全 169 件のコメント

[–]You_Have_No_Power [スコア非表示]  (38子コメント)

I was browsing PCMR, and they had a screenshot of mod thief for consoles who claimed to be a "political activist" who admits to stealing mods from PC modders because "PC gamers are selfish". I feel bad for the modders who put so much work into their creation only to have it stolen. Bethesda could do more but they won't.

Edit: thanks /u/arevbavariangod for the source

Here's the one where the thief calls himself a political activist.

http://imgur.com/tEuTlhg

[–]ImFranny [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Actually Bethesda has been taking down the most known stolen mods, but it's still a long way from taking the entire issue into control :S

[–]AREVbavarianGod [スコア非表示]  (12子コメント)

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cj8eamAWgAAeF4y.jpg:large

Link for those interested...

Bethesda are shooting themselves in the foot if they don't do something about this. Their games live and die by their mod communities as far as I am concerned.

[–]Calorie_Mate [スコア非表示]  (10子コメント)

He says that he has "years of mods experience", yet he uploaded a mod that wasnt supported, which in the end, broke savegames for many users. Someone with years of mods experience should be able to check a mod for basic incompatibility if you ask me.

Also, in his first response to the outrage, he proudly proclaimed that if anyone should be held responsible for the broken saves, its the original mod author.

He not only stole mods, and then claimed some political agenda that doesn't even hold up, but also broke the game for many people. And even though he denies it now, he actually was open for donations. Its a joke really.

[–]AREVbavarianGod [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

This may be one of the most self important and absurd things I've seen in the gaming community in some time...

[–]HelmutVillam [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

Coming from years of Morrowind modding: Messing around with mods for Bethesda games and expecting your existing save to work fine is a little optimistic and I don't think it's fair to blame anyone but the user over it.

[–]Blackadder18 [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

Most people with an Xbox One (who don't have FO4 on PC) probably don't have any experience with modding. So they wouldn't be aware of this. So the blame would be on the hack that ported someone elses mod, and didn't warn any of the clueless users (not trying to be facetious, a lot of people using mods on console really don't understand the workings of it) that there may be issues with save games.

[–]HappyZavulon [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

So the blame would be on the hack that ported someone elses mod

And probably Bethesda. There should at least be a huge warning saying that installing anything has a high chance of breaking your game and saves.

In a better world they would check every mod for compatibility, but we know this won't happen.

[–]Blackadder18 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Yeah part of the blame would go to Bethesda too. Although they took the step to have the game automatically make a backup of your save file before you started using mods in case you need to go back to that.

It would have made more sense if the first couple of months they curated the mod selection for consoles, to ensure a selection of mods that are high quality, officially endorsed (by both Bethesda and the modder who made it) and don't reduce performance of the game (to a certain level).

I guess I expected too much of them.

[–]Arrowmaster [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

This is why I stopped releasing WoW addons under open source licenses, changed existing addons to closed source licenses, and eventually quit modding. Some of the most self important asswipes I've ever run across. You just give up on the toxic community after they constantly bitch and complain when they aren't even getting the mods from the approved source and wonder why you haven't fixed something yet.

[–]Neato [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

Wait, there are mods on console that can break savegames? This seems like something Bethesda should have protected agai-Oh wait. I forgot it was Bethesda.

[–]The_mango55 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

It won't break your old games because it makes a new modded folder of your character. So unless you delete it manually you can always go back to the old saves. But yeah breaking your games is always a risk when modding, no reason it should be any different with consoles.

If anything Bethedsa games are surprisingly resilient against changes to the game files. Allowing you to enable and disable files at will while in other games removing mods would cause CTDs when loading.

[–]MIKE_BABCOCK [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

You can do this any modable game, its not really Bethesdas fault. For the most part it fails gracefully, there's just some cases it can't recover from.

[–]Jcpmax [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

They are already doing something about it.

[–]ReV_VAdAUL [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

As someone who follows politics pretty closely it is amazing how most words have ceased to have meaning. Stealing things and claiming you're a "political activist" fits right in with that. What an arsehole.

Still though, hopefully Bethesda can get this in hand quickly, it isn't a huge surprise that scumbags have tried to take advantage of console modding before there's an established community surrounding it.

[–]therevengeofsh [スコア非表示]  (5子コメント)

That's... hilarious. Why didn't anyone tell me I'm rich? Apparently I'm rich. But seriously I don't game on consoles, because I'm NOT rich. It's far more cost effective to invest in a decent desktop than a console with all the peripherals and $60 games. I mean you have to have a computer anyways, I imagine the great majority of "poor" console owners also have a PC in their house somewhere.

If you are going to spend $400 on a shitty notebook, that'll last you 2 years, plus a console and $60 games; you might as well spend $900 on a decent desktop that will last much longer and have cheaper games.

There are a few reasons to own a console, but cost effectiveness certainly isn't one of them.

[–]The_mango55 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

People who don't play games on PC or do things like video editing are more likely to have a laptop than a desktop. Much more convenient.

[–]MumrikDK [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

I mean you have to have a computer anyways

This was always the core argument for me.

Meanwhile, I don't even have a TV.

[–]Klosu [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

The other side says "You have TV anyways".

[–]GetClem [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Honestly I don't buy that. PC's are only cheaper in certain places like the USA.

[–]thatguythatdidstuff [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

a shitty PC is cheaper than a console, but a decent PC is far more expensive.

[–]human_bean_ [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Pirates will always rationalize away the copyright violation, but it will always be bullshit. Only thing that works is enforcing the law. Outside that, there's very little people can do.

[–]BoomRockDopSop [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

I'm just going to throw it out here as a person who's into the TES modding scene that this kind of behaviour could possibly lead to modders just closing shit down and stopping modding altogether.

[–]AirPhforce [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

If something gets popular, you are going to be bombarded with complaints from console gamers, either demanding you port it, or saying the port that someone else uploaded doesn't work and you need to fix it.

[–]thatguythatdidstuff [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

its the exact same as PC users demanding that you change something or 'fix' something to their liking, I see it all the time when im looking through mods.

its literally the same problem with a different crowd, stop trying to witchhunt console users just because they're now getting something you spent years dangling over them.

[–]Tiffany_Stallions [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Dame as PC gamers complaining loads are to resource heavy or don't work on their rig, there's no difference. There are entitled people on every platform, don't act like one is better then the other, that's just immature on your part.

[–]KolbyKolbyKolby [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Last week Bethesda said Xbox One's Fallout 4 mod traffic Was 50 times bigger than the PC's at launch, so it's clear the initiative has been hugely successful.

This line is pretty bullshit, since no PC user would likely get their mods from the Bethesda site rather than nexus. I find it pretty disingenuous.

[–]thatguythatdidstuff [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

the success is relative to them. they don't give a shit about nexus since it has nothing to do with them, whats important is getting traffic onto their own service. and this is exactly why Bethesda are going to continue favouring consoles, because it has a wider audience for them.

[–]NoLifeMatters [スコア非表示]  (27子コメント)

Seems to me the easiest fix for this would be to add a script extender necessity to all your mods. From what I understand this would make them unusable on console since consoles can't get the script extender.

Or hide some other shit in there that may be able to fuck with the console's ability to use the mod though that could potentially also screw over low-end PCs.

Edit: Though yes, the developer and the console publishers should be the ones cracking down. I'm just putting out ideas that bypass them.

[–]Stolen_FBI_Van [スコア非表示]  (9子コメント)

Hiding landmines in mods wouldn't be fair to people who just download the mods without knowing it's stolen, but I agree with idea of using a script extender to protect mods.

It's definitely not what Bethesda would want, but it would give modders a proper choice for whether or not they want their content available for consoles.

I don't mean this to be malicious towards console gamers that just want mods, but it's important we give credit where credit is due because nearly all modders just do this as a hobby, and stealing from them only serves to drive them away.

[–]NoLifeMatters [スコア非表示]  (8子コメント)

I'm not talking about anything that would damage the system, just something that would make it run really, really bad on a console.

At the moment the consoles can't handle the new expansion's fog effects, they're dropping to sub 30 FPS all over the place. Hide some fog in all your mods, something like that.

[–]Mundius [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

Consoles are already constantly sub 30, remember when Xbone hit a minimum of 0 FPS?

[–]NoLifeMatters [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Apparently the new fog is a particularly bad problem on them at the moment.

[–]Neato [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I've heard it's bad on PC too. Volumetric fog is pretty intensive. They should couple it with a render-distance scaler so when you are in fog too dense to see through it stops trying to draw things on the other side of it.

[–]MrFraps [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

I still don't understand why anyone should do that? Punish everyone because of the few bad apples.

[–]NoLifeMatters [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

It's not punishing, it's ensuring a lack of theft of mods.

Those people using it should not be using it until the original mod author decides to port the mod themselves.

They'll use the stolen one, it'll tank their framerate, they'll uninstall it.

When the original author decides to port it they can remove the ad-hoc DRM.

[–]MrFraps [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

Oh, ok I get what you're saying now. But wouldn't that effect PC users as well? They're downloading off the Nexus where most mods are posted anyways.

[–]Neato [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Yeah it would if that script extender or whatever wasn't already installed. Those usually need to be done manually even though a ton of mods require it. Something else like a library incompatibility that a PC mod could automatically change could be better. Maybe a hidden texture that was the wrong size or something.

[–]NoLifeMatters [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

It would effect low-end PCs with stats like the consoles. It's a sub-optimal solution but an idea.

[–]SlimMaculate [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

Or hide some other shit in there that may be able to fuck with the console's ability to use the mod though that could potentially also screw over low-end PCs.

That sounds a lot like obtrusive DRM.

[–]NoLifeMatters [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

It is, but unlike a product that is sold since the only way a console gets it is via theft having obtrusive DRM is valid.

DRM sucks when it affects legal customers. No legal customer exists in this situation.

[–]thatguythatdidstuff [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

wait so you're trying to say when its a company thats actually trying to stop people actively stealing from them and not paying for a product that years of work and money went into DRM is bad and shouldnt be done..

but when its a free pack of weapon skins for said game made by someone for free, DRM should be enforced?

thats really absurd logic.

[–]ofNoImportance [スコア非表示]  (6子コメント)

Seems to me the easiest fix for this would be to add a script extender necessity to all your mods. From what I understand this would make them unusable on console since consoles can't get the script extender.

Someone could just remove that requirement again. The only way that would work is if you mod actually needs the script extender to work at all.

[–]NoLifeMatters [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

I'm sure it couldn't be two hard to make some scripts that use it here and there even if they're mostly filler.

[–]ofNoImportance [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

It only takes as much effort to remove them as it takes effort to add them in.

If you have a mod that otherwise does not require the script extender, then add in some non-requirements here and there, they can be removed and your mod will function exactly as it's supposed to.

Finding them is only as difficult as attempting to use the mod without its dependencies present. As soon as a usage of the script extender is required, the game would crash and the mod 'stealer' can find the offending dependency. Rinse and repeat.

So unless the mod genuinely requires the script extender, a modder can just remove those dependencies and then 'steal' it.

[–]NoLifeMatters [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Well yes, people would always be able to remove it via the GECK and could remove even legit script features to make the mod console friendly.

It would be a deterrent, not a sure thing.

[–]Donutology [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I doubt these "thieves" would do that, though. Probably wouldn't know how to anyway.

[–]MIKE_BABCOCK [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

...at that point they might as well just buy a gaming pc and start modding lol

The amount of effort they are putting in to stealing a mod would be the same as just making one, only without the credit to your name and the satisfaction of making a mod lol

[–]ofNoImportance [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Well, no, not really.

Only one person needs to remove the dependency then re-host the mod for all console players.

And removing the dependency would not take the same amount of effort as making it all over again. In fact it would take a very small amount of effort to remove.

[–]xdownpourx [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Some of the stolen mods aren't working anyways but they were still put up

[–]capybaraluver [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Mod authors won't necessarily use se to stop console mods but it's a plus of using se to start with. Then maybe folks can be patient if the mod author decides to make some console version on their own time if at all.

[–]AirPhforce [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Seems to me the easiest fix for this would be to add a script extender necessity to all your mods. From what I understand this would make them unusable on console since consoles can't get the script extender.

You can still load mods w/o the script extender, they just don't function properly and break. Someone stealing a mod that requires the FOSE would likely just end with disgruntled console gamers flocking tot he true authors page and demanding he fix it.

[–]ChipmunkDJE [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

Forgive my naivety, but couldn't the thief just copy said script extender/extensions needed as well? Not sure I understand what a script extender is.

[–]NoLifeMatters [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

They allow you to use more complex scripts and the SE is installed manually into the game files and requires starting the game via a different .exe file.

It's outside of what could be done on the consoles and it's doubtful they could handle more complex scripts than they already do without huge performance hits.

[–]Romulus_Novus [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

And even if they could technically handle the scripting required, I very much so doubt that Sony or Microsoft want people messing around with that sort of thing

[–]AREVbavarianGod [スコア非表示]  (38子コメント)

I feel like bringing mods to consoles was a terrible idea in terms of what it has done to the mod community. The level of ignorance on display is astounding. Your console has limitations, scripts and changes to the libraries are big no-nos. It's not a matter of checking a box to allow your mod to be used on PS4 and XB1. Now we have an asshole stealing mods... I hope this doesn't hurt the mod community for Bethesda games long term.

[–]ImFranny [スコア非表示]  (9子コメント)

The problem is that it's actually not 1 asshole stealing mods, there are currently many different people doing it... Not to mention there are people encouraging to steal mods. (I can provide proof if you want)

[–]Jcpmax [スコア非表示]  (8子コメント)

Yes. There are maybe 100 people stealing mods. Then there are tens of thousands enjoying the mods uploaded, not stealing anything and thousands saying thank you to the modders on r/fo4 and r/fallout.

It seriously aggravates me when I see people saying that console mods were a bad idea, because some assholes steal mods. It has been a problem on PC (I am a PC player only) for decades as well.

Right now Bethesda has been removing all the stolen mods, but hopefully they get a better handle on it and perma-ban people who upload stolen mods. Maybe linking their Beth-net account with steam.

Lets give it more than a week or two before we throw the baby out with the bathwater.

[–]ImFranny [スコア非表示]  (5子コメント)

Yes, but you see, on PC the problem is much much smaller and people usually only pirate or steal mods when the modder decides to take the mods down and hide them which is kind of rare. But on consoles they do it so openly and it's a big slap in the face.

[–]MrFraps [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

There were a ton of stolen mods when paid mods was established. People will do anything if it benefits them.

[–]ImFranny [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

True, but paid mods were taken care of quickly and things went back to normal in a matter of days.

This is very different and it's outrageous that they reuplaod stolen mods to a website like this and not a torrent/piracy website.

Thats the problem, it's that Bethesda should be taking action and they are, but they are still far from removing all or most of the stolen mods.

[–]Jcpmax [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

But on consoles they do it so openly and it's a big slap in the face.

What do you mean by openly? They make obscure names for the mods so they don't get caught and those that are, get removed.

I would like to see them get Perma-banned and hope Bethesda gets on that ASAP. But I still don't see how some assholes who pirate mods should equate to Bethesda removing mods from consoles.

Thats pretty much like saying that game developers should stop making games for PC because some people choose to pirate their games on the platform.

[–]ImFranny [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

When I say openly I mean the fucking guys that steal mods come to reddit or facebook or other known websites and literally admit to stealing mods. it's so fucking ridiculous. One of the modders who got mods "stolen" made a video with comments from console players, and it's plain stupidity what some console players are saying and I'm shocked by how self entitled they are and how they think it's not a problem to steal and reupload mods.

[–]Jcpmax [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Completely agree with that. I generally hate the entitlement of the gaming community. I especially hate pirates like these assholes who try to legitimatize their actions.

I read the account from the guy who fancied himself a robin hood for taking the mods on Nexus and uploading them on Beth.net. A real scumbag.

[–]Neato [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Console mods aren't a bad idea in general. But of course Bethesda implemented them in a lazy way so there are plenty of avenues for abuse or mods breaking the game. They really need to curate their mods for a hardware profile that simply can't handle most of the changes.

Not to mention console gamers are plug-and-play gamers. They don't usually like to tinker. They want a single click to install and don't want to have to manage load order or compatibility. A rule for console mods is that they should have to be compatible with each other and not introduce anything another could easily break.

[–]Ultrace-7 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

A lazy way is better than no way at all. If I recall correctly, allowing mods on consoles so openly is pretty groundbreaking. So, the first people to do it to this extent, Bethesda, don't get it perfectly. That makes sense.

[–]Devugly [スコア非表示]  (16子コメント)

Why was it a terrible idea? It was certainly ambitious and its being enjoyed immensely. After this, things will surely change and creators will get the credit they deserve.

[–]Romulus_Novus [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I'm not the guy you were replying to, and I do think he was a tad hyperbolic, but I can see where he's coming from. I think part of the problem is that modding was never really something that Bethesda actively advertised before, it was just something that happened to their games. Now though, they're advertising modding to a community that isn't used to it. Because Bethesda has endorsed modding on consoles, and has it operating through their site, they've made an expectation that all mods will work well. When they don't, it leads to problems for the mod authors

They've also kind of been making it an adversarial thing between PC and consoles. Their claim that the "modding launch on Xbox was 50 times larger than on PC" is totally meaningless, as no-one on PC uses their site to get mods. This has again led to friction between mod creators/the pc modding community and people just experiencing mods for the first time on console

Bethesda could fix this, with heavy curation and checking to make sure that mods aren't stolen and work, but that seems unlikely given their efforts with paid mods last year

[–]MIKE_BABCOCK [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

In theory its a good thing. It opens up modding to a whole new audience and allows a new generation of gamers to feel inspired to start modding.

In reality its just created a big rift between the two communities. Children who haven't grown out of the whole "console wars" mentality are ruining what could be a good thing.

All its doing is encouraging modders to only release on the nexus and avoid all interactions with console gamers. Thats a bad thing. It creates this whole "fuck pc gamers" shit like what we're seeing here.

[–]AREVbavarianGod [スコア非表示]  (13子コメント)

There is nothing wrong with mods on consoles in and of itself; the problem comes from the lack of understanding that console owners have of how mods are made and what limitations their machines have. Modding on a closed platform mean that you are not going to get the best mod content because library changes and external scripts are a no go on consoles. When console users don't understand these things it leads to whining and ultimately hostility. Now we have some douche who is stealing people's mods and saying he is an "activist" crusading against the "elitism and class-ism of PC users". Give me a fuckin' break, the dude is a scumbag thief. For the most part, the mod community for TES and Fallout have been pretty harmonious until Fallout 4. I just worry that this new dynamic of people feeling slighted because their machines are not capable of running all of the mod content available will have long time modders finding other games to mod with a more enlightened community.

[–]MrFraps [スコア非表示]  (12子コメント)

You're generalizing a lot, not all console owners are ignorant. I have coworkers who are sysadmins and IT specialists that have no intention to game on a PC.

[–]Donutology [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

As long as a decent chunk of console gamers are constantly harassing the modders, it hardly matters.

The last thing modders need is more harassment from the community. They are doing this (mostly) for free, as their hobby. After such disencouragment from the community, a lot of modders might leave the scene. And some people would consider this a victory...

[–]MrFraps [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

No one is considering the loss of modders as a victory. This is a new scene for consoles, and it'll take time for users to become adjusted.

I could absolutely say the same about the PC community during paid mods deployment when they felt that modders shouldn't be paid for their work.

[–]Donutology [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

I'm not blaming any particular platform owner here. But look at the mindset of this fella in the OP. He thinks he is Robin Hood or something. People like him would consider that a victory.

And yes PC gamers have also done this for paid mods but it doesn't make this situation any better.

[–]MrFraps [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

As long as a decent chunk of console gamers are constantly harassing the modders

You did blame console owners, generalized all of them into a small sub group.

He thinks he is Robin Hood or something. People like him would consider that a victory.

No one is condoning his actions. His plan wasn't obviously to stop modders from creating mods, he wanted a mod on his preferred platform.

[–]AREVbavarianGod [スコア非表示]  (7子コメント)

Take a look at the comments on Bethesda.net, it's a bunch of people begging for the uploader to "tick the PS4/xbox1 checkbox" and accusing uploaders of favoring PC gamers. Are there technically literate console gamers? Absolutely. The problem is that the reasons consoles are popular in the first place (easy to set up, PS4 games run on a PS4--no exceptions, each machine performs identically etc. etc.) attract people who are far less technically literate. This shows when you see discussions about native resolutions, frame rates, graphics options etc. I'm not here trying to shit talk console gamers. I'm pointing to evidence that shows that the lack of technical understand that the average console gamer has contributes to a greater misunderstanding of what is and is not possible on their machines. This in turn has created a schism in a community that was previously copacetic.

[–]MrFraps [スコア非表示]  (6子コメント)

You're still generalizing, there are very few people begging/stealing mods than those who are just downloading and enjoying them.

[–]AREVbavarianGod [スコア非表示]  (5子コメント)

Have you seen the comments? Do you look at the forums? To what do you attribute this issue?

[–]MrFraps [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

Do you honestly believe all console users are agreeing with those who are stealing mods? It's always the vocal minority. You, like the rest of us, are a vocal minority and a small fraction of the gaming community.

[–]AREVbavarianGod [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

Do you honestly believe all console users are agreeing with those who are stealing mods?

No, I don't. What I am saying is that when people don't understand the process of developing a mod and the inherent limitations of their preferred platform they are more likely to feel that they are being short changed by another part of the community that doesn't have those same limitations. If they are not educated on the matter they could contribute to greater issues in the community.

[–]MrFraps [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

So they shouldn't be able to experience user created mods at all? Would it be great if everyone understood what effort it took to make games and mods? Sure. But, that's an inconceivable notion to hold when this industry focuses on entertainment for the masses.

[–]The_mango55 [スコア非表示]  (6子コメント)

Temporary growing pains. Won't hurt the community long term. People steal mods from each other on PC too.

[–]AREVbavarianGod [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

People steal mods from each other on PC too.

I'm aware. the difference is that once the PC community notices, there is generally backlash against the thief and some community driven corrective action. There is a certain etiquette that has developed. With mods being new to consoles, I'm not sure how aware console users are of this type of etiquette or whether they will support actions like this because they feel slighted when a mod is not made available on their console of choice. It raises some questions in my mind.

[–]Donutology [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

It's not only stealing though. Imagine a big, detailed mod coming out. It would not be available on consoles naturally and immature console players would throw a tantrum, constantly harass the modder and if they do steal the mod and put it up for the consoles they'll likely cause a lot of technical issues on many innocent console gamers too.

Modders are going to have a bad, bad time.

[–]fullonrantmode [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

This is a tempest in a teacup.

[–]Donutology [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

It might not be the end of modding but I think it's still really important.

[–]YouBeDerping [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

I like how you call console gamers immature but PC gamers are currently crying about people playing Fallout 4 mods on console.

[–]Donutology [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I didn't call console gamers immature. "Immature console gamers" does not mean every console gamer is immature.

[–]N4N4KI [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

What I want to know is how are they expecting mod authors to beta test their content if they don't own a console? and if they do own a console if there is any debug info they can get from it.

[–]AREVbavarianGod [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I think a large part of the problem is that many console users do not understand what goes into making a mod, much less general software development. I think that many are under the assumption that if it works with Fallout 4 on one platform they can expect it to work on another. The incessant comments asking mod uploaders to "tick the ps4/xbox box so that I can download plz" seems to corroborate this idea.

[–]Neato [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I think a fix to this would be for a clever mod author to find a way to put in a setting somewhere that was crucial to the mod running at all that completely broke when uploaded to a console. Something simple like a library incompatibility. That way mod thieves would have to practically rewrite the mod in order to port it, negating the easy theft.

[–]TheAlbinoAmigo [スコア非表示]  (7子コメント)

I like how 'stolen' is given in quotations as if there were any other way to describe what was being done with them.

E: Since it's not clear to the uber-literal folk on Reddit, I am talking about these mods being stolen in the colloquial sense, not the by-the-books overly legal sense. Modders created something, other people took it without permission, to everyone except IP lawyers that is theft, it doesn't matter what 'IP Statute of Law article 15 paragraph 4' states.

[–]Neato [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

It's copying, not theft. The PC piracy debate has settled this literally a decade ago. Theft requires the original to be missing.

[–]Vadara [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

The PC piracy debate has settled this literally a decade ago

It is theft, and no amount of PCMR cult propaganda will undo that truth.

[–]Scuderia [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

Copyright infringement is what is actually being done.

[–]TheAlbinoAmigo [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

There's a few categories it falls under, but taking someone elses' intellectual and creative work and hosting it without the authors' permission nor credit means that 'stolen' is definitely one of them.

[–]Petrieiticus [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

You know if people approached mods the way they did typical software, which is what we are all heading towards anyway, they would realize the benefit of copyright here. If Bethesda were smart, they would offer advice to mod creators on how to licence their code properly and offer to litigate on behalf of "official/paid" mod creators when stuff like this happens.

[–]Tetsu4 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I just want simple mods on my ps4 like perk points or something :c, Yet everything is going bad already.

Also it kinda sad when PC players lump all console player together instead of just the few.

[–]AmericanCaesara [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

When someone mentions politics and video games all in the same breath, you know you're going to be in for some good popcorn discussion.

[–]hteezy [スコア非表示]  (7子コメント)

Is all of this really as bad as its being made out to be? I mean in terms of how often mod content is being stolen and how often modders are being heckled by console users.

[–]N4N4KI [スコア非表示]  (6子コメント)

and how often modders are being heckled by console users.

go to mods.bethesda.net pick a mod that's not on xbox and PS4. take a read of the comments.

[–]thatguythatdidstuff [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

ironically I just did that and didn't see many complaints about it being on consoles, what I did see was scores of angry complaints from PC users demanding stuff be added to the mod or for something to be fixed.

this isn't a 'console gamer' problem, this is just a gamer problem. PC users are no less annoying and entitled.

[–]Razumen [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

There's more than 1500 mods for PC, you can't possible expect him to just randomly search them all for angry comments can you?

[–]N4N4KI [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

my point was that if you pick any popular mod that is on PC and not consoles you will find comments begging for it to be brought to consoles/misinformation about how easy it is to do so etc..

I know I looked when a post about it was made over at PCMR, they don't seem to have gotten any better since mods were released for the XB1

[–]You_Have_No_Power [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

IMO, the begging isn't as big of an issue, but its when they start getting angry and irrational. They start threatening and verbally attacking the modders.

Edit: didn't want to paint all console gamers in the same light. There are a lot who understands the modders' explanation of technical limitations on the console and move on, but some linger and take it personally.

[–]MIKE_BABCOCK [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

I went to the mod site and filtered all PC only mods, then closed my eyes and clicked on one randomly. I did this like 4 times.

Each mod had at least one person begging for a console version.

[–]Razumen [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

The ones I saw they were just asking for a console version, that's not the same as heckling at all. Where else are they gonna ask, Craigslist?

[–]Vadara [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

PC gamers endorse piracy and stealing dev work, and letting the people who work on their beloved games starve.

Bitch about console players "taking" free mods.

L M F A O

Bring on the downvotes, boys. PC Gamers are the most entitled children I have ever seen.