上位 200 件のコメント表示する 500

[–]xgenoriginal 412ポイント413ポイント  (100子コメント)

If your issue is not being able to play on the main stage like the "male" teams, then join the main tournament; no one is stopping you.

If you have a problem with the female tournament prize pot being lower than the main tournament, then join the main tournament; (again) no one is stopping you.

There is the growing misconception that CS is divided by gender. Tournaments are not divided by male and female, and they have never been. In fact, females are given the privilege to choose which of the two tournaments they would rather participate in (double-standard? I think so). Guess which option of the two is traditionally favored...

The documentary claims they want equality, claims they want to compete with everyone else just like everyone else, yet these female players choose to separate themselves from the scene by playing on female teams in female tournaments over open tournaments/leagues.

For what reasons? One excuse is that female players and teams need a sanctuary that keeps them away from harassment and sexist behavior, yet internet prejudices have no boundaries regarding race, sex, skill, or sexual orientation.

Others claim that hosting these female tournaments are to increase the female demographic of the game. Whether the game is 90% male or 10% female, or 50% male and 50% female, balanced demographics does not necessarily mean equality or lead to Equal Treatment because you are trying to increase the # of females for its sake rather than solving the real issues at hand. Stats are just a number, the people themselves (male & especially female) are the problem here.

Since 2003, ESWC has been hosting female tournaments, and in those 11 years, nothing has changed. Viewers still see several of the same faces STILL competing in these tournaments year after year, and the vast majority of female players begin and end their career in these tournaments. When will it ever lead to integration? Female tournaments are not the answer, and it is the female players attitudes that must change. They are the ones that decide whether they want to play in the same leagues and tournaments as everyone else, and they are the ones that decide how much effort they truly want to invest in the game; (again) no one is stopping them.

Why is the legitimacy of female esports always being questioned? It's because female tournaments employ gender, rather than skill, as a prerequisite for participation. When you bar entry to males in a male-dominated competitive scene, the legitimacy of competition within the female scene has a right to be questioned (just as an amateur league would, or even a local tournament simply because they do not feature the top-ranked competitors). Until players within the female scene prove otherwise, their skill (just like any player in the scene who is new or has yet to prove themselves) will always be questioned.

There also seems to be a growing trend that closely resembles affirmative action, and it involves inviting female teams to play in tournaments of high stature (such as Hitbox Arena Championship and Fragbite Masters), rather than letting them qualify on their own accord. Do not buy into whatever “altruistic” reasons the tournament organizers use to justify this action (e.g. to integrate the “male” and female scene)—it’s all a marketing ploy. Why should it take an invite to get a female team competing against other non-female teams in leagues and tournaments? It shouldn't. The female players themselves are responsible for what tournaments/leagues they choose to sign up or qualify for, and if they deserve a spot or a title, they will earn it just like any other team would and has done in the past. This only serves as a slap in the face to other teams who have put in the effort and would have qualified over the invited female teams, but weren’t simply because they were male.

I'll end with this,

If you are a female player that is looking for a pat on the back for your efforts (despite not being able to compete among the best), then female tournaments are for you. If your only goal is to have fun and play with other girls, then by all means have fun. However, do not expect any real respect in the competitive scene because you are segregating yourself from the main competitive community.

If you are a female player that takes criticism and failure appropriately, will continue to be motivated to play in open leagues/tournaments to gain the necessary experiences (despite not winning, or receiving prize money initially because your rather not take the easy route and exploit your gender), and genuinely wants to be the best among the best at all costs, then carry on in your efforts, because that attitude will make you a better player than any female tournament could ever produce.

masq an ex female csgo player who played in co-ed teams source http://www.hltv.org/news/13657-equal-gaming-documentary-out#r6854639

[–]Insanity601 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

See now that's the shit feminism needs. Strong women standing for true equality.

[–]IAmNotOnRedditAtWork 67ポイント68ポイント  (24子コメント)

masq an ex female csgo player

ex-female, or ex-csgo player? Might want to change the wording around a bit.

[–]Purchasers 41ポイント42ポイント  (12子コメント)

he just meant that came from an ex csgo player, who was a woman. he didnt word it that way because there was no reason to

ex female csgo player makes perfect sense

[–]mormotomyia 26ポイント27ポイント  (6子コメント)

who was a woman.

hopefully still is. (I mean alive)

[–]Draddock 12ポイント13ポイント  (0子コメント)

Would make more sense to say
female ex csgo player

[–]dovahart 5ポイント6ポイント  (2子コメント)

It's ex (female pro csgo player), meaning she's not a female pro csgo player, not an (ex female) csgo player meaning: no longer female but still in the scene

Female (ex pro csgo player) also makes sense, since the thing that didn't change was her game status, not her gender/sex, but sounds dumber

[–]MolitoGamingNate Dogg King of Hooks 44ポイント45ポイント  (6子コメント)

When I first watched cloud nine play back in the day I thought sneaky was a girl...

[–]VaIentine13th 17ポイント18ポイント  (0子コメント)

And then you heard his voice. Sneakygasm

[–]IAmNotOnRedditAtWork 7ポイント8ポイント  (3子コメント)

-__-

MFW I just found out Sneaky isn't a girl.

[–]1052941 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well, Sneaky was the first girl in LCS

[–]Quint-VPraise our KR overlords 86ポイント87ポイント  (68子コメント)

Just take the Dark Souls approach - git gud.

Who do we care about? The players we already know are good at the game. Few people appreciate bad players. Gender has nothing to do with the fact. Skill is the primary requirement for women to make it into esports, but as long as they don't invest as much as men, to expect the same rewards is absolute idiocy.

You reap what you sow. And female players generally just don't sow that much, and that's not a problem! They don't want to, then let them. Just remember - it's their problem, nobody else's.

[–]LadyofRivendell 27ポイント28ポイント  (55子コメント)

Seriously.

As a female, I've never viewed the state of pro players as sexist. The majority of challenger and masters players are male, that's just a fact. And pro teams don't recruit anyone below that anymore.

As for why most high elo players are male, I'm not entirely sure. I know ALL of my female friends have quit playing League, but honestly, it was because they sucked but didn't have the motivation to get better. This doesn't apply to all females, of course, I still play and would play a lot more if not for wrist issues. I know at least one of my friends quit due to harassment (for being a female, not for being bad). People discuss toxicity all the time, but I don't think people understand just how bad it gets when somebody discovers you're a woman. And pro players would get this treatment tenfold (I know Remilia was a bit melodramatic but you can still see all the crap she put up with from the sexist part of the community).

So yeah those are the two problems I see here. Lack of females with challenger skills, and toxicity threatening those that do try to make it.

[–]The_Great_Leon 13ポイント14ポイント  (28子コメント)

(for being a female, not for being bad).

How did people know your friend was a female? I have a friend with Princess in her name and have played 50 some games with her and never seen her get harassed, though admittedly a small and anecdotal sample I just haven't seen it

[–]LadyofRivendell 10ポイント11ポイント  (11子コメント)

I forget her name, but it was something pretty obviously female, and when asked, she would confirm. She's a bit... Naive, in that she didn't expect what would happen once she confirmed it. She loved all the positive attention, constant friend requests, etc, but in the end the negative attention outweighed that for her. I don't mean to victim blame at all, but she made it very easy to figure out she was female.

I had a blatantly female username a bit ago (the name of a somewhat obscure character from Guild Wars 2), and I had to change it after a few weeks just because I was sick of being treated so blatantly different. It's good to hear that my experiences aren't universal, though.

It's a sucky world when you have to hide your gender on a game in order to be treated fairly.

[–]Powerofboners 2ポイント3ポイント  (7子コメント)

Well that's the pretty immature community of LoL, most of these guys playing are probably mid teens with very little real world interaction with females hence the harassment which is a sad state of affairs

[–]LadyofRivendell 1ポイント2ポイント  (5子コメント)

Yeah, League is the only online game that I've received harassment on for being female. I freely use voice chat on other online games with no problems, and aside from the occasional "Not sure if girl or 12 year old boy" jokes, I haven't been treated any worse. League really is a cesspool for toxicity of all kinds.

[–]danzey12http://euw.op.gg/summoner/userName=tasteryi 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

I mean that's just not true, you're using anecdotal evidence to support this, this argument comes up for literally every community, my brother talks about how toxic people are in CSGO all the time, it happens in Dota it happens everwhere, I dunno, it's being matched with randoms that does it.

[–]adeliepingu 6ポイント7ポイント  (15子コメント)

For me, usually people only find out if one of my friends slips up and calls me by my name or uses female pronouns for me. Since we play as five-stacks fairly often, people often forget to be careful about these things.

Usually it's fine and people just ignore things. Sometimes I get people who are like, 'oh a grill' but don't really care about it. But I'd say about 10-20% of the time I get some really mean comments about being female. Worst one is probably the guy who went on a tirade about how I'm living proof girls shouldn't play video games and that I was a whore for getting carried by a guy. I was playing ARAM and we were all feeding about equally. :<

It's kind of an annoying issue, though. I shouldn't have to pretend to be a guy to avoid gender-based harassment, especially when part of the problem is that there's a 'gamer grill' stereotype based on attention-seeking girls, and those of us who don't fit that stereotype often hide our gender to avoid it - so that stereotype is perpetuated ad infinitum.

[–]Steakosaurus 13ポイント14ポイント  (7子コメント)

I shouldn't have to pretend to be a guy to avoid gender-based harassment

This is the take away point. Too many people use the "well how did they know you were a girl?" defense when it comes to gender based harassment, in a weird victim blaming kind of way. It doesn't matter how the scenario came to be, it matters that it shouldn't be a problem in the first place.

[–]areolaisland 3ポイント4ポイント  (6子コメント)

Well, there's getting really good at the game and then there's being a personality.

While I don't really find his stuff entertaining, people don't watch Sky for his quality gameplay. Good on him to take a gimmick (the black and gay shtick he started with) and build a brand off of it. Whatever he decides to do from there, he already has the following.

[–]IJUSTWANTOASKU 7ポイント8ポイント  (0子コメント)

you dont get in esports with your personality, atleast not as a pro-player

[–]arkaodubz 0ポイント1ポイント  (3子コメント)

YouTube =\= esports

[–]areolaisland 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

The topic is about professional gaming. Since popular youtubers/twitch streamers/etc... play video games as their living, I would concede that they are professional gamers.

[–]Slanerislana [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I know your terminology here is technically correct but in this context I'd put them in the "entertainers" category.

Professional gamers in this context are there purely because they are the best of the best at the game.

[–]Diabols 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well, there's getting really good at the game and then there's being a personality.

In other words, there's being a pro player and then there's being a youtuber.

[–]binarysteen 149ポイント150ポイント  (104子コメント)

I can't find the source of this quote in that post, but it doesn't sound like it's saying that this particular team is that admirably talented team. Just that they're participating in this uphill battle to get more talented women involved and visible in esports.

I feel like people are taking this team the wrong way, like they're legit trying to become a viable competitive team. But the midlaner for the team commented herself:

We are just 5 Girls who are playing and having fun and trying to get better at League. So also a lot of people shitting on us cuz we are only Plat and Diamond Players, but hey who cares?

They're having a good time and try-harding while simultaneously increasing the visibility of women in esports. They don't give a shit whether they're considered good.

If more women are visible, more women will see pro esports as a viable path in life and strive to compete at a higher level. That includes mixed teams. Women shouldn't get a pass in esports, but in order to get women playing at that level there has to be a visible community of female players.

Maybe I'm just taking the quote out of context and am completely wrong but I really don't think it's meant to say that this team is THE team.

[–]one201 87ポイント88ポイント  (17子コメント)

There's nothing wrong with friends just playing the game and having fun and improving. The reason people don't like them is because theyre garbage at the game (which there's nothing wrong with) but they got sponsored for no other reason than their gender.

[–]TangerineWaves 70ポイント71ポイント  (10子コメント)

Sponsors don't sponsor teams based on their skills. They sponsor teams based on their ability to draw attention. I don't really see a problem with that.

It's not like they're giving these teams boatloads of money. Otherwise, they'd be sponsoring LCS teams instead. It's probably just a token amount to get their brand out and generate some buzz. And in the case of YP, they can't sponsor LCS teams anyway, because of Riot rules.

[–]pepperpete 4ポイント5ポイント  (1子コメント)

Giants has been garbage since I can remember and they kept getting sponsored.

[–]MORE_LIKE_DYNAMICPOO 21ポイント22ポイント  (1子コメント)

The reason people don't like them is because theyre garbage at the game (which there's nothing wrong with) but they got sponsored for no other reason than their gender.

Gotta sell those pink headsets.

[–]neenerpants 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

David Beckham made more money from sponsorship than he ever did from football. It happens, get over it.

[–]Freeezs 10ポイント11ポイント  (0子コメント)

Respect to the people that read everything

[–]Whiztle 36ポイント37ポイント  (14子コメント)

I don't think people are pissed at the girls. but the fact that sponsors are putting the spotlight at plat players just because these plat players are girls.

What this does is that we now have a situation where a boy can have strived to get to plat but gets no spotlight for it. While his female friend suddenly is news material for having achieved just the same as the boy did.

[–]OrderlyAnarchist 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think this situation is a bit more complex given that their sponsor can't actually sponsor teams at a Riot endorsed event. Given that, it makes sense that in sponsoring a low level team they'd aim for the one that should draw the most attention. I understand the frustration from a lot of the people comment, but I do think a lot of people ARE getting angry at the players when it's not necessarily their fault. Can you blame them for turning down a sponsorship offer when it came? Because I'm pretty sure most people wouldn't. I think the whole issue is just turning nastier than it should be since people aren't necessarily sure who to blame and so they target the obvious and visible characters rather than the sponsor officials who are hidden behind the scenes.

[–]Mental_piggie 15ポイント16ポイント  (15子コメント)

I'm all good with a full female team getting into pro esports in fact i would love for that to happen and would love mixed teams even more, but the same way other teams enter, trough placements and winning.

I personally think the respect for these kinds of teams would dramatically increase if they actually consisted of players that play at the highest level (challenger, masters) and if they actually play well and don't get ridiculously stomped every time.

I also think the pro environment isn't a place for your team "just to have fun and get better at the game" you have to actually go for the win thats why it's the pro environment.

rn, they're just getting money and sponsorships and all these cool deals/things because of their gender and thats not the way to promote it.

edit: i really tried to NOT(*holy shit that must've looked bad lmao) sound sexist anywhere in this comment because im not but thats just how i view things, its a touchy subject.

[–]Hitsuyaga 13ポイント14ポイント  (13子コメント)

We are SIREN

[–]darkclaw6722DARDOCH HYPE 0ポイント1ポイント  (3子コメント)

Siren was pretty different. They actually thought they were going to beat top teams.

[–]GoDyrusGo 39ポイント40ポイント  (2子コメント)

Lol no they didn't. They knew their elo level, they were friends with pro players and knew the elos of pro players, so they knew they had no chance against the real pros. Their elos were highly similar to the team now; there are no delusions you can beat someone 500 elo ahead of you.

It's just their announcement trailer, whoever was behind the team itself, tried to market them as a competitive threat. It was a PR move to generate hype and poorly chosen, and it didn't have anything to do with the players.

[–]randomletters7396 14ポイント15ポイント  (1子コメント)

Either way, that video was hilarious

[–]zunawhyyoudothis 12ポイント13ポイント  (0子コメント)

I will bait and outsmart you. I miss spamming that in my games, pure tilt material.

[–]Krippaify 12ポイント13ポイント  (4子コメント)

Noone will take them seriously if they are a all-female team with YouPorn as their sponsor. Like thats just made to be taken non-seriously.

This feels just like Team Siren all over again. An all-female team who are just getting attention because of their gender. They are getting sponsors just because of their gender. They are playing the gender card even though it shouldn't be played at all.

Me and some of my friends got to Diamond with our team (when 5v5 ranked was a thing), why aren't we sponsored by a huge company and reaching the hot-page on one of the biggest subreddits? Because we are the wrong gender...

[–]KING_5HARK 1ポイント2ポイント  (3子コメント)

with YouPorn as their sponsor

seriously?

[–]Krippaify 2ポイント3ポイント  (2子コメント)

Yup, they are even called TeamYP. Which stands for TeamYouPorn i guess

[–]KING_5HARK 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Well thats just asking to not be considered serious then...

[–]InvisibleufoWhere is my reward 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

yea. even if Team YP was actually full of good players, they still cant get to CS or LCS because it YP violates the riot's rules.

[–]ZoomyZebra 6ポイント7ポイント  (1子コメント)

They're having a good time and try-harding while simultaneously increasing the visibility of women in esports.

That's fine but it's not really any different to playing 5-man ranked queues. It's hard to say things like "women will see pro esports as a viable path in life" when these players are only somewhat better than the average ranked player.

[–]TotolLies 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

If more women are visible, more women will see pro esports as a viable path in life and strive to compete at a higher level. That includes mixed teams. Women shouldn't get a pass in esports, but in order to get women playing at that level there has to be a visible community of female players.

The only thing that I see this team promoting is "hey you can achieve more in esports by being a woman than the sap who didn't go pro with 200 days played". Get women who are a serious threat to challenger teams and then they'll earn my respect. I can understand the visibility argument but when the only people who are visible are degenerates who get sponsored because of their genitals, then that does more harm than good.

[–]mumubleg 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't think sucking at the game will help the image of women in this industry......it just seems that they need atention......welp w/e i dom't csre who plays as long ss it's a nice match.

[–]Vonspacker 3ポイント4ポイント  (24子コメント)

I never understood this whole idea of "If I see people of my own gender doing something it validates it as a life choice for other people of my gender".

Going from the BBC article from 2012 on the percentage of females in different fields of work and more specifically the table they attached I can't say that as a male I feel like any of the following jobs are not legitimate just because of low percentages of my own gender:

(note these figured are actually from 2010 but based on the changes in percentage in these fields since 2004 it's unlikely there have been hugely significant changes)

  • Therapists (82.1% female)
  • Librarians (83.3% female)
  • Public relations officers (66.7% female)
  • Marketing (57.3% female)

as some examples of the highest female percentages there.

I don't feel like I need more males in those fields to legitimise those as 'viable paths in life'.

[–]lotionanthemage 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

But the reason of competing is winning. You can tell me whatever you want but winning should be the final goal if you want to bo competitive.

[–]Whober(Whob) on NA 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Just that they're participating in this uphill battle to get more talented women involved and visible in esports.

talented women

diamond 5 and lower

whats next, a U16 league that only accepts plat or lower players?

[–]mj9057 40ポイント41ポイント  (68子コメント)

Well think about it, the LoL community is roughly 10% female to begin with, and the the pros are made up of the top ~.1% of all players. The number of females that could even be looked at by professional teams is an insanely small number.

On top of that, professional gaming is a very demanding and taxing industry, Liquid Mark talked about it in one of his Blame Game videos (on mobile otherwise I would link it), and its the reason many males who are good enough to be pros don't want to play professional league of legends. I would assume it's the same for females too. I mean, committing 12 hours/day to LoL for months on end is a huge commitment, and there probably just isn't enough girls who play at a professional level willing to commit to being pros.

[–]MibitGoHan 15ポイント16ポイント  (58子コメント)

Here's the real answer, but no. Apparently women just suxx at vidya

[–]John_Bot 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

I mean... the law of averages would state that 10% of pros should be female if 10% of the community is female... Right?

There are 100 starters in NALCS / EULCS ... It makes far less sense that no women are players than if there were 10 women.

what % of players are (insert category here) and what % of pros are (insert category here) ... There's no discrimination, it's just a matter of whether or not you're better than other people.

[–]joshthelegodude 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

One thing that comes to mind is reaction speed. Matpat from Game Theory talked about it in one of his videos (I think dead or alive, will post link later). Peak female reaction speed is slower than it is for males. As a slight tangent, this is why I think it's notable that the first (and only) pro level female was transgender, and I suspect that may have been an advantage for her. I think that a cis female would need very exceptional game knowledge to compete at the professional level, even in a lower tier region.

[–]TsukasaKun 32ポイント33ポイント  (4子コメント)

did I go back in time to when team siren was almost a thing, or is there a new all female team?

[–]1052941 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

The "pro" team with multiple Gold Elo support mains?

That was hilarious

[–]ClanorHDEUNE - Clanor / NA - Shodale 93ポイント94ポイント  (72子コメント)

If women want equality in eSports they should be on mixed gender teams.

There is nothing stopping them from that beside their own skills, it is just there aren't any good females to be on a professional team, so that's why they go into all women teams for the spotlight, you can assemble a better team than this everyday by picking people randomly from SoloQ, but it is not special, nor the all women teams are, but that's our society, deal with it.

[–]APowerlessManNA 34ポイント35ポイント  (7子コメント)

but that's our society, deal with it.

But that's reality, deal with it.

FTFY

[–]ScarletMagenta[Scarlet] (EU-W) 29ポイント30ポイント  (3子コメント)

There is nothing stopping them from that beside their own skills

Agreed. The team that just won the university tournament in Turkey out of 243 teams had a female support player and she had a pretty great performance.

[–]Xey2510 87ポイント88ポイント  (153子コメント)

We can't have female pros because they are simply not good enough/there are no good female challenger players. Thats what mostly holds them back. You can't get a girl in your team when there is no girl.

[–]areolaisland 24ポイント25ポイント  (37子コメント)

And that's why companies try to really push it. The ratio of male players to female players is overwhelmingly one sided, and just by the virtue of these numbers it's difficult to find a highly skilled female player.

They're trying to take some of the better female players and glorify it to hopefully bring in more interest from other girls. Once they have more players, odds will be better that some of them will be actually good and that's the goal they're striving for.

[–]Senafirsnowman 1ポイント2ポイント  (31子コメント)

im sure that dem females will be attracted while everyone is laughing out of female "pro" players and im almost 100% sure that advertising such "pro" players does more harm than good

[–]NinjaN-SWE 6ポイント7ポイント  (30子コメント)

Because people are super dense. Most comments in this thread fails to realize that it's a population size problem that causes females to not be represented in the highest levels of play not biology or anything else. The solution to the population size problem is to incentivize and attract more female players (ones interested in playing to win.) and one way of doing that is spotlighting female players like YP are doing and all the companies setting up female only leagues and tournaments.

It's not charity either, they do it because if more females play competitively then that directly grows the target audience for Razer, Steelseries and other e-sports focused companies.

[–]Senafirsnowman 0ポイント1ポイント  (3子コメント)

you see the thing is that while i have acces to no data at all (and i dont think that you do have as well) i dont think that stuff like team siren helps with attracting female populus especially considering how much hate they get and cause everyone knows that grills are very vulnerable to hating its obvious that they get startled by haturs on the internets (in case you are sarcasm proof- dont take that last part serious).

[–]NinjaN-SWE 2ポイント3ポイント  (2子コメント)

Exactly, because people are dense. But blaming companies aimed at making profit for trying is hardly productive. And it's really sad when its the players that get the shit when they're only guilty of getting a payday (which we all would jump on it came up, however unlikely).

[–]SuperSulfKarma Top O.O 2ポイント3ポイント  (15子コメント)

If male players outnumber females in League or competitive gaming in general, then it makes sense that we have fewer of them on top teams. It's a little odd we don't have any, which is a bit disheartening, but we don't need any female players for good competition, it's doing just fine right now. Just like if we all female players, it wouldn't matter as long as the competition is healthy.

Perhaps women just don't want to follow the esports dream.

[–]Morzas[Morzas] (NA) 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Perhaps women just don't want to follow the esports dream.

After seeing the comments here, I can see why they might be reluctant.

[–]DANCINGLINGS 20ポイント21ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well.. Team YouPorn is not really a teamname that intends to be taken seriously though...

[–]RegalCabbage 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't really give a shit about any player's gender, I care if they're not a shit player and, if they're a pro, that they're not a shit person.

[–]skumbag_steve 57ポイント58ポイント  (11子コメント)

i couldn't give less of a shit about what gender a pro player is. if tsm was all girls i'd praise and flame them all the same. the reason why females and female teams don't get spotlights is because they are straight ass at the game when compared to the very top of the ladder, and it has nothing to do with girls being inherently bad or anything like that. Theres just less girls playing

newsflash: EVERYONE NEEDS FUCKING THICK SKIN TO BECOME A PRO. HAVE THEY SEEN THE SHIT REDDIT THREW AT ZUNA AND LINK?

[–]Queen-Yandere 23ポイント24ポイント  (7子コメント)

and remember when Reginald was a pro

it seemed everyday there was a new way he was worse than hitler in reddits eyes

[–]MGA5525 13ポイント14ポイント  (3子コメント)

Regi was TSM's lightning rod

[–]The_Keconja 8ポイント9ポイント  (2子コメント)

And curse me to hell if the kid didn't take it like a champ
Even now he is really young. 3-5 years ago he was barely a young adult getting constant hate from thousands of people every day. At that point, its easy to slip and do something stupid. He didn't. He took it like a champ and was always standing in front of his org like a boss. He grew up young and did it in a way thathas to be praise worthy. Faker may be the best player of all times, but fuck me if Regi isn't the strongest guy in professional LoL scene

[–]Redryhno 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

To be fair about the Zuna stuff, he picked absolutely terrible times to shit talk while regularly being the main reason his team lost.

[–]TangerineWaves 26ポイント27ポイント  (7子コメント)

I don't really understand the controversy here. Women's Tournaments just promote League of Legends for girls. Just like University Tournaments promote League of Legends for young college students. And Plat only tournaments promote League of Legends for plat players. And NA LCS promotes League of Legends for NA players.

League of Legends doesn't have to be a game only for the best of the best. There is merit to narrowing the field in order to give less skilled players a chance to compete. Does the NACS deserve to exist because they're not as good as LCS? I think it's fine.

It's a good thing for these smaller tournaments and teams to exist. Not everyone is LCS caliber. And it's a great thing that companies sponsor these niche teams to give them a chance to exist. At the root of it, League of Legends is a fun, competitive game. Most of us enjoy competing, even if we know we will never step foot on the LCS stage. And we want to prove our skill, even if it's only against our peers.

[–]MuHUErtekaiser 9ポイント10ポイント  (0子コメント)

Saying that "women have a hard time getting on LCS teams" is really dumb. Sure I can imagine that that might be the case maybe. But you got no proof for it since all these women on that team are only diamond 5. Of course they are not on a pro team if they dont even get master/challenger in soloq.

Can you imagine SKT pick up a plat 4 player? No, since teams take the best and Plat 4 is far from beeing the best. So ofc no chance.

[–]TheFattestNinja 2ポイント3ポイント  (33子コメント)

I remember fairly recently watching a game on twitch (I think it was the NA / EUW challenger quals?) where a team was definitely 4 guys and a girl. Am I going mad and imagining things? IIRC, but I may be off, AlexIch was on it too?

[–]lurkedlongtime 15ポイント16ポイント  (30子コメント)

That was remilia with Renegades, and uh the responses to that may not be civil

[–]TheFattestNinja 0ポイント1ポイント  (29子コメント)

What you mean?

[–]kiirne(EU-W) 14ポイント15ポイント  (1子コメント)

She is trans (mtof).

[–]aTemeraz 8ポイント9ポイント  (26子コメント)

Remi was born a guy, and a lot of people have problems respecting the fact that Remi identified as a Female. Remi has not had a sex change IIRC.

[–]pu55yslayer 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

There's actually an oce female challenger support player who's on an OPL team and played some games in the promotion games I think. She's a sub though.
http://lol.esportspedia.com/wiki/Straawbella

[–]Mydden 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

OCE challenger is like d3 NA

[–]xdxAngeloxbx 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

Tl:dr nobody is holding back women besides their skill so they have to git gud and stop complaining about e-sports being dominated by men.

[–]bringitbackman 8ポイント9ポイント  (2子コメント)

My smurfs name is pretty feminine and whnever I do bad i get called a boosted e-girl. Datfeelwen

[–]Cexgod 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

i prefer being a boosted animal

[–]The_Shog 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Segregation is bad. Having a separate tournament only for girls implies that girls, by default, are less skilled than male players.

If they want to be taken seriously, then play with everyone else and prove worth with skill rather than using gender as a gimmick.

[–]LlamaManIsSoPro 9ポイント10ポイント  (2子コメント)

LPT: DO NOT READ COMMENTS, RUN WHILE YOU CAN

[–]Lundrity 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

That team is ridiculous. Apprently their highest ranked player is d5...

[–]CptWhiskers 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

If I'm correct Riot changed the requirements to being in an LCS team to D3 minimum in the season. Also D5 is just bad. I don't know why reddit is getting their panties in a bunch.

[–]Zandthee 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

If they're good enough to join SKT they would join SKT, but they simply are not good enough. The only pro gamer that was really on the top level from what I know of was Violet in Starcraft and this support that join an NA LCS team for a couple of games but was benched.

[–]Plkgi49 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

I am Diamond 5 and I feel extremely bad compared to professional gamers. It would not be equal for these women to play with the actual pros.

[–]PromNightDumpstrBayb 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

It would be pretty cool for there to be an all female Diamond 5 or higher league.

[–]Usmieszek 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

There are no rules preventing these teams from competing on the main stage.

Also this is something that isn't new. Look at the NBA vs WNBA

[–]Micromadsen 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

To be honest I don't really care whether it's male or female gamers. What it should come down to is skill level.
In a game a woman can have the god damn exact same skill level as any man.

Should there be tournaments exclusively for women? Or exclusively for men?
Honestly I don't think that's a good idea.
This would only help segregate the two genders. Something that I'm personally much against when it comes to ESport.
I can understand that there are certain... physical limitations in real sportsball, but way less so in a gaming environment. (To be honest I'd probably be way more interested in real sport if they had mixed teams.)

What I think it comes down to is simply the fact that there are a lot more male gamers than female ones.
Which of course means that the professional players are mostly male.
IF/WHEN a female player is good enough to be hired or indeed playing with the best, I see no reason for her not to join in the main ESports tournaments. Doesn't matter if it's 4 guys and 1 girl. Or 4 girls and 1 dude.
If the players are good enough to be where they're at, then it's something they deserve.

I've heard the thought of "Pure" teams been thrown around from time to time. And it just leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Then there are teams that have a "Token" girl, which is more of a mascot than a player. Which is equally as bad.

And then every now and then a Female gamer pops up that's as good as it gets. And she is either harassed out of the gaming scene or stalked by creepy people. Which doesn't really give female gamers much of an incentive to actually pursuit a career within gaming.
It might even come down to parts of the Male community being too immature to accept a Female being better at games than themselves. Thus the harassment.

I think if the top female players were given spots and played in the tournaments people would freak out at first. But if it happened more and more often, people would be forced to accept that this is a thing.
THEN we would potentially see more female gamers go into the professional scene. THEN there would be teams consisting of Pure Male, Pure Female and Mixed all competing against each other. That's where it would be interesting, and that's when I believe ESport could be accepted as the real deal.

[–]Salohacin 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't get the whole: If we're going to have women play professionally make it 5 women.

[–]BGsenpai 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Remember Team Siren? Yeah, not happening any time soon.

[–]Darkbloomy[Beniak] (EU-NE) 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I hate to say this but it's better for a team to get a male player than a female player. It's not necessarily that the male player is better but it can cause a lot of drama within the team considering they all live in the same house. I think we all know what happens when you introduce a girl to 4 teenage guys. It changes the entire dynamic. Also considering that there are more male players than female players it's pretty much guaranteed that for a good female player you could find a male on the same level or even better and it won't be as risky.

[–]Finrod04 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

It's the age old thing again.

We don't want to play with men but we also want to be better than them.

If they wanted to play in the LCS they could get good and join a team. It's nothing different for them.

btw: The title should say "women in pro lol" not "pro women in lol".

[–]lnsetick 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

I see lots of "women just don't try hard enough," which is missing the point. If you've ever wondered why there are women-only chess tournaments, the reasoning behind having those is similar to why people would want women-only league teams. This ELI5 thread does a decent job of explaining why women are underrepresented in chess, and why women-only tournaments were needed to promote participation in something that's dominated by men.

[–]xZelinka 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Female teams consist of players that want to have as much attention as a normal team without taking game seriously.

No one should take them seriously.

[–]NahDawgDatAintMe [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

There are female players in collegiate teams. The barrier to entry is based solely upon your individual skill. You can't complain about not getting a chance if you aren't even in masters or challenger. The current rank 1 player on the NA server isn't even on an lcs team.

[–]DarkoDarkovic 6ポイント7ポイント  (1子コメント)

It just more whining about nothing. All the things they quote as problems can be said for both genders.

"The uphill battle that women face in the industry is still a reality: being a woman in this cutthroat business means you need incredibly thick skin and strength of character on top of admirable skill and talent." Yeah and if your a man you can be a hippy dippy silver 5 and you get invites to being a pro.

If there was a female Faker there is 0 chance she wouldn't play in LCS team if she wanted too. Pro players make less then 1% of all player, plus there are less women than man playing lcs in total figures. It is a bit surprising that there aren't more girls in amateur scene thou but tbh maybe there are and I just don't know because in the end I don't care about gender but about quality of games and players.

[–]DizzystyleProxy God 4ポイント5ポイント  (6子コメント)

I've never understood what the "why females can't be on same stage as men?" - question.

Answer: because of a lot of different reasons, no matter which game, males currently dominate in the highest ladder of play. Only the best can be in the main tournaments, gender doesn't matter but how good you are.

I can understand why girls need "toughness" as there isn't that many women in the competetitive gaming. They've been alianated from the gaming as it's "not what girls do", so it's a whole new world to them as there just simply hasn't been that many women. Yet. I believe that this will change in the future once hobbies are less sexualized and girls can play as much as boys without being questioned.

-> there will be steady increase in competitive girls in gaming

Unlike sports in gaming there isn't any physical advantages for us men so I think in several/dozens of years games will be a good place for us to fight as equals in mixed gender teams.

Still got a long way to go. Pardon my bad english, I hope I made atleast some sense.

[–]jnxu 5ポイント6ポイント  (16子コメント)

There are no women in pro play because they are generally bad and just don't reach levels required to be on a team.

Downvote me, but that's the harsh reality.

[–]quicktails 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Why won't more women get into the pro scene? They're treated just like men! I mean, it's not like there's an entire thread on the biggest LoL community discussing how they're all biologically inferior and critiquing them or anything.

[–]Seneido 11ポイント12ポイント  (107子コメント)

Even if there is a girl good enough for lcs i doubt she wanna live in a gaming house. No privacy at all. You can only imagine the tension that will arise with it.

[–]aggsalad 17ポイント18ポイント  (38子コメント)

Shit like this is just foreign to me. I've done 24 hours of DOTA with 4 guys at a single dining table and never felt once like anything other than hanging out with friends and playing a MOBA.

[–]Kiristran_ 28ポイント29ポイント  (9子コメント)

Come on, women living with men in a shared apartment without any problem is a common occurence. Yes it could possible cause tension but not if the support staff is doing a good job of supervising the players. It's like saying hiring a girl in a company with almost only guys is dangerous.

[–]elh0mbre 11ポイント12ポイント  (1子コメント)

People don't usually live at work.

Ask the military how common problems are...

[–]LFM_Ilvl900req 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

Military service has always included some elements of sexual tension because of the homo-erotic culture of the traditionally all male military services, you have just as much if not more male-on-male assault and harassment as you do male-on-female or female-on-male, its not a gender issue its an issue with military culture overall.

[–]BristleriderA gift from the Freljord 6ポイント7ポイント  (7子コメント)

It should be absolutely possible for a girl to have her own room and bathroom. Thats afaik nothing special anymore as far as gaming houses go.

It could be annoying that not only the team, but also most if not all of the staff is male though.

[–]Xhausted90 7ポイント8ポイント  (2子コメント)

own bathroom

She better will be the next faker, if the other 4 players share a bathroom, while she gets her own.

[–]Bowiesinspace 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

En suite isn't that fuckin magical

[–]Simjon_Un 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Holy shit you have your own bathroom?

[–]TahmatoesH2O loves you 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Why would you need your own bathroom as a girl? The only thing you'd want is a lock on the door, and I assume that's already a thing they have.

[–]altM1st 1ポイント2ポイント  (8子コメント)

What the hell can stop a girl from renting a flat in 100 meters from gaming house and come there just to play. FFS i dont even get the idea of players living together. Like guys dont need privacy rofl.

[–]Seneido 0ポイント1ポイント  (7子コメント)

free living place with food is a good reason i guess...

[–]altM1st 0ポイント1ポイント  (6子コメント)

Free living place with food doesnt exist. Team pays for both, it might as well just pay for flats. And normally at any workplace they dont give a fuck where you live and eat, they just pay you and you use the money in any way you want.

[–]Seneido 0ポイント1ポイント  (5子コメント)

i meant its free living place and food for the players. privacy and transport would be their own cost if they want their own place. for the org its way cheaper to put them all into a bigger living place then meeting flats for each of them especially if they play the game 10hrs a day together anyways and as you can see not a single player has his own flat. i guess that they rather safe the money for their future.

[–]altM1st 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

I'm pretty curious about whether players are actually allowed to NOT live in gaming house.

[–]Seneido 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

you mean outside the gaming house? i believe there were a handfull of those players mostly because of having a girlfriend.

[–]Whober(Whob) on NA 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

A team could definitely afford a small apartment for the person to live in, I'm pretty sure liquid has the players set up in an apartment complex and Alliance also had apartments that were separate from the actual gaming facilities. The player could eat with the team and bring food home if shes hungry, if its really that big of a deal she can do what a lot of smaller teams that don't supply food do, and just buy her own stuff..

[–]Senthe 2ポイント3ポイント  (31子コメント)

This is the reason teams don't want to pick up women. Come on reddit, it's not that hard to understand this and acknowledge that women do not have equal possibilities.

[–]L0git 7ポイント8ポイント  (0子コメント)

There are no women to pick up. Diamond 5 players are not pros, not even close.

[–]Yvraine 13ポイント14ポイント  (7子コメント)

Eh, it's not like there has been a woman on a challenger team which doesn't live in a gaming house either. So that can't be the only reason

[–]Xaydon[Xaydon] (EU-W) 2ポイント3ポイント  (17子コメント)

That's something you can take care of the moment there's girls with enough level to compete in the LCS.

Right now there aren't (Other than Remilia and she found a team!), so it's pointless to imply that they don't have equal possibilities when as of right now, they just don't have equal level.

[–]DerpCranberry 3ポイント4ポイント  (7子コメント)

In OPL there's also Straawbella, she's the sub support for Tainted Minds (and is biologically a female). So far her and Remi are the only two female pros.

[–]Redryhno 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

Wait, Remilia's coming back? After the breakdown she had halfway through her split?

I mean, not to bash on her(because you have to preface anything negative you say about her with this), but I really don't think she's exactly stable enough to actually come back.

[–]Xaydon[Xaydon] (EU-W) 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Oh no, I mean she found one back in the day not now!

[–]Redryhno 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Oh, ok, good. She was a pretty good Thresh, but she just tilted so fucking easily in-game.

[–]Whober(Whob) on NA 0ポイント1ポイント  (3子コメント)

Theres teams that have separate workplaces and living quarters, I'm sure theres workarounds to avoid the tension of living with 4 guys.

[–]mecca450 9ポイント10ポイント  (20子コメント)

ITT: People who have no idea what it's like to be a minority.

[–]Draki1903 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Honestly, do you even know who you're playing in game? All you see is nicknames. You can beat 12 year olds, you can be beaten by a 12 year olds and not even know it. If I gave you a list of all the faces playing in NA CS and EU CS, could you identify even a third of the players?

[–]Redryhno 6ポイント7ポイント  (7子コメント)

Why exactly would "being a minority" matter in an online game?

[–]mullerjonesBR 3ポイント4ポイント  (5子コメント)

I routinely play with my girlfriend and the amount of trash talk she gets from having a slightly more feminine user name is astounding. From people saying she's trash when someone else made a mistake to people being rude and saying all sorts of sexist stuff despite of what's going on in the game. Yes, she can mute them, but she can't know someone's an asshole before they say anything, and saying she should just mute everyone is basically admitting the community is so hostile to women they should just avoid it altogether.

Also, there's this shit (link is in Portuguese). Basically, a tournament here invented some bullshit excuses to exclude a team for having a woman in the roster. It wasn't an official Riot tournament and Riot itself later corrected them and made it right, but this is just one more example of how being a woman in League is pretty hard.

[–]Redryhno 1ポイント2ポイント  (4子コメント)

The community is hostile as a general rule dude. I've been muting everyone for years because it's just simpler that way. It sucks because all you've got is the woefully inefficient Ping system, but it saves far more headaches than it causes. It's not a woman specific thing.

[–]mullerjonesBR 2ポイント3ポイント  (3子コメント)

It isn't specific to them, but it's way worse. I've seen her play and played with her and she gets way more toxicity than me, and I suck.

[–]Redryhno 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

Here's the thing you have to remember though, the more different you are, the easier it is to find things to get under your skin with. And that's what the majority of the people doing that shit are doing.

[–]Numsy 10ポイント11ポイント  (1子コメント)

Nah, we're all part of a meritocracy here and no one has ever faced any discrimination. Especially in the LoL community. /s

[–]1052941 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Confusing being talentless with being a minority

[–]SnakeOnBush [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

... maybe stop segregating yourselves then?

There are no "majorities" or "minorities" here, only gamers.

[–]jujubean67 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

On this site more likely.

[–]Whober(Whob) on NA 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

If you're not good enough to play a game at a competitive level, you shouldn't be getting paid to play it competitively. This isn't about being a minority, these girls simply aren't good enough to actually compete against any decent teams and if a group of D5 guys decided to make an announcement like team YP did they would get laughed at and told that nobody cares about a bunch of D5 shitters.

[–]Spencer51X 3ポイント4ポイント  (14子コメント)

Are you really whining about an all girl team? Who cares? Who does it hurt? Let them do their thing, why does it even matter.

[–]Tuas1996 1ポイント2ポイント  (5子コメント)

People are tired of organizations forcing girl teams down our throats, we saw it with team siren, that other asian team siren and now this new team. Theres no reason for women to be worse at esports than men, and noone wants to see a diamond 5/ plat team competing likes its the lcs.

[–]Whober(Whob) on NA 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

When a team filled with D5 or lower guys gets sponsored and plays in a separate league from the LCS or challenger series, you can make this excuse. Theres no reason that an esport where being a male or female gives you no inherent advantage should have separate league.

[–]Jatts_integrity 3ポイント4ポイント  (6子コメント)

If you think brute-forcing women into the scene for the sake of equality, or highlighting the effort of women solely for participating in a predominantly male climate you're part of the problem. Reminds me of when the mayor of London suggested the next Bond actor should be a female to reflect modern society...the fucking irony is laughable.

[–]Burneti 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

An all-girl league is sexist, if they want to play competitively, just get good enough to play in LCS, even as an all-girl team or w/e.

[–]lovebus 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Thoughts on 45 year old neck beards trying to go pro in LoL?

[–]jtoeg 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

ITT: Siren shitposting

[–]PopsturAhri 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Gender??? Teams should be decided by skills alone. Woman already dont play games much. They should be determined by skills and not gender.

[–]IAmAGoodPersonn 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

"Professional team [...] Diamond 5"

And the team have a Plat 4 player, I can make smurf go to Plat 4 in few days.. professional team? what a shame.

Hahahahaha

[–]Runolo 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

In general boys are better at video games. And driving.

In the entire Formula 1 and NASCAR scene there is 1 woman driver.

In video games, 80% of succesful females, were at one point in time a self-identifying male.

Men and women should have equal rights- but dont expect equal outcomes for everything.

Dont get triggered but the simple fact is Men and Women are biologically different. Men are better at some things and women are better at others. This should not be a controvesial statement.

[–]lukunku 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I remember back in the CS 1.6 days we won a game against top polish female team, just to clarify we weren't any good we were like bottom of ESL ladder

[–]PeachsApple 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Smaller population, even assuming the same chances of getting professional = less results.

Need more women in eSports before anything else can have a chance at happening. If a Women's only set of competitions can get more women joining in the first place, then lets do it.

It's not about discrimination anymore, it's about getting the ball rolling and developing the scene.

[–]Ariocabron[BoyKisserPerez] (EU-W) 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Women should be encouraged to compete from the bottom, that is, making them feel comfortable with the game.

I agree, however, that giving them visibility in competitive play might help encourage more women to pursue a career in gaming. Unfortunately the issue is deeper than that, since there aren't many gamer women in the first place.

So giving visibility to an amateur team just because they are girls is not only unfair, but also unproductive for that matter. Anyways we all know that the "all girl team" theme is just marketing and has nothing to do with achieving equality.

[–]trotsky187 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Men seem to have more of a prediliction to video gaming for hour and hours and hours. IDK but I don't know any women who would ever sit at a PC and practice all day.

Just doesn't happen at the moment, maybe in the future. My GF loves to play Xbox a lot with me but she doesnt game much on PC and she certainly doesnt do it as habitually as I do.

[–]TheEpikPotato 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

One of the main issues in pro teams is housing.

If you have male and females on the same team, housing just becomes that much more difficult so they would rather just get aguy then have to make room for a female.