Why Do Women in Their 30s Not Want to Date Men in Their 40s?
I’m a 42 year old single male who recently left a 5 year relationship for various reasons, but mainly because I wanted kids and she did not. I thought that since I was an attractive, fit, well-educated, financially and emotionally secure guy that I would have no problem finding a woman in her mid 30s to settle down with and start a family. I have tried a combination of online dating, speed dating, professional singles events, volunteering, happy hours etc. and have had very few dates over the past year. I thought that online dating would be great since you are essentially pre-screening people for dates. I have found that I get no responses from any women online and the only women who respond to my ad are usually much older and don’t meet any of my criteria outlined in my profile.
I am told that women want to settle down and have kids, etc., but their actions seem to be to the contrary. At singles events, women come in groups and are reluctant to talk to men. In online situations, women say they want desperately to meet a nice guy like me, but never answer my response to their profile. I am trying to remain positive, but two things are really bothering me. One, that younger women are no longer interested in dating men who are even just slightly (3-5 years) older than them and sometimes want to date men 5-10 years younger then them. Two, women seem to be content in the fact that they are independent and self-sufficient and have a career, family and friends that fulfills them and don’t seem to be interested in truly finding a relationship. I find the latter hard to believe, but find this mantra in every profile of every professional woman online. Any advice on how to navigate these new paradigms in the dating world?
Adam
Dear Adam,
You came to the right place.
And to directly address your email, I have to divide my response into two different parts: 1) What You’re Getting Right and 2) What You’re Missing.
Let’s start with What You’re Missing. We’ll do What You’re Getting Right next week.
From 25-34, men play around a lot. Why? Because they can. They have a lot of dating options, they’re building their careers, and there isn’t a clear urgency to settle down.
Once a guy crosses 35, however, he (theoretically) tends to get more serious.
What you’re missing is that what you want has absolutely no relation to what women want.
Alas, the women with whom he wants to get serious are 27-34. This gives men time to court, fall in love, travel together, move in, get engaged, and enjoy a few years of childless marriage before starting a family.
The problem is that many women from 27-34 are independent professionals just like their male peers. They, too, have a lot of dating options, are busy building their careers, and don’t have a clear urgency to settle down.
Then she hits 35. Theoretically, this is when she starts to get more serious. This is also when all the problems start.
Because 35-40-year-old men who are ready to settle down still want to have time before becoming dads. Thus, their target market remains women, 27-34 – who may not be ready to settle down quite yet. These women still have money to make, places to travel and oats to sow.
The 35-40-year-old women who ARE ready for marriage, unfortunately, are roundly ignored by the men they desire – their 35-40-year-old peers. These women are youthful and find themselves far more attracted to men in their 30’s than their 40’s.
…the bigger takeaway is that ALL of us are very judgmental on age.
Which brings us to you, Adam. You say you’re looking for a woman in her mid-30’s. That’s perfectly fair. But if none of them are looking for you, your wheelhouse is going to be women in their late 30’s to early 40’s:
Find the people who want you. It’s the same exact advice I give to women in their early 40’s who want men in their early 40’s…except men in their early 40’s want women in their 30’s.
And around and around we go.
I’m being a bit unfair, Adam, because there IS a market for a 42-year-old man – and you can certainly be doing better than you’re currently doing. Pick up a copy of Finding The One Online and it should make a difference. Seriously. But the bigger takeaway is that ALL of us are very judgmental on age. To a 34 year old woman, 42 sounds OLD. To a 42-year-old man who wants his own biological children, anything above 36 is getting into risky territory. The lesson to all of you younger readers: take your love life seriously when you turn 30, instead of waiting until you’re 35 or 40.
Great advice, Evan. I like the way you broke it down.
I’m a 37 year old woman and have online dated off and on over the years. I’m attractive, fit, have a job, etc. I’ve never been married and do not have any kids. I’m looking for a LTR but with that said I’ m not willing to settle.
I would date a 42 year old, not a problem, but as you say, men in their 40’s are looking for women who are in the 27-34 year old bracket.
I do know when I was in my early 30’s, anyone in their 40’s seemed old to me! Funny how that works out.
It’s been my experience that I seem to get alot of emails from the 50+ and over crowd. To be fair, I’m not looking to date my dad. Sorry!
And like you said, round and round we go….
Because having children with a woman over 34 is risky and potentially expensive unless you’re health plan support reproductive health. I am 42 and while the women who stare at my profile are in their 40’s, they are 45-47, da fuc?
I have it clearly stated in my profiles I want to have children. I am not taking that medical risk.
I am a 39 year old woman and I just have to say maybe you have all waited too long to have kids. I had kids in my 20’s now its time to kick back
This is the most helpful comment on here. I am 34 and it is clear as daylight that waiting this long was a mistake and makes things harder…nkt impossible but harder. Yet people constantly advise that you have all this time and to go galavanting all over the globe and this is fine UNLESS you know you want a family. I am having a child on my own and I will tell her be married by 30 if you intend on having a family. The reality is for the best outcome you dont have all day.
Agreed! I am 35 with a 11 year old and 4 year old. I do not care if you are Prince Charming…I am done with the baby stage. That ship has sailed.
Well lah di freaking day for you, goody two shoes. Did it ever occur to you that maybe some of us got jerked around and lied to for years??? We didn’t just get knocked up by accident to a random person, like you obviously did? Great. You got knocked up at 20. Gee, that’s something to brag about. While I was traveling and seeing the world, and studying and developing and living, you were babysitting. Awesome. I can still have kids, but you will never have the adventures I had. Priceless.
Frustrated: Wow. That’s some vitriol there. I can see that you’re very unhappy, but it’s not everyone else’s fault you know. I’m one of those who got married and had kids in my (late) 20’s and I’m really grateful for that. BTW: I was “knocked” up by my husband, not some random guy and it was all carefully planned. I knew well that time to have babies was limited. Like many people, I’m now divorced and so am trying to navigate these strange new online dating rituals, but I’m not unhappy with my situation. Since my kids will be grown by my late 40s I will have plenty of time to go on those adventures you speak of. We all have to work with the real world, no matter how much we don’t like the way it works. I wish for a lot of things, but that won’t make them come true. The sad reality is that women were sold a false message that we could have it all. We were told it was OK to put off having children, that there would time for that later, after our careers were established. It wasn’t true and some of us recognized that. Now reality is catching up with those who either chose not to have kids early or simply didn’t have the opportunity. I really wish things were different and people weren’t in this predicament but that’s simply how it is.
Some times we can not control what is meant to be. I was a virgin until the age of 34. NOT by choice. I always had trouble getting girls / women intrested in me, and got rejected all my life… Now at age 43 I dont want kids. Women are still hard for me to get, but I quit trying 20 years ago..
Congrats and have fun. Not all of us have had the same experience.
I just turned 40 and dated a 47 attractive guy who has never been married and never had children. We had the most amazing time and connection until I brought up the fact that I had my tubes tied after having my second son and he decided to end the relationship that was nearly staring becuase he wants children. I’m sorry but at 40 with a 19 year old and 15 years old sons I’M DONE with kids and ready to start living life again. WHY DO YOU WANT CHILDREN AT 47? and trade what I could have been a beautiful long lasting relationship for something that obviously wasn’t meant to be and it became an obsecion.
Beautiful at 40: Don’t mourn losing that guy. He wasn’t the right match for you. He is chasing a dream that may be tough to achieve. Most of us in our 40s are in the same position as you. I can’t have any more kids but, even if I could, I’m done with that now. Realistically speaking, he is going to have to find either a woman in her 40s who wants to have kids (not impossible for sure) or try to court a younger woman. Unless he has something very special that sets him above all the other men in their 30s and early 40s, younger women will likely reject him for guys closer to their own ages. He will learn one day that he needs to compromise on something somewhere. You can go on to find a great divorced dad who’s kids are also on the way out of the nest.
@ Al
I doubt he’s actually chasing a dream. He most likely doesn’t want kids at all and just used her tubal ligation as an easy excuse to break it off, thereby turning it back on her. Beatiful at 40’s guy would have known from the very start that he’d have higher odds of having a kid with women in their 30s rather than 40s. In fact I reckon he saw it as temporary thing from the very outset.
At his age I would surmise that he doesn’t actually want kids at all, unless…he met a ‘once-in-a-lifetime’ woman. Beautiful at 40 was just unlucky to get caught up with him and not be able to suss him out properly.
alert, that’s so great that everything worked out perfectly for you. You’re obviously better than everyone else.
I’m a 42 year old man who still wants desperately to have children. I searched throughout my 20s for a woman. It’s like that episode of Seinfeld, “When they like you, you don’t like them. When you like them, they don’t like you.” Finally when I turned 30, I found a girl, fell in love, and got married.
But I made a stupid mistake. I never sat down and looked her in the eye and said, “I’m not marrying anyone unless we agree to have children.” I never had that conversation. I never even thought of it. I mean, what were we getting married for? Of course we would have children…or so I thought.
My best friend told me years later he DID have that exact conversation with his wife. She wanted to marry him very badly, and he told her to forget about it unless she gave him a child. Seems so FREAKING SIMPLE in hindsight. Biggest regret of my life, not having that conversation with my ex-wife.
So this animal wasted my 30s, divorced me, and now here I am. I still want my own children. And as a 42 year old man, I have all the problems that were covered in this article.
So should I give up now? Because I “waited too long”. So, it’s time to just give up according to you, alert. All of us in the same boat should just wait around to die now, because alert is so much smarter than us, and she says we waited too long. SHE didn’t wait too long, because she’s the next Einstein, and we are all so stupid.
That’s why there were so many angry responses to alert’s post. It is not constructive in any way. It is designed to be hurtful, to say “I told you so”, and is an attempt to talk down to people and rub our problem in our faces.
All I can say is never give up. Last year, I dated a girl who was 22 years old, nearly half my age. These girls are out there. They aren’t easy to find, but they’re out there.
Never give up. I won’t and neither should any of you. In fact, I only wanted one or two children, but now I’m going to have 3 just to spite this “alert” person.
@Jack. You are spot on with your comment. It’s funny how it is the women (alert & just me) who are paying out everyone.
Just food for thought, it is the women who control reproduction, not men. If a woman says no, I don’t want kids, than there will be no kids, even if a guy wants one. So women have the key. It’s easy for a woman to point the finger. It is a typical woman’s spiteful comments. No wonder most women in the work place for example don’t get along with each other. Most women I have worked with always wanted to work with us men.
To be honest, I hear the same mantra from some of my colleagues who have grown up children and they are only in their late 30’s, “I am glad I had kids so young, I wouldn’t have kids if I were over 35”. One of them was aiming her comments at me being 34. Also, that one colleague now has moved back home to her mum, at 39, she kicked her son out as he is 21. She is single now, never married, lives at home with her mum. Wow how awesome, she had her son young but has nothing to show for it. All she has now is living at home with her mum, no bloke on the horizon and works as a PA.
It’s funny how it always comes out of the mouths of women, this type of talk. Especially, since they know they control reproduction. Also, the way some of my colleagues comments come across like they never really wanted children and don’t love them. I never heard this type of comment from my mother. Mind you, I am not from a Western culture as I am Eastern European. We have slightly different values.
I can also say, all throughout my 20’s I wanted children, but none of the women I dated did. I have several degrees, own two homes, two cars, citizen of four different countries, lived on 4 different continents, just launching my own company with approx £1million pound investment and I am only 34. Luckily I am married now, and me and my wife are desperately trying for a child. Unfortuntely, she has suffered from bad fibroids in the womb all her life.
The point is, stop judging everyone else, when clearly as women, you are in control when and if you have children, NOT THE MEN!
@ Jack – You made sure to brag about the age of the woman you dated last year. And yet, you comment on things designed to be hurtful or to rub things in each other’s faces. Honestly, you hardly have to date 22 year olds to find someone to have children with. You should have kids if that’s what you want. It sounds like both you and your ex-wife made mistakes. There are many women in the same position as you, if you have the heart to look at women the same way you look at men. Just educate yourself about your own body and paternal age affects on children. Women are very aware of their age when it comes to children. But it benefits men themselves to be more aware of how their paternal age can affect their own off-spring. Again, I’m not saying you shouldn’t have kids. You should if you want them. But please show women the same kind of kindness you’d like for yourself.
Norbert – Can you see how strange it is that you wrap up your comments by telling others not to judge but your entire post is nothing but some terrible judgements on women?
Men have as much autonomy as any other human being when it comes to children. Any individual woman or man has a say in when and if they have children. And any individual woman or man sometimes encounters things that are out of their control. But men are not magically less autonomous here just because they don’t actually birth babies. Everyone as choices. And no, women don’t have the ‘key’.
Your judgements against women shines through though when you say things like “typical women’s spiteful comments”. If you want women to like you, you actually have to like women. Further upholding an equally terrible idealology that women don’t like each other or can’t get along and only like men clearly furthers your own agenda of spreading hate against women. And it’s not even true because women form very deep networks of friendships and support. I was infact must disgusted by your belief that most women don’t get along in the workpalce (false) or that women only want to work with you men. Could you be more degrading toward women?
There is nothing wrong with you having kids after 34. I’m 34 too and I’m open to having kids. I would never been able to handle kids in my early 20s. So while it may have been the right choice for some, I know it wouldn’t have been the right one for me. And that I will be a better Mom now then I would have been when I was younger.
I have no clue why you feel the need to tear down this 39 year old mum just because she said that to you. Are you not engaging in the same behavior she was by tearing someone else down for their choices? Maybe her and her mum are really close? Maybe she isn’t looking for a man to have in her life. But you didn’t like it when she critized your choices so perhaps you shouldn’t do the same thing to her you didn’t want done to you.
Another comment of yours that is very telling about your judgement is this statement, “it’s funny how it always comes out of the mouths of women…” I mean..come on. You’re just being massively prejudice and upholding some terrible falsehoods about women.
Perhaps the issue is that women can tell you fundamentally just don’t like them as people. You may be attracted to women, you may love them or want to sleep with them, but you do not have a fundamental respect, true appreciation of or like for women. And it shines through in the way you choose to talk about women here. Women want to be with men that truly like them. It doesn’t matter how many degrees you have or houses or whatever nonsense about money…women want to be with men that truly like them.
Perhaps you hsould take your own advice..stop judging everyone..ontop of blaming women for the outcome of your own life.
Exactly! I’m a 38 year old woman but I don’t want kids never did. When I online dated in my late 20s early 30s the thought of dating a man over 40 was creep city to me no way I would have done it! Most of the ladies I know in that age range now feel the same. Guys sorry but for the most part women that young looking at you are looking for money and such and although all men are different as a woman of 38 I can tell you sexually men over 40 and certainly 45 struggle to keep up with me now I can’t imagine at 30. So while fertility may be an issue for women sexuality because one for men! Women want it more and men can provide it less. I tend to date men who have kids and are not looking for more because I too get a lot of well I want kids you are too old. Hello you are 45 and looking to have a baby? Even though physically it may be possible is it a good idea? I dunno. Men play around a ton in their 30s. If kids are a priority to you men you really need to look for this in your 30s as well.
@alert 1.1.1: LOL. I couldn’t have said it better.
I started dating seriously since age 26 and I’m now 31 and still no luck with love. I’m aware that I’ll probably have better luck with older men but anyone over 49 makes me feel like I’m dating an uncle. I want what I want. So, 29-49 year olds: watch out for me!!!
so I just read that comment about black women. Guess what I am a 34 year old black woman from the Caribbean never had children looking for a man in that age group that doesn’t have children but it seems an exercise in futility.
even the men in their 20’s have at least one chile father (baby mama)
Hi Alanna.
I’m 39. No children. I’m successful and looking. Who knows, there may be a spark even if through a comment 🙂
To be honest, I think you may have waited a little too long to have children. I’m 26 and I view men over 35 as a huge risk factor – autism, schizophrenia, bipolar disorder and severe genetic mutations are common in men over 35. I would recommend that you adopt, for the health of your children, but even then, at 42, you would be 65 by the time your kids graduate from college! I know it’s hard, but I suppose you can adopt children around 7, 8? or Foster?
Yes, I was thinking the same thing, Melanie. This dude is way off base. The liklihood of a child having the problems you mention, particularly bipolar, skyrocket when bio dad is over 40. Funny how how seems to ignore this and just expects the girls to come flocking. As for me, I’m 40 and had a baby with a guy 10 yrs. YOUNGER than me at age 38. Perfectly healthy child, bright, vigorous and healthy. I don’t get why these guys don’t see that women are looking for the same thing: younger. Personally, I do it because younger men like me far more than older. I regularly get hit on by hotties who are many years younger than me but it seems like slimy 50-year-old guys believe I should feel lucky that they’re even talking to me. Delusional jerks!
Im with Topogigio. When I see an older woman with a younger man, my first instinct is to HighFive both of them! Im all about it, thats why I dont know why there is so much hatred for the opposite.
.
I also like the fact that the the woman is someone who I would not date, and the young guy is competition. So Im happy when both are removed from the dating pool.
.
Cougar on……
There are many more illnesses associated with men 40+. Some researchers are recommending men freeze their sperm if they haven’t had children by age 35.
Half of all cases of Down Syndrome are linked to men 40 and over. The first major study of its kind found the reason for the big increase in DS among women 35 and over is partly because they are frequently partnered with men 40 and over.
Topogigio, dating sites are full of women like you who like to brag about younger men wanting them so bad. Clearly, you are insecure with yourself and need reassurance that men still find you attractive. Here (tossing you a biscuit) have a biscuit.
I am not up on all of the other problems and the numbers but as for Autism the increase in likelihood is less than 1% If I recall it is .6% if the father is over 50. AND! AND, it does not seem to factor if the mother is under 35. It is when the father and mother are older and then it was stated less than 1%
I’m 26 and I view men over 35 as a huge risk factor – autism, schizophrenia, bipolar disorder and severe genetic mutations are common in men over 35.
===
There are many more illnesses associated with men 40+. Some researchers are recommending men freeze their sperm if they haven’t had children by age 35.
Half of all cases of Down Syndrome are linked to men 40 and over.
====
Folks, what Lisa and Melanie both overlook is what Lisa uncovered herself:
“women 35 and over”
Lets not magically forget here that most 35+ men aren’t dating/procreating drastically younger women.
Basic genetics (yeah, study up) tells you that the risk is much HIGHER on the woman’s end because she’s got the same eggs she’s had since birth and they don’t get any younger. Men, on the other hand, produce sperm basically for life and the defective sideways swimmers don’t win the races that matter.
I think you really have to look at the percentages/chances of these disorders. My 2 brothers and I were born to a father of older than 37 and a mother older than 39. We are all normal and have university education and professional degrees. None of us have ad any major illness. Im sure glad my mother didnt think like you!
@Norman
You might find this interesting. It is a recent 2012 research study, and this is the final sentence in the very last section titled, “Perspectives and Conclusions.” Note the entire focus is on the paternal risk.
“Unusually, humans represent in many ways the ideal “model” organism to study these ultrarare mutational processes.”
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3276674/
So the truth is, it is more of an excuse than a legitimate reason for anyone, man or woman, to exclude a member of the opposite sex, based on age. Marry somebody because you love them, and only for that reason. Any other reason is not a healthy reason to marry.
I take it your sourcing your information from Wikipedia?
Over 35???
Please…
The only study that I am aware of that mentions these risks is from Iceland where people are very closely genetically related (their family lineage goes back to the Viking era). I have also heard that young people in Iceland use an app to track family lineage, before ‘hooking up’ and dating. So it could you be that younger men are actively avoiding women that they are related to. Having children with someone who is very genetically similar to you increases the risk of birth defects. So I would take these findings with a grain of salt.
Just look for someone cares for you, is open to have kids and is ambitious enough to be able to provide for a child.
Another one of these dopey comments about waiting too long.
Are you advocating rape? Because I keep seeing all these comments about waiting too long, but I thought it took two to tango and I needed a willing partner to have a child. I didn’t know it was as simple as “waiting too long”, and I should just impregnate a woman on the very day I decide to do it. I think in some parts of the 3rd world, they still buy and sell girls like cattle. I’ll look into that.
Is this the new excuse now? That men over 40 have retarded babies?
I think the real retards are the women writing these posts.
PLEASE GOD…let me be a fly on the wall when these younger men leave these women because the women get too old.
“And around and around we go.”
Pregnancy and you blog
How old is too old to have a baby?
By Mary M. Murry, R.N., C.N.M. March 27, 2008
When I had my first child I was 32 years old and considered an “elderly primip.” I felt I was in the prime of life, certainly not elderly.
About 14 percent of births in the United States are to women 35 and older. Now they are considered advanced maternal age. What does that mean exactly?
I thought I would tackle the issues of advanced maternal age in two parts. Today I will talk about conception and early pregnancy. I will cover more of the possible issues of late pregnancy in women over 35 if you are interested. My goal is not to make light of the potential issues but rather put them in perspective.
Women over 35 may take longer to be able to conceive. This is related to those eggs we have had since birth. We don’t make new eggs as men make new sperm. Our eggs are with us almost from conception. They don’t always age well. They can lose quality and there can be fewer of them. This is one reason to seek help from your health care provider if you have been unable to achieve pregnancy after trying for 6 months.
There is an increase in spontaneous miscarriage with an approximate risk of 25 percent in women age 35-39 and 51 percent in women 40-44. If you look at this another way, women 35-39 have a 75 percent chance of not having a miscarriage.
The concern many women over 35 hear about most often is Down Syndrome or other chromosomal abnormalities. At 35 a woman’s risk of any clinically significant chromosome abnormalities is about 1 in 200. Her risk of a baby with Down Syndrome is about 1 in 365. In other words, the odds of having an absolutely normal baby would be about 99.34 percent.
I haven’t answered the question of how old is too old because I don’t think there is one answer. There are so many positive things about having children when we are older and yet the increased risks are real. Learn as much as possible and if and when you get pregnant, rejoice!
With
Mary M. Murry, R.N., C.N.M.
You are assuming thier will be a medical risk. Alot of women can have healthy babies until 50! Its true my relatives did.
What procedures were involved? What cost? The likelihood of a 42-year old woman having a child naturally is about 1.3%.
That is true!!, my syster has naturally my niece with no treatment and nothing whatsoever at 44, my niece is 5 years old now!! happy , healthy.. Things have changed!!. we are not on past 70′ anymore.. now women can have babies with not -special treatment-.. I have a close friend as well, she is 43 had twins 2 years ago. She is now pregnant again!! guess what ? without any treatment…
stop saying that 1% of this is real… now we are a number! we are human as you are. Who has the phone number of this 42 frustraded man.. I am 40, healthy, wanting to have a relationaship, have kids.. etc.. But you excluded us already looking for a young girl.. so seat comfortable and wait!! until I get 41!
You’re right. I was 41.
Anthony- You are a 42 man that wants children. There are also 42 year old women that want children. What do you think of these women? I’m going to guess you think if they wanted children, they should have had them earlier. Well, guess what, IT GOES BOTH WAYS!
You have had decades to have children and decided not to up until this point. Just because you want to have children now doesn’t mean that the universe owes it to you.
Some men seem to think that women have to have children before 30, but men can mess around until they’re well into their 40s and 50s + to have kids. But that is simply not reality. There are many problems associated with men having children over 40 no matter the woman’s age: decreased fertility, significant increases in many diseases/disorders, and the fact that the man may not have the energy/be around long enough to take care of the children.
But here’s the more relevant point to this article: most women under 34 don’t want to have kids with some 42 year-old dude who was so immature and ambivalent about having a wife and children that he put it off forever, when they could be with a guy their own age!!
Unfortunately, this message is a little late for you. But someone should be telling this to younger men in their 20s and 30s: If you seriously want to have children you have to get your “stuff” together, grow up, and start taking it seriously just like women have to.
-An under 34 year-old woman who would never think of dating a 40+ guy.
it has been my experience that most women from there mid twenties on up that are single already have children and I do not believe that I need to bring any more into this world I have no children I can love someone else’s children just as much as my own no matter the age of the woman or the child and there are helping the fax throughout all h is of man and women as far statistics your research goes they say wolves don’t attack people that’s been proven wrong another thing I’ve noticed drop my life and I am 40 + is people in general man and women seem to want what they cannot have and the more they can not have it the more they want it and I believe the gentlemen’s issue in discussion he said she did not want to have kids and I am 44 years old and an extremely good shape I can out work out hike out hunt the majority of men in their 20s I have spent my life building strength they have just begun.
Men 40 and over are at a higher risk for children with several different mental and physical disorders, Many women in their 30s know this and are probably reluctant to date in your age group.
Half of all cases of Down Syndrome are linked to men 40 and over according to the first major study of its kind. (Columbia Univ, 2003).
A study in England found women aged 35 paired with men aged 40 were 50% less likely to conceive compared with women paired with a man 10 years younger. The Avon Longitudinal Study of Parents and Children found men who were ideal physical candidates and had more sex than the average middle aged man were still 35% less fertile by age 40. A study in Hull, England found the average time it takes a 40 year old to get a woman pregnant is 2 years, regardless of the woman’s age. Another study found for men 45 and over, it’s 2 1/2 years.
Even studies on mice and in some fertility clinics found a 40-50% drop in fertility for men aged 40 and increased miscarriage rates.
You know most of those 40+ men are dating 35+ women, right?
That would be the REAL reason that women are having difficulty conceiving. Not the man himself.
Yeah Johnny, Oh course, it’s ALWAYS the woman’s fault, right? It’s not at all conceivable that a man might lose HIS fertility as well as he ages. Pulease. Time catches up with men too, as much as they would like to deny it has any effect on them. You may think you are as attractive to those 25 and 30 year old hotties as their peers but it just ain’t so unless you are extremely good looking or have a big … bank account. For all those average men who waiting too long and now feel entitled to a cute young “breeder,” dream on. There are still plenty of 25 to 35 year old guys out there that are more appealing to those women. Wake up and find someone closer to your OWN age!!!
I want to have family and kids too. I am 31 years now and i tried online dating before and found some guys in their 38-42 who still not looking for serious relationship. And I got confuse….
I find that Asian women are usually looking for sugar daddies.
Hello ladie, I grew up in in UNITED STAE OF AMERICA and i speak two languages including English. I would not date someone whom I do not understand even if she is cute. (I would probably learn her language because there is no working relationship without communication. I am in the same boat as the original writer. I’ll turn 38 this year may. I look a lot younger, I am fit, have a good job. I am not looking for a 25 year old, they are immature, sometimes if I open the door or pull out the chair for them they look surprised, they do not get it. Obviously looking for somebody older, mid 30’s to 45 maybe. I think finding someone close to my years and older than is a realistic goal. However I have zero luck even though I live in San Diego, California where one would think opportunity is everywhere. i tend to agree with some of comments here that said women in their mid 30’s just do not want to date anyone “whose age starts with a 4″. I do not discriminate based on race or having children because I adopt to these . My experience supports this theory too.
Wow, I’m posting for you, Dewi, because others have injected their personal hatreds without really reading what you wrote.
If you read up a little higher, you will see mention of young women not wanting to date older guys who didn’t get their act together sooner. (I might also add: gross to be creeped on by older dudes, but that’s beside the point.) These older guys are still not looking for a serious relationship because they likely never will. It was not in their nature earlier and still won’t be in another 10 or 20 years. Ignore them. Continue looking for the 1 or 2 decent guys near your own age who want what you do, marriage and kids. Don’t stop until you find it!
Sorry to hear that! I feel ya *hugs*
Almost 3 year later and I am still hearing from American Feminist on this issue. The truth is that ship hasn’t sailed, maybe only if you consider woman from Western Society but even then it hasn’t sailed.
Why? With high unemployment since the financial crisis has been locked into normalcy fewer and fewer men have the means to have finance rising a family by typical middle class standards which in Western terms is somewhere around $100,000 a year (2 parents, 2 kids, typical trappings).
Which is why expatriation has become my number #1 priority. Women can go-on assuming I lack tact or some other social skill in order to attach the opposite sex. My skill set is not on trial here. What is; my opinion that older women still have more value than younger women which is a fabrication of Western media.
Western internet dating sites are dominated by women between 34-50 years of age. Around 1/4 of them never been married while the rest are in it for try number #2, after tossing their starter husband to the side.
Go ahead and continue to assume I am social inept or a loser because the reality is, I have removed myself from the US/EU dating market. The only thing I have left to do which I haven’t felt pressured to do is close my various accounts. Actually there’s a reason for this that I won’t get into.
Really? You can’t stand *old Western* women? Thanks for clearing that up, as based on your old posts, I sure was confused. 😏
Anthony is spot on. Nice post, mate.
Anthony, considering your derogatory opinion of women over the age of 34, I don’ think women are going to feel they are missing out on you if you decide to move to another country. Women want to be with men that like them and respect them. I don’t see anything your post that indicates that you actually really like or respect women. Perhaps only when they are 20. But that’s not truly liking or respecting women. And yes, that is your personal issue, not women who are single and over the age you have set in your own head where they lack worth.
And Joseph, why would you support an individual that wants to devalue an entire group of people based any factor related to their skin color, creed or age? To things they don’t actually control? You do understand that devaluing entire groups of people based on race and religion is no different from doing it based on age yes? Since your target of choice is women, why would you support another man in his degradation of women? Do you enjoy degrading women too?
Wow, there’s a lot of clueless older men here that will probably never find love. There’s a lot more to relationships and marriage than just the age of your bride. Things like loyalty, maturity, consideration and compatibility are actually more important to marriage. But if all you care about is how young the woman is, you’re probably never going to get married or have a lasting marriage anyway.
Two of my friends had miscarriages in their mid-20s and another friend gave birth to an autistic baby at 24. Obviously, this is anecdotal, but the point is that percentages and statistics are not absolutes. If you are exclusively looking for a 20-something year old bride, because you think she’ll give you healthy babies, without fail, you might be very disappointed when she doesn’t. You might also be disappointed when she rather go out clubbing than stay home and cook you dinner. Or how she doesn’t want to take you to your colonoscopy. Or how she doesn’t want to take care of you when you get prostate cancer, because she’s still young and wanting to have her fun. But more realistically, she won’t want anything to do with you, because most young women don’t want to date old dudes (over 35).
Dating site users are predominantly male. Women are harassed off those sites, and are capable of dating IRL, so maybe the remaining ones are those that fit into the 35+ category that even older men think are unappealing.
Apps like Tinder are also more attractive for younger men and women. Sites like OKCupid and PoF might attract more older users (men and women) because they require more content for relationships rather than just looking for hook ups. And if people do not have the “youthful look” they might need to rely on something more to get dates.
There is also -no- western fabrication that says older women are more valuable than younger women, it is the opposite. Media often pairs much younger women with older men, which is why so many older men have a problem with younger women not wanting them. They feel they are being denied something they seem to think they are entitled to.
Keep in mind that the population is aging. There are less young people than older people.
Maybe people should try dating people in their own age groups if they are unable to get people younger. And especially have to go to other countries and take advantage of people suffering financial hardships. In many cases those people are used for money, and abandoned when the money is gone. Or after gaining PR or citizenship.
Also, millennials mainly grew up on the internet. The mindset is very different from that of baby boomers. Culture plays a big role in younger people wanting to date within their own generation. If you can’t relate to pop culture, or their snaps and memes, how are you going to communicate? A 30 year old can relate more to a 20 year old than a 40 year old, in many instances. If your teens years (and even early twenties) weren’t spent in chatrooms or texting, then it will be hard for you to relate to those who were. There are always exceptions, but it is worth considering these aspects before being angry at groups of people.
Dating site users are predominantly male? I am not sure that’s true. Can you site where you got that information? I do know dating sites that tend to focus on casual sex and hooking-up do tend to skew male. However, dating sites that focus on partnership and marriage tend to skew more heavily female.
Not all older men think 35+ year old men are unappealing. (I do love though how we love to pretend that 35 year old women are ‘old’ though.) Just the ones that have no yet accumulated the emotional intelligence to relate to women, physically, emotionally and mentally beyond pre-pubescent fantasies.
Look, I’m on the tail end of being a “millennial’ myself and frankly, I’m tired of other millennials acting like we are an island that everyone wants to be on because our generation somehow magically must have invented everything.
And actually, if you review statistics, there is actually less of a cultural gap then previous generations. Older and younger alike are all completely saturated in pop-culture whether we want it or not. Memes and other references are shared cross-generationally. It’s not like when the internet first started to gain speed where young people where using the technology and older people weren’t. Now older and younger all use the same technology and are all exposed to the same content. Older people are on their iphones as much as younger people. They use Facebook, Instagram and Twitter too. Technology is not the playground of the young only. And it’s because of this technology that generations gaps have actually grown smaller.
Of course, I have also heard 25 year olds say that 17 year olds can’t relate to them because how quick technology moves. So maybe both are accurate to say.
Why is it so strange that women 2-5 years older than you would look at your profile? The nerve of those people!
Please read the following article http://nycyclist.kinja.com/men-stop-using-this-excuse-for-why-you-dont-date-wome-1489185452
Links to published journals might be informative
Personally I will go a couple of years older or a couple if years younger and FYI fertility treatment exists and I know at least 10 women from the ages of 36-42 who have just had successfully their first child some with a second on the way…no help needed.
You need to do some research. Yes, there is some risk, but how badly do you want to really fall in love with the future mother of your child(ren)? I am 40 and have known I was clinically infertile since I was 35. I already know what I’m up against – which means I already know I cannot use my own eggs to become pregnant. I am otherwise healthy and although pregnancy and childbirth will carry some risk, the genetic risk factor is out. And yet, I want a man who loves me enough and wants a child badly enough to support me in getting donor eggs or adopting embryos so I may become a mother. I’m 40 – not 50. There is still time with the help of science and good health. You never know until you try to conceive what you may be up against. You or the OP could meet your ideal 32-year-old, fall in love, and find out she will have trouble or need help conceiving. You’re both 42. Stop getting caught up in the fertility factor, as infertility is QUITE common among all ages of men and women. For that matter, how do YOU know you’re swimmers are good and healthy? I would LOVE to start a family with a 42-year-old man. But most I meet have decided to remain childless or decided they’re done with the number they already have. I think it’s far more important to find the woman who views being a parent in the future as important a goal as you do…. THEN worry about HOW you’re going to get there later, if you have to worry about it all.
Correct
On the flip side, I have seen men in their 40s and 50s state they want kids yet they indicate an age range of 35-45 in their search stats for a woman. Unlike you, they must have skipped biology 101. I wouldn’t be looking at your profile btw 😉
That’s only 5 years difference in age. Why did you wait so long….
Quit looking for women online! MEET them in PERSON! Online is a catalog. IN PERSON is more direct and you get to feel the other person. You get to see if you even connect. You want a family? Quit being lazy and get out there! Leave the country too! In addition you better not look like sh*t! At your age you better be looking like those guys on the Fitness magazines. 42 is PRIME age for a man! 🙂
I’m in my twenties, but I think most women would be looking for someone closer to their age, when starting a family. You could become a dad 42, but as the child ages, so will you. When the kid hits 10 you’ll be over 50. Perhaps a woman ten years your junior now, is taking that into consideration. I know I would.
With the advances in medical technology, women over 40 are having healthy pregnancies everyday. So don’t be too quick to dismiss someone in your age range.
Jack: You call your ex an “Animal” for wasting your youthful baby making years. However, you admit that you never had a single conversation about your future family before marrying her. How anyone could get married without having these discussions is beyond me but it was clearly not just her fault if you assumed she wanted what you wanted without asking her opinion. Besides, wasn’t it apparent pretty soon afterward that kids were not going to happen with her? You could have walked out then. Seems disingenuous to blame only her for your situation.
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“MOST OF WHAT YOU HAVE BEEN TOLD ABOUT MALE FERTILITY IS NOT TRUE.
*You have to understand that virtually all research done on female fertility, until recently, does not consider paternal age as a possible influence on a woman’s odds of getting pregnant.
How age impacts male fertility has only really been studied in the past 15 years, SEVERAL STUDIES HAVE FOUND OLDER MEN TYPICALLY TAKE MUCH LONGER TO GET EVEN VERY YOUNG WOMEN PREGNANT. Two large studies found huge declines in male fertility by 40, with a 50% decline for most men. A large study in England, the first of its kind, found at 30 a man contributes 6 mos. usually to the time it takes a woman to get pregnant but by 40 it’s a year and a half. Another study found men 45-50 add two and a half years, on average, to the time to pregnancy. A study of 600 women in their early 20s paired with men in their 40s found they typically took two and a half years to get pregnant. A study of women 35-39 found they were twice as likely to get pregnant if their partner was under 40 vs. 40 and over. Women aged 35 took 5x longer to get pregnant by men aged 45 vs women aged 35 with partners in their twenties. Women in their early 30s are much more likely to get pregnant in a year if their partner is under 35. Infertility rates in men double between 25 and 35.
Some men are significantly more fertile and will beat the odds but at most they are 30% of the population because time to pregnancy numbers are averages. If a 40 or 45 year old is in this category he may instantly get a young woman pregnant, but he is the exception not the rule.
MISCARRIAGE RATES GO UP THE OLDER A WOMAN’S PARTNER IS. She is 3x as likely to have a miscarriage if her partner is 35 VS 25, regardless of her age. At 40, they increase 60% over when a man was in his 20s, even with a woman under 25. At 45, it’s 75% and at 50, the rates increase 90% regardless of his partner’s age. The older her partner is the less likely a woman is to carry a baby to term. None of these studies were done in fertility clinics as was previously reported in The Guardian.
Even studies on mice found a 50% decline by mid-life, human age 40, and a steep decline after and increasing miscarriage rates. Several studies in fertility clinics found the same.
There have also been studies linking the age of a woman’s partner to her odds of having pregnancy complications like hypertension and preeclampsia.”
I read some of comments here and it’s so sad. Are you looking for a person to be with or just to use someone’s body to produce kids for you?
I rejected a few men in my past cause they demanded kids from me and I felt that they didn’t really care about my personality and it didn’t matter for them if it was me or someone else.
I’m 34 and I still don’t want kids so for many men here I’m considered “damaged goods” right? Today I feel like if I’ll be in the right relationship I might consider a kid or 2 if it’s extremely important to my partner and I will see his will to support me during the process. But if someone puts it as the first most important thing I will run away.
And for the age thing, yes I was into older men for many years but lately I see more and more options from younger guys, sometimes with more serious intentions than the ones a bit older than me, who just got divorced many times and want to compensate themselves for all the years they “lost” being monogamous. So yeah if I had to choose between 2 men who are equally interested in me and let’s say one a bit older and one younger I’ll go for the younger. Part of it is that I feel very active and alive and I want someone who is alive also and not to be afraid that in 3-4 years he won’t even want to move his ass from the livingroom couch.
Nadya: You sound like a practical woman who knows what she wants and what she doesn’t.
Just an opinion from a single mother… I’d caution you strongly not to compromise and have kids with a partner unless YOU really want them. I can’t tell you how many women I’ve met who were left with the kids when a marriage fell apart. The guy might say he wants kids, might even mean it, but if you break up where will the children go? You can’t bring children into the world counting on a man to help and support you when they arrive. Maybe he’ll be a stellar dad and all will be well, but you need to be prepared to want them badly enough to raise them by yourself because, statistically, that’s what is likely to happen if your relationship breaks apart.
If you don’t want children at all you’re actually the dream girl for a lot of men in their 40s, if you’re willing to date men that much older than you. They are often divorced, with kids already, so they’d LOVE to find an attractive lady in her 30s who won’t pressure them for more children.
Good luck out there no matter what you decide.
having children with men in their 40’s is risky too. There’s this myth going around that somehow an older woman giving birth is more risky then having an older father with a younger woman. It’s bullshit. The children of older fathers have increased risks of breast cancer for their daughters by 60%, they increase the risk of epilepsy by 30%, they increase the risk of down syndrome by 37%, the risk of childhood leukemia is increased by 14%, the risk of nervous system cancers aka brain tumors is increased by 70%. Older fathers are also thought to increase the risk of autism and schizophrenia.
It’s not a matter of whether it’s more risky (which is true); the fact remains that older men CAN father children well into their 40’s on a regular basis, while women cannot. The “ticking clock” isn’t just a myth.
I’m going to have to disagree with you there Evan. Women can physically conceive and give birth up until menopause, which typically happens in a woman’s 50s and 60s. Women have been discouraged from having children after age 35 due to concerns about downs syndrome and other issues. It hasn’t been that women CAN’T have kids in their 40s (I personally know three), it’s that we have been told we SHOULDN’T. There’s a big difference between the two. Now, men are also being discouraged from having children in their 40s due to exactly the same kinds of health concerns for the child.
actually not so much anymore. There’s this wonderful new technology that can be used to have children past your forties and still have pretty much none of the risk if you can afford it. You can get your eggs frozen at say 33 and then have a very good chance at having a child in your early forties. The cost is less then IVF coming in currently at around 1ok to 15k and around 800 a year to store the eggs. You can increase that age if your willing to hire a surrogate as well. Of course all of these options do require that you have some amount of money. Combine surrogacy with freezing your eggs and the ticking clock goes away. The women that you cater too here are from what I can tell generally wealthy and successful which means they have a good chance at being able to afford it. Personally, I can’t afford it now, but maybe in the next few years. I’d seriously consider it since it would relieve the pressure on finding a guy to have children with in a certain time range or needing to choose to just have the child on my own when I reach a certain age. This then pretty much relieves the time pressure on having kids for me. Instead of a good 8 years I now have something like 13 years. Facebook just started really pushing this for their female employees including paying for it.
I am gob smacked at this stupid email you received from this 42 year old man. So incredibly self centred. What woman in her right mind would want an old man who just wants her because she can breed for him.
He has spent his entire life chasing skirts and has not found anyone worth his love but at 42 he decides that its time to reproduce.??
The women you go out with must get a pretty creepy sleazy feeling hanging out with you as this is the same feeling a man would get when he meets a gold digger.
I would call you a “womb digger”.
I suggest its time to give a good woman your heart and actually want to be in a relationship with someone before you place these LARGE expectations on them.
And this goes to any other man who has waited till he is 40 to settle. Really! Seriously what ever happened to LOVE not Convenience.!!!!!!!
I get everyone wants their freedom and fun when they are young but 40s not young, 30s not young and 25 is pushing it. Young is 18 and under and rest of us should have grown up by now.
Complete, utter nonsense. When did the desire to have children become calling those who want to have children breeders?
I am gobsmacked you would say that, but given the tactics used on the front lines of the gender war, maybe not.
Here’s the deal and I know women HATE this but its the truth.
Women are largely depreciating asset. You are at your highest value under 25, unmarried and no children. You’re lucky that virginity is no longer viewed as it was previous, otherwise that would continue to be apart of the gold standard.
The SAME does not happen to men. But since the late 90’s, there has been this effort to discount men over 40, while simultaneously boosting the value of women over 35-40 which is right at the tail end of woman’s ability to have children without medical intervention.
You would call a man who wants children after 40 a womb digger, its unimaginative and proves that some feminist are in fact misandrist.
Just like I can’t stand extreme feminist like you, I can’t stand MGTOW idiots either.
Memo to men in America. As I have said before and you can listen to the podcast on Freakonomics Radio (Online Dating and Marriage 1/2); economist Paul Oyer said –
Women like men with high paying jobs ($50K +)
Women will date a man who is less good looking but has $$$
Women don’t like low wage earners and unemployed men
All men really want is a nice looking woman, who stays in-shape and grows old gracefully. Stress, smoking, bad eating habits, lack of exercise , drug abuse and drinking speed that all up ladies.
At this point in the financial crisis and deepening gender/culture war, a man’s only choice is to get his passport and jump on a plane to either Eastern Europe, Southeast Asia or Central/Latin America.
I believe your spot on Anthony. Ive been looking for a good women to date and have dated some great women. All younger than me as thats whay ive always done. Women that already have children and dont want more should date men in their 40s they do Want children,such as myself .im 45 and have been looking for Woman to start a family with since I was 38, things just haven’t worked out the way I hoped.
do you know how that sounds: “You are at your highest value under 25” Who cares about the individual right? And then you go on about men being discounted. That’s the problem nowadays. Everyone thinks its all about them. What’s in it for me? No one really cares about anyone anymore. And we wonder why we have so many unhappy relationships. I agree with Carmela, whatever happened to love, not convenience?!!
Also, its only natural that older women would start to gravitate towards younger men if men their age act like they should be put out to pasture once they reach a certain age. But noooo, men are still studs because they can still shoot sperm past a certain age, right? Where this supposed ‘gender war’ is concerned, I think a lot of it is men, SOME men I should say, trying to conserve cave man day values and beliefs about women and women continuously trying to show that yes my baby making abilities and other qualities as a woman are great but I am more than just that.
You shouldn’t call any human being “a depreciating asset”. I can’t understand how dating, love and family become a gender war instead of an extension of our humanity. That being said, media and society is pressuring too much on age, money and beauty and we have forgotten that when you love that doesn’t matter. It seem men and women are just. It seems men and women are looking at dates as if they were part of a contract of need and are not looking at each other and are just interested in taking rather than giving…
I whole heartedly disagree. A man in his 40s is really past the age of reproduction as well. If your trying to start a family in your 40s with hopes of kids you would be a womb digger. Think of it this way if you married someone at 40 had 1-2 years before you had kids. Now you are 42 by time that kid is 18 and out of just high school your 60. What kind of life are you giving that kind? My grandparents are in their 60s and that would be the equivalent of them having me. I am 28 and do have kids. I am married and settled with a college education. No I am not at the hight of my career and no I haven’t traveled but that is what my retirement is for.
I guess what I’m saying is in a lot of ways you have waited to long. Women who are of childbearing age aren’t looking to have that child with someone close to there dad’s age.
(Women 32 and older increased their chances of giving birth to a down syndrome child each year passed this age. In fact it doubles each year past 32. That is another drawback to waiting.)
Most people stay within the 3-6 year either way flux keep that in mind. So if your 40 and looking most women younger than 34 aren’t going to look at you twice. Past that child bearing becomes complicated and dangerous.
So basically, you think a man needs to purchase a woman. To you, women seem to be similar to cattle or sheep. You expect them to have certain traits but do not think they have the right to also expect certain traits. To that end, you deserve what you get. BTW, most men also want a woman who will “provide” – leaving men as contributors in what way, exactly? Your sperm is not a great contribution to society.
Any person who would call another human being a “depreciating asset” is not worth dating. By all means, if a man or woman want to date someone who is younger or older, go for it. But don’t put other people down just to justify your actions.
Hmmm. I think we nailed your problem in meeting women. Your assumption that a woman’s value is her in her fertility is a little like saying a man’s value is his wallet. You don’t take into consideration that a woman is a full human being, not a baby machine. If you really are a decent human being with a great deal to offer as a boyfriend, husband and potential dad, then you need to change your approach. Women like to feel they are valued just like you do and not just for their hot fertile bodies. If you are offending women, they are not going to want to date you.
Loven the butt-hurt. Sorry self-respecting Western women don’t find you attractive. Good luck with your 16 yr old Filipino prostitute. She will no doubt love you for you. jk Sugar Daddy
Anthony,
Maybe Paul Oyer got burned? The other perception is that maybe women want a partner who makes enough money to help her raised their child(ren) as I realized now that I’m ready to start a family. Let’s not forget that smart, strong, successful women also desire smart, strong, successful men who makes big $$$. Let us not get tunnel vision on this matter.
Another point: I once dated a man who was unemployed through no fault of his own despite friends complete and disapproval. He was one of the few men that treated me like gold but you know what? Apparently, he did not feel comfortable dating a woman of a different religion. My point: I’m tired of bitter, disillusioned men calling women a gold digger, lumping/ judging women when there could be a million reasons why the relationship did not work out. Sh*t happens. That’s life. Just keep on swimming and eventually, the right match will come along, maybe when you least expect it.
First off Carmela are you enjoying the boys in high school? I only ask this because most people by the time they reach college figure out that even in your forties you have a long way towards being old. Secondly to that a man has not found anyone worth his love at age 42 because he has been chasing skirts and suddenly wants to have kids. I am in my early forties and I have never been married. I have date women some younger some older. All have been more than worthy of my love, one broke my heart. I realize now it is good we did not stay together. They were good relationships not mere skirt chasing, but I did not love any of them enough to spend the rest of my life with.
By the way, in this world both men and women can be gold diggers. Also, while some men may just want a woman for her womb, some women just want a man for his sperm.
Thank you Mark for reminding me and reassuring me that not all men are as foolish as “Anthony.” I just hope to god that he is in the minority and you are part of the majority. You are spot on that a 42 year-old man that complains he hasn’t found anyone worthy of his love while he was chasing skirts for many years, has no right to think he suddenly deserves to have a younger woman breed his children just because he’s decided that’s what he wants now.
Here’s hoping that you find a lovely 42 year-old woman to have kids with and Anthony gets a vasectomy so he doesn’t breed more fools like himself!
I think you all are giving this guy a hard time. At least he didn’t settle for the wrong woman like a lot of men and women do. I am 45 and divorced. I have two healthy intelligent children and I was 30 when I had my first child. Their father was 39. He was married before and had two children. When we met my first question was do you want more children as I didn’t want him to waste my time since I had been in a previous long term relationship with a man that didn’t want children and tried to talk me into not wanting children. I love kids. I would have had more but I had to talk my now ex husband into our second child. Its never too late and I say don’t give up your dreams of what you want in life. I am single and not online dating but maybe someday hope to find the love of my life and that dream I will never give up.
MaryAnne,
What if you view the end of relationships as 2 people simply growing apart in lieu of “picking the wrong person” or “making a mistake” mentality? I find it helpful to reframe past experiences in a positive light. There’s no point in beating yourself up for something you cannot foresee. Good luck on your search for love! <3
Even though I think your words are harsh, you made a lot of valid points. I am 43 years old, I was married and had my two beautiful daughters at different stages. First one when I was 21, second by the age 26. I was also married for 15 years. Now I am divorced with a 22 year old and a 14 year old. I date women my age not younger. Being a mature man, I want and need a mature woman. Not some young woman who has daddy issues. I for some reason think couples should stick to there same age category within reason. Maybe this may sound wrong to most men reading this post, but I think it is wrong for a 40 plus man to date a woman 10 years younger than him. Maybe because I have daughters, I really do not know why I am that way. If my daughter was 30,and some dude my age was trying to put the moves on her, well I guess I am just different, I would not care what my daughter thought about the older man, cause I’m kicking his ass. So beware of fathers of young woman, and no I am not a UFC buff guy, what I think I can not beat down with my own fists, I would use a bat, If for some reason my bat broke, then my shotgun. Maybe some jail time, but you would be real sorry you did not just stick to your own age group.
I like this guy. Sounds like a sensible, decent, common sense man. I am in my late 20’s and I too agree people should date within their own age bracket. I have no respect f0r men or women for that matter that date way younger then themselves, it’s abnormal and reeks of some kind of underlying emotional issues. I am grossed out when men more then 5 or 10 years older then me hit on me, not because I think there is anything wrong with age, but because I think there is something wrong with someone that age trying to sexually interact with someone my age. I have no respect for a man that would do that. Joe…is a respectable man. I hope when I’m married I have a man like him who loves me at every age and who has actual respect for himself and women.
Shannon– “I like this guy. Sounds like a sensible, decent, common sense man.”
.
In response to Joes comments– ” I am not a UFC buff guy, what I think I can not beat down with my own fists, I would use a bat, If for some reason my bat broke, then my shotgun. Maybe some jail time, but you would be real sorry you did not just stick to your own age group. ”
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…..a sensible, decent, common sense man….
Shannon, I will be interested to see what you think of that in 20 years when you are (likely) divorced and trying to date. It is really not that creepy to date people younger or older. What is creepy is the attitudes people have. I thought younger guys dating older women was so gross when I was in my 20’s but now I see that it isn’t at all. People are attracted to who they are attracted to. What this article is about is not attraction, actually. It is about treating women like breeding cattle who are there primarily to boost a man’s ego (by providing bio kids, looking “right” on his arm, fitting the profile he has invented). When people decide that others are there to fulfill their needs and expectations with no regard for the fact that the other is a person at all, there is a serious problem. Unfortunately, this is all too common across U.S. society.
Hello
Partner is that a threat you just made ?
There are a considerable number of older men who are
experts at playing your game. Don’t get yourself killed trying to
be Super Dad!
Anytime partner ! That’s a quick way to get killed !
Hi Joe, wish my dad would have done that….unfortunately if your daughters think they love the older guy then there is not much you can do as you may loose the daughters. I do wish however, that older men would leave the young ones alone. I was left with an 11 year old daughter. A single mom which I did not want to be. My partner died of course as he was much older then I was and yes I knew I made a terrible mistake and should have been more forward with him and said No, I don’t care what you think of me I do not want to have a relationship with you. I made a terrible mistake and I paid for it. I think women who have relationships with older men lack self-confidence. That was my problem anyway.
Cat, how is it that you made a terrible mistake? You were “left with” a beautiful 11 year old daughter. Do you not even realize how many other women are out here, wishing they had that?
If the only thing that bothers you is that he died early, you need to stop with that because the same could happen with a younger guy, or much more likely is that he leaves you for a younger woman.
Because some of you make an issue of this, I asked myself a hypothetical question. If I had to choose between an older guy who loved me completely, but would die on me, or a guy my age or younger who would leave me for a younger woman, I will take the older guy, who actually loves me, and take him without hesitation.
I have only one child, a 13 year old daughter. When she chooses someone to marry, I’ll support her. Whatever the age. It is her choice and what will make her happy, will make me happy. My father was 20 years older than than my mother. He ended up at the beginning of the war in interment camps, than ended up fighting for a country that was taken over by the Soviet Union, he couldn’t return home because he fought on the wrong side and was considered a traitor. He traveled until he found a place he could make his home and then to find someone to start a family. My brother, sister and I would never be here if my father gave up because he was too old. We love life and we are happy to be on this earth. I too want a family because the woman I married lied is not my fault but now is my problem. I want a family with several children just like the family I grew up in. My father’s died a few years back but I would never give up the great times we had together as a family that loved each other as much as we love life.
Your problem is dealing with life. There is bad with the good and if you commit a crime by hitting some one or committing a more serious injury, you are the one who is ill and should pay the price to justice. God Bless you.
What’s weird is that most men 40+ don’t want more kids. I for one get discouraged at the number of women 38-46 who have never had kids and list in their profiles that they want kids. This email has the potential of stereotyping all 40+ men as “womb diggers,” but the reality is, most do not want kids.
I wonder how many men say they do in their profiles, but really don’t, but they see how many women say they want more kids, so they are afraid to say no. At most, I will say “unsure,” just to open my profile to more women, because I think there may be many who are saying yes, but don’t really want to, or are open to not having them if they find a man that can give them enough love that they don’t feel the need for kids to fill a hole in their lives. The right man will be enough for them.
Rusty – You have stated on this board that you are done having children. For you to put “unsure” in your profile is a bald face lie !
You come to this board to tell us that all American women are b—-es and that you are trying to turn other men against American women as well because we are so awful, and now you come here and admit that you lie about something as important as wanting children in order to get what you want from women.
It is not up to you to decide if a woman really wants children, or if she is trying to “fill a hole in her life” or if you would be enough for her without children. Be honest in your profile, and if some woman who is on the fence about having children sees your profile and thinks that you may be enough for her, then she might respond. Didn’t you say you had a vasectemy because your are done having children ? How do you sleep at night telling such a big whopper of a lie online ? What if you did meet a WONDERFUL woman and she had no children and really desired them ? What if she did fall for you, and then found out that you were lying about being “unsure” ? If you can’t or won’t have them, than you aren’t unsure, the answer is “no” and you led a woman to believe that you were open to the possibility ? I thought you were a religious man. Does your religion teach that it’s OK to lie to women to get what you want ? Or is your view of American women so jaded that you think it’s OK for you to lie to them ?
It’s bad enough that people (men and women) lie about things like age, height, smoking habits etc., but to lie about relationship goals is despicable.
When I see men in my age range who put “unsure” about kids, I pass ’em by, I really do think it is a lie to try and reel in younger women. I thought I was being a cynic with this thinking, thanks for confirming it is a lie.
I also pass men by when they list all relationship goals (sites like POF, let you select one or all relationship goals) Yeah, when I see a guy who says his relationship goal is everything from one night stand to serious long term relationship I don’t respond to that e-mail.
I have gone “off line” for a while anyway. No more boxes to check, no more trying to decipher a 2-D profile. Just trying to meet the 3D audio-visual man in the real world, and get to know someone face to face.
Trying to decipher the lies from the truth is tricky on or offline, but I do think it is easier IRL.
Oh, and don’t bother pointing out to me that women lie to men. I KNOW that, and I think it’s despicable behavior in either gender. 2 wrongs don’t make a right.
I’m not so melodramatic as you Faded Jade. Many online sites don’t allow enough options to describe your views on children. If this site does not allow a man to say that he does not want more kids but is fine with your children, then saying “unsure,” is more than acceptable, so long as when she asks, he tells the truth. I can see why a man would not want to just say “no,” because it can come across as not liking kids, and might scare away the many women who have one or two children that he might be willing to date or marry. If he says “unsure,” and she assumes that he is willing to have more kids, then that is on her. “Unsure” should be a conversation starter. She should not assume that it means he is willing to have children.
What site is this. I would like to see what options it gives for you to describe your thoughts on children, because if the options are so limited that it can give false impressions, then I see his answer as perfect, since it is benign and requires discussion on the topic. Now, had he said “yes,” then that would be inexcusable.
JenLee – Match.com has an option for “Doesn’t want kids, but doesn’t mind if you do” They also have a spot to list, weather or not you have kids, and weather or not they live with you. (and there’s even an option for “they sometime live with me”.
Rusty did not indicate that he says “unsure” to seem open to women who already have kids, but to open his profile to women that he thinks he may be able to convince that his love is enough, and that they don’t need kids to fill a “hole in their lives” It is dishonest to say that you are “unsure” if you want kids, just to try and appeal to women who say they do. (and to justify it by saying that maybe they are saying they want kids but really don’t)
Rusty says he is discouraged at women who are 38-46 who are childless and want children. Those women have precious few years left to “fill that hole” in thier life, and to target the age group with feigned ambivilance towards children, when the REAL answer is a clear cut “NO” (especially if he has had a vasectemy, don’t know for sure if he has, but I think he has stated as such) is unconscionable and I don’t think it is “melodramatic” to say that lying about relationship intentions is dishonest.
I SERIOUSLY doubt that the childless women in their late 30’s are lying about wanting children. If they could go either way, they could list “unsure”.
Also, all OLD sites allow you to write a free form profile, so one could explain that they are done having their own biological children, but would be open to dating a single parent, if that option is not available in the drop down box.
FJ aka SE
Well FJ aka SE, it looks as if you got upset over nothing. I looked at what he said again, and I still was not seeing what you see. So I looked for more of his posts, and used that to do 10 minutes of research. I found his profile. I don’t know if he has more on other sites, but I don’t care to look, because his profile clearly says, No. Not unsure. It’s a nice profile, I must admit.
So I went back and read it again. It seems he is speaking hypothetically what he would do and I feel I understand why after looking on that site. If he wasn’t getting enough attention, he might assume that the match maker wasn’t working because many of the women list unsure. I saw some women in their late 40s also stating yes. Not that’s just crazy. At some point you have to face the facts that it’s over.
Plus, if you read, he was stating clearly that if he were to do that, it would be to get his profile in front of women who “may” be less than truthful…and yeah, we all know every woman is truthful on her profile, right? Shall I roll my eyes now? So it seems clear to me that he was saying that by doing this, he might get matched with these women, and they might see his profile and strike up a conversation. I do not see where he intended to trick women. It seems he was discussing a hypothetical situation. And he was saying that he wondered how many people were not being truthful about that question, and yes, I can see it turning into a vicious circle. Word gets out that some 40’s men are looking to have kids, so women list wanting to have kids, men see this and list they do to, when in reality, many of them may not want that. It appears this is what he was saying. Then through in that if he did that, there might also be some women who are on the fence, not really sure they want kids, but they feel lonely, need someone to love, and like a teenage girl , think popping out a baby is the answer. He was saying that maybe if they have a man who fills her life with love, SHE may decide she doesn’t want kids. Nowhere does he say he intended to trick women. Show me where you see that. Then I will point you back to the word unsure. Any woman who would see that and marry a man without discussing it in depth, and do so early if it is important to her, then she is stupid, and I don’t feel the need to defend stupid. I would make sure the man and myself were clear on our expectations and not just something as important as that. But if I did want something as important as children, I for sure would make the man let me know what he wants. No more sitting on the fence when we start talking a serious relationship. In fact, I am not even going to consider a serious relationship without making sure we are on the same page.
JenLee – I already stated in my first post on this, that I don’t condone lying from either gender. Yes, I know that men and women lie on their dating profiles. I’ve had men put “no way” under smoking, to “open up their profiles” to more women, only to find out that they smoke or are “trying to quit” or “smoke occasionally” both of which are options on match.com. I’ve had men lie about their age. Who knows what other lies I’ve been told, but never discovered due to lack of interest at the first meet.
I don’t condone lying by either gender in online profiles.
Except for the very obvious “fun fictions” my profile is very honest. When I was separated but not legally divorced, I put my status as “separated”. Believe me, many people advised me to put “divorced”, but I kept my status as “separated”. Some people told my I should put “divorced” to “open up my profile” to more men, and that it wasn’t important. I think that’s BS. THE TRUTH is ALWAYS important. My status did not change to “divorced” until I was legally divorced. Once we filed the papers, I kept my status as “separated”, but did mention in my online profile that my D would be final by year end.
But I guess that’s just the way of the world now. Lying about age, place of residence, employment, smoking habits, relationship intentions is the new normal.
You can get off your high horse any time SE. The truth is not always right. There are many instances where it is common to lie. Do these pants make my butt look big? Whether to not you put separated or divorced is your choice but you have zero right to judge anyone. I had a friend who put divorced. Why not? She had been separated for 2 years and had not lived together for 5. Long story but there was a legit reason. She was just a couple of months away from being divorced. As soon as she was able to make contact with men, she would let them know that he divorce was not yet final, but this also allowed her a chance to give an explanation. The reason is simple…when a person sees “separated,” they have no way of knowing that the person is just a month or two from having a finalized divorce. Often, people assume that you are recently separated. Every man she talked to was fine and admitted that they were glad she put divorced because in their mind, she was closer to being divorced than their idea of what separated is. One told her that his biggest worry with separated is that they may get back with their husband, or that their wounds are still too fresh. With her, they realized that was not the case. She could barely even remember what it was like living with her husband.
And again, I do not read that Rusty was intending to defraud those women. Had he said yes, that would be entirely different. All a moot point since the profile of his I found does not say unsure, it says no. You can find it too with simply deductive reasoning. I might make my fake profile I created, into a real profile and send him a message. I did like what he said in his profile. I notice I haven’t seen any new posts by him. I think the ladies here ran him off. I will admit that I did not agree with every last thing he wrote, but I did notice he was never aggressive or personally disrespectful, that I saw. But his posts were quite unpopular with some, and I can see why, but I also can see the difference between him posting unpopular opinions, and the personal attacks often made against him because of his opinions.
Maybe he did not offend me because I never felt he was talking to me, since I do not fall into the group he seems to have a problem with. I hope he doesn’t stay away for too long. But maybe it is better that he does, because of the personal attacks.
The right man will be enough for them? Hahahaha! Look at you, deciding what these women want before even meeting them. Wow, just wow.
Hahaha womb digger! That kills me.
It’s so true though. I am a 30 year old woman and I can tell you from experience… all the men that court me are womb diggers. I would love to meet a guy in his mid to late 30s, get married, maybe have kids, have a house, the whole shebang. But the only men that court me are 40 – 50+ guys who look at me like prize livestock. They think I’m good for breeding!!!! I don’t want to be the host body for some guys dream of being a dad. I already have a daughter, I honestly dont care if I ever have any more children.
But womb digger, omg. I completely relate to that.
Men in their 40’s look at you like prize livestock?
If you are in your thirties, that’s unlikely.
Sweetie, the ONLY reason for a guy to get hitched in this day of family court madness is to HAVE A FAMILY.
You best wake up quick if you haven’t figured that out.
Carmela @ 1.2 said “He has spent his entire life chasing skirts and has not found anyone worth his love but at 42 he decides that its time to reproduce.??”
Actually Carmela – He said he just recently ended a 5 year relationship, because he wanted kids and she didn’t. So that’s at least 1 LTR that he has had. Who knows why he stayed 5 years with someone who had such different life goals. Maybe she waffled in the beginning and said that she might want to have children. Maybe she strung him along for 5 years, with “baby, maybe ” talk. And who knows what his relationship history was prior to that. Maybe he was a “skirt chaser”, maybe he was looking for love, and just never found the one. Maybe a little of both, a “skirt chaser” enjoying sowing his wild oats while looking for love, and now at 42, it still eludes him.
We women get all up in arms, when men write with such contempt about 30 something women longing for a husband and family. And we are rightfully angry when they come to this blog to sneer at the over 30 women looking for love & family. So we really shouldn’t engage in that behavior towards our male counterparts.
@ SparklingEmerald:
SE, you are truly a gem.
I’m in much the same situation as the original poster. I’ve had three LTRs in my life, but in each case, either she didn’t want children, couldn’t have children, or was over and done with the whole thing. So I’ve never been able to have a family, despite, in some cases, nearly heroic efforts to do so. People who immediately jump to the conclusion that someone “waited” are being grossly unfair. In many cases, it’s just bad luck.
My last GF strung me along for 6 years claiming that she wanted kids, but not yet, until finally admitting that she had lied from the beginning. Even after that it took me another 2 years to break up with her, because I really did love her anyway.
Thank you for being fair and not assuming bad intent.
There’s another scenario which is often overlooked. People talk about “waiting too long” to settle down. But sometimes that “waiting” is not by choice.
I remember when I was a teenager, my grampa would take me and my friends to the amusement park & ride the roller coasters, etc. Watching him have fun with us made me not so afraid of getting older. My grandparents had been married for over 30 years at that point. My parents are still married to this day. I often used to wonder what my own marriage would be like.
Unfortunately I was considered a “nerd” in high school. I was kind of an outcast. Generally, girls didn’t want to go out with me. Apparently I was this great guy & all, but they just “didn’t think of me that way.”
No worries. I graduated school, and went on to get a good job with a fortune 500 company. I did stand-up at local comedy clubs. I even earned my pilot’s licence. But I still found it almost impossible to date. One girl actually told me that I’m just too nice. WTF ??
So here I am, about to turn 44 years old, and in my whole life I’ve had sex a TOTAL of four times. I’m not looking for pity, I’m just emphasizing that I’ve wanted a family all my life, but never been given that opportunity.
Am I in a hurry to have kids? You betcha! But the woman who wants to start a family with me would be more than just a “breeding machine.” I would love her with all my heart, and try to be the best father to our children that I can be.
And despite being a little older, I can still show her a good time, and play catch with our son, or have a tea party with our daughter. They deserve that.
Hello
You sound like quite a catch. However. Attraction is not a choice
it’s a REFLEX ! Women are attracted to strong and confident men.
Unfortunately many times this comes along with being an asshole.
There are many PUA sites which will give you tips on what women are attracted to. This is science. In other words there is data to back this up for all the naysayers out there.You might have to go overseas. Eastern Europe, Latin America and the Orient are places
to go.
Finding love outside the United States is mentioned several times in this thread. A coworker of mine from Bulgaria has said that women overseas view marriage/relationships in much the same way American women did back in, let’s say the 1950’s. He attributes this in large part to the feminism movement in this country, and also cultural differences in general.
Thoughts?
@Food4Thought:
My parents were in their late 30’s by the time they married, and didn’t have kinds until their mid-40’s. That was back BEFORE “assisted reproduction” and modern medicine! they’re now in their 90’s and doing great, still on their own.
WIth any luck, you still have 40 to 50 years ahead of you – plenty of time to see your kids grow up.
I agree with you but that is not how our world operates today. People stay in school right up to 25. Get their masters. I work with allot of women who waited till their 30’s to have children. I got to admit a guy waiting till his 40’s and beyond. Give me a break….. You are right when they reach 30 they should start looking and stop playing pickup at the bar…
1)I have friends who when they were 25 or 26 years old had children with down syndrome, autism, physical or mental handicap issues. Just because they are young, it does not guarantee they will have a healthy child. I also know women in their 40s giving birth for the first time to super healthy and smart babies. Yes of course older women have higher risks giving birth to healthy babies. However I have read UK medical research report that the older age of men not women were a huge factor on the increase of autism.
2)this is why online dating sucks!people only select age ranges. when i was 22/23 years old, men in the 50s/60s were contacting me online-gross. now i am alot older and guys 24-28 years old are asking me out not guys my age-go figure.Go out and meet real people face to face. Strike up conversations while waiting in line for starbucks. Check out your local events calendar for your city and meet people-real people. Go to pool parties. Go DJ/art events. Go to food events sponsored by the city. if you can’t strike a conversation with people in public events, then get a dating coach or something! online dating sites can hide the fact if they are really single or is it someone in a bad marriage posing as a single. when you meet people face to face in public, people with good character and who are not judgmental are not going to turn you down b/c you are 42. they probably wouldn’t know your age …..unless you are acting, talking and dressing like a 42 year old. BTW lately the single guys i have met who are in the 40s, they act so OLD which turns women off. so research what men in their 30s are wearing, talking about. ask advice from your single and married women friends on what you can improve- on your online profile , appearance, socially. Guys hate to ask for advice; however they can gain alot by asking women what turns women off about men . Women can also gain from asking men advice. there is alot that women do that turn a man off
I agree. There is solid research that shows that some problems increase exponentially with dad’s age (especially bipolar). Research also says that children of older moms (if they don’t have the dreaded downs or whatever) actually tend to be smarter than kids of younger moms. I’m not putting anyone down here it’s just that I’ve read up on this when I was pregnant. If I had it to do again I would have a child young (with someone else young) because it is easier on your body and gives you more time for enjoyment on the tail end of life. I had a child with a man younger than me – not intentionally, but being in my late thirties it was 20 something guys who wanted to date me! Worked out great, she is smart and has a very young, energetic dad.
Sorry i am 54 and get “grossed out” by women
my age. Most men do. I get hit on by the younger crowd too may times to think about. LOL !
I don’t believe you. What young woman would want to go out with her dad. Another thing you have nothing in common and your not as viral as a younger man. You know, you tire easily. Sorry….but I do understand being attracted to young women..I too am grossed out but only by older men your age…The younger men are much better looking…..
Brandon – Not being attracted to every 54 year old woman you meet is one thing. Never being attracted to women your own age and even getting “grossed out” by them sounds like an issue around your own maturity. It makes absolutely no sense at all why someone’s age alone would make you feel “grossed out” unless you personally struggle with your own age and consider yourself a gross individual. Perhaps that is the case? You feel insecure about your own aging process? I am sure you’ve noticed physical changes in yourself from your 30 year old self.
37 and you wont date a 50 year old – fair enough, but don’t call him ‘your dad”. How many of us had dad’s who were 13 when we were born ?
Well you dont know how old those guys are exactly, do you? 50+ does not neccesarily mean early 50s. And having in mind her age her dad might actually be is his late 50s-early 60s, it is normal that she associates them more with her dad than with her peers.
I am 33 and my father is 56. There were plenty of men in that range messaging me. They are dad aged.
Then do not respond to them and please do not whine about it all the time;
Thanks
Right..Our society has gone mad. I’ve been getting hit on by women 15-20yrs my senior my whole young adult life. I never thought much of dating an older woman, but boy since I hit 30yrs old women seem to make a bigger deal about a guy dating younger women. I like women 5-8yrs younger than I and the biggest opposition I get is from older women that wouldn’t bat an eye at getting with me.
John my mom and dad were both 21 when they had me. I have guys in their 70’s interested in me and I am totally grossed out because they are only a few years younger then my dad and mom.
“” I’m not looking to date my dad. Sorry!””
You shouldn’t look to date your son either Rachelle!
Many 37 years old women refuse to date men only 3-4 years older than them and they go for the much younger ones.
I think women are tired of dealing with a general sense of entitlement a lot of men seem to have about women’s ages. Even to the point that a man wanting to date someone 5 years younger leaves women feeling that the only biggest men appreciate about them is their age. Can you blame women for feeling that way? Take a look how men talk about women here? Women deal with so much external pressure about their age that I think are tired. Perhaps if all this pressure wasn’t placed on women about their age both through society and by men in general, women would be more open to dating older men. But the truth is women are tired of men’s sense of entitlement around their age. Just like men no longer just want to be an extension of their paychecks or job.
I still won’t date a guy over 40 and I’m in my late 30s. This is because I still want to have a family and don’t want someone who is done with that stage of life. Women who are educated and didn’t have kids young don’t want to settle for just anyone.
I want encourage all the guys above the 40’s don’t give up, keep looking and you will find what you seek. And if you can’t find it where you are, don’t be afraid to risk and travel around the world looking for someone to have a family with. There are plenty of Asian women in their 20’s and 30’s that are looking for an older guy to get married and have kids, there are plenty of Latinos women, incredibly hot and mature, that are easy to settle, there are plenty of Eastern European women, Russia, Poland, Bulgaria, Ukraine, just name it few. Just don’t give up your dream choosing a local woman, that will be messed up in her head, while you still have a choice. My great granddad got married at 45 took a 27 year old and had 5 sons with her, so don’t listen the feminist fools that tries to lock you up in a wedding ring, and divorce you with leaving penniless
LMAO. And cue the bitter Red Pill guys who will promptly jump in and advise everyone to give up on the American women who won’t have them (just might be the entitled attitude and blatant disrespect for women). That’s right boys. Just find some poor, economically disadvantaged gold digger from a third world country. Oh, and leave any shred of self respect you have left at the border.
How can you not understand that, if ALL of the multitudes of diverse women in your own country don’t want you, it’s not the women’s fault. There’s something wrong with you.
I’m a 32 year old woman who gets hit on frequently by men over the age of forty who are hoping that I can give them children. No offense to this man, but I agree with the women who say that he waited to long. While there are exceptions, most younger women (most women in general) prefer to be with a man who is within the same age bracket as we are. I know I am one of these women, for several reasons. I’m not opposed to dating an older man however, I prefer to date a man who is the same age as me mainly for commonality. I can’t speak for all women, but it’s important for me to have something in common with the person I’m dating simply because I find it easier to relate to them that way. This is the reason why I want to find someone who is at the same stage of life as me. It’s not that I have anything against the notion of being with a man in his forties, but rather I just find it very hard to relate to them. Additionally, I don’t have any children right now and would like to keep that option open, however I feel like the older men who hit on me just see me as an option to try preserve their family line. While I would like to have a child, I just can’t at the moment. I’ve served in the military for five years, I have very little money and a lousy paying job, I live with my mother and we share a car because I can’t afford my own car, I have significant problems relating to my military service and I’m in school working on a bachelor’s degree. It’s not fair to place an expectation on me to give you a child when I already have so much that I’m dealing with because you waited to long, and with this I’m not trying to be harsh but it really isn’t, and with a lot of these men there is that expectation. Additionally, my own father took off when I was very young and left my mother and I with absolutely nothing. For this reason, I refuse to have a child at this point in my life when I have literally nothing to provide for it. It just seems unfair to have a child in my situation. As much as I would like to have children, if I don’t have one by the time I turn 40, I accept that it’s not meant to happen.
As for this man, I sincerely hope that he’s not throwing away potentially good relationships with nice women over this. Most times when you see a young woman with a man over 40 (I said MOST not ALL. There are exceptions), it is usually because he has a lot of money and not because of romantic chemistry.
With that being said, I personally am not averse to dating an older man provided I like him, we have chemistry and there is no pressure on my part to give him a child.
Oh and for the men who pointed out that childbearing in women over the age of 34 is a risk factor, there are risk factors in children of men over a certain age too. A 2011 article in scientific American concluded that children of fathers aged 50 and older are at a significantly higher risk of psychiatric disorders such as schizophrenia and bipolar disorder so it’s not just women who get to old to have children. In a few years, this man will be a medical risk factor himself.
Men frequently hit on you hoping to have a baby? What do these men say? “Hi, can you give me children and do you come here often?” I’d love to be a fly on the wall for those conversations.
MM,
It’s not so much a “hit on” but more like they are crash interviewing you as a candidate for the Mrs. position. Do you like kids? Do you have any nieces or nephews? Do you want kids of your own?
Very interesting, realistic, and thorough analysis Evan!! I don’t seem to find anything to disagree with your posts anymore :)…
There is a huge opportunity being missed here by the online dating companies. How about one called ‘guess my age’ or “Age Anonymous” where you don’t disclose your age upfront? That should shake some things up!
What huge opportunity? Rewarding women delaying marriage and children looking for Mr. Big (proven by research) or looking for a high risk, high reward projects (Douchebag/Bad Boy/Thug) in their 20’s?
I have wanted to get married since my mid 20’s, but by the time I hit 30, I took it a bit more serious and then economics came into play. At my income level only single mothers and cast-offs are available and it just got worse and worse as I got older.
Is the penalty for not making 50K rescuing women the rest of Male society impregnants and tosses back?
I think not, so my only solution is overseas which I am not shocked Evan didn’t suggest because as well all know America is the best at everything when that statistically can be easily proven to be false.
So you went overseas to buy yourself a woman. That’s a match made in heaven. How long do you think that’s going to last? Make sure you marry her in her country because here, she’s going to take your house and half of everything else you have. Either way you’re going to be alone in the future with your plan.
According to a congressional investigation, much longer than the average marriage between Americans. Since Feminist wanted to IMBRA law, Congress wanted a study of the industry. You’re lucky much of this info is not widely viewed public knowledge as it’s not good for people like you, it destroys all your preconceived notions about American men who marry women from other countries/cultures.
The default culture has not been beneficial to minorities and now it is focusing on men. Because you need men to fight back against an increasingly combative and intrusive Government.
Ultimately as quality of life continues to tumble in the United States, women will increasingly look for the bigger and better deal and calls for polygamy will get louder; further impacting men in the lower ranges of the middle class.
By the way, since when should I or other men be more concerned about foreign women taking everything when American women have made an industry of it in the United States?
I am 50 and I have women in their 20s wanting to date.So all this stuff about women not wanting to date men over 40 don’t know anything about this subject than they do about fornicating.I am constantly approached by beautiful attractive women.They could care less about age.They just want somebody to treat them with respect.
I know a friend of mine who married a South American woman.They have 2kids and are happily married for 20 years.I don’t believe you have the ability to assume some sort of insight into dating women outside the U.S. Do you read Tartot cards!Sounds like you need to put those away.
Actually, Carol.. after reading some of these posts, he has a better chance.
Carol, you made his point for him. Congrats?
Yes that has happened many times here in Canada. Then these men start crying to anybody that listens. I don’t feel sorry for them.
Anthony what part of America do you live???
In Washington DC there are ALOT of single black women with houses and no kids making over $100,000
I live in Los Angeles if you must know. I don’t date Black (American) women, feel free to attack that if you want.
Also why it important to mention how much BW make? Men generally don’t care about what a woman makes and I am one of them.
It doesn’t make them better people either. I can show you plenty of ratchet behavior from so-called “Educated” Black women.
Wow! “Single mothers and Cast offs?” Dude, you sound bitter A.F.
I REALLY don’t think the women are the problem here. You’re completely wrong about us not wanting to date men who make under $50K. Many women, myself included, are more than happy to date a “decent” man who makes less than that. However, it IS true that if you aren’t a “decent” man you probably do need to make more money to overcome your other “shortcomings.” Of course, even in that case, you’d only be getting the dregs, since decent women don’t date men just for their money.
Anthony Thomas,
My superior from my previous job is still with her boyfriend of whom is only working part time. I know for a fact that she makes more than her boyfriend. So, there are wonderful, faithful women out there that don’t mind marrying a man who makes less and doesn’t mind being head of household. I understand your motivation to cast a wider net however beware: some people abroad are only using us to get a visa, gold-digging, and many immigrants over a certain age, tend to struggle to adjust to life abroad what with the language and cultural barriers, not to mention emotional traumas from wars/conflicts/ political instability they endured.
I don’t think it would sell. Most men and women want to be able to filter based on age, each person having their own comfort zone. And yet, some people lie about their age, so you would think that age verification would be demanded. The fact that so many people don’t do it on sites where it’s optional tells me that the number of people who lie is not small. So, my belief is that most people want to weed others out based on age, but don’t want to be judged for their own age.
Exactly. Most people want to screen potential mates out for a myriad of reasons that they’d prefer not to be judged for themselves. The perfect example of this syndrome is every man on any dating site that refuses to date a woman his own age or older, yet expects younger women not to screen HIM out. Hypocrites one and all.
Nah, then guys would just spam you with questions about how old you are. I think listing your age up front is best – it cuts out the guys who will automatically discount you. Saves more time and energy on your part, and you won’t get your hopes up each time you see a new message in your inbox, only to find that it just says, “Hey. What’s your age?”
One solution to this is to list your age younger in the search result section but be sure to put your real age right upfront in your profile so no one can miss it. I did that as an experiment (just to see what would happen) and got nothing but positive responses from it. Again, I was very clear in my profile what my real age was. I ended up getting twice as many messages from men my own age, who didn’t want to admit that they were one of “those” guys who can’t handle a woman their own age. Most men go on pictures anyway but if they screen out anyone under a certain age in their search results, they simply won’t see you at all. Usually, once they see that women over 40 can be pretty, they are happy to date us.
When I was 33 I dated a 40 year old. I had no problem with this whatsoever, but at first it seemed like a bit of a novelty. 40 can seem ‘old’ to those of us who are fresh out of our 20’s. It’s an age we can remember out parents being, so it’s a little odd. However, and this may just be me, but I tend to relate best to men who are *slightly* older than me and, at 37, a 42 year old man is rather desirable. Ideally, I’d like to find a guy who is about 2 years older than me, but I’d rather date up a few years than date someone more than 2 years younger. Again, this is just one woman’s perspective.
In this case, however, I think the failure to find dates may be a function of what this 42 year old is looking for. Unless he and Miss Right find each other, sparks fly, and it’s a very sure thing that happens quickly, the whole settling down and starting a family thing might be tricky. I don’t personally believe that courtships need to last that long, and that if they do last several years there’s something wrong. But you have to find the right person to have this happen, and, as we all know, that gets increasingly difficult with age, self-awareness, and a shrinking pool of date material.
As a professional woman in her mid-30’s I’d like to add that a lot of us don’t want children. I think some of us choose to remain single on a subconscious level to avoid this whole subject. It may seem that a lot of us have biological clocks ticking away (which is an assumption I believe the original poster is making) but I don’t think that is the case, especially amongst career girls like myself.
Then I say enjoy the realization that you’ll be single until its fairly obvious you biologically can’t have children or you better start considering men who married early, had children early but finds himself divorced in his mid to late 30’s.
Anthony, I think you can only speak for yourself. I know for a fact that most very eligible men in their 40s do not want children. Most men in their 40s, especially the most eligible ones, tend to already have children or they do not want children. Think of the life two people past their mid-30s can share when they remove the burden of having kids. And most of our peers have children old enough to leave at home by themselves, or their children have moved out and moved on with their own lives, so they are free to take a cruise to the Bahamas on a whim, or hop on a plane to Europe, or just pop out to a movie and romantic dinner. Why would a woman in her later 30s or early 40s want to give that up to pop a baby out for some egotistical male who thinks the world just has to have his genes passed on into the next generation? I find men who don’t want kids at that age to be far sexier in both mind and spirit.
JennLee is totally right. Most men in their 40s who are dating are divorced, already have kids and do NOT want more. What most of them seem to be looking for is a younger woman who doesn’t want kids. Heather is probably the ideal woman for the vast majority of middle aged men.
No courtship shouldn’t be (that long as you put it) put in today’s society courtship is nonexistent and that’s how you end up with a divorce rate such as we have. My husband and I dated 2 years and it took a year to plan our wedding. So 3 years seems reasonable.
Well now with technology women can freeze thier eggs
and have up to 50yrs old to have kids!!! So you dont
have to rush. I did.
Have you personally done testing to see how long those eggs stay “fresh” for lack of a better term?
Have you done any testing to see if your sperm is of quality?
Touche AllHeart81!
It’s sincerely strange to me how many people *only* focus on women’s fertility . There is wonderful information on Webmd about male fertility. Statistically, infertility issues are caused by women 1/3 of the time. And they are also caused by men 1/3 of time. Yet we still exclusively focus on women. When the children are healthy, everyone acts like it was all because of the Dad. when the children are unhealthy everyone immediately says “Well what factors did the mother contribute!” Even our history in the medical field has contributed to this level of sexism when women were once largely and only blamed for birth defects back in the day. I am not sure of this blog site allows for other links to be posted. All you need to do is google male fertility statistics.
I agree completely AllHeart81! Men need to knock that off. Both men and women have fertility risks as they get older, and honestly those risks aren’t actually very high, so people need to stop making it an issue. Most defects can be detected long before the 3rd trimester, so this is not a huge issue.
To the younger people reading this blog, I would advise to follow Evan’s advice, and make finding a spouse more of a priority in your twenties. I would advise to be serious in your early 20s, so that you may find they right person, and maybe get married in your mind to late twenties, then have children on your early thirties.
To those who are older, stop making an issue of this. The risks are not that big.
Seriously if you think about it…33 and 40 are not that far away.
I do not know why someone who is 30 years old and a bit more believes that she is still a youngster !
I remember in the 90s when “age was but a number”.
Those were the days.
You mean ‘age was but a number’ when women where picking men but not when men were picking women. Doesn’t feel so good to be on the other side of that does it.
Thats bullshit. 33 is not close to 40. Can you do math?
There are plenty of women online in their late 30’s who already have kids and don’t want more or maybe would like to have MORE kids that will date men in their early 40’s but of course those 40 something guys have to be “hotter”,”richer”,better job etc than their 30 something counterpart.Does that mean I think a 34 yr.old with no kids that wants some will date a 43 yr.old that wants some? No,they won’t most of the time.But a 37 or 38 woman with a guy 42 or 43 isn’t out of the question or unrealistic.
When I was 32, I met and started dating a girl who was 4 years older than me. We started out as friends and it lasted like that for almost 2 years. Things then got serious. We became intimate and very close, lived together, vacationed together, we were all but married on paper. I started asking her about getting married, she kept putting it off. When I turned 36, she made a big party and announced in front of family and friends, she accepted my proposal and we will marry.
I was overjoyed! After the party ended, I said lets get married with a quick wedding and lets get pregnant because we have no time to waste, she knew I wanted a family, 2+ kids. She said she loved me but that she was 4 years older that kids was not a good idea to her. I felt trapped and used. Everything was great and just what I thought a marriage could be, sure we had our arguments and disagreements but we always were able to come to an understanding, a mutual compromise, and making up was always the best.
This cut me down. I said no children, no marriage. We separated. It took several years to regroup then I met my ex, she was my age and wanted a family too. I said great. We dated for a year and a half, married and our child was born 9 months later.
And then, everything shut down. Separate bedrooms, no more anything together. She knew her ability to conceive was coming to an end. Money and her job was her priority and our child was just for show just like her car and our house.
I am looking for an honest woman to start a family. I have never hidden that fact. I dated an older woman, didn’t work out because she did not want children. Married a woman my age, who couldn’t care less about family but had to show how perfect she is from child to job and everything in between. So now, I will try dating a woman who knows from the start that I want a family of 2+ children and that our relationship is based on love and trust.
I am a 38 year old woman, the challenge is that most men in their 40’s act and seem old. They do not keep up with current events, music or fashion (think goatees and mom jeans). They often seem very very stuck in their ways. So as an attractive 38 year old, I am able to attract young men, and prefer their vibrancy. The older men who do keep up and are a tiny bit metrosexual probably have a easier time of it. Maybe you can do a little to be more attractive to the women you are looking at…. I really want to date men my own age…..
Michelle, you hit the nail on the head! i’ll be 40 in about 10 more months. I’ve done everything your supposed to do to die before age 30 and some how I’ve survived. I continue to LIVE my life. and I can attract younger women… BUT I’d also really like to date women my own age… Same problem though, they’ve either given up on themselves completely and or they are so jaded and sore its just one huge emotional mistrustful minefield. I do my best as far as “fashion” goes… However there will NEVER be a pair of Skinny jeans in my closet, Cuz as far as I’m concerned that whole “Metro” thing is just another word for Bi-curious LOL!!!
Another victim beaten down by feminism, what on earth is so important about marrying a woman the same age as you? So you can both quote meaningless popular culture references? To both listen to some 80’s big hair metal band? In most cases a woman 4-5, even 10 years younger will still know some of these things. The importance people put on non-important stuff is shocking to me. Men the clock is on your side and if you’re not finding reasonable options in America, there’s always overseas.
Hi Anthony, your problem is your hate for women. You have been hurt very bad in the past and shot down and you clearly show that. May God be with you and help you find love in your heart and happiness. I feel for you. I really do.
By the way, the clock is not on your side. All of us get old and unattractive. We all die. Men get impotent at 40 plus years and have to get on viagra. That should tell you something. For some reason, you think women are supposed to serve you. Maybe if you work on your attitude, you will be able to find a nice woman in America. You have been rejected for a reason. Think about it.
Anthony, I think you’re just bitter about something….
Classic feminist tactic… the ad hominem attack. You say something they don’t like, so there must be something wrong with you.
I agree that the real issue here is your bitterness Anthony. Some counseling never hurt anyone. We all get hurt, we all get broken, but you need to fix that before you move forward. Good luck.
To Jessica ~ I just stumbled across this lengthy list of postings to Adam’s letter, and have to say you seem to be closest to Anthony’s issue at it’s core. But here may be a shocker to many of you: A lot of us “Baby Boomers” (men and women) have taken pretty good care of ourselves. I for one have never even tried Viagra or other ED enhancers, and with a vibrant, caring woman I’m as viral as I ever was. To all of you with age issues, we may look like your fathers, but we are so much more…with caring, sensitive and even vibrancy someone discounted above. I’m not looking for a girl in her 30’s, but I’m still a guy at heart…and can outwork, outplay, out-earn and (surprisingly?) out-love most of them. Sorry I won’t have the chance to meet or enjoy your company. When you hit the 50’s you’ll see what I mean…
I see a lot of bitterness on this blog. I see it from women and men…not just from Anthony. But, when one of us ladies express anger, bitterness, or frustration, we don’t jump on them and say, “see, you are just bitter, and that’s why you are being rejected by men.”
I would prefer to see people stop all this blame game stuff. Both men and women can create babies into their 40s and beyond. The question is, should they, and my answer to that is no for both of them. But hey, do what you want. To the men acting like all a woman is good for is bearing children, you are ignorant and I find you repugnant. Thankfully, I have never met men like you in real life. You are the same as women who think men are only good for one thing…providing them with material things or money.
And ladies, you can stop making an issue of viagra. Maybe you have never been with a guy who used it. I have. At first I was put off by the thought of it because I did not understand it. But I was with a guy I found very attractive ad he was respectful enough to be honest about it. So I wanted to give him a chance. He excused himself to take his pill, and then we sat and watched a movie for a little while and talked. I thought the pill would just make him get hard…which was what turned me off. I wanted to know that it was me. Well we were cuddling and just talking as the movie played and I was waiting for him to get hard. I asked if the pill was not working and explained that I thought it would have made him get hard by now. He just smiled warmly and said that the pill doesn’t make him get hard, it just restores the ability to do so. He said that I am what would make him hard, not the pill. I assure you that my attitude shifted, and i shifted into high gear at that point, becoming much more passionate, and my reward was one of the best nights of sex ever. So it seems modern medicine makes having to chase young brats obsolete if what you are after is good sex.
I also find plenty of 40+ men who like to go out and do things. I’m not a club person though. I agree that most 40+ men don’t like to go to clubs to dance, but neither do I. I prefer better things to do. I got over the club scene a long time ago. Oh, I should correct that. I do know some older guys who like to go dancing at the clubs, but I prefer other activities.
As for couch potatoes, I did date one once, and he is no longer a couch potato. I think marriage does that to a lot of guys. They no longer have the money to do many of these things so the get out of the habit. I would call this guy up and tell him that I was coming by to pick him up and tell him how he should get dressed. After several times of doing this, he started calling me and telling me what to wear, and he picked me up. He just needed somebody to rejuvenate his attitude and I knew that. The only problem is, when he became active again, he lost the desire for a long term relationship. He was afraid of falling back into that rut.
But I find plenty of men over 40 who are not couch potatoes. I feel that some women are simply making excuses to justify their lack of desire to date older men. I looked through some profiles recently for both men and women. I notice a lot of women putting their age ranges lopsided in favor of younger men. What are they thinking? Men are even more averse to marrying older than women are. So if you won’t date a man who is 10 years older, don’t you think that men 10 years younger might feel that way about you? Sorry, but I feel much better in a relationship knowing that a man cherishes me, and I know I am not likely too get that from a significantly younger man. I know have learned through experience that while you still have to be choosy, you will feel much more cherished by a slightly older man. I don’t want way older, but slightly older, in my opinion is better.
@Don Kirscher
“To all of you with age issues, we may look like your fathers, “
You hit the nail on the head. I don’t have the desire to sleep with men who look like my father. If that’s an age issue, then I’ve got an age issue. I am 33 and never had trouble attracting men in their 30s. I ended up with a man who is 39, I guess there are plenty of men and women who are in the same age range who find one another. Despite what many of the older men who comment here want to believe, we aren’t all desperate enough to end up with men 20-25 years older than us.
You hit the nail on the head. Let em eat cake! I’m 35yrs old & I’ve recently given up on our women. Feminism has ruined this country. I’ve been looking since about 25yrs old. They’re either very dominant and controlling, still trying to sew their oats, unfaithful, burdened down with children from previous marriages or relationships, or they are sweethearts with great potential as wives; however are usually surrounded by very the negative types I just mentioned that want the more desirable girls just as corrupt and miserable like them. I’ve come to the conclusion that the pickings are jist too slim in America. I’m dating abroad now and am in a great relationship with an educated, beautiful and childless 23yr old woman abroad.
Anthony,you are talking nonsense. Why does it bother you so much that a man wants a woman his age? You seem stuck with an idea of a woman as some depreciating asset. Many posts of yours that I saw until now have this “lets look for young women overseas” line. Guess what – I live in one of the countries of Eastern Europe and none of the single women I know dream about older men from USA coming to save us from spinsterhood. Thank God, good old feminism got here sooner than you! Get a reality check, man – the cold hard truth is that you’d prefer buying yourself a woman from some disadvantaged country than actually invest in your looks and do lots of inner work to eliminate the deep seated hate you have for women.
Don: You say, “We may look like your fathers, but we are so much more…with caring, sensitive and even vibrancy”
Well, the same thing can be said about older women, but you don’t see a lot of men rushing out to date above (or most times even IN) their own age range. What’s good for the goose… Don’t you realize that women don’t want to date someone who looks like their fathers any more than you want to date someone who looks like your mother?
The solution for all people (men AND women) is to imagine what you want in a mate, how you’d like to be treated, and understand that (with few exceptions) the opposite sex feels exactly the same way you do. We all want to be valued for more than superficial things but we all also want someone we find attractive. If you aren’t particularly young or fit or wealthy why do you think someone else should settle for what you won’t tolerate yourself? So many people clearly feel entitled to qualities they can’t deliver themselves.
Dating younger men is sooo much better. I am 41yrs
and my boyfriend is 28yrs. I want kids.
You probably have already seen that ship sail.
oh my nasty
Hey Johnny, when I was growing up there were women who were having children in their 50’s. We called them the menopause babies. My great aunt Claire had a child late in life, a surprise shall we say. Her daughter was younger then her grandchildren. She was my dad’s cousin and I was older then her as well. So the chances of a 41 year old woman having a baby is good. It might take a little longer to get pregnant but it can happen.
Yes I agree men age after 40! Im 41 and still shop at Forever 21
21 to 30 yr old men hit on me all the time. I have no c
problem. The doctors also say im as fertile as a 21yr old
and were amazed at my health results.
tracy thas all fine and good for now but what are you going to do when you wake up 50 and the guy you were with is now with someone his own age? Don’t you women get it ie; Demi Moore……
Women should be able to date younger men without any social stigma. I am 44 years old and look like I am in my early 30s. I exercise regularly, watch what I eat, take care of my skin, and have a great wardrobe. I have a very good job and financially independent. I don’t have kids nor do I want any. I have no problem dating a younger guy or a guy my age; it is wise to be open-minded otherwise you are limiting yourself. I do think that younger men take better care of themselves, overall. Someone mentioned being scared of seeing a 50+ year-old-woman’s body, but it is way scarier to see a naked man in his 50s, especially someone who has let himself go.
DJ, you said “I have no problem dating a younger guy or a guy my age; it is wise to be open-minded otherwise you are limiting yourself.” I’ll just leave that right there, so you can see if you can find your blind spot.
Also, you say that you do think that younger guys take better care of themselves. Well the truth is that they do not. In all age groups you have those who do and those who do not. There’s no shortage of younger guys who are killing their brain cells as fast as they can, with all manner of drugs, chemicals, and alcohol. There is no shortage of younger guys who are fat, out of shape, couch potatoes, video game addicts, etc…
And please enlighten us as to why a 50 year old man’s body is scarier than a 50 year old woman’s body. Maybe because we aren’t actually judging another woman’s body as a possible candidate as a sex partner?
If he takes reasonably good care of himself, I think a 50 year old man can be very sexy.
Um, yeah. That same logic applies to older men chasing younger women.
Tracy that’s terrific
You can’t be serious!
You are 38 probably 39 by now and you dare to call a 40 years old man (just one or two years older than you) an “old man”??!
You are not that serious.
You make a good point about 40 something men being out of it. Another poster said something to the effect of they all list their hobbies as only grilling and sports. but remember a huge percent of men in this age bracket are divorcees with kids. They’ve been all about family for the last decade. They’ve let their hobbies and interests lapse because they’ve spent every free moment of the last 10-15 years shuttling junior and juniorette to endless practices, games, recitals, and play dates. And if they weren’t doing that they were working like dogs to pay for it all. Give them Just a little break.
Bruce – I think that’s great advice. Especially for men who have been busy raising families. A family man can have great qualities. But perhaps men could do the same for us ladies and not always be looking to date someone necessarily their juniors – such as the man who wrote to Evan wondering why younger women were not interested in him.
I’m surprised women aged 37 – 42 aren’t interested interested in men in their early 40’s. Is this really a trend? I don’t consider 5 yrs either way an age difference anyway so I don’t get it.
This older men preferring younger women thing though, doesn’t seem to have any end to it. Lately, an 89 yr. old man has developed a crush on me. Not only do I not want to date someone my Dad’s age, I definetly don’t want to date someone 20 years older than my Dad!
I get the idea “find the people who want you” , but hey! there’s a limit ya know. 🙂
I like your “Guess my age ” suggestion Carol. I think it would shake up some people’s perceptions of older/younger. I also think it could be a bit of an eye opener to those who believe they look much younger than they are. You don’t look 10 years younger than your age to someone who actually IS 10 years younger than you are. Trust me.
I’d say the reason they aren’t interested in these guys is because a lot of them – if not most – tend to have an entitled attitude similar to the subject of this article. They also tend to expect a woman to be in great shape, attractive, etc., but rarely do that themselves (even though they seem to think they look great for some bizarre reason). The other reason I can think of is that they often cannot get over past relationships and bring them up constantly – either they are not over their bitter divorce or there is a “one that got away” that they can’t get over. I know this all because I was single up until my late 30’s, then had a baby with a younger man. It is really usually not FUN to date a man in that age bracket. Most people who are single want to meet someone they can have fun and enjoyable times with.
Yes I definitely agree. Men take heartbreak worse than women.
Dating over 36 yr old men, actually over 30 and the fun declines
drastically!
How ignorant can you be “fun Factor”Maybe
You are no fun.what an idiotic statement.Grow up.Fun factor huh?Well I am a pilot ,motorcyclist.Scuba diver,Golfer,actor.How shallow you are to make a comment like that.Maybe you can try to compete but I doubt you could keep up..Oh and I am physically fit.I guess you have to be to sail a yacht,
Nope…..you are absolutely wrong. Again, you people keep lumping all people of an age into one group and assume they act the same. And yes, I know I look good, and it is not for some bizarre reason. Why is there so much hatred of people older than 25 on this site? You do realize that everybody gets older, right? If you live long enough, you will be 80 one day. At 80, i might just start getting some grey hair. Lol.
Maybe it’s just you and what you attract.
It’s funny to me. Tracy is saying the exact same thing guys say about dating younger women – the only difference is the female perspective – and so many guys are quick to jump on her for it. “Maybe that’s just what you’re attracting” “Idiotic” “Wrong, shallow” etc. She could be all of these things, but you would never throw that vitriol at a man who only dates significantly younger. If fact, you’d probably be supportive of his choice, and say how your own dating experience with women over 35 (or 30, or even 25 in some cases) reflects his observations.
As Evan stated many times and as commenters have pointed out, maybe people with bad relationship histories should reflect on how they got there rather than blaming their poor choices on men/women of certain ages. It sounds like Tracy isn’t looking for anything serious anyway, which is fine, so I would take her comments (and the comments of any 40+ guy trying to date 15+ years younger, for the same reason) with a grain of salt.
I agree with you Lana. However, just like I think a man saying any woman over 30, the fun declines drastically, is an idiot, I think the same of women who would say that of men. It’s also just plain not true. My experience has been that age has no bearing on how fun a person is to be around, and that goes for both women and men, friends or boyfriends. I know both men and women who are in their twenties who are about as dynamic as a wet firecracker. I know men and women over 50 whom I can’t keep up with. I know an 80 year old white man who still does roofing, and many younger guys can’t keep up with him. He reminds me of that guy who at 79 was still barefoot water-skiing. I think his name was Banana George. Even at 79, he could barefoot water ski, holding the tow line in his teeth while holding bananas in his hands. Would I want to date him? No, he is way too old for me. However, if I were over 65, I would probably think he’s the cat’s meow. But, I can also admit that even at his age, he was likely a lot more fun to be around than many guys a fraction of his age.
This also allows me to see that many men my age and older are a lot of fun to be around, and date. I look at the man, not his age so much.
That said, because I am not interested in just casual sex and casual relationships, I am not very attracted to much younger men. I refuse to live in fantasy land where you can ignore the true intentions of the vast majority of them.
I have dated a couple of women who can’t
Get past their past relationship.They dwell on
It talk about so wise up!
I am 41yrs old when I met my boyfriend who is younger
than me(he is 28yrs old). He never asked my age because he thought I was younger than him! People
are always shocked at my real age.
Why doesn’t anyone bash you over this , if you were a man 41 years old and you had a 28 years old girlfriend everyone would be shocked by it writing comments about you “exploiting” the “poor little girl”.
No?
Same here…..was refused entry into a club when I was 30 because the bouncer thought no way in hell I could be over 21…even with a valid ID with hologram.
I agree but these kind of people are the ones who are shaping relationships today and this is why relationships have been destroyed.
No…..I actually do look younger. I am 43 and I look younger than most 30 year olds. Trust me….many objective opinions on this. And I have more fun too.
I like Carol’s post! That would indeed be interesting! I’m on match and almost always completely ignore the info at the top of the profile. Age, height, have kids/want kids, body type, ethnicity etc.
I just read what people write about themselves and it’s only from reading the chat on Evan’s blog that I’ve come to realise that this isn’t normal! I have regularly dated guys and found myself asking after 5/6 weeks, “how old are you”?, “younger, older than me!?” I don’t take it in, I just go by whether their physical appearance suggests they’re young or old to the extent that it makes me feel uncomfortable.
I don’t get people that have strict age limits; for me ten years older is fine and re younger, so long as they’re out of their teens and seem it, I’m open minded! But then I’m in my twenties; who knows how I’ll feel in 20 years time!?
@sophie:
Sophie, I’ve found that most people tend to get pickier as they get older. Which is completely counter-intuitive, since, for most, their options decrease with age.
Thank you for not being so close-minded. You’re a catch.
I will marry any woman who we together love and trust each other. What is part of that relationship is that the compromise is that we try to have at least 2 children. If we can’t conceive that’s OK but don’t tell me you can and want to when you can’t or don’t want to.
Hey Adam, sad to say…you’ve had your chance to meet women who are in child bearing age and can have your children when you were in your 20s and early 30s. How come you wanna have kids only in your late 30s?
And frankly, nowadays women are leading a more active lifestyle than men in general. Older men (among even my early 30s guy friends), they tend to wanna be couch potatoes and home-bound. Whereas women still in their 30s wanna go out, do stuff, etc are even financially independent to continue to do so without tying herself down to be a child-bearing machine. So, a guy who is 40-ish…I’d be wondering what he can offer.
Shay, what’s you’re problem, men can have children at any age, unlike women, who’s eggs start to lower in numbers with each year after about 25. So maybe you should have had children in your early 20’s.
But couples are having their children in their late 30’s and early to mid 40’s.
My cusin just had his first child at 37, and his girlfriend is about 13-15 years old.
I find this to be the case where I live in new york.
The women here, love and are having children by men 8-15 years older than they are.
And men and woman who are in relationships together are also having their children in their early to mid 40’s.
So to the op, I wouldn’t listen to the arrogant 30 something women here, because they don’t count at the real women out side in the real world, that is why they are on online dating sites, most of them are lying about their age in their profiles anyways, and they wear heavy makeup to cover up their age when you see them in person.
So stay off the online dating sites, theirs nothing there but liars and snobby woman who are not confident enough for the most part to get a man on their own in the real world.
I’m sorry, I meant to say, my cusins babies mother is 13-15 years younger than my cusin.
Ummm dark, obviously not a dr. Men and women start to lose their fertility at about 25. By about 33 men are also starting to lose the rigidity of their erections. Men age. It is possible for a man tofather a child at 370, but not ve. Men age. Further, women arent stuck up just bc they arent into you. The 1st rule of having the maturity to date is you have to be able to handle rejection like an adult.
I had my first & only child at age 34 (almost 35). Conceived him the FIRST time we had sex without birth control. (a very planned conception) I did not use ovulation predictors or any sort of fertility aid, except to make a point of having even more sex around the time of my cycle that I guessed I would be most fertile. My grandmother started having children in her late 30’s. She had 4 babies, and one miscarriage, starting in her late 30’s. So if this is “losing fertility”, I guess that means in our early 20’s we could have conceived without actually having sex.
About men losing the rigidity in their erections by the age of 33.. no way. I can’t speak for other men, only myself. I can assure you that my sex drive and the rigidity of my erection hasn’t dropped much since I was 18, and now I’m 45.
I’m fit, I’m sharper than I’ve ever been in my life (and less stupid), and I have women on my mind as much as I did when I was 18. I’m adventuresome and have not become set in my ways, and never will.
I’m also an unwavering, passionate romantic, and I’m resolutely monogamous. I love seeing great long-term relationships, although truly great ones are truly uncommon.
Please read all of my points here, before forming an angry opinion.
Here’s the reality of it– and I know that I’m speaking for a lot of men. There are two things that will crank my sex drive way up… one of them is a woman I love very much, and the other is a woman I am very physically attracted to– and whether I like it or not, she has to be fit and young enough to be of reproductive age. I’m stuck with that reality.
Biologically, this is the basic mechanism of physical attraction, and much of it is undeniably visual for most men, and that means young women. It’s rarely spoken about, but these are nature’s drives that go back long before we were cave people, and that’s why there are 7 billion people on this planet. Beyond physical attraction which is subconsciously tied to reproductive drives, there can be love that goes much deeper.
Many men can physically and biologically father children right up into their 60s or 70s. That’s a fact. Sperm-quality may drop, but it doesn’t nose-dive at the age of 40 like egg-quality does; the decline is very gradual.
These men are not dirty old men just because they find young women hot. Why should that change just because they get older? It doesn’t, so get over it! Many men are biologically wired that way, and no complaining or debating will change that.
There are other psychological factors that will lower any man’s sex drive, and lower the rigidity of his erection. Things such as internal distractions, personal and life stresses, pressure, and lack of attraction to the woman. Age has less to do with it, except that some people become more stressed and pressured at certain periods in their life, often middle-age, whether you’re a man or a woman.
As far as good-quality long-term relationships go, there are three important things that have nothing whatsoever to do with age. It’s about love, attraction, and above all the quality of their personal connection. This includes interests & passions & personality connection… and a shared sense of humour also adds a lot.
In the long term, the quality of their personal connection is probably the most important, because it will add fuel to the first two. Of all the marriages that I have seen fail, it is the lack of deep personal connection that mostly causes failure years later.
About the deep personal connection, young men and young women usually miss out when choosing their partners, because the other two factors blind them initially. It can often take a few years of being together before the depth of that is known. Hasty marriages add to the high divorce rate.
People fall in “love”, and are attracted to each other… and often this lasts only a few years. But a very strong personal connection will go a long, long way. Unfortunately, from the hundreds of relationships I have seen, such great connections are simply rare. This is partly because people get tied up in relationships, long before they ever know what they might really want out of life.
LOL! If a guy loses his woodie, odds are he has circulatory issues that go beyond a blue pill.
Your ad hominem wasn’t surprising, since you really can’t back your made up numbers.
Mark, the “biology” argument has totally lost traction among biologists, behaviorists and the medical community. But, hey, if we’re going that route, you have to admit that the females would have similar biological imperatives, i.e., the “Alpha Male” argument. So, if men can’t move past the paleolithic, maybe we women are also simply “biologically” attracted to strong, attractive, muscular men who look like Daniel Craig and are fabulous providers. If you’re not on par with that, well then, I just you’ll just have to accept reality and deal with being passed over for men who are. Does that sound reasonable to you? Me neither. It doesn’t work any better when the script is flipped. The truth is that we are no longer cavemen and we have made a civilization that rises above that kind of nonsense. We also no longer accept that clubbing each other over the heads is acceptable behavior. People can and have advanced culturally. In fact, a recent study shows that not even chimps actually prefer “alpha” males, preferring the nice beta guys instead. Let’s be honest here for just one moment. Sure, there are some folks who are exceptions to this, but the vast majority of people who prefer to date younger than their own age group do it for strictly superficial, shallow reasons and then try to make up excuses as to why it’s not shallow and superficial. It is. If that’s all you aspire to and you can actually find someone who’s willing to accommodate your desires, go for it. For me though, even if a guy DOES look like Daniel Craig, it’s not enough by itself. He’d have to have more to offer than six pack abs. Sadly, for a lot of folks the “pretty” alone is enough.
I love how ALL the guys posting here rigorously defend their attraction to women extremely younger than themselves by using the tired old “biologically wired” line. Has it ever occurred to any of you that there is a gigantic media influence at work here, which has wired your brains your entire lives? Television, movies, magazines, pornography, etc., they all SCREAM at you that only young, fit girls and women are worthy of being sexually desired. You have been brainwashed your entire lives into believing that the only woman worth desiring is a young one. There are sexy, vibrant, beautiful women to be found at all stages of life. I often wonder what would happen if the media began to put the focus on finding women of all ages sexy and desirable. Wouldn’t that be something to see gorgeous 48 year old women being celebrated as much as a 23 year old girl?
I do find a woman who is 48, 49 or 50 attractive and sexy, my ex is, many of my friends are. The problem is, I want to have a family. If we can get pregnant and have a family, than lets do it.
I don’t want to just have sex, which I think is great, I want a family with children. I have many an opportunity to have all the sex I want. I only just want to make love to my wife because I love her and want to have a family just like my parents did. I have a great brother and a fantastic sister. We are very close and all are married (except for me, the divorce and hopefully soon the annulment so I can start with a clean slate) and our spouses and children are truly wonderful.
“Go out” is codeword for “alcoholic” or someone with a drug problem. My last 2 girlfriends were coke heads. . . both graduated from top 10 schools and worked in big law, both late 30’s.
No thank you, Ms. girl who wants to go out. I will be more than happy sitting at home where I cant get disbarred, and you cant pawn my watch you took off the dresser.
You dated lawyers? never mind that law is a profession with laughably low satisfaction numbers, but you dated women who argued for a living?
Sigh.
Wow.
this helps confirm what I have suspected all along about certain men avoiding me because of my profession.
Never mind that I am extremely satisfied with my law career, and work 8:30 to 5:30 with ample vacation time off and great benefits. I am paid well and have plenty of time to pursue hobbies and vacation with friends and family. I have run into certain men who are prejudiced against female lawyers. Never mind the fact that many of my female colleagues at my office are in long term happy marriages, some with kids.
But if this is what these guys think, well, glad to hear it up front.
Not all men have a problem with a woman’s profession. It can make it a little harder to find a good man, though. Here’s the good news. You are a lawyer who undoubtedly makes a decent living. This frees you to find a good guy who will appreciate you. Don’t look for the usual suspects. Maybe he will be the guy who fixes your AC, or a UPS driver who delivers to your office, from time to time. Or Maybe a carpenter who is working on a house next door.
Josie, I’m a lawyer too and I noticed many people (not just men) tend to act on presumptions about lawyers as people, forgetting that law is what we *do* and after the office door is closed, we are perfectly capable to live your human lives. I can’t be bothered about it less, as those who like me or love me (including men) don’t really care if I get paid for arguing, sowing or painting. However Johnny might be on something here – I know very few couples where both spouses are lawyers. I guess its cause when the disagreements appear, they are impossible to solve due to new arguments presented by each party, lol
I have to disagree here. I don’t think it’s just bad luck. As a 29 year old woman, most of my friends who have done online dating have stated on their profile that they’d be willing to date a guy up to 10 years older than them. I’d venture to say that most women who are at the settling down phase would be willing to go at least 7-8 years above. And I haven’t seen any profile of a woman who isn’t willing to go 3-5 years older than her. So if you’re asking women out who are 3-5 years younger than you (37-39), these are supposed to be the women who are most desperate to find a man because their biological clock is ticking the loudest. They should be overjoyed that a man not old enough to be their father is contacting them and at least send back an e-mail, even if the whole process doesn’t get to the dating phase.
So if this is not happening, your profile or approach must need serious work. Go through the archives or Evan’s various articles he’s written on the ‘net. Or you can buy his program. Or get an honest friend to look over your profile and critique it. But you’d better do something because if you want your own biological children, time’s ticking for you too.
Sort of… Women like me contrary to popular thought about men and online dating. I get emails from butt-hurt women who say I should accept them if they have children already and they aren’t too old to have more kids at 36-37. While its likely she can have more children because she’s had one already, I would like to enjoy 1-3 years of a childless sex life. That email came from a German lady by the way not an American. I got another email from a Polish woman who thought she was too fat when I said in my profile a woman shall not weight more than me (175lbs) because like Mark T, I am 43 in excellent shape, still run fast (sub 12 second 100 meters), can still dunk a basketball and the majority of people I hang with are 20’s and 30’s themselves.
One additional thing I’ll say and this is thorny but I don’t care; whenever we (as a group) talk about dating in America and its problems we’re talking about White People. This is the downfall of a country that claims its proudly multi-cultural but in practice fails miserably. I’ve gotten more attention from White women in Europe than in America and that is TELLING. The majority of White women that stare at my profiles and sometimes message me are over 40 and beyond the age of having children when I clearly have stated I want children in my profile.
I suggest women look at Amy Webb’s TED Talk about her difficulties.
Here’s the deal though, overseas there’s very little market for American women, but there’s a huge market for American men. If you can’t find what you’re looking for here, jump on a plane. My friend Law was 38 and jones’in to get married and have children. He jumped on a plane, went to Ukraine, found his wife (she found him…), in less than a year he filed for a K1, it was approved, he went back to pick her up (they talked via Skype during that time), that was the first him her met her parents… His wife Alyona is now 30 (she was 28 when they married) been married 3 years and have two kids. So men instead of whining about American women not accepting you and Evan telling you its basically unfair but that’s life. That’s not true, you have options, use them.
@Anthony Thomas- Anthony I’m interest in finding out more about your friend who went outside the US to find his soulmate? If you wouldn’t mind posting some more information on how I might learn more, I would sincerely appreciate it! Now here are my feelings on the subject. I truly believe that a lot of, if not all of courtship has to do with timing. The fact of the matter is that there are and always be mitigating factors when it comes to meeting the right person. I have found that a majority of women online in their profiles place a huge emphasis on financial specifics as to what their expectations are for the man they are seeking. Ironicly at the same time they don’t even or are not willing to state their own financial position. Why is this? It seems to be okay or expected of a man to be financially stable and take care of a woman, but at the same time a man immediately is a deadbeat if he has any expectations of having a woman take care of him? I suppose that is why I see a lot more men going to other countries to find a companion. It seems at least to me a different kind of cultural experience exists in countries where people are just simply seeking a better more fullfiling life. Afterall I dont think anyone is us would be surprised that a majority of people outside of the US are far worse off than we are. Don’t hate on me just because I am sharing my opinion here because truthfully it is and has been my observations over time. While some people may frown upon the overseas bride thing, at least she doesn’t need a hard and fast financial number in order to determine a man’s financial stability and success.
Ukraine is a cesspool. The girls there would marry a homeless American man over a Ukranian man, truth. So your friend got lucky – yay? LOL. I still say its sad that he had to go and find a bride elsewhere. Shows he cant conform to his own society. Why not a Ukranian girl raised right but still American? Hmmm. Its cause its easier to control the chick when she doesnt speak your language. 😉
Im foreign born, from a land near Ukraine. Im fairly exotically beautiful, Im told. I have men fall at my feet at the grocery store asking me to put diamonds on my hand, especially Muslim men. However. Every single man I know would NEVER go back to the “motherland” to buy a bride. Only mama’s boys with issues and insecurities have to spend $ to go back home to coerce a woman into marrying him. Most men with confidence can bloom wherever they are planted. 😉
Who’s talking about homeless men? My friends got lucky? Try multiplying that out into the mid five digit zone.
A friend of mine who is successful producer of commercial ads in his city both TV and Radio went back to his home country (Russia) to find a bride after he caught his American born wife with his best friend!
Those aren’t isolated incidents either.
Another friend and co-worker of mine who met his now ex-wife in drug rehab also caught her red handed banging his best friend.
Two years ago he married a woman from the Philippines as he found himself in a similar situation to the original poster.
I can continue to give you examples of American men who are not among the 5-6% of men between 18-35 that the majority of American women want.
All of them successfully went to other countries and found wives that love them and produced children, some of them before the internet was widely used as tool to find single women.
Sorry but like I said contrary to popular opinion with people that read my comments on here, women like me. My issue is that they are too old to have children now and I am not too old to have kids, that’s just White folk the buy into the overpopulation myth.
If I am broke by American standards, like most Black men in America we don’t NEED money to get women, duh. We have other assets that women like if they aren’t beholden to racist beliefs and pseudosciences around race.
You are correct that men of action can “bloom” wherever they are. I find the economic system quite problematic; I assume the reason you came to the US in the first place is for economic opportunities that are not possible in your home country. I am quite familiar with Eastern Europe. If you say Ukraine is a cess pool that might make you Russian because those are the only people that talk negatively about Ukrainians. Or you’re a Western European who has negative views of not just Eastern Europeans, but also Africans and Arabs in countries like Germany.
But my post have never been about me. It was directed at the person mention in the article but it seems everybody wants to get personal when I point out that women in America ARE NOT THE CAT’s MEOW and that other possibilities exist.
You can put whatever Feminist, Right Wing, Free Market nonsense spin you want on it. But dating is one of the only true free markets in the world. From Prostitution to Marriage (some would say they are closer than most people think) men are free to choose who they want, women have less practice at that art and you see the results.
Shows he cant conform to his own society.
===
This isn’t always a bad thing.
Ukraine might be a cesspool, but their women sure aren’t. As for the USA, cesspool on both counts.
You are so right i was about to say that there are women outside US and other countries that the disgusting liberalism and feminism haven’t destroyed people’s natural relationships.
Let those liberal feminist shallow and superficial women believing that they are so worthy and unique.
Every human being on the face of the planet is worthy of love.
And we are all unique individuals.
And feminism is pretty awesome because all feminism is the realization that women are equal to men.
Anthony, I can also tell you about more than one American man like you who choses to blame his failures and shortcomings on others (in this case, all American women), who went overseas to find a poor, dependent bride, got married and ended up in the same place — cheated on, trapped by kids, and broke after she cleaned him out and returned to her home country with a small fortune. (Dead giveaway is when you’re dating or just married and her family members back home start suddenly dying in large numbers and she wants you to give her money to send home “for the funerals.”)
What men like you will never understand or acknowledge is that when your intentions are shallow or dishonorable, you will attract and find yourself with similarly shallow and dishonorable women — regardless of their nationality.
Trust me — my work takes me to many countries and I have lived for extended periods of time overseas. I know there are gold digging women in EVERY country and they know who to find easy targets — bitter, shallow, insecure American men looking to fulfill a deluded fantasy and willing to shell out what cash they have to soothe their egos– and they know how to play you like a violin.
Do I know men who married non-American woman who are wonderful women and they are happy? Yes of course and many of them.
But the difference is the latter are decent men not consumed by hatred for American women, and need to prove they are men by finding women they can walk all over.
Again, you attract what you put out there — whether you are in Tennesee, Thailand or anywhere in between.
Me again.
Anthony says: I can continue to give you examples of American men who are not among the 5-6% of men between 18-35 that the majority of American women want.
Are you seriously suggesting that only 5-6% of the male population is desired by and has a chance with American women? What I find so ironic about men like you is that you make these ridiculous claims about American women only wanting a small sliver of so-called alpha men (despite all evidence to the contrary that the vast majority of American men successfully date and marry if they want to) but then out of the other side of your mouth you spew a list of criteria that women you want must have (youth — as you’ve stated ad nausuem here, extraordinary beauty, etc.) that only a small sliver of American women posses. Hypocrisy at its finest.
The reality is not that American women only want 5-6% of American men. The reality is that you want the 5-6% of American women that don’t want you. Women above a certain age, women who have average or below average looks but who have integrity and might be a compatiable partner are not good enough for men like you.
Anthony says: If I am broke by American standards, like most Black men in America we don’t NEED money to get women, duh. We have other assets that women like if they aren’t beholden to racist beliefs and pseudosciences around race.
That seems to contradict what you’ve previously said — that American women don’t want you and your friends because you aren’t the 5-6% and that’s why you go overseas. Putting that aside for a second, I may be wrong — I can likely guess what those “assets” you are referring to are — but what I see you saying here in that you are willing to indulge in a racist stereotype about black men to attract white women but then you get upset when some white women don’t want to date you for reasons having to do with race? Huh?
Bottom line, Anthony: your problem isn’t racism, sexism, classism or feminism. Your problem is that end of the day you don’t really like women. You may want women for selfish reasons (status, sex, etc.) but you don’t like them. And that’s what makes women pass on you. Because as strange as it sounds — women as a whole aren’t really interested in spending time with men who dislike them. Imagine that!!
Lizard size doesn’t make up for a lack of money.
my problem is most think I am in the 18-21 age group and I am actually 34 and men in their 50’s are trying to date me. I would love a 38 or 39 year old.
My thought is that it depends on whether the woman in her 30’s has been in long term relationships, or any relationships actually, or has been more of an “always single” girl. If she spent most of her 20’s and early 30’s “single” then I think there is even more resistance to finding a man in their 40’s that she sees as immediately settle down with, have a kid or two, and be an “older” couple. She might still want to catch up a little on the “fun” “couple” life all her friends got to have – that YOUTHFUL couple life of vacations, concerts, sporting events that she spent a lifetime of doing single and wants to catch up on some of those milestone moments with a guy in his 30’s who still seems to live that lifestyle before wanting to “settle down.” A woman who got to experience many of those things as couple, just with the wrong person in the long run, but had fun and enjoyed them at the time, is probably more willing and into settling down and craving more wanting to get married and start a family and a home life.
Mara- you are so right in your saying. iam 33 and have spent all my life being single. i tried to have relationship with few but they all turned out to be jerks and so the things could nt get worked out. but yes the way you have explained the feelings or aspirations of a lady in her early thirty are so so right…pleased to know that there are people out there who totally understand what a single lady in her early thirty wants to see in her husband:)
you are spot on!
Yes, I was single for most of my 20s, dated a complete jerk till I was 30, and have actively dated since. I am not in a serious LTR at 33 with a man who is 39. When we recently discussed our timeline for having kids, I told him 35 or 36 because I want us to still have fun times together, just the two of us. He agreed with this. I want to be married and have a child but I still want to enjoy getting to know him before we are strapped down with a child who takes up most of our time. Women in their early-mid 30s still have this opportunity.
This is the problem with online dating. In person you can see and judge how “young ” or “old” someone may be. But on online you just have age cut offs. In person, I am often approached by men 10 -15 years my junior. Online alot less so. When I was in my late 20’s and early 30’s and someone asked if I wanted to date a 42 year old, I would have said eweeeeeeee no way!!!!
When you are young you picture yourself dating someone within 5 years of your age . As you get older the range increases.
I wonder if it’s possible that Adam has never married. I know this is often perceived as a red flag for a 42 year-old guy. It sounds like his initial email and his profile may need revising. Maybe he talks about wanting to start a family in his profile. Many sites encourage you to say what you’re searching for, and while some women in their mid-30’s might have their initial interest peaked by what he has to offer, they’re not sure where they stand on such an issue and so they pass. It’s kind of like the woman who mentions her desire to have children too soon for a guy’s liking and he scatters off.
He is now living in a world “as it is” vs how he perceived it to be when he exited his LTR. Many women of today are interested in dating and claim they want to find a good guy, but in reality, eh … not so much. They are as he has described: successful, career-oriented, independent, active, financially strong, self-empowered, and loving life. They also do not always want children. And some women are choosing to have children, but not in the traditional way.
@Diana:
That was a very thoughtful reply. Thank you.
I’ve noticed that times have changed. Far more women these days just don’t want children. It’s become very stylish to be “child-free”, as they call it. For those of us who have never had a chance to have a family, this is a very disappointing turn of events.
Not “stylish”, Traveller. Lots of us women have grown up while watching our mothers spend 20+ years raising kids, day and night, always putting others before them- which was very sweet of them- but also seen our dads NOT doing this- leaving us kids or just spending their days as they wished(formally a father, but not putting in that many hours neither in child upbringing nor housekeeping), coming home expecting the moms to do everything. Lots of us observed and concluded we’d rather spend our days as we wish…
🙂
Stylish? No, rather adopting the approach many men have. Not all men have that attitude and those who doesn’t will become great fathers- and great husbands 🙂
I would date a successful man that didn’t have children, but I cannot have children. So I would not be someone he would want, I am also not healthy enough to care for an adopted child, so we would have to hire help.
But as in dating guys in their 40’s .. some have so much, when I read “my 6 year old is my life”, I go to the next one because I think, well then you don’t need a woman then do you?
Other than that, I don’t care what age I find. I want to know what’s inside the mind heart & soul.
BTW thank you for the stuff about the young guys… have had them honking at my car, flooding any dating sight, etc etc. I need not another 2 year relationship.
I agree with Diana (#13). Women being scared off by men who disclose their agenda too soon.
In fact, if Adam really disclose that he wants to start a family, the woman he showed interest in might think that he is not really interested in her as a person, merely a convieniant child bearing machine. Then any woman would fit the bill, right?
Buddy, you are just doing something wrong. If you’re good-looking and have a job you should not be having any trouble getting a woman. But maybe you aren’t good-looking or employed in the way that women like. If so you gotta move down the food chain. Like go after the ones that make a lot less than you do or the ones that don’t have minicures or something.
Boy you stepped in it didn’t you…
Define “Moving Down Market” because its more about economics than animal instincts is correct, I wouldn’t use food chain.
Now I suppose you’ll say something along these lines –
At 42, moving down market would mean accepting a woman in her 30’s with pre-teen children without any chance of having your own children. I know for many men this is a non-starter, including myself (43).
Women like money (mostly women in Western Culture) and that is problematic. My ex made more and she paid the rent, there was never any money issues in our relationship and I never felt emasculated. But she was a downmarket woman, from Prescott, Az and overweight. In other words she wasn’t going to be like the good-looking people they find for Match.com adverts. Those women would never accept such an arrangement and would continue looking for Mr. Big. The guy that could give them the lifestyle she’s always wanted even if she decided to be a stay-at home mothers with the future children. This is an unrealistic goal normally, but for women over 30 to believe its possible watch too much TV. Under normal circumstances, women would find a way to finish their education or start their careers while finding a husband, this means getting the job done in your mid 20’s. But that’s not happening, women are allowed to have extended adolescence and waiting until they are economically independent before trying to settle down. Women are playing with fire, economics and biology all at the same time and the results are quite messy.
I am not sure what income bracket he’s in, but historically for me it been about 30-35K so moving down market, means chicken heads, single mothers with multiple children, overweight women (like my ex) and mousey women.
Even good-looking, unemployed women still want Mr. Big. Other women down market also have a high opinion of themselves even if society doesn’t, think Porn Stars and I live in the San Fernando Valley, so dating them when you catch them at strip clubs or local watering holes is a total possibility.
Women often complain of douchebag behavior and older men not having much self-respect. That really isn’t it, the douchebag behavior goes without saying, but older dudes with pot bellies and only strong enough to lift a beer can up to their soup coolers is a common occurrence, especially online.
I am broke by US standards so I am on the sidelines looking to get called off the bench. Problem is only D-League women want me, no thanks, I am taking my show on the road and so should the OP, dating AW at his age is a losing proposition.
At first I thought what a DH but now you are making me laugh!,,
ANYWAY everyone shut up who cares… theres a lot more going on in life than this nonsense lol.. Be happy with who you are, try to get some great sex or affection if you can, and be happy and kind…..I’m 40 and loveeee younger men. I missed the child thing but that’s ok, I love my life! esp when I’m helping others..
be kind..
Broke by US Standards. Yep. There ya go. And why you wont find a woman. Youre outing yourself as broke on a dating advice blog – god help the women you actually ask out on a DATE. I bet you never shut up about your $ issues and past emotional issues, is my guess.
ont hate AMERICAN women, then. Hate ALL women. ALL women want an ambitious and hard working and SUCCESSFUL man. Ha!
If a man cant make it in the Land of Opportunity then I worry for you. My parents came here with NOTHING. A man in America not living up to his potential is one of the saddest sights to see. 😉
Don’t let the door hit you on the way out 🙂
Spoken like a typical patriotic, jingoistic American.
Americans have always had a problem with African-Americans, why should I stay?
Having traveled to many countries, I can say that being Black is a negative mostly in America but no where else.
Except for all the European countries where racists slurs are routine from the soccer crowds.
Blacks often go out of their way to be different. Any black who decides to just assimilate into America, runs the risk if being labeled a sellout, or Uncle Tom. No other race does this. No other race goes out of their way to have their own language, and anti-establishment persona. Even if you aren’t like that, will your child identify more with that crowd in school, and end up with that mentality in the end? You can’t blame women who have other options for not going that route.
Many Asians come here with nothing, and ask for nothing, and in the end, build something for themselves.
Like it or not, black men have earned a reputation as a group, that is not attractive to most women. I have no problem with the skin color of black men, but I do have a problem with black culture. I’ll leave at that.
JennLee: Are you kidding??? African Americans are the only race that “…goes out of their way to have their own language, and anti-establishment persona???” LMAO! Puleese. Insecure Xenophobes in ALL demographics use race as a means of feeling superior to others, as you’ve just demonstrated. I don’t know or care what race you are. The fact that you just made such an irrational, blanket statement about the entirety of another race pretty much reveals all anyone needs to know about your emotional intelligence.
Anthony your posts have alot of really vile bitter and
odd words. You sound very bitter. This is why you are having such a hard time finding women. Very bitter
This is a standard reply from a so-called Feminist. You cannot confirm any bitterness, it’s just words no proof.
Carry on
Only Evan I don’t go to Soccer matches in Europe and may I remind you that there is constant fighting between hooligans from Germany and Poland that are based on angst from World War II?!
This happens at regional soccer matches. As far as other bits of racism in Europe, during the European championships to qualify for the World Cup in Ukraine, some Ukrainians barked racial slurs at some of the African players.
This has nothing to do with me and I have spent some time in Ukraine.
Pot meet kettle.
Tracy, you have made numerous posts today and none of them would even remotely be classified as peace making or nurturing. They have been bitter, ageist, inflammatory and filled with hatred towards men, especially men over 40.
I have several online dating accounts and as a mid-30s man, I have seen multiple posts talking about how bad 40+ men are. So even though I will not date 40+ women, I decided to see for myself all of these raving beauties over 40. I have news for you. The vast majority of women over 40 are not beauty queens by any stretch of the imagination. Frankly, I can see why the 40+ men choose to try for under 40 women. I also chose to peruse the 40+ men to see what was on offer for the ladies. I have news for you. Far more of the 40+ ladies were fat than the 40+ men.
I think you ladies need to stop with the propaganda that the choices of men out there are so poor, but then you seem to think that the women are worthy? Use some logic for a moment. You women are here for a reason…because those upper top 10 to 20% of worthy guys haven’t found you worthy. In short, you aren’t in the top 10 to 20% either. So we see it written here many times that the guys you are interested in aren’t interested in you but the guys who are interested in you, you aren’t interested in them. So you aren’t interested in your peers.
You can claim that you are oh so perfect looking, and claim that all those young hot studs are so into you. I have news for you…I know the young hot studs that chase older women. Come talk to us when one actually marries you. Oh, so you say that you’ve had many proposals? So we can expect an invitation to the wedding next month? Oh, wait…no wedding? If a younger guy marries you, will he wake up ten years from now and realize that you are way older than him, and start chasing younger women? When you hit 50, will he want to trade up?
You think we men never talk? Of course we do. You women don’t need a safe place, you need a wake-up call. You really want to know what goes through our minds when we see a woman who is hot for her age? If she is late 30s and up, younger men see that and think only of the here and now. We realize that you are hot but also realize that the clock is ticking and that you won’t be for long. So we think in terms of short relationships with older women. When it ends, you think it just didn’t work out and so you try again. You don’t know that we knew it was never going to go anywhere. I would have never told you this 10 years ago when I was hittin it and quittin it with 30 something women. Oh, I can assure you most thought it was going to be a real relationship. No, it never was.
So save us the propaganda about how great 40+ women are and how awful 40+ men are. It’s a tired and worn out fairytale. You cried about Anthony stereotyping all black women, so how about you stop stereotyping 40+ men. I’ll be 40 in a half dozen years, and I’m in great shape. That isn’t going to change in just 6 years. I hope I’m married by the time I get there because if I’m not, I think I’ll just resolve to remain single after seeing the attitudes of women here. You all are hugely flawed but think you are all Cinderella’s who deserve somePrince Charming and the Baker and the Cobbler can go pound sand. Well wake up…Prince Charming has rejected you. You aren’t Cinderella. By the nastiness I see, it’s more like the evil step-sisters.
@Paula,
If I had a dollar for every woman who put “my children are my life” in their profile I’d be richer than Bill Gates….lol
Just like the women with 4 kids who sometimes write…”I have time for relationship” I just laugh and say sure you do…..next!
These days we constantly hear that age is nothing but a number.
50 is the new 40, 40 is the new 30, and even black is the new white! LOL!
The truth is age does matter! (especially in the long run).
Personally when I was in my 20s I dated women who were 12 years older than me. When I was in my late 30s/early 40s I lived with a woman that was 15 years older than me. All of these women were very attractive for their age but in the long run is where the problem comes in for most people. When you’re 60 and your mate is 40 there are going to be some major differences between you. Energy is one of them along with thoughts of retirement…etc
Having said all of the above there are still lots of old guys dating women in their 20s and 30s while they are 50 and older. However most of thoes women are not just looking for an old man who is “financially secure”. He has to be rich, powerful, or famous. Trust me that is the only reason why someone like Hugh Hefner (almost 80) has a long line of 20 something year old beautiful girls waiting to jump in bed with him.
If you want a girl who is a “gold digger” or looking for a “meal ticket” they are out there but most of them will not be highly educated nor have career interests of their own.
If the age of a woman is real important to you then you would be better off thinking in international terms… (women from Latin America, Europe, Middle East, South America, and Asia). Women from these cultures are beautiful and raised to view age differently than in America. They are much more open to marrying older successful men. You might want to google some international dating websites. Keep in mind there are over 6 Billion people on this planet of ours. There is nothing that says your wife/soul-mate can’t be waiting for you on some tropical island.
Just as business has to think globally to thrive you too should think globally when it comes to finding the woman of your dreams. Thank God for the internet and airplanes! LOL!
Yes there are exceptions in America but you have to look at the odds. I’m certain if you were to sift through every dumpster in New York City you are bound to find a diamond ring or something of value in at least one of them but why would you choose to go down that road just so you could have something locally.
We place value on youth in our culture. Everyone here is trying to look younger than they are, dress younger than they are, keeping track of music and new Hollywood stars. The “Baby Boomers” coined the phrase, “Don’t trust no one over 30!” Today these are the same people who refuse to get “old”. They are standing in line for plastic surgeries, popping Viagra like vitamins, constantly trying to shape up or trin down…etc
In America a man in his 20s and 30s with a good sex drive is seen as sexy. A man in his 40s, 50s, and beyond is considered a “dirty old man” for having the same desires. The thought of older people wanting sex is a turn off until we ourselves fall into that age group. LOL!
Great Post – Dead-On!
Adam, look internationally and you will find someone who fits your profile. There are plenty of women who would love to be with a successful older (but not-so-old) man, especially one who wants a family. In the age group you are looking, I know for a fact there are thousands of young ladies in Central and South America, Southeast Asia and former Soviet countries that would love to meet you and develop a relationship.
I know this because I have spent close to ten years as an expatriate, visited 56 countries, and lived long-term in six of those countries. As “dashing-one” mentioned above, only in America do we negatively view older males who want to start a family later in life.
If your financial position allows you, travel and live abroad for a year or two. It’s will be a great experience and you will more than likely find your life partner. I do not recommend the mail order bride racket or the 90 day trial (fiance visa). Go and live abroad, relationships take time.
B
I think Dashing One and B are both correct. I’m 38, divorced, father of an amazing little boy. I’ve lived abroad, in Central America and the Caribbean, and let me tell you something: the majority of women down there actually dig guys who are older than they are. They’re into stability, and I’m not talking about money, I’m talking about maturity. You don’t need to be rich, famous, powerful, etc. As long as you have a good head on your shoulders and are a decent guy, you’ll find more than a few beautiful ladies that are interested.
Like Dashing One said: “In America a man in his 20s and 30s with a good sex drive is seen as sexy. A man in his 40s, 50s, and beyond is considered a “dirty old man” for having the same desires. ”
You might want to consider their advice and look beyond what this country has to offer… just saying
It’s not about age as a number so much as it is about life stage discrepancies. Every five years or so, priorities tend to change. I found, while dating again in my early 40s and wanting to date men my age, that they “all” wanted younger women because oops! They forgot to have kids. The men who were interested in me, at 42, were in their late 20s to late 30s and did NOT want kids (neither do I), who were relieved to find a woman who wasn’t all over them to get married and start a family right away, the way the women in their mid-30s tended to be. I was divorced ten years and didn’t care if I ever got married again, and that was like catnip to the younger guys I met who were ambivalent about having kids (almost all of them, frankly). Also, the older men (50+) dug me, because to them I was a “younger woman” who didn’t have any baggage or expectations when it came to wanting kids or more kids. I wound up with a guy eleven years my junior; and while there are a few life stage issues now in terms of where we are in our respective careers, we are wildly happy together because we both eschewed having kids and don’t feel the least bit selfish or regretful about the choices we made.
@BeenThruTheWars:
You are absolutely correct. It has nothing to do with age; it’s all about being in the same stage of life. Of course, practically speaking, people in the same age bracket often are in a similar stage of life.
It’s just tough for those of us who didn’t move through things at the same rate as most.
@Dashing One:
Great … good to know that there are foreigners out there to take away EVERY job from Americans! 😉
I really don’t see why someone who was 35+ wouldn’t want to date someone who is 42. Man or woman. But, if that’s really the case, then I guess men are now geting a little of their own medicine. I can’t say I have too much sympthy since most men usually don’t really care how this issue affected women.
I did enjoy the post by Dashing One that said that women in other countries are raised to view age differently. The irony in it is he seems to only care about how older men are viewed, not older women. He’s more upset about how older men past 40 are viewed , not women past 40.
It’s not that having a sex drive past 40 is bad. It’s when men want to play around and not grow up until they are 40 and then expect that they deserve a younger woman after they had their play time.
Although, the man that wrote the letter did say he was in a relationship for 5 years. So in that case, it wasn’t that he was playing around.
Im in my early thirties and their is no way I would date a man in his 40s. I was talking with my girlfriends that are my age, and they feel the same. Why would anyone want to give up their youth to parter up with somebody so much older. Also women are in their prime in their 30s and 40s. Men loose it in their early 20s. Not a comparable match
Tina, you’ve cracked me 😀 You’re in your early thirties and you call that youth!!!!
Tina, I don’t believe men loose it in their early 20s. Men can be wonderful at all different ages. Early 20s or 40s. And I think if you don’t want men to devalue you based on your age, you shouldn’t devalue them based on their age either.
I’m in my early 30s too. I’m a much better partner now than I was in my 20s. I was very naive, selfish and wanted Prince Charming to take care of everything for me. I was hungry for something I lacked growing up. Today I care more about his needs as well as mine and actually being a good partner to him. I think some of Evan’s advice is good, but too much of it is centered on what primarly makes men happy and doesn’t sometimes factor in female needs.
I would date a man in his 40s but he would have to be the kind of man that wasn’t setting out to specifically date younger women. I by-pass alot of men online because the way they list their age preferences easily weeds out the men that are agist toward women. Why would any woman want to put herself in that situation? There is absolutely no pay off to tie yourself with such a man even when he is older than you. I want to pass on genes to my children with the kind of guy that truly likes women, not women’s ages. Lots of guys say they love women when they really just love women’s bodies and sex with women. But a man that truly likes women? That goes beyond sex, age and bodies. Alot of people confuse the idea that a love for a woman’s body is an actual love and appreciation for her as a woman. And it’s not. Which is probably why alot of women who marry older men end up divorced in their 30s.
Miki, I do think early 30s is youthful. If you don’t, you’re going to be spending the majority of your life with one foot in the grave. How drool.
she is a transexual:)
As a woman of 41 the men my age mostly suck. Thry are jaded and bitter. Its not that I wont date them but they have lost thier fun and mojo unless they have been divorced they are often more bitter than women
After 30 it seems that many men begin to distrust and hate women. Not all of course.
You have got to be joking ? I am 54 and get hit on by women in their late 20’s ! What you look like and how you carry yourself make an INCREDIBLE difference. Women ARE NOT in their prime in their 30’s and 40’s (at least men don’t think so). And the “cougar phenomena” is if i may be blunt is b******t !
Can’t tell you don’t know women well, neither do your friends, or whoever men you are claiming to agree with you. Yes, women’s prime is in their 30’s and 40’s. There’s a huge difference in sexuality, in giving and receiving it, NOT faking it. If you don’t know that, you are probably not paying much attention to your women in bed. Just saying…
I’m 40 and I’m hit on by men in their 20s and 30s all the time. I’m not a “cougar,” because I do not seek such young men out. But there is DEFINITELY a market for young men you are very attracted to much older women – and NOT for their money. So many women are full of drama or have low self esteem or are inhibited – until they really come into themselves and know who they are in their mid-30s or so. Now at 40, young men see me as confident, intelligent, sexy, well-spoken, & self-assured. These are different times now, my friend.
“So many women are full of drama or have low self esteem or are inhibited – until they really come into themselves and know who they are in their mid-30s or so. Now at 40, young men see me as confident, intelligent, sexy, well-spoken, & self-assured. These are different times now, my friend.”
Let’s be honest. You are also likely above average in looks. THAT is what they see. In my experience, most men don’t give too much thought to the future. Not deep thought. They don’t think about what it will be like when you are 55 or 60 and they are 45. You also treat them differently because well, they aren’t old. They are young and hot, even if the younger women don’t see them as hot. Youth has an aphrodisiac-like quality on us as we get older. We see younger people as hotter than they are seen by their peers. Face it, many younger men are still trying to find themselves, which is not attractive to younger women, so the left-overs are more open to at least dating an older woman. He is also able to feel more confident because while the younger women send messages that say they don’t want him, he realizes that his youth has value, and that older women are more likely to want him. Thus more confidence. There’s nothing wrong with this if it works for you. But let’s not wear rose colored glasses. The vast majority of these men don’t want anything long term, and many WILL lie or be evasive about that fact. It’s not beyond many to claim they want marriage if they think that is going to get them what they want. If you are willing to brave the minefield and look for the needle in the haystack, more power too you, but don’t be dishonest and deny that the minefield exists, or that it is a hunt for the needle in the haystack.
Jenn,
I agree with most of your post. But you have one big blinder.
The negatives you say of younger men ALSO exist in “men our age” — Lying or evasiveness, for example. And ADD to that they’re not as hot as they think they are, and certainly not as hot as the guy 10-20 years his junior 🙂
And there are plenty of “men our age” who haven’t found themselves, too.
At the very least, younger men are good to look at naked. It’s a hell of a lot more fun to give a bj to a young guy with a fit bod than a guy whose gut is hiding the thing you’re trying to blow.
But you’re right. Young men are for fun only. Any older woman who is beyond her child-bearing years and thinks that a younger guy who hasn’t had any children yet is going to stay with her for the long haul IS denying reality. She needs to make sure she’s mature enough to let go when the time comes. And she has to be conscious that she is trading in her last attractive years for a guy who won’t be there when she needs him most, in her middle-aged to senior years.
I think most women can afford a year or two with a younger guy. But more than that and she’s risking trading in the potential of a long-term partner for a short-term stud.
I agree Karmic. Women want different things. Some of us just don’t get a warm and fuzzy about having sex with a guy who doesn’t value us enough as a person to want us long term. I agree that yes there are some older men that have the same negatives as the younger guys. But then, there are many younger guys who also have the same negatives that some older men have. Take a walk through Walmart and you will see no shortage of nasty looking men in their 20s and 30s, and in my experience, they tend to have more problems with hygiene than guys my age and older.
I think the issue for me is that I never have problems finding men my age and older, that are desirable. Not much difference physically than the younger guys that try to approach me. Yes, they do not look like the guys 10 to 20 years younger, but I have never seen that as a negative. And if I did, let’s be honest, y=wouldn’t the younger guys actually prefer to be in bed with a young hotty their age? I believe the answer is yes, and if those girls were actually giving them sex, they would be in their bed, not mine, right? I have my eyes open enough to understand that the real attraction for older women is the promise of easier, wilder sex. But whether they admit it or not, they wish they could get the same from the younger girls. I don’t want a man who prefers me more for my availability, or because I let his youth make me more open to doing things with him than girls his age will. I don’t want a man because he thinks I will be more open to anal sex, or giving BJ’s than girls his age. But that is probably because I don’t even feel much sexual attraction for a man until I have a mental connection to him. Maybe that makes me the odd one in the bunch. But it is who I am, and I am not going to alter that to keep a man around. It’s a core part of who I am. I find a man sexier than other men when he shows me I am worth fighting for, worth sacrificing for, worth spending a lot of time with. Once I have that connection with him, I am insatiable, but until I have it, there’s not much desire.
And we are in agreement that if it is long term that you want, a guy our age or older is a much more realistic route to take, and not by just a little bit. Most who try the Cougar route, for long term, are going to end up being crazy cat ladies. :p
There are a lot of great guys out there who are in their 40s and 50s, who are in great shape. No, they don’t look 25 or 30, but I feel sorry for the women who can’t see them for the catch that they are. But I also don’t mind. It makes it easier for me. haha
One last note…modern medicine has made it such that age is not an issue sexually, for the majority of older men. I did have a couple of relationships with men who used the pill. One was in his late 40s, and one was in his late 30s. Honestly, had they not told me, I would have never guessed. It was incredible sex. Once I realized it was great, I stopped worrying about it.
Also, at first I was naive about the pill. I thought that IT made the guy hard, but it was explained to me that it did not, it just allowed him to function normally if he was aroused by the woman. This was very good for me to learn, I guess because I wanted to know that it was me arousing him, not the pill. I have been more than assured, even by doctors, that this is how it works. It just allows nature to happen. That’s all.
Let me tell you something about guys over 50…Unless you are like Brad Pitt, it’s your imagination. I see plenty of men like you when I do my groceries… I say excuse me to get by and they think they have a chance and they start talking … It’s cute and all that but No! Men don’t look any better than women as they age : they get a fat belly, wrinkles, ugly teeth, lose hair, bags under the eyes …Sorry!
Here we go again, define “Growing Up”
Is that going into debt on a house you can barely afford? Is that buying more car than you need not to appear cheap (b segment compact) or immature (said b segment hot hatch)?
Women are finally starting to realize that they can’t be “just like men” in all aspects of life. They always throw out canards like men’s fertility goes down as they age. Not nearly as much as a woman’s does, stop with the bullsh*t. Just because more women over 40 are having their first child, what they don’t tell you is that many are medically assisted. Its not cheap and often times not covered or even effective.
I haven’t played around, I am not willing to settle for something that was unreasonable and my dating life got progressively worse as I got older. I was growing increasing frustrated that the only women interested in me where either:
Overweight
Had children, never married
And older than me or a combination of one or two or even all three of those.
I also ran into a series of women who either couldn’t have children or had one child and then had to have their reproductive system removed.
Thus far I haven’t talked about Black Women who are a complete train wreck in this country and I won’t consider them for even dog catcher at this point.
I have been overseas and while it didn’t work out like I want, its time to go back, this time South America and I may not come back, not like you’ll miss me anyway.
,,Thus far I haven’t talked about Black Women who are a complete train wreck in this country and I won’t consider them for even dog catcher at this point.” What a vile racist.
1) Are you a White saying that? If you are, what gives you agency?
2) Given the volume of evidence, you speak without knowing the facts.
80% of African-American women have a child out of wedlock. Let me repeat that, 80% of Black women have a child out of wedlock. It was 79%. All in the US Census data, use Google.
How does that play itself out in real terms? Go to any single dating site and tell me how many profiles you see if Black woman with at least once child, because 60% of those woman have a second child with another man.
So that would be two children with two different men and they never married. Now I am not saying that is unique to Black women, because dusty arse Black men are just as responsible. Lots of these men impregnate White women, Latinas and Asian women though to a much lower level because 90+% of Black men say they want to marry Black women.
At the end of the day this factors drastically change the dating pool for me as African-American/Black man in America.
Go kick rocks.
You are stereotyping all black women as the same and they are not.
You cannot put a ghetto hood rat black woman in the same category as an upper class highly educated blavk woman. You are losing out on a huge pool of women
Many single black women are high income earners
Amelia you are CORRECT that is insanely racist
You see why some men are single eeeeek.
Not to mention in America there are multiple categories
of black women. 1. African American 2. Ethiopian
3. Carribean 4. West African 5. East African
we are not all the same thinking or culturally.
@Amelia & @Tracy. How is Anthony racist? He is black himself. Just because he is stating facts about his OWN women in his race. Typical white liberal women trying to play the race card. I guess you stuffed up, because Anthony is black as he has stated in some of his comments.
THEY wont want you, either. Youre running out of Continents to “escape to and find your bride”. LOL. 😉
I have been overseas and while it didn’t work out like I want, its time to go back, this time South America and I may not come back, not like you’ll miss me anyway.
That is NOT a racist comment. It’s an accurate statistic.
Anthony, for a man who admits to living off his ex (“she paid the rent”) you may want to lay off the tirade of insults aimed at others and leveling judgement at women as being unworthy of you. You certainly are not coming across as any prize yourself.
Anthony – It’s not just that men’s fertility goes down as they age. The sperm’s quality actually breaks down. A young man of 20 has 25 genetic mutations to his sperm. By the time a man reaches 40, the mutations in his sperm has tripled to 65. With age, and with sperm continually reproducing (and the cells dividing over and over again to generate new sperm), over time, sperm breaks down in quality. Unlike men, women have the same eggs at 20 that she had at 40. So while she may have less eggs, the medical community has discovered that young women and older women both have about 15 genetic mutations to their eggs either way. This is why it’s very important to consider a man’s role and age. There is no doctor that will ever tell a man to wait to have kids. And actually there are studies that have shown that older women often have more intelligent children. I’m not saying women should wait to have kids either, but it is not the black and white picture we’ve used for generations to shame women about their ages while giving men free passes for theirs. Older men need to understand how their own age contributes to the baby process. That’s just common sense. Instead of ignoring it.
When you say things like “I won’t consider them for even a dog catcher at this point”, yes, the likihood of women missing you if you left, is highly unlikely.
@Norbert – you appear to be a white guy and you magically get to comment on race but no other white person doesn’t? You are an extremely prejudice man against women. This is the second time I’ve come across your post where you’ve felt it was your entitlement to make the statement about ‘typical women” this and that. It’s unfortunate how much you dislike women. Why visit this place at all? So you can verbally abuse women?
I couldn’t agree with you more Jersey Girl. I’m a 34 year old tomboy and all my friends are men 40 plus. The 50 year old mid life crisis men are the worst. They whine all day long that women (35 and under) are so horrible to them and use them. The normal guys their age and me just stare at them in disbelief while sitting at the bar amazed at their state of denial.
After reading these posts, it is clear men and women are just not on the same timeline!
I had one child in my late twenties during grad school and got divorced four years later. When i got around to dating again I found that men in their 30’s and 40’s were mostly like Adam – they either wanted kids or had kids, along with an ex-wife and a custody schedule. Been there, done that. Not interested.
It wasn’t until I started dating again in my late 40’s that I could find men who affirmatively did not want children, or like mine, their kids had flown the nest. What i find interesting about Adam’s email is that he equates children with a LTR. I think Evan’s analysis is right on about men wanting younger women who aren’t yet ready to settle down – although my biological clock wasn’t ticking anymore, a lot of my (professional) women friends had children in their late 30’s and early 40’s. Perhaps Adam should find the woman first and then figure out the kid issue instead of the other way ’round. Is carrying on his gene pool more important than being alone? Some women come with kids already and there is always adoption. I agree that there is a certain “I’m looking for a breeder” tone that if its in his profile might be a turn-off.
Have I solved the problem? Sort of. Having just turned 50, I have been actively dating for the last four years (using a lot of Evan’s advice, of course) and have dated men 12-15 years on either side of me, but not so many my own age. For the last year I have been seeing a man eight years my senior. His kids are grown up and married. He has his own law practice. He doesn’t know how to use a BlackBerry, but he calls me every day and (Evan will cringe) on dates he brings me flowers, pays, and helps me off with my coat. He understands responsibility and commitment. He is the only guy I’ve dated since my divorce with whom I can see having a future. Would I have dated him ten years ago when I was 40? Probably not.
Why wouldn’t you have dated him when you were 40 PortiaOnline?
@ Heather #20
Isn’t the response in the Outsourcing/Illegal immigration debate always “because they’ll take the jobs Americans are unwilling to do”. In the future, even Americans won’t be “Made in the USA” anymore.
Am I allowed to be offended by the guy that chooses to “date” and “have some fun” but then expects women so much younger than him, to hook up with him and start breeding once he hits his “I’m now stable” stage? What happened to behaving with a bit of maturity and self-restraint when you are younger? What happened to thinking things through?
It’s letters like this, that make me lose my faith in men. Actually, it makes me lose my faith in people a little bit.
I’ve realized, that at 36, kids may not happen for me. I also realize, that even if I craved them, no man I meet is going to want to be seen as the “father” of my kids before he’s ready or even willing to make that decision. If I want some-one lovely in my life, I have to accept that kids may simply not be on the agenda. If I really wanted to, I could have one on my own. So no pressure on the guys, and just get to know them slowly.
But when I read this stuff from guys, I think, how self-absorbed is he?
Thankfully I know some really great younger men, who have had families young and although they do believe they may have made a mistake in their choice in partner, they are working on it and are absolutely dedicated to their children and their partners lives. Some of my younger male friends, do give me back some of my faith in men and people overall and I hope their marriages prevail.
I probably shouldn’t be, but I’m really disgusted by this guys attitude. He wanted his cake, and wanted to eat it too…and doesn’t spare a thought for the women, who may have wanted children and still do, but are running out of time. You know, those women who were once young enough to have kids, but met men that just couldn’t make that commitment. He wants a breeder who will do things his way. Harsh, but that’s the way I see it.
Offended? Really? Self Absorbed? I think you are viewing it from your own biased viewpoint.
I completely understand his dilemma. And I empathize. I am 48 and in the same boat, luckily I look 38 and can get away with it. But the truth is, Annette, I couldn’t have a fmily in my late 20s or even 30s as I was still a struggling business owner and barely took care of myself. Now that my trees are bearing fruit for the last 5-8 years I have been searching without getting to the end result.
Sometimes “play” because we know we can’t “pay” just yet.
Is that so bad?
Absolutely, it’s irresponsible.
If I had a quarter for every comment saying “I look 10 years younger!” I’d be very wealthy indeed.
??? I don’t understand, just because a woman is in her 40’w doesn’t mean she’s dead, and her child barring days are finito! my aunt had her last child at 40, my mothers best friend had her last child at 44, healthy. What is wrong with you people, and american society as a whole with the youth forever crap? the fact is you’ll have children when the LORD wants you to.
Men and woman in countries like south/central america, africa,asia, and the middle east most have their children very late. It’s only in the united states that puts caps on child barring age, which is idiotic. Get over yourselves, also to woman in their 20’s early 30’s, you’ll be in your 40’s soon, and you’ll thank back to the days when you wouldn’t date a man in his 40’s. By the way, once you hit 18-21 the years begin to pass super fast, and before you know it, you’ll be that late 30-42 year old looking for love and someone to start a family with.
The fact is, most late 30’s and 40 somethings didn’t have many relationships and children early on because they didn’t want to just have children by just anyone, they didn’t want to be fast asses and rush into a relationship. I am not 40 but I do love older women, and yes I would settle down with and older woman, 5-10 years older isn’t a huge gap as some are trying to make it seem.
one can always adopt
Adoption is very much a second choice.
I like and share your positive view, Dark.
My grandma had her last kid at 47yrs. The poster
can get a 37 to 40 yr old woman and still have kids.
THANK YOU!!! YOU are what we all need to see more of. I’m 40. I absolutely still want to be a mother someday. I come with the “baggage” of already knowing I’m fertility challenged. But at least I know. I still want to have a family – with the RIGHT man for me – whether he’s 30 or 43. I think it’s more important for a couple to be on the same page with what they want (they both really want or really don’t want children), and then figure out the rest together. Science is amazing and infertility can happen at 22, 32, 42…
PortiaOnline (#22) said what I want to say but didn’t know how to put it!!! Hahaha…
Yes. People nowadays have the sequence the other way round. Kids are the testimony of love between a couple. Having kids should not be the ultimate purpose of a relationship. So, the aim should be the find the right person first.
Foreign chicks are cute but you cant talk to them.
So true, I’ve gone on dates with a couple but we had nothing in common. I want a woman I can relate to.
I want very little in common with a woman I marry aside from the same family-raising goals.
Otherwise, I’d just hope an identical twin copy of myself pops up out of nowhere and date him instead…
@ 27 –
I did have a brief relationship with a foreigner. VERY handsome man, but he started acted flakey as soon as I agreed to be his girlfriend. However, even if he didn’t act like a flake, I do wonder how things would have worked out. Communication was difficult. I had trouble gauging his emotions due to his accent, his voice was very low & soft pitch wise, so I had to struggle just to hear him, and even when I could hear him, understanding was difficult because of pronounciation or sentence syntax. Also, at times he seemed to understand me very well, but when it was convenient for him to NOT understand me, somehow he didn’t. Also, seemed to work in the other way to, his speech would get heavier accented when he was telling me something that he knew I wouldn’t like, yet he could speak clearly to say things most women would like to hear. (Sort of how some men mumble or grunt if they have to tell you what you don’t want to hear) So I really couldn’t tell if he was passively-aggressively erecting “language barriers” when convenient, or if the language/culture barrier was real. Any way, looking back at the brief relationship, I must admit, I responded to his pursuit of me, pretty much because I found him extremely handsome.
I did briefly date another foreigner, but he lived in the states over 20 years, and although he had an accent, he was easy to hear and understand, and his English was extremely good, no language barrier at all. He was actually quite handsome, seemed to be really into me, but for some reason, I wasn’t that attracted to him. I have a few theories for why I wasn’t attracted to him, but I’m not really sure why I wasn’t.
Not that I care about that so much-but I mean about anything!
“Foreign chicks are cute but you cant talk to them.” – Joe #27
You know, I’ve wondered about this too. For those of you who have watched “Love Actually,” you’ll recall that the men fell in love either with foreign women who couldn’t speak to them, or women who had such a different career (tea girl vs. prime minister) that you had to wonder what they would ever TALK about if they got into a long-term relationship.
So it is in real life as well… there a LOT of white men falling for foreign women (especially Asians) who don’t speak English very well but are very cute.
Do men just not care about language and other verbal barriers when it comes to finding a mate? I’m not judging one way or the other; I’m just wondering, because it seems so strange, and I’d like to hear others’ perspectives.
Helen, I grew up in Europe and speak 3 languages including English. I would not date someone whom I do not understand even if she is cute. (I would probably learn her language because there is no working relationship without communication. I am in the same boat as the original writer. I’ll turn 41 this year. I look a lot younger, I am fit, have a good job. I am not looking for a 25 year old, they are immature, sometimes if I open the door or pull out the chair for them they look surprised, they do not get it. Obviously looking for somebody older, mid 30’s maybe. I think finding someone 5 years younger than me is a realistic goal. However I have zero luck even though I live in the Chicago area where one would think opportunity is everywhere. i tend to agree with some of comments here that said women in their mid 30’s just do not want to date anyone “whose age starts with a 4”. I do not discriminate based on race or having children because I adopt to these thing easily being quite open minded but the age thing is stuck in my head. My experience supports this theory too. I’ve met a lady who was 33 coming out of a marriage, having 2 children. I did not care about her hispanic background either. I was madly in love with her and did not see these as an issue. She loved me too but it got complicated and she broke it off. We both cried a lot and still miss each other but for some reason it had to be over. I have not been able to make such a deep connection with anyone but I know I can only be with someone I love as much as her. So this narrows down the search to a very thin margin. Finding love has nothing to do with age – even if we take into consideration – it is more like getting lucky. I am just not being one.
love
Cool, “Love Actually”, a fantastically unrealistic movie. Nevertheless, Colin Firth is spending every day with the fit Portuguese wet underwear model, so there is a certain affection there, on his side, despite the language barrier. And they did speak in the end; it was not a relationship without conversation. Colin made an enormous effort, right?
With regard to Hugh Grant and the secretary, it seemed to be a deliberately scripted crossing of their class barriers over there. He’s head of government; her family is very blue collar. This was back when they thought it was so cute that Tony Blair’s wife was in the middle of having a baby, just like a normal couple, in the stuffy official residence.
I think there is a deleted scene showing that Colin Firth’s unfailthful girlfriend in London, who we never saw, is Alan Rickman’s marriage-wrecker coworker.
Re verbal barriers: cultural barriers are pretty big too. Try being married to a German. She’ll tell you what she thinks you’re doing wrong. About everything.
Men have to move along with the reality that has changed a long time ago now. I think men still follow stereotypes that are no longer valid. And, yes, they sometimes do tend to view things from the perspective of their wishes. The culture conditions them to do so. I think men aim too high when it comes to women’s looks and age. There are simply not enough hot 25 year old women to go around for all the men that desire them. And there won’t be because less girls are being born. And the ones in their 20s and even 30s have choices.
I am 32, good looking (not hot, just cute) and do not wish to be with an older man, quite the opposite, I desire younger men. I had a relationship with a man 13 years my senior when I was 19. But from then on, the men were my age, a couple of years older or younger. The problem was, even the older man did not want to have kids (he had had one already). I had long term relationships but the guys didn’t want to have kids back when I was 23-25. They just wanted the good sex and the hot meal. Just like many guys in their early 30s. I used to think that I’m different than other women because I wasn’t physically attracted to older men (unless they’re Viggo Mortensen who is 50 but unfortunately they’re not). I was raised by a young dad (he was 21 when my parents had me, mom being a bit older). I have always desired virile men in the age group of 19-30. But I also like softer, more tolerant guys, the so called beta males, and it’s the younger ones who tend to be like that because they appreciate independent women. As a woman, I desire a few things that are not traditional, but alas, the reality has long since changed and ppl haven’t come to terms with it. I have my own money (there never was another choice but to work and pay my own bills). So I desire other things – good looks, youthfulness, caring, attentiveness, ‘father’ potential (not a highly paid Sunday dad but someone who will atually raise the kid, Dad with the capital D). His wallet is not my priority. And it is not always the older guy who is more stable and secure. I know a lot of guys in their mid-late 20s that are in committed relationships and have already had kids. And then there are many guys aged 35 who are still “sleeping’, being ultra picky, looking for the bestest of the bestest. I know that they want the hot 23-27 year old (who makes her own money preferably). Well, they set themselves up for loads of competition because those women are desired by thousands of men in the age range between 21-60 (both rich and poor).
It is sad. I wish I was attracted to older guys (some of them are really neat). But I just can’t help it when I see a handsome 25-27 year old, I am simply enchanted!
Also, I dislike the attitude of older guys towards older women or women their own age. Hei, I will be old some day too – they will not get a piece of me for putting down my older sisters!
What is interesting I notice some other women who are actually similar to me.. I thought I was an exception… they claim they like older and ‘smart’ but in the end looks do matter to them and so does the age..
I’m actually considering staying single or having the kid on my own as the extreme choice.. but thankfully there are many good guys out there.
Guys, don’t be sleeping through out your 20s and 30s.. where is your commitment at that age? Sperm quality and men’s fecundity drops too with age… and to the Western guys who think they will import a much younger wife, alright you might, but I come from one of those ‘poor’ countries in Eastern Europe and I do love Western men a lot.. but – not my dad’s age! And not even 10 years older, sorry.
Im exactly like . I am 32 and I am just attracted to men under 30 and I can’t and I don’t want to change my desire.I expend many years going to graduate school and studying and I want good looking young man in retune .I want my childern have a young father. I think when you have money you must be crazy to date and marry expired men. thanks to science now a day we have slots of time to get pregnant.
All that work going to grad school only to find out that men who have had their careers don’t give a flying youknowwhat about that in their mates.
Also, at age 32, your time is running out.
I once liked this girl who played with my time and emotions out of immaturity.I did not have a good job then so i concentrated on improving myself .This lady wanted to date ball players etc..it did not happen she married a very average guy a far cry from what she first desired.She wanted me before that but sounded creepy because she appeared to investigate my newly realised status.We all think the world is ours when we are younger and dismiss others.This world does not comply to anyones dictates..you can marry a young good looking nuthead who will kill you , it does not matter how beautiful you may think you are ..life is not always in your hands , ask hot Russian girls who cant find decent guys what their problem is….if they find this 40yr old American guy they will hold on to him for dear life…
Well there you are! I’ve been waiting for one of you guys to jump on and run up the benefits of finding a “girl” from a disadvantaged country you can exploit because WOMEN from America won’t have you.
Perfect name IceQueen. Just what a healthy minded upper crust man is looking for. I’m mid-30s, and read so many comments from women about how awful the older guys are. I have news for you. Men don’t have to get with the times. The hot guys you women want? They’re doing just fine. Life is good for them. And those 25-27 year old guys you are enchanted by? They know you are and they know all women are. But they aren’t “enchanted” by you. They have no problem screwing you, but remember, like you said, when you were 23-25, men didn’t want kids. They don’t want to get married or have kids. Why would they? Women are enchanted by them. They are having the time of their lives. I know, I was one of them.
You complain about older men bad mouthing older women, but I’ve seen plenty of bad mouthing of older men. So I will advise the younger guys to adopt the same attitude as you. Solidarity with their older bros.
Men have to move along with the reality that has changed a long time ago now? No, the don’t. Just because women now want to marry a guy several years younger, you think all of us men just have to toe the line and marry older women? Sorry, isn’t going to happen. Let me tell you what will happen. Men can have all the sex they want without getting married. We can go from short relationship to short relationship, even with older women who are easy because they are “enchanted” and maybe, at some point, a slightly younger woman we really want will come along and want us back, and we will get married. But you women that have your heart set on marrying a younger guy? Most of you are going to go from short relationship to short relationship and at some point, your looks will be gone and you won’t be able to attract younger guys, or older guys. You don’t even realize how the system works. I showed my father the article about women 50+ being invisible. My dad thought about it and look at my mom who was off in the distance. He said, he feared for her if anything were to happen to him. He said that looking at it objectively, if he didn’t know her now, he might not be as attracted to her. He said that he sees her through decades of love, so she is the most beautiful woman to him. He said that he thinks the system is meant for us to meet when we are young and beautiful, then stay together into old age and that the years of love blind us to the fact that we have gotten old and not as beautiful. So he said that if something happened to him, and she had to find another man, he knows another man could not see her like he sees her.
This blog amazes me. Evans stuff is pretty cool, and seems to be level headed most of the time, which surprises me. But the women that post here. WOW I am constantly reading how 30 something women say they all have their choice of hot younger guys, and don’t need or want older guys. But then the late 30s to late 40s women will admit that guys their age or just a bit younger don’t want them. Only the older guys do. Which reminds me that those choice 20 something guys are quickly going to be the older guys that don’t want the older women. But you want to marry them. The pattern here is that when guys are younger and sowing wild oats, they will gladly have sex with older women if she is decent looking. But when they are ready to settle down, they aren’t interested in the older ladies anymore. So maybe women can stop bragging about all of these options they have with younger guys, because no, you don’t, and your first sentence said so. No, men don’t have to move along with the reality that has changed a long time ago now, because it’s not reality and it never was. It’s a fantasy in your minds that all of you women are going to hit the lottery and find that needle in the haystack guy that will marry an older woman.
I know two women who married guys considerably younger than them. One marriage only lasted a year, the other is still going strong. My friend who is still married was very reluctant to go out with him at first because of the age difference, but he persisted and pursued her, and they ended up married. I know another man who fell head over heels in love with a woman five years older than him. She turned him down at first because of the age difference, but he pursued her and now they are happily married and he was the most joyful groom I have ever seen ! I know these are exceptions, (and really I don’t think 5 years is much of a difference in either direction) but they do happen. Since all 3 of these couples, obviosly the men in these scenarios didn’t think these women were worthless.
Me, I have no desire to date a big age gap in either direction. In my younger days, I actually preferred older (but wound up marrying someone 2 1/2 years younger). I had NO IDEA that my younger self desire for an older man (10-20 years depending on the man) was so unusual or was so repulsive to other women. And to this day I am still amazed that women think it’s perfectly OK to tell other woman that they are full of it for wanting an older man. (I caught so much crap when I was dating a 42 year old when I was 29) Now that I am older myself, I really wish to keep it closer to my age, and with a man who is fit and healthy for his age (as am I) But I am not going to revile others for their choices or desires. Different strokes for different folks.
Sometimes young men will hit on me online, and give me a bunch of BS about how they think I am so sexy and gorgeous and truthfully, it grosses me out. Even if his picture shows an attractive youngster. Perhaps it is because I have a son in college. Perhaps it is because I suspect that these youngsters are misogynists hitting on older women for an easy lay, or to check off an item on their sexual bucket list. So I ignore those kids. I have raised one child, I don’t want another.
But to each his or her own. While it is not the norm, or what is typical, there are some successful older woman/younger man pairings, if they are happy, it’s not mine or anyone else’s place to tell them that they are full of s***.
Very accurate !
Why so bitter Jason? If the world is your oyster and you can get hot women well into your 40s and the dating market favors you, why do you seem so consumed with tearing down the women here?
Well, my fiancé is 6 years younger than me, so I guess we do have options of dating both older and younger. And he wasn’t a needle in a haystack. I’ve had plenty of younger guys, older guys, and guys my own age ask me out. If you’re attractive, smart, and kind, guys will want you – no matter what. The only guys that have big philosophies regarding what age of women they will date, are usually the guys that have very limited options themselves and need to soothe their hurt egos, by pretending to reject women first.
HI
Hey it appears that you must have it “goin on” . Men need to wake up to reality ? There is mounting amount of evidence that the ” cougar phenomena” is b.s !
Times change and culture changes but biology doesn’t. A little muscle goes a long way. What you look like as opposed to how old you are is the key.
Disagree with me if you will but as rule men age a hecka of a lot better
than women!
That is quite subjective.
I’ve seen women here make the same claim for women. It sounds ridiculous both ways. About an equal percentage on both sides age well.
“…men age a hecka of a lot better than women!”
What drugs are you on and where can I get some? Sorry, I’m not attracted to the balding heads, fat beer guts, hair in the ears, wrinkles, saggy butts and balls, erectile dysfunction, and over-inflated self worth of a lot of older men. Do you know what George Clooney looks like at 50? Well, he looked 10 times better when he was 30! Same can be said about Sean Connery or Harrison Ford. No matter how hot you guys think you are as you get older, you were still considerably better looking when you were younger. This is how it is for everyone – men and women. And you presuming to know what women think of older men compared to younger men is just wishful thinking on your part. In fact, most young women (20s to 30s) would prefer Ryan Gosling or Channing Tatum over their “dad” George Clooney, so don’t kid yourself.
When I was in my 20s, I wouldn’t have considered dating a 40-soemthing man without PUKING first 40s is old. .And guess what else? Guys who go around saying stuff like “men age better than women” and “only young women are valuable” sound like jerks and I wouldn’t want to date one anyway. All women age and if you’re going to insult a woman just because she’s 10 years older than me, you’re basically insulting me 10 years in advance. Why would I want to date a jerk like that? If you want a shot at a love life, you need to grow up!
Yeah – I agree 110% with Pat. Clint Eastwood was beautiful in his 20-30s. He’s a great actor and all but he wasn’t better looking at 50 then 30. Now his son, who looks a lot like he did when he was younger, is beautiful. He’s in his 20s. Not that there is anything wrong not being as attractive as you were when you were younger. It’s just the reality that we all age. The big difference in our society is men have had entitlement in this regard for a long time now, telling themselves all kinds of things about their own aging process that just isn’t true. Alot of my guy friends started to complain about getting older in their late 20s! They complained about loosing hair and getting grey hair and wrinkles. So I know men feel the pressure too. There is value in every human being. Both men and women get older and it shows similarly. Men sperm breaks down triple the rate by the time they are 40 while women may have less eggs, but they have the same eggs at 20 that they will have at 40. Nature always seems to balance things out. We just place more unrealistic standards on women.Hence why the world likes to tell itself men age better. I don’t remember the last time I heard a 20-30 year old woman go crazy of Clooney. But they do often talk about Ryan Golsing or Ryan Reynolds or Chris Evans.
Pat – you’ve said everything I’ve said in the past. If you can’t like women when they are older, then you won’t like me when I’m older. And a man who only likes women when she is young, doesn’t really like women at all. He only likes what he things a young woman can do for him. That’s not the stuff relationships should be built on. Women want to be with men that actually like them. That like our beauty, sure. But not when the concept of beauty is so unrealistic and twisted around to suit a man’s personal agenda. We also want men to like us for who we are, what we are. And all that good stuff. You have to actually like women if you want a healthy relationship with one. And i’m not talking about liking the way women look or smell or the desire to have sex with them. You have to like them beyond those factors.
I wish I could ‘like’ your comment Pat!
Fortunately for men like him with money they can look for women in countries where age is not considered in the vein you describe.He is probably just hurting because being alone can suck.He can still go to Russia and get a very beautiful and intelligent 20yr old.My own cousin who is 41 married a 26yr old, and he was a virgin 🙂 there is no world consensus to matters of age…the world is wide.He needs to change his entitlement position, however its society that puts pressure on men to have..there are married men who are living from one pay check to the next…in life you dont always get what you want…
Boze: Right on time with the whole “foreign women” nonsense.
You can convince yourself that the gorgeous young 24 yr old Russian bride loves you just for you, but the reality is that, if you have to go to an economically disadvantaged country to buy a woman, she’s almost certainly in it for a Green Card or your wallet, and before you judge HER for being a “Gold-digger” remember that you’re using her for her sex appeal, which is just a bad. Frankly, if you are not appealing to American women, you aren’t actually any more appealing to a foreign woman. She’ll just put on a show for her own advantage. And that’s what it’s really all about for guys like you. You want the young hottie, even though you can’t offer them what THEY want, so you want one to pretend to like you to stroke your little boy ego. It’s quite sad, really.
Look on the bright side. Men have two options for getting a younger hotter woman. 1. Be super good looking and fit or 2. Have money. Women don’t get the second option. Men don’t really care if women have money. If we’re overweight or unattractive we’re just screwed with a large swath of men. Luckily, there are still a few cool guys out there who see women as actual people instead of sex toys.