上位 200 件のコメント表示する 500

[–]jssuzuki 1522ポイント1523ポイント x2 (186子コメント)

For those who can't watch the video:

  1. There is no way that Riot knows that LCS teams are funneling the money they earn through League sponsorships into other esports. He went and asked every team if Riot ever asked for revenue sheets. None of the teams said so.
  2. There is indeed money in esports. Monte used an example with REN made 10X as much money from CSGO stickers than from summoner icons. Businesses don't go into esports believing that they will get nothing out of it.
  3. Therefore, Riot almost certainly makes money from League tournaments. When the client pops up a window touting the latest LCS match, the people who watch the games will not be distracted from external advertisements and etc., only showing the latest skins that the pros are playing. Monte claims that Riot almost certainly has marketing data showing that the LCS dramatically increases the likelihood that players buy a skin after seeing a match. In his own words "it is highly profitable for them." While casting Worlds, Monte would have to create champion packs that would be sold in discounted bundles. There is no profit sharing. Riot gets everything.
  4. Tencent would have stopped the esports realm if it lost them millions of dollars for no reasons. It was always an option that Riot could sell the broadcasting rights to a third party for a lot of money from sponsors because "the game is huge."
  5. It's Riot's imperative, not the teams, to increase player salaries via sponsorships and etc. Why not the teams? Because teams are already paying their players a reasonable amount of money. Nobody is paid the Riot Minimum, not that Monte knows of. If teams don't spend money, they are threatened by relegation constantly. Relegation ensures high competition for good players. If Riot is concerned about pay, they should raise the stipend, as it hasn't been since 2013. The game is much bigger now than it is then. Riot made 1.6 dollars last year.
  6. Riot is the "fucked up tyrant Santa Claus" who determines who goes on the naughty or nice list. Regi is part of the nice list arbitrarily.
  7. Salaries for players doubled or tripled since the entrance of venture capitalists. Regi is certainly paying his players top dollar. Monte claims that teams are actually willing to pay their players at a loss to build a brand, placing more market power into the hands of players over their owners. The logic behind this is that teams are willing to lose a little bit of money now to make an incomparable amout later on. Monte "broke his budget" paying for his players on REN.
  8. (He goes on a sidebar) Casters. Riot was offering rates that were roughly 40 to 70 percent of the "industry rate," that which is seen in Halo, Dota 2, etc. Monte asked Riot to pay him the industry standard rate. Riot said no. That's fine. It's their prerogative. CSGO casters make twice as much as Riot casters. Monte posits that all casters should be freelance casters, basically having all of the rights that Monte has now (streaming, casting for leagues not associated with Riot, getting sponsorships, etc.) Monte made more money than any Riot caster casting alone. Riot casters have a flat salary, regardless of how much work they do. MSI and worlds is extra work. In fact, at IEM tournament, casters are basically loaned out for free by Riot. Everyone else is paid directly by ESL. Jatt, Kobe, and Deficio can't make VODs or build their own brands because of Riot. Casting is inherently a talent job, not a salary job that pays relatively little. Dota 2 casters made as much in 3 weeks at TI as Riot casters in six months.
  9. Teams are very player-oriented. Teams are not making millions of dollars of the LCS because player salaries are at the highest they've been.
  10. The patch fundamentally changed the game. Every player that he has spoken to has hated the patch.
  11. Laneswapping is a skill. Some teams actually signed players that were good at laneswaps. Rosters are locked. They are screwed.
  12. We don't know that Doublelift and Biofrost can actually compete against the best in the world. Riot doesn't know jackshit about what skill is. Riot wants League of Legends to look like solo queue, which bolsters it as a marketing tool. They don't want viewers to be confused. They want to cram League into the most efficient marketing tool to sell skins.
  13. The fact that teams are forced to cater to sponsorships takes away from practice and leisure time, making player lives worse. Riot could step up and take more of the burden by sponsoring a mouse, a headset, or a computer, but they refuse to.
  14. Monte makes the majority of his money from other esports projects. He has perspective on other esports and claims that Riot is very much out of touch with its own scene and other esports scenes.

Edit: 1.6 billion dollars. Sad days.

[–]Waltorzz 259ポイント260ポイント  (13子コメント)

Very well summarized.

Nothing to add but this;

5. Riot made 1.6 dollars last year.

Made me laugh.

[–]Glorx 86ポイント87ポイント  (0子コメント)

No wonder Tryndamere wants Regi to spend "his millions". Rito is barely breaking even at this point. /s

[–]Pan_Borowik 407ポイント408ポイント  (42子コメント)

Riot casters have a flat salary, regardless of how much work they do. MSI and worlds is extra work. In fact, at IEM tournament, casters are basically loaned out for free by Riot.

I wonder if that had anything to do with my favourite duo of Deman and Joe Miller moving away from Riot.
I know there were other reasons mentioned, but this might have something to do with it as well.
Also, thanks for the TL:DW mate.

[–]ShadowguynickBDD is good 125ポイント126ポイント  (23子コメント)

Maybe for Joe Miller, but I know that at least the primary reason for Deman was because he would have to move away from his girlfriend and he didn't want that.

[–]StormknightUK 87ポイント88ポイント  (9子コメント)

Joe had opportunities to further his career. He's moved to more of a production director role and he wasn't going to get that staying where he was.

[–]xgenoriginalⰁⰀⰓⰄⰑⰂⰍⰀ, ⰝⰓⰅⰈ ⰁⰑⰆⰉⰤⰕⰀ ⰁⰎⰀⰃⰑⰄⰕ, ⰍⰓⰀⰎ ⰐⰀ ⰈⰅⰎⰅ 32ポイント33ポイント  (5子コメント)

and then they broke up.

[–]OGreatNoob 16ポイント17ポイント  (2子コメント)

I'm just glad Deman did. It's been great hearing him cast Overwatch.

[–]RKNetoSHROOOOOMS 28ポイント29ポイント  (77子コメント)

Thanks a lot.

Btw, what patch is he talking about on 10 and 11?

[–]DOOO_DOOO_BROWN 81ポイント82ポイント  (70子コメント)

6.15 which gave towers extra defensive stats for the first 5 minutes + the addition of "first turret blood" gold. It basically removed the OPTION of lane swaps from competitive play.

[–]denunciator 49ポイント50ポイント  (65子コメント)

Also, and the most important factor, botlane turrets lost their protection. If it's just those two the team with better laneswap strategy/comps would get WAY far ahead by nabbing the first turret. With the third change whoever gets the botside gets it first, disincentivizing swaps.

[–]Lenoxx97 13ポイント14ポイント  (58子コメント)

So is Monte complaining more about the fact that laneswap was a thing in the first place or the fact that the rosters were made for laneswapping, but now laneswapping isnt a thing anymore and the rosters are not as efficient as they could have been?

[–]ICantSurvivee 50ポイント51ポイント  (45子コメント)

He's complaining that it reduces the overall skill cap, since the option is essentially removed completely

[–]Lenoxx97 18ポイント19ポイント  (38子コメント)

Ah ok thanks. But dont most people in the community dislike laneswaps? I often hear people complaining about a boring early game thats always the same without much variety.

[–]Rohkor142 33ポイント34ポイント  (12子コメント)

What the majority of the community sees as entertaining is not necessarily what is most competitive/skill based. Monte is talking about how it removes strategy and higher skill ceilings in order to force the competitive scene to be more like what the average player will see in their games.

[–]Tortillagirl 18ポイント19ポイント  (16子コメント)

this change didnt exactly make it less boring though, its now survive 5 minutes if your team gave you a shitty toplane/botlane matchup. Then swap out for turret.

Had quite a few games with sub 5 kills in 20 minutes over the playoffs.. and tryndamere had the audacity to call games more bloody...

[–]sekaifrost 5ポイント6ポイント  (2子コメント)

only games that were bloody were the game 3/4 of envy vs c9 though that was more of envy running it down mid.

[–]DOOO_DOOO_BROWN 8ポイント9ポイント  (1子コメント)

Thanks!

[–]jssuzuki 11ポイント12ポイント  (0子コメント)

No problem. Just something I did on the side as I listened to monte

[–]NotLokey[Lokey] (SEA) 383ポイント384ポイント  (25子コメント)

Damn now that Monte mentioned it, I would love to see casters like Jatt or Deficio do some youtube stuff like vod reviews, thoughts expressing series like Monte's Musing or Thorin's Thoughts. Shame that we will never get that.

[–]Bloodrager[Splat] (EU-W) 40ポイント41ポイント  (0子コメント)

I believe it's also down to Riot that you don't see any on other people's talk shows like SI. That to me is ludicrous when you can't even indirectly build up your brand.

[–]RozuemUol And TSM <3 852ポイント853ポイント  (108子コメント)

Damn monte went in

Next post from tryndamere

"Monte is an asshole we won't be working with him anymore"

[–]Hey_Swizzy 338ポイント339ポイント  (78子コメント)

Too bad monte won't care because he will make more money off other content

[–]lightbetsoin 215ポイント216ポイント  (31子コメント)

yup he secured revenue elsewhere before going ham, smart guy! i hope the casters gets paid better thanks to him.

[–]Thoronris[Bithya] (EU-W) 568ポイント569ポイント  (168子コメント)

The comparison of casters employed by Riot and players employed by teams (around 15:00 onwards ) is a really interesting one. It's a good spot to term casters as "talents", because in the end that's what they are.

[–]Jinxzy[Pornstar LuIu] (EU-W) 283ポイント284ポイント  (72子コメント)

It was pretty big for me to hear Monte actually explain that even Riots own casters are getting fucked, as there seems to be this general idea floating around that they're doing super well compared to freelancers. It also makes Tryndameres comment even more disconnected with reality.

[–]Thoronris[Bithya] (EU-W) 97ポイント98ポイント  (64子コメント)

If you are actually employed you most of the time are better off than as a freelancer. At least in Germany freelancing sucks if you don't make a lot of money with it. The security aspect is big. Still, if you cannot make money additionally and are paid a considerable amount less that freelancers in the same business, that is not right.

[–]Bloodrager[Splat] (EU-W) 16ポイント17ポイント  (29子コメント)

What's different in Germany that makes freelancing worse than being contracted?

[–]CrossBowKill 35ポイント36ポイント  (13子コメント)

Don't know if it is common in other countries, but for example in germany (and I think the most of the EU staats) you "need" to pay extra taxes on your earnings for something like "Rentenversicherung" (basically you pay monthly money so you get some pension after you retire) and "Arbeitslosenversicherung" (you get money from the gov if you dont have a job its like 300-600$ a month plus they pay your rent and so on) which is partly covered from the company you are employee at, so if you work as a freelance you need to pay the hole share of that (easily missing like 200-600$ a month because of that)

[–]NinjaN-SWE 9ポイント10ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yepp, same in Sweden. The potential for high income is better with freelancing but the risk coupled with the fact that you can easily make way less if you aren't aware and taking into consideration how much extra you lose in taxes and fees when setting your rate.

[–]BigBoss0327 43ポイント44ポイント  (13子コメント)

The point was that they're making less than even the employed casters from other games.

[–]Jinxzy[Pornstar LuIu] (EU-W) 29ポイント30ポイント  (8子コメント)

I didn't mean getting fucked just in their salary, more importantly IMO is the intangible value of having a strong Twitch/YouTube presence. Casters like Deficio, Kobe and Jatt could easily create extremely strong YouTube channels, which would make a great backbone to keep a presence in the scene in case they were to suddenly not work for Riot anymore. However Riot straight out denies them that possibility.

[–]engkybob 10ポイント11ポイント  (2子コメント)

Riot likes to keep their casters on a leash. They make it so the casters need Riot more than Riot needs them which is why so many of them have been around for so long. Sad to hear they are underpaid.

[–]goingbankai 181ポイント182ポイント  (24子コメント)

Monte actually made a really good point there about how Riot casters can't grow their own brand - I think his entire side rant about casters is extremely important to take note of.

When Jatt put out that youtube video at the beginning of the year about his predictions for NALCS, I thought he would be doing more similar content on his own, growing his own brand as a person and so on. As Monte said, he can do this while contracted by OGN and grow his own brand, same for Thorin and casters for other esports. Apparently Riot casters aren't able to do this at all, and instead Jatt's ideas went into PTL as far as anyone can tell since he hasn't posted any more content on youtube.

Monte once again is making perfect sense with this topic while Riot has been convoluted at best (Renegades ruling anyone?) and it'll continue to be like this until more info comes out. I doubt that will happen though, in the meantime I get to be mildly annoyed but relieved that I at least got some sort of explanation as to why casters from Riot don't put out more interesting content on youtube by themselves.

TL;DR : let casters do at least some content unrelated to Riot, I know from watching all of them that they'd each have something quality to contribute that they themselves want to do.

Edit - added tldr

[–]ComedianTF2 58ポイント59ポイント  (20子コメント)

And that is actiually really important for their carriers after riot. if you have two casters who are equal in skill, but one has a massive fan following through youtube, twitch, etcetera, they can leverage that to get paid more and do bigger events. It creates a bigger dependancy on riot.

[–]goingbankai 25ポイント26ポイント  (11子コメント)

Exactly, the other thing I would point out is the fact that the price of living somewhere decent in LA area is pretty high last I remember it, and I would assume that price of living where Monte is in Korea would be lower than that. Monte said he was earning more than most (if not all) Riot casters on salary alone so he must be far more comfortable financially than them. Especially since he's able to monetize off of alternative areas while the Riot casting crew is confined to their little Riot box unable to do anything Riot doesn't want them to. Even if the Riot casters wanted to move away from casting as you said they wouldn't have any portfolio to show a future employer as a clear cut example of their skills

[–]Gorantharon 8ポイント9ポイント  (7子コメント)

Where does Monte live in Korea? Living expenses and rent isn't cheap in the big cities there.

[–]gineus 72ポイント73ポイント  (1子コメント)

"you put them in a little box, you put them in a little box"

[–]Jacyl 10ポイント11ポイント  (0子コメント)

...and cover you up with dirt and rocks.

[–]Psyman2Let's go outside! 85ポイント86ポイント  (14子コメント)

That's not even a comparison, that's straight up having a job vs. being abused.

He's implying Jatt, who did amazing teamfight breakdowns and similar and has shown in the past that he can do them completely on his own, actually earns less than Chobra, not because of what they're both being payed but because of what Jatt ISN'T ALLOWED TO BE PAID for.

[–]Khyrst 22ポイント23ポイント  (11子コメント)

It's interesting how Monte is pretty much the only prolifically verbal one on this issue. Considering how Miller and Deman left as well I don't think Monte is outright lying about the status quo. That really makes me question why some casters haven't found a better job yet. They obviously can't talk about this issue right now since they're probably under an NDA, but if what Monte mentioned are true it should warrant at least some action.

You have people in all sorts of jobs clawing to be paid what they are worth in accordance to their skills, but this silence and nonaction by Riot employed casters truly baffle me. There HAS to be something else Riot offers them, or the casters we love and adore are complete idiots for not fighting for fair pay in accordance to what they can earn elsewhere.

[–]LyricalSinner 11ポイント12ポイント  (6子コメント)

Those two did have pretty vaild reasons for leaving tho. Deman didn't want to leave his Girlfriend while Joe didn't want to be chained up to only League when he loved CSGO as well.

Honestly, i agree with you. There has to be something that Monte is missing that Riot is offering to the casters because there hasn't been any complaints or even inking of this until today.

[–]Gearman 10ポイント11ポイント  (1子コメント)

There could be many reasons why not many have spoken up, and they tend to be very similar across many other jobs as well, especially in the game industry. They tend to typically be: 1) The employees don't know that they're underpaid. 2) The employees know they're underpaid but are afraid to speak up. 3) The employees believe they have limited job prospects/opportunities outside their current job. 4) The employees have family/friends/cats that they don't want to disrupt by leaving their current job. 5) The employees are fine with their current agreement. I can't say which of those might be true, but the track record for game companies is rather poor when it comes to fair compensation and proper work/life balance.

[–]Mesial 88ポイント89ポイント  (36子コメント)

Exactly, its kind of stupid to see how monte uses the dota casters to show how big of a difference there is, but Tryndamere over here is complaining about Regi not paying enough. When its shown he pays the most in NALCS.

Edit: I'm specifically saying Tryndamere is stupid for spewing Hypocritical bullshit

[–]whan0109 68ポイント69ポイント  (12子コメント)

This makes a huge point IMO, Riot shouldn't blame teams (actually, even the blame itself is nonsense) when it doesn't pay their casters AVERAGE $s.

[–]elesdee1 21ポイント22ポイント  (15子コメント)

No way bjerg stays in TSM if they aren't one of the top 3 paying orgs in LCS, like what is tryndamere even saying

[–]MelGibsonDerp 29ポイント30ポイント  (11子コメント)

Player careers are short. They don't owe a single ounce of loyalty IMO.

This isn't Professional sports like the NBA where you see players get roasted for leaving their team (LeBron/Durant).

LoL players should show ZERO loyalty and absolutely chase the money until the scene becomes more stable and pay is insane regardless of team.

[–]Zalbu 11ポイント12ポイント  (8子コメント)

If they want to chase the money then they need to get into streaming, streaming is infinitely more profitable if you're a big name like Bjergsen or Qtpie. Players with the competitive drive don't prioritize the money first hand.

[–]xGareBear 39ポイント40ポイント  (6子コメント)

Why is it stupid? League of legends is the most popular game in the world, and also the most popular esport game. They should be leading the industry in salaries, not dragging in last. It is a huge statement that dota 2 casters make the same money in 3 weeks that riot casters do in 6 months, and quite frankly, fucking ridiculous. It's relevant because dota 2 and league of legends are similar games in a lot of ways. Riot should be embarrassed by that whole segment of the video. It would be slightly different (still shit) if riot allowed their casters to monetize their abilities and capitalize off of the brands they build for themselves, as casting the most popular game brings a lot of publicity.

[–]Mesial 32ポイント33ポイント  (2子コメント)

I was saying its stupid that Tryndamere complains about others paying low salaries while Riot as a company fucks over casters.

[–]iDarkelf 13ポイント14ポイント  (1子コメント)

Your initial reply did not come over clearly then. It seemed like you were calling Monte stupid

[–]Mesial 8ポイント9ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yea that's my bad, I worded it pretty poorly.

[–]darthpsykoz 5ポイント6ポイント  (1子コメント)

And have you seen the Dota TI prize pools? The winning team can live off it for the rest of their lives...

[–]T3hSwagman 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

People were bitching that Maelk chose TI over being with his team. Maybe he was just choosing the more lucrative career option.

[–]RedheadAgathaboop 419ポイント420ポイント  (36子コメント)

The joke about Phreak and Riv being locked up has suddenly turned macabre.

[–]kim-soo-hyun 47ポイント48ポイント  (0子コメント)

The funniest part was..

"You put them in a little box! You put them in a little box!"

with hand gestures.

[–]A_Wild_Blue_CardKReygasm 101ポイント102ポイント  (25子コメント)

Deman may have bungled his move to CSGO, but you can 100% understand why he'd want to move away from League.

Games only ever last so long, and casting a single title isn't good for a long term career. It may also have been a factor in Deficio's interest to move to Copenhagen Wolves, and we know how Riot clamped down on that.

This isn't isolated, nor is it confined to casters:

Marc Merrill thus losing it on Reginald investing in other esports makes perfect sense.

[–]Tasadar 40ポイント41ポイント  (3子コメント)

And I mean... How exactly can they get more work or transfer to other games if Riot won't let them. And if League tanks they can't get into a new game all of a sudden, they're gonna get fucked.

Riot is fucking them.

Straight fucking them, exploiting them.

Fuck Riot.

[–]alexqq 315ポイント316ポイント  (34子コメント)

It looks like Phreak and Rivington aren't really acting when they try to escape the LCS studio

[–]Hellman109 200ポイント201ポイント  (19子コメント)

Phreak is 100% in the Riot hivemind. He argues about booths for instance, they've been standard in most esports for over a decade, yet he claims other people need to do research.

Well its called Starcraft in Korea onwards, but he will argue Riot = correct, every other esports for over a decade = wrong.

[–]TheDirtyCondom [スコア非表示]  (13子コメント)

Holy shit this annoys me so much. I like phreak but when I see him blindly defend everything riot does he seems like a fucking idiot. I don't know if he truely believes it or if he's just trying to suck the big dick of rito tho

[–]bulsajo21 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

my impression as well, he must have noticed how dumb he sounds and yet he still sticks to it.

Riot advertise that they prioritize and care their players, while players been asking for booth for how long? And Phreak comes back 'oh it's not going to be effective' how dafq would u even know without even trying and then when DOTA shows how it helps he's like oh in our case the crowd is fqing humongous. Hey Phreak, why dont u take the effort to ask the DOTA players who played inside the booth then, instead of denying all the possibility at least show some efforts to solve it.

He is quite double standard. Let us go back when he was talking about the caster payment with monte. Monte wrote how relative to all the other esports they get paid much lower from casting LoL. Making fun of it he makes hypothetical riot budget schedule. Phreak brings up olympic which is quite not right thing to bring up as Monte points out that Olympics only sells broadcasting right and probably casters are paid by NBC or respective stations. And yet Phreak believes it's the same thing and Monte is making excuse.

When Phreak wants to dismiss he brings 'we are different' attitude. When he wants to argue he brings up completely different example and calls it "the same thing". Just too much desperation out of this guy to defend whatever he/riot believes

[–]Zerole00 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

It's too late for Phreak, we can still save Riv though.

[–]Dr_Foppo [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

I like Phreak's casting, but just as others have pointed out in the comments, Phreak unfortunately is a Riot Bot.

I remember when people criticised the Bo3s in Worlds Bracket Stage, he just argued "Why Bo5s? Waste of time, no? The better team will simply win the Bo3!"

Lmao.

[–]hurei7 [スコア非表示]  (6子コメント)

Phreak = Riot. He defends Riot with the dumbest logic ever(Riot will actually benefit more if someone else tries to damage control). The most recent one was about not using booth at Worlds. He said booth doesnt work so Riot should use sound proof headphones instead(which also doesn't prevent noise). A normal person would use both headphones and booth to minimize the crowd noise. But for Phreak, it has to be black and white. It either works or doesn't work.

[–]KaptainKhorisma [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Phreak will fight you to the bloody end if you say one ill word about riot in this subreddit and is typically downvoted into the ground because of it

[–]Scorps [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

The best part is even when Regi literally told him "Yes we tested it at MLG and it works and was better" he was like "Well that's cute but theres no way of knowing if it could be better at the studios!"

Like what the fuck kind of circular logic does this guy use, I thought Lyte was ridiculous but Phreak would spin Riot murdering someone into it seeming like a benefit to someone

[–]gineus 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

Can't get out of the little box

[–]Tha_Hama 271ポイント272ポイント  (17子コメント)

Monte defending Regi, what a time to be alive

[–]Nicer_Chile 55ポイント56ポイント  (5子コメント)

No wonder Scarra rejected an offer from Rito to be an analyst.

he would lose all about his stream and youtube content, make sense he went to be an interviewer.

WTF is wrong with rito.

[–]EmperorKira [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Yeah, given what we are hearing, if you want any future as a content producer, don't join Riot.

[–]Banaanisaha 186ポイント187ポイント  (20子コメント)

The part about LCS casters blows my mind. I was aware that they cant monetize their twitch etc, but that the salary of the casters is so much worse than casters in other games is just insane and sometimes having to work for free in events is pretty ridiculous.

I dont really see the point in limiting the content they can produce / monetizing content or having sponsors. I bet many casters in other games would not be as popular if they didnt have the freedom to create content and grow their brand themselves (Anders, Semmler, Thorin, YNk in csgo, Artosis, Apollo in sc2 for example), many casters are seen as the face of their respective games and not letting them grow their brand seems counterintuitive.

Imagine having more strategy content like this or podcasts by LCS analysts, guaranteed people would watch this type of content

[–]NotLokey[Lokey] (SEA) 42ポイント43ポイント  (3子コメント)

I would love to see a bi-weekly or monthly podcast with Deficio, Jatt and other analysts talking about the games, patch, etc.

[–]SankaritarinaAmbition's fanboy 32ポイント33ポイント  (0子コメント)

I dont really see the point in limiting the content they can produce / monetizing content or having sponsors. I bet many casters in other games would not be as popular if they didnt have the freedom to create content and grow their brand themselves

Well, that is the point. If you're given freedom to build your brand and you do it successfully, you can demand higher salary from Riot and simply move to another game/company when they refuse.

[–]Truthhhurts 521ポイント522ポイント  (105子コメント)

This new episode of reality show monte vs riot is pretty good.

[–]HitXMan 220ポイント221ポイント  (96子コメント)

If this means monte doesn't go to worlds I think it's actually a loss for riot/the viewers.

[–]PerfectlyClear 206ポイント207ポイント  (66子コメント)

I don't know why people have any impression that Riot would even extend an offer to Monte after MSI, let alone this

[–]DisturbedFox 142ポイント143ポイント  (37子コメント)

I don't know why people have any impression that Monte would want to work with a company that screwed him over big time

[–]chainer3000 93ポイント94ポイント  (19子コメント)

It would be a massive loss for the more casual fans who mostly tune in for major tournaments, as he does a great job of breaking down complex information into digestible bits without dumbing things down, raising his viewers understanding of the game at the pro level; the hardcore fanbase would be all the more disappointed by a long-standing string of poor decision-making from Riot management, largely based on personal grudges (or an inability to take valid critical criticisms).

Many of the best highlight clips of both the casters and the analyst desk over the last few years have featured, or come directly from, Monte; he has seasoned, steady casting and knowledge of KR that is second to none (plus amazing chemistry with DOA and deep knowledge of ever changing metas); plus the rare ability to convey said knowledge without boring the audience, and the guts to throw in entertaining trash talk, and you've got a caster who is hard to imitate.

Edit: clarity, grammar. Apologies for the errors.

[–]whan0109 55ポイント56ポイント  (17子コメント)

rotations, Rotations, ROTATIONS

All aboard SKT HYPE TRAIN

So everybody's with me: KOOO KOOO KOOO

I can already remember 3

[–]trafaco 18ポイント19ポイント  (0子コメント)

knowledge of the KR scene

that's the important part.

[–]Dr_Foppo 56ポイント57ポイント  (3子コメント)

"So DL. Now that you've missed your chance for Worlds you're practicing your stand up career?" - after DL said Xmithie was better than Dandy :D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1KblJS5ZTb0

[–]AdvancedWin 12ポイント13ポイント  (0子コメント)

That's alright I'll just have you riding the bench next season

[–]RonthekingRiggle says hi! 16ポイント17ポイント  (6子コメント)

Or with Prolly in the middle and him finger pointing " No! No! No!"

This guy is a great caster, he has a lot of knowledge and Riot refuses to hire him because of personal grudges.

[–]trainfok 231ポイント232ポイント  (41子コメント)

His bit about locking down caster rights reminded me of that time Riot tried to forbid LCS players from streaming other games

[–]pvtzack17 59ポイント60ポイント  (26子コメント)

They did? What the fuck

[–]Nightmayr 91ポイント92ポイント  (18子コメント)

Yeh lol, there was a massive uprising and they had to take it back. Any LCS player caught streaming another game during queue would be punished.

[–]WorkglovexsneakyWoo sneakyGasm sneakyWoo sneakyGasm sneakyWoo sneakyGasm 380ポイント381ポイント  (69子コメント)

Holy crap. I didn't know how underpaid the LCS casters were for their work. Not being able to do content out of riot's and not getting paid extra for Riot events such as worlds, MSI... Oh my.

[–]4THOT 189ポイント190ポイント  (49子コメント)

Weow I wonder if our boy /u/phreakriot will stop by to share some insight? Or any of the other casters?

We know you're reading this thread and watching the videos :>

E: I will eat my socks if a RIOT caster responds to this video within 48 hours.

E: /u/AchiliosCasts thinks I will regret this, but the fire rises!

[–]PerfectlyClear 65ポイント66ポイント  (2子コメント)

Nope it's just Phreak asking loaded questions on Twitter time ;^)

[–]stopthatdude 24ポイント25ポイント  (1子コメント)

Phreak collecting data and asking for "clarifications" again

[–]dustofoblivion123 88ポイント89ポイント  (19子コメント)

At this point I'm almost hoping that Phreak or another caster can come in and alleviate some of MonteCristo's accusations, because if everything he said is true, then I've truly lost faith in Riot as an organization.

[–]mrsonnai 92ポイント93ポイント  (7子コメント)

They're probably not allowed to, ironically. I don't think Riot wants casters being involved in any sort of drama. It's so sad if what Monte said is true, such a scumbag way of dealing with your talented employees.

[–]4THOT 17ポイント18ポイント  (3子コメント)

I'm pretty sure Krepo got to address that 14+1 drama a while ago.

I'm pretty sure all the casters were allowed to defend themselves from various criticism following some occasional lackluster casting.

[–]Mestarimees 23ポイント24ポイント  (1子コメント)

He doesn't want to be on the naughty list of Riot obv.

[–]Uriohh 19ポイント20ポイント  (1子コメント)

they probably aren't allowed to comment in threads like this.

[–]MadJ0hn 10ポイント11ポイント  (0子コメント)

Not very likely. Its not like they have the choice to speak openly about it, if its true what monte said. Unless they want to risk losing their job.

[–]Cringlebeary 59ポイント60ポイント  (0子コメント)

YOU PUT THEM IN A LITTLE BOX. you put them in a little box.

[–]MelGibsonDerp 330ポイント331ポイント  (72子コメント)

Alright just finished.

Biggest issue for me, is the fact that Riot doesn't let it's casters monetize their streams, youtubes, etc..

It's actually a fucking joke if you think about it. It impacts Riot in ZERO way. Unless you count "They are such a good talent they would make more money doing content than casting" which I would respond with "Then Riot should pay it's fucking god tier casters appropriately."

EDIT: Throwing in a big fuck you to Riot because poor /u/Krepo has to sit on his stream and deal with fuckwits spamming "15" at him when if he were able to monetize he would simply throw on submode permanently.

[–]lightbetsoin 157ポイント158ポイント  (39子コメント)

did you miss the part where lcs casters have to work unpaid overtime on the worlds championship and msi?

[–]MelGibsonDerp 71ポイント72ポイント  (6子コメント)

Yes I also think that's bullshit.

[–]HolySymboly 59ポイント60ポイント  (5子コメント)

"Unpaid overtime" Piss on Riot for this. People work their ass off with their talents and Money-whoring Riot isn't paying? That's some downright horseshit right there.

[–]MelGibsonDerp 27ポイント28ポイント  (1子コメント)

Agreed. The game knowledge and prep work that goes into being a caster is ridiculously extensive.

Monte is 100% correct saying that them not getting paid for an extra 2 months of work is egregious.

[–]ComedianTF2 11ポイント12ポイント  (0子コメント)

and also for ESL IEM! Thats not even a riot company that they work for free for!

[–]Mista_Wong [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

How is it overtime if that's their job they are salaried for? It's what they agreed to.

[–]deathgripsaresoft 9ポイント10ポイント  (0子コメント)

Unpaid overtime? Those guys are all salaried.

[–]WebLlama 20ポイント21ポイント  (9子コメント)

They're paid a salary. That salary obligates them to cast tournaments.

I don't even understand these arguments.

I'm a tv reporter. Today I'll work a double because there are elections. THAT'S WHAT MY CONTRACT IS FOR.

They are Riot employees. They work for Riot. When Riot hosts a tournament, they are expected to help.

[–]Luph [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Meanwhile, there are probably days during off season where the casters do absolutely nothing and don't lose a paycheck for it.

[–]GmbDarien 325ポイント326ポイント  (39子コメント)

LOL riot is shitting on casters wtf, krepo lost all his twitch subscribers and can't even have a youtube channel also that's why deficio doesn't even use his yt channel...

[–]DaggerFout 340ポイント341ポイント  (30子コメント)

Deficio even got punished for considering another job. He literally committed a thought crime.

Riot are afraid of losing talents they have invested money in.

[–]GmbDarien 99ポイント100ポイント  (10子コメント)

Imgine how shit would eulcs be if they lost deficio along side with deman and joe lol

[–]Fnatic_FanBoy 64ポイント65ポイント  (0子コメント)

At this point if that's what it takes for riot to changes their ways. Im okay with it.

[–]EtoshOEEtosh [EUW] 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Some laws even forbid the planning of a crime so there's a real law precedent for Riot's decision, he talked extensively about roster rebuilds back then

[–]Regvlas [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Deficio even got punished for considering another job.

Are you kidding? That's blatantly wrong. Deficio attempted to poach players for a team (CW? can't remember) while he was working as a caster at Riot. He was 200% in the wrong, and deserved the suspension.

[–]Kiyoh 154ポイント155ポイント  (28子コメント)

His first point kinda makes sense, wasn't there a moment where Faker played Battle Bunny Riven by "accident", then not a moment later, it was on the store for a discounted price?

Since this went pretty high up, I'll add some insight. The article is from 2014 found here: http://sports.news.naver.com/sports/index.nhn?category=e_sports&ctg=news&mod=read&office_id=236&article_id=0000096820

Faker states:

"Before the match, the ogn staffs use the player's account to see if there is anything wrong. The staff who used my skin selected the battlebunny riven skin before. Since I don't use skin at all, I didn't check skin selection menu before the match and I had to play with the skin." And he also mentioned "If I used classic skin, I would got mvp in 1st match instead of Impact." (this is jk, ofc)

Edit: Added clarity on Faker unintentionally using a skin in 2014.

[–]Luschiss17LZ/H2K 11ポイント12ポイント  (0子コメント)

I remember that also for Scarlet Hammer Poppy when Vizicsacsi played her in the 2015 Spring Promotion tournament versus Millenium. About 10 mins after the P&B the Skin was on Sale.

[–]Xyltin 55ポイント56ポイント  (19子コメント)

It is not a big secret that it can work like that. It is not that players get forced to use skins but if they do Riot is going to try and make money from it. That is how business works and how sports works. Why do players in other sports get payed millions to use certain shoes?

I am sure they lost a lot of money at the beginning with esports, but not today. It was a risk back then and they and other esports got rewarded for it.

[–]Uriohh 70ポイント71ポイント  (18子コメント)

Why do players in other sports get payed millions to use certain shoes?

yeah but difference here is Faker didnt get anything from what Riot made out of selling the BB skin even tho him playing it is what made people buy it.

[–]MelGibsonDerp 498ポイント499ポイント  (14子コメント)

HERE WE GO BOYS.

DICKS OUT FOR MONTECRISTO.

[–]Cater0mcf 124ポイント125ポイント  (7子コメント)

I always knew Monte was friendly, harmless and dead.

[–]receptiveblocks 64ポイント65ポイント  (4子コメント)

When were you when Monte was kill?

[–]FearFailure 120ポイント121ポイント  (3子コメント)

apology for poor english

when were you when monty christo dies

i was sat at home watching LCS when doa ring

"monte is kill"

"no"

[–]JenaxuI've embraced the memes 32ポイント33ポイント  (4子コメント)

I don't recall Harambe viciously roasting the living daylights out of anyone.

[–]esneT 259ポイント260ポイント  (19子コメント)

I think I'm starting to understand why Deman and Joe Miller left Riot.

[–]TheLoopKeen 26ポイント27ポイント  (2子コメント)

Joe never worked for riot directly, he was contracted through ESL.

[–]marshed 59ポイント60ポイント  (7子コメント)

Suddenly everything just makes so much more sense

[–]EscapingMyEx 21ポイント22ポイント  (6子コメント)

We're also happy to have Deman for Overwatch, we won't let him go.

[–]Cresrael 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

The Casting for the Atlantic showdown was so good,hopefully the quality carries through for the eleague.

[–]Skulldier 92ポイント93ポイント  (4子コメント)

"They're like some fucked up tyrant Santa Claus..." I fucking died.

[–]Minishcap1[Minishcap1] (NA) 142ポイント143ポイント  (7子コメント)

Totally agree with Monte about his comments on "good guy" vs "bad guy" team owners. We've seen Riot ostracize and shun team owners who they disagree with on trivial matters.

[–]Mintastic 71ポイント72ポイント  (8子コメント)

He's definitely not wrong, Trynd's post was pure PR and no one has really come out to disagree with Monte/Regi's statements. While LoL has done well they should really avoid acting like they know better than every other esport.

[–]secretdrug 37ポイント38ポイント  (2子コメント)

well the problem is that they're not treating this as an esport at all. they're treating it as a marketing tool to boost sales for things like skins or poro plushies. In that regard Riot has done an AMAZING job as they grossed 1.6 billion dollars last year. Also in that regard they do know better than everyone else. In terms of building a healthy esport system tho they fail miserably

[–]etww 7ポイント8ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think PR would do a better job.

Sounded more like Trynd lashing out at someone who dared insult Riot. None of his comment actually addressed what Regi brought up in the interview and was just full of self-serving praise for Riot and what they were doing.

[–]naocist 28ポイント29ポイント  (1子コメント)

I wanna see Phreak defending Riot's position right now, especially when he had riot's back with SoloQ vs. Dynamic Que, Jungler timers, Dragon changes, etc

[–]stolersxzMEME 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

unfortunately he cant really ever disagree. Not saying he was lying about his opinion on those things, it just sucks we'll never know for certain unless he leaves

[–]0ptriX[Planet 6] (EU-W) 34ポイント35ポイント  (1子コメント)

Can't wait for the deafening silence in response by Riot.

[–]Donzo_ 21ポイント22ポイント  (1子コメント)

Did we just witness the Donezo Montecristo?

[–]Apuntar 79ポイント80ポイント  (50子コメント)

Oh shit, so far so good. Lets fucking go.

Edit:

Uhh the skin thing after being seen in the LCS... Interesting but like Monete said no one has seen Riots books when it comes to it.

The caster part, wew lad that sucks that Riot casters don't get paid as much as they should. Imagine Krepo being able to have his sub mode back on, twitch 15 spam would be all but gone.

[–]Kaldoro 13ポイント14ポイント  (45子コメント)

Not able to watch the video, but am I getting that right, casters can't have sub mode on? Are they not allowed by riot or why did you say that? Sorry if it's common knowledge that I might lack.

[–]0nlyRevolutions 33ポイント34ポイント  (28子コメント)

According to Monte, Riot casters do not get payed for anything outside of their Riot salary. They are not allowed to have their own Twitch subs or monetise youtube vids. They can't produce extra content, unless it is produced by Riot. They don't get paid at all for casting tournaments.

[–]faladu 30ポイント31ポイント  (25子コメント)

just ask krepo on one of his streams and he will confirm you that he can't monetize streams, YouTube, etc. as that is a clause in his contract.
He says he doesn't like it but since he knew it before he signed he is ok with it

[–]lolSpectator 4ポイント5ポイント  (1子コメント)

Riv and Phreak has also confirmed that they cant make money off twitch streams. Not even donations

[–]Luschiss17LZ/H2K 7ポイント8ポイント  (2子コメント)

Krepo said he isnt allowed earn money from his stream so he doesnt have Subs/Donations.

[–]ComedianTF2 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

casters can't have subs, can't have youtube monitisation, can't earn any money in any way from league of legends related content (or even any content), work for events like MSI and worlds with no extra compensation over other riot casters that don't, get lended to companies like ESL with no extra compensation.

Basically, if you are a caster under riot, you will only get base salary from riot and nothing more.

[–]Cablex90 56ポイント57ポイント  (2子コメント)

This video is fucking awesome. Good shit monte

[–]derpepper 61ポイント62ポイント  (3子コメント)

I feel like Marc Merrill is making so much money from league that he just assumed everyone else was making at least a couple million. Really goes to show how out of touch he is with esports organizations.

Riot underpaying casters came up last year too but nothing came of it. Hopefully this time something will change, especially since I didn't know about how riot restricted their employees from creating their own content, like wtf.

[–]pvtzack17 7ポイント8ポイント  (2子コメント)

Its like thooorin(?, not sure honestly dont quote me) said, riot lives in their own bubble and when they head into the real world and it bursts they just go back to their headquarters and make another one.

[–]QuoteMe-Bot 6ポイント7ポイント  (1子コメント)

Its like thooorin(?, not sure honestly dont quote me) said, riot lives in their own bubble and when they head into the real world and it bursts they just go back to their headquarters and make another one.

~ /u/pvtzack17

[–]lolNiSo 19ポイント20ポイント  (0子コメント)

Damn Monte went in this time. Great points all around.

[–]Dyloslawer 25ポイント26ポイント  (4子コメント)

guess ill just be watching worlds from monte's vod reviews :X

[–]Pavementt 8ポイント9ポイント  (1子コメント)

Monte's VOD reviews are hands down the best thing to come out of international tournaments.

[–]2poundWheel 7ポイント8ポイント  (1子コメント)

That bit of Max "Atlus" Anderson popping up on Facebook had me dying

[–]NeroStarGazer 32ポイント33ポイント  (2子コメント)

Monte articulately breaking down Trynd's original reddit comment sentence by sentence. Glorious.

[–]Sofaboy90 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

thorins video is coming tomorrow boys. perhaps we can get richard in there too somewhere? he might be done with lol forever already tho

[–]Hey_Swizzy 14ポイント15ポイント  (0子コメント)

Like Dunkey said a long time ago... "riot taking the money and leaving"

[–]NormTheStorm 40ポイント41ポイント  (6子コメント)

Seeing a good amount of "RIP Monte at Worlds"

I seriously hope Riot, and Tryndamere, just admit that there's some flaws in how they're currently running things and simply update it without a bunch of dramatic kerfuffle.

But I also hope they don't get insecure and despise Monte over this. Monte is talking as much as he does because he wants to see LoL and the eSports industry thrive. He doesn't like seeing the low-tier business model that the LCS currently has because he doesn't want it to see it fail due to Riot thinking "oh well everything is completely fine right now it's the organizations own faults".

If I were Riot right now I'd be listening to Monte because he knows what he's talking about and has a broad understanding of the outside eSports industry. This is literally a guy who is a caster, analyst, and former team owner. His understanding of this topic is deep. They should be listening to his criticism to further improve themselves. And from an analyst standpoint, they should bring him to Worlds and pay him an industry standard- who else on his calibre can you bring in when you think about knowledge of the Korean scene and its players? The same region that has won your world championships 3 years in a row, and will likely reach the knockout stage.

[–]dustofoblivion123 19ポイント20ポイント  (6子コメント)

Wow. If what MonteCristo said about casters being 'put in a little box' is true, Riot has disgusting standards of work. Basically, if you work for them you aren't allowed to do anything outside of that.

[–]Awela 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

They can stream, but they can't monetize anything, so no subs, no donations, no bits, no youtube money, ....

[–]Darkbloomy[Beniak] (EU-NE) 17ポイント18ポイント  (9子コメント)

Fuuck I can't watch it yet. Is it spicy?

[–]marqt 18ポイント19ポイント  (0子コメント)

Someone from tencent really should bann Tryndamere from social media, the guy is a moron.

[–]BlainVM 21ポイント22ポイント  (3子コメント)

I was laughing so hard through this. Monte took the grave tryndamere dug for himself and made him dig deeper before making him bury himself alive. Seriously I already had my reasons to stop watching LCS after this year at worlds but this takes the cake. Rito get your shit together before you start bashing on one of the team owners that probably pays his players the most.

[–]Dobblehale 9ポイント10ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think 'Monte's Maulings' is a more appropriate title for this particular video.

[–]TrulyWitty 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

The biggest problem with Riot is not making all these dumb decisions, but rather when they are uncovered they don't actually make improvements or even attempt to make things right. All these issues Monte spoke of are not going to get fixed. There is no "we're wrong" in Riots dictionary

[–]Lek12345[🍰] 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

Who would've thought monte would ever make a 30min video defending regi :O

[–]andrecsq 12ポイント13ポイント  (1子コメント)

Love Monte. Riot is destroying LoL with their obsession to control everything related to the game.