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Gerry Adams defends N-word tweet (theguardian.com)

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[–]AWookieeFromKashyyyk[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (32子コメント)

There's an election in a few days. Fuck me what a moron. Although i'd be very surprised if there was any kind of investigation or changes made because of this.

[–]DogBotherer 3ポイント4ポイント  (31子コメント)

Again, it isn't the kind of thing a politicians should be doing, but it's an idea which has circulated on this side of the Atlantic for decades if not longer. Stiff Little Fingers got media shit for it in the '80s despite being active anti-racists (probably NSFW lyrics given these sensitivities and assuming anyone is at work).

[–]whydoyouonlylie 8ポイント9ポイント  (15子コメント)

I don't think this is in any way comparable to what Adams was saying though ...

This is clearly comparing racism in general (blacks, Pakistani, Irish) whereas Adams was attempting to equate black slavery in the US, depicted in Django unchained, with the treatment of Irish Nationalists in Ireland.

[–]JackXDark 2ポイント3ポイント  (8子コメント)

Elvis Costello gets away with it and Oliver's Army is regularly played on the radio uncensored so it's definitely not without precedent, especially when someone's using it ironically to talk about themselves.

Gerry Adams can fuck off for lots of reasons I'm sure don't need saying, but using that word to refer to people someone feels superior to and wants to dehumanise has a history outside of it just referring to black people ie 'Sand-N-gger' for Arabs or 'Timber-N-gger' for Native Americans, or 'Spud N-gger' for Irish in general, so I don't think anyone should really get upset about him using it when he's clearly referring to himself rather than anyone else and using it pejoratively.

[–]whydoyouonlylie 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

It's not so much the use of the term that I take issue with. I mean just the other day at the White House Correspondent's dinner on live television Larry Wilmore called President Obama "My Nigga" and nobody batted an eyelid.

I more take issue with his use of the term with the reference to Django Unchained to compare the treatment of Irish Nationalists in the Ballymurphy area with the treatment of the blacks in the period shown in the movie. I mean that movie talks about "house niggers" and "field niggers" and essentially equates the word "nigger" to meaning a black person who is the property of the white owner.

[–]JackXDark 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

It's not directly equivalent, sure, and getting into discussions about The Troubles is a complicated minefield, and fuck defending Gerry Adams (or loyalists too, for that matter) but the word does have a history of being used alongside a whole load of other not especially pleasant, but perhaps more directly Irish ones. As I've mentioned already, I refer you to Elvis Costello's Oliver's Army for another ironic example.

[–]borg88Buckinghamshire 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Costello's song Radio Radio was also played regularly on the radio. Too many words in most of his songs for the BBC to follow.

And the radio is in the hands of such a lot of fools tryin' to anaesthetise the way that you feel

[–]AWookieeFromKashyyyk[S] -4ポイント-3ポイント  (4子コメント)

'Spud N-gger'

WTF? Noone uses that.

[–]ThyrotoxicNot actually Welsh 7ポイント8ポイント  (1子コメント)

White nationalists who don't think Irish people are white enough call them potato niggers amusingly.

[–]contrarianmemelordPolish in Britain 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

This sounds like something from the 17th century...

[–]JackXDark 5ポイント6ポイント  (1子コメント)

Just because you've never heard it, doesn't mean it's not a thing. There's even a band with that name.

[–]AWookieeFromKashyyyk[S] -3ポイント-2ポイント  (0子コメント)

It means it's such a fringe hung it's not worth mentioning.

[–]brycey06 -1ポイント0ポイント  (4子コメント)

It's not an unfair comparison, poorly worded as it was

[–]whydoyouonlylie 1ポイント2ポイント  (3子コメント)

It's an incredibly unfair comparison when comparing Irish nationalists to the "niggers" in Django Unchained. Irish Nationalists in Ballymurphy were not in even remotely similar circumstances to the slaves depicted in Django.

[–]brycey06 -1ポイント0ポイント  (2子コメント)

why is it unfair? two groups treated as second class citizens in their respective places + eras

[–]whydoyouonlylie 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't know if you're actually being serious or not ...

The fact that you think that the black slaves were treated like 'citizens' at all is disturbing in the extreme. They were property. They were bought, sold and abused at the will of the white owners.

Irish Nationalists were treated as second class citizens, but they were still treated as citizens. Never as property.

Any attempt to equate the two is either seriously ignorant or utterly disgusting.

[–]crackshot87 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Slaves weren't even 2nd clas citizens, they were rounded up and treated like cattle

[–]DogBotherer 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

True.

[–]AWookieeFromKashyyyk[S] 2ポイント3ポイント  (14子コメント)

it's an idea which has circulated on this side of the Atlantic for decades if not longer

It's still complete bullshit. Just because it's an old idea doesn't change that it's complete bullshit.

[–]DogBotherer 4ポイント5ポイント  (12子コメント)

It comes from signs like "No blacks or Irish".

[–]AWookieeFromKashyyyk[S] 3ポイント4ポイント  (8子コメント)

Still doesn't even come close to being the same. We were never kidnapped and shipped off to America as slaves.

[–]DogBotherer 6ポイント7ポイント  (6子コメント)

No. I agree. As indentured servants though.

[–]Shadow_on_the_HeathHampshire -1ポイント0ポイント  (2子コメント)

..and dogs is meant to be on there somewhere.

That particular message has been said to have been on every B And B and pub in the country decades ago. Is there any photographic evidence for this?

[–]DogBotherer 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

I don't know, this letter to the Guardian claims there is 'ample oral history'. It's a little before my time to remember them.

[–]Shadow_on_the_HeathHampshire -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yeah I'm pretty sure I read that source you gave, ages ago when I went on the hunt for evidence (as it's referred to often by Guardian comments BTL!)

Just contrast it with other bigoted symbols from the same time of the 1950s and 1960s we have a huge amount of photographic documentation of segregation in the deep South, USA water fountains, threatres, waitings rooms labelled for either "white" or "coloured". Yet this "no Blacks, no Irish, no Dogs" has nothing photographically to back it up.

It's not beyond the realm of possibility for such signs to exist as open bigotry was far more acceptable in those decades then it is today. Yet, if there is no proper evidence then we're relying on shaky "oral history" which makes me doubt its existence.