全 20 件のコメント

[–]Corguitos 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

What do you think my heritage is, now that your poor manners are compounded by being presumptuous. I'm curious.

Also, if you think my view is propaganda, what aim do you think I have by spreading it?

[–]cookedpotato 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (4子コメント)

TL;DR bot plz.

[–]jelsomino[S] 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (3子コメント)

Really? It's there in first paragraph
The conceptions "Ukrainian nationalist," "nationalistic movement," differ from similar terms used in the West. The Ukrainian nationalistic movement has nothing in common with Nazism, fascism or national-socialism. Ukrainian nationalism is fighting against totalitarianism, racism, dictatorship and violence of any kind.
The name "Ukrainian nationalist" is consonant with "Ukrainian patriot" who is ready to fight for freedom of his people, to sacrifice for his people everything he has, even his life."

[–]cookedpotato 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I read that part. There is a lot more to the article than that.

[–]Corguitos 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I guess Bandera didn't get that memo about not aligning with Nazism?

[–]jelsomino[S] 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

What in that statement or article in whole made you say that?

[–]SquaredUp2 -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (11子コメント)

Please keep Bandera from this sub. Or any sub, for that matter. This is not what Euromaidan is, or ever was, about. This is not what Ukraine should be about, either. The revolution and the movement for change that has been happening in Ukraine, as well as the struggles you people are facing, should not under any circumstances be associated with a Nazi collaborationist. To say you're giving it a bad name by doing so is a gross understatement. I come from a country with huge ideological divide problems as well (stemming, of course, back from WWII) and as such know how it is to have people in your country glorify Nazism and fascism under the guise of "patriotism". We actually had a similar situation you people are facing now about 25 years ago (political instability, insurgency, war) and I empathise a great deal with the Ukrainian people as a result. As such, I can tell you you are doing them a great disservice by posting this.

[–]axeller 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (7子コメント)

Did any country find him guilty in fascism?

[–]SquaredUp2 -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (6子コメント)

Ukraine did, for one. The Soviet Union as a whole also certainly did.

[–]jelsomino[S] 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (4子コメント)

Really? Was there a Bandera trial in USSR? Can you provide information on that? Nuremberg Trubunal acquitted Bandera of War crimes. Are you questioning Nuremberg Tribunal findings?

[–]SquaredUp2 -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (3子コメント)

Nuremberg acquitted numerous people who were guilty, such as Dönitz, gave extremely light sentences to people such as Hoth, and never even charged people such as von Braun. So yeah, I'd say they weren't exactly effective in delivering justice all the time.

[–]jelsomino[S] -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (2子コメント)

It bored me. Your pathetic attempt to underminne post-WWII system of international justice as laughable as Holocaust denial. Good bye, have a miserable life

[–]axeller -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Ukraine? Proofs, please)

[–]jelsomino[S] 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (2子コメント)

For fuck's sake get your facts straight! "Nazi collabortionist" was arrested by Nazis in 1941 and sent to concentration camp in 1942. Stalin collaborated with Hitler longer than Bandera was free during Ukraine's occupation

[–]SquaredUp2 -1 ポイント0 ポイント  (1子コメント)

The fact that the Nazis eventually decided they didn't like Bandera all that much doesn't undermine, or diminish in any way, the fact that he was a Nazi collaborationist. Also, I don't see why you would try to refute my argument by saying Stalin also collaborated with Hitler. Did I say at any point Stalin was a good person? No. But that fact doesn't make Bandera any better. This is no more than blatant apologism of fascism, and it's disgusting. How is this any different than saying Quisling or Petain were good people because they opposed communism and fought for national self-determination?

This sub should have a zero-tolerance policy towards fascism, and you should too. The Ukraine I know was built on a legacy of antifascism.

[–]jelsomino[S] 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I didn't say Stalin collaborated with Hitler longer than Bandera, read my reply carefully. Declaration of Ukrainian State Act was announced on June 30 1941, 8 days after Hitler attacked USSR. Immediately after that Nazi arrested all leadership of independent Ukrainian State and Bandera ended up in Sachsenhausen concentration camp. How's that for collaborationism?