上位 200 件のコメント表示する 500

[–]AutoModerator[M] [スコア非表示] stickied comment (2子コメント)

As a reminder, this subreddit is for civil discussion.

  • Do not call other users trolls, morons, children, or anything else clever you may think of. Personal attacks, whether explicit or implicit, are not permitted.

  • Do not accuse other users of being shills. If you believe that a user is a shill, the proper conduct is to report the user or send us a modmail.

  • In general, don't be a jerk. Don't bait people, don't use hate speech, etc. Attack ideas, not users.

  • Do not downvote comments because you disagree with them, and be willing to upvote quality comments whether you agree with the opinions held or not.

Incivility results in escalating bans from the subreddit. If you see uncivil comments, please report them and do not reply with incivility of your own.


I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

[–]Redleg61 [スコア非表示]  (130子コメント)

If this article was posted in April it would have 0 upvotes

[–]ZachariahSilverberg [スコア非表示]  (40子コメント)

I'm still surprised how much this subreddit has done a complete 180 since March.

[–]nightpanda893 [スコア非表示]  (20子コメント)

I'm not. With Trump as the nominee, I could see this coming a mile away.

[–]ayylmaooo0o [スコア非表示]  (13子コメント)

I get the sub moderately supporting her, but considering they went from die hard bernie fans saying "omg clinton is satan bernie or nothing" to now super excited die hard Hilary fans....that's pretty surprising to me.

[–]enjolras1782 [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

Some of them listened to Hillary speak and rembered she doesn't actually have cloven hooves or whatever. Something about chewing a diagram. Idk I've been pretty high since I heard Jack Spear talking about pépé on nor. I figured at this point why not.

[–]Devam13 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Well I am more surprised because just a month ago, this was a Pro-Trump subreddit for a week or so. That made me so irrationally angry.

[–]topest_of_kekz [スコア非表示]  (34子コメント)

My first reaction was no way but the more I think about it the more I realize that this would probably be true.

People would similar to the Trump supporters right now just pointed to other 'evidence' of corruption, question the medias integrity or question how many other secret speeches there were that we don't know about.

This whole corruption narrative is really really powerful especially if the figure presenting it is way more charismatic.

[–]OTL_OTL_OTL [スコア非表示]  (28子コメント)

Someone posted an example of how different things changed...they basically copied/pasted the same comment they posted months ago, today, and received gold/many upvotes for their post...then showed people they made the same exact comment 8 months ago, in the same subteddit, and that same post was in the negatives. Pretty interesting how much the first presidential debate changed the tone of this sub.

[–]raivetica20 [スコア非表示]  (5子コメント)

Was that the comment where someone posted a big list of videos of Clinton speeches that are publicly available online? I saw that earlier today and the OP also said that they were downvoted like crazy earlier this year for posting the same thing.

[–]1000000students [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

yeah i saw that, it was amazing that the speeches wre actually available months and months ago

[–]varsil [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

Not the speeches, because people wanted the speeches she'd given to various Wall Street types (especially Goldman Sachs). Those speeches were not available months and months ago, but some different speeches were.

[–]copperwatt [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

To be fair, our country's ambitions went from "Holy shit how great is the view going to be when we climb this mountain" to "Holy shit I hope we survive the night so that our shuddering starving bodies are discovered in the days ahead."

[–]twoambien [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

My first reaction was no way

my first reaction was no shit.

this sub was a huge berniejerk in april, anything about hillary that wasn't negative was downvoted.

[–]geoman2k [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

I think part of it is that the reality of the election is starting to set in with people, and they're starting to realize that while she isn't a great candidate, she isn't the horrific demon that so many people have tried to paint her as over the past year. I think this is mostly due to the fact that Trump is not only a terrible candidate, but his team is so busy trying to manage his issues that they haven't had time to make a believable case against her.

The reality is her presidency will likely just be 4 more years of an Obama-like administration, which might not be the change a lot of people have been wanting, but certainly won't be the disaster we'd be getting from Trump otherwise.

[–]Byzantine279 [スコア非表示]  (342子コメント)

Yep. They are pretty much exactly like all the speeches that were already available on Youtube.

Hillary is just way overcautious about things like this, and didn't want to give in and it turn into another birther scenario - where no matter what action she takes the other side will never be satisfied.

[–]LemonHerb [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

I think she let them focus on this because she knew it was nothing. Let them spend the whole election wasting time on the speeches knowing that when the transcripts make it out nothing will come of it.

[–]RheagarTargaryen [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

It was a smart play. As long as they are calling for her Wall Street speeches, they would be spending some of their resources on trying to get them.

[–]sagan_drinks_cosmos [スコア非表示]  (115子コメント)

Yup, people give her shit over the vast right-wing conspiracy line, but there really has been a partisan noise machine out to get her for decades. It freaks out people who assume she must be hiding ten thousand skeletons, but it's also at the very least understandable why she would be so guarded.

[–]_Big_Baby_Jesus_ [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

but there really has been a partisan noise machine out to get her for decades.

It's not just the right wing media, it's been the government as well. People forget that Ken Starr was made an independent counselor to investigate Hillary and the Whitewater land deal. When he couldn't find anything incriminating there, he just kept interviewing people until Linda Tripp told him "I recorded a phone conversation where my friend Monica Lewinsky talks about blowing the President".

The Republican Majority Leader admitted to Sean Hannity that the extensive Benghazi hearings last year were entirely about hurting Clinton's poll numbers.

“Everybody thought Hillary Clinton was unbeatable, right? But we put together a Benghazi special committee, a select committee. What are her numbers today? Her numbers are dropping. Why? Because she’s untrustable."

[–]kitduncan [スコア非表示]  (75子コメント)

Actually the fact that in 30 years they haven't been able to stick anything really big to her or to Bill could be taken as a sign that she's cleaner than most politicians out there. Not many people have been subject to such close inspection, and I don't know how many people would survive it as well as she has.

[–]eviemcstevie [スコア非表示]  (55子コメント)

To the alt-right, everything is a conspiracy.

[–]bass-lick_instinct [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

At this point I wouldn't be surprised if they believe that if you stand in front of your bathroom mirror and say "BENGHAZI!" three times then a bloodied Hillary Clinton will appear and sneeze on you.

[–]flibbityandflobbity [スコア非表示]  (48子コメント)

Not just the alt right. The left did the same thing when she failed their purity test.

Of course things got awkward when not even Sanders could pass that purity test.

[–]smc23 [スコア非表示]  (45子コメント)

out of curiosity in your opinion what could sanders not pass in a purity test? it seems out of all the politicians in the past 50 years he was the only one with no skeletons in the closet.

[–]versusgorilla [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

When he supported Clinton (like he said he would, because he's a man of his word) some of his supporters decided not to support Clinton AND also decided Sanders had sold out.

It's probably not a majority, but there's definitely a "Green Tea Party" on the left who supports zero compromise.

[–]lennybird [スコア非表示]  (13子コメント)

I knew of Sanders long before his candidacy and participated from early on his run in the primaries. Nobody can name another politician who has as much experience, consistency in views, and the foresight as him.

We seriously missed an amazing opportunity.

Many people understand something needs to change, but not everyone understands how. This is how you get people supporting Trump because he "tells it like it is." But as I've said before, if you're not knowledgeable you won't be able to discern the candid intellectual from the candid idiot.

Towards the end, as far as I can tell Sanders supporters split in two: those who were generally the younger ones who voted for Sanders in the way they supported Obama because he was a beacon of hope, and those who supported him not simply because of hope and idealism, but because this was a legitimate opportunity to push for policies not commonly in the spotlight. These people opted for pragmatism which meant you pursued progress, but when that fell you shift your goal to damage control... Bernie is a pragmatist believe it or not and he knows this too despite not getting along well with Hillary.

But the first group resented Sanders' endorsement of Hillary after his loss... Not seemingly understanding what was on the line.

[–]seenorimagined [スコア非表示]  (6子コメント)

I understand the love for Sanders & his policies. But politics is about compromise and coalitions. It does not matter if you are right (Sanders was the only Senator to vote for/against x, y, & z) if you exist in a vacuum. We are talking about government institutions--change will be small and incremental.

Obama started out his presidency calling for "an end to the petty grievances and false promises, the recriminations and worn-out dogmas that for far too long have strangled our politics." He will finish it facing unprecedented obstruction on the part of the Republican members of Congress.

I have mad respect for Sanders and am glad he pushed the Democratic platform to the left, but I am grateful that our nominee is a badass bitch that can go toe-to-toe with the Republicans and get shit done.

(Why am I still seeing people on Facebook saying Bernie has a shot at the presidency?)

Also, also, also, here's more on Obama's strategy:

Obama’s strategists wrote that all campaign communications, even the slogan—“Change We Can Believe In”—had to emphasize distinctions with Clinton on character rather than on policy. The slogan “was intended to frame the argument along the character fault line, and this is where we can and must win this fight,” the memo said. “Clinton can’t be trusted or believed when it comes to change,” because “she’s driven by political calculation not conviction, regularly backing away and shifting positions. . . . She embodies trench warfare vs. Republicans, and is consumed with beating them rather than unifying the country and building consensus to get things done. She prides herself on working the system, not changing it.” The “current goal,” the memo continued, was to define Obama as “the only authentic ‘remedy’ to what ails Washington and stands in the way of progress.”

[–]shckkjaslkdj [スコア非表示]  (26子コメント)

They're trying to bring out a woman who testified that a supposed rape she doesn't know the date (or month) of never happened, as some proof that Hillary is somehow unfit.

It's beyond all comprehension at this point

[–]Thurwell [スコア非表示]  (6子コメント)

I don't think there's really a conspiracy. Conspiracy: a secret plan by a group to do something unlawful or harmful. The right wing has been pretty up front that they're out to get her (and Obama).

[–]smilingstalin [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

Yeah, I think Clinton is just such a huge target that they're pretty much all attacking her out of their own accord.

[–]N0PE-N0PE-N0PE [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Secret enough that huge swathes of the US citizenry doesn't believe any such persecution exists. Want a test? Just say the secret word: "Benghazi".

Citizen A: "Politically-motivated witch hunt that cost taxpayers millions."

Citizen B: "BLOOD ON HER HANDS!!!! LOCK HER UP!!!!! TRAITOR!!!!"

[–]flibbityandflobbity [スコア非表示]  (126子コメント)

I still can't believe how many people got so up in arms about what could be in those speeches when so many were recorded and avilable for viewing online at any point.

People were stoking their anger and carefully ignored facts. Clinton derangement syndrome.

[–]Byzantine279 [スコア非表示]  (8子コメント)

And that tens of thousands of people sat through these speeches and none came forward.

There weren't all rich executives, most were middle management.

[–]cranialflux [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I remember some of them talking anonymously to the papers. They basically said Clinton was sympathetic of Wall Street and absolved them of the 2008 crisis.

[–]armrha [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

We linked tons of them, and the general response was, "Well, her seedy promises weren't in THAT speech!". And people who attended the Goldman Sachs speech summarized what was said, and they said, "Well, of course they're lying! They don't want to reveal the SEEDY PROMISES Clinton made them!!" For months on here, it seemed like literally nothing defending Hillary Clinton could get said without you being downvoted and being accused of being a shill.

[–]codeverity [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

The fact that Trumpets still cling to the 'omg shills' argument even now is simultaneously amusing and incredibly frustrating.

[–]Merlord [スコア非表示]  (79子コメント)

She really should have released them though. I understand her caution, but she wasn't exactly demonstrating the kind of transparency people want in a President.

[–]Bananawamajama [スコア非表示]  (42子コメント)

That's a reasonable criticism, but I imagine she figured it would go something like Obamas birther thing

Obamas not a real American!

That's ridiculous, of course I am

Show us your birth certificate then!

What? No! No white candidate ever had to do that.

He's a Kenyan Muslim!

Fine, here it is

That could be a fake! Show us your long form birth certificate!

If you think this is a fake, why would I think the long form one would convince you?

Show us! Prove you're American!

No, I'm the god damned President if the United States, I don't need to bow down to conspiracy theorists.

I can keep this up literally the whole rest of your presidency.

Ugh, here, you piece of human garbage

OK, but that could be a fake too maybe

I knew it

How bout releasing your college transcripts?

Fuck you.

[–]thelandsman55 [スコア非表示]  (32子コメント)

This is what I feel like so many conservatives don't get about the birther thing. Being asked to verify you are who you are because of the unsubstantiated premise that your identity is an elaborate hoax is both humiliating and a textbook example of discrimination and profiling. This is particularly true because none of them were questioning his white mothers American citizenship, even though if you believe she is his mother there's literally no way he would not be an American citizen.

It's not as if Trump ever returns the favor on his transparency witch hunts. I would love to see the mad scramble to destroy evidence of investor fraud, discrimination, corruption, and tax evasion that would happen if someone tried to subpoena his emails for a public hearing.

[–]daybreaker [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Exactly. The GOP loves moving goal posts. They make a seemingly reasonable request, and you either dont comply and they shit on you, or they issue a new request. And repeat the cycle. So either youre stuck in a cycle of constantly trying to validate yourself, or you just tell them to fuck off and deal with a bad press cycle.

Like right now. Trump said he'd release his taxes if Clinton released her emails. 1) Every president since Nixon, who was also under audit, has released taxes. Including Hillary. 2) If Hillary released her emails, do you really think Trump would release his taxes? No, he would ask for something else first and claim then he'd release his taxes.

It would never end. It would just be Trump avoiding releasing taxes by making "reasonable" requests of Hillary first. "Oh... why wont Hillary release her police records in order to get Trump's tax returns? Is she hiding murders???"

[–]flibbityandflobbity [スコア非表示]  (21子コメント)

I get why she didn't. For starters she was not the only person to do paid speeches. Certainly not the first politician. Why was she being held to a different standard? Where was the call for Trumps transcripts? She was targeted from the get go.

She shouldn't play into that kind of hypocrisy. Partially because it's not fair. Mostly because it would never ever be enough. Three would always be something more being demanded that none of her peers had to worry about.

The other important part is that no matter what was in those transcripts there would be one phrase that could be taken out of context and used as an attack. Then she would need to spend time and energy refuting it. Its too much data to mine.

[–]KnowerOfUnknowable [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

For starters she was not the only person to do paid speeches. Certainly not the first politician.

Not the only person? Not the first?

Try every single politician with any type of name recognition. Bush, Nancy Reagan, Bill Clinton, Colin Powell, John Pondesta, Bush II, Kissinger, .....

I am sure the Obamas already have tens of millions dollars worth lined up already.

[–]eebro [スコア非表示]  (10子コメント)

I agree, it was first a play by the Sanders campaign, since Sanders didn't have any paid speeches, but when GOP took it, well I don't know if it suits them at all.

[–]Abstrusity [スコア非表示]  (6子コメント)

There's also the whole "Here's the Goldman Sachs speeches right here! Here's the leak!"

CLINTON: WHY WOMEN ENTREPRENEURS ARE THE FUTURE

FUCK

How the fuck do you spin that as a negative?! She played us like a damn fiddle!

[–]IICVX [スコア非表示]  (5子コメント)

This is why you don't talk about the 47% or grabbing pussies even when you're pretty sure nobody's recording.

[–]Fraulein_Buzzkill [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

Even simpler, just be a decent person.

[–]Abstrusity [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

Well, that's the thing. If you look past all the trumped up controversy surrounding Clinton, you'd see that she...kind is a decent person. She cut her political teeth on campaigning for Barry Goldwater, but it's been all up ever since. These speeches that were recently leaked sort of prove the point that it's mostly assumptions because of the absence of proof than anything else. The repetition at which these assumptions were pushed is what made them 'truth.'

[–]IICVX [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

It's such hypocritical nonsense that the Sanders campaign tried to make this an issue.

You know why Sanders doesn't have any paid speeches in recent memory? Because he's been a Representative and a Senator for the last thirty years. Members of congress have been banned from making paid speeches since 1991.

He was attacking her for something she's entirely allowed to do as a private citizen, and that he's legally prohibited from doing as a member of Congress.

[–]Donald_2016 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

It was actually brilliant to keep them hidden. It made for an easy identifiable fault that could be easily fixed by her if it started to cause damage.

[–]AssassinAragorn [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

When people need to make up conspiracy theories about someone, they are probably far more squeaky clean than people would like

[–]Cordingly [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

People just don't want to accept that the candidate they started rooting for is a cartoon character, let alone a grown up Joffrey Baratheon.

[–]MirrorWorld [スコア非表示]  (7子コメント)

The fucking battles we had with Sanders supporters over shit like this. I'm kind of nostalgic for them. Trump people are too dumb to argue with; it's not fun.

[–]WhyDoges [スコア非表示]  (14子コメント)

I've been saying this since the start, why did people expect something terrible to be in them?

[–]tentwentysix [スコア非表示]  (7子コメント)

Because there haven't been any scandals that have ever stuck to the Clintons, so every time one came up her detractors hyped it as the thing that would bring her down.

[–]tartay745 [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

What would happen if she released one? They would say that it was a boring one she had stored for this occasion and that she was still hiding the damning ones. I doubt she keeps a record of every speech she's ever given and all you'd get is "we need more". She couldn't win this fight so she sat out.

[–]toxicroach [スコア非表示]  (47子コメント)

I don't want to get too "Hillary is a fucking genius" but if she'd just released them when asked, it would be over.

Now it's this huge scandalous.... proof that she's really pretty cool and undermines all the people who tried to use tell you it was a huge scandal. Psychologically that matters.

[–]Hjeltepojk [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

Releasing speeches gives support to the notion that Trump can demand for her to release documents without any precedent, and increases legitimacy of E-mail accusations. It also shifts the discussion from Trump to Clinton, and give some fodder (regardless of how tame) that will be spun into a damning attack ad somehow. Plus, if they don't like the transcripts they can just say they were fake or insufficient or whatever. Regardless of the content you're basically just giving attack angles away.

She made the decision (probably after running a plethora of focus groups) that voters really didn't respond much to attacks over not releasing transcripts, so she figured she'd be better to simply ignore it and try to shift focus away from it.

I would say that strategy has been very succesful, seeing as how she was consistently ahead of Trump from the start of this campaign, only dropping temporarily after the convention and her health scare.

[–]jayydee92 [スコア非表示]  (22子コメント)

She is pretty genius though. People can demonize her but she's a smart cookie.

[–]toxicroach [スコア非表示]  (13子コメント)

Yeah she is. But I don't want to get too fanboy. Tends to cloud the judgment, as Trumps fans are showing.

[–]mommy2libras [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

It wouldn't have been over. The same thing that's happening now would have happened then. "Oh God, just LOOK at what she said!"

[–]toxicroach [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

It's gaining zero traction because if you actually read the article you see there's nothing there.

I mean, I've read the articles and I've straight up asked Trump supporters what is scandalous in there in case I missed something. So far nobody's bothered to reply.

[–]Threedawg [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

If she released them after she was asked then people wouldn't believe them.

[–]Aikidi [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I almost think that someone up in her campaign, or her herself, knew that people had these speeches somewhere and would leak them when the timing was right. Like, some horrendous Trump scandal would happen and they'd think "okay now, release the speeches."

And now we have Hillary's smoking gun speeches that reveal that she's pragmatic, honest, etc. sitting shoulder to shoulder with Trump's biggest bombshell of the campaign. The juxtaposition couldn't possibly work out better for her.

[–]CrazyP00nTang [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Most people correctly points out that it would've damaged her in the primaries and limited her credibility in adapting her policies to fit the needs of America (if those policies were different from her speeches).

From a strategic stand point, I agree with her keeping the transcripts hidden. She now has a robust platform to deal with what a lot of Americans want.

[–]killmetonight [スコア非表示]  (128子コメント)

Serious question... why is every post on r/politics either pro Hillary or anti Trump? There is honestly no middle ground. I'm not a Trump supporter, but seriously... the amount of bias in this sub is ridiculous.

[–]MengTheBarbarian [スコア非表示]  (6子コメント)

You must've not been here in April. It was heavily anti-Hillary because of Bernie.

[–]DebitsOnTheLeft [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

This fucking subreddit makes no sense. Either there are completely different users posting and voting on here compared to 6 months ago or everyone has a shockingly short memory. It's astonishing how many users are outspoken about being pro Hillary when you'd expect most people to be more like "ehhh, I'll vote for Hillary but she's still not my first choice."

[–]MyNiggaBernieSanders [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Dude the narrative has shifted big time. It's actually scary. Look at how many pro Hillary posts and comments there are now. It was never like this. And how many posts have made it to the top about wikileaks's releases. That shit would have hit front page in 5 seconds not even a month ago. What has changed? Dare I say bought and sold mods? Or could it be that 3 letter acronym at work?

[–]CampusTour [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

It's much simpler. People are operating under the assumption that saying anything negative about Hillary helps Trump, therefore, they are less likely to want to do that. During the primaries, saying negative things about Hillary was seen as being beneficial to Bernie, so people were more likely to do it then.

People are not on this sub to have some kind of enlightened, reasonable discourse about candidates, they mostly are arguing in favor of some outcome they want. During the primaries, it was "Nominate Bernie". Now, it is "Defeat Trump".

[–]Prysorra [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I've finally decided to filter this sub out of /r/all because of this submission.

[–]hatrickpatrick [スコア非表示]  (5子コメント)

She literally admits to having one policy to tell the public about and another for closed-door policymaking, and this is "honest"? This is evidence of everything that's wrong with politics.

[–]weiss27md [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

And this is only 1% of the emails, still 99% to go.

[–]nhnolan [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

If the big scandal is that she does some law-making behind closed doors, like how deals are supposed to be made, I can live with it.

[–]Seeking_Adrenaline [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

Honest?

She literally discusses how you must have a public and private position on policy...

[–]primitive137 [スコア非表示]  (81子コメント)

So far the most honest headline about this. I supported Sanders hard and these honestly make me like Clinton more.

[–]proggeranon [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

I supported Sanders too but I don't know if I like her more because of the leak. However, these leaks do make a lot of her actions a lot easier to explain. Mostly, she just thinks of voters as ill-informed about the issues and reactionary (possibly / probably true to an extent). Like, she talks about how Dodd-Frank was necessary politically because of the populist backlash in the speeches (which may well be true, idk) but this is at odds with her previous romanticization of the bill. She has just accepted these populist undertones in our politics as too powerful for her to overcome, after all she isn't exactly a great speaker (by her own admission). So, instead, she has some aspirational, technocratic vision for what the world should be ("open trade and open borders") and has decided to slowly dissemble around her positions on some subjects until "public opinion" matches her own "private opinion", or she isn't constrained by public opinion anymore (like Obama isn't on TPP).

At least, that is my read of the situation. None of this is really honest like the headline suggests (and the author is editorializing heavily to reach his conclusion), but its not "hillary-is-literally-bought-by-goldman-sachs" bad. I will probably still vote for her because, even if I am not in a swing state, my hatred for Trump is so great that equivocating the two by voting third party seems nonsensical to me. However, I really wish she would make an affirmative case rather than being nebulous around her beliefs. I think she is far too pessimistic on how much more voters (especially younger voters) value authenticity over specific views.

[–]GYP-rotmg [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

she is far too pessimistic on how much more voters (especially younger voters) value authenticity over specific views

I hope she's wrong about this, but she may be right.

[–]916M_IN_LOSSES_LMAO [スコア非表示]  (57子コメント)

She's the most scrutinized politician in American history, maybe in world history.

Republiclowns haven't found anything in the last 30 years. They're not gonna do it now.

[–]macinneb [スコア非表示]  (5子コメント)

I love that Donald got only a TASTE of what Hillary's been through her whole life (constant scrutiny under a microscope) and his entire life is collapsing beneath him.

[–]hans_grosse [スコア非表示]  (12子コメント)

That's why I'm not worried about an "October surprise" from Wikileaks. People have been digging into Hillary's past for ages. I don't expect to see anything surprising - just typical politician stuff.

[–]this-one-is-mine [スコア非表示]  (5子コメント)

It's so funny that the deplorables were getting excited for a Hillary October surprise when there are a fucking infinite number of skeletons in Trump's closet. This last week and a half could be just the tip of a very perverted, unethical, even criminal iceberg.

[–]daybreaker [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Exactly. Any time someone posts some conspiracy theory about her, there is literally no evidence other than some shitty ranting on a no-name right wing blog.

All the major stuff has been heavily scrutinized by the GOP for decades.

If she was really dead and replaced by a secret body double, or had an intern murdered for leaking emails, or whatever other bullshit, the GOP wouldve found it.

[–]Redleg61 [スコア非表示]  (15子コメント)

This is what I tell my grandma when she complains about Hillary. After all these years and money wasted on phony investigations, what have they found?

[–]flibbityandflobbity [スコア非表示]  (8子コメント)

Her worst quality is that she's a national American politician.

[–]drordinaire [スコア非表示]  (5子コメント)

It's that she's a smart and capable woman.

[–]eviemcstevie [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

Who doesn't wither away under pressure. Not only is she on their level, she's above it. They're mad because they can't keep up.

[–]Callmedory [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

If it's true that Russia is behind Assange, this is why. Putin would rather have an idiot than Hillary.

Damn! I'm starting to actually LIKE her. I voted for Bernie, but I always figured that she might be the better president.

[–]garyp714 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

After all these years and money wasted on phony investigations, what have they found?

North of 220 million tax payer dollars since like 1992. Sickening.

[–]ThunderrBadger [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Source? Not saying that that much hasn't been spent, but I'd like to add another page to my "In Case of Arguments" folder

[–]gsxdsm [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

She personally killed thousands of Americans in Benghazi, duh. /s

[–]Plisskens_snake [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Arkansas Project/Judicial Watch, Whitewater, travelgate, Benghazi. Like poor marksman her well financed hunters keep missing the target. Chelsea said she couldn't remember a time when her family wasn't under some sort of attack.

[–]navikredstar [スコア非表示]  (7子コメント)

Same. I was pretty pissed initially when Sanders got beaten, and I'll admit I bought into a lot of the bullshit about her, though nothing as extreme as the Clinton Body Count shit - but I did research, and what I saw of her, the more I liked. She's done some shit wrong, the email thing was ill-advised; she's a bit more hawkish than I'd prefer and seems to have a bit of an ego thing, but she's he only sane one running and her policies are pretty goddamn reasonable and solid. And I think her ego will drive her to be a fairly good president - she wants her legacy to be looked at highly.

We could do a HELL of a lot worse. Hell, even if we get four-eight more years of the same, it's still a far better alternative. So she's not a great campaigner. I can deal with that. As long as she keeps the majority of her platform promises (though I'll forgive her if she's hamstrung like Obama), I'll be happy. And at the very least, we don't have to fear her nuking another country when someone pisses her off on Twitter.

[–]TheAllDayThrowAway_ [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

I have faint hopes that she won't be as hamstring as Obama. He came into the Whitehouse relatively inexperienced and I don't think he had many political relationships, particularly in the senate and definitely not in the House. He thought he could show up and be a nice guy and everyone would just want to do business with him. He wanted to be the Great Compromiser. Took him 4 years to learn that wasn't going to happen in this new America we live in. He got 2 years and he spent literally all of his political capitol on the ACA (which, for me personally, it was worth the expense).

Hillary has the same connections Bill has, and plenty of her own. She has allies and some are in Congress. So I am moderately hopeful that even with the state of politics today, she has relationships in place already and she has had 8 years of watching Obama's relationship with Congress to help her jump the hurdles the republicans throw at her. And who knows, maybe the republicans in the house will be demoralized (but I doubt that).

[–]daybreaker [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

Yeah, the one thing she did very wrong was setting up the private server with shitty security.

But then it turns out Russia is hacking everything anyway so it probably didnt even matter.

[–]TheAllDayThrowAway_ [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

Does Russia actually have her emails or do they just have everyone else's?

[–]FireHazard11 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

The FBI is the only one who are confirmed to have her emails. Everything about Russia hacking her is currently speculation, though extremely likely.

[–]zuriel45 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Everyone else's it seems. Honestly the fact that she had a private server might have worked out because no one knew she had a private server (well almost no-one) that she was using as her main account. The best way to keep a secret between three people is to kill two of them after all.

[–]-poop-in-the-soup- [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I agree. I also wish it were Sanders. But if we're sticking with politics as usual, she is very good at it, and will make a very competent President. Just seeing how she's organized and run her campaign has been impressive.

[–]TheMuffStufff [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

You guys must have missed the part when she said there should always be a public, and private, opinion. 😂😂

[–]Geolosopher [スコア非表示]  (9子コメント)

In 2016, that's a pretty decent slogan.

Clinton / Kaine 2016: Honest and Boring

[–]Vega62a [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

That's exactly what I want out of my elected officials.

Interesting is for somebody I'm chatting up at the bar. I want my senators and presidents to be honest, hardworking dad joke-telling sweater-vest enthusiasts.

[–]MysticRay [スコア非表示]  (25子コメント)

How is it honest to tell the world you're against a trade deal which you're clearly not? How is it honest to look voters in the face and say "I'm progressive" when you want industry to regulate itself and tell donors you are occupying from the center-left to the center-right? How is it honest to admit that you don't trust the voters with the real version of your positions?

Over Trump, Clinton is the obvious choice and many might be in line with the views expressed in these emails, but why do we have to go one further and brand her as honest when she's circumvented reality and misrepresented herself throughout the entire election? If you don't have to like a candidate to vote for her, now is the time to practice that and hold the next President of the United States to a standard fitting of her office.

[–]BT35 [スコア非表示]  (8子コメント)

The speeches...if quoted accurately...no one has vetted this stuff...were given in 2013... the trade agreement underwent some major changes after John Kerry became the Secretary of State. She liked the deal as it was in 2012 but did not like the changes. Is that difficult to understand?

[–]WickyRL [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Honest to her donors behind closed doors or the public? She says different things to both.

[–]BadDecisionDino [スコア非表示]  (6子コメント)

Not it doesn't. It proves that she lied about exactly everything that we already knew that she had lied about. From being insincere about TPP, to having different private/public positions with regard to Wall Street and campaign finance, to illegal coordination with her Super Pacs.

The reason no one is shocked is because the leaks didn't reveal any new lies that would've surprised anyone who's already been paying attention.

While we can be grateful that our alternative to Trump is effectively no worse than we already knew her to be, it is in no way an exoneration. She's not the second most disliked candidate in recent history for nothing.

[–]FatLadySingin[S] [スコア非表示]  (36子コメント)

Riveting, isn't it? Behind the scenes, it turns out, Hillary Clinton is running a—what's the word I'm looking for? Oh yes: boring. She's running a pretty boring campaign that basically does all the usual boring campaign stuff.

But of course, this email dump is only the first 2,000 emails, and WikiLeaks promises there are 48,000 more to come. I'm sure the smoking gun is in there somewhere. Probably right alongside the infamous whitey tape that no one ever seems to have tracked down.

[–]loremipsumchecksum [スコア非表示]  (8子コメント)

Run the country like a math teacher, not like the coked up art teacher.

[–]MulciberTenebras [スコア非表示]  (6子コメント)

not like the coked up art teacher substitute Gym teacher

[–]Hjeltepojk [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

"Well, I'll tell you the funniest is that before a class, I'll go into the changing room and everyone's getting dressed, and everything else, and you know, no men are anywhere, and I'm allowed to go in because I'm the teacher of the class and therefore I'm inspecting it"

[–]the2belo [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

this email dump is only the first 2,000 emails, and WikiLeaks promises there are 48,000 more to come.

If they're implying that the real dirty stuff is in the remaining 48,000, then why wouldn't they release those first?

[–]FatLadySingin[S] [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Thats 36D Hungry Hungry Hippos stuff there. :)

[–]togetherments [スコア非表示]  (8子コメント)

So does this mean Russia wants us to vote for Hillary?

[–]FatLadySingin[S] [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

I think Vlad the Shirtless made a miscalculation. He was depending too much on the shiny hats.

[–]cromwest [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I think the last five or so years have shown that Putin is more ruthless than smart.

[–]Fariswheel [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

I think there is also a chance that Russia has recalculated the risk of having an unpredictable madman as the leader of the United States. Decreasing the American sphere of influence isn't worth a nuclear war.

[–]K9ABX [スコア非表示]  (5子コメント)

What's the whitey tape?

[–]FatLadySingin[S] [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

[–]Shriman_Ripley [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

John Hinderaker, writing at Powerlineblog.com, claimed that the rumor was "apparently started by the Clinton campaign".

Lol. Every single thing is Clinton's fault.

[–]BlazeBro420 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

"Rational wiki" is the most reddit-sounding thing I've ever heard.

[–]smilincriminal [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

This is pathetic. Why even hide behind the facade anymore? Just fucking merge /r/politics and /r/hillaryclinton already. They're basically identical at this point, might as well be upfront about it.

[–]JushtFinisht [スコア非表示]  (5子コメント)

I've always been particularly indifferent to all of the candidates this election, but I have to ask. When did /r/politics becoming so approving of Hillary Clinton? Did all the users from /r/The_Donald just crawl into a rock these past two weeks?

[–]Random_pm_privs [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

And apparently knows a good bit about cyber security! Imagine that

[–]Wrinklestiltskin [スコア非表示]  (30子コメント)

Honest, sure.... Let's just forget about all the lies she's been caught in.

And before it's accused, I'm not a trump supporter and think he's worse.

[–]zethien [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I mean if her speeches were really so honest and boring, and as some comments are saying "they make me like her more", then why didn't she just release them?

[–]NitroS1991 [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

its hilarious that you have to state you arent a trump supporter just to avoid downvotes into nothing. When talking about Hillary

[–]jacksonsmashon [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

It's pretty fucking sad now. It's always a deflection to him

I understand were stuck with her, but I don't want her fucking being praised and worshipped and having history be so easily rewritten.

She lied throughout the entire primary, lied in every way imaginable regarding emails, lied about just Bosnian sniper fire, lied about her husband's infidelity, on and on

Now she's amazing and infallible

[–]cerebrus21 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Yeah wtf. That article just quoted one snippet of an email and came to the conclusion that she is honest and boring? Give me a break

[–]PrivateShitbag [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Honest? You got to be fucking kidding me

[–]dustoff122 [スコア非表示]  (58子コメント)

I was a heavy Bernie support and was pissed at the DNC, but I got tired of the Memes and lies of fox news so I did my own research on Clinton and have been a fan of hers ever since. I honestly can say, I am voting for Clinton not just because i don't want Donald the Con Man to win but i think she will be a good president.

[–]Quinnjester [スコア非表示]  (6子コメント)

LOL I did the same thing! Still wary to trust her completely though.

[–]normalinastrangeland [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

If you trust any politician completely, you've gone too far.

[–]reid8470 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Exactly. The second people blindly follow what any politician says is the second that politician stops being held adequately accountable.

[–]CANOODLING_SOCIOPATH [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

You should never trust any politician completely. Check what they say and hold them accountable. After all, politicians are people as well and make mistakes.

furthermore politicians only have so much time to get things done while in office. If there is something that you really care about than try and pressure your politicians into acting upon your issues, even if they already expressed support for your issues there needs to be constant pressure.

[–]dilatory_tactics [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

She's been able to learn from not one, but two sitting Presidents.

You can fake confidence, but you can't fake competence. Hillary is competent.

She's going to be at least good.

Granted, Congress will probably still suck balls, and people on the whole are still stupid as fuck.

But as POTUS I believe she will be great.

[–]LemonHerb [スコア非表示]  (30子コメント)

She could really be one of the best we ever had. She might win huge, have congress on her side and really be able to build on what Obama started.

[–]BenevolentCheese [スコア非表示]  (8子コメント)

Well, no, she's not going to have congress on her side. The chance of the democrats retaking the house is extremely unlikely. Senate is possible, maybe even on the slight side of probable right now.

[–]joadbrotherfollower [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

The chance of the democrats retaking the house is extremely unlikely

I was looking to dispute this, but turns out you're right: 98.5% chance of GOP retaining the House according to Election Betting Odds.

[–]dustoff122 [スコア非表示]  (5子コメント)

true, my big thing with her was mental health. A majority of my friends are in the military and I respect what they do but I do have concerns about not only their physical health but also their mental health.

[–]navikredstar [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

I'm also really impressed she has a whole platform plank on autism and has a real plan for aiding autistic Americans. None of the other candidates even talk about it, let alone have a plan on aiding people with it.

[–]IronTagger [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

The headline is missing /s at the end.

[–]AlexTeddy888 [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

Frankly, much of what Hillary Clinton keeps a secret shouldn't cause a lot of hubbub. However, as Axelrod quite neatly put it, it is her unhealthy penchant for secrecy that lands her quite often into this mess. Her pneumonia, the transcripts... If she came out earlier and talked about it, there wouldn't be such an issue. It's one of her flaws as a candidate which I must openly admit and criticise as a Clinton supporter.

[–]SquareJerker [スコア非表示]  (84子コメント)

OK, I am rooting for Clinton over Trump, but this post had 80 upvotes in the first 10 minutes. Either there's some voting manipulation going on or everyone is into Clinton way more than I thought.

Edit: Three people just responded to my post within a minute. How is that possible? Went through their account histories to verify no signs of paid shills. Conclusion: everyone is legit. Holy shit, Reddit is on fire right now against Trump in favor of Hillary. Kind of awesome.

[–]eats_shoots_and_pees [スコア非表示]  (6子コメント)

I would imagine this subreddit is experiencing heavier traffic than usual due to the Trump controversies. This place is consistently more pro Hillary than not, especially when anti-Trump news is dominating the cycle.

Edit to address OP's edit:

Edit: Three people just responded to my post within a minute. How is that possible? Went through their account histories to verify no signs of paid shills.

I wish I got paid to talk about politics and the Portland Trail Blazers constantly. That sounds much better than my real job.

[–]Nirbhana [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

That Arnold Schwarzenegger post had 400 upvotes in an hour. That's pretty much means that Reddit is under very high traffic.

[–]ClockClucker [スコア非表示]  (6子コメント)

This sub has over three million subscribers and a lot of us are hanging out on /new/ waiting for new tidbits. A hundred upvotes is really nothing.

[–]Fartmatic [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I'm not even American and generally had little interest in US politics in the past but I'm hanging out in r/politics/new feeling like Michael Jackson in that popcorn gif

[–]MrRtd [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

Yup. I've been checking out /new/ more than usual. Some of the anti-Hillary conspiracy theory submissions are just pathetic.

[–]Falceon [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I think I've read a dozen or more articles today stating how Hillary's rather boring emails were actually the bible of the anti christ himself.

[–]thethinktank [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

Three people just responded to my post within a minute. How is that possible?

If anyone else is like me, I'm basically living at /r/politics right now given how much fucking crazy shit is happening.

[–]sagan_drinks_cosmos [スコア非表示]  (12子コメント)

This sub is incredibly popular right now. Many, many more people than usual looking for the latest revelation as the Trumpster fire rages.

[–]tartay745 [スコア非表示]  (8子コメント)

It's also talking about her speeches which was really the only "shady" thing left for anyone to reveal about her. This is a pretty cathartic moment for everyone praying there wasn't an October surprise for hillary that would grant trump the presidency.

[–]Byzantine279 [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

Yeah, pretty much everything came out the same day. And it was a very bad day for Trump. Hillary didn't even hiccup.

[–]sagan_drinks_cosmos [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

She's too busy studying for a serious debate tomorrow. She has competent staff to tell her if her attention is needed elsewhere.

[–]Byzantine279 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

I was mostly saying her numbers were unharmed by the transcripts.

The only people reading them badly were never going to vote for her to begin with, and most of the rest either nodded along or were surprised by how mundane they were.

[–]tedisme[🍰] [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

It's almost like she was pretending to be extra-shady during the primaries so that by the time everything leaked, everyone would be so relieved by how mundane it was that she'd win in a landslide.

Almost.

[–]Cintax [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Honestly? I'm more willing to bet she didn't want to cave and release the transcripts because she one it'd go over the same way Obama's birth certificate did: the diehards would still doubt it and Trump would congratulate himself for getting her to release it. This way there's no precedent of getting her to cave to the demands of others.

[–]Nirbhana [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

I haven't refreshed the Top posts by the Hour this much since the Ellen Pao fiasco.

[–]Merlord [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

It's a slow-motion train-wreck and I want to experience every moment of it

[–]jcw4455 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I think it's a matter of being so against trump at this point.

[–]parkinglotfields [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Tens of millions of people are going to vote for her next month. People have been flocking to /r/politics all day, and this is one of the only stories gaining traction that isn't about Trump. 8 upvotes a minute is hardly surprising.

[–]Risley [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

What you are seeing is the coalescence of Hillary supporters with the the people abandoning 3rd party candidates and likely even some people who are telling Trump to fuck off. We are getting closer to the election, and more people are seeing that she or possibly Johnston are the only possible candidates. So it shouldnt be a surprise to see more Hillary posts be upvoted at a higher rate.

[–]GearPeople [スコア非表示]  (5子コメント)

I'm up voting anything that doesn't have to do with pussygate. I'm bored with that. When the hell is he going to release his taxes?

[–]Byzantine279 [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

Trump fucked up so badly r/politics is no longer a warzone. Trump and his supporters can do nothing but sit in their tower as it crumbles around them, more with each successive blow.

If the debate goes badly for Trump tomorrow I expect the last vestiges of his sanity to flee and us to get to see what a Narcissist looks like fully unmasked. It won't be pretty.

[–]RheagarTargaryen [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I think what we have seen in the past 2 weeks is the death of the Bernie of bust crowd. I think there is a fraction of the size it used to be. A lot of this has to do with Trump's debate performance, his remarks about former Miss Universes, and the nail in the coffin of "grab them by the pussy".

[–]ChlkDstTtr [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

There are so many developments with Pussygate right now that there are a lot of us lurkers just hanging out waiting to see what pops up next. I think there are a lot of people like me, who aren't strongly for/against her, but like to read everything to form our own opinions rather than being told what to think. Many of the articles that have had critical headlines about this latest email leak have had very little substance...because there really wasn't anything in them.

[–]system_exposure [スコア非表示]  (35子コメント)

Nevermind that her campaign may have been complicit in fueling the rise of Donald Trump?

From this attachment of Podesta email 1120:

Friends,

This memo is intended to outline the strategy and goals a potential Hillary Clinton presidential campaign would have regarding the 2016 Republican presidential field. Clearly most of what is contained in this memo is work the DNC is already doing. This exercise is intended to put those ideas to paper.

Our Goals & Strategy

Our hope is that the goal of a potential HRC campaign and the DNC would be one-in-the-same: to make whomever the Republicans nominate unpalatable to a majority of the electorate. We have outlined three strategies to obtain our goal:

1) Force all Republican candidates to lock themselves into extreme conservative positions that will hurt them in a general election;

2) Undermine any credibility/trust Republican presidential candidates have to make inroads to our coalition or independents;

3) Muddy the waters on any potential attack lodged against HRC.

Operationalizing the Strategy

Pied Piper Candidates

There are two ways to approach the strategies mentioned above. The first is to use the field as a whole to inflict damage on itself similar to what happened to Mitt Romney in 2012. The variety of candidates is a positive here, and many of the lesser known can serve as a cudgel to move the more established candidates further to the right. In this scenario, we don’t want to marginalize the more extreme candidates, but make them more “Pied Piper” candidates who actually represent the mainstream of the Republican Party. Pied Piper candidates include, but aren’t limited to:

• Ted Cruz

• Donald Trump

• Ben Carson

We need to be elevating the Pied Piper candidates so that they are leaders of the pack and tell the press to them seriously.

Undermining Their Message & Credibility

Most of the more-established candidates will want to focus on building a winning general election coalition. The “Pied Pipers” of the field will mitigate this to a degree, but more will need to be done on certain candidates to undermine their credibility among our coalition (communities of color, millennials, women) and independent voters. In this regard, the goal here would be to show that they are just the same as every other GOP candidate: extremely conservative on these issues.

[–]dilatory_tactics [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Never interfere with your enemy when he is making a mistake.

A++ for encouraging the giant Trojan/Trumpian horse to explode and shit all over the Republican party. It could not have happened to a more deserving political party.

Republicans have been happy to destroy America for the sake of tax cuts for the super rich for decades. But they haven't had enough people in on it on their own, so they've had to cultivate a base of complete idiots. And now it's come back to bite them in a glorious way.

It doesn't make up for destroying America with their psychopathic greed, but it does feel like karmic justice on one level.

[–]Paradigmist [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

Oh, you mean like how the Koch Brothers helped fund pro-Bernie ads?

[–]LordoftheScheisse [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Or how Trump's been trying to pander to Bernie supporters since Bernie dropped out.

[–]AlexTeddy888 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

This is pretty standard politics. I have no doubt the Republicans had similar outlines regarding Bernie. There has been astonishingly little coming out of right wing media outlets regarding him or his policies during the primaries, even though he is a self-professed democratic socialist, the latter word something Republicans utterly despise.

[–]ChlkDstTtr [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

That's kinda how politics works. You raise up the weakest candidates so it's easier to crush them later on. It's a smart way to give your candidacy a better chance. It's not exactly a negative thing as much as you wish it was.

[–]KaitRaven [スコア非表示]  (11子コメント)

Nothing unusual about this. Both parties try to influence the narrative of the other. The only surprise is just how successful Trump ended up being. I would argue that the Clinton campaign had very little to do with Trump's ultimate success.