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Could United have handled LVG's departure better? (self.reddevils)

Shifter99Carrick が 投稿

BBC Sports editor Dan Roan:

"In April 2014, United's mishandling of the sacking of Moyes was heavily criticised, the coach humiliated when learning of his demise through the media.

"The club's hierachy accepted it was wrong that news had leaked out before the manager had been informed. But two years on, it has happened again.

"Van Gaal was apparently informed of his impending departure by his wife when - still at Wembley following the club's FA Cup Final win - she read the news on the BBC website on Saturday evening.

"United hold the Dutchman in high regard and had desperately tried to maintain secrecy during their negotiations with Mourinho, hoping Van Gaal would lead his team to a top-four spot in the Premier League.

"Even after that target was missed, the club wanted him to be able to enjoy his FA Cup win, never once briefing against their coach or adding to the speculation. But it was always naive to think that news of their plans would remain secret.

"Once the news broke on Saturday, it was hard to fathom why they waited to put Van Gaal out of his misery. Once again serious questions will be asked about the way the Glazer regime runs the club - and the way it communicates."

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[–]DarmianLVG 14ポイント15ポイント  (3子コメント)

Absolutely, but the final leaks appear to be Mendes' doing, not the club.

[–]mufcirclejerk 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

I believe the club has offered some sort of access or privilege to reporters in exchange for them not publishing any of this prior to the FA Cup final. The news broke in multiple outlets immediately after the final. (Like, right after the final whistle -- before LVG's press conference even.)

The reports which are running today have a huge number of very detailed insights from "a source close to the players".

[–]DarmianLVG 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Yeah that's possible too, but if so that's very disrespectful to LVG.

[–]mufcirclejerk 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Maybe I wasn't clear. I think the story was going to break before the Cup final, and the club went above and beyond to prevent that from happening.

[–]dannybark 26ポイント27ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yes, in December 2015.

[–]Crusty_Gammon_Flaps 3ポイント4ポイント  (2子コメント)

It's agents leaking information not the club.

[–]fjpeaceManchester United -1ポイント0ポイント  (1子コメント)

but surely Jose has some control over his agent he can't just go around doing whatever the fuck he wants, he works for Jose not the other way around

[–]Crusty_Gammon_Flaps 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't know what happens behind the scenes but I just said it wasn't the club, I didn't say Jose had nothing to do with it.

[–]Dude-o-minator 8ポイント9ポイント  (19子コメント)

Yes.

Edit: My statement is about how the club handled the departure with Louis himself, not how it was/will be announced to the world.

[–]TIDZ3Rash-Daddy 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

How? The club and Mourinho have been silent all season until Saturday when Mendes leaked the news. What else could the club have done?

[–]kmtchlEvra 0ポイント1ポイント  (12子コメント)

Care to elaborate? If Mendes leaked the news, what could the club have done to handle the situation better?

E: If they'd announced it earlier in the season, we could have ended up in an even worse league position (Manchester City).

[–]BloodyMess111 2ポイント3ポイント  (3子コメント)

Put it in a contract that the club dictates when the news is broke?

[–]kmtchlEvra 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

First of all, how can the club put into a contract that "news" of this deal will be leaked on their terms, when the deal itself hasn't been agreed (apparently happening Tuesday)?

Even if that contract could be made, what if that contract is broken?

News would be leaked that Mourinho is going to be the new manager. However, that agreement is void because of the news being leaked.

So where does that leave us?

  • An unhappy LVG because he found out the club were having talks with Mourinho behind his back
  • Potentially no manager lined up to replace LVG.

[–]BloodyMess111 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Come on, Mendes is embedded in our club. Mourinho has been nailed on for 6 months. You don't have to void the contract, just have a clause that Mendes' company to pay reparations should the story leak from a source not at the club. There should only be a handful of people who know what is happening. It can't be that hard to contain. Utd used to business like this all the time. A transfer would just happen.

[–]wharsmetoothpicson 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Exactly, it also comes off as weakness on the part of the board in that Mendes believes he can act without any sort of repercussions

[–]Dude-o-minator 0ポイント1ポイント  (7子コメント)

I know it probably was not possible, but they shouldn't approach to sign a new manager behind the current one's back. I would be furious at my employer if I'd knew they had some behind my back agreement to replace me at some point. Either you are sincere with the man and let him know what the situation is as it develops or you end up with a mess like this.

[–]yuhche 0ポイント1ポイント  (6子コメント)

Do you not look for and secure new employment before telling your current employer you're leaving? Why should it be any different when it's the other way round?

[–]Dude-o-minator 0ポイント1ポイント  (5子コメント)

Maybe I'm weird but I always inform my manager/superior about my plans and that I'm looking for a better job and I expect the same the other way around.

[–]yuhche 0ポイント1ポイント  (4子コメント)

That is weird.

"I plan to leave in 6 months time so I would appreciate it if you didn't look for a replacement until x days prior to my departure."

Why? If you've found something better, I'm not going to wait around to find someone better to replace you.

[–]Dude-o-minator 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

No, you don't get what I'm saying. On your example it looks somewhat like this: "I plan to leave in 6 months" That's it. They can look for someone to replace me, I just told them I'm leaving.

The club should have approach Louis, tell him they want to look for another manager, so he could know what to expect.

I am starting to feel bad for you if your employer treats you like this and doesn't give you a heads up on possible departure.

[–]yuhche 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

A lot of good that did our neighbours, didn't it?

Just last month I started a job, before signing my contract, the criteria was; if I chose to leave within 6 months then I have to give a weeks notice in order for them to get someone internally to fill my role, i.e. cover my shifts.

If within 6 months, the probation period, they decide to get rid of me, that's fine as both parties have agreed. However, if they decide to keep me after the probation period, I am to give TWO calendar months notice that I'm leaving and its ample time for them to find a replacement. And that's fine too, as it was, again, agreed.

And honestly, someone who had started a few weeks before me was sacked just this week just after he had started his shift because he said he hadn't been shown something when the colleague training him had done so, even myself, who started after him had been shown the same procedure.

He fucked up and he was sacked. Football managers are no different.

"You're getting sacked next month don't worry about the bills you have as it will be easy to find another job."

Oh, and don't feel bad for me.

[–]Dude-o-minator 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Another one to clarify - what you wrote there is absolutely abnoxious. I didn't say anything like this.

Simply put - they shouldn't look for another manager without informing Louis about this.
The other way around, hyphotetically, Louis shouldn't leave without giving the club a heads up so they can actually look for a replacement.

[–]yuhche 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

They have to sound out who's available to take over a position that is going to become available.

Say they didn't speak to Mourinho whenever they did because they hadn't yet told van Gaal he was getting the sack and Mou decided on his next job, then what? Stick with van Gaal for another season or two? Or find the second/third best fit for the job?

[–]Shifter99Carrick[S] -2ポイント-1ポイント  (4子コメント)

In what way?

[–]Dude-o-minator 1ポイント2ポイント  (3子コメント)

In my opinion it was a disgrace that the manager himself had no clue about his future, especially that the press has been nagging about his sacking for the past six months. Leaks happen and there was (probably) nothing the club could do about that, but the manager shouldn't be left blindfolded for the entire time. As I mentioned in another comment - I'd be furious at the club if I was in LvG boots.

[–]Shifter99Carrick[S] -2ポイント-1ポイント  (2子コメント)

But we don't know the facts, for all we know the club might have been on the fence(or they just wanted to wait and see if LVG could secure top 4), then when it came round to the FA Cup it was probably a good idea not to break any news to anyone. It seems to me like Mendes and the press forced the club hands at the end. edit: the fuck kind of bellends are downvoting an opinion

[–]Dude-o-minator 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

They didn't have to announce it to the whole world, they could just tell Louis. My statement about United handling LvG's departure is about dealing with him, not with the world.

[–]Shifter99Carrick[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think that still leaves room for potential to derail the season at the time, similar to city, although since it would have be isolated to LVG it may not have been as bad.

[–]Dave1711Januzaj 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

Most likely. Mendes is a snake though he'd probably have done it regardless.

[–]BarbadosDMLord Scholes -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't think Mendes likes LVG much after the Falcao saga

[–]blazingmagnums 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

They could have handled everything post Ferguson better.

[–]exxpiredDe Gea 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't think to much it is the clubs fault, He was getting sacked either way. Leaks happen all the time.

[–]itsandercontrolSpecial 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I could've handled it better and I sing like a canary.

[–]legojs 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Honestly, I thought of Fergie's 3rd year when he won the FA Cup maybe lvg's too old for the second fergie, but as much as i hated lvg's style of games, if we waited for another year, we would have done better in my opinion with the potential youth players and new signings under the assumption that Jose is not available. Because he is available, I think that's what the club made that decision. Rash call though.

[–]Carson99Wee Paddy 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

The way the media is at the minute it must be nearly impossible to do it behind doors, especially with such a big club like us and the click whoring newspapers and wannabe twitter journos.

It has been the same for countless managers this season, Rodgers, Martinez, pellegrini. Only reason Pelle announced Pep was to shut the media up as it was all he was being asked about when the media rumour mill kicked off

[–]uGeekPwnzMata 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

You can't always prevent these things being leaked as obviously Mendes knew and he is likely to have leaked this rather than coming from club sources. To be honest though if it wasn't leaked on Saturday, then there'd be a million other stories about how soon after winning the cup we sacked him or how certain players wanted him to stay or basically anything else as the media love writing about us.

[–]LightningRisingBlind 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Everyone keeps saying LVG had no idea what was going on and wasn't talked to or anything but how do we know that? He isn't going to come out and say "Yeah they are taking about clearing me out for Mourinho" if we're able to figure out what's going on then why hasn't he? He could have known about this for months and we wouldn't know.

[–]bitterjealousangryLuke Shaw 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

The BBC should stop printing articles from unofficial sources and then blaming the sources for leaking the information and blaming United for not firing their manager sooner.

Did they expect United to fire LVG on Friday night before the cup final?

[–]PM_Me_Your_StarBurnsBlind -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

Could we have handled it much worse?

[–]vjunitedRooney -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think people need to move on. The leak was an unfortunate incident and frankly its hard to sack a manager in this day and age in a "classy" manner. Let's wait for the official statement and then move on and discuss about the future of our club.

[–]awiyum -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yes.

[–]FeezbullGiggs 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

From the other thread where I mentioned this-

Here's what I'd have done:

Back in November and December when rumours and leaks were rampant on how he had one or two games left etc -

Seeing as they weren't sacking him then, I'd have made a media statement to back the manager and say he's got our support. We look forward and hope for progress now after this period.

Done.

Near the end of the season:

Talk to LvG again and just let him know in a way that we are talking.

Ensure mendes doesn't leak anything as we will take care of this because he IS getting paid by us for the agent fee and such too and make him sign an agreement even if needed.

Not leak to the press about the methods of LvG in a PR way to damn the manager.

"Louis, we are extremely pleased with the FA cup win and congratulate you on it after the 12 year drought in the competition and being the first manager to break our trophy duck so quickly. As you know, our league form wasn't great and as you may have clues, champions league football is a priority for this club. We feel that we haven't made enough progress in the league overall and in Europe that a change is needed. As such, we have decided to go in a new direction with Mourinho and also let you retire a year earlier to Truus and Portugal. Thank you"

Or something like that and definitely make it known LvG left to retire instead. And do this only in a day or two from now with zero media briefings or leaks till after LvG has been told and had time to enjoy the weekend and cup at least.

Tweak as needed for more professionalism and dignified stuff.

Edit: given that di marzio said he was sure months ago, then maybe even tell LvG then that they are looking to change and hope we finish the season strongly as an alternative option.

[–]artofthenumber7Fellaini -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

I fucking hate Jorge mendes.

No accomplished professional deserves the treatment LVG recieved. It's shocking, especially coming from Man Utd. The football world respects LVG and the board must have known what his football ideology is.

[–]Chemical_Robot -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

The media and our rival fans love any excuse to shit on us. It would have been impossible to sack a manager without this kind of backlash. I completely expected it. Liverpool and arsenal fans aren't happy we sacked Lvg and replaced him with Jose Mourinho? What a surprise..

[–]CveinMemphis & Martial -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

The thing that grinds my gear now is that we did not buy Renato Sanches because of LvG not wanting him, and if LvG were told earlier, we would probably got him.

Bayern called it and went for it.