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India successfully test-fires indigenously developed supersonic interceptor missile (thehindu.com)
LawOtheLariat が 9時間前 投稿
残りのコメントをみる →
[–]TheyTukMyJub -14ポイント-13ポイント-12ポイント 5時間前 (44子コメント)
Idk man, if a nation develops missiles while 50% of the households dont have access to toilets in their homes...
[–]_Mrityunjaya_ 7ポイント8ポイント9ポイント 4時間前 (5子コメント)
Idk man, if a nation develops missiles while 50% of the households dont have access to toilets in their homes
How would not developing missiles solve any of India's problems?
[+]TheyTukMyJub スコアが基準値未満のコメント-6ポイント-5ポイント-4ポイント 3時間前 (4子コメント)
More gov resources to reallocate?
[–]_Mrityunjaya_ 6ポイント7ポイント8ポイント 3時間前 (2子コメント)
First of all, we have two hostile nuclear neighbours, and we don't want to depend on arms imports for our military. Secondly, we don't spend a lot on our military and space programs(1.88% of our GDP). Thirdly, even if we scrap our military and space budget, It would end up getting swallowed by corrupt officials in India.
[–]TheyTukMyJub -5ポイント-4ポイント-3ポイント 3時間前 (1子コメント)
I kind of replied to a similar comment, so I'm just going to quote myself if you're ok with that:
I believe that (no disrespect) Third World countries shouldn't be doing programs like these. It causes an increase in the already present systematic leakage of funds. Be it corruption, stalling or actual development problems. I understand the need for a defence system. That's not the point. My point is that prioritizing the development of a new system instead of purchasing it, is a silly allocation of funds which the Union budget could've spent otherwise.
[–]_Mrityunjaya_ 4ポイント5ポイント6ポイント 2時間前 (0子コメント)
My point is that prioritizing the development of a new system instead of purchasing it
The thing is that we do not want to depend on foreign suppliers for weaponry and aerospace. Why shouldn't a country develop an independent military and aerospace sector? Development of our military and aerospace sector would prove a huge boon for our economy. We will be able to get low-cost hardware instead of depending on other nations for weaponry.
Secondly, the funds will go to waste if you re-allocate them.
[–]zolzks_rebooted1 [スコア非表示] 30分前 (0子コメント)
India allocates 25% of its budget to welfare. The entire defence budget is about 3%.
India became poor because it didn't/couldn't defend its borders. It was historically the wealthiest region in the world right up until British colonization.
[–]throwaway_153759 13ポイント14ポイント15ポイント 5時間前* (7子コメント)
Idk man whoever taught you this asinine logic that a nation cannnot build missiles to defend itself and toilets for its people simultaneously are bigger retard than you are
[+]TheyTukMyJub スコアが基準値未満のコメント-10ポイント-9ポイント-8ポイント 4時間前 (6子コメント)
Sweet job on the ad hominem. But consider this "asinine" logic: India (a developing country) would have saved billions by purchasing Russia's system. Instead, they insisted on DRDO developing their own system and wasted funds which could have been better spent.
[–]ChaIroOtoko 10ポイント11ポイント12ポイント 4時間前 (2子コメント)
Lol, the money spent on DRDO remains in India.
While buying russian missiles would mean giving money to a foreing nation.
Use some brains mate.
[–]TheyTukMyJub -2ポイント-1ポイント0ポイント 3時間前 (1子コメント)
That's a nationalistic way of looking at this. I prefer looking from an efficiency perspective: instead of creating and sustaining fake jobs by an inefficient program (which develops things from scratch) it would be better to invest in India's infrastructure to create structural development. Which in turn would benefit India's military.
[–]YouredumbasfuckOP [スコア非表示] 1時間前* (0子コメント)
Go tell an ISRO scientist that his job is fake because India "shouldn't have" (whatever the fuck that means) a military/space industry. He'll laugh in your face.
Literally, your argument boils down to: India shouldn't promote the growth of certain manufacturing industries because some Indians are poor.
[–]imnoidiot5 6ポイント7ポイント8ポイント 3時間前 (2子コメント)
You know, if you shat on India's corruption problems and leaks in the system, I would agree with you in a heartbeat. The fact is, you look at anything that is kind of necessary (a good aerial protection system when you're in a bad neighborhood) and you froth at your mouth while ignoring something that is completely unnecessary (endemic corruption at all levels).
India can, should and will spend money on defense capabilities because it needs to. The instant NATO and US troops leave Afghanistan, everything may change and Pakistan will once again be able to properly focus on their eastern border. China is already miles ahead of India and poses a threat.
India also needs sanitation.
These two are not related or mutually exclusive. They can and will happen simultaneously because unlike you, even an inept government knows how to allocate budgets and distribute administrative power - here's a sanitation comparison for select states.
I didn't know any of this. I just googled it. You can too.
[–]TheyTukMyJub -3ポイント-2ポイント-1ポイント 3時間前 (1子コメント)
while ignoring something that is completely unnecessary (endemic corruption at all levels).
I'm not ignoring that. In fact, it's partially why I believe that (no disrespect) Third World countries shouldn't be doing programs like these. It causes an increase in the already present systematic leakage of funds. Be it corruption, stalling or actual development problems. I understand the need for a defence system. That's not the point. My point is that prioritizing the development of a new system instead of purchasing it, is a silly allocation of funds which the Union budget could've spent otherwise.
[–]imnoidiot5 3ポイント4ポイント5ポイント 3時間前 (0子コメント)
How is it a priority? It's been in the works since 1999, according to Wikipedia. That's 17 years.
You're sitting here in your ivory tower pooh-poohing at the "Indian government" for doing this when the actual decision to spend, how much to spend, where to spend has been taken by multiple ministries and administrators who have evaluated everything that you said and still proceeded with it. As you said, India isn't rich. The fact that they chose to spend on this as well shows there's money for this, and a need for this. Those guys aren't morons.
Before you go saying "appeal to authority", I'd like to point out your entire line of thought (where you explicitly believe you think the money is wasted because it should have been spent elsewhere) is arrogant.
[–]SolSearcher 10ポイント11ポイント12ポイント 5時間前 (17子コメント)
Getting nuked seems like a valid concern with your crazy neighbor having them.
[+]TheyTukMyJub スコアが基準値未満のコメント-10ポイント-9ポイント-8ポイント 4時間前 (16子コメント)
Definitely. Or well, the problem isn't really nukes since Pakistan and China don't have a "fire first" doctrine. But Pakistan isn't shy of using "non-nuclear" ballistic missiles.
But that's besides the point. I'm not saying India doesn't have the right to defend itself. My point is more that instead of building a system from the scratch they should've bought it on the market. They wasted billions on the project, which is a luxury a developing nation shouldn't afford when 50% has no sanitation.
[–]thisisshantzz 9ポイント10ポイント11ポイント 4時間前 (12子コメント)
What? Actually its India that has a "no first use" policy. Pakistan will use nukes the moment it sees an opportunity. That is why they are making tactical nuclear weapons (Hatf IX) to counter India's conventional military might.
[+]TheyTukMyJub スコアが基準値未満のコメント-8ポイント-7ポイント-6ポイント 3時間前 (11子コメント)
Pakistan will use nukes the moment it sees an opportunity.
That's gross simplification of Pakistan's nuclear program. You're totalling ignoring the fact that Pakistan's nukes are a reaction to India's development of nuclear weapons and that the Nasr-missile is a in turn a reaction to India's dubious Cold Start. It's a good ol' example of mutual deterrence.
[–]MatCauthon28 8ポイント9ポイント10ポイント 3時間前 (9子コメント)
False. The pakistani nuclear program was started immediately after the their defeat in the 1971 war.
[–]TheyTukMyJub -5ポイント-4ポイント-3ポイント 3時間前 (8子コメント)
Read again. India started their nuclear program in 1944. Bhutto's started Pakistan's nuclear program as a response to India's program. (Idd after their defeat).
[–]MatCauthon28 7ポイント8ポイント9ポイント 2時間前 (6子コメント)
Lol! What?
India started it's nuclear program while it was still a British colony? Before America dropped the first atomic bomb?
[–]TheyTukMyJub -4ポイント-3ポイント-2ポイント 2時間前* (5子コメント)
I'm not even shitting you, March 1944.
Edit: lmao, nice downvoting and running when you have to deal with historical facts.
[–]jainsourabh 5ポイント6ポイント7ポイント 1時間前 (1子コメント)
India didn't start until 1967. Don't know where you are getting your information from but I'd stop using those sources immediately.
[–]MatCauthon28 2ポイント3ポイント4ポイント 1時間前 (1子コメント)
Historical facts? More like LSD facts. Any source to back your hilarious claims?
[–]a_random_individual [スコア非表示] 1時間前 (0子コメント)
What are you smoking, mate? India was still a British colony in 1944. Can you provide some source at least?
[–]thisisshantzz 3ポイント4ポイント5ポイント 1時間前 (0子コメント)
India started their nuclear program in 1944
Pakistan didn't even exist in 1944.
[–]thisisshantzz 1ポイント2ポイント3ポイント 1時間前 (0子コメント)
But Pakistan still will not hesitate from using nukes in any battle. India on the other hand has a "no first use" policy which means that even if Cold Start were to come into play, India will not use WMDs in war unless attacked by one, and that includes tactical nukes of Pakistan.
I also don't see what is so dubious about the Cold Start doctrine.
[–]imnoidiot5 3ポイント4ポイント5ポイント 4時間前 (0子コメント)
wasted
Yeah sure
should've bought it on the market
What an idea sirji, if only americans behaved the same way.
Quote: "Through a recent trade agreement, the United States government has made such technology - forward-mode AN/TPY-2 ballistic missile defense radars – available to several allied nations. The trade agreement was carried out through the Foreign Military Sales program and sanctioned by the Arms Export Control Act, which allows the government to sell arms to foreign nations as long as it serves American security interests.". Fuck that lol
luxury
Indian defense spending is a pittance, India already imports a lot, and geopolitical dynamics along with India's industrialization means that India needs an indigenous military industry more than ever.
Anyway, this industry employs people, who educate and put their kids through school and (magic) have toilets at home. Their kids will have toilets at home too. Isn't that what Reddit likes? For people to be off welfare (welfare = getting help from government(s) for toilet stuff) and to do good old fashioned grunt work? Why this double standard with India then? Is Reddit suddenly concerned for poor people in India?
[–]coolirisme 3ポイント4ポイント5ポイント 3時間前 (1子コメント)
India and China has a 'No first use doctrine'. Pakistan doesn't have that.
[–]TheyTukMyJub -4ポイント-3ポイント-2ポイント 3時間前 (0子コメント)
True, I guess it could be fair to say Pakistan's reaction to Cold Start is a new doctrine.
[–]imnoidiot5 5ポイント6ポイント7ポイント 5時間前 (10子コメント)
First prize in not understanding how governments work to you laddie
[+]TheyTukMyJub スコアが基準値未満のコメント-8ポイント-7ポイント-6ポイント 4時間前 (9子コメント)
Thanks, lass. It's ironic that the front page has a documentary criticizing the US' military spending. But criticizing a developing nation that wastes cash on inefficient military projects instead of sanitation somehow causes butthurt.
[–]imnoidiot5 10ポイント11ポイント12ポイント 4時間前 (4子コメント)
instead of
lol. because the indian government is a monolith, and can do only one thing at a time because. it's not like there are separate ministries for defense and sanitation, and its not like each have their own allocated budget, information that is available on the internets for all to see. india actually underspends on military. keep it real there buddy, lol i like that you're parroting out low effort trip
[–]TheyTukMyJub -5ポイント-4ポイント-3ポイント 3時間前 (3子コメント)
india actually underspends on military
No, India has growing ambitions and wants to project more power into the region. That why it only looks like they're underspending. But India's child malnutrition rate is higher than sub-Saharan Africa. Wasting cash on ego-trip projects is not a luxury that a third world country like India can afford.
[–]imnoidiot5 5ポイント6ポイント7ポイント 3時間前 (2子コメント)
India has growing ambitions
Yes, as a function of the fact that it's expected to be highly populated, bigger economy than the US by 2050, which is also around the time my kids will be having their own kids. I don't want them to live in fear of Pakistan hulking out and blowing up shit.
and wants to project more power into the region
Yes. Big deal. Think long term, prepare for the worst and hope for the best. Keeping the airspace over India secure and critical installations in India secure isn't a bad thing, but somehow you're making it out to be. This is all a long-term investment. It's not an investment for the next 2 years only. It's something that'll last for the next 20-30 years (I don't know the life cycle of ballistic missiles). So its definitely not a bad thing.
That's why it only looks
Wut? India spends on military, but not enough, with a focus on long term investments instead of stop-gap bandaid fixes. That's a bad thing? You were the one who said "inefficient spending".
child malnutrition rate is higher than sub-Saharan Africa
Yes, we're working on it at the same time we're working on acquiring missiles and building roads and building power plants and building malls and supplying electricity to the Indian railways while maintaining the tracks. See? Magic! That's how government works. All these things are happening together, right now, even as you read this.
wasting cash
Not even kind of. It would be a waste if India were sitting where Chile is now and doing it. Don't kid yourself. Pakista, India and China have no love lost for each other.
ego-trip
No. What? Are you saying this is for bragging rights? Bruh, India's foreign policy and military strategy has been to go it alone and do it alone from time immemorial, with occasional Russian/French/Israeli help. Nothing about a missile system developed on its own suggests bragging rights. To who? Other countries that have done it on their own? Or countries in the vicinity who don't care? Realpolitik don't work like schoolyards dude.
No, it's a necessity.
third world country like India can afford
It can and will continue to be able to afford it until it can't.
When would you suggest India develop self-defense capabilities? Did you see the links I posted? Shit's expensive outside, India anyway needs an indigenous industry, that industry employs people...none of that got through?
Before I reply - didn't I already reply to you? Am I arguing with you on 3 different comments or am I confusing you with someone else?
[–]imnoidiot5 2ポイント3ポイント4ポイント 3時間前 (0子コメント)
It's all me
[–]ChaIroOtoko 5ポイント6ポイント7ポイント 4時間前* (3子コメント)
I mean USA spends hundreds of billions on defense budget but still cannot provide clean water to it's people. We are spending nothing compared to them.
EDIT: oooh, butthurt muricans. o7
[–]TheyTukMyJub -4ポイント-3ポイント-2ポイント 3時間前 (2子コメント)
You can't compare the US with India in that regard. India's child malnutrition rate is higher than sub-Saharan Africa. 50% of Indian household have no toilets at home.
[–]ChaIroOtoko 6ポイント7ポイント8ポイント 3時間前 (1子コメント)
Usa cannot even provide clean water. People go bankrupt due to medical bills. The gun violence is extremely high. Drug epidemic is at it's peak. Infrastructure is failing. Education system is failing. What's your point?
[–]TheyTukMyJub -3ポイント-2ポイント-1ポイント 3時間前 (0子コメント)
My point is that the standard of living in the US is still tremendously better than in India. And that the Indian government should rethink their priorities. What makes you assume I wouldn't want the US government to do the same?
π Rendered by PID 4610 on app-88 at 2016-05-16 19:45:07.811860+00:00 running c4b08ed country code: JP.
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