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Does r/Hillaryclinton have a racism problem? (self.SRSDiscussion)

whitstifier が 投稿

Many of the subscribers seem to appropriate black culture, using language like "slay," "yaaaas," and "queen." There's a fundraising thread there today in which the OP heavily references Lemonade. This seems inappropriate for a white person's political campaign. The meanings of these words and images reserved for black voices get lost.

Note: I was just banned from the sub, which is fine. I responded to a mod comment with the same comment that got removed. I understand the mod's decision. I bring my questions here for answers.

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[–]awesomefaceninjahead 15ポイント16ポイント  (0子コメント)

What? You don't get to own words.

[–]dream_meme_team 51ポイント52ポイント  (2子コメント)

The meanings of these words and images reserved for black voices get lost.

I really don't get what meaning you're referring to. "Slay," yaaaas," and "queen" are fun slang words, not sacred incantations passed down by black people for millennia. Lemonade is a mass-market pop song, not the black national anthem. You'd have a point if Clinton supporters were going around talking about how they "have a dream" that Hillary will be elected, and using pan-African symbols as campaign logos, but this is a bit much, IMO.

[–]FakeyFaked 19ポイント20ポイント  (1子コメント)

I'm pretty sure Lemonade is being hailed as an example of black feminist art. To strip it of its blackness really seems like it takes away a ton of meaning. Appropriating black art doesn't have any type of aging-requirement attached to it.

[–]dream_meme_team 17ポイント18ポイント  (0子コメント)

Art can have multiple meanings. I agree that Lemonade is definitely an example of black feminist art, but this is not mutually exclusive with being a pop song. Art has different meanings to different people, and can even mean different things simultaneously to the same person. It would be appropriation to actively deny Lemonade's blackness and recast the song as something else. But when Clinton supporters reference Lemonade, they are simply deriving a personal meaning from it, and there's nothing wrong with that. They aren't denying others that same right. Now of course others have the right to criticize this interpretation in favor of their own. But to say that there is only one true way to interpret art is to overlook art's ability to have many meanings, which is what makes art such a powerful medium of expression in the first place.

[–]thecitycouncil 10ポイント11ポイント  (6子コメント)

"Slay" and "yaaaaaassssss" are just as much a part of gay culture as they are black culture. Should straight people not be allowed to use those words either?

[–][削除されました]  (5子コメント)

[removed]

    [–]thecitycouncil 6ポイント7ポイント  (3子コメント)

    What point have I lost? They're silly words that aren't somehow intrinsic to black or gay identity. I'm a gay man, I don't get offended when my straight friends say "yasss" or "slay." It's always in good fun, and its because they appreciate gay culture.

    [–]greenduch[M] 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Hey sorry, please try to have more substantial replies here than "whooosh" in the future.

    [–]TheKettler 10ポイント11ポイント  (2子コメント)

    And here I thought Broad City was just finally getting really popular. I didn't know that was a Beyonce thing and not just an Ilana thing.

    [–]thecitycouncil 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

    It's more of a black/Latin@/working class white gay thing. This terminology developed in the underground gay scene in New York City during the late eighties/early nineties. Words like "yas" and "slay" are especially associated with drag queens and ball culture. Watch Paris is Burning.

    [–]kyleehappiness -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

    its neither

    [–]srsthrowawayninety 30ポイント31ポイント  (7子コメント)

    The people I've noticed in real life doing this (both about Clinton and before) seem to all have picked it up from Beyoncé fans or by being Beyoncé fans. I do think that they're referencing Beyoncé's fandom/her position as a role model by applying it to Clinton, implicitly calling her the Beyoncé of US presidential politics, suggesting she's the same kind of icon. Referencing Lemonade fits with that.

    How weird is that? But that's what it seems like the people I know on Facebook who do this are doing.

    [–]greenduch 10ポイント11ポイント  (6子コメント)

    so, some of the subscribers there use my chat website, so I'm fairly familiar with them. They're just legit obsessed with Lemonade. I don't actually read the subreddit, but my assumption would be that them mentioning it a lot is related to them being generally really obsessed with it.

    not actually an edit: oh, lol I see what OP this is referring to. Yeah that person is a long time friend of mine (and a long time SRSter) and she's just hella obsessed with Lemonade.

    [–]bushiz -4ポイント-3ポイント  (5子コメント)

    I got mad shade for white people who get crazy about Beyoncé. Lemonade is fucking great on every level and in strong competition for aoty but I've when white people start saying "Preach!" about it, especially white people from fucking Connecticut and shit, I'm immediately suspect. White people identifying with Beyoncé is like black people identifying with The Royal Tenenbaums.

    [–]greenduch 3ポイント4ポイント  (2子コメント)

    Yeah I follow you. But I don't think thats what that particular OP is doing (plus we're perhaps making the assumption that all the folks talking about lemonade or using lemonade gifs over there are white, which I know they're not).

    Lemonade dropped this week, and its a huge thing in pop culture. As she (the OP that this OP is referring to) said downthread here: "Because I grew tired of thinking of names for the endless parade of Tuesdays, and Lemonade is the most important thing to happen this week."

    Idunno, I totally get what you're saying, and if folks were "owning" Formation or something, that would feel hella weird. But Beyoncé is also a hugely massive pop star who just released what so far is probably considered the most important album of the year, yeah?

    Sorry, I realize I might be defensive here because she's a friend of mine, and I appreciate that its not really my place to defend stuff here. Kinda trying to explain what I think the thought process is, and how I think its probably different than what you're describing. Sorry.

    [–]bushiz -4ポイント-3ポイント  (1子コメント)

    But Beyoncé is also a hugely massive pop star who just released what so far is probably considered the most important album of the year, yeah?

    Sure, but that doesn't make it fine. When we talk about words like "yaaas" and "slay", we're talking about words that originated in ball culture of the NYC drag queen scene of the 80's and 90's, and spread throughout the east coast and south, at least(I don't know shit about the west coast gay culture at the time), over the next decade as expressions of radical and defiant blackness and femininity in the gay and black communities. When you take those labels and apply them to Hillary Clinton, who isn't very radically or defiantly feminine by any measure that doesn't also apply to, say, Marissa Mayer, it feels very unsettling to me, as a southern femme queer, even though I'm white.

    It's not to say that clinton supporters are maliciously racist or appropriative when they post things like that, but they definitely aren't checking themselves, and it feels very disingenuous to see them give themselves endless passes on that when they eviscerate anyone who could be seen as microaggressing against Hillary.

    And maybe I'm just oversensitive about this shit because the people on my facebook TL sending out the most "Yaaaaas Queen!" posts about Hillary are the same people who would only take a cab over to my house because they were afraid of their cars getting vandalized when I lived in a house that's visible in the background of the video for No Angel.

    [–]greenduch -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Thanks for spelling it out a bit more, bushiz, very appreciated. I get where you're coming from.

    [–]louisbullock 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

    To a point though don't ya think people can still support and enjoy the music of someone who isn't the race of their own? Simply put, if you dig their music, do that.

    Of course though not many people would be thinking about any racial undertones, not everyone is that tuned in. I mean, I enjoy a bit of Kanye for example, but I'm not gonna understand completely where he's coming from in terms of racial issues.

    Maybe its not so much identifying either, I mean if Beyonce says things the are generally relatable and messages of strength and whatnot, surely it doesn't hurt for literally anyone to relate to that, connect with what she's saying etc.

    I can't think of anyone I know who's white who's been like "oh I can totally understand the struggle of black folk", I mean lets be serious here, most people who're not idiots will know that there's things like racial struggles that won't be understood, probably ever unless that person was in the body and mind of someone of a different race, you feel me on that?

    A fellow I know, lets list a few things, is gay, white, male, right? They dug the album, they were keen for it. They loved the messages of general empowerment, the strength it gives to the listeners. But they knew where they wouldn't be able to relate in terms of racial things, so they could only say "I support this as much as I can, but won't completely understand and that's ok".

    Y'get me on that? They're just enjoying a great album, good music, good messages, and know when to step back a bit. Ain't nothing too wrong with that I reckon.

    [–]louisbullock 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

    To a point though don't ya think people can still support and enjoy the music of someone who isn't the race of their own? Simply put, if you dig their music, do that.

    Of course though not many people would be thinking about any racial undertones, not everyone is that tuned in. I mean, I enjoy a bit of Kanye for example, but I'm not gonna understand completely where he's coming from in terms of racial issues.

    Maybe its not so much identifying either, I mean if Beyonce says things the are generally relatable and messages of strength and whatnot, surely it doesn't hurt for literally anyone to relate to that, connect with what she's saying etc.

    I can't think of anyone I know who's white who's been like "oh I can totally understand the struggle of black folk", I mean lets be serious here, most people who're not idiots will know that there's things like racial struggles that won't be understood, probably ever unless that person was in the body and mind of someone of a different race, you feel me on that?

    A fellow I know, lets list a few things, is gay, white, male, right? They dug the album, they were keen for it. They loved the messages of general empowerment, the strength it gives to the listeners. But they knew where they wouldn't be able to relate in terms of racial things, so they could only say "I support this as much as I can, but won't completely understand and that's ok".

    Y'get me on that? They're just enjoying a great album, good music, good messages, and know when to step back a bit. Ain't nothing too wrong with that I reckon.

    [–]polisalwayright 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Liverpudlian women call each other "queen".

    im not saying r hillaryclinton is filled with liverpudlians its just a fun fact I learned.

    [–]fatherhamlet 26ポイント27ポイント  (3子コメント)

    not really. complaints about cultural appropriation like this are useless in my opinion. all culture is hybrid, and there is no point where legitimate appreciation ends and shameful appropriation begins.

    a world without cultural borrowing is terrible and bleak. and in making the complaint that using those phrases is cultural appropriation, you are denying the agency of people from black culture. to accept the idea that using those terms is a heinous act of appropriation, is to assume that no black people would ever approve of such a thing, even though I'm sure many would not care, and some would even find it flattering. but in becoming offended on their behalf, you are putting your own righteous judgment in front of their agency.

    also, the whole idea that "you should only consume what comes from your own culture" is essentially the same mindset that white supremacists maintain to keep people pure.

    [–]danceparty3000 -5ポイント-4ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Borrowing when you weren't invited is called stealing.

    [–]aboy5643 16ポイント17ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Sounds an awful lot like white gay culture which has taken heavily from southern black culture. My favorite quote from an avid white gay Hillary supporter on the Human Rights Campaign: "It's a bunch of young white gay guys appropriating culture from black women."

    Not really sure how I personally feel about it.

    [–]Orphan_Script 24ポイント25ポイント  (18子コメント)

    More damning than this IMO is that their self-assurance that 'the minorities' are on their side, treating people as if they are bargaining chips. I'm sure we've all heard the claims that people of color aren't voting for Bernie Sanders nearly as much as middle class white people, which is fine, but that doesn't give you authority to 'claim' entire demographics of people. I see that attitude constantly and it's gross. Manipulating people of color doesn't make you a progressive.

    Plus the whole imperialism thing. Any group associated with the Clinton's political ambitions are de facto imperialist.

    [–]gavinbrindstar 18ポイント19ポイント  (13子コメント)

    Manipulating people of color doesn't make you a progressive.

    Are you saying that people of color are being "manipulated" into voting for Clinton, or just manipulating the numbers? Cause the first one is gross A F.

    More damning than this IMO is that their self-assurance that 'the minorities' are on their side, treating people as if they are bargaining chips.

    I think when talking about elections it's an okay sentiment. There truly are large blocs of people that vote in a similar fashion, and discussing those blocs is an important part of elections.

    [–]Orphan_Script 18ポイント19ポイント  (12子コメント)

    I think a lot of people- people of color, lbgt, anyone to the left of John McCain, immigrants, low wage workers- are trapped into voting for the Democrats. They do not have any other political options. The Democrats don't have to work for their vote. The Republicans legitimize them no matter how little they actually do for people.

    That is manipulation. They're forced into representation that they may or may not want because the Democrats have a monopoly on power.

    On more case-by-case basis, I don't think Democrats are strong-arming and threatening people at the polls or anything. I'm not really following the whole election mismanagement scandal this election so I can't speak to that.

    I think when talking about elections it's an okay sentiment. There truly are large blocs of people that vote in a similar fashion, and discussing those blocs is an important part of elections.

    When it comes to white Clinton supporters flaunting the fact that the black voters are on their side, and are effectively 'theirs', that's a problem. Equally when Sanders supporters scold minorities for not joining them, for not knowing what's good for them, etc. These are real people with interests and needs, not just political tokens. It's dangerous to view and treat people this way, even in an election, even if it's a 'tactical' means-to-an-end type of thing.

    [–]FakeyFaked 14ポイント15ポイント  (1子コメント)

    It's the whole 'they're voting against their interest' and 'not knowing what's good for them' type of statements that get to be a real problem.

    You might enjoy this article. It really held a mirror up to me and I think a lot of us on the left, or on social media for that matter, might want to take a look at it.

    Smug American Liberalism.

    Be warned, it's a good 20 minute read. I found it uncomfortably worth it, however.

    [–]Orphan_Script 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

    I read that earlier. I thought it was a good read too.

    [–]thecitycouncil 1ポイント2ポイント  (6子コメント)

    I think a lot of people- people of color, lbgt, anyone to the left of John McCain, immigrants, low wage workers- are trapped into voting for the Democrats. They do not have any other political options. The Democrats don't have to work for their vote. The Republicans legitimize them no matter how little they actually do for people.

    The only way we can force the Democrats to the left is to use protest votes against it. Don't vote for someone because you think you have to. If a large enough bloc votes against the Third Way Democrat establishment, we have a chance of getting a true progressive, leftist in.

    [–]kyleehappiness 5ポイント6ポイント  (5子コメント)

    but the problem is while that is an option for middle class white people - many people black, lgbt, muslim, latino cannot risk having violence leveled against them for a power play

    [–]thecitycouncil 3ポイント4ポイント  (4子コメント)

    I am an LGBT person. When Hillary Clinton met with Benjamin Netanyahu, she was practically salivating at the prospect of getting to go bomb brown people. During her time as Secretary of State, she authorized the sale of weapons to autocratic, despotic governments. She supports trade policies that encourage the use of sweatshops and slave labor in developing nations. She supports neo-liberal economic policies that continue to plunder the world's lower and middle classes to enrich the wealthy.

    The Democrats fooled me once in 2012 because it was my first election year, and I had yet to discover true leftism; they're not fooling me again. I cannot in good conscience vote for an imperialistic warhawk. Yeah, none of the outcomes are good for me as a gay man, but I believe in a new communist Internationale, so I cannot support politicians that want to continue to pillage the developing world.

    [–]xdre 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

    That works for you, and that's fine. It doesn't work for every minority. Protest voting in 2000 netted eight years of George W. Bush, which was catastrophic on so many different issues, and devastating from a SCOTUS perspective in that we got Alito and Roberts.

    Sometimes better is the enemy of good.

    [–]gavinbrindstar 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

    I think a lot of people- people of color, lbgt, anyone to the left of John McCain, immigrants, low wage workers- are trapped into voting for the Democrats. They do not have any other political options. The Democrats don't have to work for their vote. The Republicans legitimize them no matter how little they actually do for people.

    That is manipulation. They're forced into representation that they may or may not want because the Democrats have a monopoly on power.

    You can actually look at the polls and see why minorities, LGBT people, and others support the Democratic party. This idea that minorities of all stripes are being forced to vote against their own interests is pernicious, and frankly paternalistic as fuck. Seriously, maybe consider that people of color, LGBT people, and immigrants etc. might actually like the Democratic party.

    When it comes to white Clinton supporters flaunting the fact that the black voters are on their side, and are effectively 'theirs', that's a problem.

    I'm proud that the candidate I support appeals to a broad base. I'm a straight white male, so when I see organizations that represent others (such as the Human Rights Campaign, the Congressional Black Caucus, and Planned Parenthood) endorse my candidate, it makes me feel like I made the right choice.

    [–]Orphan_Script 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

    You can actually look at the polls and see why minorities, LGBT people, and others support the Democratic party.

    What do the polls tell you exactly?

    This idea that minorities of all stripes are being forced to vote against their own interests is pernicious, and frankly paternalistic as fuck. Seriously, maybe consider that people of color, LGBT people, and immigrants etc. might actually like the Democratic party.

    I certainly don't mean to be paternalistic, my entire point is that representation is inadequate and the Democratic party holds a monopoly on power.

    I'm not discrediting people who are satisfied with the Democratic party. I disagree with that, but that's not what this topic is about. I'm talking about being in a position where you may not like the party line, but your only alternative is a party that views you as subhuman. So you're going to stay with the Democrats no matter what. That means there effectively is no alternative. That is not adequate representation, that's being trapped.

    I'm proud that the candidate I support appeals to a broad base. I'm a straight white male, so when I see organizations that represent others (such as the Human Rights Campaign, the Congressional Black Caucus, and Planned Parenthood) endorse my candidate, it makes me feel like I made the right choice.

    I don't know what this has to do with anything. I'm not debating your political views or questioning your attachment to the issue.

    [–]FakeyFaked 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

    We do the same thing to people in Kansas, Arkansas, Alabama, class marginalized communities, when we say their votes for the GOP are against their self interest.

    It's not really right either way.

    I"m gonna LOL regarding Human Rights Campaign, but that's a whole nother story though.

    [–]praxulus 6ポイント7ポイント  (1子コメント)

    What do you mean when you say they 'claim' groups of people?

    Edit: Obviously they 'claim' that black people overwhelmingly vote for Hillary, but that's just a fact. Is there something wrong with that, or is there something else they're doing?

    [–]Orphan_Script 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Edit: Obviously they 'claim' that black people overwhelmingly vote for Hillary, but that's just a fact. Is there something wrong with that, or is there something else they're doing?

    It's one thing to recognize demographic trends, and there's nothing wrong with that. What I have seen tho is petty slap fights where Hilary supporters flaunt the fact that they control the black vote, like they just pulled out their trap card and won the game. That behavior is gross. It's also dangerous to look at real people with their own needs and interests and basically turn them into political tokens. I understand why politicians and campaigners do that in the course of an election, but it is dehumanizing.

    And like someone else mentioned, Bernie supporters have their own variation of this. They pull the 'savior' card out for Bernie and talk down to people for not knowing what's good for them. What would actually be good for people is more diversity in political representation, not two sides vying and pandering for support. There are many problems that do not get expressed, do not get looked at, because everyone is eventually bottlenecked into whatever the Democratic party gives them in the end.

    [–]whitstifier[S] 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

    And Sanders' supporters who covet minority votes ask "why won't they vote for us?!" The attitudes of both sides in appealing to minorities is pretty gross. Badly need more POC in U.S. politics

    [–]CANOODLING_SOCIOPATH 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Part of that argument is to counter the idea that Sanders is the candidate of the future because of his popularity with young people. POC are the fastest growing part of the Democratic Party and are wielding more and more influence in the nation (losing 90% of the racial minority vote will now lead to an impossible path to victory for the Republicans, so they must change or continue to lose).

    Since Hillary is winning the minority vote the argument is that she is the future of the party, not Sanders.

    In reality neither are necessarily the "future" of the party. All candidates put together coalitions that can change. Sanders coalition only has a small part that is truly left wing, so his left wing policies may or may not be the future of the party. We can just as easily see a moderate anti establishment figure take a Sanders role in he future. Or a populist minority focused candidate.

    [–]GriffBot808 19ポイント20ポイント  (23子コメント)

    TIL it's racist to say "queen"

    [–]whitstifier[S] 2ポイント3ポイント  (22子コメント)

    Generally, no. I think this sense of the word is borrowed from AAVE.

    [–]GriffBot808 31ポイント32ポイント  (18子コメント)

    "Cool" was a word coined by black people, is it racist for a white person to call something "cool?"

    How much time goes by before it's not racist for other people to use slang? 5 years? 10 years? The entirety of the modern English language is a hodge-podge of mashup and loan words.

    [–]whitstifier[S] -5ポイント-4ポイント  (15子コメント)

    I think the act of stripping meaning from a word can be racist. Calling Clinton queen seems like racism. In the fundraising post, the OP referred to Beyoncé as "king." So, in this narrative, is Clinton Queen and Beyoncé King?

    [–]GriffBot808 32ポイント33ポイント  (8子コメント)

    There is no context of calling a powerful woman a "queen" outside the black community? I don't think so.

    [–]whitstifier[S] 6ポイント7ポイント  (7子コメント)

    What's with the strawman? I never said that the word queen is off limits. What seems wrong in this case is that Clinton supporters are saying "yaaaas queen" or "slay queen" in reference to Clinton. They're appropriating language for their community. Is it okay to imply that Clinton is the Beyoncé of U.S. Politics? I think it's an uncomfortable comparison.

    [–]GriffBot808 13ポイント14ポイント  (5子コメント)

    Is it okay to imply that Clinton is the Beyoncé of U.S. Politics? I think it's an uncomfortable comparison.

    Why? I think it's a bad comparison, but outside of not making sense, why is it uncomfortable?

    [–]whitstifier[S] -1ポイント0ポイント  (4子コメント)

    Clinton is not a black woman.

    [–]GriffBot808 17ポイント18ポイント  (3子コメント)

    So it's inappropriate to make comparisons between two people of different races? In general? Hillary Clinton is the Taylor Swift of politics, is that any less meaningless?

    [–]ellouelle 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Is it okay to imply that Clinton is the Beyoncé of U.S. Politics?

    Who implied that?

    [–]ellouelle 10ポイント11ポイント  (5子コメント)

    OP referred to Beyoncé as "king." So, in this narrative, is Clinton Queen and Beyoncé King?

    I referred to her as king because that's what she goes by.

    [–]whitstifier[S] -1ポイント0ポイント  (4子コメント)

    And she goes by queen too. Clinton is already the queen on that sub though, right?

    I don't understand why you thought Lemonade should be included in a fundraiser for Clinton. It diminishes a work meant for black women.

    [–]ellouelle 10ポイント11ポイント  (2子コメント)

    And she goes by queen too.

    I think she prefers king (she's used king more recently than queen), and so I used king.. it had absolutely nothing to do with referring to Hillary as queen.

    Clinton is already the queen on that sub though, right?

    I'm not quite sure what you're implying. It's not like there can be only one person referred to as queen.

    I don't understand why you thought Lemonade should be included in a fundraiser for Clinton. It diminishes a work meant for black women.

    Because I grew tired of thinking of names for the endless parade of Tuesdays, and Lemonade is the most important thing to happen this week. I fail to see how merely mentioning the album is diminishing it.

    [–]whitstifier[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

    It's diminishing to use the work, which is meant for black women, as a fun theme for a fundraising night for a white politician.

    [–]ellouelle 7ポイント8ポイント  (0子コメント)

    I didn't use it as the theme. I made reference to it in one sentence.

    [–]Trivesa 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

    How does it diminish it? Surely appreciating or even imitating art can't ever diminish it, even if the appreciation and imitation are being done by people not the target audience.

    I mean, growing up, the Nancy Drew books were clearly aimed at girls, and having a clever female protagonist must have given the books a much greater meaning to their target demographic, which suffered a scarcity of such role models, than it did to me. But my personal enjoyment of the books surely didn't lessen the power of them for their intended audience.

    A work likewise can be "meant" for black women, but once in the public sphere it becomes available to all (and I put "meant" in quotes, because I strongly suspect that the artist wouldn't refuse to sell copies to white men, money being a great equalizer). Other people may enjoy it for other reasons or on a shallower level, but they take away nothing from anyone else in doing so.

    [–]OrkBegork -4ポイント-3ポイント  (1子コメント)

    "Cool" wasn't coined by black people. They had a certain amount of influence on the modern meaning of the word, but so did Shakespeare. It's not all that cut and dry.

    [–]GriffBot808 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Fair enough, but even using slang popularized in very early hip-hop which are part of our common lexicon today, it becomes clear that "slang for some groups only" becomes incredibly unfeasible.

    Nice 40k name :) dakkadakkadakka

    [–]SwarlyB 5ポイント6ポイント  (2子コメント)

    Oh I thought it was since a main character is Broad City uses it. Hillary was featured a few episodes ago, where one of the main characters Alana got a job working as a, uhmm... campaigner for Hillary? Sorry don't know what Americans call them.

    Here's an example

    And here's the scene with Hillary. Youtube

    [–]penzoilthehippo 5ポイント6ポイント  (1子コメント)

    I think a running joke is that Ilana appropriates other cultures constantly. She even has "Latina" earrings. That's probably why she says yass and queen so much. But it's gone past just her in tv, I hear people saying these things all the time.

    [–]SwarlyB 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Cool, I don't hear it here in Ireland so thanks for letting me know. Still love the show, that episode was just so weird as an outsider of US politics. Although the Joe Biden one in Parks and Rec was much better!

    [–]lvysaur 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Are you certain those words are even specific to AAVE and not just urban kids of every race? When I was tutoring downtown I'd hear them from Hispanic/white kids just as often as black.

    Are you also sure the people using the words aren't black? Hillary had the highest black support after all.

    I'd also be careful not to assume that all cultural participation is cultural appropriation.

    [–]CANOODLING_SOCIOPATH 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

    I think that this kind of stuff has picked up since Hillary said that she always keeps hot sauce in her purse, which many people interpreted as a reference to Beyoncé. If you watch that interview you can actually see that Hillary was confused by the reaction her answer got, and in interviews years ago she has talked about how much she loves hot sauce and always brings it with her when she is traveling. It was just a funny coincidence with Beyoncé's song "foundation".

    But the people who are making those comments in the subreddit may be POC, and if that is the case then would it matter? I'm not a Beyoncé fan, so I usually ignore those comments because I don't really understand them.

    [–]hoxhamania 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

    I think we should care less about frivolous internet-culture stuff and have a deeper look at some of the racial/imperialist implications of Clinton's foreign policy record.

    [–]HarryLillis -4ポイント-3ポイント  (21子コメント)

    It's a subreddit devoted to promoting the inheritor of Henry Kissinger's policy model. Of course it has a racism problem. If you weren't a racist imperialist you wouldn't be voting for Hillary Clinton.

    [–]GriffBot808 23ポイント24ポイント  (15子コメント)

    If you weren't a racist imperialist you wouldn't be voting for Hillary Clinton.

    This is basically just an outlandish polarizing comment from /r/The_Donald with the names changed, what a joke.

    [–]Orphan_Script 17ポイント18ポイント  (4子コメント)

    OP here came on strong.

    But 'Hilary Clinton is an imperialist' is not an opinionated statement. If you're an avid Clinton supporter you are absolutely supporting an imperialist agenda.

    [–]GriffBot808 9ポイント10ポイント  (3子コメント)

    An avid Clinton supporter? Sure, no argument there. But every single voter?

    [–]danceparty3000 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

    If you vote for an imperialist then you are supporting imperialism, which makes you an imperialist.

    ?????????????????????

    [–]ampersamp 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

    Demanding ideological purity in your political candidates is not pragmatic. It's pretty well understood that a vote does not confer full endorsement of someone's platform, just a relative preference.

    [–]danceparty3000 -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

    In a primary when you get to choose between a murderous imperialist and someone who isn't, then you don't get to reject the label of imperialist when you vote for the imperialist.

    [–]AlwaysUnsureOfThings 2ポイント3ポイント  (4子コメント)

    The nerve of all those racist people of color voting for Hillary. How dare they!

    Right...

    [–]HarryLillis 1ポイント2ポイント  (3子コメント)

    On the international scale, yes, right.

    [–]AlwaysUnsureOfThings -2ポイント-1ポイント  (2子コメント)

    I really wish people would stop telling PoC they voted "wrong". Especially by accusing them of voting in favor of racism.

    [–]hoxhamania 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

    Agreed, I'm PoC and I'm voting for Trump. I keep having all these privileged white people say that I'm racist for doing so.

    [–]danceparty3000 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

    You can't vote for someone who kills brown people and not be voting in favor of racism.

    [–]noobicide61 -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

    I'm not sure why people in this tread are giving you grief and seeming to take the words are just words approach to appropriation, but yeah, this is kinda racist. I mean Clinton is really the candidate of white feminism (see Lena Dunham). She and her supports have a Lily Allen problem of carting out blackness when it's convenient or cute without realizing how appropriative it is to decontexualize these aspects of Black English.