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Legal Advice for chemicals. (self.legaladvice)

saintpetejackboy が 投稿

I recently spent a while in federal prison (did an IAMA on here that got to the front page). I was importing a chemical from China, MDMC/M1/bk-MDMA/methylone that became Schedule I ten days AFTER I was indicted (I was indicted Oct 11, 2011, it became Schedule I Oct 21, 2011).

Anyways, I've been asking my probation officer to get me in contact with the DEA or something so I can figure out what chemicals are or are not illegal and have been getting no response.

I was prosecuted under something called the CSAEA (Controlled Substances Analogues Enforcement Act), and charged with actually importing MDMA. The federal law is so messed up, the CSAEA is read in the disjunctive now (OR instead of AND) in most circuits and does not require they prove human consumption.

There was a recent mens rea case about it that went to the Supreme Court and the guy won there, but then on remand to a lower court they just slammed him on all the related charges (some victory...) and it was really over the jury instructions only.

If I am unable to get a government official or representative to give consultation on this matter, is that not illegal? What can I do? I feel like if I open back up my website and get back in business that I will go back to prison for something that isn't technically illegal again and I want to have 100% support the whole way and authorization from the government.

Advice?

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[–]seditious3 53ポイント54ポイント  (0子コメント)

I am a criminal defense lawyer. Regarding the sale and transport of chemicals (psychoactive or not) between countries, there are multinational law firms, and professional expediters, that deal with those issues. There is no way you or I can figure it all out when dealing with more than 2 or 3 countries. The answers will not be found in a treaty or agreement, and the laws may not be in English. I would not trust a translation of foreign statutes. It will cost you thousands to find the answers, and there's no way around it.

Second, if you want to deal with chemicals, I strongly suggest that you not deal with chemicals that can be used as psychoactive drugs, regardless of whether they are legal or not. As you know, if the Feds want to fuck you, they will find a way.

Lastly, it is not the job of any government employee, from your PO to the DEA to the DOJ, to tell you whether your specific business plan is legal. And they won't advise you. Also, what if person X tells you it's OK, but agency Y decides to prosecute. Do you really think it's a defense that person X said it was OK? If you do, then you haven't learned anything.

Want to work with drugs? Work for Bayer or Wyeth.

[–]GoonCommaThe 108ポイント109ポイント  (40子コメント)

Are you really this fucking stupid? You went to prison for over six years for importing illegal drugs, you are currently on probation, and you are still trying to import and possess drugs?

Delete this post, because your probation officer can see this thread when they look you up, due to the fact that you were stupid enough to give your name and inmate information in your AMA. I can almost guarantee that you are breaking the terms of your probation by seeking to import and sell drugs.

Cut the fucking bullshit and check yourself into rehab. You obviously have a severe drug problem.

[–]Cosmiccue 29ポイント30ポイント  (0子コメント)

Hes a snitch..

Thats why he is here while on probation.. still trying to get off by collecting info.

[–]fiskiligr 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

Cut the fucking bullshit and check yourself into rehab. You obviously have a severe drug problem.

Rehab deals with addiction - it's not possible to be physically addicted to MDMA...

MDMA has the potential to be psychologically addicting. Individuals who use it regularly may find they have an increased desire to continue using it. There is a short period of tolerance after MDMA use. Using MDMA two days in a row is likely to lead to a greatly diminished experience the second day, though spaced 7 or more days apart, this effect is lessened. Some users report noticing reduced effects for up to 2 or 3 weeks after initial use.

Source is Erowid.

So while it's possible he has formed some dependency on MDMA, that seems rather unlikely. I would guess whatever is motivating his risky behavior is something else.

[–]GoonCommaThe 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

This guy was shooting up meth, cocaine, and a whole list of other drugs before he went to prison. When he ran out of drugs he resorted to random chemicals he didn't know the identity of. You're telling me this guy isn't an addict?

[–]grasshoppa1Quality Contributor 18ポイント19ポイント  (20子コメント)

Even if not scheduled, it looks like bk-MDMA is an illegal analogue, so I'm really not sure what you're asking here. Don't sell or possess this substance unless you want to go back to prison.

[–]saintpetejackboy[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (19子コメント)

I already know that one is off the list, as yes, it is considered an analogue. Previously, it was also that it had to be sold for human consumption to be considered illegal, but that is not how the any more. I know CSAEA only covers Schedule I and II, but there are things like Ketamine, for instance, which are not Schedule I or II... the problem with things though like the Ketamine analogues, is some could be construed and PCP analogues as well (with the wrong prosecutors and "government witness" chemists involved...);

This thread is more for advice like I am discussing above, the technicalities. I'm really looking for things that are NOT considered gray area.

[–]Junkmans1 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm really looking for things that are NOT considered gray area.

There are lots of things you can import that are not grey area. How about cotton or polyester fabric? Maybe some flashlights. Those should be safe.

Things that are a grey area: Chemicals you import that might ever be used as mind altering drugs or a component of mind altering drugs. Regardless of what list they are, or are not, on.

[–]grasshoppa1Quality Contributor 22ポイント23ポイント  (17子コメント)

Here's some advice: Get out of the drug game. It already landed you in prison once.

[–]saintpetejackboy[S] -2ポイント-1ポイント  (16子コメント)

Not all chemicals are drugs.

For instance, why can I not import and sell caffeine? I'm sure I can get it made very cheaply and it has a market value. It could also be considered a drug, but it is definitely not illegal for buy/sell/trade.

[–]grasshoppa1Quality Contributor 29ポイント30ポイント  (14子コメント)

Sure. If you want someone to help you figure out what chemicals you can sell legally, without worrying about going back to prison, hire a lawyer.

[–]saintpetejackboy[S] -1ポイント0ポイント  (13子コメント)

I've considered that. Is there any good recommendations for some that have proper qualifications?

[–]grasshoppa1Quality Contributor 24ポイント25ポイント  (12子コメント)

We don't do referrals here.

[–]saintpetejackboy[S] 2ポイント3ポイント  (11子コメント)

Ah, hmm, so just Google then, I guess?? I need to find one with free consultation before I fork over some money... and somebody I can research that is good.

I tried to get a hold of the CCLE (Coalition for Cognitive Liberty), but they have no freaking email like this is 1987 or something, they want snail mail.

[–]_My_Angry_Account_ 12ポイント13ポイント  (10子コメント)

Try your state bar association.

[–]Junkmans1 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

Not all chemicals are drugs. For instance, why can I not import and sell caffeine?

Caffeine is a drug. I've read articles (here is one) about the FDA cracking down on sellers of the drug and that it can be fatal even in small doses.

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[–]lekoman 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Let's try it this way: The grey area you seek and that someone else may successfully be able to navigate is no longer open to you.

It's very clear from your posts that what you're trying to do is get as close to selling chemical analogues or those used in the manufacture of controlled substances as you can. You seem to be interested in charting the grey area and figuring out how to ride it by playing games with the letter of the law. This is ill-advised, generally, even for those without a criminal history. Staying out of trouble means honoring the spirit of the law, because if you're just trying to lawyer your way past it, as your story shows, the authorities will figure out how to slap you.

But, as someone with a criminal conviction and jail time for one or several controlled substances violation(s), this is territory any lawyer worth their salt is going to tell you to stay away from. Like, well away from. Like, go raise sheep or work in a mill or learn to code or something. Regardless of how valid you think your conviction was, it's now on your record and that's that. No backsies. Fair or not, you're always going to be a little (or a lot, depending on how you comport yourself in the future) more suspect than the average Joe in this space, and if you do anything to give law enforcement even just the inkling that you're up to no good — even just a whiff — they're going to show you very little lenience.

Criminal convictions limit future opportunities. That's why it's best to avoid them in the first place. You didn't, and that happened, and that's a bummer, but whether or not you think it's fair or just is irrelevant at this point. Unless you go get the law changed (and hey, if you do, more power to you... that'd be pretty impressive), you're going to have a damned hard time getting a lawyer to give you legal basis to do the sort of work you appear to want to do.

[–]Hulluja_Ajatuksia 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

I feel like if I open back up my website and get back in business that I will go back to prison for something that isn't technically illegal again

Key Word:

again

So yes, if you re-open exactly the same website that got you thrown in prison without changing anything, you will get thrown in prison again...

You have already received some

consultation on this matter

In the form of a 6 year prison sentence.

If you continue to ask for additional consultation you are likely to receive another helpful prison sentence for planning or conspiring to break the law again...

Why is this so hard for you to understand?

[–]crimson117 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

So you had a business importing chemicals that weren't technically illegal, but maybe they became illegal later.

What did you do with them? Did you sell them to people who may have found a way to get high off of them? Or did you sell to big legit factories who needed a steady supply?

How did you decide which chemicals to import? Industrial applications, or off label uses?

And now, after getting in trouble for your past behavior, can you explain what you're looking to do now, and how it's different?

[–]flamedarkfire 4ポイント5ポイント  (2子コメント)

STOP BREAKING THE LAW!

[–]joeschmoe37 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Hey asshole, I screenshotted this and your other drug post's and sent them off to a number of different people who would be interested in your activitys