[-]Chrissibreeee 155 points (2 children)
Mom of a four year old and three year old here. They surprise me everyday, but some things that really stand out are: Their little boy brains are like predestined to gravitate towards "boy toys" such as trains and construction vehicles. I mean, sure if I give them a Barbie doll they will play with it, and enjoy movies like frozen and tangled, but if we're at the toy aisle they run to the boy section. It really has nothing to do with what I provide them with. They pick. Also, they discover themselves REALLY early. The other day my four year old says "mom, my peepee is getting big!" I say, okay that's fine. He laughs and says "it's growing big like a bean stalk!" It was hilarious. And lastly, boys are so sweet. They really do love their moms. I am constantly getting kissed and hugged and it's the best. They love dad too but when they get hurt or are sad it's right to mom no matter what. I love having boys. I think if I had little girls that are just like me I think I'd be miserable haha.
[-]Atheist101 [score hidden] - [removed] (1 children)
Holy hell you caused a shitstorm lol
[-]Chrissibreeee [score hidden] - [removed] (1 children)
Must have struck a few nerves, I guess.
[-]Atheist101 [score hidden] - [removed]
I unfortunately didn't get to see those posts but were they angry feminists yelling at you for that boy toys thing? If so I'm actually surprised the mods cracked down on their own...
[-]ZZ9_Plural_ZAlpha 64 points - [removed] (9 children)
Don't you think socialisation has a lot to do with your boys going for boy toys? As a little girl I loved playing with barbies and my favourite colours were pink and purple, even though my mum tried not to enforce gender stereotypes on me. But being exposed to ads, television, friends and family gives children a sense of which category they are supposed to feel in in society even from a young age. Biology and parenting only go so far as to shaping a child's mind. Socialisation is a huge factor too.
[-]Chrissibreeee 96 points - [removed] (3 children)
Can I be honest? No, I don't. They have choices. They pick what they watch on tv. They know how to navigate YouTube and Netflix. Some days they pick peppa pig. Some days they don't. My three year olds favorite color is purpl but he's obsessed with excavators. My husband hates sports and other typical manly stuff. I don't know why they like this stuff they just do.
[-]GoghGirl [score hidden] - [removed] (2 children)
It's very possible that you are socializing them to be gendered without even realizing it.
We start genderizing them before they are even born.
Here is an excerpt that provides reasons why your boys might be leaning to being 'boyish' depsite you not intending it to be so. Delusions of Gender was a fantastic read if you have time to read or listen to it. https://www.google.com/amp/s/sexnotgender.com/2014/02/26/excerpt-delusions-of-gender-by-cordelia-fine/amp/?client=ms-android-samsung
[-]Chrissibreeee [score hidden] - [removed] (1 children)
Well, probably. I know I'll get hate for this but whatever. Of course I genderize (is that a word?) them to a point. I mean, they were born with male parts so I gave them masculine names. I think to truely raise a child to be genderless is impossible and frankly silly. If they grow up and tell me mom I think I'm a girl, then fine. But I don't believe that a child can make that decision before even reaching puberty.
[-]maregal [score hidden] - [removed] (2 children)
Then you shouldn't be surprised that they like the gendered toys that you give them to play with.
Gender is a completely social construct, there is no such thing as a "female brain" nor a "male brain".
[-]Chrissibreeee [score hidden] - [removed]
All I was saying is that my boys have choices. I buy them toys that they pick out. They want the things that boys typically like. There's nothing wrong with that. Its surprising to me, which this thread was initially about, that in a huge selection of toys in wal mart, they want the construction vehicles and trains. I think it's fascinating. The brain does decide in utero what the gender is. Boys like certain things and girls like certain things with variations. Its cool. That's all.
[-]ctrigga [score hidden] - [removed]
Gender does not equal sex. Gender expectations and roles are a social construct. Sex is not. There are definitive biological differences in males and females that cannot be changed with hormones.
[-]efirelines [score hidden] - [removed] (1 children)
Please stop. Your one of these people who would end up forcing their boys to wear dresses, just because you wanted a girl.
[-]reagan92 [score hidden]
Your comment has been removed because:
Derailing of the topic is not permitted.
[-]alass_insane [score hidden] - [removed]
I'm confused. If your husband hates sports and other manly stuff, why do you think your sons have boy brains which are "predestined" for boy toys?
[-]Mmnicole [score hidden] - [removed] (1 children)
I loved playing with boy toys from the jump, I'm a girl
[-]PPL_93 [score hidden] - [removed]
sample size of 1
[-]piotr223 35 points - [removed] (2 children)
As a boy that grew up to be a huge gearhead, I don't think so.
I've been obsessed with cars since a very early age, to the point when one of my first words was a distorted version of the word "car". Take note that nobody in my family has a particular interest in cars.
Of course, it meant I almost exclusively played with toy cars. But I believe it was just something that clicked very well with me, not something I was conditioned to like.
[-]HellInAHamBasket [score hidden] - [removed]
Yes a lot of interests have nothing to do with socialization. My friends and I back in the day all liked doing "boy stuff". I would dream every day about being a baseball star or race car driver.
But my dad repeatedly told me, no, girls don't do that. He wouldn't let me do sports, or buy car toys. So that interest got socialized out of me.
I think too often people look at little kids who happen to be into gender-appropriate things, and go, "See, it's natural for boys like to cars!" When really there are tons of girls who like cars too.
[-]stripedpinkboxers [score hidden] - [removed] (1 children)
one of my cousins liked cars so much he cried when he saw one in a magazine.
He's a racer now.
[-]piotr223 [score hidden] - [removed] (2 children)
> one of my cousins liked cars so much he cried when he saw one in a magazine.
Was it that good? Or maybe a resurrection of a long-gone nameplate?
I'm not a racer unfortunately, but I do have a project car and have a small car-related side business.
[-]stripedpinkboxers [score hidden] - [removed] (1 children)
He was 2 or so, not very good at words yet, and he wanted to have it. He finally stopped crying when someone got scissors and cut it out for him.
It's one of my strongest/best memories of how you can draw straight lines from children to the adults they become. Kinda of how my dad sent me a sci-fi story I wrote when I was 7 or 8..
On the fortunate side of you not being a racer, having a car-related side business is much better financially than being a racer...
[-]piotr223 [score hidden] - [removed] (1 children)
> It's one of my strongest/best memories of how you can draw straight lines from children to the adults they become.
Very well put! I think you're right.
As for the financial side, it's a minor business - I print and sell stickers specific to particular old models, like the Rallye graphics for the old Peugeot 106.
Not exactly a lot of money in it, but I find it fun, particularly if I can engage with the buyer.
[-]stripedpinkboxers [score hidden] - [removed]
Eh even if it's minor, you get to meet people with similar interests which is pretty great.
And yeah it's still a very strong interest of mine. I don't have a side business related to it or anything, but I do have vague thoughts of starting a magazine that accepts submissions in Spanish.
[-]reagan92 [score hidden]
Your comment has been removed because:
Derailing of the topic is not permitted.
[-]mleftpeel [score hidden] - [removed]
I think ads/tv are less influential now in the age of Netflix. My kid never ever sees commercials because we only stream tv and movies. Maybe they really push that he play with cars/trucks/trains/dinosaurs at his daycare (though kitchen sets/dolls are available) but he really does gravitate to that stuff, which we never consciously pushed. And when he plays with dinosaurs, he doesn't pretend to feed them or rock them, he has them ride on cars and growl. When he has a baby doll he'll not really engage with it.
He sure as hell loves Frozen though :) He can sing a lot of "Let It Go" and talks about Anna and Elsa and how much he loves them.
[-]lip_twitch 23 points - [removed] (1 children)
I think socialisation amplifies it, but I think some amount of gendered interests is very natural
[-]destria [score hidden] - [removed] (1 children)
Yes because trucks and cars are such natural toys. We've been playing with them since the Stone Age!
[-]zambixi [score hidden] - [removed] (1 children)
The argument is that the different sexes have biological aptitudes for different things (IIRC with boys it's something about spacial awareness and with girls it's something about social play), and so are attracted to toys that appeal to those aptitudes. (source A, source B).
Research isn't conclusive at all (source C, and I tend to think that people grossly overestimate the influence biology but... that's the argument.
[-]Dildosinthesky [score hidden] - [removed]
Hey you dropped this :D
         )
[-]keepinitzen [score hidden] - [removed] (1 children)
So what came first? Socialisation or gender specific interests? Socialisation is based from gender specific interests not the other way around
[-]Honey-Badger [score hidden] - [removed] (2 children)
This is something people always forget with the nature/nurture argument. Surely there must be a reason we have developed a society where boys typically like machines and girls typically like dolls or whatever.
[-]Kill_Welly [score hidden] - [removed] (1 children)
Yes, because centuries of fundamentally sexist society has created a world where women and girls are expected to be nurturing home-makers and men and boys are expected to work.
[-]Honey-Badger [score hidden] - [removed] (1 children)
And the millennia before that when we were essentially troglodytes, that was also sexism?
[-]maregal [score hidden] - [removed]
A paper from nearly ten years ago agrees with your silly claims of "male brain"/"female brain". What about the countless studied done more recently that contradict those findings?
[-]transamination [score hidden] - [removed] (1 children)
Because women give birth and we give them dolls so they'll model maternal behavior. When you have a window of time in which you're confined with a pregnancy and then a baby you don't get a lot of choice of stereotype.
[-]Honey-Badger [score hidden] - [removed] (1 children)
But women have always had maternal behavior. Look at our closest relatives in the animal kingdom, all female mammals show maternal behavior without being indoctrinated with toys. We as a species didnt always have dolls and yet women showed maternal behavior. The fact that you are trying to argue that maternal behavior exists because of dolls is ludicrous.
[-]transamination [score hidden] - [removed]
I'm not arguing that maternal behavior exists because of dolls - I'm saying the opposite. The biological basis for the toy is clearly already present.
The problem, in my mind, is arguing that girls like dolls and boys like cars or whatever. Girls give birth so we get dolls. Boys don't "drive cars" or "play video games" - there's no biological basis for most of what we consider boy-stuff. Boys play with "action figures" which are dolls. Boys play dinosaurs while girls play horses. Those differences are not ingrained, they're marketed.
[-]ZizzerZazzer [score hidden] - [removed]
I'm torn on this.
My 1.5 year old has always shown a preference toward cars and trains, sports toys, and knocking things over. He lives for the garbage truck coming by.
I tried to give him a wide range of toys. He has a doll that he ignores.
Of course, this is one kid and not all kids. Also he does have influences as much as I try and mitigate it. Even cheering when he throws his ball in his hoop is rewarding him in a way.
I think it's a combination of factors and certainly children are taught that some toys are "gendered" from a young age but I don't know if that explains everything
[-]Nillix [score hidden]
Entire chain nuked from orbit for derailing. This is not the thread to argue nature vs nurture. Please stay on topic.
[-]keepinitzen -9 points - [removed] (1 children)
No, get over it
[-]reagan92 [score hidden]
Your comment has been removed because:
Disrespectful or hateful commentary is not permitted.
[-]lordperiwinkle [score hidden] - [removed]
No. When my kids were young they were not around television. They saw no ads. And they had my girl toys from my childhood to play with as well as other stuff. They liked tea parties but they certainly gravitated towards more traditional boy activities. Nurture is strong but nature is stronger. Have you ever heard the story Of David Reimer? I'm pasting a link to a video. It glosses over the darker part of the story. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bw24j0Litlc
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