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Sincere question : Possible 'must play when fit' clause in Rooney's contract? (self.reddevils)

MakupaLakers が 投稿

Not critisism but a serious contract question, He was almost leaving to chelsea, Moyes managed to keep him. But since then he has been undroppable. Three managers later, kept kagawa, mata, mikhi. Is is possible we are a carrying a bad contract?

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[–]JayDevilK1993 17ポイント18ポイント  (2子コメント)

Simple answer is we don't know and it's unlikely we ever will.

Good article posted yesterday that stated he's never player less than 42 games which was interesting.

All I know is that today, he started off in a 433 as CM with Pogba and Fellani holding, despite what Jose said about him only being a 9, 9.5 or a 10.

2nd half he went on to play 10 and both of the wing positions. He was terrible in all of them.

Herrera has done more than enough to earn his starting place IMO. He's often just disregarded as that lovable guy who's decent at football and loves the game but I feel he's so much more.

[–]farfalameuxSmalling 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

I just like Herrera for his passion for the club, numerous times he's showed pure emotion for the team. Coming from Bilbao, this is especially impressive. We need to play players who care and will put in a shift for the badge on the front and not to get a nice paycheck at the end of the week. It's why many fans love the guy, he clearly cares arguably the most.

[–]MakupaLakers[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Probably the most sensible response to the question. Next question is why if he underperforms in a position, he is not subbed but rather shifted to another position. And everybody agrees he is no longer the powerful player he was due to age and milage? If in one game i saw the manager sub him to try and shake the team then yeah. But its most likely another player being subbed

[–]bosnian_red 39ポイント40ポイント  (0子コメント)

Starting to think so

[–]DaveShadow 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

Have thought this for a while tbh. Only reason we keep forcing him into positions he shouldn't be in over players who are natural in those positions.

[–]meho7GifLord 7ポイント8ポイント  (0子コメント)

Contract till 2019 and we have f..g Moyes to thank for it

[–]BUfels 3ポイント4ポイント  (2子コメント)

Starting to think it. Moyes' legacy lives on?

Mourinho has specifically stated that he will never play in midfield. Then it's so abundantly obvious we should play 4-3-3 that we do...

Except in that formation you'd need to play Rooney in midfield. Which he does. Such a joke.

[–]RVallant 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

I wouldn't put it past Moyes to make such a naive decision.

[–]BUfels 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Not even naive. Pretty cynically placing his own job security ahead of the club's long-term interests.

[–]throwawaycoolaid 8ポイント9ポイント  (2子コメント)

Man i miss Shinji. Was he that bad? I remember he scored a Hattrick

[–]SlappyBaggMichael "The Knife" Carrick 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Lmao. Love this sub. Yea he scored a hattrick in one of his only good games and went his last 30 games for us without a goal. Good player for Dortmund but didn't work out at all for us.

[–]TheOnlyTagey -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Against Norwich, and hasn't really commanded a starting place back at BvB. He's good don't get me wrong, but not good enough to start all our games...

[–]summerincassiopeia 14ポイント15ポイント  (1子コメント)

No.

[–]HighOnNicotine 5ポイント6ポイント  (7子コメント)

I've not seen a goal from a corner in ages. Is it coincidence that Rooney's on corner duty? Every single corner has been over hit by Rooney today. No idea if he has a clause, but Mourinho fancies him, and he will keep playing.

What was the last goal from a corner we scored? Schweinsteiger vs Leicester is all I can remember.

[–]_Mayama_#2sweet 4ポイント5ポイント  (4子コメント)

We just shit on corners, Rooney, Mata, Blind, etc... all been on corners duty and we rarely ever score from them.

[–]HighOnNicotine 0ポイント1ポイント  (3子コメント)

Rooney's been taking them all this season, we scored none.

I thought it was a fault of Louis van Gaal on how he has coached the team to attack corners, but Rooney has not given us any chance by overhitting each cross.

[–]shotputprinceVidić 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Better than blind hitting g the first man each time though

[–]_Mayama_#2sweet 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Mata took a few this season and it was the same result. We're just generally shite on corner.

[–]DaveShadow 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't even expect goals from corners, cause thats not a common thing. But Rooney isn't even getting them accurately to anyone in the box. The number of corners that either hit the first man or dropped to absolutely no one today was incredible.

[–]OriArRooney 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

We are shit at corners, and always have been even in Fergie's years.

[–]wakey87433Mata 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Rooneys set peices have been awful for a few seasons. Even when we have scored from a Rooney FK against City he completly over hit it so the goal was more luck than judgement

[–]spoofexKing Cantona 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

We would never agree to it. No manager puts that into a players contract unless they plan to sell him straight away.

[–]parton9020 times, 20 times, Man United 8ポイント9ポイント  (0子コメント)

Put your tin foil hat back on and return to your shack in the woods immediately

[–]MegaGowl 17ポイント18ポイント  (16子コメント)

Anyone who seriously thinks there is an absolute idiot really.

[–]doesnt_like_pantsJose Mourinho 1ポイント2ポイント  (12子コメント)

I don't think there is but it's not as if such a clause categorically couldn't exist.

[–]Kiddcohen39Bailly 16ポイント17ポイント  (11子コメント)

No it couldn't. It categorically couldn't. How anyone could possibly think a team like Manchester United would include such a clause is beyond me. Anyone with any capacity of critical thinking will understand the absurdity of that statement.

[–]ManUToasterMartial 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

How anyone could possibly think a team like Manchester United would include such a clause is beyond me.

I mean... we did give him an absurdly lucrative contract that we all knew was not going to be worth it on the long term (I think most of us imagined his decline a little bit later in his career though). I'm not saying he has a clause in his contract but I don't think this is the stupid proposition you make it out to be.

First, Woody on his first year. Rooney is the face of the team so from a marketing point of view he would've been happy to tie him down to the club and to see him play as much as possible.

Second, keeping Rooney (at the time) was THE moment that would define Moyes' United career... that was the narrative at least...

Third, with the new manager coming and with the iffy relationship Wayne had with Moyes (though they will both say they had made up and were great friends) it wouldn't be past Wayne to look out for himself and ask for such a clause (especially if he anticipated, in any degree, Moyes' inevitable failure). We all know that, despite being a club hero, Wayne is selfish (as he is entitled to be I suppose) and he will never put United before himself and what's best for him so would he give two fucks if 4 years down the road a clause would be hurting the team?

And I guess four, his agent is a cunt and I would not put him past him to instigate this whole idea.

I think you're giving "a team like Manchester United" too much credit. When in reality the decision would've been made by the two dudes that thought buying Fellaini for 28m was a sound decision...

You keep saying how stupid this conspiracy is, and I agree that putting such clause in Rooney's contract would be massively idiotic, but that doesn't really make it any less plausible.

Just playing devils advocate though, every time someone is too quick to dismiss a conspiracy for being too stupid, improbably, or far fetched, it makes me consider it even more. The truth is, if this wasn't so unlikely then it wouldn't be a conspiracy at all and we would all be discussing it openly so... let's indulge a little and believe that Woodward and Moyes can actually be that stupid.

[–]MajorWayneKerr 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

But in the Ronaldo documentary Mendes confirmed that when Ronaldo first joined United he would get at least 50% playing time and that was in his contract. Why is it dumb to assume something similar for Rooney?

[–]DaveShadow -2ポイント-1ポイント  (3子コメント)

Moyes obviously saw Rooney as a critical part of his team when he offered him the bumper contract. Would it really be so hard to believe that if Rooney asked for such a clause, Moyes wouldn't have thought "Sure, I'll be playing him week in and week out anyway, so what difference does it make?"

[–]Kiddcohen39Bailly 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yes, it's that hard to believe. People have been predicting Rooney's decline for years now and it was never difficult to see coming in the first place considering his age and years spent at the top level. In what world would a manager possibly include a clause on such a lengthy contract that fundamentally blocks them from shaping the team they want? This is literally one of the stupidest conspiracies I've ever heard on this sub and these desperate attempts at rationalization such that Moyes would just throw in such a god awful and impactful clause off hand is laughable at best.

[–]hoochiscrazy_Giggs 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yes it would be hard to believe. And even harder to believe that the rest of the club's heirarchy would have allowed it

[–]OriArRooney 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Which is why Rooney wouldn't ask for it anyway.

The few times those clauses are given it's when it's a young player worried about his playing time, not the face of the team FFS.

[–]danskzwag -1ポイント0ポイント  (4子コメント)

This is the same team that was stupid enough to give Rooney a 5 year contract , we also spent 59 million without having a clear role for Di Maria

[–]Kiddcohen39Bailly 2ポイント3ポイント  (3子コメント)

I understand the point you're trying to make but the situations aren't even remotely similar in terms of stupidity required.

[–]danskzwag -1ポイント0ポイント  (2子コメント)

I wouldn't be surprised though Moyes royally fucked up in the transfer window

[–]Kiddcohen39Bailly 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Yes Moyes was shocking but I can personally promise you that such a clause wasn't made. And I have literally zero ITK on the matter other than common sense.

[–]danskzwag 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Common sense is also something utd lack because it looks like Pogba is our 2nd massive but without us having a clear role for him

[–]SlappyBaggMichael "The Knife" Carrick 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Plenty of idiots on this sub don't worry

[–]BUfels 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Don't put anything past David Moyes

[–]wharsmetoothpicson 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

What fucking idiots do we have on here? Go and have a look at the team sheet from Thursday or just pause and think about what you're asking.

[–]MakupaLakers[S] -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

A game in a tournament that manager himself said does not see as a priority?

[–]OriArRooney 1ポイント2ポイント  (5子コメント)

Jesus fucking Christ, he was bad today but some people go way overboard.

[–]MakupaLakers[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (4子コメント)

So if the consensus he was bad, which has happened in several games and most people agree he is no longer the player he was due to time and games played, why is he an automatic selection. Another player drops in performance are either dropped, or rested. Again, this is not critism of rooney play, but he underperforms more nowadays and is never rested.

[–]OriArRooney 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Firstly, it was the first game this season he was genuinely bad, in August he was better than Mata and Martial and was probably the best attacking player in the derby so he didn't deserve to get dropped for it either.

This is the first match where Rooney was among the worst on the team, let's see what happens now.

[–]johnsom3Ronaldo 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Mata and martial have both been dropped, so they have nothing to do with this discussion. "Player x was was worse then Rooney" doesn't change the fact that Rooney was poor. Stop trying to deflect away attention from him.

[–]sodaboixBerba T 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Honestly though. No player performed upto the mark today. De gea was ok. Valencia too but didnt do anything special. Bailly Smalling didnt look awesome. Shaw wasnt at his best, misplaced quite a few along the flank. Fellaini, well. Ibra ok. Pogba not at his best. Mata looked good coming on.

It was a bad overall performance. As a team. Period.

[–]OriArRooney 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Smalling and Baily were horrific.

We missed Blind bigtime today, if he plays the team would look way better.

[–]ateroPride of all Europe 2ポイント3ポイント  (6子コメント)

Serious question: have you taken a knock to the head?

[–]MakupaLakers[S] 2ポイント3ポイント  (5子コメント)

Nope. Check NBA contracts are more transparent and clauses like this are known. For example a marquee player must approve all new signings. They are ridiculous but they exist

[–]OriArRooney 0ポイント1ポイント  (3子コメント)

The only clauses that exist in the NBA about this kind of stuff is a no trade clause, there isn't a single guy in the NBA that has clauses about deciding stuff that isn't related to him directly, even Lebron doesn't have this type of shit in his contract.

[–]MakupaLakers[S] -1ポイント0ポイント  (2子コメント)

Are you seriously saying LeBron is not involved in player recruitment? And historically players like Kobe and Jordan never vetoed player trades? I can agree with the people who say we dont have such a clause with rooney it will be stupid, but saying some players dont have them in sports? There is alot of evidence they exists

[–]OriArRooney 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

They never had a clause in the contract that allows them to do so.

It's just that they have fuckloads of influence over their GMs enough that they are consulted before everything.

[–]MakupaLakers[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Lets remember that if Fergie had stayed Rooney would be gone. So is possible he has that level of influence without it being in the contract?

[–]ateroPride of all Europe 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Thankfully United play in England, not corporate America.

[–]ADMRVPBailly -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

No way

[–]Crusty_Gammon_FlapsBailly 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Probably have to pay him a shit ton of money if he doesn't play.

[–]wakey87433Mata 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Highly unlikley. Think it's just that Moyes seemed to decide that keeping Rooney would be seen as a feather in his cap so bent over backwards to play him, even to the point where in that Bayern away game when he wasn't fit and could barely kick the ball he got played. Then LVG made him captain and LVG has always been someone who will generally subscribes to the Captain always plays ideal. Rooney seemed to take the off field element of being captain seriously which I think may be now causing Jose issues in dropping him because he can get away with freezing Bastian out but doing anything against Rooney could see it cause problems

[–]RyanSorsbyFalcao 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

There has to be. Plays in week in week out regardless of form.

[–]mrpiggywinkles52Rooney 0ポイント1ポイント  (5子コメント)

Why the fuck are we blaming everything on Rooney? The complete lack of movement, lack of runs, lack of in form players and lack of creativity is what is fucking us over. Not to mention Smalling was fucking atrocious. It is PATHETIC. Mourinho is not infallible and he didn't make the right subs, he didn't play the right way and he is failing miserably as a result, as much as the players are to blame Mourinho is too.

[–]MakupaLakers[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Three Managers later, and still its their fault? Mourinho is possible one of the top 10 managers in the world and still its his tactics. Something doesn't add up with the team.

[–]DaveShadow 0ポイント1ポイント  (3子コメント)

Whataboutery doesn't help. Plenty of blame to go round, but Rooney as captain, one of the higher paid players, and being played constantly out of position cause he can't nail down any, is always going to yield discussion.

[–]mrpiggywinkles52Rooney -1ポイント0ポイント  (2子コメント)

Certainly, but I just think people are too quick to only blame Rooney yet their favourites in Martial, Pogba etc. played far worse in this game.

[–]DaveShadow 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I've seen no one defend Martial or Pogba, but its a topic about Rooney so I'd expect 99% of the discussion to be about Rooney :/

[–]Bighairman 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Pogba didn't play worse than Rooney though did he?

[–]Sidonian7 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

It's the only logical answer. But seriously, for all the good that Rooney did in his younger years for this club, he's seriously nearly ruined that legacy now with his form over the past 3 years. The amount of potential progress that we have lost as a club thanks to that form...

[–]SonnyisKing -3ポイント-2ポイント  (0子コメント)

It's the only explanation to why this useless out of shape cunt is still playing.

When Rashford scored the goal, he was trying to ask for a penalty instead of playing to the whistle. Just about sums him up really.

[–]LetsPlayForza4 -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

José and even Van Gaal really can't be that stupid not to drop him? Surely they see that he is absolute crap

[–]lectroboy -4ポイント-3ポイント  (2子コメント)

So who out there played better than Rooney today? Nobody. Lots of hate here for Rooney yet Zlatan, Pogba, Martial, Fellani, Bailly, Smalling, And Shaw were all worse than him.

[–]IwanJones10Pogba 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Are you sure? Rooney was the worst player. Shaw, Pogba and Fellaini were the best

[–]kaizoku7 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

No one else gave the ball away almost everytime he touched it. Players seem scared to pass to Rooney at times.