@Giorgio. Thanks for the update and translation. Much appreciated. My take from it was
- they are still working on OLO (although I couldn't see any of the OLO boxes in the video) and will have a more complete prototype in six weeks (which I hope we will see videos of in action)
- they are actively monitoring the comments page but have made a deliberate decision to not engage
- they are claiming to be on track to meet their published deadlines.
That said, I'm surprised they didn't mention their appearance as an update here as it would have given some reassurance they are still active and that work is underway.
@Thomas in fact you're right, the more and more I speak to people, the more pissed people I find about crowdfunding.
yeah, "thanks" to places like IGG and K$, crowdfunding concept is going to shºt specially by releasing tools without control where scammers can take the money and run AND THEY STILL MAKE PROFIT OUT OF IT!
Yeah, there's gonna be an end to all these crap crowdfunding sites, sooner or later. THis, or a BIG change from a big name who has bigger means to control funds (like Google or whatever).
Might i remind you that your the one that said kickstarter does nt care and now you ve changed your tune ? You make a lot of bold and damaging statements without proof in nearly every post you have done.If you believe in the project then what s the issue why are you moaning bout kickstarter ? While im not defending olo s lack of communication.You are carrying on saying things like scam with NO PROOF.I might also suggest reading kickstarters t& c again and read your previous comment to which i responded so you better understand the point i was making
@ioannis, I back in projects, because I believe in the people behind it, see the efforts in their work and everybody deserves a chance to bring a great product to market. OLO does nothing, than just making jokes of the backers. No proofs at all, no updates with real messages, only nonsense. And than saying, that the backers are trolls! Even, if they ever have a good product, these guys are not worth spending any $. Not, if they treat their backers (who believed in them and/or product) or their next customers.
@ ioannis, yes I do understand KS-platform. If they don't care at all, why having than terms of conditions for projects? Why do they first check the project before you can go live? Why can creators only have 1 project at a time? And why did KS suspend "Skarp Laser Razer"?
Again you did not have to back the project.as far as arguing about kickstarter. Feel free to contact kickstarter and complain to kickstarter. Oh wait here's a far better idea DONT BACK PROJECTS. It is not up to kickstarter to take action but the backers.Do you understand what a platforn is? Would you blame ebay because your item did nt come ? Seriously do you even understand what kickstarter is ?
@ Ionnis, you're right, that this is not the section to argue about KS, but there is no other section to do so. And as you said, KS has t' of c, and OLO didn't fulfill these. So it was (now it's to late) on KS to take action on this project. Don't understand me wrong, for me KS was a serious platform, where, of course, projects can go wrong, but because of the t of c, scam projects should be minimized. But if creators don't have to stay with these terms, what does this tell me about KS and other projects? I tried to contact KS, while the project was live, concerning the virtual images and not working prototype, but I just got a blabla-mail back. They only see their 6%
I do not have any confidence on OLO project anymore. I may just fall into a historical largest kickstarter scam. Anyone has suggested what to reach out to the OLO, to either get next project status, money back, or justice?
One last thing again this is not the place to have this discussion as i pointed out earlier :) Its not what the comments sections for and realistically does nt have a single thing to do with this project :P
but again Venture capital involves seeking and attracting official investors to sponsor your business or project through the selling of private shares. This is more of a “formal” approach that can be challenging and a little complicated. There are also a number of legal steps that a startup business needs to take in order to properly his or her business as well as any assets that may be accounted for in the process. Potential investors also want to ensure that their investments are protected should your business fail.Where as one of the main reasons why crowd funding is so effective and popular is because many startups have embraced the opportunities to reach right to their target audiences and provide them with a valuable service or product for sampling in exchange for a few dollars that count towards a startup’s overall campaign.
Kickstarter is merely a platform that allows us to back projects,we are not a company.Therefore it is our choice weather we choose to back a project or not.The terms and conditions are clear and easy to understand for all.Kickstarter is not affiliated with projects therefore they have no reason or are in a place to enforce anything.
Na your all good keep the 2 dollars for your next 2 projects you wanna back :)
@ioannis - Actually, and I'm saying this respectfully, you've still missed the point. Maybe I'm not being clear and I'll save everyone else the agony of explaining it again. BTW, I'll pay you $2 not to write comments to me anymore. :-)
@ Saeed i go the point hence as i clearly pointed out in the messages.Rather than regurgitating the same gibberish in a different way let me again remind you if you dont like how kickstarter operates dont use it.It is a choice.
There can be a lot of harm in VC, s to a startup company especially if they lack in experience and business sense.I could easily spend all day explaining the pro s and cons of a VC and of a kickstarter.I could even explain how a combination of the two can work together in perfect unity.
If developers wanted to go down the Vc route many of them have that choice open to them whilst others dont.It s a choice.Just as you chose to invest 1 dollar, the developers,designers etc chose to go the crowdfunding route
I think you have missed my point tho if you want to complain about kickstarter may i suggest hitting the contact us button and airing your views to them.
I think you missed the point. The point is not about the OLO project, the point I was making is that crowdfunding is maturing and given the large scale failures, there needs to be more oversight on large projects like OLO.
When you're talking millions of dollars going to people who are making fundamentally unproven statement, there is a responsibility that MUST be taken by KS. So far, they've been able to wash their hands of any responsibility, but that won't last, and IF KS wanted to be a mature company then using proven methods from the VC industry makes sense.
There is no harm and lots to gain in having more oversight on higher funded projects - particularly in the early stages. This is beneficial to the backers, to the creators and certainly to KS's reputation as a place where large scale projects can be funded and delivered more successfully than any other crowdfunding site.
Agreed Colin the main complaint is the lack of updates and your right we should nt have to ask.They took our money and have yet to deliver a update since the 5th of may.However from some of the updates from our friendly Italian backers.It does seem like olo s on track would just be nice to hear it from OLO themselves.
saeed ill send you your dollar back if you promise not to comment anymore.
As for the comments regarding VCs this is crowdfunding so there is a few big differences as to why that argument wont work.One of the main ones being VCs can also maintain control provisions including board seat allowances and anti-dilution measures so that rights attributable to the venture capitalist don’t apply to crowdfunding shares.All of the hard work of crowdfunding is also building your brand – where the work with lawyers and pitching to partners in board rooms to do a VC round may be less so. While some young companies may choose to go this route often these days a startup would rather go crowdfunding route so that the control of the company remains solely theirs.
Id like to remind you as well we ALL (including you ) choose to back projects under kickstarter s t&c s.So the solution to your issue is simple choose not to back a project and you ll have no reason to complain pointlessly in a comment section especially when those complaints are directed at kickstarter and not the project in question.
Given the troubled history of SEVERAL 3D printer projects, AND the amount of money OLO raised, Kickstarter should have some controls in place to minimize the risk of large scale failures -- i.e. like Zano, Peachy Printer, Coolest Cooler etc.
In short, say for any project that raises over $1M, they should only release, say 25% of the raised funds initially, so the creators can move forward with their project and their performance can be monitored. IF evidence of severe problems, false claims, lack of progress etc. are found, then the rest (75%) should be withheld until the problems are remedied.
This is how VCs work. If you raise 20M in a round ,you get it in tranches (literally slices). No use throwing good money after bad.
Seems though that KS would rather just take their commission and tell backers that they take 100% of the risk and KS takes 0% of any responsibility for users of their platform, even though they gladly take 5% of the funds raised.
The Wild West days of crowdfunding are over. Time to grow up Kickstarter.
Well, anyone who backed expecting them to contribute to the "comments" section was probably more than a bit naive - I mean if they didn't do it when you could take away their funding, why would they change their behavior when you have no way to get your money back?!
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@ned death I can't complain about Rift - still one of the best campaigns I've been involved in. http://imgur.com/gE3hx6K
ioannis beat me to it. I agree, just because some people say something "not nice" on the internet does not justify them ignoring the rest of their backers. That just goes to show that they're being as childish as they portray us "trolls" to be. It sounds like when a teacher punishes an entire class for something that 2 students did. Fair?
If they feel disheartened it's because there's a reason: their communication is appalling --> people get pissed --> sad face.
The "trolling" as they call it, didn't even really start until it was evident that they weren't posting anything. They were supposed to post videos and pics before the campaign deadline, as THEY promised, and didn't follow through. So we're to blame for them being disheartened when people question their conduct? Praise is supposed to be earned..
@Markuss, feel dishearten? Well I hope they do! They don't deserve anything else.
I feel fooled and somehow blame KS as well. They now say, that they don't have a working prototype. It's one of KS terms, to have one, before starting a project. KS has approved this without proof of a working prototype and virtual images. And also their resin needs to be developed? What, except of the money they got, is real?
See if they had updated with us with everything that has been said in that video.i for one as im sure many other genuine backers would be happy with that but they dont even have the courtesy to do that we had to rely on other backers to attend,search for and translate for us in order to have what i consider to be a positive,reassuring and informed update.
While i agree with some of what you said ( especially some ppl here to be trolls ) i have to disagree with the encouragement as im sure most backers would we have had exactly one update since funding closed so where have the olo team given the backers the info that they not only need but actually deserve (since their money made this possible)in order for backers to respond positively,or encourage or even praise.Read the comments i ve been defending olo a good deal i do however understand where the genuine ppl with genuine concerns are coming from.If your saying that is a good argument for olo to not update backers due to some trolls well thats just ridiculous and unfair to the backers as a whole.What was it 20 trolls he said ? So because of 20 trolls they refuse to update and punish all of us ?
I think a bunch of people came here just to troll backers, people have been saying it's a scam since day 1, this is what he is refering to.
I also think his comments regarding the lack of encouragement is valid, if I were working on a project and all comments were like this I would feel disheartened.
I think most people here know about KS deadlines and their realism, Tutusaus. The comments regarding That subject are few and far in between.
I think it would be best if we all refrain referring to previous posts about deadlines and scams, as that's a small minority, and Filippo's already confused enough about what commenters are upset about.
The only things i'm going to say about deadlines:
In the video, he did tell his professor that an actual working prototype will be ready in 6 weeks. As in, a full fledged olo box that is not assisted by components outside the box.
He also made the claim somewhere in the video that they will have Olos out and in peoples hands before Christmas.
#1 Thanks @Giorgio for the great update
#2 @SlimJim @ioannis and basically the rest of us with some hope left in this project: we do agree they should communicate more, we do agree egos dont play any game here, nor nationalities....but hey! they raised 2M3 and they have "il sopravvento" on this... so theres not much more we can do but WAIT.
And whoever was expecting them to recieve OLO on time.... WAKE (the f*ck!) UP! This is Kickstarter!
@Giorgio Thanks for the time/effort and info.
As a Non Italian and another complainer (must make 11 of us now :D) i have to say i have read the whole of the posts on here an i can't see anything Troll like ( could not say for any Italian bits) so stop offending the people have supported you up to this point.
It does not take much just to post a little bit on here every now and again.
You have done a talk shared some details why are they not announced on here? you have taken a fair bit of money from a lot of people and no updates for over a month is just not good enough, if you can't organize your self now whilst things are in the development stage then how bad are you going to be when the products launched (if it ever does get launched that is, and if it does it could be as much of a farce as the Rift has been), we ask questions because we care and want to know how things are going not to annoy or insult you, so put the effort in and give us SOMETHING.
I'd like to be the 21st angry commenter but I'm not that angry..
I just have a bit of advice. The comment of "how there are more people complaining than praising them" is very easy to resolve. Just provide some updates. Talk to your backers. Make them feel included in the process. Talk about your challenges, your accomplishments. Seriously, just look at the comments and updates section of the Tiko 3D printer. It's like a perfectly run campaign. They talk about engineering challenges, their solutions, which team member is in China doing what, steps for molding parts, how the consistency was difficult to resolve, etc etc. Any their backers love them!
Btw, "being Italian" is not an excuse for lack of communication in CROWDfunding. I don't care if you are Italian, American, from Ghana or a Kiwi. If you wanted funding to do work in secret, you should have went the route of venture funding and you wouldn't have had to deal with the annoying people that handed you $2.3M dollars.. No wonder people are saying you are scamming them. That's because you are displaying the exact attributes people generalize onto Italians and then complaining about how you are not being treated fairly. Btw, I'm not Italian..
I have a legitimate concern fir the lack of updates.i wonder if more ppl could see some of the comments how many of them would agree with him bout the "troll section " . Clearly ego s need to come down to earth if thats the case we the backers he refers to as troll s made this project possible by funding it and thats what he called us?
First off, grazie mille Giorgio per i video e per aver gia' tradotto le parti importanti. Io sarei stato troppo pigro! :) For non Italian speakers: don't worry about what i just said. Just secret Italian stuff. ;)
Now my 2 cents.
This will be my last wall of text on this project.
6 minutes into the second video he says Stefano (no idea who that is), responds in the "right" section of kickstarter. Bascially, this section here is the "troll section".
Apparantely having legitimate concerns about the professional conduct of a company puts you in the troll category.
He says that if you ask a question in the correct place you'll get an answer. Anybody found this magical section?
He's missing the problem though: he keeps referring to the skeptics who think the project is a scam, and ignores the fact that most of the complaints are based on their absence.
For the Olo fellows:
Nella piccolissima possibilita' che stiate leggendo questi commenti, vi sarebbe costato nulla dirci come minimo "ciao, stiamo lavorando sul progetto, ma siamo ancora vivi"? Va beh che ora c'e' il video di Milano, ma avreste risparmiato un sacco di tempo e problemi se solo vi sareste fatti vivi almeno una volta nell'ultimo mese. Il problema non e' che ci sono scettici a riguardo del vostro progetto, ma che voi ignorate il resto di noi che ci chiediamo dove siete finiti. Come minimo ci meritiamo una giustificazione per credere in voi, e invece siete stati assenti da quando avete fatto l'aggiornamento del backerkit.
I am thinking that all this project, OLO and so on are just a way for these people to have a sort of revenge against life or other people who never trusted their works or their minds (this is why they flew from italy and underline so many times how italians are so bad). It's also clear from the updates we had during the KS, always focused on advertise their success, how good they are, the "record of the 3d printer project" on KS, so many images of awards etc. etc. and in the end? Still no real working prototype... They even went to a public conference with nothing just to underline how good they are just to gain some glory. I really hope they will realize OLO as they promised otherwise all this show they are doing will fall and crush them a lot more than their ego
i'm listening to Giorgio's videos as we speak. 4 minutes in and i already think the guy's an ass. In response to a lady who pointed out the concerns from the backers, he basically retorts that those of us who voice our concerns are just trolls and have no "scientific or technical notion". What an absolute ASS! CLASSIC Italian behaviour: never admit fault + blame someone else.
@Colin
"I seriously hope the reason they aren't posting stuff is that they are just working as hard as they can on the project."
They're Italian so..no.
And i'm not being offensive here. I'm full blooded: i know my people. :)
@Giorgio hey are they showing print samples in the video ? It's towards the last 5 minutes of the video. If those are print samples then I am impressed.
Saeed Khan: please be so kind and stop calling people who don't complain or generally don't spend all their time writing comments "ignorant". We just have better things to do.
Thank you so much for your detailed comment and translation. I have to say that nothing that you've described gives a positive feel for this project.
First, perhaps I'm one of the 10 non-Italian complainers they refer to. I'll take that as a badge of honour.
To be honest, that kind of answer -- i.e. out of 16,000 backers, there are only a tiny handful who are complaining -- shows a real level of ignorance of how sentiment in these projects exists. We know that only a small minority of KS backers ever visit the site and comment, let alone comment regularly.
Secondly, it's the kind of statement that is used by people who really have no intention of addressing the issues raised. i.e. well only a tiny percent are complaining so they are just crybabies unlike the large majority who aren't complaining.
Third, it's unclear if he addressed the utter lack of communication they've had with the backers. Did he say that would change or that they'd start regularly commenting or updating?
Lastly, they are 6 weeks away from a "REAL working prototype". i.e. best case, that will be late July if not August. They were supposed to go to production in July. Very bad news. Also on May 5 update, they stated:
"We have two production updates that we are excited to share with you; the preproduction of the test mold will be ready in 10 days and the sensor chip will be ready by next week!"
Since then no news and it's not even clear what those two milestones actually mean.
Overall, it's pretty clear they are struggling severely with this project and have little to show for it so far.
What would be better for them would be to be open and honest about the project and status and if there are challenges they have to overcome, then be honest about that. They've raised a LOT of money and have a responsibility to the backers to be open and honest in their communication. Something they have not been until now.
WAIT- are they trying to make their own resin? WHY? There's TONS of different companies making resin already, and some of them are working on resin that uses light from a screen. Go with them and save all the time and expense instead of making your own.
Georgio you are now my favourite italian.thanks for that share and taking the time to translate for the rest of us.greatly appreciated.i had a good chuckle at that comment how no one s praised them id like to take this opportunity to remind them that without a update we re not in a position to praise them and while some have complained myself and others have come to their defence but every one is in fairness beginning to become frustrated with lack if updates we dont need constant one a month and a hello in the conments once in a while would do . We get time is important and could be better used bringing us our olo s rather than constant updates but if you want praise give us a reason to clap our hands and say well done ! Lol
Use this space to cheer the creator along, ask questions, and talk to your fellow backers. Please remember to be respectful and considerate. Thanks!
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Show older commentsViral Videos 1 minute ago
funniest part.... from there bio, they log in everyday ...
someone gives u 2 million dollars and you never comment and your updates are late and with few text bs ....
no one thinks these things are wierd???
Brendan Moylan about 5 hours ago
@Giorgio. Thanks for the update and translation. Much appreciated. My take from it was
- they are still working on OLO (although I couldn't see any of the OLO boxes in the video) and will have a more complete prototype in six weeks (which I hope we will see videos of in action)
- they are actively monitoring the comments page but have made a deliberate decision to not engage
- they are claiming to be on track to meet their published deadlines.
That said, I'm surprised they didn't mention their appearance as an update here as it would have given some reassurance they are still active and that work is underway.
Alex Tutusaus about 7 hours ago
@Thomas in fact you're right, the more and more I speak to people, the more pissed people I find about crowdfunding.
yeah, "thanks" to places like IGG and K$, crowdfunding concept is going to shºt specially by releasing tools without control where scammers can take the money and run AND THEY STILL MAKE PROFIT OUT OF IT!
Yeah, there's gonna be an end to all these crap crowdfunding sites, sooner or later. THis, or a BIG change from a big name who has bigger means to control funds (like Google or whatever).
ioannis about 14 hours ago
@ Paul Completely agree with you ;P
Paul Unger about 14 hours ago
@meisje - They weren't calling all their backers Trolls... just you!
ioannis about 14 hours ago
@ Meisjie
Might i remind you that your the one that said kickstarter does nt care and now you ve changed your tune ? You make a lot of bold and damaging statements without proof in nearly every post you have done.If you believe in the project then what s the issue why are you moaning bout kickstarter ? While im not defending olo s lack of communication.You are carrying on saying things like scam with NO PROOF.I might also suggest reading kickstarters t& c again and read your previous comment to which i responded so you better understand the point i was making
meisje about 16 hours ago
@ioannis, I back in projects, because I believe in the people behind it, see the efforts in their work and everybody deserves a chance to bring a great product to market. OLO does nothing, than just making jokes of the backers. No proofs at all, no updates with real messages, only nonsense. And than saying, that the backers are trolls! Even, if they ever have a good product, these guys are not worth spending any $. Not, if they treat their backers (who believed in them and/or product) or their next customers.
meisje about 16 hours ago
@ ioannis, yes I do understand KS-platform. If they don't care at all, why having than terms of conditions for projects? Why do they first check the project before you can go live? Why can creators only have 1 project at a time? And why did KS suspend "Skarp Laser Razer"?
ioannis about 18 hours ago
@meisjie
Again you did not have to back the project.as far as arguing about kickstarter. Feel free to contact kickstarter and complain to kickstarter. Oh wait here's a far better idea DONT BACK PROJECTS. It is not up to kickstarter to take action but the backers.Do you understand what a platforn is? Would you blame ebay because your item did nt come ? Seriously do you even understand what kickstarter is ?
meisje about 22 hours ago
@Saeed, I totally agree with you.
@ Ionnis, you're right, that this is not the section to argue about KS, but there is no other section to do so. And as you said, KS has t' of c, and OLO didn't fulfill these. So it was (now it's to late) on KS to take action on this project. Don't understand me wrong, for me KS was a serious platform, where, of course, projects can go wrong, but because of the t of c, scam projects should be minimized. But if creators don't have to stay with these terms, what does this tell me about KS and other projects? I tried to contact KS, while the project was live, concerning the virtual images and not working prototype, but I just got a blabla-mail back. They only see their 6%
clara chen 1 day ago
I do not have any confidence on OLO project anymore. I may just fall into a historical largest kickstarter scam. Anyone has suggested what to reach out to the OLO, to either get next project status, money back, or justice?
ioannis 1 day ago
One last thing again this is not the place to have this discussion as i pointed out earlier :) Its not what the comments sections for and realistically does nt have a single thing to do with this project :P
ioannis 1 day ago
@ Saeed i get the point
but again Venture capital involves seeking and attracting official investors to sponsor your business or project through the selling of private shares. This is more of a “formal” approach that can be challenging and a little complicated. There are also a number of legal steps that a startup business needs to take in order to properly his or her business as well as any assets that may be accounted for in the process. Potential investors also want to ensure that their investments are protected should your business fail.Where as one of the main reasons why crowd funding is so effective and popular is because many startups have embraced the opportunities to reach right to their target audiences and provide them with a valuable service or product for sampling in exchange for a few dollars that count towards a startup’s overall campaign.
Kickstarter is merely a platform that allows us to back projects,we are not a company.Therefore it is our choice weather we choose to back a project or not.The terms and conditions are clear and easy to understand for all.Kickstarter is not affiliated with projects therefore they have no reason or are in a place to enforce anything.
Na your all good keep the 2 dollars for your next 2 projects you wanna back :)
Saeed Khan 1 day ago
@ioannis - Actually, and I'm saying this respectfully, you've still missed the point. Maybe I'm not being clear and I'll save everyone else the agony of explaining it again. BTW, I'll pay you $2 not to write comments to me anymore. :-)
ioannis 1 day ago
@ Saeed i go the point hence as i clearly pointed out in the messages.Rather than regurgitating the same gibberish in a different way let me again remind you if you dont like how kickstarter operates dont use it.It is a choice.
There can be a lot of harm in VC, s to a startup company especially if they lack in experience and business sense.I could easily spend all day explaining the pro s and cons of a VC and of a kickstarter.I could even explain how a combination of the two can work together in perfect unity.
If developers wanted to go down the Vc route many of them have that choice open to them whilst others dont.It s a choice.Just as you chose to invest 1 dollar, the developers,designers etc chose to go the crowdfunding route
I think you have missed my point tho if you want to complain about kickstarter may i suggest hitting the contact us button and airing your views to them.
Saeed Khan 1 day ago
@ioannis
I think you missed the point. The point is not about the OLO project, the point I was making is that crowdfunding is maturing and given the large scale failures, there needs to be more oversight on large projects like OLO.
When you're talking millions of dollars going to people who are making fundamentally unproven statement, there is a responsibility that MUST be taken by KS. So far, they've been able to wash their hands of any responsibility, but that won't last, and IF KS wanted to be a mature company then using proven methods from the VC industry makes sense.
There is no harm and lots to gain in having more oversight on higher funded projects - particularly in the early stages. This is beneficial to the backers, to the creators and certainly to KS's reputation as a place where large scale projects can be funded and delivered more successfully than any other crowdfunding site.
Saeed Khan 1 day ago
@ioannis -- It'll cost you more than one dollar. :-)
ioannis 1 day ago
Agreed Colin the main complaint is the lack of updates and your right we should nt have to ask.They took our money and have yet to deliver a update since the 5th of may.However from some of the updates from our friendly Italian backers.It does seem like olo s on track would just be nice to hear it from OLO themselves.
ioannis 1 day ago
saeed ill send you your dollar back if you promise not to comment anymore.
As for the comments regarding VCs this is crowdfunding so there is a few big differences as to why that argument wont work.One of the main ones being VCs can also maintain control provisions including board seat allowances and anti-dilution measures so that rights attributable to the venture capitalist don’t apply to crowdfunding shares.All of the hard work of crowdfunding is also building your brand – where the work with lawyers and pitching to partners in board rooms to do a VC round may be less so. While some young companies may choose to go this route often these days a startup would rather go crowdfunding route so that the control of the company remains solely theirs.
Id like to remind you as well we ALL (including you ) choose to back projects under kickstarter s t&c s.So the solution to your issue is simple choose not to back a project and you ll have no reason to complain pointlessly in a comment section especially when those complaints are directed at kickstarter and not the project in question.
Colin 1 day ago
I just want to know what they are doing and we shouldn't have to ask.
Saeed Khan 1 day ago
Given the troubled history of SEVERAL 3D printer projects, AND the amount of money OLO raised, Kickstarter should have some controls in place to minimize the risk of large scale failures -- i.e. like Zano, Peachy Printer, Coolest Cooler etc.
In short, say for any project that raises over $1M, they should only release, say 25% of the raised funds initially, so the creators can move forward with their project and their performance can be monitored. IF evidence of severe problems, false claims, lack of progress etc. are found, then the rest (75%) should be withheld until the problems are remedied.
This is how VCs work. If you raise 20M in a round ,you get it in tranches (literally slices). No use throwing good money after bad.
Seems though that KS would rather just take their commission and tell backers that they take 100% of the risk and KS takes 0% of any responsibility for users of their platform, even though they gladly take 5% of the funds raised.
The Wild West days of crowdfunding are over. Time to grow up Kickstarter.
Thomas 1 day ago
@SlimJim: totally agree
@Alex Tutusaus: you said wake up, it's kickstarter, but I say if we can't trust any projects on kickstarter, then f*ck Kickstarter!
John 1 day ago
Well, anyone who backed expecting them to contribute to the "comments" section was probably more than a bit naive - I mean if they didn't do it when you could take away their funding, why would they change their behavior when you have no way to get your money back?!
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@ned death I can't complain about Rift - still one of the best campaigns I've been involved in. http://imgur.com/gE3hx6K
asshole 1 day ago
ioannis beat me to it. I agree, just because some people say something "not nice" on the internet does not justify them ignoring the rest of their backers. That just goes to show that they're being as childish as they portray us "trolls" to be. It sounds like when a teacher punishes an entire class for something that 2 students did. Fair?
If they feel disheartened it's because there's a reason: their communication is appalling --> people get pissed --> sad face.
The "trolling" as they call it, didn't even really start until it was evident that they weren't posting anything. They were supposed to post videos and pics before the campaign deadline, as THEY promised, and didn't follow through. So we're to blame for them being disheartened when people question their conduct? Praise is supposed to be earned..
meisje 1 day ago
@Markuss, feel dishearten? Well I hope they do! They don't deserve anything else.
I feel fooled and somehow blame KS as well. They now say, that they don't have a working prototype. It's one of KS terms, to have one, before starting a project. KS has approved this without proof of a working prototype and virtual images. And also their resin needs to be developed? What, except of the money they got, is real?
ioannis 1 day ago
See if they had updated with us with everything that has been said in that video.i for one as im sure many other genuine backers would be happy with that but they dont even have the courtesy to do that we had to rely on other backers to attend,search for and translate for us in order to have what i consider to be a positive,reassuring and informed update.
ioannis 1 day ago
@ markuss
While i agree with some of what you said ( especially some ppl here to be trolls ) i have to disagree with the encouragement as im sure most backers would we have had exactly one update since funding closed so where have the olo team given the backers the info that they not only need but actually deserve (since their money made this possible)in order for backers to respond positively,or encourage or even praise.Read the comments i ve been defending olo a good deal i do however understand where the genuine ppl with genuine concerns are coming from.If your saying that is a good argument for olo to not update backers due to some trolls well thats just ridiculous and unfair to the backers as a whole.What was it 20 trolls he said ? So because of 20 trolls they refuse to update and punish all of us ?
Markuss 1 day ago
@asshole and ioannis
I think a bunch of people came here just to troll backers, people have been saying it's a scam since day 1, this is what he is refering to.
I also think his comments regarding the lack of encouragement is valid, if I were working on a project and all comments were like this I would feel disheartened.
asshole 1 day ago
I think most people here know about KS deadlines and their realism, Tutusaus. The comments regarding That subject are few and far in between.
I think it would be best if we all refrain referring to previous posts about deadlines and scams, as that's a small minority, and Filippo's already confused enough about what commenters are upset about.
The only things i'm going to say about deadlines:
In the video, he did tell his professor that an actual working prototype will be ready in 6 weeks. As in, a full fledged olo box that is not assisted by components outside the box.
He also made the claim somewhere in the video that they will have Olos out and in peoples hands before Christmas.
Alex Tutusaus 2 days ago
*to deliver
Alex Tutusaus 2 days ago
#1 Thanks @Giorgio for the great update
#2 @SlimJim @ioannis and basically the rest of us with some hope left in this project: we do agree they should communicate more, we do agree egos dont play any game here, nor nationalities....but hey! they raised 2M3 and they have "il sopravvento" on this... so theres not much more we can do but WAIT.
And whoever was expecting them to recieve OLO on time.... WAKE (the f*ck!) UP! This is Kickstarter!
Nick Spirov 2 days ago
I guess they just can't make it work. But that's also relatively good news - at least show they may be working on it.
Saeed Khan 2 days ago
@SlimJim
VERY well said. Totally agree.
ned death 2 days ago
@Giorgio Thanks for the time/effort and info.
As a Non Italian and another complainer (must make 11 of us now :D) i have to say i have read the whole of the posts on here an i can't see anything Troll like ( could not say for any Italian bits) so stop offending the people have supported you up to this point.
It does not take much just to post a little bit on here every now and again.
You have done a talk shared some details why are they not announced on here? you have taken a fair bit of money from a lot of people and no updates for over a month is just not good enough, if you can't organize your self now whilst things are in the development stage then how bad are you going to be when the products launched (if it ever does get launched that is, and if it does it could be as much of a farce as the Rift has been), we ask questions because we care and want to know how things are going not to annoy or insult you, so put the effort in and give us SOMETHING.
SlimJim 2 days ago
I'd like to be the 21st angry commenter but I'm not that angry..
I just have a bit of advice. The comment of "how there are more people complaining than praising them" is very easy to resolve. Just provide some updates. Talk to your backers. Make them feel included in the process. Talk about your challenges, your accomplishments. Seriously, just look at the comments and updates section of the Tiko 3D printer. It's like a perfectly run campaign. They talk about engineering challenges, their solutions, which team member is in China doing what, steps for molding parts, how the consistency was difficult to resolve, etc etc. Any their backers love them!
Btw, "being Italian" is not an excuse for lack of communication in CROWDfunding. I don't care if you are Italian, American, from Ghana or a Kiwi. If you wanted funding to do work in secret, you should have went the route of venture funding and you wouldn't have had to deal with the annoying people that handed you $2.3M dollars.. No wonder people are saying you are scamming them. That's because you are displaying the exact attributes people generalize onto Italians and then complaining about how you are not being treated fairly. Btw, I'm not Italian..
ioannis 2 days ago
I have a legitimate concern fir the lack of updates.i wonder if more ppl could see some of the comments how many of them would agree with him bout the "troll section " . Clearly ego s need to come down to earth if thats the case we the backers he refers to as troll s made this project possible by funding it and thats what he called us?
asshole 2 days ago
First off, grazie mille Giorgio per i video e per aver gia' tradotto le parti importanti. Io sarei stato troppo pigro! :) For non Italian speakers: don't worry about what i just said. Just secret Italian stuff. ;)
Now my 2 cents.
This will be my last wall of text on this project.
Here's some more screengrabs:
http://oi66.tinypic.com/zsr047.jpg
http://oi66.tinypic.com/2wnpzc6.jpg
6 minutes into the second video he says Stefano (no idea who that is), responds in the "right" section of kickstarter. Bascially, this section here is the "troll section".
Apparantely having legitimate concerns about the professional conduct of a company puts you in the troll category.
He says that if you ask a question in the correct place you'll get an answer. Anybody found this magical section?
He's missing the problem though: he keeps referring to the skeptics who think the project is a scam, and ignores the fact that most of the complaints are based on their absence.
For the Olo fellows:
Nella piccolissima possibilita' che stiate leggendo questi commenti, vi sarebbe costato nulla dirci come minimo "ciao, stiamo lavorando sul progetto, ma siamo ancora vivi"? Va beh che ora c'e' il video di Milano, ma avreste risparmiato un sacco di tempo e problemi se solo vi sareste fatti vivi almeno una volta nell'ultimo mese. Il problema non e' che ci sono scettici a riguardo del vostro progetto, ma che voi ignorate il resto di noi che ci chiediamo dove siete finiti. Come minimo ci meritiamo una giustificazione per credere in voi, e invece siete stati assenti da quando avete fatto l'aggiornamento del backerkit.
The Cepparian 2 days ago
I am thinking that all this project, OLO and so on are just a way for these people to have a sort of revenge against life or other people who never trusted their works or their minds (this is why they flew from italy and underline so many times how italians are so bad). It's also clear from the updates we had during the KS, always focused on advertise their success, how good they are, the "record of the 3d printer project" on KS, so many images of awards etc. etc. and in the end? Still no real working prototype... They even went to a public conference with nothing just to underline how good they are just to gain some glory. I really hope they will realize OLO as they promised otherwise all this show they are doing will fall and crush them a lot more than their ego
asshole 2 days ago
screengrab, here you go:
http://oi63.tinypic.com/200e9h0.jpg
asshole 2 days ago
...for the record, i don't think Giorgio's an ass. I think Whatshisface from the olo printer is...
asshole 2 days ago
i'm listening to Giorgio's videos as we speak. 4 minutes in and i already think the guy's an ass. In response to a lady who pointed out the concerns from the backers, he basically retorts that those of us who voice our concerns are just trolls and have no "scientific or technical notion". What an absolute ASS! CLASSIC Italian behaviour: never admit fault + blame someone else.
@Colin
"I seriously hope the reason they aren't posting stuff is that they are just working as hard as they can on the project."
They're Italian so..no.
And i'm not being offensive here. I'm full blooded: i know my people. :)
eleazar carmeli 2 days ago
@Giorgio hey are they showing print samples in the video ? It's towards the last 5 minutes of the video. If those are print samples then I am impressed.
Viral Videos 2 days ago
saeed and mr asshole is what makes this place fun and by commenting here u joined our ranks
Saeed Khan 2 days ago
@Lami
Please show me where I did that.
Lami 2 days ago
Saeed Khan: please be so kind and stop calling people who don't complain or generally don't spend all their time writing comments "ignorant". We just have better things to do.
Colin 2 days ago
Thanks for the info! I'm just confused right now about what I should think. There are so many conflicting things.
Saeed Khan 2 days ago
@Giorgio
Thank you so much for your detailed comment and translation. I have to say that nothing that you've described gives a positive feel for this project.
First, perhaps I'm one of the 10 non-Italian complainers they refer to. I'll take that as a badge of honour.
To be honest, that kind of answer -- i.e. out of 16,000 backers, there are only a tiny handful who are complaining -- shows a real level of ignorance of how sentiment in these projects exists. We know that only a small minority of KS backers ever visit the site and comment, let alone comment regularly.
Secondly, it's the kind of statement that is used by people who really have no intention of addressing the issues raised. i.e. well only a tiny percent are complaining so they are just crybabies unlike the large majority who aren't complaining.
Third, it's unclear if he addressed the utter lack of communication they've had with the backers. Did he say that would change or that they'd start regularly commenting or updating?
Lastly, they are 6 weeks away from a "REAL working prototype". i.e. best case, that will be late July if not August. They were supposed to go to production in July. Very bad news. Also on May 5 update, they stated:
"We have two production updates that we are excited to share with you; the preproduction of the test mold will be ready in 10 days and the sensor chip will be ready by next week!"
Since then no news and it's not even clear what those two milestones actually mean.
Overall, it's pretty clear they are struggling severely with this project and have little to show for it so far.
What would be better for them would be to be open and honest about the project and status and if there are challenges they have to overcome, then be honest about that. They've raised a LOT of money and have a responsibility to the backers to be open and honest in their communication. Something they have not been until now.
Charles McGuinness 2 days ago
Thanks for the update Giorgio. I look forward to hearing how things progress...
The Atomic Soul 2 days ago
WAIT- are they trying to make their own resin? WHY? There's TONS of different companies making resin already, and some of them are working on resin that uses light from a screen. Go with them and save all the time and expense instead of making your own.
(Thank you Georgio.!)
ioannis 2 days ago
Georgio you are now my favourite italian.thanks for that share and taking the time to translate for the rest of us.greatly appreciated.i had a good chuckle at that comment how no one s praised them id like to take this opportunity to remind them that without a update we re not in a position to praise them and while some have complained myself and others have come to their defence but every one is in fairness beginning to become frustrated with lack if updates we dont need constant one a month and a hello in the conments once in a while would do . We get time is important and could be better used bringing us our olo s rather than constant updates but if you want praise give us a reason to clap our hands and say well done ! Lol