Newcastle 0-3 Manchester United: Ferguson’s diamond forces Newcastle to change shape
Phase one: formations 0-15 minutes
Manchester United won the game primarily because of a dominant opening 15 minutes.
Alan Pardew selected a 4-4-2 from the start. James Perch was at centre-back, Davide Santon on the right, and Shane Ferguson at left-back.
Sir Alex Ferguson continued with the diamond he played against Cluj in midweek. Danny Welbeck replaced Javier Hernandez, while Tom Cleverley and Michael Carrick came in for Anderson and Darren Fletcher.
There were three phases here. First, Manchester United’s diamond dominated Newcastle’s 4-4-2. Second, Pardew switched to a 4-5-1 to compete in the centre of midfield. Third, Ferguson switched to a 4-5-1 to give protection to his full-backs.
Last season
It’s impossible to consider the tactics for this match without thinking back to the equivalent fixture last season. Newcastle won 3-0 in a staggeringly dominant performance, and while long balls towards Demba Ba and Shola Ameobi (this was pre-Papiss Cisse) provided the major attacking threat, the real story was in the centre of midfield.
“We won because we controlled the game in terms of what we wanted to do,” said Pardew at the time. “We wouldn’t let them play, I thought we took a bit of a gamble in terms of a high press on them, and then physically and aerially we had an advantage, and we capitalised on that.”
The midfield partnership between Cheick Tiote and Yohan Cabaye completely overpowered Ryan Giggs and Michael Carrick that day – to the point some suggested Ferguson should attempt to sign either of them to bolster his midfield. Instead, Ferguson persuaded Paul Scholes out of retirement three days later.
Phase one – Manchester United diamond plays around Tiote and Cabaye
Knowing that Newcastle were dominant in the centre of the pitch last time, Ferguson continued with his diamond. With this set of players, he could have opted for a 4-2-3-1 / 4-2-1-3 like against Everton on the opening weekend of the season, but he wanted to pack the central midfield zone to ensure dominance of possession.
Phase two: 16-55 minutes
Carrick sat deep in space, Tom Cleverley was to the left, Kagawa higher up on the right and Wayne Rooney at the tip of the diamond, closely supporting Robin van Persie and Welbeck. The full-backs provided overlapping runs on the flanks, but generally only one at a time.
Last week’s defeat to Tottenham, when his side were caught out 2 v 2 on the counter-attack, was probably the reason Ferguson told his full-backs to be more cautious, so when Patrice Evra or Rafael went forward, the other maintained a 3 v 2 at the back.
The real story was in midfield, however, where the away side enjoyed a staggering amount of possession in the first 15 minutes – 78%. This was turned into an attacking threat, as they had eight shots compared to Newcastle’s none.
The home side’s problem was their attempt to replicate last season’ strategy, trying to press in an area of the pitch where they were outnumbered. In the first five minutes, Cabaye was pressing Carrick, Tiote pressing Cleverley. But there was always an easy out-ball – either one of the full-backs, or forward into Rooney, who was left unattended between the lines – as both Newcastle’s centre-backs were occupied by strikers.
The two goals came from corners rather than open play – Jonny Evans and Evra both headed in – but it was a fair reflection of the game in the first 15 minutes.
Phase two – Newcastle go 4-5-1
After the second goal the away side were clearly in the ascendency, so Pardew was forced to make a tactical change. In 2012 he’s often made switches between 4-5-1 / 4-3-3 and 4-4-2, using Ba as either a forward or a wide midfielder and tucking Jonas Gutierrez inside. Today’s change was different – he moved Gutierrez into the middle, but shifted Cisse rather than Ba to the (right) flank, which meant Hatem Ben Arfa moving to the opposite wing. This was a recognition that Ba was Newcastle’s main attacking threat, having scored all five of their previous league goals.
Phase three - formations 56 minutes - full-time
The move unquestionably steadied the ship. It would have been natural for Manchester United to sit back more with a 2-0 advantage, but statistics demonstrate the change. Between 15 and 45 minutes the possession figures were now 49-51 (quite a difference from 22-78), and Newcastle had eight attempts compared to Manchester United’s zero. The extra man in the centre of the pitch was helping Newcastle compete, and this forced Rooney into a deeper position, where he defended well, but was unable to offer much attacking drive.
Phase three – Manchester United go 4-5-1
This pattern continued into the second half, when Newcastle got the ball into the final third and tested David De Gea in the air. The home side were particularly dominant down the left, with Ben Arfa darting towards goal with the ball, and Shane Ferguson overlapping energetically past Kagawa.
Therefore, Ferguson turned to the bench, bringing on Antonio Valencia in place of Kagawa. Valencia’s qualities as a defensive winger are well-known, while Kagawa is accustomed to a free role at Borussia Dortmund. The Ecuadorian tracked Shane Ferguson up and down the line, as Manchester United went 4-5-1 – Welbeck moved left, Rooney was now a standard central midfielder (he was later replaced by Scholes) and van Persie played upfront alone.
Now, with both sides having a spare man at the back and a ‘free’ holding midfielder, the game was played at a slower pace and there were few goalscoring chances. Cleverley’s long-range strike increased the advantage, but the first 15 minutes was where the game was won.
Conclusion
If the Clasico was a match between two sides playing their own game, this was the complete opposite. Ferguson’s diamond was, in part, a response to Newcastle’s dominance last season. Pardew had to adapt his own side to compete in the centre of the pitch, and then Ferguson switched formation himself, to get numbers on the flanks. Essentially, there were three separate examples of a manager changing formation specifically because of the opposition’s area of dominance.
Ferguson’s diamond won the game in the first 15 minutes. Even when Pardew successfully changed formation to get Newcastle into the game, this was a sign of Ferguson’s tactical victory, for the game was now being played on the away side’s terms – about possession – and Newcastle had one fewer target to replicate the aerial bombardment of last season.
Outstanding analysis. Was looking forward to having some intelligent insight into such an exciting game. Found it in the usual place. Ok, so opinions on rooney in this position please – a good idea for man utd and England?
The movement from Rooney, Clev, Kag, RVP and Welbeck in particular was very good, and Welbeck i like as a player, he brings good energy to a team and presses the opposition very well.
Interesting to see Rooney playing in a more recognised midfield role in the last two matches, that injury lay off was probably the best thing for him because he looks lean and fit and his touch and technique seems much more like how it used to be from a couple years back. His ‘withdrawn’ role in midfield could the key to success this season, and with RVP in the team he will not have to worry so much about scoring goals.
Still yet to see the best of RVP and Kagawa but im expecting them to slowly but surely get used to the Man Utd system, Kagawa really is a top player, in a way i’d like to see the other United players trust him more, he has so much to offer. Overall a good result, the clean sheet was the most promising thing, and Evra i was for once pleased with defensively, interception after interception, he looked much more like his old-self, here’s hoping he carries on this good form.
his first touch together with keeping the ball needs to be refined he still cannot dribble the ball properly needs to be better in one on one situations .
That’s what has always stopped Rooney from been a world class player,as well as his terrible consistency mind,the fact he is a poor dribbler in tight spaces.
I thought on the evidence of this match and the previous one his touch has improved which is encouraging, but the more work he puts in the more it will get better.
And his dribbling hasn’t been anywhere near the level of his earlier years at United, big shame that.
His lack of dribbling skills is something he is well aware of. I seem to recall an interview where he admitted it himself. So its something he’ll have to live with, including his fans.
I’d like to add that the pressing from United from high up and quickly in the first 20 minutes was very good to see. We commit so many players forward but we don’t press when we lose it, we let the opposition have a go at us too quickly, which is asking for trouble when we have had the likes of out-of-form Evra, static Scholes and wanderer Giggs. It also allows us to start attacking moves higher up and when the opposition is not as settled as they would be if we started deeper. Would like to have seen more of the pressing after the first 20 minutes but I guess, in hindsight, the tactical warfare throughout the game meant that Ferguson was wise to play conservatively.
This change in team shape was bound to happen or needed to at least, accommodate what the likes of Cleverley, Kagawa, RVP and Anderson can bring in central areas. It will be interesting when the deep and passive axis of Carrick-Scholes returns to the fold, as to how Ferguson uses the lessons of the past two games in relation to this partnership. Because it is getting tiresome and predictable watching them constantly going for the wide ball to the right. Also frustrating to see how little they and Kagawa combine, as there is a chasm of space between Kagawa and the central midfield of Carrick-Scholes. It will take time for both the manager and the players to incorporate/balance the central creativity/movement of the likes of Cleverley and Kagawa with our wing strength. Going to be a balancing act between wing play and central attacking play, as it has been part of our history far too much for us to let go of the wing play a lot but we have badly needed the variety that central attacking play can bring. Will be interesting to see how Ferguson does tinker with how vital the full backs need to be going forward, in games with no wingers. Love the wing play trademark of ours but been a refreshing change the last two games. We need some unpredictability back in our game. Interesting times ahead for us, tactically.
The combination of the lack of pressing and static/slow & uninspiring movement/passing in central areas has been a big problem in recent times. Hopefully the last two games are a sign of what is to come.
Welbeck does lots of good work outside the box and build up phase but my word, does he lose his composure in the box. He needs to keep calm. His pressing was very good.
I thought the full backs had very good games but I think Rafael, surprisingly, been a little too shy getting forward to provide width in the last two games. Clearly seen team mates trying to signal to him to provide width in the last two games. The diamond midfield needs its full backs’ width, a la Ancelotti’s diamond (of sorts) formation at Milan and Chelsea. But I guess maybe Ferguson has told the full backs to get back to basics first and start defending properly, which is understandable.
ZM, do you see any similaries in Ferguson’s attempts tactically in the last two games to Ancelotti’s diamond (of sorts) at Chelsea and Milan?
Though I am now thinking there is also some similarity to the tactics used by Prandelli in the game against Germany at the Euros. Especially with the way Montolivo’s role fluctuated between being at the tip of the diamond and going deep to help Pirlo, bit like Rooney on Sunday.
Great analyses ZM.
I thought the key part of this game was Rooney’s performance. In last season’s match he played far too high up and let the game pass him by. In this match his was key to United’s attacking play, dropping deep and orchestrating play. He was helped by Welbeck and RVP’s excellent movement across the forward line, helping to create space and chances.
Newcastle’s change to a 451 then exposed Man United’s weakness, as once they lost the extra man, they were unable to stop Newcastle’s midfield players breaking past them. They became too lightweight and couldn’t break up Newcastle’s attacks. Man United then switched to a more counter attacking set up and saw out the game, with Rooney again central as he played even deeper and provided some much needed steel to the central midfield.
Very much a tactical win for Ferguson and a personal victory for Rooney after his poor performance in the same match last season.
Newcastle couldn’t handle the movement from the front 5 and as you say, got outnumbered in midfield. Even when Newcastle pressed well, Man U kept possession excellently under pressure but the game was as good as over at 2-0.
For this formation to work United need better attacking fullbacks,maybe if Evra was a few years younger and they had another top RB this could work against better sides.Maybe play Valencia there?Evra is good going forward but he no longer has the legs to bomb up and down the pitch all game,plus he is abysmal defensively.
Also Kagawa should be playing AM not Rooney,Kagawa is more creative and better at retaining possession in small spaces because of his dribbling etc.
With that said there main problem is still their midfield,it is shit.
Kagawa is a natural attacking midfielder and is better at it than Rooney but for United’s needs, I think Rooney would be a better fit. Although it is too early to tell I admit as this system is in its infancy. But I just feel that Rooney’s work rate and awareness of when we don’t have the ball (e.g. when to drop very deep to help the holding midfielder) is quite important. Because that attacking midfield role for United, I don’t see it as being as free-role as the one Kaka had at Milan or Zizou at Juve under Ancelotti in the latter years, as they had little defensive responsibility. Whereas, going from only two games I know, it seems Ferguson requires more defensive work from the central attacking midfielder. Bit like Italy’s diamond at the Euro’s against say Germany, their central attacking midfielder had more defensive responsiblity, whether it be Montolivo or Marchisio. Montolivo pressed high and joined with the forwards but he also had spells where he slotted deep to help Pirlo. I think that game against Germany reminds me a little of United’s tactical variety against Newcastle That sort of work rate and awarness is something I think is what makes Rooney maybe better suited at this moment. But like I said, this system is in its infancy, so who knows how it could evolve.
Kagawa has some big important positives to his attacking midfield game that Rooney isn’t near but in terms of impact for United, I think Rooney would be better in that role for United’s needs.
I am not saying Rooney should be a sub,but should play up top with Van Persie.
I haven’t seen Kagawa play much to be honest but I was under the impression that he had a fairly high work rate off the ball,even if Rooney works a bit harder I don’t think it justifys playing him there instead of Kagawa….
Kagawa has really good work rate but in my view, he is more suited to MAINLY pressing high from the front, instead of having to BOTH high pressing and dropping very deep to helping Carrick & wide players defensively and tactically. Whereas Rooney has the tactical know-how/awareness to switch between the advanced central midfield role and the deeper central midfield position. Its not just about working a bit harder, that wasn’t the gist of the point I was making and apologise for the lack of detail. Kagawa is better off playing in a narrow wide role, like he has done for Dortmund, instead of having to fluctuate between central attacking midfield role and having to go deep to help Carrick centrally. I think Kagawa would find that deeper midfield side of the game in PL more tougher than Rooney. Tactically, Rooney is one of the best players out there at being able to switch roles between two or three tactical systems in one game, even if he is technically messy. At this point in time, I trust Rooney more to be able to do the dual role of the attacking midfield role and the deeper central role in one game. That wasn’t a simple orthodox central attacking midfield role yesterday.
While Kagawa has obvious technical skill, I’ve yet to see him or anyone else in the side who can match Rooney’s ability to replicate Scholes’ distribution of the ball, especially from deep-lying positions.
Carrick is a wonderful simple passer and is rightly praised for his ability to get into safe positions for his team-mates to have an outlet pass, but when a dangerous, penetrating pass from deep is needed it is always Scholes who provides it.
Carrick’s role in the side needs to be replaced with a real ball winner to provide the spark that is lacking from an aging Scholes and passive Carrick duo.
the only thing that that i can say about this match is newcastle may be played a little deeper than usual opting utd to play in front of them rather than on their shoulders and one more important thing kagawa was played but he was out of position he was coming inside but then he was drifting outside. instead i would had like him to be just behind welback and rvp where he is very good and rooney could had drifted in his position just like they did against tottenham for the first goal .
very good analysis got nothing more to add other than the fact that when you look at the game cleverly still needs to get refined his first touch still lets him down couple of times as does rooney’s . he needs to get his head up when the ball is being passed to him and needs to do it quick . same goes with other english players like welback and rooney .
last but not the least i would like hodgson to select perch . this guy is phenomenal . he can play anywhere in the back four plus he can even play as a defensive midfielder and whoever had seen him play he keeps things simple and does his job effortlessly and without fuss .although hodgson has that uncanny ability to pick stupid players who dont even get selected for their club’s first team itself .
can anybody explain please, at what cleverley is good at? i thought he’s quite average midfielder for a top side. he doesn’t go to 50/50 challenges, and he not offers much either? is he overrated as all english players are?
Correct me if I am wrong but wasn’t this the second time we played a midfield diamond and both times against Newcastle? With cleverly where he was this game on the left and Anderson on the right for the cup game.
I think the formation we used in this game might become our template for the future as we have a lot of players that are suited for this system save Nani and Young. Unless of course Fergie finds a way to accommodate them into it as well.
I think though that had Valencia been fully fit(he had a late physical) we would have seen a formation of something like
—Roony–RVP-
—-Kagawa—-
-Clev—–Val-
—Carrick—-
Interesting – I didn’t see the cup game.
in the game against Newcastle in capital cup, united played the same formation. and always one of the strikers went to the flanks and the other worked as central striker. it happened a lot during that game.
It did mirror the cup match against Newcastle just 2 weeks prior.
Cleverley, Fletcher, Anderson, Rooney, with Welbeck, and Hernandez leading the charge.
We used it again against Cluj and it worked to great effect, and now this past weekend. Ferguson definitely found a system that works with this current lot. However, it will be interesting to see how this holds up against teams that counter down the flanks. (when they get the ball)
The revert to 4-5-1 is a great secondary option now.
Not sure about the Valencia part of that. He remains a Right Wing, and pretty much only a Right Wing, for United. It’s hard to see him playing the same role that Tom did on the other side, and Tony really isn’t a “linking” player. His dribbling skills are more at “taking a run” at a defender or blowing by them than in tight spaces or in pockets of spaces the pop up between the lines. He’s also not really a strong possession passer like Tom or Carrick.
He’s a very good offensive Right Wing, one whose defense (as Michael pointed out) is very strong relative to most attacking wingers. But there’s a narrow range of what he does, and the diamond doesn’t look one of them (anymore than out wide right in the front ling of a 4-3-3).
Anderson’s defensive effort gets spotty, and his positional awareness defensively is poor. One would worry about Anderson and Rafey out on the right against a team with a quality wide player supported by a fullback pushing forward.
United’s diamond has been interesting to watch, and could be a useful alternative formation for them against specific opponents. The game against Newcastle does show how easily it can be stunted given United’s current talent.
I think one other thing that needs to be taken out of this game relative to the recent run of EPL games by United: they really need to put the Carrick+Scholes partnership to bed. Michael has written about SAF being cautious in using this partnership prior to last season, as has Jonathan Wilson. Due to injuries and form, SAF got stuck with it last year and it “worked” to a degree in getting the team back into the title hunt. But it has the same limitations it always has had, simply with Scholes a few years older and an even worse defender. We saw a strong Carrick performance on the weekend where he was able to cover the centerbacks, not worry about moving forward as often as he does with Scholes, and in turn know that if he moved forward that Cleverley tends to shift back to provide cover. Even more than that, Cleverley is extremely active in busting his hump to get back on the counter, whereas Scholes just doesn’t have the wheels for it.
Cleverley might not be United Fans ideal partner for Carrick (see Modric, Luka), but he is more compatible to him than Scholes (and especially the shot Giggs).
Not saying that Scholes should be sent to the bench for good. But Carrick+Scholes pairing together to start has problems that an increasing number of teams are figuring out. The “great second half” of the Liverpool game is an illusion because Scholes+Carrick should dominate a 10 man side that no longer can press or counter in numbers. Sir Alex needs to come up with alternative pairing for the two. Cleverley appears to play well with Carrick, and also mentally approach and read the game similar. They could become a good pairing not just in the diamond, but also in the 4-2-3-1 and 4-4-1-1 formations United has been using.
I wonder how he carries out the central/narrow role Ecuador? I haven’t seen them play but have read that Valencia has played in central roles for them. Vaguely recall him playing a game for Wigan in that role and did quite well but that is just one game I do realise. So I am wondering whether there is more to his game than we have seen at United. Ferguson loves wide play, width and wingers, so it wouldn’t surprise me if he has restricted him to do just that, especially as he does it well and considering the imbalance on the left wing at times.
That’s a good question. I haven’t seen him play for Ecuador. Missed the Copa game against Paraguay where he badly hurt the ankle. Had been looking forward to watching him against Brasil later in group.
I think defensively he can handle the role. But offensively and playing possession passes that role typical demands (as Tom was doing), not sure it fits Tony’s game.
Great Article, but I think Padrew overcorrected. Yes, the 451 finally blocked up the ManU midfield passing, but at the price of forfeiting the one clear advantage newcastle had: playing a physical, direct game and overwhelming a small, weak MU. Newcastle is at their best when they keep those 2 strikers together. They should have simply matched MU’s diamond, with Tiote at the base and Ben-Arfa as the 10. Same result defensively, better goalscoring odds.
Not a bad idea in hindsight, considering the Newcastle left back wasn’t shy in getting forward and putting crosses in, as well as Ben Arfa’s below-par performance on the left. I understand why Pardew wouldn’t do that as I don’t think he has used a diamond like that much, so he resorted to something more orthodox in his eyes probably.
Though I don’t think Newcastle have played that well this season as a team, with Ba-Cisse up front as a duo. Going forwards it hasn’t been that bad but defensively, they don’t have the same solidness as the 4-2-3-1 they were using last season. It still doesn’t work all that great for me, for the sake of the team, the orthodox front pairing of Cisse-Ba. Might work for those two but for the other 9 players in the team, they might be better off going back to 4-2-3-1/4-3-3. They won that game against Spurs when they changed from the 4-4-2 to a 4-3-3, for example.
For me, he should have gone with Ba to the left, Cisse through the middle and Ben Arfa with the free role from the right. It is a formula that has worked for them time and time again, despite Ba’s moaning. But Pardew was obsessed with peppering De Gea with crosses (fair enough, it is a big weakness), so he wanted Ben Arfa to play direct, head down the wing and cross it in, very little cutting inside, then Cisse, off-the-ball, would cause one CB and the giant Evra trouble with his movement at the end of crosses. It caused Man United problems but it was the same type of problem that didn’t look like paying off and no variety either, as he had Ben Arfa pinned to the left, instead of freeing him.
I think Pardew has a big tactical headache that stems from Demba Ba’s desire to play up front and for me, despite his goal record, is costing the team.
“Newcastle is at their best when they keep those 2 strikers together”
Show me the evidence of that particularly when Ba and Cisse have both scored in the same game ?
Is it just me or does it seem like they are jealous of each other?
From the data I gathered on the Stats Zone app Newcastle have scored 1.06 goals per game when Ba and Cisse play together in a 4-4-2 and conceded 1.3 goals per game (I didn’t include any goals that were scored or conceded once one of them had been subbed off). When they’ve played any formation where Ba is on the left they have scored 1.2 goals per game and conceded 1.2 goals per game. So they have a slightly better offensive and defensive record with Ba on the left. This is certainly an imperfect comparison since it doesn’t account for factors like quality of opponent. I also didn’t have a good way to account for changes in formation made in the middle of the game so I assumed whatever formation they started the game in, they also ended it in that formation. Clearly Cox’s post shows this isn’t always the case.
ZM, you should especially in context of this game. What is interesting was the tempo we maintained in these two games using the diamond formation(of course we lost that when we went to 451 or whatever that was). Usually we switch gears through segments of the game but we were in a cruise control pace when in the diamond formation for much of these two games and maybe its due to the ease at which we held possession.
Also,I wish i understood why we keep picking Giggs under the concept of maintaining possession when he gives the ball away so cheaply all the time.
“Last week’s defeat to Tottenham, when his side were caught out 2 v 2 on the counter-attack, was probably the reason Ferguson told his full-backs to be more cautious, so when Patrice Evra or Rafael went forward, the other maintained a 3 v 2 at the back.”
This really is basic football strategy nowadays but it seems SAF has ignored this too often over the past few seasons. Tactically, I don’t think United have been leading the line since the trio of Ronaldo-Tevez-Rooney were playing at Old Trafford. They must do something about this.
I’m sure some side will exploit the narrowness of the diamond by applying width later down the line, I just hope United don’t go back to the pass-to-wings-cross-rinse-repeat tactic again and actually do something interesting strategically.
Oh and inb4 the ABU crowd wades into the discussion claiming SAF is king of the FA.
I disagree with the notion that one full back has to always stay back. I don’t see it as a huge problem to have both full backs getting forward, as long as the balance in the team is right and those full backs are willing to get up and down sharpish. Many a team have committed both full backs forward at the same time, to provide width but they also have a solid central midfield base to protect as well as the full backs can’t be lazy. I thought Nev pointed it out well the other week that as long as they get back quick, it doesn’t have to be a big problem for both full backs to get forward. Barca sometimes commit both full backs forward, although not necessarily with two sitters. Chelsea have done it, with Bosingwa and Cole in the past but they have had good shield in central midfield. Dortmund commit both but they also press quickly, i.e., put pressure on the opposition when the team loses the ball. Made sense to keep one back yesterday, to get back to basics in terms of playing it safe defensively with our full backs. Makes sense to keep one back, as long as we have soft central midfield. But generally, I don’t see anything fundamentally wrong with both full backs going forward, if the circumstances are right.
1) Scholes is a liability defensively in a central midfield duo now. Too easy. Once Scholes gets out-manouvered/out-powered, Carrick gets all shy, result: central midfield overrun. 2) Evra has been poor for two seasons at least (yesterday aside of course), he has very poor at getting back quickly. Glen Johnson is dodgy defensively but when he gets forwards and the side loses the ball, he busts a gut to get back. Simply can not afford to be lazy as a full back, when it comes to getting up and down that line. 3) We don’t bother much with trying to win the ball higher up the pitch, i.e., pressing, which is what we did well yesterday in the first 20 minutes. Which makes it harder/longer for the opp. to get at the defence.
These issues have made us easy to get at in recent seasons and made life unreasonably hard for our CBs, who have enough worries on their plate with their bloody fitness anyway. Add in Giggs on the left, you got a bloody nightmare happening.
True, but then you need a central midfielder that will sit back and shield the centre backs. Carrick is good at interceptions but he does need support if wingers + forwards + midfield runners are barging into him and the other two CBs. I think Fletcher has been doing reasonably well in his two matches so far in spite of facing relatively inferior oppositions.
I also think that SAF shouldn’t be shy of using young and energetic CMs (well Anderson is usually exhausted at the hour mark anyway) in place of Scholes and Giggs. Scholes and Giggs have their place but SAF should know when to use their ‘experience’ and when to rely on young legs to do the running around.
The match yesterday was good, let’s hope he keeps things fresh and doesn’t go back to tired tactics.
Yep, thought I had said/implied that you need a central midfielder to sheild the CBs, to allow the full backs to go forward at the same time but apologies if my post was somewhat confusing.
I am fine with Carrick as a individual player but I just don’t rate Carrick-Scholes axis anymore. For me, you need two to sit back in central midfield for the full backs to get forward, unless we do a high pressing game like Dortmund, i.e., defend aggressively higher up and quickly, starting from the forwards. Carrick has to now be played alongside a mobile and dynamic central midfielder like Cleverley or Ando. Carrick is best left as the sole pivot player in central midfield. Whereas the double pivot in Scholes-Carrick is dangerously too passive and somewhat confusing as once in a while one needs to gamble going forward but neither are comfortable or at least leave themselves in dangerous situations. Especially when Scholes is left as the deepest when Carrick gets forward, it is horrendous to watch teams counter attack us, especially when the full backs are still wandering back. A lot of people picked on Rio for that Bale marking in the Spurs game but our central midfield and the full backs made the CBs’ lives unnecessarily much harder.
Yep, it was good and refreshing, the past few games. Hope Fergie rides out the waves that this adapting will take, instead of resorting to the tired tactics.
Hi ZM, thanks for all the great analysis.
Do you think the diamond will be a long-term alternative for United?
Barcelona under Guardiola (perhaps under Villanova too, haven’t seen much of them this season) were able to bomb both fullbacks forward because they have Busquets. When the backs were providing width up front, he would drop back into a 3 man defense with the CBs. If United are going to continue with the diamond, they’ll need width eventually from the fullbacks. At that point they should play someone who is comfortable as a defensive midfielder and a CB to cover when they have the ball.
On their squad that’s Phil Jones. It’ll be interesting to see if Fergie plays him at the back of the diamond when he returns. Of course, the diamond might just be a brief phase or specific plan to Newcastle.
Suerly Carrick could play as a modern centre-half and drop in from the base of the diamond!
Jones would be ideal as one of the centrebacks, his time at rightbakck would stand him in good stead when whe moves wide.
Still a Fergusson team without wingers … cannot see it being a long-term proposition myself.
Agree. Man Utd lacked width and were forced to play in the middle at times. This was not helped by the fact that the full backs were taking turns coming forward. Both need to go very high up in my opinion and a 3 man defence would be the best fit as it offers some protection.
Regarding Kagawa, he struggled throughout the game. He went wide on the right and tracked the opposition fullback and a got a yellow card too for his efforts. His best position is upfront behind the striker- a no.10. The midfield position doesnt bring the best out him. Rooney can fit in the left of midfield three as he did in the 4-5-1 formation in the second half
United have always played with wingers over the past and if SAF wants to carry on with wingers, 4-5-1 is the best option. Hope he doesnt go back to the bland and outdated 4-4-2
I think the diamond won’t be a permanent tactic for use, but it will be handy in certain games to overload the central zone very similarly to how Italy operated towards the end of the Euro’s, it certainly is a handy option to have.
I think for now its crucial to get the right balance in the team and most importantly bring out the best in the industrious Rooney with the creativity of Kagawa.
I’d love to see a front 6 of; Carrick, Clevs-Rooney, Kagawa-Nani, RVP.
Kagawa playing a slight inside left position to play “between the lines” and pressure the opposition high up, but the onus will be on Evra pushing forward for support and Clevs (or even Rooney) to drift towards the left of the field to allow Kags to have the space to float from the inside-left to central zones, always playing just near enough RVP to be ready to trigger attacks.
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