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Did I commit assault? How can I defend? (self.legaladvice)

ArcherPI が 投稿

Edit: Completely forgot! I'm in Winnipeg, Manitoba. Sorry everybody.

I'll make this quick and cut to the chase. My coworker who is on maternity leave made the obligatory post-birth visit to the office today with her new baby so we could al say "hi" and see how they're both doing.

So she's in the break room passing around the baby when I pop in to grab my lunch and take it outside. It's pretty chilly, but we can't bring food onto the floor and the break room was extra crowded because everyone wanted a look at the guest of honour. I'm not a baby person, so my plan was to slip in and out without disrupting this ritual. But it's a bit of an obstacle course to the fridge and I'm very friendly with most of the people I work with so naturally, I get sucked into the pleasant chit chat of a couple of my work mates and the next thing I know the new mother is joining the conversation,I say hi to the baby, ask all the obligatory questions, (Gender: male, age: I forget, healthy? Yes.) and then a second later she's trying to pass her baby to me.

It all happened in a second. I'm still not 100% clear on the exact order of events, but as I remember it, I heard her suddenly saying, "ArcherPi you haven't gotten a turn yet". And then she kind of lobbed the baby against my chest, while I stuck my hands behind my back and stepped away instinctively. I guess she let go instinctively before she noticed that last detail because she removed her own hands in the same motion and the baby tumbled.

We have hard tile floors in the break room and bathroom and the baby's head made a sort of hollow thunk, there was a pause, and then the baby started wailing. My coworkers all swarmed to pick her up and her mother starts screaming at me! I don't feel strong enough to repeat the parts I remember except when she hustled out of there saying she was taking her to the hospital, and then before she leaves, she says that she is going to press assault charges against me.

The break room is under video surveillance. I already went to security and asked them if it was possible to make a copy of the break room footage from today and they said no problem if I need it for legal purposes. The break room was also full of people who witnessed the event.

I'm fairly certain that I can't be held accountable. FAIRLY. I have the footage and the witnesses, but I'm worried that not everyone would see it that way. Namely, I'm worried about what constitutes an assault. I don't feel like I did anything LEGALLY wrong in this scenario. Did I?

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[–]derspiny 103ポイント104ポイント  (7子コメント)

Now that you've posted your location: It's not assault.

s. 265 (1) A person commits an assault when

(a) without the consent of another person, he applies force intentionally to that other person, directly or indirectly;

(b) he attempts or threatens, by an act or a gesture, to apply force to another person, if he has, or causes that other person to believe on reasonable grounds that he has, present ability to effect his purpose; or

(c) while openly wearing or carrying a weapon or an imitation thereof, he accosts or impedes another person or begs.

In no way is refusing to grasp someone assault.

[–]Radix2309 116ポイント117ポイント  (6子コメント)

One could argue the mother assaulted OP with the baby.

[–]the_ocalhoun 27ポイント28ポイント  (5子コメント)

Assault with a deadly weapon.

[–]artanis00 40ポイント41ポイント  (4子コメント)

Assault with a lively weapon.

[–]mickles1975 18ポイント19ポイント  (2子コメント)

Well it used to be lively until she dropped it. Now when it grows up it's gonna be all "Hey you guys!"

[–]Durbee 4ポイント5ポイント  (1子コメント)

You're on a straight line to hell, and damn you for taking me with you.

[–]songoku9001 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Biological weapon of mass distraction??

[–]promnesiac 248ポイント249ポイント  (10子コメント)

OP, I'm wincing on your behalf. This sounds to me like bad timing and a not-very-bright mother -- not assault. She dropped the kid, after all.

[–]ArcherPI[S] 100ポイント101ポイント  (9子コメント)

Thank you. I feel terrible about the whole thing, and I honestly didn't even realize what was happening until it was all over. Ironically, I prefer not to handle babies because I'm so afraid my giant hands will mishandle them in some way. They just seem so fragile.

[–]promnesiac 42ポイント43ポイント  (2子コメント)

I can sympathize -- I find holding babies to be nerve-racking as all get out.

[–]whiskeytaang0 25ポイント26ポイント  (1子コメント)

As a parent (couldn't resist that 'ole chestnut), I'm shocked they're as tough as they are. The worst is passing them to someone else in all honesty. Not because I worry what other people will do, but your arms can get crossed up and you're not sure if the other person has them.

[–]dusters 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

They have to be that tough or we wouldn't have anyone left.

[–]mountaingoat05 65ポイント66ポイント  (1子コメント)

Not legal advice.

As an overbreeder (as in, I have given birth to more than 3 kids), I still totally get that babies are terrifying to people who don't have them. I would never make someone hold my baby unless they specifically asked. She was an idiot to thrust the baby at you. I would never think you did anything wrong. I'll be outraged if you have any negative consequences for this.

[–]Grave_Girl 28ポイント29ポイント  (0子コメント)

Oh man, I'm an overbreeder too and I am still nervous about handing the baby off to people who want to hold him. Never let go of the kid until the other person's arms are securely around him and he's cuddled close. The heck was this mom thinking?

[–]SGDFish 6ポイント7ポイント  (1子コメント)

As an OB I used to work with said, "it's not very hard to be a baby, they're pretty resilient"

[–]Lying_idiot 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

OP missed his chance to say this, then X-post to /r/TIFU

[–]Darth_Pyre 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

Ironically enough, I refuse to hold other people's babies because I'm afraid I'll drop them...

[–]stillobsessed 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

A pediatrican's advice to us a day after our kid was born: "Don't worry. Really, the only way you can hurt them is by dropping them..".

They're not that fragile. I just don't see anyone to blame other than the mother... Hope the kid is OK.

[–]derspiny 54ポイント55ポイント  (3子コメント)

we could al say

u/locationbot, you had one job.

OP, the definition of assault will be given in your state, province, or national criminal code. Failing to hold onto a baby the instant it was handed to you without warning is generally not assault. The mother can still file a police report, and she may even - possibly honestly - claim that you dropped her baby. The police, not the mother, will be in charge of any further investigation. Realistically, the odds are pretty slim of anything coming of this beyond hurt feelings.

[–]Reddisaurusrekts 14ポイント15ポイント  (2子コメント)

the odds are pretty slim of anything coming of this beyond hurt feelings.

Pretty sure the baby hurt its head too.....

[–]Dash_O_Cunt 10ポイント11ポイント  (1子コメント)

Nah babies are resilient

[–]GodlySphinx 12ポイント13ポイント  (0子コメント)

Prince Aegon disagrees.

[–]family_jewelS 102ポイント103ポイント  (7子コメント)

holy crap, i dont know the legalities of baby handling, but my god that lady is an idiot to assume every one wants to hold her god damn baby

[–]ArcherPI[S] 19ポイント20ポイント  (6子コメント)

To be fair, we are a pretty friendly workplace. There aren't that many of us, so we've all socialized together to some extent. And this woman, while I wouldn't consider her a friend exactly since we only see each other at work, is someone I've gotten along with very well before this.

[–]beowuff 38ポイント39ポイント  (0子コメント)

Doesn't matter. That woman is still a god damn idiot. I hated babies before I had my own kid. I was always a nervous wreak around them. I love my kid and now have no problem holding other people's kids, since I'm now use to it. But that doesn't mean I WANT to hold someone else's bratty kid. She dropped it, not you. You should have 0 guilt here.

Now, if she asked, that's a different story. It's the assumption that makes her an idiot.

[–]FilthyRedditses 31ポイント32ポイント  (4子コメント)

I hope this isnt rule breaking here but, could you update this when you know the condition of the baby? I'm really sorry that happened to you, the mother, the baby.. I feel unwell.

[–]ArcherPI[S] 33ポイント34ポイント  (0子コメント)

It was definitely one of those moments that feels almost physically painful to think about.

[–]alice-in-canada-land 28ポイント29ポイント  (1子コメント)

Baby cried immediately afterwards, and is probably ok.

It's when they don't cry that you have to worry.

[–]Bufo_Stupefacio 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

Sounds like advice from an experienced baby-dropper.

[–]darsynia 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Me too. No blame on OP but I love babies and have a friend who has brain damage from falling out of his carseat as a baby.

[–]taterbizkit 47ポイント48ポイント  (1子コメント)

She assaulted you with her baby -- using the "put the victim in apprehension of an immediate battery" definition. It's pretty clear you "apprehended" an unwanted touching via the baby. Same as if she threw an 8lb rock at you.

Countersue. The way this turned out would give me nightmares.

(This is all in jest, btw).

[–]Reddisaurusrekts 12ポイント13ポイント  (0子コメント)

The way this turned out would give me nightmares.

Intentional Infliction of Emotional Distress?

[–]2317 43ポイント44ポイント  (7子コメント)

What the fuck kind of mother chucks her infant at someone else like a game of hot potato? If the cops are looking for someone to arrest I'm pretty sure it won't be you.

[–]RaineBearNW 28ポイント29ポイント  (6子コメント)

I'm sitting here trying to picture how this happens. Every mom I have seen pass a baby carefully places the baby in someone's outstretched or cradled arms. Who the fuck just drops a baby into someone's hands??

[–]ohnochin 17ポイント18ポイント  (3子コメント)

This post reeks of creative writing style bullshit, either that or OP is leaving out a lot of details.

[–]KnightWhoSaysNi1 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

I've wondered this too, especially since OP's post history is pages upon pages in r/childfree .

[–]b0bo 9ポイント10ポイント  (1子コメント)

Could be. OP specifically identifies the baby as male then says the mother is taking "her" to the hospital.

[–]SquattingDawg 9ポイント10ポイント  (0子コメント)

As a childless man, babies have no gender. They are things to fear. An "it", if you will.

[–]DasKapitalist 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

I've had that happen to me before. And I /hate/ babies. I'm glad I grabbed it by reflex while frantically protesting or I'd be in the same boat as the OP.

[–]Reddisaurusrekts 30ポイント31ポイント  (3子コメント)

Your coworker is an idiot and you're legally in the clear.

[–]RoboticElfJedi 14ポイント15ポイント  (2子コメント)

To be fair, the new mother just saw her baby go head first into a tiled floor. It could have gotten badly hurt. She was no doubt in a state of panic and high emotion. Of course she would want to blame somebody in that instant. She may well cam down and forget about getting OP charged especially if, and hopefully when, the baby is given the all clear.

[–]Reddisaurusrekts 12ポイント13ポイント  (0子コメント)

Oh yeah no doubt, there's certainly an element of that. No - the idiocy was in throwing a baby at someone who hadn't confirmed they'd want to, or were going to, hold the baby.

[–]darsynia 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

This--take any threats or similar reactions as shock and fear, OP.

[–]ElMachoGrande 7ポイント8ポイント  (2子コメント)

When handling over a baby, one checks that the other person has a good hold before letting go. That's common sense and ordinary parenting. I suspect the might get into trouble over that, should she choose to go to court.

That said, I'm not a lawyer, so what do I know...

[–]SJHillman 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

Unless it's a pair of uncles. Then they're free to toss the baby between them at will.

[–]The_Choir_Invisible 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

I would get a copy of that tape and keep it in a safe place, just in case, even if they don't wind up making a stink now. Because they may make a stink about it later. Like, years later. You want to have some kind of defense against that.

[–]alex3omg 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

You might want to post to /r/relationships to find out what to do about keeping the peace with your co-workers. I'm sure they'll have some advice.

[–]fireork12 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Legally, you're peachy keen, but you might want to get it out to almost everyone you can in the office with the video, seeing as people will trust the idiotic mother of the baby in the hospital, than the person who she accused of putting the baby in the hospital.

[–]shatter321 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

A call to CPS may not be amiss here...

[–]darsynia 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Please don't waste their time. It was a mistake, borne from a desire to show off the baby, not from neglect.

[–]MiseEnSelle 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Honestly! Who THROWS a BABY? (a la Austin Powers)

[–]RenegadePM 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

So, since most here is not actually legal advice... It appears from Canadian law that you're in the clear. And, according to Canadian law, the mother assaulted you by applying force intentionally to you (directly or indirectly). Canadian law does NOT require that the force be with intent to be harmful or offensive. Thusly, mama bear committed a crime, not you. If she tries to raise hell, waltz into your police department and open up some whoopass. If she walks on off, I'd advise letting dipshits be better off alone. Not Canadian, not a lawyer there, but am a lawyer in US... hire someone if she files something, but you're all good. Sub to /r/childfree and bask in the glory. ONE OF US!