No Fats No Femmes Dilemma

ImOnABeach · 11時間前

IMO, you can have your preferences, just don't vocalize them in a way that divides people. Date who you want to date, just don't put down other people in the process.

tedsmitts · 10時間前

Personally I won't date the Welsh

derbyna · 10時間前

A lot of people haven't evaluated WHY they have preferences. Some things are innate, but some things are very difficult to separate from our influences.
Fat people, feminine gays, and asian people are often desexualized in society/media

bussytwink · 10時間前

It's good Kim put the issue on blast and tried to reclaim it in a way. The gay community has a lot of internalized racism and misogyny going on.

robthedragqueen · 10時間前

I think when you make sweeping generalisations, especially when it comes to race, that's problematic. I think with things like "femmes" it's slightly different because that's a much less broad range of people than, say, "Asians" - there are so many Asians with all types of personalities, all sorts of body types etc etc that when someone says something like "I don't date Asians" I have to question why that is?

UrDadsBF · 10時間前

I think it's very much racist to completely exclude a race of men when there's such tremendous variation within racial categories. Not all East Asians look the same, as "no rice" gays imply. Where it gets complicated for me is that I prefer specific body characteristics that are more common in some races than others. For example, I'm really attracted to body hair, which is on average more present in (for example) Middle Eastern men than in East Asian men. That said, I would never just make a blanket statement against East Asian men, because there's a high chance that one could have body hair, or that I could be attracted to a more hairless man if there are other things about him that attract me. It brings into question where we draw racial boundaries. If it goes beyond skin colour, what about racial trends in eye colour, hair type, body hair, musculature, build, etc.). Over all though, I don't think anyone should have such a narrow "type" that they totally exclude entire groups of people regardless of the individuality of the people in those groups.

Angel_Campy · 9時間前

These issues are very deeply ingrained in North American society and the culture of white power and patriarchy, and are extremely sensitive issues. "Preferences" are one thing, societal attitudes that dictate who is and is not attractive, is and is not deserving of love, and is or is not a sexual being is determined for us by large media franchises, advertising industries and the like. When was the last time you saw a male hearthrob in a Hollywood blockbuster that was black? Or Asian? If you can think of one; was he gay? Chances are no, he was not. He was probably traditionally masculine too, and quite muscular, or in shape. This is what is understood to be "attractive". North American society as a whole tends to embrace certain types of gay men as acceptable; that being white middle class ones who resemble these "attractive" men we see in the media. We (and I speak under the assumption most of us on the sub are gay cis-men operating within North America) are subject to this flawed hegemony as members of this society, and thus unwittingly internalize these notions. What can be justified as "only preferences" are so much more complex than that. I'm a women and gender studies and socio-cultural anthropology 4th year student at the university of Toronto. Don't get me started on these things for I will write a dissertation.

moodiesc · 10時間前

It's just kind of stupid. Why specify who you aren't into at the risk of coming off like an ass when you can simply specify who you are into. Like.. Why say no blacks, no asians, no etc. etc. It's a easier to list everything you like instead of everything you dont. Like when you order food do you tell your server everything you don't want and just expect the right meal to show up? Nah. Thats my view anyways...

talbotthefox · 9時間前

Seeing as there is no way what so ever to concretely decide that you're never going to be attracted to a single person of a certain characteristic,saying no fats no fems, is saying you're not into the idea of fat people, or fems, and I think that needs a lot of self interrogatiom

otcishot · 10時間前

I think everyone is entitled to like what they like but there are far better ways to turn down someone than to be explicitly an asshole (and potentially racist)

ChaChaGalore · 9時間前

I have my preferences and I list them. I don't list the traits I don't prefer. It could turn out that my magical unicorn might not fit my preferences perfectly. I don't want to turn him off before he can contact me and we meet.

I'm fat. I'm Asian. AND I'm older than many folks online looking for dates. If I see someone cute and then read that they clearly state that they will reject fats, Asians, and anyone over 30, I move on. But damn they are missing out!

problematicrealness · 6時間前

I think everyone is entitled to their preferences as long as they're not being an asshole or blatantly racist/homophobic/transphobic/femme-phobic/misogynistic/ableist/body-shaming about it. But they absolutely need to think deeper about where those seemingly "natural" attractions come from and the environment that makes them possible. The issue isn't really going to be solved by giving someone crap about not being attracted to xyz type of guy. If we start increasing diversity among the people we consider sex symbols or whatever, then we create an environment where less exclusionary preferences can be born. The reason why we're in the situation we're in is because for the longest time (even now) white, muscular, masculine, and (usually) young men are held up as the ideal. You see it on magazine covers, in movies, in fashion, etc. If you grow up in that kind of environment, of course you'll start to internalize the idea that that is the only thing that can be attractive. So I think that's a big part of where we need to focus. But of course if someone is explicitly and unnecessarily mean about it, they should be called out.

Flazedoo · 10時間前

I think it's okay to not be attracted to different traits in people. It's the same as straight men and women having 'types'. However, the point Kim was making in her statement was that making a sweeping comment on a Craigslist or Grindr is generally accepted doesn't sit well with me. The gay community is a community that fights for equal rights yet disguises hate and profiling under 'preference'. I can't speak collectively but I can speak for myself in that I don't generally see a lot in straight culture. You have people who voice their tastes and preference openly but if a straight man would list 'No fats' on their tinder profile, feminazis and tumblr dwellers would go crazy; yet there doesn't seem to be much of that reaction within the gay community and it does seem as though it's just accepted to be okay. As Pride Magazine summarises nicely: The big question is, since when is it okay to judge an entire group of people before you meet them? There got a word for that: Prejudice.

tedsmitts · 7時間前

Can we have the argument about how if you're gay but say you're not attracted to FtM trans* folk you're not actually gay, just a phallophile because you reduce an aspect of sexuality to an organ? That's always a fun one.

yeahtheaidan · 7時間前

I'll fuck pretty much anything with a cock and a pulse. My sexual history looks like a Benetton catalogue. But I can't get mad at people who have racial preferences. There's a lot of research that shows that we're attracted to people who look the most like us. Is that a socially conditioned response? Absolutely. Is there a biological component? Almost certainly. Either way, is it easy to unlearn? Nup.

What I do object to is these vapid dudes on gay social media with no sense of how their words hurt others. I'm a fit guy and I like guys within a couple of standard deviations of my size. But to put that out as the first words on your profile is kinda reprehensible. Just read the messages, say you're not interested, and move on with your terrible life.

xenom0rph · 10時間前

I think it's pretty telling the way straight people react to hearing about this. Even my gay-clueless friends have had WTF reactions to it when I tell them about it.

PurseLast · 10時間前

Online hookups and dating OMG.

I think "no fats, no fems" is offensive. There are better ways to word preferences such as "fit and looking for the same" or "masculine looking for similar" is better. As far as races, keep it to yourself and respond to who you want. I've seen "no dirty old men" in hookup and dating posts, as if when a person hits 40 (or whatever age) they're suddenly a "dirty old man" if they want to date or have sex. Also I see "no blacks, sorry just a preference" as if adding "just a preference" somehow makes it less offensive.

I have had bad luck and bad experiences with online hookups and online dating in general to the point where I don't bother anymore. The worst problem for me is that almost everyone is a liar. They always take years off their age, sometimes 10 - 15 years older than they advertise. And they use very old, fake or otherwise deceptive photos, like from 10 years ago before they gained 100 pounds. I actually hooked up with a "35 year old" from adam4adam once who admitted to me he was 50 after meeting - his picture was 15 years old too, obviously. If you're 50 that's fine as long as you're honest and not lying and deceiving, like nobody will notice lol.

I also think that online hookups and dating is a magnet for sociopaths, or people with a bad character, from my personal experience over the years. I don't know what to do anymore. Meeting people face to face is the way to go but bars and clubs are not a good place to meet people either from my experience. I think the best option would be to join a gay hiking group (or whatever your interest is) through meetup.com or something similar.

I've given up. They say when you quit looking suddenly your soul mate will show up, but that's BS too, as I've been there done that. It's better to be alone than to wish you were because you're with someone incompatible or just plain rotten, I know that.

Here I go again rambling on and on...

Reaper628 · 7時間前

You can have preferences but you have to not be a cunt about it. Saying "i want a masculine white man" is far better than going out right and saying "no fats no Fems no Asians"

perryduff · 6時間前

as a little bit fem Asian guy, I really could careless about it. I RAN OUT of fuck to give. I know nothing will change in my generation, and maybe, just maybe, if changes can happen in the next generation I would be old and you know how it will go. I have dreams, but I know I better live in reality and prepare to die alone.

Roan89 · 1時間前

I think it has a lot to do with online profiles and how easy the access is to what one is looking for. In my area (East London) I see a lot of profiles that say 'only into muscular, masculine, fit, 'specific race'. Those same guys will flirt with me when clubbing, and I'm definitely not one of the above.

Boby-LM · 5時間前

I feel like if you don't want to date black/asian/arabic whatever type of guy just don't say it, like you can clearly see if someone isn't white so you don't have to tell the world you don't want to date them. However tho I can understand why someone would say "no fem", some people are just not attracted to feminine personalities and i don't see what's wrong with that, it's also something you can't always see on a pictures, some dudes be looking masculine af and then act really feminine.

icedarkling · 5時間前

I don't think anyone is really "for it" other than horrible people.

nikkysan · 5時間前

I've always wondered why Latinos are generally the "accepted" minority amongst those white gays who won't touch a black or Asian guy?

LuckyWriter · 10時間前

I think people should be allowed to state whatever they want in terms of what they are looking for and people shouldn't get butthurt about it.

Not everyone is going to find everyone attractive. I feel like putting it in your bio just helps save everyone from wasting time. Is it a good thing to make a huge generalization about a single race? Well, no. But if that person has seen a lot of...Indian people for lack of a better race and hasn't found himself attractive to any of them, why not put it in the bio so he can avoid awkwardness? It just makes sense.

Just like if someone doesn't want a feminine guy or if someone is specifically looking for someone who isn't masculine - they should be allowed to vocalize that without being accused of internalized homophobia or whatever bullshit SJW term of the month is.

The point is - just because you're getting moist over someone on Grindr and see that they say "no asians" and you yourself are asian is no reason to make a huge deal and shit show. Just move on/scroll past/swipe right/and continue with your life.

sugarfame · 5時間前

I don't really care...I think it's pathetic to beg other guys to be attracted to you. If they aren't attracted then amen. It's not that big a deal, I do get that when these white guys say that kind of stuff, it comes off very harsh. Even if it's not a big deal, it just comes off that way.

uprock · 10時間前

[deleted]

dsaitken · 3時間前

Why would someone want to date a fat person?

expremierepage · 3時間前

I pretty much agree with the opinions expressed in this segment on Samanta Allen's article published a while back on the Daily Beast.

This woman's perspective also resonates with me, and she mentions some of the ways the media might play into racial preferences in sexual and romantic attraction.

Basically, people should try to be open-minded, but they really can't be held responsible for their sexual preferences and attractions. In stating preferences, especially in the context of romance, it's always best to focus on what you do like so you're not forcing people to wade through a sea of negativity. And if you do feel the need to list any deal-breakers you might have, there's absolutely no need to be a dickhead about it and write shit like "no rice, no spice, no fats, etc.".

LuisEnRod · 10時間前

It's ok to have preferences, just don't be a cunt about it. Like, I personally don't like Asian people, but I'm not rude about it. If an Asian guy ever messages me, I'd tell him politely that I'm not interested in anything physical.

I think there's also a stigma right now amongst gay guys were you have to act as masculine as possible, or else you're not accepted by others. Interlaized homophobia has gotten way out of hand, like, people won't even talk to you if you're not closeted or "discreet" (hate this term), we're all inside the same big bubble, we should be proud to be gay and unite, not divide ourselves based on physical apperarance. Also, being fat myself, I feel like gay guys lately have been all about working out and getting fit to feel desired I guess. I've never had to work out in order to feel desired by other men.

Anyway, that's how I view the whole issue.

uprock · 9時間前

I'm curious as to Ru's opinion on "blackpeoplemeet" or "Christian Mingle" or any other site that gears towards a specific demographic. These people ain't paying my bills so if you say, "no fats, no fems" on your profile, I'll gladly just block you because I have better things to do than waste my time... or waste time complaining about it.

Would we be more comfortable if people said, "And no disrespect, but if you are overweight or flamboyant, I am not interested." Please. Ain't nobody got time for that.

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