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The "not all men" argument. (imgur.com)

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[–]Smoogy 55ポイント56ポイント  (12子コメント)

Can't upvote this enough.

One moment when they say that women have to be more careful, promoting these rapists a free bypass of responsibility to their own actions.... "These guys have no choice over the offer of opportunity if you dress like that or live a certain lifestyle that requires you to leave your house".

Next moment they are whinging #notallmen. Suddenly they DO have choice over their actions. And not only that, they want that choice to count as a good deed. Like, "Aren't I great? I didn't rape you, ladies. YOU'RE WELCOME?"

[–]twelvedayslate[S] 37ポイント38ポイント  (2子コメント)

Exactly.

So many men haven't raped me, but that doesn't cancel out the one who did. No, not every man has. But one did.

And you don't deserve an award for not raping someone.

[–]notapantsdayI have an X chromosome too 18ポイント19ポイント  (4子コメント)

"These guys have no choice over the offer of opportunity if you dress like that or live a certain lifestyle that requires you to leave your house".

Next moment they are whinging #notallmen.

Not trying to break the circlejerk here, but are those really the same people? I mean, I know both kinds of men but I can't think of anyone who checks both boxes.

[–]Smoogy 7ポイント8ポイント  (3子コメント)

Familiar with the famous car analogy? It's a perfect bingo and then some.

"Not all guys are bad but there are some bad people out there. you have to be careful. Like you don't park your car in a bad street with the keys in the ignition and doors unlocked and not expect it to get stolen"

It even starts out with a "not all men" And immediately shifts in responsibility to be the women's fault as well as comparing women to inanimate objects.

[–]notapantsdayI have an X chromosome too -4ポイント-3ポイント  (2子コメント)

I don't think saying "be careful out there" shifts the responsibility to women. It's just a reaction to reality. Honestly, what else should be said? "Sure, that back alley looks sketchy as fuck but rape is illegal so you have nothing to fear"?

I think you screwed up the car analogy a bit. The way I know it, it has some phrase like "no wonder you were raped / your car was stolen" in it, which does shift the blame to the victim and is absolutely fucked up.

In my opinion, the belief behind the "car analogy" is that men are just dick-controlled rape machines who can't help themselves when they see an exposed ankle. If I hear a woman use this analogy, I wonder what experience made her feel that way about men. If I hear a man use that analogy, I run.

[–]nowayitsathrowaway5 7ポイント8ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think the problem is that the focus is telling women to alter their behaviors, instead of trying to fix rape culture. Women have been told their whole lives to stay "safe", it's just redundant at this point.

[–]Smoogy -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

And what next? Potential victims can't go outside to buy groceries or let a plumber in their house lest it be argued as a form of consent? A person walks down the alley is not consent too being raped. This is rooshv logic. Just like leaving your car unlocked isn't consent to steal. Bad behaviour isn't promoted by circumstance. Bad behaviour is chosen. It's still an action they choose regardless of opportunity.It's not negating their entire premeditated decision.Yes, bad people are out there. The point is to lock them up. Not the victims. They are a danger to society. That's kind of the point of removing them from treating the world like a romper room. The world isn't their oyster. But it's hard enough even locking up people over rape when consent is so heavily argued.
Also consent of ownership is proved on registration. Consent to argue rape is still controversial enough to say these two things don't even come into the same neighborhood of comparison

[–]AnnaTrocity 32ポイント33ポイント  (0子コメント)

And then you have to stop and explain the concept of "derailing" and really by the time that happens, they've already achieved their goal of shutting women up.

[–]DarcyMcCarbombPeople. What a bunch of bastards. 15ポイント16ポイント  (3子コメント)

For real. If they're not talking about you, then cool! You're one of the good-- or maybe just not terrible-- ones! I don't jump into conversations about white police brutality and scream, "But I'm white and I've never murdered a black man! How dare you!" Like, excellent, good job on that, but as a non-murderer it already wasn't about me so there's no need to take it personally.

[–]notapantsdayI have an X chromosome too 10ポイント11ポイント  (2子コメント)

I agree with you 100%.

But sometimes discussions become less civilized. If you were in a group of black people and the conversation goes from police brutality to "white people think they can just shoot our kids and get away with it", I'm sure you'd be a bit offended too.

What I'm trying to say is that sometimes, a "not all men" is just a clumsy way of saying, "can we please stop using the word men when we mean rapists?".

[–]YouAndMeToo 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

Men when we mean rapists

This! Sadly a large amount of men here "men" and connect that to all men. It's human nature.

[–]Serendipities -4ポイント-3ポイント  (0子コメント)

the conversation goes from police brutality to "white people think they can just shoot our kids and get away with it", I'm sure you'd be a bit offended too.

I mean, no, I'd not be offended. That sentence isn't a personal indictment of me and it's not my place to try to speak "for" white people when a more important conversation is happening.

[–]emorrell 11ポイント12ポイント  (0子コメント)

🙌 🙌 🙌

[–]smurgleburf 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

PREEEACH

[–]Intanjible 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

I will never understand why people feel the need to apply attention seeking or blame diverting "quantifiers" (e.g. "not all men" or "all lives matter") to situations like these. Of course it isn't actually all men, but it sure as fuck is enough of us to be a problem, and malignant humblebrag posturing bullshit like "not all men" detracts from the issue at hand. Pointing out that you might not be part of the problem doesn't solve the fucking problem.

[–]AllyD- 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

It's a way to derail feminist arguments.btw funny memes: http://m.imgur.com/TRErIOI,Q9yWFNO

[–]hawleyal 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Devil's advocate here, making overgeneralizations is prejudice.