome it). This makes Maoism today synonymous with autism, and the left in general, really.
No.1424098
No.1424137
>>1423982
>Cyridius who is leading the charge against April is one of the head honchos of the Discord group
could you elaborate on this please?
No.1424149
No.1424160
>>1424079
Dialectical Materialism is Soviet theology.
No.1424165
>>1424160
t. Rosa Lichtenstein
No.1424169
>>1424079
>There's also that one thread that ended up with you posting that pic comparing one Bordiga quote with a Luxemburg quote with the subject of democracy somewhere in them both, which I replied to with another OC but you or nobody else ever replied to again.
You mean this one? I posted in a couple times, not sure when you're talking about. Were you the autist going on about a synthesis between stirner and bordiga?
>Curb it, though. I like the discourse but I ain't wasting my time on our spergfest outside of dedicated threads.
It is my sworn duty to harass and confront leftcom posters no matter where they appear.
No.1424173
>>1424149
>my position on feminism is without reproach. While I reject clintonesque bourgeoisie feminism I have more feminism stuff and pro minority stuff on my Facebook page than socialist stuff by a country mile
What the fuck is wrong with these people? It's like they think socialism is just a sideshow. And this is one of the better people on there. Well, at least they're continuing to self-destruct.
No.1424178
>>1424137
Cyridius is the alt of Polbacht-Oibrite (sp?) he is one of the two central people amongst the discord group the other being MyShitsFuckedDown3 aka MSFD.
They are trying to smear April-Maria who is a popular oldfag /r/soc user and the who received the most votes in the referendum but got vetoed ostensibly because someone posted a link too a two year old comment where she said cunt (she is irish btw so it was just the general brit / irish / aussie usage of the term, not in a offensive context)
The real beef they have with her I don't know, I haven't bothered with /r/soc since the leftcom purge.
No.1424190
Suprise, suprise one of the new mods is a maoist-third-worldist.
>Remember guys catgirls are offensive but saying the white working class is a reactionary labour aristocracy will get you made into a mod.
The irony is this tool has probably never done a day of hard work in his life.
https://www.reddit.com/r/socialism/comments/5wdiv8/new_mods/de9940f/
No.1424195
>>1424178
> cunt (she is irish btw so it was just the general brit / irish / aussie usage of the term, not in a offensive context)
I'm not in any way justifying this shit where they drag you over hot coals for saying a naughty word, but is cunt really that different in American and non-American English? It's still the most offensive word there is here in Britain.
No.1424202
>>1424178
I'm the guy you're replying to, is there verification that Poblacht has an ant account?
I was a regular on the carrot/dicord /r/socialism chat from about a year ago, and being Irish myself I have lurked /r/ireland myself for two or three years so I know April Maria well
I was banned twice from the dicord for the silliest reasons, and got into a personal argument with Poblacht.
No.1424207
>>1424190
Of course. UpholderofThoughts's appointment was preparation for this.
No.1424209
>>1424195
Yes. To put it simply, I've never heard cunt used in an American movie.
No.1424215
>>1424207
>UpholderofThoughts
THAT GUY became a mod?
he has to be the stupidest regular commenter on that board
what is with americans and maoism?
No.1424216
>>1424173
I'm not sure, but I think she brought it up because she was attacked for being sexist because she previously used the word "cunt" (she's from Ireland). Got to outcrazy them somehow.
No.1424225
>>1424216
>>1424173
she's a rural small farmer in her mid 20s and tries to turn rural people onto socialism, it's far more than you middle class 19 year olds have ever done
No.1424229
>>1424225
Back to Reddit please.
No.1424231
>>1424225
>Defending someone who admits to being far more interested in idpol than in socialism
No.1424232
>>1424215
>>1424207
I guarantee you both these faggots have never done a hard day of work in their life. Honestly we talk about the White working class having false consciousness but MTW are even more spooked.
No.1424235
>>1424229
back to your sociology class
>>1424231
back to your civics class
>>1424232
back to your mass starvation class
No.1424238
>>1424235
>back to your mass starvation class
kek
No.1424241
>>1424235
>back to your civics class
No argument, as I thought. The ad hom isn't even on the mark.
No.1424243
No.1424245
>>1424178
MSFD was a complete bitch in the discord talk following the first /r/soc exodus to here. Also one of his goons banned me because I said 🍀🍀🍀catgirls🍀🍀🍀 lel
No.1424247
>>1424243
does anybody have the screenshot of the mods ridiculing her on the Discord?
No.1424248
>>1424229
>>1424231
The user he's talking about is actually chill. When people start whipping out the SJW tactics a lot of people don't know how to react besides doubling down on their idpol credentials.
No.1424250
>>1424241
>No argument
what is this, mollypoo?
fact is that april maria is a good 7 years older than you, has a real job as opposed to your college classes, and does a good job spreading socialist thought in rural ireland
No.1424251
>>1424243
>That's not at all what happened but thanks for misgendering mods, super cool
Hahahahahaha. Why are they so fucking stupid?
>>1424248
>The user he's talking about is actually chill
I'm not attacking her as a person, I'm just saying her ideology is retarded.
No.1424253
>>1424250
Keep on with the ad homs, you ridiculous white knight faggot.
No.1424254
>>1424248
I didn't even criticize her though, I even defended her for bringing it up
No.1424260
>>1424250
Why do you assume to know our occupation and age? That's why I'm telling you to go back to Reddit, you have no idea what makes up an anonymous imageboard.
fyi I am 23, work part time and am active in 2 different political organizations
No.1424266
>>1424260
>Why do you assume to know our occupation and age?
because you're a bunch of fucking 17 year olds
>>1424253
good look with your leaving cert
No.1424273
>>1423925
dude how do you not know about le music defener?
No.1424284
>>1424266
>because you're a bunch of fucking 17 year olds
t. 18 year old
No.1424293
No.1424298
No.1424301
>>1424287
Inb4 /pol/ uses their ultra elite hollywood hacking skills to dox you
No.1424330
>>1424202
I cant provide any direct evidence but its pretty easy if you got Cydrius or w/e that its him, he sometimes went b the name on discord.
No.1424338
>>1424254
I misunderstood sorry.
No.1424352
>>1423703
How can this be so fucking blatant and people still use that shithole?
No.1424385
No.1424407
>>1423741
Or he's just anti-sectarian and is willing to side with any revolutionary, anticapitalist group of people because they all have the same end goal anyways.
No.1424417
>>1424243
It's funny how you can see the mods are brigading the comment thread. Top comment heavily upvoted and they can't reverse that by voting on it, the further down you go though the more the votes shift
No.1424450
why is the mod team so 🍀🍀🍀Irish🍀🍀🍀?
No.1424495
Prince_Kropotkin do you post here?
No.1424613
>>1424243
>e: obviously I got banned
No.1424634
>>1424632
Lel i got banned by that fucking wimp too for calling out their bullshit rewriting of what happened re: LovelyBone93.
No.1424673
TOP KEK
I just found this shit from our favorite weasel P_K:
Speaking of "reporting", let me tell you a great story I heard from one of the current /r/socialism mods, who is less than happy about the way things go on there (I have the greatest sources and moles, folks. The best. Believe me, you would be so amazed by my sources).
A couple months ago the mods trolled Jason Unruhe of Maoist Rebel News into a debate. Unfortunately for them, the large majority of /r/socialism is basically unaware of the guy, but he on the other hand has a ton of Sam Harris-level cult fans, being a Maoist and all.
So they set this thing up and debate Unruhe on Discord. The agreement they made beforehand was that they'll do the debate, edit it a bit and post the results on /r/socialism publicly. Of course they didn't bother prepare or anything like that because they thought he wouldn't be able to debate for shit (he is pretty cringy, but at the same time he does a newscast and has been making videos for a long while). Unruhe makes points, they can't really counter anything, and instead keep having to skip to the next topic.
The debate goes along and it's a total shitshow, all the /r/socialism mods don't give a fuck but Unruhe's Father Sam-tier fans are going bananas, and as I said they can't really counter anything the guy says, embarrassingly enough. So they renege on making the debate public because they don't want to massively lose face to a cringelord Youtube Maoist. Unruhe in response posts it up himself, completely unedited.
Unruhe apparently lives in the same state that the most prominent /r/socialism debater does. This is the kicker: the modteam 100% seriously considered calling the cops in that state to get Unruhe charged for violating the privacy laws there, since he posted that audio without their consent.
What a bunch of fucking goofs, right?
>https://www.reddit.com/r/SubredditDrama/comments/5vtv1b/uvoteanimal2012_previously_known_as_the_banned/de4xfp6/
No.1424761
>There are legitimate criticisms of Socialist Alternative Australia, and I think it's important not to be too dismissive of them. Having said that the organisation does a lot of great work.
I wonder if they describe "great work" as "pressuring female comrades to sleep with potential members to get them involved" still? Holy shit SAlt are the biggest cancer on the Australian left, to imply they do "great work" when their entire modus operandi is infiltrating other groups, hollowing them out, and using them as organs and soapboxes to sell copies of their shitty trot paper is fucking garbage. That is literally all they do, they weaken the left massively and take credit for other people's achievements. Fuck this guy.
No.1424767
>>1424673
you know you fucked up when you make /leftypol/ sympathize with Jason Unruhe of all people
No.1424779