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OKCoin and Huobi suspend Bitcoin and Litecoin withdrawals for one month to upgrade system security (coindesk.com)

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[–]finalhedge 58 ポイント59 ポイント  (13子コメント)

Meanwhile bitcoin volume in Japan continues to surge

Don't let the door hit you on the way out, PBoC

[–]cosmic_boombox 32 ポイント33 ポイント  (3子コメント)

I always keep hearing stories from China fanboys about how China is "more capitalist" or "more free" than the west. It sure looks like a totalitarian state from here.

[–]Cryptolution 13 ポイント14 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I've been having spirited debates recently with people who seem to refuse to acknowledge the fact that the Chinese government can and will impose whatever sanctions they feel is necessary to keep a tight control on their currency Supply.

To me this is just another obvious nail in the coffin that China is the worst place to have Bitcoin activity. Yet there is a sweet irony in that because places like China are the ones that need Bitcoin the most. It's just that the market has a lot to learn about censorship prone governments.

Right now there are way too many eggs in the proverbial Chinese basket and I would be very happy to see some other countries cough Japan cough really pick up the slack

[–]Lite_Coin_Guy 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

of course, these statements are made by morons maybe - "more free" lol!

[–]Sdbp619 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

0% fee, volume means nothing.

[–]zby 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

The Japanese exchanges with big volumes have zero fees - these numbers are meaningless.

[–]roller-coaster-guy 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

time to go up hodlers! buckle up

[–]Sugar_Daddy_Peter 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (5子コメント)

1 month? Like probably until after 3/11/2017?

Holy fuck the governments are starting to move some pawns. Get off of exchnages! Get off coinbase! Buy a hardware wallet!

[–]CONTROLurKEYSredditor for 10 days 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Fire! fire! Panic! Panic!

[–]Sugar_Daddy_Peter 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Step 1: buy discounted coins

Step 2: get them the fuck into your own possession

[–]ohbleek 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

starting to move pawns

Meaning what?

[–]kegman83 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Bitcoin is a threat to central banks but not if the central banks just seize the exchanges

[–]shaninchina 56 ポイント57 ポイント  (27子コメント)

American here, living in China, and regularly trade on Huobi. I knew this was coming a long time ago, I just didn't know when. I once tried to send Bitcoin to my Kraken account as a way of remittance (the laws here in China for RMB remittance are so horrible, have to show every bit of taxes was paid in stamped and approved receipts, and you can't transfer more than 100k RMB at a time). When I tried to transfer it to Kraken (to then sell and withdraw USD), Huobi gave me a notification that said “有账户风险，请联系客服”, Your account has risk, please contact customer service. Anyway long story short, the customer service rep lady kept telling me the government is really putting the pressure on them to keep Bitcoin in China, and not transfer them out. After Skyping them to prove I was in fact the true holder of the passport photo I uploaded as verification, the restriction was lifted, and I sent my few months worth of paychecks back to the US where I wanted it.

The China Central Bank's reserves are at a historical lows, I'm imagining this along with money laundering is the reason for these new restrictions.

[–]waxwing 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (2子コメント)

The China Central Bank's reserves are at a historical lows

That's a slightly squishy definition of "historical". I believe they've had less than 2.9 trillion USD before :)

(The valid point is that it's been trending down aggressively recently)

[–]masternode 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Goldman Sachs calculated that cumulatively since August 2015 through November 2016, FX outflow for China totaled roughly US$1.1 trillion. FX Outflow chart avail on tweet below.

https://twitter.com/EdwardAMoncada/status/829823759708155904

[–]kegman83 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

If you believe the official numbers which you shouldn't

[–]bitking74 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (13子コメント)

What would happen if you just withdraw them to your private wallet, then they could not link it to Kraken right? I am but surprised that they were able to link the Bitcoin address to Kraken anyway? Did you save it with that name?

[–]shaninchina 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (12子コメント)

This is what I get for keeping my bitcoin in a exchange like /u/cqv said. It's impossible to take it out, no matter where it's going.

Everytime I try it says "根据监管部门的要求，该功能正在升级，详情请查看公告" which translates roughly to "The function you are trying to use is unavailable due to the requirements of the upgrade by the regulatory authority. Please see the announcements for details"

[–]AjaxFC1900 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (11子コメント)

This is what I get for keeping my bitcoin in a exchange like /u/cqv said. It's impossible to take it out, no matter where it's going.

You mean that even before today you could not withdraw to your personal wallet?

[–]Geldeintreiber 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (10子コメント)

Yes. The fact that he was withdrawing to an address in his kraken account is actually pointless or even confusing. A withdrawel to ANY bitcoin address would have started this inspection of his withdrawel.

[–]ThomasVeil 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Wait... so all traders on the Chinese exchanges keep their Bitcoin there forever? That's some sort of Mt.Gox setup. They'll learn a hard leasson I guess - and Bitcoin will be fucked for years again, because now the PBOC has massive supply.
I guess I'll better prepare some fiat for when bitcoin hits $200 again.

[–]masternode 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

They are going to stop BTC withdrawals all together. The only way to end capital flight from China thru BTC is to stop BTC withdrawals on the Chinese exchanges. You can still speculate on price, but you get no utility out of it. All of the BTC sitting on the exchange will eventually cash out to Fiat. This is what is going to cause the bloodbath.

In regards to PBoC actions towards bTC there is much more to come. Keep in mind the largest mining pools are in China.

[–]ThomasVeil 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

In regards to PBoC actions towards bTC there is much more to come. Keep in mind the largest mining pools are in China.

I agree, judging from what happened the last time. They won't be happy until the price is much much lower.
I find it obviously corrupt when their public justification is better price stability.

[–]AjaxFC1900 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (6子コメント)

So why the price only tanked today? Inspections seem a pretty big red flag!

[–]Coolsourceredditor for 1 month 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (4子コメント)

Inside trading. Did you really believe Bobby Lee saying everything is fine? The fcker is fooling all of you

[–]LarsPensjo 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

Can't be inside. If it was, we would have seen high sell pressure before the news.

[–]Geldeintreiber 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Maybe it would have gone up much more without these inspections? Who can tell this kind of stuff...

[–]CTSlicker 12 ポイント13 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well thanks for the timeous heads up

[–]FuckM0reFromRredditor for 25 days 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (4子コメント)

the government is really putting the pressure on them to keep Bitcoin in China

How the fuck do they know where your bitcoin address is from?

[–]shaninchina 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (1子コメント)

They had no idea, I mean, no one can, but they know I am American, there's actually quite a lot of expats here that use Bitcoin as a remittance method, so the first time I tried to send that large amount of bitcoin, it sent up red flags at Huobi. The Chinese government wants expats to use the bank method of remittance with the annoying tax restrictions and such in order to ensure legality of sending money overseas (along with a large fee from the bank... >.>)

[–]Cryptolution 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Is there a localbitcoins in China? Find their OTC market!!!!

[–]Geldeintreiber 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

They do not. They just checked for EVERY address that receives large amounts. Now they just seized it all.

[–]AnonymousRev 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

http://coinvalidation.com/

https://skry.tech/

Because all major merchants and services are tracked (especially darknet) and thousands of blockchain analytic companies work with exchanges to know where people are sending their money.

Same way coinbase knows if your gambling, or useing darknet sites and need to close your account.

[–]jjwayne 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (2子コメント)

Soo..... if you knew this a long time ago, what's next?

[–]shaninchina 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I think if you're going to hodl, best to do it in a private or hardware wallet.

[–]MAssDAmpER 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Thats always been the case.

[–]JamaicanLurk 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Sounds like PBoC wants to subsidize the local mining industry. Good luck freezing those.

[–]hgmichna 26 ポイント27 ポイント  (9子コメント)

Smells of insider trading. Imagine you work at one of these exchanges and know in advance …

Edit 4 h later: The OKCoin price began to sink 6 hours before the announcement and sank by 0.66% until the announcement. No proof, but no contradiction either. At the prevailing trading volumes that's quite a lot.

Definitely the temptation is there at the exchanges and even more at the PBOC. Making a 5% profit in a few days is certainly tempting.

[–]imfadingyou 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (5子コメント)

Something does stink! Traded at a high of ~1074 usd midday in China. They wait until an hour or so ago to announce (9-10pm in China)?

[–]stinkyfrito 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (4子コメント)

Couldn't agree more, my first thought was "Why is this coming out at night?"

[–]Cryptolution 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (3子コメント)

This actually makes sense. The later the announcement the less panic from Chinese traders. It was meant to prevent Chinese sell panic, which is reasonable considering we are discussing Chinese.

[–]hgmichna 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I thought I saw panic selling.

[–]livinincalifornia 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Now it's back from low 900s and pushing 990. Get em while they're cheaper!

コメントをもっと表示する (1 返事)

    [–]CONTROLurKEYSredditor for 10 days 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Is there any question of it at this point?

    [–]HeadCRasher 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

    You've seen the dip 24h before?

    [–]ItsAboutSharing 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Did you notice the the quarterly futures trading at a $50 discount to the weekly on OKC? Something was up.

    [–]stringliterals 21 ポイント22 ポイント  (6子コメント)

    Instead of weeping over the price, or obsessing over how a price change may effect those outside of China, this might be a good time to show some empathy for those people in China that are really caught up in this.

    Bitcoin is many things for many people. It just stopped being one thing for many of those people. I genuinely hope this didn't catch any families in the middle of seeking an exit from an oppressive state.

    Let's try to be a little more sensitive to things beyond price, please.

    [–]waxwing 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Good point, at least in general - this is mostly hurting some ordinary Chinese people I guess (even if it's almost all speculative, all the same).

    But, people should be learning by now that coins on an exchange do not belong to you. It's not just about being a purist, not at all.

    [–]GenghisKhanSpermShot 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Empathy? This is Reddit, we want blood!

    [–]livinincalifornia 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Is there really an anti-china sentiment here though?

    I'm empahetic and all but China is a totalitarian state so hard to say we couldn't see this type of actioj being taken by the PBOC.

    コメントをもっと表示する (3 返事)

      [–]HowRiskyIsDatClick 17 ポイント18 ポイント  (1子コメント)

      Bitcoins now 15% off. Supplies are limited.

      [–]ieatdurt 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      My face when I already reached the weekly buy limit :(

      [–]flix2 15 ポイント16 ポイント  (2子コメント)

      Don't want your funds blocked? don't want to be Goxxed? Start using P2P exchanges... https://bitsquare.io/

      [–]UKcoin 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (1子コメント)

      this might be the sort of boost bitsquare needs, it seems perfect for the chinese, what would the PBOC do with it if there's no one running the show? It seems like decentralised exchanges are exactly what China needs.

      [–]nyaaaa 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      Block the website.

      [–]cqv 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (31子コメント)

      This is why you shouldn't store bitcoins on exchanges.

      [–]HeadCRasher 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (2子コメント)

      If I did this I could have SODL just 34 Minuten before. Now it's too late.

      [–]monkyyy0 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      SODL

      Satoshi weeps

      [–]AjaxFC1900 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      If everyone kept their BTC in cold wallets price would have not tanked in the first place ...

      [–]ebaley 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (22子コメント)

      So how can people trade?

      [–]CONTROLurKEYSredditor for 10 days 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (21子コメント)

      Be ready to lose everything if you are gambling.

      [–]ebaley 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (20子コメント)

      Trading is not gambling.

      [–]easyb 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (4子コメント)

      Trading is gambling in it's oldest form. Until a mind-reading invention is dropped on the world, it will always be gambling. People use all kinds of mental gymnastics to argue otherwise, but there's never been any proven system to make money trading other than buying and holding long term.

      [–]CONTROLurKEYSredditor for 10 days 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (2子コメント)

      It's worse than gambling actually. Gambling you at least know the players and have straight odds. But yeah it's gambling.

      [–]ebaley 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

      The players could be cutthroats or cheats. A race or game could be rigged.

      [–]CONTROLurKEYSredditor for 10 days 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      Sports betting maybe not table casino games. Pvp poker excluded

      [–]hgmichna 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

      Trading is not gambling.

      Normally it isn't. But with the strange, unpredictable attacks on bitcoin it comes close.

      [–]ebaley 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      China "banning" Bitcoin is unpredictable? The very volatility of Bitcoin makes it easy to trade.

      コメントをもっと表示する (10 返事)

        [–]slowtriangle 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (4子コメント)

        How do you have liquidity and price discovery without an exchange?

        [–]cqv 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (3子コメント)

        Did I say centralized exchanges shouldn't exist?

        [–]slowtriangle 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (2子コメント)

        "This is why you shouldn't store bitcoins on exchanges."

        It sounded like you didn't think bitcoins should be stored on exchanges.

        [–]cqv 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

        Obviously when you use their service you have to trust them at some point but unless you are gambling you don't need to send them your full stash and you can withdraw everything after trading. You don't own the coins if you don't have the keys.

        [–]slowtriangle 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        True. But I think if everyone followed that principle there wouldn't be enough liquidity and trade would suffer.

        [–]ethbtc 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (11子コメント)

        To be clear, the statement says that Renminbi withdrawals are still OPERATIONAL.

        [–]bitsteiner 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (10子コメント)

        That's the point. You can only sell, if you want your money back.

        [–]cacamalaca 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (8子コメント)

        Which is why, if there was/is gonna be a run on the exchanges, it would have happened already. IMO, things are going to stabilize quickly barring more FUD.

        [–]SilencingNarrative 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (7子コメント)

        But bitcoin is a hedge against banks failing in china. If all you can do is sell bitcoin back to exchanges and deposit the yuan in Chinese banks, then you no longer have hedge against banks failing.

        The government has removed the pressure bitcoin was exerting on yuan price.

        [–]cacamalaca 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (6子コメント)

        You can still deposit fiat to BTCC and withdraw Bitcoin.

        [–]SilencingNarrative 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (5子コメント)

        So btcChina will let people withdraw bitcoin but other Chinese exchanges will not?

        [–]cacamalaca 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (4子コメント)

        Current reports indicate the restrictions only apply to Houbi and OKC.cn. The news I've seen on BTCC says 72hrs for BTC and LTC withdrawals. People here have mentioned that BTCC is already known to have strict KYC and AML protocols.

        [–]SilencingNarrative 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

        I wonder why the government is only imposing bitcoin withdrawl ban on houbi and okc?

        The phrasing of the announcement, that the gvt is worried about pyramid schemes and money laundering (vague assertions of consumer protection concerns) makes me think it's the competition from bitcoin that the authorities are really worried sbout.

        And if consumer protection is their motivation, why get rid of zero fee trades? To protect consumers we need to charge them more? What sense does that make?

        It makes sense if the banks are worried that bitcoin is competing too well with their payment network.

        I wonder if this has anything to do with the 1 year maturity on wealth management products and the 5 year maturity on the construction loans banks in china make with those deposits? Now thats a pyramid scheme.

        Maybe the gvt should investigate that if it cares so much about consumers.

        [–]cacamalaca 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (2子コメント)

        I wonder why the government is only imposing bitcoin withdrawl ban on houbi and okc?

        I've heard from a few people that Houbi and OKC have abysmal KYC protocols. BTCC is known to have strict KYC, so the math adds up that they were excluded from the suspension.

        I don't see why mandating exchanges to enforce strict KYC and AML protocols is an unreasonable demand by the PBoC. Tax evasion and money laundering are legitimate concerns in the Bitcoin space.

        As for the rest of your post, I can only speculate. Certainly all theories are on the table at this point.

        [–]SilencingNarrative 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

        What is KYC?

        I agree it is reasonable for the government to require exchanges to implement some AML steps, but what would strict AML steps look like?

        Reasonable steps would be that the exchange has established who their account holders are. Their home and work addresses, phone numbers, that they actually work at the companies they say they do and those companies exist an so on.

        I grant you that if they are allowing withdrawls of bitcoin from btcchina because it has already demonstrated that it has taken reasonable AML measures and the other exchanges havent, then this looks legit on their part.

        I would expect there will be a large withdrawl of cash from okc and houbi and a big influx the btcchina.

        [–]ThomasVeil 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        So if one would design a ruling to specifically to crash the price, that one would be it.

        [–]coinx-ltc 20 ポイント21 ポイント  (12子コメント)

        Pboc, please ban bitcoin. I am sick of this rollercoaster. Without China we would have a slower but steadier growth.

        [–]stinkyfrito 12 ポイント13 ポイント  (6子コメント)

        I am about sick of China. However, it looks like were going to settle about $70 lower, which is nothing. A year ago news like this would've tanked the price.

        [–]Matt-Choo 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (4子コメント)

        Who says it's done tanking? West coast still not awake yet.

        [–]stinkyfrito 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (2子コメント)

        Yeah looks like im wrong :(

        [–]Matt-Choo 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        It's not that I want you to be wrong, I wanna buy when they're at the lowest and it doesn't seems like the knife has hit the floor yet so it's still not safe to catch.

        [–]gulfbitcoin 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        Bounced back pretty good however so your original estimate not too far off

        [–]klondike_barz 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        im awake and laughing because ths is more of the same from pboc.

        my bitcoins are safe

        [–]Lynxes_are_Ninjas 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        Settle?

        [–]nybe 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        you kiddin? they are making too damn much money off this game.

        [–]cryptoboy4001redditor for 24 days 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (2子コメント)

        ... and shut down the mining farms while your at it. The hashrate from non-Chinese mining is still high enough to secure the network.

        The sooner Bitcoin becomes decentralized again (i.e. negligible Chinese influence) for both mining and trade volumes, the better. We might even have a chance of getting Segwit activated if they're gone.

        [–]UKcoin 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

        this would be the best result ever, if they stepped in and shut Jihan Wu down then at least we could get back to normal life without a crazy dictactor going mental all the time.

        [–]Toxhax 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        Yes. Let's shut down the only company that sells asic miners to the public. That will help decentralization...

        [–]mccormack555 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        Feels like recovery from bad news is quicker and quicker these days.

        [–]parishiIt0n 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (5子コメント)

        I wonder why BTCC is not subject to the upgrade too. Already done?

        [–]Taidiji 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (4子コメント)

        When they say AML it's blockchain tracking. BTCC already has a full team in place doing this.

        [–]parishiIt0n 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

        Thanks for the insight! Respect to BTCC

        I do think that the 1 month freeze period is way to much to implement acceptable tracking tho, considering the resources this companies have and the repercussions for the clients. Once clients move to another exchange its gonna be hard to bring them back

        [–]bitsteiner 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (2子コメント)

        Yeah it is ridiculous. Pboc wants to control the price, like they do with everything. It is called central planning.

        [–]cacamalaca 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

        Estimated 1 month but can be significantly ahead of schedule if it went well

        https://twitter.com/cnLedger/status/829683866763829248

        [–]TweetsInCommentsBot 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        @cnLedger

        2017-02-09 13:30 UTC

        .@CharlieShrem @OKCoin @huobicom Estimated 1 month but can be significantly ahead of schedule if it went well

        This message was created by a bot

        [Contact creator][Source code]

        [–]dayz_ike 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (1子コメント)

        To "upgrade security." Bull shit. It's to install government monitoring equipment

        [–]ItsAboutSharing 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        Excellent point. Sure doesn't take a month, not to mention why not the other exchange?

        [–]GanjaFarmer23 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (2子コメント)

        For once this is actual bearish news

        [–]PrimeParticleredditor for 2 months 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

        Not for the long term. If you look beyond the very short term, this will make bitcoin even more stable than ever, just as their last actions did (like stopping margin trading). So thanks! PoBC.

        [–]Next_5000redditor for 26 days 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        Doesn't the fiat have to move via centralized services? Isn't that where the choke point would be? Isn't it also limited to 1 BTC purchases?

        [–]N_B_B 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (2子コメント)

        Bhoy, I am sick and tired of the fact that every time "PBoC" and "bitcoin" are mentioned in an article there's a run on bitcoin. We (the non-chinese) need to stock up and weaken their influence if we want bitcoin to succeed as a store of value.

        [–]LarsPensjo 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

        That is not the case. Many Chinese holders are currently not allowed to withdraw their bitcoin from the exchange. If they want the money, they have to sell the bitcoin, and withdraw fiat. That is why there is a sell pressure. It is not about rumors or bad news.

        [–]N_B_B 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        If the Chinese not being able to withdraw their bitcoin from the exchanges doesn't qualify as bad news, then I don't know what does. If the Chinese held less than 1% of bitcoins then this wouldn't be news and the price today would not have dropped as significantly.

        [–]Vapor114 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        People sure get confused. FACT: Know Your Customer and Anti Money Laundering Laws have nothing to do with war on drugs or terrorism. It is so the governments and banks can control where the money is and inflate it away as a tax.

        This withdrawal delay will stop some Yuan from fleeing into Seattle real-estate. But it now gives the Chinese (reminds, educates) permission for them to move their money into BTC and hold long. The Chinese are moving record amounts of money into overseas properties to avoid devaluation of the Yuan (Gov't pretends it's money laundering for control). Chinese can move to BTC legally IN ANY AMOUNT (no 50K limit) and hold, then move back after Yuan devaluations. These sudden and stupid moves from the PBOC are excellent eduction and publicity for BTC on the long term. The PBOC looks like they will become partners with the exchanges as they re-register as banks not exchanges, this is in order that the gov't does not lose out on all the upside going to be coming in BTC through heated currency wars and global economic turmoil. You are going to see BTC double or triple in value soon. The big money will see the moves and not want to miss out. No one trusts each other - hence that is why BTC exists. Have fun on ride dudes and dudettes!

        [–]FuckM0reFromRredditor for 25 days 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (2子コメント)

        This is as devious as it is crafty.

        1. Take deposits
        2. Halt withdraws without notice
        3. Keep all funds that don't pass AML screening

        [–]Geldeintreiber 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        Still the prices are the same in China and on Bitstamp. Wonder when they will start to deviate. Should be MtGox all over again. Where is the Bitcoin Builder? Maybe people want to start trading BTCChinaCoins vs real Bitcoins :)

        [–]Five100 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        I thought they would allow you to withdraw cash to a Chinese bank account?

        Do you know they keep all bitcoins that don't pass??

        [–]BitcoinOdyssey 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        HODL is slightly appropriate for a change!

        [–]mshadel 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

        Theory: PBOC has determined that bitcoin is here to stay, and banning it outright would leave the Chinese behind while the rest of the world builds the next gen infrastructure and profits. That looks bad for The Party. But, bitcoin must be monitored to prevent money from leaving the country, and the PBOC must be able to manipulate the price to some extent. So, they freeze bitcoin withdrawals at the big exchanges to put their monitoring systems in place. At the same time, they order the exchanges to review all accounts to ensure the documentation is legit. That could take a month or more. The bitcoin from any fake (presumably foreign) accounts are claimed by the PBOC. Now they have a big, free bitcoin stash available to tweak the markets as they see fit.

        On the upside, SEC regulators determine that Chinese volume is mostly real and KYC/AML rules are being enforced on the Chinese exchanges. With that in place, they can safely approve the ETFs.

        [–]dennisonb 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        yes I think the same. This is good news, and a step in the right direction. People might panic now, but better to stock up while you can. In one month bitcoin will be much stronger.

        [–]ATMGHOSTredditor for 1 month 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

        As someone living in China who trades on OKCoin.cn, all I can say is thank god I moved everything into my Electrum wallet ages ago.

        Thanks to the advice on this sub, I learned one absolute truth of Bitcoin: Only keep coins on exchanges as long as you need to, then GTFO. I buy and transfer off almost instantly. I used to think about day trading, but the risk just isn't worth it and, when stuff like this happens, only serves to reinforce that notion.

        [–]sreaka 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        I'm wondering if a lot of people did as you did when the exchanges announced trading fees? Do you think the PBOC is collecting data on users right now?

        [–]paulh697 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        cheap bitcoin!

        [–]fearofthedark1 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (2子コメント)

        ...this is actually a good news?

        [–]Hitchslappy 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        Short-term no (obvious price drop and might even effect SEC decision on ETF), long-term yes.

        [–]mrs_fatal 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        Yes, for further decentralization ...

        [–]givesupplz 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        Im pretty sure they blocked only on okcoin.cn, Okcoin.com withdraws seem to work fine

        [–]Chakra_Scientist 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (4子コメント)

        /tinfoil hat on The conspiracy theorist in me is thinking that insiders at the SEC and PBOC talked. US Insider gets info that the ETF is gonna be approved. Talks to chinese insider, gets exchanges to halt all withdrawals. Tanks the price. Buys up low before ETF goes live. 1 month withdrawal halt? LOL YEAH RIGHT. Maybe it sounds easier said than done, but I bet some freelancers can get the KYC implementation done in days.

        [–]Hitchslappy 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

        Except for the fact that their actions would put the chances of an ETF approval in jeopardy.

        [–]Chakra_Scientist 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (2子コメント)

        The assumption I am using is that the ETF decision has already been made prior to this exchange halting event.

        [–]Hitchslappy 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        Ah ok. Maybe. But I think it's more likely that the PBOC just want to show they can still throw their weight around when they have to.

        [–]FlappySocks 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        I'm not so sure. Wouldn't the ETF want to declare a decision quickly, to avoid it leaking?

        My thinking is they are reluctant to go ahead by leaving it so close to the wire.

        Today's events can only hurt those chances.

        [–]Filthyunderwear 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        The so-called second largest economy in the world is now paying us mind. Cheers!!

        [–]masternode 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        PBoC is serious about stopping capital flight, not just thru BTC.

        "Exclusive: Banks forced to cover tracks of China's forex regulator"

        http://in.mobile.reuters.com/article/businessNews/idINKBN14V0CN

        [–]sreaka 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        Short term it's gonna blow for price, but long term it's actually a really good thing. Shows China is serious about consumer protection and regulating a legitimate asset (Bitcoin)

        [–]drogean2 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

        about time China fucks off - the rest of the world wants to move on and all they want to do is fuck with their and OUR currencies

        [–]FlappySocks 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        It's not China's fault. It's just the way bitcoin has evolved. If too much power falls into the hands of one state, then that states actions will effect everybody.

        [–]Senojpd 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (23子コメント)

        RIP Bitcoin.

        But really this is going to be very interesting to see how the price reacts.

        [–]AstarJoe 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (1子コメント)

        I would say the fact that it bitcoin is receiving so much attention from the PBOC and how draconian they are acting is actually quite the endorsement to bitcoin's efficacy.

        Flak is heaviest over the target. Let the honeybadger do it's thing.

        [–]ItsAboutSharing 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

        Interesting, this might have an opposite affect (in time)

        [–]HeadCRasher 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (10子コメント)

        What would you do if you have coins in there?

        [–][削除されました]  (8子コメント)

        [deleted]

          [–]Viznab88 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (6子コメント)

          Most delusional thing I read all day. "Oh they can only withdraw Yuan. Guess they will just hold their BTC" Where is the logic in that? What do you think when people want to get their money out?

          Historically, what happened when other exchanges halted BTC withdrawals? Do you remember Mt.Gox? You think nobody will be scared? :)

          [–]skabaw 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (4子コメント)

          The logic is that Chinese buy BTC for Yuan, transfer abroad and convert to USD. The "withdrawal" ban means ones you buy BTC on exchange, you can't send it to your private address.

          [–]Viznab88 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

          You've got your logic twisted. They can't get their BTC out. There's no 'transferring abroad', BTC are stuck there. There's no converting to USD.

          They ban BTC withdrawals, not yuan withdrawals.

          [–]skabaw 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (2子コメント)

          The logic is correct. A Chinese has a plan: 1. Send Yuan to exchange 2. Convert Yuan to BTC (buy) 3. Transfer BTC to another exchange (like Bitstamp), i.e. BTC address -> BTC address. 4. Convert BTC to USD (sell) 5. Witdraw USD

          The operation "3." is just BTC withdrawal - the same problem as was the case of Mt.Gox.

          [–]Viznab88 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

          So you're saying exactly what I'm saying but worded it like you disagreed with me. Now I'm confused.

          Step 3 is prohibited, yes. That's what I was saying. So Chinese will be way less inclined to buy BTC because they can't transfer it to another exchange.

          [–]skabaw 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          Yes. Actually, the sell off might have also been caused by the fact that they have BTC stored on the exchange and the only way to withdraw the value (now) is by converting it to Yuan.

          On the other hand, BTC as a way to transferring Chinese money out is not a very effective method. There was a post on reddit by a guy who said that he attempted to make a business by offering transfer abroad by means of BTC. Eventually, he found out that other methods as cheap as 0.1% commission exist in China.

          Consequently, the "logic" of the ban on BTC withdrawal is not a big deal for China. It is merely, I suppose, a question of meeting AML/KYC regulations.

          [–]HeadCRasher 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          This. I would panic sell all, get my Yuan out and into another exchange in... Whenever I have one...

          [–]HeadCRasher 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          Or sell and cash out before they go to MtGox?

          [–]nattarbox 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          Sell them for yuan immediately.

          [–]HowRiskyIsDatClick 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (9子コメント)

          So far not well. But if it's legit then it's fine.

          [–]Senojpd 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (8子コメント)

          I meant in the longer term. Over the next few days/weeks/months.

          [–]HowRiskyIsDatClick 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (7子コメント)

          I would say don't worry about it

          [–]Senojpd 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (6子コメント)

          I'm not worried. In fact I'm gonna buy more.

          My point was depending on how fast the price recovers will be very telling about the overall health of bitcoin and how much it is actually relying on china.

          [–]HowRiskyIsDatClick 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (5子コメント)

          I just picked up more too at 960, I bet you we're back to $1020 by lunch.

          [–]Vaztes 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          This is just the beginning. News not even been out for an hour. We're gonna see the 800's no question.

          [–]WalterRyan 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          Why do you think this panic will be over so soon? I have no doubt its gonna recover, but it still looks like a major deal for me which takes some more time

          [–]HandcuffsOnYourMind 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

          looks like it it's going down, you would lose your bet :(

          [–]HowRiskyIsDatClick 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          $985 on Coinbase, that's not too bad.

          [–]Introshine 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (3子コメント)

          Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

          Markets:

          >"Quick, sell coins [that you can't withdraw] because Reasons™!".

          Herp. Derp.

          [–]_jstanley 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

          ???

          Sell coins that you can't withdraw, to get CNY, so that you can withdraw.

          [–]spoonXT 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          Bingo.

          [–]Cryptolution 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          CHINA BAN BITCORN!

          [–]h3rlihy 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

          Weird that they both pulled the same thing, at the same time, with no warning. F*ck that.

          [–]cryptoboy4001redditor for 24 days 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          In fairness, if you were going to impose a "no withdraw" decree, you would have to ensure the enforcement occurs simultaneously with the announcement, otherwise everyone would just withdraw their crypto before the decree came into force. Simultaneous announcements also prevent one exchange having an advantage over the other.

          I'm not saying it's right. I'm just saying, if you want be the bad guy, that's how you'd do it.

          [–]theuniverseisabrain_ 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

          ONE MONTH! Wtf they need one month for?

          [–]CONTROLurKEYSredditor for 10 days 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          Beg pboc to let them operate again

          [–]Lite_Coin_Guy 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          @PBOC

          https://cdn.meme.am/cache/instances/folder494/500x/31047494.jpg

          [–]lightlasertower 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          THIS sounds familiar............

          [–]BitcoinNL 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          HODL!

          [–]bitdoggy 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          Today China, tomorrow US and Europe.

          [–]Feelsgood767 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          How many times is this that China banned Bitcoin?

          [–]dennisonb 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (2子コメント)

          Honestly- this is a good thing. In one month the exchanges are back, finally with the blessing of the government. This seems only positive.

          [–]jjwayne 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

          I would not count on the blessing of their government. They will just find something else to 'inspect'.

          [–]dennisonb 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          True, but it's a step in the right direction. They could have banned bitcoin years ago. It's very telling that in all this time they never have, and it's totally reasonable they want to protect investors as well.

          [–]dennisonb 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          Think of it this way, in one month we will have exchanges that the PBoC are happy with. This will go a LONG WAY to making bitcoin legitimate in other countries as you could point to China as being a state where the government is involved. I suspect people will freak out for now, but in one month, people will be sad to have sold.....

          [–]theuniverseisabrain_ 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          Great. Now the price will plummet like a rock.

          [–]ridenourt 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          Sold some at 974. Maybe I can buy back in cheaper at a later date.

          Overall I think that is messed up to stop withdraws for one month on a whim. I wonder how many accounts they will confiscate.

          [–]BobAlison 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          I'm just going to throw this out there:

          ... investor confidence has been shaken as MtGox paused all withdrawal requests as they face a technical issue that has users experiencing bitcoin withdrawal delays.

          http://www.ibtimes.com/bitcoin-prices-fall-mt-gox-suspends-withdrawal-capability-citing-technical-issues-1554054

          Yes, I believe there could be more than meets the eye, and no, I'm not prone to believe everything I read about motivation from Chinese companies.

          [–]polsymtas 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          Are Bitcoin Litecoin deposits still available? Can miners still sell their coins?

          [–]bitusher 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

          https://twitter.com/WhalePanda/status/829711334568841218

          Looks like just the .cn site but the international site allows for btc withdrawls.

          [–]TweetsInCommentsBot 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          @WhalePanda

          2017-02-09 15:19 UTC

          FWIW I just withdrew #Bitcoin from @OKCoin's international site and went through very smooth.

          This message was created by a bot

          [Contact creator][Source code]

          [–]42Obits 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          One month.... then two... then three... then forever?

          [–]Nooku 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

          I was told Bitcoin can't get hacked and makes everyone their own bank.

          Yet, all Bitcoin holders their money is now stuck in China while the price is crashing.

          What the....

          [–]Jonnyb42 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          bitcoin wasn't hacked, if you keep coins in exchanges you should realize this is always a possibility, unless you have the private keys, they aren't your coins

          [–]bitn0 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          Can anyone confirm if customers on the Chinese exchanges can exchange their existing bitcoin/litecoin to fiat then cash out?

          [–]jjwayne 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          Can someone explain/guess why they're pausing BTC withdraw during the upgrade? Fiat withdraw is still possible as i understand it, so everyone laundering money will withdraw and go somewhere else.. Is it a technical reason?
          Also why did they announce it in the middle of the night (china)? Seems like this was coordinated as OkCoin and Huobi announced it at the same time. This seems shady..

          [–]kcfnrybak 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          except for a few insiders, nobody knows. You could speculate that the authorities might decide within that month to seize all bitcoins that have not been converted to Yuan? The bigger concern would be Chinese Miners. What would happen to them?

          [–]DakotaChiliBeans 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          Nothing to see here, just the Chinese government taking control of the domestic bitcoin economy one step at a time.

          [–]Fiach_Dubh 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          my two cents: PBOC is trying to modernize the regulation of bitcoin exchanges in China responsibly, without malicious intent.

          Evidence: they could have called a meeting last month, required trading fees to be added AND halted all withdrawals to upgrade KYC/AML.

          BUT they didn't. My belief is they recognize that the exchanges are fragile and are therefore introducing gradual upgrades, so as not to spook customers away from the space.

          They can and could bring out the hammer on this space in China, but that's not what this is. It's bringing out some wrenches and screws for installation of a regulatory compliance mechanism. I'm going to be buying this dip modestly.

          [–]kegman83 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          They spelled "add pboc backdoor" wrong

          [–]masternode 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          PBoC is going to force Chinese exchanges to stop BTC withdrawals all together. The only way to end capital flight from China thru BTC is to stop BTC withdrawals on these exchanges. You will still be able to speculate on price, but you get no utility out of it. All of the BTC sitting on the exchange will eventually cash out to Fiat. This is what is going to cause the impending bloodbath.

          In regards to PBoC actions towards BTC there is much more to come. Keep in mind the largest mining pools are in China.

          [–]masternode 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          Goldman Sachs calculated that cumulatively since August 2015 through November 2016, FX outflow totaled roughly US$1.1 trillion, while implied FX sales suggested by PBOC’s FX position (headline reserves after adjusted for currency valuation effect) were approximately US$630bn (US$540bn), indicating that the real rate of reserve depletion was nearly double that represented by PBOC reserve data. (attached)

          Why would China try to misrepresent the full extent of its currency outflows?

          Simple: it is an ongoing attempt by the PBOC to not precipitate the feedback loop of even further panicked selling of Yuan, even greater purchasing of Bitcoin, even more outflows, and thus, even more reserve depletion. The PBOC will simply not allow capital flight if their reserves have been and continue to take hits defending the yuan peg. This is why they are halting BTC withdrawals on Chinese exchanges, because it's the only way to stop capital flight thru BTC.

          [–]DanielWilc 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

          BTCC china is still operating as per normal, apart from margin trading?

          [–]masternode 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          I thought I read they halted withdrawals for 72 hours.

          [–]1waterhole 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

          Has this been mention by Chinese government or just the exchanges?

          コメントをもっと表示する (13 返事)