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Quality PostClinton Archipelago [1600 x 952] (i.sli.mg)

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[–]caffiend98 1138 ポイント1139 ポイント  (104子コメント)

This is pretty fascinating... cities are dense, yo.

[–]Minsc__and__Boo 1010 ポイント1011 ポイント  (40子コメント)

Semi-relevant: http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/heatmap.png

[–]VascoDegama7 158 ポイント159 ポイント  (38子コメント)

very relevant xkcd

[–]DvigubaiPiktas 279 ポイント280 ポイント  (36子コメント)

Not very relevant. The map does not show the quantity of Cliton voters, it just show the percentage of total voters that voted for Clinton. So in this case actually more densely inhabited areas are more likely to vote for Clinton.

[–]VascoDegama7 122 ポイント123 ポイント  (24子コメント)

true but the correlation between democratic voters and population density is pretty high

[–]MilkTaoist 115 ポイント116 ポイント  (1子コメント)

It looks like a population heatmap, but it's one step removed - the XKCD examples don't demonstrate a similar correlation. They don't give you any info that you wouldn't get from population data, whereas this map is a useful visualization of the tendency for cities to vote democratic.

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    [–]gumol 13 ポイント14 ポイント  (0子コメント)

    It doesn't, it shows the percentage of people that voted for Clinton if the percentage was greater than 50%.

    [–]ggtsu_00 67 ポイント68 ポイント  (8子コメント)

    Fun-fact, a map with percentage of population with at least a bachelor's degrees would look near identical.

    There are many things that correlate with population density.

    [–]aPocketofResistance 14 ポイント15 ポイント  (1子コメント)

    The FBI crime frequency map is nearly identical.

    [–]izixs 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Duh, where there's more people capable of committing crimes, all else being equal, there will be more crime. The important statistic to look at if you're trying to make an argument about the people in those locations is the crime rate, not the total crime.

    [–]immi-ttorney 30 ポイント31 ポイント  (1子コメント)

    I remember when Clinton won the deep south against Bernie, and it was all about "Clinton really connects with 'real people'!" When Clinton lost the south to Trump, it became "Those people are stupid hicks, what do they know?!"

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      [–]PaperCutsYourEyes 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

      The more densely populated an area the more likely to vote for the Democrat.

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          [–]pepperman7 160 ポイント161 ポイント  (51子コメント)

          Reminding me of a recent awesome video

          [–]Jushak 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (5子コメント)

          It would be nice if this kind of future came faster. In the city where I live right now, the public transport is great - in the rare case when I even need to use it, since most of the stuff I need is within a quick walking distance already.

          In my hometown... Not so. You can get anywhere by bike which is all well and good - until winter comes. At which point you really feel the lack of public transport.

          [–]SquarePegRoundWorld 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (4子コメント)

          Not so. You can get anywhere by bike which is all well and good - until winter comes. At which point you really feel the lack of public transport.

          I found it interesting that all the shots this guy put together there was not a single one of people biking/walking in bad weather.

          [–]icecubesbones 86 ポイント87 ポイント  (30子コメント)

          Thank you for sharing this video.

          As someone who has just recently transitioned from a very rural area, to a blossoming city with actual public transportation; I'm in love. I'm not ditching my car yet, but biking and the light rail are so easy and fun. When people ask me about my move, I tend to tell them about my lack of driving, and that's about it. It's just increased my happiness so damn much!!

          [–]DiscordantCalliope 118 ポイント119 ポイント  (19子コメント)

          >biking and the light rail are so easy and fun

          What kind of horribly optimistic robot are you

          [–]icecubesbones 43 ポイント44 ポイント  (9子コメント)

          Haha, I know I sound that way right now, because my experiences are based on my fun trips to the grocery store, concerts, movies, friend's houses, but not commuting to a job. This may change in the very near future when my savings are depleted though...

          I like the exercise of biking, and I like browsing Reddit on the light rail while not having to deal with the fucking asshats who attempt to drive cars.

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                  [–]eternal_septuagint 479 ポイント480 ポイント  (18子コメント)

                  I'd love to see the "didn't vote" landmass

                  [–]Van_ae 501 ポイント502 ポイント  (23子コメント)

                  Origianal post: TrumpLand and Clinton Archipelago

                  http://www.vividmaps.com/2016/12/trumpland-and-clinton-archipelago.html

                  [–]Shatbird 320 ポイント321 ポイント  (10子コメント)

                  And the much nicer original that OP "was inspired" by: http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/11/16/us/politics/the-two-americas-of-2016.html

                  [–]1agomorph 116 ポイント117 ポイント  (6子コメント)

                  The NYT version is more developed but they each have their merits. OP's has population percentage voters shown as topography. That's a cool addition which the NYT version doesn't have.

                  Edit: percentage voters, not population.

                  [–]TheCastro 18 ポイント19 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                  The nyt versions fit together. The other ones have gaps.

                  [–]c32020 31 ポイント32 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                  Because the NYT ones show everywhere, based on whether Trump or Clinton won. These ones only shows where either Trump or Clinton got over 50% of the vote.

                  Somewhere that went 48% Clinton and 43% Trump would show up in NYT and not in these.

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                      [–]TheChoke 16 ポイント17 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                      Why are the "islands" smaller than the "lakes?"

                      [–]Angzt 28 ポイント29 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                      Because both only start at >=51%. If an area was dead even, or had (e.g.) 48% Dem, 49% Rep, 3% 3rd Party, it would be sea in both maps.

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                        [–]mrtomjones 28 ポイント29 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                        This makes so much more sense....

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                          [–]Limabean93 275 ポイント276 ポイント  (219子コメント)

                          What percent of national population is this?

                          [–]theruins 534 ポイント535 ポイント  (202子コメント)

                          She got about 48% to Trumps ~46%.

                          [–]Limabean93 245 ポイント246 ポイント  (69子コメント)

                          I meant total population of the archipelago.

                          [–]ImpiusEst 132 ポイント133 ポイント  (53子コメント)

                          Since noone replied with the answere to your comment yet. Archipelago has a population of 174 million.

                          This has 148 million.

                          [–]MisterAdair 103 ポイント104 ポイント  (47子コメント)

                          Looks like what the US will be if we keep electing morons that appoint climate change deniers.

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                            [–]Brystvorter 131 ポイント132 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                            That'll take a while to figure out, you'll have to look at county population data and match to the map.

                            [–]stanleypup 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                            This comment links to a very similar article by the New York Times that has the population of it in there.

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                              [–][削除されました]  (117子コメント)

                              [removed]

                                [–]StoneColdCrazzzy 14 ポイント15 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                so Clinton got ~27% of the vote and Trump ~26% of the eligible to vote population.

                                [–]_BigWill 129 ポイント130 ポイント  (108子コメント)

                                If they wanted their voices heard they should of voted.

                                [–]ffca 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                I come from a huge family of immigrants. My paternal extended family are all based in NY state. As legal immigrants with successful careers, they naturally embraced Trump. Most of them didn't vote. Trump was never going to win NY, and probably not NJ either.

                                I kept hearing that sentiment for both sides after the election. Additionally, if you were Republican in a deeply Republican state, you still had no incentive to vote. Same for Dems in Democrat states. The 50/50 states are where it's at.

                                If every vote counted (popular vote wins) I wonder how everything would have turned out. I abstained.

                                [–]PM_ME_UR_DOGGOS 174 ポイント175 ポイント  (64子コメント)

                                It's possible that not voting is how they wanted their voices to be heard. Abstaining is a valid choice.

                                [–]Tinjubhy 89 ポイント90 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                                I think that adding a "none of the Above" option to the ballet would be a good way to quantify abstaining voters. It makes it easier to see why people didn't want to vote. It would probably also generate more talk about the issue.

                                [–]Consirius 203 ポイント204 ポイント  (29子コメント)

                                The problem is that abstention gets lumped into the numbers with those who are too busy/lazy/etc. to vote. A better way to get your voice heard in that way is vote for someone else like Vermin Supreme or Mickey Mouse or your High School Science teacher. It at least gives a more tangible number to assign to the disenfranchised voters.

                                [–]RadioFreeCascadia 63 ポイント64 ポイント  (19子コメント)

                                There where close to 100k ballots cast in Michigan alone that filled in all of the ballot except the president.

                                [–]LikeThereNeverWas 34 ポイント35 ポイント  (12子コメント)

                                And Trump won Michigan by like 13k

                                [–]Jushak 133 ポイント134 ポイント  (11子コメント)

                                Shame that the Democrats ran such a shitty candidate.

                                [–]ReducedToRubble 40 ポイント41 ポイント  (9子コメント)

                                I keep trying to point this out, but Hillary supporters don't want to hear it:

                                She turned Michigan against her in 2008 when she tried to steal the vote. It's no surprise that it went to Bernie by a record upset in the primary, then trump in the General.

                                Like Colin Powell said, these 'character minefields' always come back to bite Hillary in the ass, but she doesn't learn.

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                                    [–]Umutuku 16 ポイント17 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                    That's all well and good until people actually do it and your president wears three boots now.

                                    [–]Yoshih9 19 ポイント20 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                    I, for one, welcome our new three-boot wearing overlord.

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                                        [–]canuck1701 14 ポイント15 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                        Not when there's downballot votes as well.

                                        [–]ProgrammingPants 16 ポイント17 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                        Not voting is not making your voice heard. It is silence. It makes governmental leaders wonder if maybe you don't have a voice to earn in the first place, not try to earn your (maybe existent) voice.

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                                          [–]kaesekopf 30 ポイント31 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                          heard they should of voted

                                          heard they should have voted

                                          ftfy

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                                              [–]jonpaladin 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (8子コメント)

                                              that percentage of popular vote, totally not national population

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                                                [–]NotWithoutIncident 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                I like how nobody is actually answering your question. From this article featuring the original map, Clinton's land has 174 million and Trump's has 148 million.

                                                [–]chomstar 38 ポイント39 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                                                Assuming you're referring to only the people in these areas that voted, ~28%.

                                                Math: Total US population is 318,900,000. Voting eligible population is 58.6%. Clinton popular vote percentage is 48%.

                                                Caveat: Pretty sure this map doesn't account for Clinton votes in areas where Trump won, so the real number is significantly lower than my estimate.

                                                Edit: Well, the map does show the voting heat indices, but I'm not good enough at math to figure out how to account for them.

                                                [–]no_talent_ass_clown 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                Oh my god I did not understand this map of the US until I read your comment.

                                                [–]PingInDaNorf 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                54% Clinton

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                                                  [–]tittysprinkles112 90 ポイント91 ポイント  (29子コメント)

                                                  Correct me if Im wrong, but I'm pretty sure that tiny dot south of Sioux Island is Vermillion, where the University of South Dakota is. It's interesting to see how a university can change voting.

                                                  [–]erty3125 63 ポイント64 ポイント  (8子コメント)

                                                  you can tie tons of the smaller islands that are isolated to being nearby to universities

                                                  [–]kmacdowell 24 ポイント25 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                                                  Well universities are usually in cities too.

                                                  [–]burritolocopants 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                  Vermillion isn't a city, it is a tiny college town of about 10,000 on the Missouri River.

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                                                    [–]royalhawk345 23 ポイント24 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                    Champaign (south of Chicago, or "cook mountain") is the university of Illinois. The area is extremely rural, two hours from any decent sized city, but the university is nearly fifty thousand students and employees most of whom are liberal.

                                                    [–]Eudaimonics 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                    Young people tend to be liberal. Particularly socially liberal and therefore support the socially liberal party. Also tends to be more white collared jobs which also skews liberal.

                                                    The only reason Trump was able to win because he wasn't the typical Republican Bible thumper.

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                                                      [–]Shankbucket 207 ポイント208 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                                                      I thought this was originally some remote pacific archipelago that was randomly polled. Took a good 30 seconds to figure out its my own country....

                                                      [–]spec1alsnowflake 23 ポイント24 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                      This doubles as a Pokemon density map

                                                      [–]HarambeSniper 183 ポイント184 ポイント  (39子コメント)

                                                      This is cool. I like this.

                                                      [–]jwumb0 18 ポイント19 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                      Would make for an interesting CIV map

                                                      [–]r_fitness_only 63 ポイント64 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                      Too much Salt Resources

                                                      [–]Sylvester_Scott 1675 ポイント1676 ポイント  (632子コメント)

                                                      Acreage doesn't vote. People do.

                                                      [–]chrisman01 683 ポイント684 ポイント  (428子コメント)

                                                      However, the reason this looks so drastic is because people in cities live in completely different economic and cultural environments than someone rural does.

                                                      Take my home state of Maine for example. Most people outside of Cumberland County, where Portland is, love hunting, fishing, gun culture, and depend on agricultural and factory jobs (eg mills) or don't mind commuting long distances for other jobs. Most are extremely conservative.

                                                      Portland, on the other hand, is trying to be a modern city. Most people in Cumberland County want to work in offices, live in an urban area, and are generally against gun ownership. Portland is very, very liberal.

                                                      Everything from drug regulation to taxes, if you ask someone in Portland a question then ask someone from the Millinocket area, you would get two very different answers, because they're two very different cultures.

                                                      Yet Cumberland and a few other counties, while being incredibly tiny, have massive amounts of pull over the rest of us that have a completely different way of life. They greatly affect local politics, and ensured Hillary got 3 of our 4 electoral votes.

                                                      [–]T3C_Illuzion 17 ポイント18 ポイント  (8子コメント)

                                                      I don't get your point. Are you saying that because they live within a smaller area their vote should count for less?

                                                      [–]Fascists_Blow 185 ポイント186 ポイント  (121子コメント)

                                                      Because they're only tiny in size. Population wise they dominate.

                                                      And this election was an excellent example of the rural population getting to decide for the majority despite fewer votes, much like the 2000 election.

                                                      [–]RadioFreeCascadia 63 ポイント64 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                      Trump drew heavily from the Suburbs, not just rural areas. He just won rural white areas at a rate far higher then ever before (akin to the Democrat percentage in black areas).

                                                      [–]Touchedmokey 88 ポイント89 ポイント  (114子コメント)

                                                      I'd argue an implicit function of the Electoral College was to make sure a politician who didn't appeal to the rural/suburban population would have a hard time getting elected to preside over them

                                                      It was a pretty canny move, given how different the needs of urban and rural communities are

                                                      [–]Murrabbit 29 ポイント30 ポイント  (5子コメント)

                                                      I'd argue an implicit function of the Electoral College was to make sure a politician who didn't appeal to the rural/suburban population would have a hard time getting elected to preside over them.

                                                      Weren't no burbs in the 1780s, bruh. You're sort of on point with the rural/urban divide, though at the time it was actually a way of transferring the south's hard-fought 3/5ths compromise regarding representation in congress greater than the size of their voting population into presidential politics, as well. The 3/5ths compromise and slavery as an institution are long gone now, of course, and maybe it's time we really re-examined why we still have the electoral college.

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                                                          [–]hauskeeper 44 ポイント45 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                          I live in Vermont, which is also very rural and there's a lot of people who hunt and fish and work blue collar jobs and Hillary won all but one county. Saying that blue collar people who love fishing and hunting must be conservatives is a drastic oversimplification.

                                                          Also, the counties you mentioned that have more pull do so because they have more people. If the counties in Maine worked like the electoral college for all votes, a vote on taxes for example could pass if it benefits the people in the less populated counties even if it hurt the people in the more populated counties. If this was the case it could have a negative impact on more people than actually benefited from it. This doesn't mean that people in less densely populated areas deserve to get screwed over, but all an electoral system does is give a smaller number of people the chance to screw over a larger number of people, which doesn't make any sense.

                                                          [–]bobbyfiend 95 ポイント96 ポイント  (14子コメント)

                                                          Portland is very, very liberal

                                                          Your penchant for understatement is to be applauded.

                                                          Edit: Yes, I'm an idiot and /u/chrisman01 was clearly talking about Portland, Maine and I confused it with Portland, Oregon, and I totally know that Portlan, OR is in Multnomah County, so the "Cumberland" should have tipped me off, but it didn't.

                                                          I have no idea how liberal any part of Maine is. However, growing up in the Pacific Northwest, I was constantly aware of the glaring political divide between the rural parts of Washington and Oregon and the Seattle and Portland metropolitan areas, so this comment seemed to fit... aaaaaaand I turned my brain off.

                                                          Damn you, peripheral route!

                                                          [–]arrotz 186 ポイント187 ポイント  (13子コメント)

                                                          Not that Portland, ME isn't liberal, but it sounds like you may be conflating it with Portland, OR, the place where liberals grow on trees (hugging them, of course).

                                                          [–]ProgrammingPants 39 ポイント40 ポイント  (12子コメント)

                                                          Yet Cumberland and a few other counties, while being incredibly tiny, have massive amounts of pull over the rest of us that have a completely different way of life. They greatly affect local politics, and ensured Hillary got 3 of our 4 electoral votes.

                                                          So the rest of Oregon Maine, while being incredibly tiny in terms of how many people actually fucking live there, should have massive amounts of pull over the rest of the population, which outnumbers them?

                                                          [–]Cran-baisins 20 ポイント21 ポイント  (6子コメント)

                                                          He was talking about Portland Maine, though your point is still valid, just change Cumberland County to the Multnomah Valley.

                                                          [–]ProgrammingPants 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                                          I blame stupid city namers for not coming up with unique names for each city.

                                                          [–]RadioFreeCascadia 13 ポイント14 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                          It was almost Boston, but Portland won the coin flip.

                                                          [–]Kanyes_PhD 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                          I'd blame the Oregon city for that then, as I assume Portland, Maine was settled first.

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                                                              [–]ipiranga 473 ポイント474 ポイント  (245子コメント)

                                                              Yet Cumberland and a few other counties, while being incredibly tiny, have massive amounts of pull over the rest of us

                                                              So you hate democracy?

                                                              If 9 people live in one area and 1 person lives in another, he should have as much power as all nine of them?

                                                              What about those people's rights?

                                                              Your comment is literally a sob story about how nice "rural people are" and how those big mean "city people" have more power than they do because gasp there are more of them and that's how voting works: the majority gets more say.

                                                              [–]AsterJ 454 ポイント455 ポイント  (147子コメント)

                                                              "Democracy should be more than 2 wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for dinner"

                                                              [–]ProgrammingPants 311 ポイント312 ポイント  (84子コメント)

                                                              From the other perspective: "Democracy should be more than one wolf and a two lambs voting for what's for dinner, but the fuckin wolf gets to decide what's for dinner anyway."

                                                              [–]aquaknox 122 ポイント123 ポイント  (72子コメント)

                                                              This is basically the justification for federalism. If you let the rural areas and the urban areas both make their own rules without forcing them on each other then it doesn't usually matter if they have different interests. For instance, it makes perfect sense to me that many cities ban guns and that most rural municipalities do not.

                                                              [–]NathanWoodfield 99 ポイント100 ポイント  (60子コメント)

                                                              Democrats have really shot themselves in the foot over gun control issue

                                                              [–]JayhawkRacer 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                              I've never really cared about that issue, but from a purely strategic perspective, you're right. They should really re-frame the argument to be about poverty and violence in general rather than guns. Get kids into after school programs (funding needed) to keep them out of gangs. Give families the money they need to know where their next meal is coming from and so they can make rent this month (funding needed). Stop making it about the guns and make it about education and opportunity. Gun violence is far more prevalent in areas of low income and low economic mobility. Do something about the cause(poverty), not the effects (guns).

                                                              Obviously there will still be a debate, but it won't be as heated as taking away people's guns.

                                                              [–]xSOCIALx 32 ポイント33 ポイント  (47子コメント)

                                                              I'm generally a liberal person: have never voted for a Republican in a presidential election but I do own hand guns (i.e. don't pretend I hunt). I think the Democrats are very wrong on this issue and alienate a large portion of the electorate with their stance.

                                                              [–]kingrootintootin 65 ポイント66 ポイント  (46子コメント)

                                                              Except Democrats as a whole don't want to ban guns, or even institute major gun control laws. There's a few out there that do, but the majority just want stricter background checks and other reasonable policies.

                                                              But nope, the entire party is painted as "they want to take my guns away!" which is super convenient for Republicans despite their many other rural-unfriendly policies

                                                              [–]Drumlin 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                              Former resident of Chicago, and still current resient of Illinois.

                                                              Illinois Democrats definitely want to take your guns away. All of them.

                                                              [–]captainant 57 ポイント58 ポイント  (38子コメント)

                                                              Uhhh, Clinton was saying repeatedly that Australia was a model she'd like to apply to the USA, which is literally taking away guns.

                                                              [–]xSOCIALx 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                              I can't explain why certain people support certain policies, most of it doesn't make sense to me. You're also correct in the sense that politics is generally too much nuance for a lot of people to understand, apparently.

                                                              I'm just saying that I'm a liberal city dweller, well educated, high income, drive an electric car and I love handguns. I enjoy target shooting, I enjoy the security of having them for home defense. As far as "reasonable" gun control measures, I don't buy assault weapons so I don't worry about that much but I do know that for handguns there are magazine limits in CA and MA (at least, I'm not an NRA member so I don't know the full talking points). I'm not sure of the logic behind telling someone they can fire 11 rounds (10+1) but not 12.

                                                              My personal opinion is that many gun control progressives live in very safe parts of wealthy cities and would probably not live in some of the neighborhoods I lived in growing up (or, admittedly, as part of gentrification while an adult). It's all based on personal experience and I'm smart enough to realize we don't all share the same ones, thus I'm not trying to legislate away other people's rights.

                                                              Anyway, I generally don't support Republicans because even though I'm more fiscally conservative than average, I'm socially liberal and would rather see Democrats fuck up fiscal policy (from my perspective) than Republicans fuck up social policies.

                                                              [–]Wartz 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                              stricter background checks and other reasonable policies.

                                                              Define reasonable.

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                                                                  [–]fakenate28 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                  Federalism really sucks for rural voters in big states though.

                                                                  Even though all the spinach and produce you eat is grown in California, the spinach lobby is shit in Washington. Where as the corn lobby is influential because of Iowa.

                                                                  Imagine we got rid of federalism. America would probably be a lot less fat because the corn growers wouldn't have subsidies on corn and put corn syrup in every foodstuff. The spinach lobby would be bigger and more influential.

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                                                                      [–]Upthrust 37 ポイント38 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                      The electoral college doesn't do that, it just shifts who the wolves are.

                                                                      [–]Isord 19 ポイント20 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                                      Sure and that's what the senate is for.

                                                                      [–]ipiranga 64 ポイント65 ポイント  (28子コメント)

                                                                      should be more

                                                                      Then what should it be?

                                                                      If either 9 people or 1 person is getting screwed, I would hope that 9 times out of 10 the 9 people get their way because that's what's fair.

                                                                      [–]bolj 125 ポイント126 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                      Holy fuck, everyone in America needs to learn some math and look at something called "social choice theory". It's not just proportional or the system we have; voting can literally take on infinitely many different forms.

                                                                      There seem to be two sides arguing here, and I'm not picking on you in particular. But felt this comment needed to be put somewhere.

                                                                      [–]TOO_DAMN_FAT 27 ポイント28 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                      There seem to be two sides arguing here, and I'm not picking on you in particular.

                                                                      They are also arguing ridiculous, absurd examples and applying those to the real world and they fall apart. I'd comment more on them but I don't want to engage in a silly argument.

                                                                      [–]TheSystem_IsDown 15 ポイント16 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                      You want 9 out of 10 to get their way in a 9/10 system, while arguing for 10/10. Replace 9/10 with 6/10 and you see the problem.

                                                                      [–]Vecusum 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                      That's not how fairness works.

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                                                                          [–]bookerTmandela 12 ポイント13 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                          Don't do that. The person made cogent observations of the tension between rural and urban citizens. There was no value judgement in anything they said, they simply pointed out facts. Whatever side a person falls on, this is the exact kind of discussion that should be encouraged.

                                                                          [–]ZeronicX 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                                                          Yeah but its not 9/10 split in america its 4 guys arguing with the other 4 guys while 2 guys abstain completly,

                                                                          [–]Touchedmokey 62 ポイント63 ポイント  (32子コメント)

                                                                          Actually, it's one of those checks and balances we're famous for

                                                                          Nobody can get elected on urban or rural support alone. To get elected to the higher office, you have to appeal to both

                                                                          The point being made above isn't that urban communities are mean, but that they don't sympathize with rural perspective

                                                                          [–]thisisnewt 75 ポイント76 ポイント  (10子コメント)

                                                                          Well that's not true.

                                                                          If one candidate only gets rural support and one candidate only gets urban support, one of them is still going to get elected.

                                                                          [–]Touchedmokey 66 ポイント67 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                                                                          Trump had surprisingly high percentages in several urban centers in swing states

                                                                          He made an appeal to the correct urban communities that felt Trump sufficiently represented them.

                                                                          Trump did not have to make much of an appeal to Democratic bulwarks (which happen to be urban) much like how Clinton didn't need to appeal to Republican bulwarks (which happen to be rural).

                                                                          [–]24Aids37 35 ポイント36 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                                          Clinton failed to attempt to appeal to Democratic bulwarks which pushed enough of them over to Trump.

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                                                                                    [–]rderekp 85 ポイント86 ポイント  (69子コメント)

                                                                                    Acreage gets more weight in the vote though.

                                                                                    [–]Manadox 129 ポイント130 ポイント  (62子コメント)

                                                                                    Not acreage, but states. Each state gets a guaranteed minimum amount of representation regardless of acreage or population.

                                                                                    [–]Golden_Kumquat 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                                                                    In this case, though, it didn't make much of a difference. Trump ended up winning 7 of the 10 most populous states.

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                                                                                        [–]GammaGames 31 ポイント32 ポイント  (60子コメント)

                                                                                        Do you have a version for Trump?

                                                                                        [–]llamasR4life 109 ポイント110 ポイント  (28子コメント)

                                                                                        https://i.imgur.com/Ab0Hc0K.jpg

                                                                                        [–]llamasR4life 59 ポイント60 ポイント  (18子コメント)

                                                                                        On one of the original threads commenters figured out that Phoenix is probably the largest remaining city.

                                                                                        [–]Golden_Kumquat 25 ポイント26 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                        It helps a lot that Maricopa County contains both the city and suburbs of Phoenix.

                                                                                        [–]BULLZEYE420 31 ポイント32 ポイント  (13子コメント)

                                                                                        probably because Trump was hardline on illegal immigration, and Pheonix has a relatively low black population compared to somewhere comparable like Dallas or Houston perhaps to prevent the down ballot (D) skew.

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                                                                                          [–]localbizdude 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                          New York's narrows and Connecticut straits. Very creative

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                                                                                            [–]an_angry_dave 39 ポイント40 ポイント  (6子コメント)

                                                                                            https://i.sli.mg/efqo9B.jpg

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                                                                                              [–]NikkiHaley 197 ポイント198 ポイント  (22子コメント)

                                                                                              Yay, I live on land

                                                                                              [–]poompt 25 ポイント26 ポイント  (18子コメント)

                                                                                              I live in the abyss. I'm guessing it's kinda like sunless sea?

                                                                                              [–]SuperSMT 116 ポイント117 ポイント  (16子コメント)

                                                                                              You live here

                                                                                              [–]camly75 49 ポイント50 ポイント  (11子コメント)

                                                                                              I live in the sea on both maps somehow.

                                                                                              [–]RipatNayalam 48 ポイント49 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                                                              Maybe you actually do live in the sea

                                                                                              [–]SuperSMT 23 ポイント24 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                              Your county probably had no majority win

                                                                                              [–]geraldodelrivero 11 ポイント12 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                                                                              Maybe a third party candidate somehow won your county.

                                                                                              [–]Upthrust 23 ポイント24 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                              Or third party candidates were popular enough to keep both of them below 50%

                                                                                              [–]SuperSMT 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                              Nope, no counties went third party (and none have since Ross Perot, who won only 15)

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                                                                                                      [–]SkittlesDLX 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                                                                      Is Travis Island supposed Austin Tx? I thought it was further east, and I figured it be bigger.

                                                                                                      [–]SnowdensOfYesteryear 53 ポイント54 ポイント  (30子コメント)

                                                                                                      I'm quite surprised by Mississippi to be honest

                                                                                                      [–]Manadox 126 ポイント127 ポイント  (10子コメント)

                                                                                                      High black population.

                                                                                                      [–]Kindness4Weakness 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                                                                      But look at Houston compared to Austin (Harris island vs Travis island, respectively). Houston is the 4th largest metropolis in the country and much "blacker" than Austin. Granted Austin is known as the most liberal city in Texas, but it's also very white. I'm not disagreeing with you, just pointing out something interesting.

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                                                                                                        [–]vaderhader1 72 ポイント73 ポイント  (5子コメント)

                                                                                                        The area in question is largely populated by African Americans. If you look at a map of plantations in the south back in the 1850's you will see it lines up with the African American Population and Democratic voters.

                                                                                                        [–]The_Dukes 78 ポイント79 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                                                                                                        And if you go further back it lines up with the geology of that area from millennia ago when the seas retreated and deposited fertile silt in that region that would later be used to grow cotton.

                                                                                                        [–]JoshH21 12 ポイント13 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                                                                        This is always bought up on reddit when the black belt is mentioned. It never ceases to amaze me how interesting it is

                                                                                                        [–]SWIMsfriend 9 ポイント10 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                        me too. although its odd hearing people talk about it on the kung fu and karate subreddits

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                                                                                                              [–]Navar4477 12 ポイント13 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                              I wonder what kinds of Pokémon I'll find there!

                                                                                                              [–]AshleyYakeley 5 ポイント6 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                                                                              Where's Hawai'i?

                                                                                                              [–]GunPoison 47 ポイント48 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                              In the Pacific Ocean.

                                                                                                              No need to thank me, you're welcome.

                                                                                                              [–]FC37 48 ポイント49 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                              This leaves out a literal archipelago that voted overwhelmingly for Clinton...

                                                                                                              [–]timawesomeness 63 ポイント64 ポイント  (11子コメント)

                                                                                                              https://xkcd.com/1138/

                                                                                                              [–]Petrarch1603 64 ポイント65 ポイント  (205子コメント)

                                                                                                              I wonder what the voter ID laws are like on these 'islands'.

                                                                                                              [–]CanadaBlamer 44 ポイント45 ポイント  (197子コメント)

                                                                                                              Here

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                                                                                                                [–]wah-ji-wah 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                                It maybe because I come from a country where gaming the system is a national hobby, but what the actual fuck? I can go to multiple booths saying I am John Smith or Jose Martinez, I bet atleast half will have one who hasn't voted?

                                                                                                                [–]Karkrash66 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                                Yupp, because apparently it's a racist policy to ask for ID.

                                                                                                                [–]marklyon 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                                This map is clearly wrong, at least for Mississippi. Voters passed a constitutional amendment requiring voters to show ID in 2011.

                                                                                                                Would you like to know more?

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                                                                                                                    [–]Zaneisrandom 147 ポイント148 ポイント  (85子コメント)

                                                                                                                    States vote, not citizens. It's like every 4 years everyone forgets the federal government isn't a democracy

                                                                                                                    edit: before I get a torrent of angry comments, I'm not saying I agree, but that's how American government works, citizens don't get a say in the federal government past electing congressional representatives. State governments are where democracy actually exists.

                                                                                                                    [–]rab777hp 91 ポイント92 ポイント  (49子コメント)

                                                                                                                    democracy just means there's voting

                                                                                                                    [–]ziekktx 57 ポイント58 ポイント  (36子コメント)

                                                                                                                    We're a representative Republic, is what the poster meant, not a democracy.

                                                                                                                    [–]Isord 129 ポイント130 ポイント  (24子コメント)

                                                                                                                    Which is just a type of democracy. What you mean to say is we are not a direct democracy.

                                                                                                                    [–]rab777hp 32 ポイント33 ポイント  (22子コメント)

                                                                                                                    In fact though, we have many direct democracy elements, such as statewide referendums/ballot initiatives

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                                                                                                                      [–]nenyim 26 ポイント27 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                                      Still a democracy. There are lots of representative Republics with direct elections as there are lots of others with indirect elections which are taking numerous form.

                                                                                                                      Democracy tells you nothing about how things are, it just tells you that people have the power.

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                                                                                                                          [–]duktalo 34 ポイント35 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                                                                                          This is /r/mapporn, not some political sub. Sure, the map isn't especially useful if you want to run a campaign, but it's interesting to look at, nonetheless.

                                                                                                                          [–]Ragnars_Fav_Skull 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                                          The people who are part of the federal government were already elected on a local level to represent their state, thus giving people relative say in what goes on. However you only have as much say in the federal government as your state has representatives. It's almost like there's a system designed to work like that...

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                                                                                                                            [–]VLAD_THE_VIKING 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                                            If you're just talking about rural America, Trump really did win in a landslide.

                                                                                                                            [–]croagunk 65 ポイント66 ポイント  (9子コメント)

                                                                                                                            Or, what $1.2 billion will get you.

                                                                                                                            [–]LuniWin 54 ポイント55 ポイント  (8子コメント)

                                                                                                                            It's quite ironic that Clinton mocked Trump for losing a billion dollars in the 90s.

                                                                                                                            And now she lost more than a billion dollars to not win the election, money well spent.

                                                                                                                            [–]anyone4apint 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                                            I spent $0 to not win the election. It has just dawned on me that I am probably a financial mastermind, who'd have thought!

                                                                                                                            [–]burncycle 13 ポイント14 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                                                                                                            She's not the best for the job, but she wanted to prove she's the best at something - best at losing money

                                                                                                                            [–]its_still_good 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                                            I would bet she didn't lose a cent in the election. She actually made money living off campaign contributions. Her supporters are the ones that lost over a billion dollars.

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                                                                                                                              [–]Flick1981 1 ポイント2 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                                              Nice map, but why are there two Pima Islands? Wouldn't something like El Paso island make more sense?

                                                                                                                              [–]code_22 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                                              What about Hawaii and Alaska?

                                                                                                                              [–]AdeonWriter 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                                              I want to see the Trump version

                                                                                                                              [–]Kilo8 12 ポイント13 ポイント  (13子コメント)

                                                                                                                              Everybody is seeming very unhappy about the results of the election and the fact that Clinton lost by a small margin while winning the popular vote.

                                                                                                                              A. They both agreed to run by the system in place of the electoral college because it is in the constitution. I'm not happy about it either, but that's how it is, and it does a lot more to ask and propose a new system than to ask for an exception. Plenty of people in California didn't vote because they knew it would be blue, and many in Texas didn't because they knew it would be red.

                                                                                                                              B. Going 100% by population brings up its own problems. While the basis of the electoral college was to systemize the national voting process and allow the more informed to make the decision of the less so, neither of those things are a problem today. The problem is that in and out of areas are different types of people. For instance, let's say a lot of farmers are conservative, and usually republican. However, if over 50% of citizens live in cities (which do as of now) most do not understand the challenges farmers go through to get them the food in their plates at night. Cities vote mostly democrat and if someone they vote for gets into office then screws over farmers they will inadvertently be affected. Basically, this means that politicians would only have to campaign in cities and might as well not even think of the rural population, which will be horrible for the farmers, and in turn for the city dwellers.

                                                                                                                              Something in between would be ideal, but I have no idea.

                                                                                                                              [–]florencemorph 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                                              Shelby Island

                                                                                                                              If this place were really an island, it would become Escape From New York in about 3 weeks. I have nightmares about not being able to escape this terrible city.

                                                                                                                              [–]rderekp 18 ポイント19 ポイント  (34子コメント)

                                                                                                                              So where can I move that's on these islands, but it's cheap to live and also I can get a job for everyone in my family.

                                                                                                                              [–]cplusequals 33 ポイント34 ポイント  (10子コメント)

                                                                                                                              St. Louis is pretty cheap.

                                                                                                                              [–]danjenator 10 ポイント11 ポイント  (2子コメント)

                                                                                                                              Yup, we're growing decently lately. Hopefully that can continue in this new political climate. Our state just flipped to the reddest I think it's ever been.

                                                                                                                              [–]cplusequals 4 ポイント5 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                                              Oh, it's been great for the tech industry in STL. I don't think we have anything to worry about unless you're in the city directly. St. Charles and West Co. have been thriving.

                                                                                                                              [–]BULLZEYE420 19 ポイント20 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                                                                                                                              white flight tends to do that

                                                                                                                              [–]cplusequals 6 ポイント7 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                                                                                                              The county, where the whites fled to, is cheap too if you avoid mid county.

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                                                                                                                                [–]Golden_Kumquat 18 ポイント19 ポイント  (4子コメント)

                                                                                                                                Find a college town away from any big cities.

                                                                                                                                [–]Atomichawk 3 ポイント4 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                                                Dallas

                                                                                                                                [–]Rimm 8 ポイント9 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                                                Minneapolis is relatively affordable has good job prospects and is full of sweeties

                                                                                                                                [–]novak253 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                                                Compared to other big cities Chicago is actually affordable. You can live in a good neighborhood for 500-600 per room range. Probably the best bang for your buck city in the U.S.

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                                                                                                                                  [–]BarryOakTree 2 ポイント3 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                                                  Hey, I can see my house from here!

                                                                                                                                  [–]kzrsosa 62 ポイント63 ポイント  (229子コメント)

                                                                                                                                  And she got 2.8 million more votes out of these tiny islands. Like that one dude said people vote not acreage.

                                                                                                                                  [–]bikesandlego 122 ポイント123 ポイント  (7子コメント)

                                                                                                                                  There were plenty of people who voted for Clinton in counties Trump won, and vice versa. It's not like the only people who voted for Clinton live on these islands.

                                                                                                                                  [–]ebilgenius 23 ポイント24 ポイント  (6子コメント)

                                                                                                                                  The map starts at 50% of vote for Clinton

                                                                                                                                  [–]newcitynewchapter 15 ポイント16 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                                                  There are also certainly areas where Hillary didn't reeve a majority of the votes, but was the candidate with the highest percentage.

                                                                                                                                  [–]llamasR4life 32 ポイント33 ポイント  (3子コメント)

                                                                                                                                  So as much as 49% will have voted Clinton in some counties and won't show here.

                                                                                                                                  [–]socksRnice35 87 ポイント88 ポイント  (212子コメント)

                                                                                                                                  Thankfully nowhere in the Constitution does it mention the words "popular vote".

                                                                                                                                  We're a constitutional republic not a democracy. Popular vote doesn't matter.

                                                                                                                                  [–]hall5714 15 ポイント16 ポイント  (1子コメント)

                                                                                                                                  We're a constitutional republic, not a democracy

                                                                                                                                  We're both. A representative republic is still a democracy, it's just not a direct democracy.

                                                                                                                                  [–]ArttuH5N1 7 ポイント8 ポイント  (0子コメント)

                                                                                                                                  Representative democracy. The American usage of republic as somehow excluding democracy is so weird. Haven't people actually looked up the definitions of those words?

                                                                                                                                  [–]ShutYourFaceJabroni 45 ポイント46 ポイント  (174子コメント)

                                                                                                                                  Why are you thankful for that?

                                                                                                                                  [–]socksRnice35 61 ポイント62 ポイント  (172子コメント)

                                                                                                                                  Because I support the Electoral College and not the popular vote.

                                                                                                                                  [–]ShutYourFaceJabroni 42 ポイント43 ポイント  (167子コメント)

                                                                                                                                  Why?

                                                                                                                                  [–]AsterJ 73 ポイント74 ポイント  (119子コメント)

                                                                                                                                  The United States is too big to have large sections of it ignored in lieu of high population centers. It only works as a federation of states.

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