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[San Francisco, California] Alcoholic roommate pooped on the bathroom floor, threatened to assault me, and is now missing work because he's hungover. I've discovered a way to get out of my lease early, but my other roommate might not be able to. (self.legaladvice)

allholy1 が 投稿

Hi everyone.

This is a slightly similar post to this one.

We had some friends over for halloween. My roommate, Kevin, got belligerent drunk and kept on hitting my butt... joking around and out of jest. I kept saying Kevin... stop, and the 6th or 7th time he did that, I caught his hand and firmly pushed it back. Kevin started screaming, slurring his words, telling me to never touch him like that again and wanted to kick my ass. My other roommate, Brian (cool chill guy), got involved and put his arms between Kevin and I. He said the only thing he had on him was his knife and was about ready to pull it out to get Kevin to stop. Though there was no physical altercation at all, I was able to go to a psychiatrist and get a letter saying that it isn't good for my health remain a tenant due to domestic violence. This works with California Civil Code 1946.7 and I am legally able to get out of the lease.

The next morning we told Kevin that this was unacceptable and we no longer want him to drink anymore. He agreed to it. He lasted a couple of weeks and begun his drinking habits again, slowly increasing over time with annoying issues occurring every time he drinks.

This past weekend, we had a friend spend the night on the couch. Kevin got super hammered, woke up in the middle of the night, and sat on our guest while he was sleeping. The next day, Sunday, Kevin got hammered again, came back slurring his words. Used the bathroom and took a dump and missed the toilet.
Monday, he missed work because he was hungover, his boss called me and asked where Kevin was (his recruiting agency found me my current job, so I worked directly with his boss in the past). No call no show. Tuesday, today, he missed work again because he was still hungover.

He's also passed out with the stove top on, with me waking up at 3am to the smell of burning of the pans on the stove top, and rushing out of my room to turn off the stove.

There are a lot of issues that I've left out, but I think I've hit the major ones.

I've let the property management know our situation and they are not allowing us to get out of the lease early. Like I said above, I am able to terminate my portion of the lease legally. Since Brian was in a way part of the altercation between Kevin and I, could he be eligible for being part of the domestic violence and get the same letter that I have? Are there any other solutions that we can do to terminate the lease?

We are all part of the lease.

Thanks for your help.

Edit: http://nhlp.org/files/Early-Lease-Termination-Toolkit-Combined-Advocates-and-.Survivors.pdf

You can break your lease by obtaining a signed document from a “qualified third party,” or a professional such as a doctor, registered nurse, psychologist, licensed clinical social worker, domestic violence or sexual assault counselor, among others. You must also sign this document.

http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/pub/15-16/bill/asm/ab_0401-0450/ab_418_bill_20150713_chaptered.html

(3) (A) Documentation from a qualified third party based on information received by that third party while acting in his or her professional capacity to indicate that the tenant or household member is seeking assistance for physical or mental injuries or abuse resulting from an act of domestic violence, sexual assault, stalking, human trafficking, elder abuse, or dependent adult abuse.
[.....]

I am licensed by the State of California as a: (insert one of the following: physician and surgeon, osteopathic physician and surgeon, registered nurse, psychiatrist, psychologist, licensed clinical social worker, licensed marriage and family therapist, or licensed professional clinical counselor.) and I am licensed by, and my license number is: (insert name of state licensing entity and license number.)

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[–]NapalmenatorQuality Contributor 13 ポイント14 ポイント  (16子コメント)

I am confused. That law requires either a protective order or police report. You have neither.

[–]BiondinaQuality Contributor 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (2子コメント)

The code OP linked to doesn't include the code as it was updated January 1, 2016. Am I reading this incorrectly, because the code in this link does include the letter from a qualified third party provision?

http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=CIV&sectionNum=1946.7

[–]NapalmenatorQuality Contributor 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I am also confused on what got enacted from that bill and when it went into effect.

[–]BiondinaQuality Contributor 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

I can tell you this, FindLaw has a bad habit of not updating their codes, etc., and that's the site OP linked. It's not a site I find very reliable, as a matter of course.

[–]allholy1[S] 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (12子コメント)

http://nhlp.org/files/Early-Lease-Termination-Toolkit-Combined-Advocates-and-.Survivors.pdf

What type of proof do I need? You must give your landlord one of the following:
* a signed document from a certain type of professional that verifies your status as a victim of abuse.

[–]xHeero 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (2子コメント)

You'd be better off posting the more relevant section from that document:

You can break your lease by obtaining a signed document from a “qualified third party,” or a professional such as a doctor, registered nurse, psychologist, licensed clinical social worker, domestic violence or sexual assault counselor, among others. You must also sign this document.

Keep in mind that document was created by the National Housing Law Project. It's not from the government. But I'd say they are probably correct. The law, on paper, doesn't seem to include the psychologist part, so you should look a little more into case law and see why the NHLP is saying that it will work with a letter from the psychologist. But assuming you can use that letter to trigger this law then you should be able to get out of it so long as you follow the correct process laid down by the law.

[–]allholy1[S] 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

So say this route does work, in terms of domestic violence and my roommate around and trying to break up a fight... would he be considered part of the domestic violence?

[–]allholy1[S] 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Whoops, thanks. I should have clarified that a bit more. This is exactly what I saw and meant.

Here's another link from a gov site:

http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/pub/15-16/bill/asm/ab_0401-0450/ab_418_bill_20150713_chaptered.html

Part II. Qualified Third Party Statement I, (insert name of qualified third party), state as follows:

My business address and phone number are:
(insert business address and phone number.)
Check and complete one of the following:
I meet the requirements for a sexual
assault counselor provided in Section 1035.2 of
the Evidence Code and I am either engaged in an
office, hospital, institution, or center
commonly known as a rape crisis center described
in that section or employed by an organization
providing the programs specified in Section
13835.2 of the Penal Code.
I meet the requirements for a domestic
violence counselor provided in Section 1037.1 of
the Evidence Code and I am employed, whether
financially compensated or not, by a domestic
violence victim service organization, as defined
in that section.
I meet the requirements for a human
trafficking caseworker provided in Section
1038.2 of the Evidence Code and I am employed,
whether financially compensated or not, by an
organization that provides programs specified in
Section 18294 of the Welfare and
Institutions Code or in Section 13835.2 of the
Penal Code.
I am licensed by the State of California as
a:
(insert one of the following: physician and
surgeon, osteopathic physician and surgeon,
registered nurse, psychiatrist, psychologist,
licensed clinical social worker, licensed
marriage and family therapist, or licensed
professional clinical counselor.) and I am
licensed by, and my license number is:
(insert name of state licensing entity and
license number.)

[–]NapalmenatorQuality Contributor 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (8子コメント)

That isn't the law. Your original link was to the legal requirements. So no, your letter won't work

Read the codes you linked to. There is no wiggle room

[–]pizzatoppings88 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (7子コメント)

Wait but it literally says that it is the law in that document:

California Civil Code 1946.7 allows certain victims of abuse who have a restraining order, a police report, or documentation from a qualified third-party to break their leases without owing additional rent. This law protects victims of:

  • Domestic violence;
  • Sexual assault;
  • Stalking;
  • Human trafficking;
  • Elder abuse; or
  • Dependent adult abuse.

The law also protects family members who live with the victim of abuse.

I guess what you're saying is that the letter doesn't count because it's from a psychiatrist and not law enforcement?

[–]NapalmenatorQuality Contributor 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (6子コメント)

The CA law does not state a qualified third party. So yeah, it doesn't count

[–]allholy1[S] 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (5子コメント)

It explains it here: http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/pub/15-16/bill/asm/ab_0401-0450/ab_418_bill_20150713_chaptered.html

(3) (A) Documentation from a qualified third party based on information received by that third party while acting in his or her professional capacity to indicate that the tenant or household member is seeking assistance for physical or mental injuries or abuse resulting from an act of domestic violence, sexual assault, stalking, human trafficking, elder abuse, or dependent adult abuse.

......

I am licensed by the State of California as a: (insert one of the following: physician and surgeon, osteopathic physician and surgeon, registered nurse, psychiatrist, psychologist, licensed clinical social worker, licensed marriage and family therapist, or licensed professional clinical counselor.) and I am licensed by, and my license number is: (insert name of state licensing entity and license number.)

[–]NapalmenatorQuality Contributor 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (4子コメント)

Ok. Still trying to see if that bill was put in to effect this year or not.

But does this apply to you

The documentation may be signed by a person who meets the requirements for a sexual assault counselor, domestic violence counselor, or a human trafficking caseworker only if the documentation displays the letterhead of the office, hospital, institution, center, or organization, as appropriate, that engages or employs, whether financially compensated or not, this counselor or caseworker. (c) The notice to terminate the tenancy shall be given within 180 days of the date that any order described in paragraph (1) of subdivision (b) was issued, within 180 days of the date that any written report described in paragraph (2) of subdivision (b) was made, or within the time period described in Section 1946.

[–]allholy1[S] 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

Awesome. How do you determine if it's in effect this year or not? We were planning on executing this in January 2017.

[–]NapalmenatorQuality Contributor 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (2子コメント)

I can't find it. Maybe someone else can. You can can your local HUD office and ask

[–]allholy1[S] 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

Ok I'll give them a call. Thanks for your help. So say we go through with this, is my roommate eligible to get the same letter I did... as in, is he also considered to be part of the domestic violence?

[–]grasshoppa1Quality Contributor 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (10子コメント)

I was able to go to a psychiatrist and get a letter saying that it isn't good for my health remain a tenant due to domestic violence. This works with California Civil Code 1946.7 and I am legally able to get out of the lease.

No it doesn't, and no you're not. Re-read that statute.

[–]allholy1[S] 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (9子コメント)

It explains it here: http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/pub/15-16/bill/asm/ab_0401-0450/ab_418_bill_20150713_chaptered.html

(3) (A) Documentation from a qualified third party based on information received by that third party while acting in his or her professional capacity to indicate that the tenant or household member is seeking assistance for physical or mental injuries or abuse resulting from an act of domestic violence, sexual assault, stalking, human trafficking, elder abuse, or dependent adult abuse.

......

I am licensed by the State of California as a: (insert one of the following: physician and surgeon, osteopathic physician and surgeon, registered nurse, psychiatrist, psychologist, licensed clinical social worker, licensed marriage and family therapist, or licensed professional clinical counselor.) and I am licensed by, and my license number is: (insert name of state licensing entity and license number.)

[–]grasshoppa1Quality Contributor 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (8子コメント)

Interesting. It does appear that bill was signed into law too.

[–]allholy1[S] 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (7子コメント)

How can you tell that it was signed into law?

[–]grasshoppa1Quality Contributor 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (6子コメント)

Here you go.

[–]allholy1[S] 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (5子コメント)

Yes thank you! So now that that bill was signed into place and active... is my roommate eligible for this since he got involved in the fight, even though it was just to break it up? Basically, is he considered to be part of the domestic violence?

[–]grasshoppa1Quality Contributor 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (4子コメント)

He would need to have a letter like you have.

[–]allholy1[S] 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (3子コメント)

Right, but in order to get that letter he needs to be part of domestic violence. Does getting inbetween a fight and breaking it up count as domestic violence?

[–]Morrowynn 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

I work as a crisis counsellor for women fleeing DV. My feelings on this are if your roommate can show he no longer feels safe in his home because of what happened with your roommate he should qualify with a letter of support.

I'm in Canada so things may not be the same but domestic violence protection should apply to all individuals living in a home together.

Good luck and stay safe OP.

[–]grasshoppa1Quality Contributor 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

That's depends on what his counselor or psychologist says, I suppose.

[–]rvaducks 12 ポイント13 ポイント  (1子コメント)

This whole thread is surreal.

Poster: OP, you're a big dummy. You can't use a doctor's note to get out of a lease.

OP: But this explains it...

Poster: Well how 'bout that. I was wrong.

[–]allholy1[S] 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Thanks. I've done so much research on this situation. I'm glad I was able to teach some people some new things. The law seems pretty new so I understand that people might not have known about it. I'm glad I did all the research myself before being discouraged by coming in here.

[–]ExpiresAfterUseQuality Contributor 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

That isn't at all what CCC 1946.7 says. You are completely wrong.

[–]allholy1[S] 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (0子コメント)

It explains it here: http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/pub/15-16/bill/asm/ab_0401-0450/ab_418_bill_20150713_chaptered.html

(3) (A) Documentation from a qualified third party based on information received by that third party while acting in his or her professional capacity to indicate that the tenant or household member is seeking assistance for physical or mental injuries or abuse resulting from an act of domestic violence, sexual assault, stalking, human trafficking, elder abuse, or dependent adult abuse.

......

I am licensed by the State of California as a: (insert one of the following: physician and surgeon, osteopathic physician and surgeon, registered nurse, psychiatrist, psychologist, licensed clinical social worker, licensed marriage and family therapist, or licensed professional clinical counselor.) and I am licensed by, and my license number is: (insert name of state licensing entity and license number.)

[–]ChemPossible 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (5子コメント)

Wait--did your landlord actually ACCEPT this letter and agree to let you out of your lease?

Because no. A doctors note holds no legal sway here.

[–]allholy1[S] 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (4子コメント)

Not yet. I haven't thrown that card yet.

It explains it here: http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/pub/15-16/bill/asm/ab_0401-0450/ab_418_bill_20150713_chaptered.html

(3) (A) Documentation from a qualified third party based on information received by that third party while acting in his or her professional capacity to indicate that the tenant or household member is seeking assistance for physical or mental injuries or abuse resulting from an act of domestic violence, sexual assault, stalking, human trafficking, elder abuse, or dependent adult abuse.

......

I am licensed by the State of California as a: (insert one of the following: physician and surgeon, osteopathic physician and surgeon, registered nurse, psychiatrist, psychologist, licensed clinical social worker, licensed marriage and family therapist, or licensed professional clinical counselor.) and I am licensed by, and my license number is: (insert name of state licensing entity and license number.)

[–]ChemPossible 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (3子コメント)

You can certainly try it but there's a good chance your landlord will choose to take their chance in court rather than accept a doctor's note.

[–]allholy1[S] 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (2子コメント)

The big question is, is my roommate part of the domestic violence since he broke up the fight? He literally wanted to pull a knife out to stop it from happening.

[–]ChemPossible 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

No. He would have to go get his own doctor's note.

[–]allholy1[S] 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Right, he would have to. It is considered domestic violence against me, but is it considered domestic violence against him too since he tried to break up the fight and got involved?

[–]DevilGuy 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (4子コメント)

Your information is wrong, you need a restraining order against him to break your lease, a doctor's note is not enough in California.

[–]allholy1[S] 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (3子コメント)

It explains it here: http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/pub/15-16/bill/asm/ab_0401-0450/ab_418_bill_20150713_chaptered.html

(3) (A) Documentation from a qualified third party based on information received by that third party while acting in his or her professional capacity to indicate that the tenant or household member is seeking assistance for physical or mental injuries or abuse resulting from an act of domestic violence, sexual assault, stalking, human trafficking, elder abuse, or dependent adult abuse.

......

I am licensed by the State of California as a: (insert one of the following: physician and surgeon, osteopathic physician and surgeon, registered nurse, psychiatrist, psychologist, licensed clinical social worker, licensed marriage and family therapist, or licensed professional clinical counselor.) and I am licensed by, and my license number is: (insert name of state licensing entity and license number.)

[–]DevilGuy 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (2子コメント)

ah that's new, I haven't rented in years but it does appear that way since 2015.

[–]allholy1[S] 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (1子コメント)

The big question is, is my roommate part of the domestic violence since he broke up the fight? He literally wanted to pull a knife out to stop it from happening.

[–]DevilGuy 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

yeah that struck me as sort of weird, I don't think he'd be considered part of it as he was a third party that intervened. He might be able to claim some sort of mental duress from having to babysit a potentially violent handsey drunk all the time but IDK IANAL.

[–]burn_the_turn 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (2子コメント)

I highly doubt you meet the qualifications for domestic violence.
"Domestic violence is the willful intimidation, physical assault, battery, sexual assault, and/or other abusive behavior as part of a systematic pattern of power and control". Perhaps your landlord won't investigate and will just let you go, but your shrink is risking their license with this false claim of domestic violence (assuming you told them the same thing you told us).

[–]allholy1[S] 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

"Abusive behavior" is very vague. What about verbal abuse? That's part of domestic violence. He literally threatened to kick my ass. Between the verbal abuse, and literally shit being on the bathroom floor from him pooping on the ground, I might have grounds for not only domestic violence but also unsafe living conditions.

[–]madfer 0 ポイント1 ポイント  (0子コメント)

Tenants don't have grounds for unsafe living conditions when they create those conditions themselves. In fact you and your roommates will be responsible for any damages created as a result of those actions.