上位 200 件のコメント全て表示する 226

[–]roadpuppets 19ポイント20ポイント  (79子コメント)

This is a discussion board, stop erasing 200+ comment discussions.

Edit: I'm not talking about comments, I'm talking about entire threads. I'm sorry I don't have the time or inclination right this moment to give you specific examples of threads that are no longer even searchable. You might start with your mod/censor siouxie, especially in any thread discussing her own behavior.

RemindMe! 5 days "Follow up re: improvements, or ANY suggestions heeded?"

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (46子コメント)

Got any examples? Maybe if we explain why we remove certain comments you can understand us better or give us more concrete feedback that we can act on.

In general we remove comments that break rule 1. Whether or not those comments are otherwise contributing is not really considered. That might sound harsh, but we think it ultimately leads to a better discussion board. The reason why a majority of subreddits have rules talking about how people should be civil and respect each other is because they want to stay discussion boards and not become dispute boards.

[–]angieb15 8ポイント9ポイント  (0子コメント)

I can't think of many specific examples, there are not a lot of new threads these days, I have seen threads disappear that were good. Sometimes the initial thread is iffy but the conversation in the comments are priceless, whether funny or informative.

I definitely think mods should pause and seriously consider before deleting an entire thread. If this community upvotes a thread into the 20s or 30s, there is almost certainly interest in it and some validity.

Edit to add, I understand if someone is doxing or doing something else egregious, this may draw interest and still need to be deleted.

[–]roadpuppets 7ポイント8ポイント  (4子コメント)

I just came across the one that I had been interested in, and that kinda ticked me off when it suddenly got removed. I believe this is also the thread I removed my own comments from, after the op was erased, reason; pissed, effort/time wasted. Justified or not may be a good example for our discussion;

https://www.reddit.com/r/MakingaMurderer/comments/4j781j/someones_mad/

So I can see where at some point a pissing match is forming, but do not see a justification for erasing the topic and all 96 comments with not a mention why. Would love to hear thoughts from the mod responsible.

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] -2ポイント-1ポイント  (3子コメント)

For context (you saw it, but others didn't): the OP in that post obviously copy pasted some of Jerome Buting's tweets and doesn't know anything about propper formatting.

The post is an incoherent mess, but the OP should received a message explaining what happened to their post.

I guess the problem might be our anti twitter stance. It's possible OP wanted to circumvent that. The twitter thing is certainly something we may reconsider. However, I can't stress enough, that people should come to us and talk, if they think their posts won't get through.

[–]screamingforoxygen 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

No one told me why. I am horrible with computers in general. I have seen other things copy and pasted, I did not know it was an issue. If you want to delete a post because of formatting, that is your call. However, it seemed like everyone understood the post well enough and made many comments on it.

I did not even know you had a anti twitter stance., I just wanted to show all the tweets together and which ones were made in a 10 min time frame.

It is not a big deal to me, and I don't care. I did not like the implication I deleted it and that was all I commented on. I had no idea why it was removed.

[–]roadpuppets 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

OK, can agree with the first part of that. However, if I'm the one doing the removal, even if the rules are crystal clear, here's what im asking myself;

"What exactly did I just accomplish here?"

And I'm out, way too much Reddit for one day. Thanks for the followup.

[–]roadpuppets 5ポイント6ポイント  (36子コメント)

Here's one of the more egregious, that led to OliviaD leaving https://www.reddit.com/r/MakingaMurderer/comments/4icj9v/warning_editorial_speculation_whatever_you_want/?sort=confidence although it's pretty useless after the mod sanitized it.

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (35子コメント)

Yeah, that's the post I was talking about in my other comment. OliviaD complained about a post removal and the mod came in and explained everything and even reconsidered and approved the post. I don't know what happened after, because OliviaD hasn't posted here in 7 days, so maybe the post was removed again?

What the problem of that post was, was that instead of waiting for any explanation by the mods, people jumped on the bandwagon, attacked the mod and didn't really consider any reasoning coming from our side. Like you said, all mod comments are gone, so I can't prove anything. Whether or not the post being discussed got approved in the end shouldn't be important (but it probably is to some of you, since Olivia was a heavy contributor). The important part, imo, is that this could have been easily resolved in modmail. Only because one mod thinks a post isn't the right fit, doesn't mean other mods can't overrule that decision. And if we decide to leave something removed we try to explain it. Furthermore we clearly state our rules on the sidebar and that we reserve the right to have the last word. If you can't accept that, you'll have to leave. And that's what Olivia did, and I respect that. (These last sentences won't go over well, I am afraid.)

Again, I'm trying to differentiate between complaints about a single post removal and ideas/criticism about the way the subreddit is moderated. The latter is something that should be discussed in public if need be. And we are willing to change certain things, but not everything.

[–]OpenMind4U 2ポイント3ポイント  (6子コメント)

And that's what Olivia did, and I respect that. (These last sentences won't go over well, I am afraid.)

Unfortunately, you're correct on this. Can you try to bring her back (maybe)?...you know better how to reach her....we'll appreciate.

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (5子コメント)

Heh, I can't bring her back, sorry.

[–]OpenMind4U 0ポイント1ポイント  (4子コメント)

ok...understand...I'm not gonna downvote you for that:)

[–]screamingforoxygen 2ポイント3ポイント  (3子コメント)

You can PM her. She is still on reddit in general.

[–]OpenMind4U 2ポイント3ポイント  (2子コメント)

You know how many times I already did???....she ignores my PM:(

[–]roadpuppets [スコア非表示]  (25子コメント)

Really sick of talking about this, but i feel this shouldn't be left unanswered (plus this is the last time I'm dealing with/expending the effort on this bullshit) as this wasn't what actually went down at all;

instead of waiting for any explanation by the mods

yeah, these explanations just don't happen so not sure what the appropriate waiting period is

people jumped on the bandwagon, attacked the mod

didn't happen that way either, commenters were a bit disgusted but remarkably civil, posting questions not attacks, remaining acceptably so even after being met with a flippant attitude, memes, and even a "meh.. shit happens" (that's verbatim)

Like you said, all mod comments are gone, so I can't prove anything.

and that's the whole point, how is that in any way acceptable? get called out on your lousy mod practices, act like a complete punk to your subscribers defending said behavior, then delete all record of it???

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] [スコア非表示]  (24子コメント)

I will respond to your other comment in here as well.

It might sounds like it, but I am not speaking for u/siouxsie_siouxv2. So ssv2, please don't hesitate to tell me if my views of what you did are incorrect.


these explanations just don't happen so not sure what the appropriate waiting period is

The oldest request for a post approval I've replied to this morning was five hours old. As it stands right now we have an okay response time (although it can take 12-14 hours, depending on the day and how busy we are with other stuff), especially if you compare it to other subs. But you can't expect an instant reply. The site would have to actually hire people for something like that.

didn't happen that way either, commenters were a bit disgusted but remarkably civil, posting questions not attacks, remaining acceptably so even after being met with a flippant attitude, memes, and even a "meh.. shit happens" (that's verbatim)

Before she started replying the thread was kind of one sided: "This mod is not objective IMO.", no statement as to why they think that is; several people complaining about their post being removed without adding that it was mostly for breaking rule 5. That is kind of an issue in general. The mods who do the most work on a sub (and ssv2 does the most work here) also get the most flack, because sooner or later, you piss someone of. And when someone is pissed of, they don't care about the whole picture. They don't care that we are just trying to keep the sub at bay sometimes. They don't care that sometimes it it is kinda hard to draw a clear line about what is and isn't relevant to the subreddit topic. They just care about their post. She was a little bit snarky. Instead of saying "the line between what is and isn't relevant isn't very clear here, we will review the post and reconsider" she said, "shit happens". Okay, maybe not a good idea. But she deleted that statement. For you that looks like hiding some kind of evidence, for me it looks like someone who acknowledges that they were too snarky and taking what they said back.

Let's get back to the big picture, though. While we think we are quite lenient when it comes to what we allow here, most of the subscribers who talked to me, don't see it that way. Okay. I don't want to end this with "we agree do disagree", so what exactly can we change here? It might help to clear up rule 5 and to formulate a more exact phrasing.

and that's the whole point, how is that in any way acceptable? get called out on your lousy mod practices, act like a complete punk to your subscribers defending said behavior, then delete all record of it???

Again, not really the way I see it. Lousy mod practices? That specific thread was about one post discussing the state crime/testing lab. It was not about how it handled Avery's blood and not about any new findings that were made there, but the lab itself. ssv2 interpreted it as a somewhat political post that has nothing to do with MaM. She made a judgement call while considering the rules on the sidebar. You could say it was the wrong decision, but you can't call it lousy moderation. Did she act like a 'complete punk'? I don't know, how would you react if everything you got after putting hours of work into something are just people doubting every single one of your decisions because they don't agree with you on one post removal you made. Did she delete all the record? I can see your point here, but like I said before, it looks like she just simply wanted to take back what she said. At the very least she wanted to leave it all behind and maybe avoid more angry messages resulting from those comments. Also, have you never said anything you regretted a day after? I don't think she wanted to hide anything. That obviously didn't work and never works. When you mod long enough, you know that.

Is there a process in place to remove mods?

If you are talking about some kind of public vote, no there isn't. Historically that has never been a good idea on reddit. There are too many ways to abuse that. Mods are added here for having a track record of running subs well and putting in the work. They are not added because they can always please everyone.

I'm gonna be direct here, this whole "we want to remove her" thing is an overreaction. You have someone who helps the sub a lot and ensures some kind of order, one person complains about them and leaves, so the mod has to be thrown out as well? I also don't think her snarky replies and the fact that she used memes is a reason to get rid of her. Finally, when a user breaks the rules here, they get temp ban, but they get to come back. You can't ban us (unless you manage to get us banned site wide through some heavy collusion or get rid of us through r/redditrequest, which all has happened before), but we do have to deal with the consequences when we rub too many people the wrong way and we might have to deal with the fact that people leave and build competing subreddits. Maybe you don't think that is enough punishment, but that is basically how the site works.


When I watched that first episode on youtube, I would never have imagined, that I would end up here writing this.

[–]roadpuppets [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

While some of this is confusion due to you and I discussing 2 completely different threads (I'll take the blame on that one), thanks for the reply, and for creating this topic.

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Sorry, I read over it a couple of times and changed the phrasing, but this is as clear as I am able to express my thoughts today.

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 [スコア非表示]  (21子コメント)

tl;dr: people upset about memes on Reddit? Lol

Ok so blaming mods for removing a post when you didn't even ask to have it reinstated is crazy on Reddit. This isn't your Facebook group where some faceless entity removes things and they fall into the abyss never to return.

Also, you guys might think I'm a jerk but I'm not unfair when it comes to mod stuff. You can't point to one post that got removed and brought back and keep saying I'm a terrible mod. Well you can if you want but I know I'm doing a fuckton of work for this sub so it's hard for me to see that point of view.

[–]solunaView [スコア非表示]  (18子コメント)

People don't think you are a terrible mod because you remove posts. It's your attitude and demeanor that sets people off. Also your lack of transparency. You go on rants, you break the very rules of Reddit and the sub you ban people for, you bait people and meme your way out of it or simply erase what's been said. People see this and the behavior is cumulative. You can't unring that bell, as they say.

Comments like the below demonstrate how out of touch you are with the sub itself, the community you supposedly serve, and the criticism leveled at you:

You can't point to one post that got removed and brought back and keep saying I'm a terrible mod. Well you can if you want but I know I'm doing a fuckton of work for this sub so it's hard for me to see that point of view.

Sometimes a particular mod in a particular situation is just not a good fit, no matter how pure their intentions. An experienced super-mod like yourself must realize this.

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 [スコア非表示]  (14子コメント)

We added a new mod and I'm letting him take over as sheriff of MaM. So... have fun with that!

I'm still here, but he's going take over the reigns as hitler most active mod. Even if he doesn't know it yet lol

/u/notanestleshill

[–]solunaView [スコア非表示]  (7子コメント)

Nice of you to make that decision for the community instead of asking them what they wanted. Says all about you (as a mod) that really needs to be said. Have fun with that.

[–]retroxit [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Bringing more of that relevant quality experience from /tifu /meirl and /animalsbeingjerks that made you such an amazing moderator.

[–]MamMoFo [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

I'll reply to you instead of the mod, because her posts are so disingenuous in fact they're almost outright lies. The "one post"... I've seen nearly a dozen myself that this could be about. Interesting as well, the 'regretted her words' excuse, remember that one? She regretted her words in her other sub too and got caught deleting the users comments and her own nasty replies... might still be in her history.

Thanks from us who are paying attention for putting into words so eloquently.

[–]solunaView [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

You are very welcome and thank you so much for the kind words. I sent you a PM. :)

[–]retroxit [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

And you have no clue why so many people think you're a jerk, really? I'm pretty new and things were clear right quick.

[–]OpenMind4U -2ポイント-1ポイント  (30子コメント)

What? 200+ comment erased? By whom?

WOW....freedom of speech at it best.....Now, as Reddit subscriber, I DEMAND to know the reason behind such deletion.

[–]stOneskull 0ポイント1ポイント  (29子コメント)

I guess he stopped counting after 200.. Maybe there have been deletions of a million posts. Maybe a billion.

[–]Werner__Herzog[S,M] 0ポイント1ポイント  (28子コメント)

A total of 959 comments where removed in the past month.

[–]roadpuppets 1ポイント2ポイント  (27子コメント)

That number is meaningless, when you 'remove' a thread, the comments aren't actually deleted, however for all intents and purposes they are indeed gone. However in the specific instances I mentioned, when the discussion was ABOUT the mod herself, she did indeed remove the comments (including her own) in addition to the topic.

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (26子コメント)

This sounds personal and not like subreddit business. I don't know if it is appropriate to discuss this here, and it is certainly not appropriate to discuss it with me.

[–]solunaView 4ポイント5ポイント  (3子コメント)

How about possibly pointing people to where it is appropriate to discuss issues such as potential rogue moderation and subs that are now only modded by "professional Reddit moderators" with little to no interest in the sub they are moderating?

The original owner and mods are gone from MaM and we are left with moderation being done by people with little community interest or involvement. This becomes an "Us vs. Them" scenario and is not at all what Reddit is supposed to be about. Self-run communities are the focus and it would be great if the remaining moderators here remembered and acted upon that credo.

One of the biggest problems here in this sub is that the moderators have no real feel for or idea what is "contributing to discussion" anymore because they have no connection to the content. They are disinterested "outsiders" "doing a job", "volunteering", "overworked", modding hundreds if not thousands of subs. These views have come from the mods themselves but of course those posts are now removed.

This is the crux of the problem and what is pushing away great contributors and stifling quality discussion. In similar fashion this is what is contributing to the erosion of the community. I'm sure many others will testify to this.

Thanks for your time.

[–]screamingforoxygen 6ポイント7ポイント  (1子コメント)

try https://www.reddit.com/r/InnocenceandInjustice/. The mods there are awesome :)

[–]solunaView [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

These mods could learn a thing or two about humility and community. I seriously doubt they are interested but they are welcome, as is everyone.

These people mod a sub they have no interest in. I find it intriguing they cling onto it when it's obvious everyone wants them out and to have control of their own sub.

What do these mods have to gain by modding a sub they don't care about?

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I have been considering adding more people from the community as mods. Especially if we want to introduce flairs and wikis. Most of you have problems with handling site functionality itself, though, I don't know how far that would get us to randomly appoint mods, so I'd have to write up some guides first. I also would need to make sure that whoever is added has an active interest to enforce site wide rules (not our rules, the reddit rules) some don't seem to care about those and have to be constantly reminded by us.

How about possibly pointing people to where it is appropriate to discuss issues such as potential rogue moderation and subs that are now only modded by "professional Reddit moderators" with little to no interest in the sub they are moderating?

You mean a place like r/subredditcancer? I mean, if you think it's better to go there instead of trying to resolve our issues, be my guest. They take it a little bit too far, but I actually agree with the core premise. Mods should serve their subscribers. The problem is, most mods actually do that, it's just that subscribers don't see it that way. Their post or comment gets removed or they get banned and they don't consider if that is or isn't good for the subreddit, they just see it as a personal attack and the mods become an enemy.

The original owner and mods are gone from MaM and we are left with moderation being done by people with little community interest or involvement.

He's not gone. I'm pretty sure he still lurks. I was added one month in. So when we disregard that this place is barely months old and there is no such thing as "original" owners yet, I am one of the first to be modded.

The subscribers changed the original premise. This was a subreddit about a TV show and became a subreddit about solving a case and about very real people. But the same mods stayed. Yeah, it's kind of an issue...but we are trying to make things better.


I feel like some kind of public relations person...

[–]roadpuppets 2ポイント3ポイント  (21子コメント)

Far from it, although I've had one discussion with her, my opinions are based primarily from observing her direct conversations with others. Many of her explanations or justification are to post crappy memes, which itself is against some weird sub rule.

Also re: being personal, not even sure she's removed anything of mine, or said anything remotely harsh to me, I actually kinda dig her sense of humour... she's (siouxsie_siouxV2) just really shitty at being a mod.

And if this isn't the place lol, then where? Regularily removing threads with 100's of comments, with perhaps 50+ participants, for NO discernible reasons, with NO explanation given sure should be subreddit business. Who polices the police sort of thing. So imo as far as you gathering feedback and actually making any constructive attempt to better the sub, well...

I expected nothing, and was still disappointed.

Edit to add; ALL of this has been said before, in a pretty civil manner in fact, and not by me... and it's all been erased.

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (6子コメント)

And if this isn't the place lol, then where? Regularily removing threads with 100's of comments, with perhaps 50+ participants, for NO discernible reasons, with NO explanation given sure should be subreddit business.

Okay, it sounded like you had beef with that mod. In that case it is subreddit business and should be discussed here.

I mean, it really depends. I don't think making public posts about individual modactions is okay (that's the only time I can think of that corresponds with what you just said). Most subreddits don't allow that. If a post of yours gets removed, discuss it with the mods. If the mods take it too far by removing multiple posts without giving you a reason even in modmail, then yeah, maybe make a public post. We are usually willing to discuss things and we try to explain our removals in modmail (not in public, though, that is something we should change by introducing removal reasons like other subs do). Compared to many other subreddits we are very lenient when it comes to content, so I may have a different perspective on things.

So let me ask you this, is it going to better the subreddit, if we let people discuss individual post removals on the subreddit? I'm a big fan of posts that discuss the subreddit, its users and moderation in general, I even linked to one in my OP, because they help us get on a better track. But individual removals should be discussed in modmail, imo. You can disagree of course. I might not have the full picture. Like I said, I can only think of one instance where a bunch of comments were removed, including the post itself and it was about an individual post removal. The discussion became kinda petty and I don't think it was really worthwhile: OP said her posts got removed, mod came in and explained why. A bunch of people still complained.

[–]FoxyMcJ 5ポイント6ポイント  (2子コメント)

That mod mocked me repeatedly. Whenever I asked her a question, she was sarcastic and basically said she didn't care anymore, and that no one else wants to mod this page.

She also replied to me with 3 different memes. When I pointed out that was breaking her own rule #5 (Posts unrelated to Making A Murderer or the issues presented in the case will be removed - this includes memes & image macros, scenes from other shows or movies, or comparing the physical features of people portrayed on the show to various actors. Please keep your posts on-topic. ) she sent me another meme.

She then deleted all of her posts the next day. Is there a process in place to remove mods?

[–]roadpuppets [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Last comment then for the record, why is the comment below, NEVER answered, or even acknowledged?

It's been asked more than once, in multiple threads.

She then deleted all of her posts the next day. Is there a process in place to remove mods?

This one is for you /u/Werner__Herzog I appreciate you taking the time (and heat) in this topic, but as you may have gathered I am very skeptical of any real change as a result of it.

Edit: spelling, coherence

[–]roadpuppets 5ポイント6ポイント  (2子コメント)

I don't have a particular beef, other than her very publicly admitting that she didn't really give 2 shits about doing a decent job, then removing all traces of that conversation. End of discussion on that from my end.

I don't think there necessarily needs to be a bunch of discussion regarding the removal post-axe, just more transparency instead of a complete disappearance.

If a thread gets THAT much activity (short of devolving into a total shit show), there's probably a legitimate reason for it's existence here. And if it violated some critical rule, the mods need to be paying better attention (see my other comment about multi subs, overworked, etc.)

I think as far as individual comment moderation goes, you guys are doing a relatively good job. This sub wouldn't exist and be worth visiting without your work, I don't envy you. Going back to my very first comment... I just want to see the wholesale content stop disappearing, noone benefits from that. Otherwise I think the rest of you are doing pretty good in a thankless role.

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

the wholesale content

I'm not sure about what you mean by this, can you explain? (might be a language barrier thing)

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 -4ポイント-3ポイント  (13子コメント)

she's just really shitty at being a mod.

/u/GuyOne isn't a girl.

[–]GuyOne 0ポイント1ポイント  (5子コメント)

I'm not sure if /u/roadpuppets is talking about me. Was there a thread about myself? I've only ever commented 8 times in this sub and the last time was 3 months ago.

https://www.reddit.com/r/MakingaMurderer/comments/47rzm3/lets_remove_the_downvote/d0f8kak

Regarding being a 'she'... I do have long hair so I can head bang at metal shows so I understand the mistake but I am definitely a guy. :)

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 -3ポイント-2ポイント  (4子コメント)

I was just joking. They are clearly referring to me. Which is kind of funny considering my status as a mod on this site.

[–]Gellikinz 5ポイント6ポイント  (5子コメント)

I kind of feel that when we start to touch on the wider Avery/Dassey family we are told off and have our posts removed. I wonder if you would act the same if we were slagging off EDIT ahem, I mean discussing, the Kardashian clan? Probably not

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (4子コメント)

If there is any discussion about the Kardashians on here, please feel free to report it.

The only example of a post I can think of is this one about Carla Chase. It's still up. I'll admit that I don't really feel comfortable with it. It has barely anything to do with the case documented in Making a Murderer, it has the potential of contributing to unwanted consequenses. And for what? So people can gossip? We are very willing to let people talk about whatever they want, but we feel at least partially responsible for people's safety. I'm not saying anyone is unsafe because of this subreddit; (1) most people here are reasonable, (2) a lot more than a few gossiping posts has to happen for people's safety to be threatened. But that doesn't change the fact that social media sites contribute to people's lives being ruined. And it happened on reddit as well. There is no need to let it come to this. We might be a little rash when it comes to post about individuals (not just Avery family members), but that's just because we don't think it's worth it to let them suffer more than they already have.

[–]Buckyluggar 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

It was I that started that post however rest assured the intention was NEVER to 'ruin lives' but I do feel it raised many questions and created a healthy debate in regards to people's perceptions. The post is very much related to the MAM case and it is questioning potential influences that might occur due to what the 'family group' is doing and how they are going about it. Granted, there a few 'edgy' comments on there that too, made me squirm a little nervously. The post was originally deleted but was reinstated of which I was thankful for. Like many others it was my first and only post and when it was deleted it was done so without any feedback. I did ask for feedback so as to ensure I could make sure I didn't post anything controversial again. So I guess my suggestion would be the same as others. Feedback (particularly for us newbies who are trying to understand Reddit) would be hugely invaluable.

[–]Jmystery1 -2ポイント-1ポイント  (2子コメント)

I agree someone was complaing about this that it got removed and I think sioux the mod did the right thing. I didn't relize it was gossip sorry /u/siouxsie_siouxv2. I see why she deleted because I don't like that gossip stuff either it goes no where. I just thought a link got deleted but she did the right thing and I think she needs to delete it.

[–]Werner__Herzog[S,M] [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

The post actually got reported via modmail, and the another mod agreed with the report and removed it, not ssv2.

[–]Jmystery1 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Ohh well thats Good! I saw someone complaining about deleted post and thought it was another post just deleted and by mistake and I am agreeing that post should be deleted it was witch hunting.

[–]wilbert-vb 5ポイント6ポイント  (4子コメント)

Thank you for this brainstorm session.

My feeling is that significant valuable information got lost over time, interesting discussions that happened in the first month and no one knows how to search for them.

It seems that we now just react to the slow progress in the case and we sometimes feel a need to 'fix boredom'.

Perhaps a Wiki page with references to those invaluable threads might help. Kind of 'documenting this sub', which could help anyone navigate here.

This could also solve 'already discussed', or 'somewhere, but can't find it now' dead ends.

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

There is a wiki: http://www.makingamurderer.org/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page. Post made on this site are cataloged on there as well. I don't know how much it is maintained, I have no control over it. But it is certainly not a bad idea to have some kind of wiki on the subreddit as well.

[–]wilbert-vb 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

This Wiki on makingamurderer.org is certainly informative.

I wonder if a Reddit Wiki focused on relevant discussions would be complementary for both seasoned and new redditors. I imagine that it would be helpful that any discussion or answer could be enhanced with readily available links to those relevant threads/comments (that you wish would be sticky).

[–]Jmystery1 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

I wonder how we can have a page that has our info and when after a post we found out joe smoe is in fact related to sue smith just an example. We can add this great find on discovery some where or like a day discussion summary of new info or blunked info. Like today fingerprint experiment we got a good conclusion so we can put this is an update or yes maybe a flair with the final discussion results. I guess we discover info than it gets buried and the discussion gets repeated again. Just throwing ideas out.

[–]angieb15 6ポイント7ポイント  (5子コメント)

We definitely need some things stickied. Some people post things that are great references and they get lost in the shuffle.

[–]JLWhitaker 2ポイント3ポイント  (4子コメント)

I agree! Like your Timelines.

I see them in the Interesting Posts list, though. :))

[–]angieb15 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

This is one, I can't live without, from /u/SirMildredPierce
Transcript Index by Witness

*Edited because I linked the wrong thing the first time, because I have to go wading through 50 saved posts to get to it, and inevitably click the wrong one at least once every time.

[–]angieb15 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Thanks! My timelines aren't there though, there is a good timeline there, but it's older and just hits the high points. There are quite a few other posts I use that would be nice to have 2 clicks away rather than buried in my saved folder.

[–]JLWhitaker [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Oh! I just assumed they were yours. Yours are comprehensive and should be listed.

[–]CrouchysAvinIsNachos 4ポイント5ポイント  (2子コメント)

So there's a feed that posts links from the rss of this subreddit to Twitter, in order to generate traffic from people with an interest in what was posted.

It have seen it done successfully a few times before, where it generates hundreds of clicks per link (at peak times) and requires little in the way of babysitting, unless that was what was wanted.

I won't link it without asking first because you seem to have a weird relationship with social media here.

It's usually a slow burner at first but mushrooms when it reaches a certain stage.

Obviously it's much less busy here than during the initial madness, but that could well return if there are significant developments in the case.

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

you seem to have a weird relationship with social media here

Yes, many social media sites are blocked not only here but on many other subreddits because there is a potential of personal information being shown in combination with calls to action. And because they mostly link to fluff.

I guess you can link it and message us to have it approved. People who use twitter might be interested.

[–]stOneskull -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

I like this. I pressed the up arrow on it.

[–]z_vida 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

You may be seeing interest wane but it will spike when Steven Avery's attorney files her brief. Unless the date is extended that brief is due by this month's end.

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yeah, that thought crossed my mind. But I also remember that she made promises about big reveals before and nothing came up.

Even if something happens, figuring out what the core of the subscribers wants will help a lot when the traffic rises again.

[–]MrDoradus 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Are we human? Or are we dancer?

[–]Powerdan74 2ポイント3ポイント  (3子コメント)

While we have your ear, I have noticed a problem that may be bigger than this sub but it's an issue none the less. I have seen several threads and posts in which it appears that the user deletes their original post, comment, or user. With all scenarios the information is then gone. Furthermore if they are the user who started the thread this causes the thread not to show unless bookmarked. Is there anything we can do to change the way this works or is it just a person's prerogative to take their ball and go home?

[–]JLWhitaker 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

That's interesting. I sometimes see the original title, then the content below is gone from the OP BUT the comments are all still there. I don't know how that works. I use a web browser interface. Maybe it's different for a reddit app.

[–]Powerdan74 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

I might not have described it properly because I do see it the same way but I can't find the thread unless I have commented or saved it.

[–]JLWhitaker [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Ah. I sort by 'new' so they just show up on the list. Because I'm often reading much later because of timezone, it's not unusual for a post to have already been removed by the time it shows up on my list.

[–]RonnieGeo 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

I would really like if certain posts could be labeled as speculation or opinion or theory.

Not sure if that is what is meant by flair, but it is difficult to see a thread titled "SA did not leave a message at 435" and find it is just someone's opinion. I see those and think (hope) that some new facts have come out, only to be disappointed. I think that anything to help this would improve the sub

As for the down voting and upvoting I understand that you can't do much about it, but it is really getting difficult to see a thread where someone suggests that SA may be guilty and it gets downvoted to oblivion even though there may be good content and 'food for thought' in there. I know not everyone does this but it happens often enough to be a pattern.

The last thought is some way to control the posts that are repetitive or ask something already answered 100 times. I know that many people have just seen the series recently, but if I join a conversation late, I expect to sit back a while and absorb before I start asking questions. Example would be "hey, did you know a juror was excused?" Or linking articles from 3 months ago.

One of the things this sub has become (as you stated in the OP) is a discussion of what is currently going on with SA and BD - so posts that seem to impede that progress (or step back too far) are detrimental to the sub. Not sure if anything can be done, but just a thought. Maybe a waiting period before posting?

Overall I really like the sub and the people on it, but I definitely have my pet peeves... People putting out theories as facts, or accusing innocent people are probably top of the list (no, unless you have some pretty damming evidence, I don't want to hear about how TH's mom worked with Kratz to frame SA. )

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Prohibiting repetitive posts is quite a lot of work.

For example on r/OutOfTheLoop we check our front page before approving new posts and we have a wiki with so called "retired" questions. A bot has to help us out by reporting certain keywords etc. That took quite a while to set up and we have posted several feedback threads where we ask people what to put into the wiki. I think that system works okay.

Another Example is r/Futurology, where we have a rule about repeat posts. It is not as well enforced as on that other sub, tbh. There is way more traffic on there and we try to go back several days when modding. It's a lot harder.

So my suggestion would be "retiring" certain topics and including them in a wiki. We'd have to get input from the subscribers for that.

Or linking articles from 3 months ago.

That is also quite hard to keep track of. On a sub I mod, someone had to make a bot just to handle that...I hesitate to promise anything in that regard, but feel free to report post that you find too repetitive/old, we will certainly act on reports.

[–]OpenMind4U 2ポイント3ポイント  (41子コメント)

Great and timely post! And I'll jump to structure first. Yes, we need these FILTERS or I call them FOLDERS. It will not just separate the discussion based on the topic (for example: forensics discussion, theory discussion and so on) but will make the SEARCH easy for further analysis. This would be simply win-win change for everyone and will be greatly appreciated.

In regards of civility, this is much complicated issue, believe it or not. It involves human behavior which not too easy to be 'controlled', imo. Agree, we all (including myself!) should learn and compose our emotions. I'm first to admit: I'm guilty of over-emotional behavior:)....However, IMO, Reddit is guilty as well by 'contributing' to our non-so-proper behavior allowing using 'downvote'/'upvote' as the mean of inflating our 'imperfections'. And you, as the Mod, already saw how many problems this 'voting' Reddit system has and created. So, civility as the 'two-way street' becomes the 'three-line freeway' with Reddit 'no U-turn zone', in the middle.

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (40子コメント)

Thanks.

Calling them folders is nice way to put it. What you say makes me think it wouldn't even be a bad idea to retroactively flair posts so finding them is easier.

To your second point, reddit is in many regards great platform, but it is far from perfect. If you set it up to show you comment no matter how low the score, the downvotes won't bother you too much. At least that's what works for me.

Just for clarity: there's pretty much nothing we mods can do to disable downvotes. We can only hide the buttons, but even that will effect less than 50% of the subscribers. I know that many moderators brought this up multiple times to the admins and even to the chairman of the site, but it isn't really a priority for them to disable downvotes.

[–]OpenMind4U 3ポイント4ポイント  (37子コメント)

If you set it up to show you comment no matter how low the score, the downvotes won't bother you too much. Just for clarity: there's pretty much nothing we mods can do to disable downvotes. We can only hide the buttons...

Let's talk about. First, about 'bothering' issue.

I said many times that I don't care about 'downvote/upvote'. This what I said. Does it really true?...Not really...Sometimes when I see negative vote it makes me wonder: what did I said in my comment that people don't like or don't understand? It's my English or I fail to make clear what I meant? ....'downvote', regardless of your personality, creates some confusion to the author...and I'm talking from my perspective only. I'm on this forum not for the sake to be 'liked'...I'm here to discuss and learn...and this 'voting' crap (excuse my language!) is not contributing to discussion at all. Opposite, it creates pretty hustle environment, imo.

Second, in regards to 'hide' this option. IMO, yes, it should be hide for inside thread comments. It should be only used for the post/thread itself. And inside of thread, it should be hidden...and if person who dislike your comment or/and disagree with your comment - it's OK...instead of pressing 'downvote' it'll make this person to start typing and EXPLAIN why he/she disagree. It'll make person PARTICIPATE and THINK. Not just simply click and minimize someone's 'work'/thought process....Don't you see, in some way, this 'downvote' is kind of humiliation tool which improves NOTHING, no benefit what's so ever, not to discussion, not to the thinking process.

jmo.

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (4子コメント)

And inside of thread, it should be hidden...

You missed the part where I said it doesn't effect over half the subscribers, because it is only a CSS hack. People on mobile devices, or people who have the subreddit CSS disabled will still be able to downvote you. And if someone wants to downvote you on the desktop version of the site, there is nothing stopping them from disabling the CSS. It's fairly simple. I know enough people and have tried it myself on other subreddits, hiding the downvote button does almost nothing. But it isn't much work, so we might as well try it out, just don't expect it to have any effect.

[–]trishpee 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

I agree with OpenMind4U. Regarding the downvote/upvote issue, correct me if i don't understand but you're saying this particular feature can be disabled? Thats all well and good, i don't care if i get downvoted or upvoted. But i probably wont go out of my way to alter that feature because I don't have time and don't care tbh. It doesn't affect my reddit experience because the content of people's comments are more important then their votes. However for this particular subreddit, i feel as though users that express their opinion and who also believe SA are guilty, get severely downvoted. Why is this a problem? Because some users (and i've been guilty of this) will read a well informed and rational guilty view of a topic and be influenced by the negative number against it. It's pack mentality, whether or not you're actually offended by it - it puts a preconceived notion in your head not to agree. Its just human nature. If someones getting attacked then its easier to agree with the majority then think twice and defend that person.

I'm a member of several other forums and the 'rank' that users have is dependant on their number of posts, contributing value of their posts, and things that factor into their time as a member of reddit. And i reckon it works. Keep the voting for thread as it is i reckon, but comment downvoting has a correlating relationship with dispute for that particular thread. Give us all a level playing field.

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

you're saying this particular feature can be disabled?

It can't. It can be hidden, but anyone savvy enough can circumvent the hiding mechanism.

Give us all a level playing field.

I can't do that. I can however hide the scores for 24 hours....It's on my list.

[–]trishpee 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

All good. Was just my two cents :)

[–]OpenMind4U 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Ok...fair enough...please at least try it:)....and thank you in advance.

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 0ポイント1ポイント  (31子コメント)

In my experience, the minute someone thinks you care about their downvote in any way, you'll be downvoted out of spite by that person. Forever. Or until they get tired of being a pest.

[–]OpenMind4U 2ポイント3ポイント  (28子コメント)

Forever. Or until they get tired of being a pest

lol...pest is never tired....pest 'produced' nothing...and Reddit voting system is great nourishment environment for pest. :)

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 3ポイント4ポイント  (27子コメント)

Downvotes are no big deal. You're on Reddit enough to accumulate karma at a way higher rate than losing it. I have a fairly high karma score so when someone downvotes me it's like this:

http://gifrific.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/gob-letter-throw.gif

Edit; they nourish me

[–]OpenMind4U 3ポイント4ポイント  (6子コメント)

lol...oh dear!!! I have no idea what Reddit 'karma' is and what it means!!! I cannot even see what this green 'shit' next to my userid has...so, it really means nothing when I make post or comment...btw, what is my 'karma' score???:)

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 -1ポイント0ポイント  (3子コメント)

https://www.reddit.com/user/OpenMind4U

Karma is 9697. Not too shabby

[–]OpenMind4U 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

shabby

lol...thank you!...definition of shabby: 'dressed in old or worn clothes'....hahaha...yes, my 'karma' is right!:).

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Be warned: upvotes are addictive. Next thing you know you'll be answering everything in askreddit for that sweet sweet karma

[–]FoxyMcJ [スコア非表示]  (19子コメント)

Queen of the memes.

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 [スコア非表示]  (18子コメント)

Hey I've been called worse. I like your other sub btw. Seems like a cool place.

[–]FoxyMcJ [スコア非表示]  (17子コメント)

It is, and you are welcome there, as long as you follow our only rule:

.I&I Rules:

  1. Be KIND

OR YOU WILL BE BANNED

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 [スコア非表示]  (16子コメント)

Well so far before even joining your sub there's already people saying unkind things about me. Then someone responded with an unkind comment to something positive I said in here. I don't feel too welcome in that community when whole posts are dedicated to how terrible I am.

[–]anditurnedaround 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

If the whole sub is a no down post sub, it works for the most part. All the participants will counteract down votes to up votes, not because they love the comment, but because they want their sub to work this way. It works. I know. I am part of a no down vote sub.

We have occasional down voters, but for the most part, the other user will bring them back up to 1 at the very least.

Control is sometime on the shoulders of the participants.

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't think this group is like that.

[–]screamingforoxygen 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

It does make it harder to down vote. If you subscribe, you really won't be able to without circumventing a bit. Hiding the down vote button is a great idea.

The die hards will still find a way, but it won't be the norm.

[–]Minerva8918 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Regarding the downvotes, something I've seen in other subs (such as /r/HiveMindMaM) is that if you hover over the downvote button, you see a little banner thing that says "For content that does not contribute to any discussion."

I like that because I think it makes people rethink their decision in the "heat of the moment" so to speak. Of course it's not going to prevent anyone from downvoting, but maybe it would at least cause them to reevaluate their reasoning.

[–]Buckyluggar [スコア非表示]  (6子コメント)

I'm just putting it out there, but traffic to this page has probably been dwindling due to the sheer number of people banned from this site?!

[–]LunatikFringe [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Also just tired of the nonsense. In my opinion the squeaky wheels get a disproportionate amount of notice, but of the majority that just get sick of her shit, don't throw a tantrum about it, and just leave.

https://i.imgur.com/KptWy1I.jpg

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

We don't ban as many people as you think we do. By your theory we would have banned 13 million people in the first month alone. Say banning someone takes about 5 seconds (that's when you use special third party tools), and I think there were only 4 mods back then. It would take each mod 188 full days to ban all those people.

It was to be expected that less and less people would have any interest in the subreddit, just as I am sure not as many people watch the show on netflix as they did in December of last year.

[–]FoxyMcJ [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

Did you know that in SS2s thread of complete lack of respect that she threatened to ban me all together from this sub?

Do you know I was (at first) permanently banned from this site for calling someone a twat?

[–]MamMoFo [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Well in your defense it was watwatt. And he is. Plus what he said was 5X as offensive, and he knew it, that's their MO to goad people into finally saying something they can then cry to a mod about, says a lot about their character after all.

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

No to the first one, yes to the second one. And yeah, everyone gets banned for name calling, you were not the only one...

[–]FoxyMcJ [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I accepted my punishment, and in the end you and another mod were very respectful to me.

I also accept it is not okay to call names, although I have been called far more vile names by this poster I called a twat (which was a typo ;))

But, yes, when I asked her a question, and she was throwing me memes, she did in fact threated to ban me from this sub permanently. I would go looking for the post to quote but I have blocked her, so I can't see her anymore.

[–]FoxyMcJ [スコア非表示]  (8子コメント)

Some of us started an independant sub called https://www.reddit.com/r/InnocenceandInjustice/ and a lot of that start began due to a mod here. She signed up as a subscriber over there and is causing problems.

This is what she said on this MaM sub today:

[–]FoxyMcJ 1 point 52 minutes ago

Should I reply, "shit happens"? :)

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 [score hidden] 48 minutes ago

If you wish, that is also your prerogative. And then I'll call you a cunt but you won't ban me because you don't ban people for stuff like that. And the whole thing will come full circle.

[–]FoxyMcJ 1 point 46 minutes ago

Wow.


Is this was this sub has become? Embarassing.

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 [スコア非表示]  (7子コメント)

Hey I was just making a play on the fact that you called me a cunt and I didn't ban you. I thought we were being jokey about that conversation :(

[–]FoxyMcJ [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

being jokey about that conversation :(

Yah. Jokey. You and I jokey. /s

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I don't actually have anything against you. Seriously. I don't care that you called me a cunt. I'm sorry I responded with k gifs that time. It's a reddit thing. It's hard to remember sometimes that a lot of this sub isn't used to reddit culture.

[–]FoxyMcJ [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

and yet you went and cleaned house and deleted all your bullshit. Nice

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

We remove arguments from this sub all the time. This one just included me.

If you really want me to leave as a moderator I will.

[–]FoxyMcJ [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

If you really want me to leave as a moderator I will

I do, but this is not my sub.

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I think we can all get along. Yes I'm sarcastic but I don't think my mod stuff is biased at all. And no I didn't ban you that time you were referring to. But if you were attacking another user I would ban you. But that's not because it's you personally. And even then I very rarely hand out bans for more than a couple of days. I do care about the sub or I wouldn't have stuck around this long.

[–]OpenMind4U 1ポイント2ポイント  (37子コメント)

Without whining, here is my list of MaM subdirect propose 'improvements':

  • each new post should have an appropriate label attached to the title. For example, look at OP title. It has green 'label' MOD. We need to use meaningful 'labels' as well in EVERY our post/threat title like: 'forensics', 'theory', 'legal', 'cell phone', 'blood', 'Zellner'... and so on...;

  • the Reddit search engine should be able to recognize the search based on 'label'. Meaning, the search engine should have an additional search criteria to optimize the search filter. Possibly, to add 'label' yes/no 'checkbox' (it's WEB programming issue of Reddit maintenance group);

  • 'downvote'/'upvote' should be only used for post/thread itself, not in individual's comments, inside of the thread. IMO, enough is enough. This 'fixture' has been used and abused inappropriately for too long. 'You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink';

  • the comments or/and post deletion by Mod should have warning first to the 'author', so issue can be resolved in civil matter between 'author' and Mod, PRIOR to escalation of not-necessary anger, accusation and suspicious;

Please make your list and/or discuss/modify mine...but please let's start this improvement process going...Mod invites us so let's do it!!!

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (3子コメント)

the comments or/and post deletion by Mod should have warning first to the 'author', so issue can be resolved in civil matter between 'author' and Mod, PRIOR to escalation of not-necessary anger, accusation and suspicious;

Thanks. Removal reasons are the first thing I will introduce, possibly today already. AutoMod will start messaging more people as well.

[–]roadpuppets 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

I will applaud you for going in a positive direction, specifically for the things we have NOT been seeing, at least recently;

making an effort, being involved

behaving professionally

One minor complaint I've had is that you mods (3 that I know of?), all seem to also moderate a half dozen other, some very large subreddits, not sure how you find the time, but MaM seems yo suffer for the lack of focus/attention/interest. Of course I'm making a big assumption here, feel free to correct me.

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Most of us are default mods, yeah. It can be good and bad. The good part is, we know the site and its tools, we kinda know how to handle a large subreddits, people who take it too far by threatening people etc (emphasis on 'kinda', I can't promise the subreddit will not implode on us some day). The bad thing is, we might be spread to thin. Although if the defaults we mod are well run, we don't spend that much time on them, because of the larger teams, the work is evenly spread. But I obviously don't have the authority of someone like you when it comes to the content of every single thread, or the Avery case itself for example...

[–]OpenMind4U 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Excellent! Thank you very much. Reddit has PM system which can be utilized for such matter.

[–]pdentt 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

great point with number 4 open :)

[–]OpenMind4U 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Thank you...looks like Mod promise to address this issue asap. We'll see how it'll be resolved/improved shortly, hopefully.

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 -1ポイント0ポイント  (30子コメント)

The problem with the "warning" system is that we have tons of posts in this sub. Keeping up with who has been warned etc could be problematic. Which is why when a post is removed we encourage people to come to modmail to see if there is something that can be done to either approve the post or repost it again. Some posts need to be removed immediately due to concerns about personal information or being totally off-topic (like the ones complaining about other subreddits). Posts like that would never get a warning.

Edit: and I would like to add this is how it goes in virtually every other subreddit

[–]screamingforoxygen 3ポイント4ポイント  (14子コメント)

Just wanted to say this won't always work. I had not even noticed my post was deleted. I saw a comment someone put my user name in that said I had deleted it the following day. This is how I realized it was gone.

Unless you keep checking your post, how would you even know it was deleted?

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 0ポイント1ポイント  (13子コメント)

Werner is working on an automated removal comment. Which would alert you. But it takes some technical know-how

[–]screamingforoxygen 4ポイント5ポイント  (12子コメント)

Do you know why when my post was removed, I could not tell? I could still see it.

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 0ポイント1ポイント  (11子コメント)

We are working on making the flairing easier for removed posts. Unfortunately reddit doesn't offer these things as a standard.

[–]screamingforoxygen 6ポイント7ポイント  (8子コメント)

I am certainly not going to pick on anyone for not having the right technology, clearly I don't even know how to format.

Suggesting we contact a mod if our post are removed though seems silly if I can't see that it has been removed.

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 1ポイント2ポイント  (7子コメント)

Well that is a good point. And half the reason we made this post.

[–]MamMoFo 0ポイント1ポイント  (5子コメント)

We? You keep saying that, what have you done?

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

The other mods helped me draft the post that is up here. When I put on the green hat, I'm not speaking alone...the other mods are on board with what I say.

[–]LunatikFringe [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

She's in charge of a fuckton of memes, pay attention.

[–]MamMoFo 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

vs. putting any thought or actual effort into not deleting the post in the first place. you really don't get it.

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

We can't leave every post up. You would hate the sub if we did.

[–]OpenMind4U 4ポイント5ポイント  (14子コメント)

Ok. I would agree in regards of posts with personal information in it. But for other posts - regardless how much extra workload it adds to the Mod - it should be done on more, civil level...at least, try to make this more civil. I still remember what happened with Olivia's post...and what was achieved? We lost Olivia...one of the best, knowledgeable blogger, contributor in this sub!!!...and she's gone!!!...so? what benefit it creates? ...you see, coin always has two-sides.

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 2ポイント3ポイント  (13子コメント)

Or... We could all agree that it's nothing personal and just how the site works. We aren't bothered when a person asks in modmail if their post can be restored. There is just no real way to "follow up" with warnings. Modding subreddits is all about having every action logged for any other mod to see. The warning thing isn't something that we have available in the mod tools given to us. So it would be kind of a cluster trying to figure out what someone is talking about when they say they were warned three months ago. Right now you could say I removed a comment three months ago and I could easily find it and discuss it with you.

[–]OpenMind4U 4ポイント5ポイント  (12子コメント)

I'll tell you short story. Yesterday, I made post on admin side 'Letter to Admin'. With radical proposition to make visible the usernames who vote. So, if you click on downvote/upload - you can see who vote. omg...you should see what happened as soon as I posted...hahaha...you should see the number of downvotes and anger it creates...so, in no time, I deleted my post...keep receiving hatefull mails....hahaha

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 -1ポイント0ポイント  (11子コメント)

I know one brave soul who makes his upvote/downvotes visible. It's actually an option in your preferences to allow others to see how you voted.

It used to be you could see the downvote total as well as the upvote total. I miss that :(

[–]OpenMind4U 1ポイント2ポイント  (10子コメント)

Oh I want to do it too. I want my vote to be visible. How to do it?

[–]roadpuppets 5ポイント6ポイント  (7子コメント)

Now I'm going through your voting record... judging you! jk ;)

[–]OpenMind4U 0ポイント1ポイント  (6子コメント)

Good! My vote is non-private anymore. I have nothing to hide. And this how I believe it should be done. So, before I'll downvote someone comment - I'll make sure to ask why person think this way or make sure I understand the comment properly.

Follow me!:)

[–]roadpuppets 4ポイント5ポイント  (5子コメント)

I may be wrong but I think it only shows your voting on topics vs. comments? btw you're one of my favorites, but shhhh we must never speak of this -_-

[–]siouxsie_siouxv2 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

preferences>privacy options>make votes visible

[–]OpenMind4U 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Great!...thank you...done it!

[–]Skipalou 1ポイント2ポイント  (8子コメント)

Tabs on top and list what they are

Eample: http://begone.wikia.com/wiki/Forum

1 Tab: All Avery

2 Tab: All Dassey

3.Tab: All Court

4 Tab: All Crime

Etc.....

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (7子コメント)

Thanks, that's pretty much what I meant by introducing flairs + filters.

[–]Strikeout21 1ポイント2ポイント  (4子コメント)

Dummies? You're a Mod, correct? I gotta tell ya, this makes me less than hopeful for the future of this sub.

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

I was joking...

[–]Strikeout21 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Gotcha.. Yours was the fist comment I read in the thread and it completely threw me off. Also, I must have missed the /s.. Carry on

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

I still don't know what you meant by "tabs on top and list what they are".

[–]anditurnedaround 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

What?!

[–]Werner__Herzog[S] [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

He only said same cryptic thing about tabs before editing the comment...

[–]OpenMind4U 0ポイント1ポイント  (7子コメント)

Question: I want my vote to be visible in people's comments and in thread/post area. I already made changes in my profile. Why it's still not visible in comment area? Can you help please.

[–]anditurnedaround 0ポイント1ポイント  (6子コメント)

I can see your up and down votes on the main post (not comments)on your page. I think it is the only way to see it, to go to someones page and look. which I only did because you wrote this, other wise I would never bother.

[–]OpenMind4U 1ポイント2ポイント  (5子コメント)

hmmm...so, nobody can see my userid in comment upvote/downvote?

If this is true then what the reason to keep this freaking COUNT in the first place???? It's just dumb counter...and if it's 'count holding container'/variable then why not set it up to 'not less than 0' default?!!!!!! What am I missing? What the purpose of this than???

[–]anditurnedaround 0ポイント1ポイント  (3子コメント)

The purpose of the up vote down, down vote has nothing to do with the recognition of what you personally have voted. The sole purpose of the up vote down vote is to bring what the majority has voted on top of the page, so the reader can see what the majority finds most important.

Why do you want people to know what you voted on? This is a personal need, not on that benefits the whole of the sub.

Please don't take this as being mean, just trying to give you an understanding of the votes.

[–]OpenMind4U 2ポイント3ポイント  (2子コメント)

It's not about ME dear! It's about how this downvote/upvote in comment has been used...it's perception and execution which people use exactly how they should NOT use.

If like you said: 'The sole purpose of the up vote down vote is to bring what the majority has voted on top of the page, so the reader can see what the majority finds most important' then keep this vote count ONLY for title/thread/post...not for comments.

Otherwise, imo, it has no meaning. And believe me, I can leave my life just fine with 'less than zero' count next to my comment!!! I'm fine:)...I simply trying to bring attention to something which is BROKEN and USELESS and brings no benefit to discussion Reddit forum. just my strong opinion.

[–]anditurnedaround [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

While I agree the vote arrow is used incorrectly across reddit., it still brings up the comments that are most valued by the community.

It lets us not go through a ton a ridiculous comments, or trolls, to get to a really great comment. Theoretically anyway.

Trust me, this is an issue across the board. It does seem to bring up the really great comments to the top for the most part. with exception of course.

I apologize for misunderstanding why you wanted your vote to show. I still do not quite understand., but can see you see what many of us have for a long time. Its not a perfect system.

I think if we had just a up vote and no down vote., this might work. Ignore what you think adds nothing, up vote what you think is a really good contribution, and report what as needed. The down vote I am sure makes the whole process faster, and I think over all it evens out in the larger subs. You can have a few haters, but will make little impact. That is why some of the smaller subs have a hidden down vote arrow.

[–]LunatikFringe [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Thank you! There IS value in downvoting garbage that people overlook. Usually garbage posters.

[–]LunatikFringe [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I feel bad for finding it amusing you getting all riled up over this little thing :) I love your emotion tho.

[–]roadpuppets [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Wanted to add a final thought here, until recently I didn't have much of an opinion on you (the mods) at all, I just so seldom saw you, and while I'd prefer that you were more involved... as interested community members, I understand if that's not your preference.

My comment tho is this; /u/Werner__Herzog - although I disagree with your take (completely) on the other "issue", I have a great deal of respect for you solely from what I learned in this thread. If we had a couple more moderators (for the workload, etc.) that followed your example we'd be in great shape.

I really think in the long run this MaM deal is gonna be more about injustice, corruption and rights and hopefully be a spark or turning point in history, so anyway, thanks for making an effort to improve this sub.

Edit: I do Reddit 99% on mobile, where I can view the site sidebar, but apparently only a portion of it, so after all this time I just now saw the mods ARE listed here when viewing on desktop. We have 12 moderators?!

[–]KingLuxor [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Can you edit the original post to include a bullet list of the things to be changed, and show them according to in the works or completed ? Thanks!

[–]icmeta4s [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Can I get a confirmation from the mods that all posts regarding Edward Wayne Edwards are deleted?

[–]wilbert-vb 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

You can see this thread as a brainstorming session

Let me for this comment assume that anything is possible.

I wonder if a page with "Best Comments of /r/MakingaMurderer" would be useful, similar to "Best of Reddit".

[–][削除されました]  (6子コメント)

[removed]

    [–]Werner__Herzog[S,M] 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

    You probably want to post this to the q&a thread or make a post about this. This thread is for meta discussion about the subreddit itself, not the case.

    [–]OpenMind4U 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

    With all due respect, can we stay on OP topic, please. Can we discuss how to improve this MaM subdirect?

    We're all facing interesting time ahead, especially after Zellner's brief will be completed and published to the public. The traffic on this side will be huge and 'bumpy'. I believe OP raised good questions, at the right time. Let's discuss it and have some improvements, if possible.

    But first, I want to hear from Mod what happened with our comments deletion.