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Does no one here rate Lingard? (self.reddevils)

DelaRoadSchweinsteiger が 投稿

Seems to be the type of player Mourinho would like: a fast, hard-working guy who can play a number of positions. If we get Embolo, I could see Lingard starting the tougher games against big sides and Breel coming in to face the smaller teams.

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[–]Easily_BakedRonaldo 38ポイント39ポイント  (5子コメント)

I rate Lingard as a good squad player, not as a Manchester United starting RW.

[–]TheJoshider10De Gea 3ポイント4ポイント  (3子コメント)

See if he bothered learning how to finish it would potentially be a different story. Right now though he spends too much time wasting game changing chances that it's not really worth having him start. He makes solid runs but if you're not gonna finish them off then what's the fucking point?

He's had some good games and helped us win the FA Cup so fair play, but he should be starting to show his quality with his age and yet he's still making youth player mistakes. I don't care if this is his first year in the first team, these mistakes are incredibly basic. If he doesn't sort his shit out, Mourinho will rightfully get rid of him.

[–]GourangaPlusPlusPartial to Martial 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

Mourinho does like a squad player with a good workrate

[–]TheJoshider10De Gea 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

True, at the same time though if better is available he'd go for it. Lingard has to prove he's more than just a squad player who runs around a lot.

[–]GourangaPlusPlusPartial to Martial 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I mean obviously he'd go for a better player if one became available, that's football.

[–]bonorcrown 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I agree, but I'm not going to write him off until I've seen how he fares under Mourinho.

[–]labtecozaRonaldo 7ポイント8ポイント  (0子コメント)

He's not good enough for United imo. Good player but not what we should have on the right wing. Useful to have and will always put a shift in

[–]ampx61250 million, down the drain 14ポイント15ポイント  (9子コメント)

I like Lingard, especially after the fa cup final, but I do feel that we need a much better creative force down the right wing. He's a hard worker, but if we want to really push on as a team and challenge for titles regularly again, win the champions league etc then I think we need more than just hard work, we need players who can create something out of nothing, and I just don't feel like Lingard is that player. Definitely wouldn't sell him though, it's great to have a local lad who has come through the ranks around the team as a squad player, but for me, he's not a first team player

[–]ThadderfulRooney 5ポイント6ポイント  (4子コメント)

challenge for titles regularly again, win the champions league etc

Exactly this.

Look at the lineups for teams that have won the Champions League in recent years. The question is not 'Would Lingard start?' or 'Would he make the bench?' but 'Would he even make the squad?'.

We currently have no outfield player in the top tier or even close to it, and because RW is our weakest option it is most obvious there. Lingard is decent for backup at best but look where the top tier of players were at 23 - absolutely worlds apart imo.

[–]PM_Me_Your_StarBurnsBlind 0ポイント1ポイント  (3子コメント)

I think someone with his talent would be on the bench in a champions league winning team.

Take our team from 2008, it was fantastic wasn't it? But in our squad we still had Shawcross, Simpson, Possebon, Bardsley, I think even that Lee Martin was still here and don't forget we had Darren Gibson who actually played a lot of games for us.

I think Lingard is better than all of those.

If you discount our squad as Fergie magic then we could look at 2012 Chelsea, they had Turnbull as second keeper I think, and players like Sam Hutchinson and Bosingwa making the bench and sub appearances.

Lingard is a good squad player and has a good chance to get a lot better.

[–]ThadderfulRooney 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

Most of those players are defenders/maybe defensive midfielders - top teams rarely rotate defences or keepers, especially if they are CL winning quality.

I should have specified that by recent years I was talking mainly about the last 4/5 years of Bayern/Barca/Real squads in terms of their attacking players.

P.S. Turnbull, really? How many appearances did he get that season lol -plus pretty sure he was third choice but there was an injury somewhere between him and the first spot wasn't there?

[–]PM_Me_Your_StarBurnsBlind 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Okay fair enough with defenders and goalie's, you're right with the Chelsea squad (oh and just looked it up, you might be right with Turnbull, they had that Hilario there so was he second?) But with the United squad we had players like Manucho and Gibson and they were basically attackers.

I had to look up these but Bayern has Emre Can and Shaquiri both accumulating quite a lot of minutes in the 2013 win. On top of that they had IMO an average Tymoshchuk making a lot of appearances and an average Tom Weiser warming the bench.

I don't think that a player on par with Lingard would look out of place making 15 appearances. He'd probably look better due to the increase in quality around him.

[–]ThadderfulRooney 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

True, he would probably have a part to play in facilitating the rest of the team to win a CL. No way he starts a CL final, he would take pressure off the team when a run of games is thick and fast in the league and domestic cups.

[–]OmomooDe Gea 8ポイント9ポイント  (3子コメント)

we need players who can create something out of nothing, and I just don't feel like Lingard is that player.

He's already done it twice when everyone in the squad was struggling in the LVG regime. Once in the draw with Chelsea, which would have been a loss had it not been for his superb volley, and again with the winning goal at the FA Cup final.

Yes, he's not the best of his position or the sort of creative wide midfielder we crave for, but that really means little at this stage. He may be 23 but people forget he is doing all of this in his first full season of PL football. If he was 18 or 19, people would have been raving about him as much as Rashford.

All I can say is, don't rule him out of anything at this stage. Keep him in the squad, and if he exceeds expectations, he should get a shot in the first team as he did this season. Otherwise, he will still be a very useful squad player. Doesn't hurt either way for United.

[–]Isserley_ 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

He's already done it twice when everyone in the squad was struggling in the LVG regime.

Twice. We need someone who can create something out of nothing more than twice a season. Look at how much threat Martial poses on the left flank every game. We need to emulate that on the right.

I love Lingard, but if we want to be world beaters again, we should look to upgrade our RW starter. Lingard will be a great squad option.

[–]Rolling_TomassiShaw 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't think people would be raving about him as much as Rashford if he was 18 - he simply hasn't been as good as Rashford this season - even if we take ages out of the equation.

[–]TudoorsScholes 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think his best position is as an attacking midfielder. That's where he played his entire youth career.

He also scored that great shot outside of the box, he's a big game player. I want to see him given a chance next season, I really do.

Remember, he would have most likely been a mainstay 2 years ago as well but he got injured in the season opener.

[–]sartschMcNair 2ポイント3ポイント  (3子コメント)

In my opinion, Lingard is a good squad player, as were, for instance, Henning Berg, Quinton Fortune or Park Ji-Sung. But he shouldn't be first choice for his position.

I think, he's great to come in and bring fresh incentive to our attack, or to play when the fixtures are piling up. However, I don't think he has the quality to carry the burden of being first-choice. But he is a sound lad and breathes United.

(And OT but just for the record, I loved Park Ji-Sung to bits and still have a soft spot for the wee Korean)

[–]berzerkerzCarrick 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Little harsh on Park who was considered a big game player by any metric. Far more talented than anyone else you listed.

[–]sartschMcNair 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

I totally agree that he was immensely talented and a great big-game player. However, he never had a first-team berth down and was rather used in rotation.

Perhaps I should have added in Blomqvist (even though he only played one season for us) and Nicky Butt.

[–]wakey87433Mata 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

In a Jose team though he is a million times more a starter than some of the RW we have been linked to or people want. If it was Spain maybe Jose would go with two creative attacking wingers but he has never done that in the PL (or in Italy either) so he is likely to favour a defensive winger. Building a winning team isn't about getting a group of gallaticos together as such teams often fail to meet their potential and get beaten by teams with a mix of players reputation levels that is balanced and works perfectly as a unit. It's what Fergie succeeded with in his time, we rarely had a team anywhere close to being the best players in each position in the league let alone across Europe or the World but we were able to compete and win against teams that seemingly on paper had a better overall set of players

[–]craigybachaManchester United 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Not really. He's good rotation, but you look at his goals and assists and he doesn't do enough with his final product.

[–]tallmotherfuckerShaw 3ポイント4ポイント  (8子コメント)

Here's a hypothetical: if memphis was a right sided player, would he have been starting over Lingard (ignoring Mata as an option here)?

I'm just putting it out there, not stating whose better

[–]BallsX 1ポイント2ポイント  (5子コメント)

Very good question. I'd be inclined to say no if the only difference was his position. To be honest, it could really go either way. There was no way Memphis was going to start over Martial last season. And its unfortunate for Memphis that Martial was our best attacking player. Lingard had the right attitude to fit what LVG wanted.

Its a really good question mate.

[–]tallmotherfuckerShaw 2ポイント3ポイント  (4子コメント)

What do you think about Mou playing memphis at rw?

If only we could combine Lingard and Memphis, we'd have a Willian sort of player!

[–]BallsX 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

I'm actually for it because that LW spot is fully Martials and I don't see Memphis getting game time there unless Martial is not available or if its a relatively less important game.

I'm hoping that Memphis will be able to adapt to playing on the RW.

[–]TrickyxoneCoppell 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

I'm not writing Memphis off but why the hell should he start over Lingard, Lingard has more goals and the same assists in roughly the same amount of minutes and works a hell of a lot harder defensively, they're both in their first season in the Epl. Fair enough he's a year older but against that Memphis has international and top league experience. If we are giving players time to develop then Lingard deserves it as much as Memphis.

[–]danskzwag 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Memphis has a lot more potential , and looks a lot more talented

[–]wakey87433Mata 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

No. Jose has only played with two attacking wingers when at Real and that's because the play style of the league and the level of opposition allowed him to commit an extra attacking player. Every other time he played with an attacking winger and a hardworking winger who puts in a good defensive shift so there is no way we are going with Martial on one wing and Memphis the other. Unless we buy someone lie, Willian it's going to be Lingard/Valencia/Young taking up the defensive winger slot menaing Memphis will be battling it out for the attacking winger spot

[–]berzerkerzCarrick 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Lingard lacked end product but generally offered half decent vertical play. Memphis only offered losing the ball,

[–]tallmotherfuckerShaw 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Man there was a run of 2 or 3 games when Lingard missed some crucial chances.. I remember them hitting the post or going real close, i feel for the guy but he came into his own and i think he deserves a decent shot at rw

[–]lilpeleMartial 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

As a squad player he's about as good as you can get. He's not spectacular but he puts in a shift and had the technical ability to play the top level and seems pretty level headed.

[–]mufcirclejerk 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

He's a good player. Hope he continues to get a chance around the first team.

[–]tgmgg 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

He's good enough to be a squad player. I could see Jose bringing him on late a game to stretch the opposite defence and track back of we are trying to close out a game and there isn't much creative work needed.

[–]srbstevey 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Damn I must be the only one to rate him. Every somewhat positive comment about him gets down voted. I had my reservations on him untill I saw at least 10 games. I agree with people he isnt as talented as some wingers you would call world class, he dosent have the raw skill but he will beat the man his own way just like Young. I know last season i would of rather seen Young in the team than Di Maria. Also for someone who gets ripped about his finishing he has a handfull of decent goals this season ( Fa cup, Chelsea, Wes Brom, Newcastle). He does go missing sometimes which I did notice, but after being put in the number 10 spot by Lvg against city and couple other games after he proved to me he has something in him! Also 23 is still young, specially if you were injured and in the championship and youth team up to that point.

[–]Rylingo 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

A good squad player who tries his best and fights for the team. We need a world class right winger still but Lingard should be the backup for that position, not Mata.

Our treble team had Greening as a backup. Lingard will be more useful.

[–]testbug0what's the Mata? 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Our treble team had Greening as a backup.

Yeah, thankfully he never started a single game.

[–]aspiretobewiseCarrick 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

I really think with regards to Lingard many fans don't rate him because he's an academy player and unless the fanbase is being sold fantastical accounts of a player's escapades abroad, they'll overlook the possibility that an academy player can be a world beater talent (i.e. Pogba being the prime example).

tl;dr our fans don't rate Lingard because they love being wined and dined as opposed to eating a home-cooked meal IMO

[–]testbug0what's the Mata? 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Then why do people rate Rashford? Or any of our previous successful youth products?

[–]PlugpinSolskjaer 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Jose likes his players to put in a defensive shift when the match demands it. Can't say I remember Lingard doing that a whole lot but in all fairness I didn't watch many of our matches due other other commitments/I fell asleep through boredom lol.

I'd love to see him play and I was made up that he got his chance last season but I just don't know under new management.

[–]hkoesnadieRashford 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yes i do rate him. The only player seems to be playing the 'United' way.

[–]monsterm1dget -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

He reminds me of Young a lot, a classic winger. He'll come good, and I have high hopes for him. It's the kind of player to balance with a more spectactular LW.

That said, I'd like to see Memphis being tried there. The right wing has the best defender of the pair of starting fullbacks (Darmian) so there is a lot to be experimented with that.-

[–]danskzwag -1ポイント0ポイント  (6子コメント)

He's better than Young was 2 seasons ago

[–]jsmhe 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

No way. Young was better IMO

[–]jsmhe 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

No way. Young was better IMO

[–]danskzwag 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Youngs end product is non existent he has only hit double figures in goals and assists once in his career , and that was at Villa people over rated him because he runs around a lot and grabs the Utd badge .

[–]berzerkerzCarrick 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Hey bro, I know we go at it here and there but can you use some punctuation for once?

[–]berzerkerzCarrick 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Young was routinely getting by multiple defenders and swinging in dangerous crosses. End product is the precise problem with Lingard...

[–]danskzwag 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

How many goals and assists did he have that season ? He only had a few games where his crosses were useful

[–]Trigg82 -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

I do rate him but he can be really wasteful in the final third. Frustrsringly do. But he does have good pace and technical ability and he's quite a clever player with his movement.

Not sure he's a winger if I'm honest but he's a good player to have in a squad as he can play multiple positions.

If there's a chance to get an upgrade for the right side then I'm all for it though.

[–]BallsX -1ポイント0ポイント  (2子コメント)

I've posted this about Lingard a few times. I like him, I think he offers pace and pressure down the wings which we don't get from Mata and seeing that Valencia is now a full time right back/wing back, we don't really have any other direct players on the right wing.

He's probably not one we should be relying on as a first team starter but I'd like to have him as a sub or a role player. He will get plenty of playing time and can rotate over the season.

His shooting isn't the best but I like his pace with the ball. He always seems to be in great positions too only to be let down by his finishing.

[–]CarbonSoloTony Martial -1ポイント0ポイント  (1子コメント)

Can he be the rw we need If his finishing improves ?

[–]BallsX 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Finishing and passing vision I'd say. I don't expect every winger to be able to dribble like Martial so Lingard just needs a little more in his arsenal to stand out and be the first choice.

[–]jsmhe -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't rate him at the moment. But he has a brain to be a proper footballer. So given that he's a player with pace he can still improve his ability to be useful for our club.

[–]testbug0what's the Mata? -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

Years from now, we'll be looking back in amazement that Lingard was a regular starter for us.