LeeLee in Babylon

LeeLee in Babylon

Girly Thoughts on The Red Pill

Of Course Women Are Objects

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(You’ll want to follow this post up with Aftercare)
A feminist left a comment on my Brock Turner post the other day that really got me thinking. Here it is:
Nikki
 
It was the absurdity of the statement that got the wheels in my head turning. Of course women, as human beings, are objects – we’re physical beings, blood and skin and hair and cartilage.
The most ethereal things about humanity; the arts, great works of fiction, poetry, scientific discovery, etc. issue forth from our very object-ness; our brain matter, neurons, hormones, etc.
We are objects. Human beings are objects. That feminists like Nikki deny this fact testifies to how much feminism has evolved into a religion. The dogma of feminism is that women possess a brightly burning, otherworldly spiritual value that cannot be extinguished or even diminished by any negative choices, attitudes, or behaviors – except for the heresy of denying feminism itself.
Let’s be clear: If you are a human being reading this post, whether you have a penis or a vagina, you are an object. Your value isn’t lurking somewhere outside of your physical existence, it’s located solidly within it. What you do with the raw material of your body – your thoughts, your face, your voice, your emotions, your hormones, your muscles, your sexual organs — this is where you produce value, or lose it.
What feminists hate about this glaringly obvious truth is that it means women have a burden of performance – just like men do. Of course, feminists are glad to evaluate men as objects with the potential to add or lose value. Are they utilizing their physical strength to protect women while they’re out drinking themselves into incapacitation? Are they misappropriating the raw material of their minds on video games and porn? Are their emotions in line with what feminists like to see, or are they ensnared in “toxic masculinity”?
While feminist perception of what men’s burden of performance is is as absurd and baseless as the rest of their dogma, they’re not wrong that men have a burden of performance. They’re wrong that women don’t have one too.
The female burden of performance is sometimes just as heavy as men’s. We’re expected to provide beauty for this world – to be beautiful, to be thin and lovely and stylish, and to create beautiful spaces. We’re expected to be kind and people-oriented, and so provide a kind of social glue. We’re expected to be quieter and more gentle, and so add a restful balance to the roughness of masculinity. We’re expected to be mothers, and use our reproductive capacities well to literally propagate our heritage.
When we misuse our reproductive capacities in the forms of casual sex, multiple partners, abortion and the like, we hemorrhage value — because our existence as objects is so heavily tied to our bodily capacity to create and sustain human life. But to acknowledge this thread of common sense that has run through human history would get in the way of feminism’s goal of expanding female power ad infinitum, regardless of the consequences.
The truth? By failing to live up to the burden of being an object – by being fat, slovenly, loud, aggressive, slutty, or selfish – women truly can lose value. Just like men.
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33 Comments on "Of Course Women Are Objects"
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insanitybytes22
Guest
2 months 6 days ago
I’m really sorry you perceive yourself and others as objects. That’s very red pillian of you. We’re all just commodities in a meat suit with a SMV. It’s an ugly, perverse kind of heresy that really has no place in Christ. I wish I could help you to see that, but I suppose your insatiable need for RP male approval is going to trump anything I could ever say.
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LeeLee
Author
2 months 5 days ago
You could start by stating your counter-position and defending it, rather than beginning by lamenting that I could never accept push back. Believe it or not, I welcome readers arguing with my positions. What I’m saying is no heresy. God created humans and called them good. Being in a physical body is not a negative thing, what’s negative about our physical bodies right now is that they’re infected by sin. When Jesus comes back, he’s not going to set up free from physical existence, he’s going to resurrect us into a better physical existence. Your life in Christ happens in… Read more »
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insanitybytes22
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2 months 5 days ago
Here, I have done my best to explain the problem,
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LeeLee
Author
2 months 5 days ago
I’ll repost my response to you here: Insanity, why do you have such a low view of life in the body? Being a human is not about being a “meat sack” — as I said to you before, God created humans as physical creatures and called it *good*. Your claim that we are spirits inhabiting bodies sounds very much like dualism to me, which I associate more with Aristotle than with Jesus Christ. Perhaps this is why my post is so offensive to you, because you seem to see spiritual life as something that happens apart from our bodies. I… Read more »
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MaryBeth
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MaryBeth
2 months 5 days ago
I think you’d enjoy reading how Ortega describes women, it’s reinforces your point, women’s connections with their bodies, etc. It’s very interesting, specifically in “Man and People” and “On Love” by Jose Ortega y Gasset, you can find his books in English on Amazon.
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LeeLee
Author
2 months 5 days ago
Thank you for the recommendation! I’ll definitely check it out!
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Liz
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Liz
2 months 5 days ago
People are objects?!?
Bring in the fainting goats!
Next you’ll claim that “all flesh is grass”.
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Liz
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Liz
2 months 4 days ago
Comment at IB’s. I’ll quote it here, for clarity because I’d like a response from you Lee lee.
“She certainly said of all humans, men and women alike cannot be spiritual beings or even have a spiritual part of ourselves which denies much of God’s teaching.”
Is the above true?
I ask so you can make it clear. As far as I can tell you never stated, nor implied, the above.
Quite the contrary, but perhaps I am interpreting you wrong and the poster who made the above statement is interpreting you correctly, so I thought I’d ask you directly.
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LeeLee
Author
2 months 4 days ago
No not at all! That’s not what I’m saying. I just don’t see a dichotomy between the body and spirituality. I don’t know how Biblical it is to say that souls are these disembodied things floating in and out of physical bodies. In fact, that sounds like where a lot of heresy has come from. I think our spiritual life happens in our body. There is the element of intervention that comes from the Holy Spirit, but I don’t think that downplays that our relationship with God is something that is born out of our physical bodies. The point I’m… Read more »
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Mike
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Mike
2 months 4 days ago
I see what you are trying to say but I’m not sure I can get behind it. Yes, in the comments here you connect our value and existence to Christ, but you play a dangerous game saying that humans are objects with more or less value based on performance. That’s the same argument being used to justify abortion and can be used to justify infanticide or assisted-suicide and euthanizing the elderly. This system of valuing a person based on their performance is entirely other than the gospel, which says that God so loved us that he sent his Son for… Read more »
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LeeLee
Author
2 months 4 days ago
Mike, your comment has given me a lot to think about but what about this: If all humans are intrinsically valuable, why did God command the death penalty and genocide in the Old Testament? To me, it suggest that bearing the image of God is a responsibility as much as it is a privileged position, and you can cross lines that make you unworthy to continue bearing the image, or even inappropriate for you to continue in human life.
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Mike
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Mike
2 months 3 days ago
Indeed those are difficult circumstances to reconcile with. I’ve done a bit of reading and thinking, as well as read more of these comments, and I have a couple of conclusions. 1. “Object” must be defined clearly. This has been hit upon and clarified in comments below. Obviously you meant that we are made up of physical elements, and will gain new physical elements in our new resurrected bodies. However, the word object can mean and imply inanimate, owned/dominated completely by people. Other people do not belong in this category, which I believe was the objection to your original analogy.… Read more »
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Shadow Boxer
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Shadow Boxer
2 months 4 days ago
Hi Leelee. I really liked your original post and I concur with Mike that your original analogy about houses and arson was excellent. As heinous as rape is, and I do consider it to be a heinous act, I have a hard time sympathizing with a woman who got victimized because she was dumb enough to get knocked out loaded at a frat party and pass out behind a dumpster. All that said, I also concur with Mike that referring to anyone as an “object” is very problematic from a Christian perspective. Here’s my reason: One of the ways in… Read more »
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LeeLee
Author
2 months 4 days ago
I understand your objection and I definitely don’t mean to imply that humans have no free will when I refer to us as “objects”. The post probably should have been longer and had more explanation, but the point to me of saying that we’re objects is that we are what we do in our physical body, which includes the way we feel and choose towards God. I’m including emotions, values, ideas, plans, etc in the life of an object, because I see our minds as being a part of our bodies. Your example about capital punishment for rape makes sense,… Read more »
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Liz
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Liz
2 months 4 days ago
IMO, there are so many real world examples to pull from, there’s really no reason to use extreme examples like the death penalty to make the point. People understand fundamentally that behaviors and appearances add or decrease value. That’s why a person who is serious about his or her job hunt will not show up at the interview in a ratty tee shirt and jeans. It’s the purpose of zoning laws…society recognizes that a red light district brings crime, and if a prostitute is working your corner and a junky is shooting up near your doorstep you don’t live in… Read more »
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LeeLee
Author
2 months 4 days ago
The OT death penalty thing has been a stream of thought swirling around in my mind for a few months now.. it’s not necessarily related to this but it does deserve it’s own discussion at some point and probably a post once I’ve picked it apart sufficiently.
You’re right, it is completely obvious though that you can gain or lose personal value through any number of actions far less extreme than murder. This is true from a Christian or secular perspective.
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John K
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John K
2 months 4 days ago
From a Christian perspective, the redeemed can never loose value in God’s eyes but one might provoke some correction because He chastens whom He loves. In the secular perspective, your witness and testimony can loose credibility because of your choices or behavior. Those that are under the judgement of the law of sin and death will always judge the appearance and behavior of others.
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Liz
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Liz
2 months 3 days ago
John K, I want to make sure I’m interpreting what you are saying correctly. Are you asserting that actions (aka appearance and behavior) don’t, and/or shouldn’t matter to Christians?
If that’s the case, it’s certainly odd the Bible includes so many passages on the subject.
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John K
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John K
2 months 3 days ago
Liz,
What I am saying is that I prefer the term ‘credibility’ over ‘value’. Our witness and testimony are what the world perceives when we interact with them. Most people do judge the appearance and behavior of the believer trying to determine their credibility. One who is careless with their appearance and behavior loses credibility. LeeLee and her husband must be doing something right because she has gained credibility in the manosphere (Christosphere). There are others that have little to no credibility.
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Liz
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Liz
2 months 3 days ago
Ah, thanks for the clarification John K.
🙂
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insanitybytes22
Guest
2 months 4 days ago
“If all humans are intrinsically valuable, why did God command the death penalty and genocide in the Old Testament?” Leelee, in faith we are all on death row. We are all guilty, we all fall short. “There is none righteous, not even one.” -Romans 3:10 And “While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.” God does not kill people based on our worth and value in the world, nor does he run about killing us because we’re bad. Death comes to us all. However, Romans 8:1 tells us, “There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in… Read more »
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LeeLee
Author
2 months 4 days ago
Are you a Universalist then, Insanity?
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insanitybytes22
Guest
2 months 4 days ago
No, I am not. John 14:6 tells us, “Jesus said to him, I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me.”
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LeeLee
Author
2 months 4 days ago
Okay. Honestly, you’re going off in many, many directions and I’m not really following you at this point. I’m not sure what that sermon about the eternal security of the believer had to do with the question of why God required death for offenders of certain mosaic laws.
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insanitybytes22
Guest
2 months 4 days ago
“Okay. Honestly, you’re going off in many, many directions and I’m not really following you at this point.” These are basic foundations of faith, not a sermon. These are bible versus. You’re calling women objects, off in Mosianic law, and now speaking of the death penalty. I’ve been trying to point you to Jesus Christ who does not perceive us as objects at all, nor does He hold us in condemnation, regardless of our allegedly being “fat, slovenly and slutty.” “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not… Read more »
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LeeLee
Author
2 months 3 days ago
Above is the comment that got IB banned, and this is a screenshot of her lying about it, for anyone interested.
Lying
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Liz
Guest
Liz
2 months 3 days ago
I don’t recall the portion of the writeup where Lee lee asserted that one will burn in hell for having a poor appearance or bad conduct, or that God will cast him or her out of salvation for it. She’s simply noting a fact of life that people are judged by their appearances and behavior, and outcomes are better (and communities benefit) when people show basic courtesy via their appearance, and don’t engage in destructive behaviors.
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Liz
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Liz
2 months 3 days ago
I must say, it’s quite interesting to me that in spite of the fact Lee lee has explained herself many times for clarity, those explanations are disregarded by IB and posters.
It isn’t lost with me (and I hope it isn’t lost with others, but I’m probably kidding myself), that while she has attempted to explain herself and attacks no one, those posters have not only ignored her explanations they have launched some rather personal attacks on HER character and motivations.
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LeeLee
Author
2 months 3 days ago
I had to block her. Her last comment was bordering on abuse so I deleted it and added her to my banned list. Her interactions with me feel very personal in a way that I don’t really understand because I don’t know her, aside from her reputation.
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Liz
Guest
Liz
2 months 3 days ago
“We launch mean spirited attacks, and it’s all so very Christian. But don’t you dare judge any behavior…that would be unChristian!”
Yeah. That makes sense. Are we talking about Chrisianity or The Secret here?
Ah well.
-Liz out
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Liz
Guest
Liz
2 months 3 days ago
Since my internet time on blogs is about over (for a few years anyway), thought I’d post some thoughts on my observations from online “Christian” debate. First, it’s ver apparent to me that interpretations differ. That’s why Dalrock and Vox have entirely different and conflicting interpretations from IB, yet they are all (ostensibly) debating from the same source material. And each, unsurprisingly, believes his or her interpretation to be “the right one”. When I was a moderator on a political debate forum, we stopped allowing religious debate for this reason. It wasn’t productive. What we would get is a bunch… Read more »
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LeeLee
Author
2 months 3 days ago
Thanks for your perspective, Liz. I know what you mean about dueling banjos. For me, I thrive on the push back and conflicting opinions usually, because I process outwardly and it helps trim the fat off my opinions. It’s funny because I had a conversation with a young earth creationist man at a church cookout recently. I didn’t let on to him that I believe in Evolution, just listened to what he had to say about Christians who believe in Evolution. Honestly it shook me up a bit. But it was good, it made me dig deeper into what my… Read more »
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Rollo Tomassi
Guest
2 months 3 days ago
Women are shocked that men are literally, neurologically wired to see them as sex objects. The parts of our brains that are attuned to using tools is stimulated when we see scantily dressed women. Women may be horrified by this, but one thing you will never hear them utter is a word of how astounding it is that men (largely) have such psychological self-control over it.
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