[–]platocplx 165ポイント166ポイント  (21子コメント)

Yep trump is blowing away the dog whistles republicans have been using for a long time now.

[–]AbortusLuciferum 48ポイント49ポイント  (15子コメント)

Except that in order to cut expenses now it's normal whistles humans can hear, and that's the problem.

[–]Saamstraat 35ポイント36ポイント  (3子コメント)

Whistles? He's been bullhorning ever since he started running.

[–]kmacku 34ポイント35ポイント  (1子コメント)

That's been his plan all along: 4D Vuvuzelas.

[–]thats_bone -1ポイント0ポイント  (10子コメント)

Sadly I feel like a lot of Democrats felt this way about Bernie. We need to stop being ashamed of thinking that socialism might be a good thing. We will get it right because now we have the technology to figure out what decisions to make that will affect everyone correctly.

[–]deannnkid 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

You don't even know what Socialism is. Social democracy doesn't = socialism.

[–]learntouseapostrophe 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Bernie's a liberal, not a socialist.

[–]jswilson64 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

We don't need no Socialism here in 'Murca.

Now excuse me, I gotta run my Mom to her doc. She loves this guy - she found him once she got Medicare.

[–]Zehardtruth 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

And people don't even care, the time for Republicans to play this charade is over. Now they can express their most extreme views on live TV and still get their votes...

[–]platocplx 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

interestingly enough I think we are seeing history repeating itself the likes of george wallace etc are on display the out right racism really doesnt work for most peoples sensibilities its why even with some success back then for those guys the got killed nationally.

However Nixon and Regan and republicans since then adopted and adapter their rhetoric to be more ambiguous to where people could say "NO im not racist i just want to stop welfare cheats and terrorists and illegals!" "they just happen to be brown and black cuz (racist reasons)" I hope more and more Americans understand how shitty this coded language is and just get away from this shit. I also would love to ask every single middle class and below republican what POLICY have the benefited from, because I guarantee that every single program was probably a democratically lead like social security, HUD and medicare(even though there was initial studies done by Eisenhower).

Tired of the lie that social programs are totally taking money out of the middle class which really helps even the playing field, when there are millionares and billionares literally just hoarding money and its a damn lie they are zero sum job creators.

[–]sophandros 229ポイント230ポイント  (177子コメント)

Relevant:

https://www.thenation.com/article/exclusive-lee-atwaters-infamous-1981-interview-southern-strategy/

You start out in 1954 by saying, “N####r, n####r, n####r.” By 1968 you can’t say “n####r”—that hurts you, backfires. So you say stuff like, uh, forced busing, states’ rights, and all that stuff, and you’re getting so abstract. Now, you’re talking about cutting taxes, and all these things you’re talking about are totally economic things and a byproduct of them is, blacks get hurt worse than whites.… “We want to cut this,” is much more abstract than even the busing thing, uh, and a hell of a lot more abstract than “N####r, n####r.”

Trump has been tapping into the angry white sentiment regarding giving things to non-whites and leveling the playing field. This is why they rant against "welfare" and "political correctness".

[–]IllIlIIl 73ポイント74ポイント  (2子コメント)

When you are used to privilege, any fairness will seem like oppression.

[–]Orlando1701 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

He was born on third base but wants us to think he hit a triple.

[–]TurloIsOK 64ポイント65ポイント  (2子コメント)

They dumbed-down their base so much that they couldn't understand the codes.

[–]aveman101 45ポイント46ポイント  (1子コメント)

The fact that Trump polls so well in the categories "tells it like it is" and "honest and straightforward" says something about the way his supports view the world.

[–]stormtrooper1701Vote your conscience! 12ポイント13ポイント  (0子コメント)

He just says what eeeeeveryone's thinking, come on!

[–]flemhead3 9ポイント10ポイント  (9子コメント)

After last week, Donald may start working with the Republican Party. I think he realized he won't get elected if he keeps pissing off the other members of his party. This past Friday when he endorsed Paul Ryan and others, you could see he was reading from a speech he had on paper. Well, he would read a line or two, go off the cuff for a moment, then go back to the words on the page. Maybe someone in his campaign or the Republican Party bitch-slapped him down a peg so he would be reasonable for a moment. But we'll see how long that lasts, which shouldn't be long..

[–]ogg33 7ポイント8ポイント  (2子コメント)

But we'll see how long that lasts, which shouldn't be long..

That's what gives me the most reassurance. He has no discipline. Remember how after they hired Manafort, his twitter was professional for like three days?

[–]JakeArrietaGrandeTrump wants to date his own daughter 5ポイント6ポイント  (1子コメント)

If there is a comprehensive Game Change-like book written about the Trump campaign, I hope there's a timeline or something that can match the public tweets to the behind the scenes bickering.

"And tweets from this week show when Manafort changed the password to the Twitter account, and here is when Trump guessed it. Here's where Manafort picked a longer password, and here's where Trump remembered the email address for password reset."

[–]ogg33 -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

I need that book, and the HBO movie that ensues. Who plays Trump?

I watched Game Change again last week because I was so happy about trumps self immolation, but it ended up making me sad to see how much more dignified that campaign was.

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Did it take a long time for you type this with your tiny hands /u/automoderator?

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[–]Svenomancer 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

will he find the money next to his tax returns?

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[–]CherryBlossomStorm 8ポイント9ポイント  (0子コメント)

Usually they "dog-whistle" to rapists, but this season has really been more like rape whistling from trump.

[–]CantHugEveryCat 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

#NotAllRepublicans

[–]f3ldman2 7ポイント8ポイント  (14子コメント)

Conservatives have always pandered to their racist xenophobic base, but hardly ever acted on it meaningfully. They were a means to an end.

[–]Periaphelion 51ポイント52ポイント  (13子コメント)

hardly ever acted on it meaningfully

This is flat out wrong, there are so many examples.

  • Mass incarceration
  • "Tough on crime" laws that disproportionately affected minorities
  • Surveillance and profiling of Muslim-Americans after 9/11
  • Mass deportations and border militarization
  • Voter ID laws
  • Opposition to police accountability

Should I continue?

[–]f3ldman2 8ポイント9ポイント  (10子コメント)

Yeah, you're right, but not on the level of "build a wall between us and the mexicans" or "keep all muslims from coming to America"

[–]Periaphelion 11ポイント12ポイント  (7子コメント)

I'd consider mass incarceration and mass deportations to be worse than building a wall on the border.

[–]f3ldman2 11ポイント12ポイント  (6子コメント)

You could implicate democrats in the mass incarceration issue as well. The outright racism of Donald Trump is like nothing we've ever seen from establishment GOP

[–]Periaphelion 2ポイント3ポイント  (5子コメント)

Yes you can, which is why I hate the Democratic Party as well. Obama deported 2 million people from the US during his 8 years in office. The GOP may be outwardly racist but the Democrats over the past 30 years hid their racism but were racist in effect - Bill Clinton's welfare reform, immigration reform, NAFTA, mass incarceration, deregulation of the banking industry, etc. The GOP is worse but that's a very low bar to set.

[–]Enantiomorphism 7ポイント8ポイント  (4子コメント)

How was nafta racist? Free trade helps both countries involved.

[–]Periaphelion 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

NAFTA destroyed the livelihoods of many Latin American people, especially people like small-scale farmers who could not compete with the massive industrial scale of US agriculture production. NAFTA is one of the largest reasons why the population of undocumented immigrants skyrocketed in the past 15 years - in order to provide for their families people had to follow the capital flight across the US border.

It's racist because it predominately affected poor Latin American countries while their wealth and livelihoods flowed into the US to enrich the predominately white US ownership class.

[–]Enantiomorphism 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

But overall wages have increased al over mexico, and Mexico was able to stabilize inflation and reduce public debt.

Furthermore, Mexican exports have substantially increased, and unemployment in Mexico has substantially decreased. That's good for everybody involved.

On the U.S. side, our prosperity has increased a bit, although manufacturing and farming jobs are lost. (They would have been lost anyway). Don't blame nafta for America's poor people, the correct solution to poverty in the U.S. is not to increase poverty in Mexico by repealing nafta, it's to create a proper social safety net and more infrastructure within the U.S.

[–]Stabby2486 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Not true. Wages shrank, the growth rate was cut in half, basic food stuffs rose in cost, and it took until 2008 for employment to reach 1994 levels. You might want to look up the Zapatistas if you really think NAFTA was so great for Mexico.

[–]learntouseapostrophe [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Free trade helps both countries involved.

if "both countries" means "the capitalist class of both countries, at the expense of the poor and vulnerable."

you realize a fucking revolution was started in Mexico by poor farmers who were unable to feed themselves thanks in a large part to NAFTA, right?

keep that right wing "le free market" libertarian horseshit outta here

[–]ogg33 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

"build a wall between us and the mexicans"

The wall was a thing in the Bush years, as I recall.

[–]Svenomancer 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

It was a fence, but you are correct

[–]platocplx 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

welfare queens is a classic.

[–]KhalmiNatty [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

You're sadly mistaken if you think it's only conservatives enacting those policies. Bush Sr. was tough on crime. Clinton was "tougher" on crime.

Democrats have been extremely complicit in mass incarceration policies that have imprisoned all aspects of American society. Although, according to Michelle Alexander the whites are collateral damage.

[–]ArmyofNorthernVA 3ポイント4ポイント  (96子コメント)

As a Republican, I disagree, and I think that the divisiveness of the republican party shows that this isn't the case. Either stereotype us to be fractious or to be racists, logically I think the two are exclusive.

[–]p68 17ポイント18ポイント  (3子コメント)

Disclaimer: I was raised in a gun-toting Republican family and I've been a Democrat for the latter half of my adult life so far.

Some perceptions Republicans have can lead to somewhat racist conclusions. Having a poor understanding of the black community is the underlying issue here.

When you believe that all it takes is a good work ethic to be successful, and that rich people are rich simply because they have "good values" and work hard, it affects how one views the poor.

If their worldview is true, it's easy to make the following deduction:

  1. People that work hard are wealthy
  2. Conversely, poor people are poor because they don't work hard
  3. Black people are disproportionately poor
  4. Therefore, black people must be lazy.

I'll admit, in the community I grew up in, nobody would outright state #4, but it's a conclusion I used to believe based on points 1-3.

On top of that, a lot of Republicans like to share crime statistics by race without a rationale or explanation. "It's not racism; it's statistics!"

Some might say "family values", but this too implies that some groups must must simply have "shitty values" compared to everyone else. It's very easy for people to simplify the issue and it's difficult to combat one's innate suspicions of out-groups. That is, the numbers themselves aren't racist, but if one does not take care to understand the issue, the conclusions too often are.

[–]platocplx 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

The line about hard work is the biggest crock of shit people sell to people. Its about opportunity and taking advantage of them and getting as many as possible. However for minorities the number of opportunities pales in comparison where one set of people get the "boys will be boys when they misbehave as a kid" while others are seen as criminals even when they are just a dumb kid like we all are.

Thats just one example, also most of the wealthiest people isnt based in immediate success but based off of inheritances etc that has been passed down.

And yeah when people are targeted that totally inflates crime statistics when people across the board probally commit crimes at the same rate. If there were a focus on white offenders you probally would see the rate skyrocket on that side thats why its hard to even take that as a statistic without context.

Its just so much to unpack. people really fail so hard when it comes to being objective about social issues.

[–]ArmyofNorthernVA -2ポイント-1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Well I can't argue that the GOP has no good understanding of the black community, and their voting patterns. There's just no ground to stand on. I think, while they have merit, your 4 deductions may be overly simplistic. And of course, my party is not innocent of that. But the party that wrote the Growth and Opportunity Project, the party that they want to build, is free from a lot of those bad practices. It's a shame they never had a chance.

[–]p68 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think, while they have merit, your 4 deductions may be overly simplistic

That's exactly the problem with failing to understand an issue. Again, when it's thought that all that's needed are hard work and ambition, it's easy to make erroneous conclusions. "shit-in, shit-out" kinda deal.

And just to source it, here's some stats on the partisan gap on the issue of "success": http://www.pewsocialtrends.org/2008/10/23/republicans-still-happy-campers/

[–]m-flo 120ポイント121ポイント  (36子コメント)

Racism isn't an on or off thing. There are degrees. They run the gamut from your KKK/Nazi skinhead, to little old grandma who still can't lose the culture she was raised with that thinks interracial marriages are icky but tries not to call blacks niggers.

The Republican party is filled with racists. The successful dogwhistling that has worked for 25+ years is testament to that. People who are either outright racist or people who care so little about it they are willing to ally themselves with outright racists, which pretty much makes you a racist.

[–]Punchee 10ポイント11ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think that's the most fascinating part at play here. The dog whistles were vague enough to cover the spectrum before, but now that we are using plain speech grandma is getting upset because deep down grandma isn't a piece of shit.

[–]Nopersom 26ポイント27ポイント  (24子コメント)

Yeah, honestly though I think that rhetoric kind of lets progressives off the hook for our racism. By which I don't mean some "you're oppressing white men" bullshit. But we're often just as blind to the stuff we ignore, or the ways in which we're trying to give ourselves good guy guy points but balking at anything which would require any real effort or even listening to people.

So yeah, racism occurs in degrees absolutely, and we can't let people off the hook sowing anxieties about immigrants or black people or three million American citizens who are Muslim without a fight, but... it's definitely everywhere and it's easy for us to subconsciously say "Well at least I'm not like them" as an excuse for not making a change where we live and in our own lifestyles.

[–]ayovita 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I made friends with a guy who claimed he was Republican but didn't really agree with their core vaules the further we talked about it. I wouldn't say he was racist, maybe ignorant in some ways but it didn't come from pure hatred. He was an atheist, pro-choice and was in favor of most programs that helped those of low income (which makes sense considering his family is mostly poor in WV.). At first he asked why it seemed like the Republicans were so "bad." I told him that's up for him to morally decide and it might do some good to actually see what bills his local politicians were in favor of.

[–]Yaboysatchel 0ポイント1ポイント  (3子コメント)

Flipping your sentence to the other side of the line...

People who are either outright homosexual or care so little about it they are willing to ally themselves with outright homosexuals, which pretty much makes you homosexual

I don't care who you love, love is love, but I know I'm not homosexual...you can pick and choose whatever adjective you like, but your OP doesn't make sense, you can't just blanket statement people...isn't that was were trying to fight against??

[–]m-flo -2ポイント-1ポイント  (2子コメント)

Flipping your sentence to the other side of the line... People who are either outright homosexual or care so little about it they are willing to ally themselves with outright homosexuals, which pretty much makes you homosexual

Err... no...

Allying with outright racists and not caring about racism makes you a racist because if you really don't care about the existence of racism at all and do things that perpetuate that racism, while knowing it will perpetuate that racism, that is pretty much the definition of being a racist.

Allying with homosexuals doesn't make you a homosexual because the definition of being a homosexual is having sexual attraction to the same sex.

"I don't really dig all the anti-Jew stuff that this guy is saying, and I know voting for him is going to increase all these anti-Jewish things and make life hell for them, but man I just really like how he tells it like it is."

That person is anti-Jewish.

"I think being homosexual is okay and I will fight for their right to be homosexual."

That person is not gay.

[–]Yaboysatchel 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

So you automatically gain the attributes you denounce in someone because you like a single attribute that person possesses?

Damn Kobe Bryant is a hell of an athlete, just a fantastic basketball player...fuck, now I'm an accused rapist.

I understand what you're trying to say, but you can't blanket statement a whole people because their political party starts with an R and not a D....that's all I'm trying to say here.

[–]m-flo 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

So you automatically gain the attributes you denounce in someone because you like a single attribute that person possesses?

If you only liked a single attribute in that one person and you actually found the other parts of that person truly reprehensible, you wouldn't support that person. That is the point here. You have to really just not care about treating people of different races fairly if you care so little about racism that you would support a person like Little Donnie.

Damn Kobe Bryant is a hell of an athlete, just a fantastic basketball player...fuck, now I'm an accused rapist.

You're making some enormous leaps here. If Kobe Bryant were actually a rapist and instead of just making objectively true statements about his ability as an athlete you said "he's the person I'm going to vote for, who will influence policy including women's issues" then I'd have to conclude you weren't much of a feminist.

I'll use the example of an athlete on my favorite sports team, Pavel Datsyuk. He answered in a bigoted way on the question of homosexuality. Is he still a great athlete? Absolutely. Is he someone I'm going to vote for office? No.

[–]ArmyofNorthernVA -1ポイント0ポイント  (3子コメント)

I think that there are a lot of leaps there, but I at least understand your point. And you're right, we do struggle with racists. That said, the party was on course to change. Would we have exhumed all racism? No. There's probably some on the Left too that they just can't scrub out. And I am a Never-Trumper. I want to advance that course that we were on. The one that would lead to solutions.

[–]m-flo 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

That said, the party was on course to change. Would we have exhumed all racism?

The leadership was on course to change.

The people of the GOP are still too racist. It's the party of old white dudes. It's the party where the demographics are still strongest in the South, which yes, is more racist.

Until you either kick those members out by telling them there's no place for them or they die out, the GOP is going to continue to be the party of racism.

[–]ArmyofNorthernVA 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Well racism started generationally and I think it will have to end generationally. And change comes from leaders. When you cant take away anyone's right to vote, and you're faced with consistent losing...how much of a choice is there?

[–]m-flo 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I dunno. Call me in 20 years after a few more GOP losses.

[–]Periaphelion 57ポイント58ポイント  (6子コメント)

>Republican claims Republican Party is not racist

>Said Republican's username is a tribute to the Confederacy

Hmmm....

[–]ArmyofNorthernVA -4ポイント-3ポイント  (5子コメント)

Said Republican didn't know his internet forum name constituted his whole identity.

[–]MexicansAreCriminals -2ポイント-1ポイント  (3子コメント)

Preach it, Brother!

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[–]TheDonJonJay 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Did he get banned because he was talking about Donald Trumps tax returns?

[–]AutoModerator[M] 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Speaking of tax returns, did you hear Donald Trump is refusing to release them because Donald Trump has donated to NAMBLA? That's what all the best sources, the most tremendous sources are saying, and if they're all saying that Donald Trump donated to NAMBLA, well, I can see why Donald Trump would want to cover up his donations to NAMBLA. I'm not claiming that Donald Trump donates to NAMBLA, but that's what these excellent sources are alleging, that Donald Trump does indeed donate to NAMBLA.

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[–]Fitzmagics_Beard -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

No, but it clearly points out one terrible part of your identity, racism, which makes the argument about the Republican party not being racist harder to swallow even if it it mostly correct.

[–]thephotoman 48ポイント49ポイント  (11子コメント)

You can't claim to be anti-racist then name yourself for the totally racist Army of Northern Virginia.

Sorry, it just doesn't fly.

[–]It_Could_Happen_HereDONNIE LOVES VLAD 50ポイント51ポイント  (1子コメント)

Fair. Username undermines the message somewhat.

[–]ArmyofNorthernVA -3ポイント-2ポイント  (0子コメント)

I see what you did there haha. I hadn't thought of that until you said it.

[–]GobtheCyberPunk 29ポイント30ポイント  (4子コメント)

Says the guy named after the army of a traitor who both believed slavery was bad (for white people) but black people's "natural state" was subservience. He also had all free blacks he found during his March through the North beaten and sold into slavery, regardless of whether they were even born slaves.

No, no, please explain how you are not racist. I'm glad we're slowly erasing all traces of Virginia's worship of traitors and bigots from our monuments, roads, and schools.

Edit: For context this guy posts a ton of right wing bullshit in subreddits related to Virginia. He basically hits every stereotype of Leeaboo, and his response to anyone who criticizes the racist history of the state is not a real Virginian. Which is hilarious because I recently found out that despite my family only settling in NoVA in 1991 that I have ancestors going back to Jamestown, whose descendants not only fought in the Revolution but also fought in The Army of Northern Virginia at Gettysburg (while another ancestor of mine fought for the Union), so I have at least as much of a right to criticize this history of racism as any Lost Causer.

[–]aurous_of_light 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

Leeaboo?

[–]Periaphelion 7ポイント8ポイント  (1子コメント)

A fan of the confederacy and General Robert E. Lee. It's a reference to the term Weaboo which is a non-Japanese person who is obsessed with Japanese culture and media. There are other similar terms like Wehraboo which is someone who thinks the German WW2 Wehrmacht was awesome / did nothing wrong.

[–]ArmyofNorthernVA -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

Hi there. Nothing you wrote is true, and I would appreciate you editing. I don't have to explain how I am racist, I would rather you explain why my username on an internet forum makes me a racist.

Also, I don't spew "right wing bullshit", I am a Republican with as much right to free expression as you, and I do a way better job of not attacking people but their points. Yours are invalid. Good luck editing history.

Your vitriolic, immature writing casts a bad light on your point.

[–]jb4427 5ポイント6ポイント  (1子コメント)

Donald Trump won the nomination outright. Make all the excuses you want, but the Republicans had a vote and that's the guy who won it.

[–]ArmyofNorthernVA 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

well, and you're not wrong at all, Donald brought people to the polls who had not been there in a long time. The party that Ryan was trying to build, that the Growth and Opportunity Project was a blueprint for, was a far far cry different. Low-wage, working class whites had a way higher rate of attrition before this year, and that has skewed results somewhat.

[–]therevengeofshcustom flair 7ポイント8ポイント  (2子コメント)

You disagree? Paul Ryan won't even resend his endorsement of Trump, and he endorsed Trump even after he's said the terrible things he has said. I think the only thing causing divisiveness in the Republican party is exactly what this cartoon is highlighting. Republican's rely heavily on the racist vote. You guys refuse to admit you have a problem.

[–]kmacku 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

Just letting you know in case that's not a typo, the word is "rescind."

[–]ArmyofNorthernVA -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

*rescind.

And if no one has to you yet, let me be the first Republican to tell you that we have a problem with racists. Democrats have different problems, but there are probably a few populations that they believe cast them in a bad light as well. But you can't believe that the party is united while looking at polls that have Hillary +10%. That CLEARLY shows that there isn't party unity, or that gap would be narrower.

[–]mynewaccounts 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

I think a fractured party not proof that it is not the case, but proof that it is. The racists who support Trump were generally already Republican. They were called to the Republican party through the use of dog whistles that were more subtle than what Trump is using, but that is why they are there.

They were dog whistles instead of outright statements like Trump makes, however, because there are several other groups Republicans also dog whistle. Trump has proven that those groups are driven away by the overt rhetoric that draws the racist Republican supporters in.

But all of this is perfectly reflected in the cartoon. If 100% of Republicans were as racist as Trumplicans then there would not really be an issue and speaking in code would have been unnecessary from the start. Even if all Dems disagreed with the overtly racist rhetoric it would not matter if the Reps could get their people to the polls better.

The problem is that the Reps were using subtle racism to draw racist supporters to the polls, and it looks like that represents somewhere from 1/4th to 1/2 of the Republican party. By making it overt Trump is getting that 1/4th to 1/2 super excited, but is pushing away the other 1/2 to 3/4ths, which is why the Republican party is kind of breaking apart over this election.

[–]ArmyofNorthernVA 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well I think your point is well stated. I would like to err on 3/4 rather than 1/2, though I will admit it doesn't gel perfectly on first glance at the polls. The problem is, that many of the reliable establishment type voters had given up by February, and that Trump brought people out to the polls who had not been there before. You're not wrong that if those folks had been polled pre-Trump that they would have likely fallen Republican if forced to be on one side or the other, but as a party, and I believe this, the group that wrote the Growth and Opportunity Project was on the right track to change that perception.

[–]Trepur349 2ポイント3ポイント  (3子コメント)

As a republican I think the rise of Trump and the fact that now close to 90% of Republicans say they'll vote for him shows just how prevelant racism is in our party.

This primary season was very disheartening for me, since it showed white nationalism trumps conservative values in Republican primaries. Democrats have long since believed that to be the case, but I didn't think it was true until I saw it happen.

But I do still hate the democrats claiming all republicans are racist, take it from the anti-Trump republicans in this sub, we're not unless you're lowering the bar for what constitutes as a racist too the extent that the label becomes meaningless.

[–]ArmyofNorthernVA 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

Well I disliked the primaries as well. Huge Rand Paul supporter, and he just never got it off of the ground. Rubio supporter, and then he had to climb in the gutter.

Where did you get the 90% number? Because I am seeing waaaaaay lower estimates.

And I agree. Many, in fact I would posit most, of Republicans aren't virulent racists. And the stereotype cuts deep to those of us who work hard to try to make tomorrow's GOP better.

[–]Trepur349 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

I myself supported Jeb then Rubio (following a couple of bad debate performances by Jeb) then Cruz (after Rubio dropped out).

As for the number, the actual number (prior to the Khan scandal) is 85%, I thought it was high 80s not mid-80s (hence my almost 90%), so sorry for misrembering, lol.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/gop-voters-are-rallying-behind-trump-as-if-he-were-any-other-candidate/

[–]ArmyofNorthernVA 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

No, actually thanks for helping me understand. Pre-Khan, those numbers seem pretty believable. Its all been downhill from the DNC.

[–]LandKuj 12ポイント13ポイント  (10子コメント)

We're not supported by a base of ignorance and racism! Look at this black guy we elected! Hahaha

As someone who would gladly vote for someone like Paul Ryan, I don't hate republicans. However the idea the republican base hasn't been riled up on purposefully ignorant bull is just a lie

[–]p68 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

FYI, there's actual a term for this. It's called moral licensing.

[–]ArmyofNorthernVA 2ポイント3ポイント  (7子コメント)

Well you're not wrong and I know I'm a long way from home base on this site, but I'm one of those wonks in northern va that actually read a lot of the Growth and Opportunity Project after 2012. Man that thing is pure solid gold for winning in national elections and DT just wrecked even the possibility that it could be useful. And it kills me.

[–]20per10flat 11ポイント12ポイント  (3子コメント)

My issue with the right is and always has been that I would love to have a discussion about economics, but it's hard to sit down with bigotry.

I think the two party system forces a lot of people who really just believe in the economic principles and other policy matters to crack down on homosexuality, and claim racism doesn't exist. It's kind of tragic honestly.

Just my two cents.

[–]compounding 4ポイント5ポイント  (1子コメント)

I’ve been reading a bit from that GOPLifer blogger who just quit the party in spectacular fashion over Trump.

Intellectual rather than anti-science, against pure obstructionism, pro personal liberties but not smaller government at any cost, bitter criticism for racism and dog-whistles within the party and a recognition that good design can strengthen and optimize a necessary social safety net while simultaneously softening the impact of unequally distributed benefits/harms from economically valuable pro-market reforms...

Damn, combined with a newfound awareness of the “tea-party on the left” in virulent Bernie supporters, its almost like a peak through a portal into an alternate universe where guys like that moved the Republican party towards the middle while the Left moved towards its fringe with candidates promising the sky with little concern for how you actually get there or the actual costs/benefits of the policies themselves. I could almost imagine myself having become a Republican in that alternate universe.

Then I snap back to reality where Democrats became the party of reason and embraced some market-based regulations like cap-and-trade as a reasonable compromise for balancing environmental concerns with economic and business interests, and where they actually try and solve serious market failures like we see in the Healthcare system, going so far as to promote pure Republican ideas and yet still don't receive any legislative support to design and implement a good system. A reality where Democrats offered and Republicans turned down 2 trillion in additional deficit reduction including entitlement reforms, apparently because they couldn’t be seen doing business with “the antichrist” they created in their own minds.

What a different reality we got, one where I cannot imagine supporting any Republican candidate at the national level.

[–]20per10flat 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

See the nomination of Merrick Garland for another example of how gop hates compromise.

Not to mention global warming, which I recognize many voters think is only presented as a moral issue for political reasons, but that's just because there's such a huge twisting of the facts. I know gop candidates are well educated to know the pseudoscience they are promoting is garbage, I know they know they are telling their supporters bullshit in the interest of big oil, like when Ted Cruz intentionally used raw satellite data instead of actual satellite data.

Or when I hear gop people I know invent the statistic that "just as many climate scientists believe in global warming as don't", which no climate scientist would agree with.

Global warming is such a serious issue that it irks me so much to see people know full well they are killing us all, but not care near enough to do shit about it.

The science behind global warming is not complicated nor is there room for error. We've known for more than 100 years that co2 is a greenhouse gas, and there's nothing more simple than the idea that it's blocking infrared light from leaving, resulting in warming.

Climate change deniers are bullshit.

[–]ArmyofNorthernVA 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

This is a great comment, and thanks for your perspective. Yes, I too struggle with people in my party that are undoubtedly bigots. Generationally its sad that I have to sit quietly while people who will die soon ruin the reputation of my party. But I do still believe in the core tenets of economic conservatism, and the core functions of government.

[–]ThinkMinty 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

You could consider converting to leftism? We actually care about people.

[–]ArmyofNorthernVA 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

See, this is the false dichotomy I try a lot to fight on Reddit. Being a Republican is automatically synonymous with being an uncaring asshole. What if I believe that streamlining government to its core responsibilities will free up money, time and people to make government programs actually work for the people they were designed for. Or that a controllable national debt will help increase our national security, much like freeing us up to use our own energy resources rather than importing. Or what if I believe that government governs best which is close to the people? What if I believe that executive overreach subverts the will of the people? What if I oppose unilateral military action or undue interference in international politics or fear a surveillance state?

I care about people a lot. I just think my solutions will help them more than the ideas Democrats have.

[–]ThinkMinty 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

What if I believe that streamlining government to its core responsibilities will free up money, time and people to make government programs actually work for the people they were designed for.

Start with banning government use of mercenaries (they're pricier and less accountable than our own soldiers), disallowing spending on military hardware that gets sent right to the boneyard and will never be used, and military contractors marking up weapons and gear beyond their costs, then we'll talk about waste.

I would like less guns, more butter. The money's there in the existing budget to do stuff like single-payer healthcare and tuition-free higher education without raising taxes a single red cent, but we blow it on a cartoonishly overstuffed military budget. If we could afford to burn several trillion dollars on the Iraq War, a fraction of that to improve people's lives is not only reasonable, but you'd have to be an uncaring dick to argue against it.

While we're at it, can we stop paying federal legislators who are no longer in office? They're already all rich people anyway, they don't need a six-figure benefits package once they're no longer representing anyone.

Or that a controllable national debt

Doesn't public debt translate into private surplus, though?

will help increase our national security,

You wanna increase national security? Ban predatory lending practices that target soldiers and veterans. That's gotta be undermining national security somehow.

much like freeing us up to use our own energy resources rather than importing.

If you want to nationalize our oil fields and only buy from "new world" countries such as Canada and Venezuela so we don't need to prop up dictators in the middle east, that's something I'd be glad to do.

Additionally, ending oil subsidies and converting to renewables will give us a revolution in tech and tangible, long-lasting energy independence. Think of all the jobs in solar power, for example. Plus with solar panels, people can harvest power so locally it's from their own house, lower their bill, and sell some of that power back to the electric company. Germany shouldn't be beating us in solar power so badly, it's kind of embarrassing.

Or what if I believe that government governs best which is close to the people?

State-level Republicans need to stop fucking with towns who pass anti-discrimination ordinances and ban fracking, then.

This "state's rights" crap only seems to come up when y'all object to federal-level anti-racism efforts such as desegregation, but this so-called principle went out the window when DOMA happened.

I've never bought into the idea that conservatives believe in small government, because y'alls behavior contradicts that as soon as gay people want rights or when someone wants to smoke weed and watch MST3K without getting more time in jail than child rapists, cannibals, and terrorists.

What if I believe that executive overreach subverts the will of the people?

Let's abolish the death penalty, if you really believe that. What's more overreaching than the state committing an act of pre-meditated murder?

What if I oppose unilateral military action or undue interference in international politics or fear a surveillance state?

Why was it acceptable when Bush did it? You people were silent on this until 2009 when you weren't cheerleading for it.

I care about people a lot. I just think my solutions will help them more than the ideas Democrats have.

Political opinions other than "Democrat" and "Republican" exist. Note that I asked you to try leftism rather than registering as a Democrat.

[–]bigmacxtrasauce -3ポイント-2ポイント  (0子コメント)

it's not a base. it's just the times we live in.

[–]JayaBallard 5ポイント6ポイント  (4子コメント)

The Republicans are capable of pandering to more than one group, you know. Trump just sucks at it.

The Republican party undeniably courts the racist vote.

The Republican party is also undeniably fractious. You've got dixiecrats, authoritarians, libertarians, social conservatives, fiscal conservatives, etc. Many of these factions have ideologies that are hardly compatible.

[–]ArmyofNorthernVA -1ポイント0ポイント  (3子コメント)

Well, I know that there's nothing I can do about things that happened 50 years ago, but I would recommend you give the Growth and Opportunity Project a look. It was a great blueprint to bring in diverse communities, millenials, and make the GOP a big tent again. I am sad that what happened did, but the hijacking of a bunch of populists shouldn't invalidate that amazing research. I hope it instructs our strategy going forward.

[–]JayaBallard 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

The "Growth and Opportunity Project" is the "New Coke" of the GOP.

The RNC recognized its demographic problem, but it just tried to rebrand its same old pandering in a new package that it thought would be appealing to younger people. The target demographic saw right through it.

The Republican party is the same fractious heap of racists, bible-thumpers, fascists, libertarians, conspiracy theorists, and general idiots that it's always been. It is simply too attached to those groups to pivot toward a more rational position.

The primary process ensures that anyone resembling a "moderate" conservative will have no chance.

[–]ArmyofNorthernVA 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

I suppose we don't have anything to discuss, sufficed to say that we both believe strongly the other is mistaken. Have a good life.

[–]JayaBallard 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

You too.

EDIT: Serious. You and I have obvious differences, but for what it's worth it seems we both want a good life for us, our families, our friends, our parents, and our children.

There's no sense in hating one another.

What I'm saying is that if you were my neighbor and your septic tank was bubbling up through through your floor, I'd let you shit in my toilet.

[–]Cr3X1eUZ 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Everybody farts. Most people have the good sense to try and not fart out loud in public.

[–]ArmyofNorthernVA -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

Never heard it put that way.

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[–]AbortusLuciferum 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Oh my god where did that picture come from? Cameras aren't allowed in the office!

Was it Brent?

[–]adevland 0ポイント1ポイント  (14子コメント)

Who's the elephant supposed to be?

[–]bilaljsa 50ポイント51ポイント  (5子コメント)

Elephant is the symbol of GOP.

[–]QuidProQuo_Clarice 6ポイント7ポイント  (2子コメント)

If they didn't know the significance of the elephant, there's a good chance they don't know what GOP means either.

  • Elephant is a symbol for Republican
  • Donkey is a symbol for Democrat
  • GOP stands for Grand Old Party, which refers to the Republican Party. The etymology of that term dates back to the 1800s, but that's all I know about it

[–]NullStellen 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Chances are /u/adevland was making a joke on the fact that they put a label on Trump but not the elephant as if the audience was somehow ignorant as to who Trump is and what he looks like yet somehow informed as to symbol representing the Republican party.

[–]adevland 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I actually had no idea about any of this. TIL. :D

[–][削除されました]  (1子コメント)

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    [–]Greyhaven7 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

    I mean, I know who Trump is, but only because he's labeled. It must be the elephant man...

    [–]bathroomstalin -2ポイント-1ポイント  (6子コメント)

    Jesus fucking Christ

    [–]016Bramble 5ポイント6ポイント  (2子コメント)

    Why'd they draw him looking like an Elephant. And why's he talking to Trump??

    [–]xalxolcotl 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

    Early artistic depictions from the 2nd century[1] show Jesus as a humanoid elephant, as the first Christian sect was a Semitic offshoot of Hinduism. The artist is mocking the GOP by reminding them that Christianity once embraced the entire Hindu pantheon, although today the GOP is sometimes seen as xenophobic. The Holy Trinity was once the Holy Tridecamillenity[2].

    Sources: 1, 2

    [–]Lordepelger 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

    No way Tump's hair has ever looked that good

    [–]BoringWebDev 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Good programmers always hide their opinions in the comments.

    //you asshole.

    [–]Shrodingerscat4223 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

    I think electing President Obama President brought out the racism that was more of an undercurrent in the past.

    Now the racist, sexist, and cultural superiority they feel has been brought out into the open.

    [–]PM_me_a_dirty_haiku 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

    Wouldn't you prefer the GOP candidate to say exactly what he means as opposed to speaking in code? Or is this just a dig at GOP and not Trump?

    [–]mrpnut123 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

    They know that if they say what they mean, they can't win elections.

    The cartoon is a reference to the fact that Donald Trump doesn't seem to understand that the GOP's long standing tradition of appealing to white racist voters is supposed to be done using subtle dog whistle phrases.

    BTW, this isn't a conspiracy theory, one of Reagan's advisers basically admitted it.

    [–]thechapattack -3ポイント-2ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Trump speaks many of the same positions clearly that the current administration has. Everyone was shocked when trump said that he would go after the families of terrorists but the Obama administration has already did just that. Abdulrahman al-Awlaki was the son of a suspected terrorist and was killed 2 weeks after his father was killed and he was also a minor and an American citizen. Robert Gibbs simply said he should have picked a more responsible father. Hell he actually was less hawkish than Clinton when speaking to AIPAC.

    One of Trump's greatest sins is that he speaks plainly and clearly mainstream political positions of the GOP and even some of both parties. He is a mirror being held up to our political system and what he is reflecting isn't pretty.