全 112 件のコメント

[–]deaglebro 19ポイント20ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm so proud of them. Congratulations brothers!

[–]johnyann 77ポイント78ポイント  (2子コメント)

Turns out calling people 'racists' and 'bigots' doesn't actually work..

[–]poproverLibertarian Conservative [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Thank god the majority of Brits still have a brain.

[–]neemarita 67ポイント68ポイント  (18子コメント)

My facebook feed is crawling with people screaming about the evil bigots and horrible people who ruined GREAT Britain. Why do the leftists (and to be fair their right wing is our left wing) always act like this? There is no ability to debate; it is my way or the highway, you are wrong, and not only are you wrong, you should probably die.

I can see both sides of the Brexit debate. Why people are freaking out I have no idea. So 51% of your country is made up of knuckle dragging Neanderthals? But they think that way of us conservatives as well...

Just random thoughts here. Maybe I should go to England next year with the exchange rate. My husband and I joked about buying some GBP and saving it til we visit again.

[–]Triforce179 38ポイント39ポイント  (7子コメント)

I think this kind of attitude is what puts me off about politics in general; regardless of political party.

If you win the vote, then its the law of the land; but if you lose, clearly the electorate is misinformed and the system is rigged.

Some people I saw on Reddit who voted stay expressed that despite their side not winning, the results should be respected, but an alarming amount of people on Reddit and Twitter insist that the vote should not count (aka because they didn't get their result), when something like 72% of the voting population, the highest electoral turnout, participated.

Democratic society is supposed to operate of the notion that despite differences in viewpoints, the results are what you move forward with. Nowadays, it seems like your only option is to be victorious, or absolutely demonize your opponents in a desperate attempt to deny defeat.

Writing off half your population as idiots does nothing to foster prosperity, only ignorance.

[–]neemarita 14ポイント15ポイント  (2子コメント)

I agree with everything you said here.

Just because you disagree with a result does not make it valid.

But these people have no concept of a democratic society. It is as they want or else.

ETA: "All because you hate brown people!" and all the people going on about evil racist right-wingers. Wow, they really love their racist narrative.

[–]donvito7335 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

They cling to the racist narrative because it gives them the moral high ground in defeat and victory.

They win: "Yeah take that you monobrow, enlarged forehead savages"

They lose: "I don't want to live on this planet anymore"

[–]64bitHustler [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

In decades to come we will look back at these people calling everything racist with the same absurdity as we now look upon people who called those with scientific knowledge witches.

[–]xray606 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

It all started with Mr. 'Hanging Chad'. Ever since then, it's been a race to the bottom.

[–]TheForged [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Thank you, this is something that's so omnipresent in politics that it's astounding. Sometimes I wish we could just have earnest discussions about policies instead of this name-calling that our politics most of the time degrades to.

[–]dcht [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

I'm sick of how people even in my office are talking like the UK made the wrong decision. Like I can't even have my say because I'll sound like a fucking idiot to them. It's like the norm to them. I sadly have to agree with them or else I'll be shunned.

[–]alexdinhogaucho [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Yup, you can't dare say you're a conservative, or else you're a bigot, xenophobic black people hater...

[–]chakrakhanRonin [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Why do the leftists (and to be fair their right wing is our left wing) always act like this?

I've been giving this some thought as I watched all the rhetoric last night. Even as a former radical leftist, the answer hasn't been clear to me in the past.

I think it boils down the way leftists are primed to think about the world. You believe that oppressive forces control the world. You're a utopian, and you interpret everything through a narrative of victimization. In response to any event, your natural instinct is to create a version of events that reinforces that narrative. Might makes wrong. Any unit of humanity that you could have described as dominant or powerful in recent history is the de facto villain because you can project certain meta-narratives (slavery, segregation, colonialism, imperialism, patriarchy, capitalism, neoliberalism, etc.) on to their role in the event.

Certain entities (America, Western Civilization, conservatives, white people, men) are the most frequent targets of this criticism, and so any time they are involved in an event, even if the so-called "victims" are themselves oppressors (Palestinians, for instance), they must be the bad guy.

This perspective traps the leftist in a pattern of one-step thinking. The reason they think conservatives are racist is because they can project their worldview pattern onto a superficial interpretation of conservative policy. After they've done this, they essentially stop thinking unless they're doing mental work to link this to other examples of "oppression" or further articulate their hegemony conspiracy theory. What they don't do is look at the actual effects of conservative policy.

For example, consider the case of broken-windows policing and stop and frisk. Because the targets are disproportionately black, the leftist has all the evidence they require to demonstrate that something racist is happening. Any other argumentation or evidence thus reinforces racism, and is therefore discarded. Consequently, they ignore the fact that NYC is a safer place for law-abiding black people. This is, in part, why Black Lives Matter fixates over the 100 unarmed black people killed by "racist" police in a year while ignoring the 2,500 black victims murdered by other black people (who should never, under any circumstances, be forced to have a negative interaction with the racist police).

In cases where there's any complexity or ambiguity about the outcome (i.e., Charter Schools), their default interpretation of the outcome is necessarily one that reinforces their favorite meta-narrative mythology (i.e., evil neoliberalism).

tl;dr: leftists have a deeply-rooted, socially-reinforced problem with selection bias.

[–]neemarita [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

That makes hell of a lot of sense.

Thanks everyone. I lurked in this sub for awhile before posting anything. The liberal echo chamber of the Internet galls one after awhile. I have found my people! :)

[–]Roez 4ポイント5ポイント  (2子コメント)

I'm seeing the same thing on Twitter. A lot of sour people making shaming type comments aimed at the uneducated, "who don't get it." The word, "Europhobic" has been tossed around a bit.

The world isn't coming to an end people. There's obviously a lot of very, very unhappy people who don't like how the EU was handling their lives. Naturally though, people not getting their own way is why so many justify letting their preferred politicians lie and doing whatever. Perhaps, if those people pushing for the EU and its policies so hard had listened and been a bit more willing to compromise (aka respect the people who voted leave for example), then this type of vote wouldn't have come about.

[–]JexInfiniteTea Party Conservative 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Most people that I know who were Vote Remain were alarmists about the situation. Only a couple were realistic about the future.

[–]neemarita 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yes, this as well.

One thing I've seen from my British friends are that their worries about benefits like visas, university exchange programs and the like will be severely hampered by this vote.

And that Cameron could hypothetically just say this doesn't count, it's done with, then resign. They're all hoping for this which is hilarious considering they hate him but want him to save their EU-membership!

[–]fuck_sal_hardPool Boy [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

My facebook feed

this is why I refuse to be on FB. I know, I am the only person on the planet with an internet connection who isn't on FB. But the low-intelligence nonsense that seems to pervasive on FB is enough to keep me from joining.

[–]LScottSpencer [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

But, Facebook is basically comprised of your family and friends. So are you saying your family and friends are idiots that don't get it? Sorry, I just don't get how Facebook can possibly be any worse than Twitter or Reddit. It's all in who you choose to follow, friend, or interact with.

You assert that people on Twitter and Reddit are more intelligent than people on Facebook. That's just not the case. Idiots are everywhere. And so are intelligent people.

[–]SideTraKd [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

You aren't alone. I refuse to be on FB too...

[–]scungillipig [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

They act like this because it is their nature.

Why do they act like insane people with the emotional maturity of 9 year olds?

Because they are.

“With reasonable men, I will reason; with humane men I will plead; but to tyrants I will give no quarter, nor waste arguments where they will certainly be lost.”

― William Lloyd Garrison

[–]cactusjack- 31ポイント32ポイント  (0子コメント)

"Rule Britannia, Britannia rule the waves. Britons never, never shall be slaves"

[–]Erundur 42ポイント43ポイント  (30子コメント)

Congratulations to everyone who lives in the UK.

[–]enmunate28 23ポイント24ポイント  (17子コメント)

Except for the scots and the Irish who voted to stay.

We may be witnessing the end of the United Kingdom.

[–]tehForce 7ポイント8ポイント  (3子コメント)

The U.K. has been winding down for some time now.

[–]enmunate28 [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

I wonder if Spain will be next. Spain is basically a union of kingdoms too, much like the UK. Will Belgium split too?

[–]jivatman [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Belgium has Brussels, capital of the E.U. and only a population of 11.2 Million. If they were anywhere near threatening to leave the E.U. would likely basically shower them with cash.

[–]enmunate28 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

No, I'm talking about a nationalist split between the Walloons and the Flemish.

[–]DJWhamoSingle Payer Proponent 5ポイント6ポイント  (4子コメント)

That also depends on what happens to the EU as a result of this. As more pressure is placed on the remaining producing members to prop up those nations in need, and as the threats both within Europe and from without continue to put pressure on them, it might end up looking preferable to stay in the UK.

[–]JexInfiniteTea Party Conservative 10ポイント11ポイント  (3子コメント)

Apparently the Dutch are looking into a referendum as well. The more countries leave the EU the better. If you put immigration as the main issues, you can surely get enough votes to leave.

[–]DJWhamoSingle Payer Proponent 8ポイント9ポイント  (1子コメント)

The right wing in France is pushing for one as well. And apparently the fear of an increasingly powerful Germany within the EU is expected to drive Euroskepticism. The more things change...

[–]StJimmy92 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Pretty sure Italy has a decent amount of people wanting out as well.

[–]sonofsmog [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

The Dutch and the French are out. Book it. The EU is done.

[–]padronrNever Trump 1ポイント2ポイント  (4子コメント)

Whoo!

[–]enmunate28 2ポイント3ポイント  (3子コメント)

Not sure if you're a Scot and hoping to finally be free or if you're an English and happy to rid yourself of the scots.

[–]padronrNever Trump 2ポイント3ポイント  (2子コメント)

American, excited to see the Brits basically forced to participate in true independence, 240 years after we showed them how great of an idea it is. Countries joining world organizations is just a bad idea in general, in my opinion.

[–]NuclearWatchdog [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Normally, countries gain independence FROM Britain. The UK is just kind of what's left of the British Empire, but I see where you're going with the whole independence from the EU thing.

[–]padronrNever Trump [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Yeah its not the same but it has striking similarities. The UK is tired of having their own rules set by other European countries, and I don't blame them. The immigration thing is just one of many issues in this vote.

[–]pipechapLibertarian Conservative 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

That would be a really stupid move if there is a Frexit.

[–]Olipyr [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Why's that?

[–]pipechapLibertarian Conservative [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Let's look at the Scottish referendum results and the reasoning behind it. Best I can tell, they voted to stay part of the UK, largely because they were concerned about their benefits and social welfare they receive from England, mainly.

To leave the UK in favor of joining the EU would more than likely mean attempting to gain that same financial backing should the pound continue to fall.

The Scots and the Irish would be in nearly the same position as the Eastern European countries attempting to join the EU, in desperate need of the financial assistance the EU tends to provide.

The Scots for example have only one growth industry, Scotch whisky. That's not exactly a varied economy, and one that can easily be choked out by an eager, newly liberated nation and government needing to now pay for things it once received money from Westminster to pay for.

Now that the UK no longer provides 20 billion pounds a year to Brussels, they're that much poorer, and if there is a Frexit, the EU loses another one of it's higher GDP nations.

There are several other nations buzzing about exiting, and it appears based on how the British have voted, that the EU is going to come tumbling down.

[–]thatsnotminesir[S] 29ポイント30ポイント  (11子コメント)

Unlike us, they won their independence without ruining any perfectly good tea.

[–]lion27Libertarian Conservative 20ポイント21ポイント  (9子コメント)

Ya gotta crack a couple of eggs to make an omelette, man.

[–]tehForce -4ポイント-3ポイント  (8子コメント)

That historical phrase is always used in such a way to disassociate the fact of a massive slaughter by referring to to the dead human bodies as merely the broken eggs used to make what was a delicacy at the time.

It's a very disturbing quote.

[–]Fr_Time [スコア非表示]  (7子コメント)

Lighten up, Francis.

[–]SideTraKd [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

You made me look to see if his name was actually Francis...

[–]TheDubDubs 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

That tea was tainted with tacks anyway.

[–]MrSparkle86Moderate Conservative 14ポイント15ポイント  (9子コメント)

HA! David Cameron is stepping down! Good riddance. Very proud of our conservative brothers and sisters across the Atlantic.

[–]neemarita 13ポイント14ポイント  (4子コメント)

Did you know Boris Johnson kills puppies and is worse than a Nazi?

That's how my friends are reacting to all this. He's pure evil, guys. As are all conservatives of all stripes across all nations!

[–]MrSparkle86Moderate Conservative 5ポイント6ポイント  (3子コメント)

Liberal smear tactics knows no borders it would seem. I pray for a day when logic dictates our actions instead of emotions.

[–]rambaroo [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

Everybody in Uk politics are liberals. There is no conservative movement in the UK and never will be

[–]cactusjack- [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

UKIP?

[–]rambaroo [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

They are liberal as well. They may be conservative in the UK but in America they would be seen as the loony left worse than Bernie Sanders. They believe in universal healthcare,no guns, pro abortion.

They are also a protest party and their only MP does not listen to the party leadership.

[–]JexInfiniteTea Party Conservative 9ポイント10ポイント  (3子コメント)

I respect the guy immensely, especially with that exit speech. Encouraging the Brits to support the decision, even though Remain lost. Good on him. He's also right to step down, because they need a pro-Brexit leader.

[–]MrSparkle86Moderate Conservative 5ポイント6ポイント  (1子コメント)

I respect that he's stepping down, but I do not respect his ideology.

I don't know... I get annoyed when foreigners start talking shit about American politics, so I'll try to refrain from shitting on other country's politicians.

[–]JexInfiniteTea Party Conservative 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm not a fan of his ideology, but he has definitely taken the country in a positive direction, rather than negative.

[–]CherryCokeNixonBuckleyite Conservative [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Unlike sore loser Obama who blames any losses on "bad messaging" or bigotry

[–]TheAlphaGareBear 18ポイント19ポイント  (0子コメント)

God save the queen, you glorious bastards.

There will be costs to this, but there are always short term costs to get long term benefits.

[–]DJWhamoSingle Payer Proponent 5ポイント6ポイント  (3子コメント)

Now we see what becomes of Scotland. The SNP is more left-leaning than the rest of the UK, won the majority of seats in Parliament last time around, and might see Brexit as a good excuse to hold another referendum.

[–]neemarita 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

They're already talking about it despite having had a referendum in 2014 that was pretty solidly NO.

That would be a very bad thing for Scotland IMO.

[–]LantroProgressive 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

A large sticking point was Scotland being barred entry to the EU by the UK if they elected to leave. Since that's off the table I could easily see them leaving now. Northern Ireland, too.

[–]1707BestYearOfMyLife 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

Thank you!

Over the moon with the result, a victory for conservatism in the UK and Europe as a whole!

[–]bubby963 9ポイント10ポイント  (3子コメント)

My facebook feed is crawling with people screaming about the evil bigots and horrible people who ruined GREAT Britain.

Seriously I've seen awful ones one my facebook all day. Here is the worst.

[–]GodzRebirth 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

The irony of saying "brown people" and calling others xenophobes

[–]neemarita 6ポイント7ポイント  (1子コメント)

Oh good lord, the melodramatics.

Yes, we all hate and fear brown people and want them dead and gone. Where is that coming from? They seriously believe that garbage. Or as my British friends would say - rubbish.

[–]drac07 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

It's what's required to maintain the moral high ground in their eyes. It doesn't really matter what your cause is if you can paint your opponent as an ignorant, hateful racist.

[–]Just_a_prank_bro 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Just in time for the new movie today too!

[–]bernie_is_haram 22ポイント23ポイント  (1子コメント)

This is fantastic. And Obama is also blocked on his immigration bullshit.

Get fucked Obama. Your time's almost up, and you're going out with a whimper like the lecturing weakling you are. Good fucking riddance.

[–]artyfoul 10ポイント11ポイント  (13子コメント)

And RIP the Pound

[–]Anal_Vacuum 9ポイント10ポイント  (4子コメント)

Time to invest in British stock.

[–]enmunate28 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

Not yet. We haven't seen it bottom out yet.

[–]sonofsmog [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

You gotta wait for the margin calls that have to cover.

[–]downsouthcountry -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

British bonds will be great. The market'll be worried about Britain leaving the relative safety of the EU, so there'll be lower bond yields in the short term. Great arbitrage opportunity to short bonds.

[–]sonofeast11 5ポイント6ポイント  (1子コメント)

[–]rambaroo [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Nothing changed it was just speculators selling off that caused the drop

[–]brenap13 10ポイント11ポイント  (3子コメント)

and RIP the Euro

[–]JexInfiniteTea Party Conservative 7ポイント8ポイント  (2子コメント)

The Euro has been terrible for ages, and will continue to depress as the poor economic handling by the EU ruins more countries.

[–]CuntyMcFagNuts69 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Seriously, I lived in NZ for a few years and remember walking by the Exchange Rate boards at banks and seeing the euro at like $1.75

[–]jivatman [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Hah, well there's a reason the Dollar has been solid for fucking ages now. It's a country with a fairly strong sense of nationalism and a really strong military. Both things the Euro lacks.

[–]thatsnotminesir[S] 11ポイント12ポイント  (1子コメント)

They are ripping a piece of duct tape off their arm. Some short term pain for a long term improvement.

[–]jivatman [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

That is how I view it... Britain has spent a long time basically half-in. Domestically railing against the EU, and blocking a lot of things the EU was trying to do.

My general philosophy is I think half-assing things is worse than choosing one way or other other, fully in or fully out...

A good example of this is how the WWI peace was concluded. France and to a slightly lesser extent Britain wanted to effectively carve up Germany and turn them into a colony. President Wilson on the other hand wanted a fully conciliatory peace arrangement that didn't assign and blame to Germany or punish them. In the end the agreement succeeded in blaming and punishing Germany but giving them enough independence to rise again, resulting in the Nazis.

[–]poppingfresh 2ポイント3ポイント  (5子コメント)

Does anyone have any info or material on the UK leaving the EU, like why they are and what could possibly happen? I haven't really followed it so I don't know what's going on.

[–]storminnormies 11ポイント12ポイント  (1子コメント)

You know how Washington is an impenetrable bureaucracy that hates average Americans and wishes they would all die? The EU is like that but the bureaucracy is even less accountable because it's run by foreigners.

[–]Spayed-And-Neutered 11ポイント12ポイント  (0子コメント)

Just imagine if Mexico had a say in US law. That's the EU wrt the UK.

[–]cactusjack- 8ポイント9ポイント  (1子コメント)

Here's a couple of links as to why this is a good thing:

http://campaignforanindependentbritain.org.uk/the-economy/

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/436853/brexit-vote-restore-british-democracy-vote-leave

Leftists are screaming that the leave campaign is nothing but racism against immigrants, but this is nonsense. The EU is a corrupt organization run by bureaucrats that answer to no one but themselves and policy decisions are made that often go against the better interests of members like the UK. The sovereignty of the members of the EU is often sacrificed at the altar of globalism and pan-European nonsense.

I don't know what will happen now but I'll say this: all the scare-mongering about the economy needs to stop, things will work themselves out like they always have. The EU is a very recent experiment, a return to the not-very-old ways is not going to crash the global economy.

[–]poppingfresh 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Will read this once I get the chance, thank you

[–]dumpydouche [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

From what I gather, it's like Canada demanding how many Mexicans you must take in and able to override the Supreme Court.

[–]TheOutlawJoseyWales1Make My Day 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Extremely happy for the people in the UK! I've heard speculation France and The Netherlands may be next, we shall see. One question though, what happens when these countries withdraw from the EU currency wise? Surely they will drop the Euro, and transition back to their own currencies? But their markets are going to take a hit because speculation? I'm just confused how the financials of this whole deal are going to play out and wether it is possible to withdraw without serious financial ramifications.

[–]Causedtheflames 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

No, I want France to stay with the sinking ship. I hope they go under.

[–]dafowler88 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Anyone think the Danes will be next?

[–]_SimpleJack_ [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

In Brazil the Left-Wing Press is calling Nigel Farage "EUROFOBIC"


the Headline is

Eurofobic Leader, Nigel Farage votes for exit of EU in referendum.

original "Líder eurofóbico, Nigel Farage vota em referendo pela saída da UE"

[–]chisau -3ポイント-2ポイント  (3子コメント)

I can't help but wonder if this could lead to a civil war type of situation. Think about some of the commonalities. A member state just declared they are leaving a voluntary union.

[–]fuck_sal_hardPool Boy [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

No, it won't lead to a civil war. The UK was only the UK before they were also part of the EU. All member nations reserve the right to leave the EU.

[–]chisau [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Its just such an interesting parallel to the US civil war, where those states too entered a union voluntarily and desired to simply leave (but were not allowed to in the end)

[–]jivatman [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

The Civil War was also preceded by 'Bleeding Kansas' where pro- and anti- slavery militias flooded into the state from the North and South in attempt to sway whether or not it chose to be a Slave or Free state.

I think one of the reasons the war happened because the Northerners were so ideologically invested in anti-Slavery and couldn't countenance having a Slave country on their borders. Plus the South was a much more central part of U.S. national identity than the U.K. is to Europe, so losing it would feel as a more terrible loss than this.