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[–]h4qq 31ポイント32ポイント  (125子コメント)

Yes, alhamdulilLah.

Converted 8 years ago, kept it secret for about 5.5 years. Definitely right about the secrecy :P

[–]WinterVein 8ポイント9ポイント  (0子コメント)

Wow mashallah bro :D alhamdulilah. Blessed to have you as a part of this community, you are a valuble contributer

[–]severdine 5ポイント6ポイント  (119子コメント)

What were the reactions like when you decided to let your family know?

[–]h4qq 28ポイント29ポイント  (118子コメント)

I was kicked out of my house - took my car, a good sized bank account that my parents had their name on as well (mistake on my part), and my phone. Sure, I probably could have gone to court or something over these things, but it would have been petty, just had to suck it up and deal with it.

Also, as word spread across the world (literally have family on every continent), I was seen as a traitor to the community and family, death threats, etc.

At this moment, just working on making things good again (probably won't happen for maybe 2-3 more years).

However, I will say, mothers won't give up on their kids no matter what everyone else in the family says. The hadith of loving your mothers first, second, and third before your father makes sense when you see it.

[–]severdine 12ポイント13ポイント  (1子コメント)

At least you got to keep the beard Amirite!?!

[–]tearsandprayers[S] 8ポイント9ポイント  (2子コメント)

Wow. You are so strong, mA. How did you end up deciding when to tell your family and how did you go about telling them?

[–]h4qq 7ポイント8ポイント  (1子コメント)

You are so strong, mA.

AlhamdulilLah, all from Allah :)

I knew I would end up being kicked out of my house so I had to make sure I was financially independent.

When I told them it was a very slow and gradual conversation that went for about 6 hours, and eventually exploded and turned pretty physical between me and my father, sadly.

[–]tearsandprayers[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Wow. May Allah bless you with many, many rewards both in this life and in the akhirah. :)

[–]Radicool21 5ポイント6ポイント  (1子コメント)

May Allah (SWT) reward you for your struggles.

[–]Admiral_Barbarossa 5ポイント6ポイント  (110子コメント)

I was seen as a traitor to the community and family, death threats, etc.

Wow.

[–]Singh_Q6 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

Lol, you "wow", but ignore what your own community does to people who leave Islam. May I remind you there are death penalties for leaving Islam in many Islamic countries.

Also many Islamic scholars agree that Islam teaches you to kill apostates. So you can keep wowing.

Not saying it was right for him to receive death threats, but be mindful of what your own community does.

[–]Admiral_Barbarossa -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm not apologetic about anything my community does and I never will be. I love Islam just the way Allah perfected it. I was just wowing because I had no idea an Indian religion could be so militant (Sikhism).

[–]BandarBrigade 1ポイント2ポイント  (107子コメント)

He is a traitor. Why the wow? Don't you guys get up in arms about a muslim leaving islam? No true sikh would become a muslim

[–]tearsandprayers[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (33子コメント)

With all due respect, just because a person is born into a religion doesn't mean that they are a traitor because they decided another religion seemed more true to them. Also according to Sikhism all religions are a path leading to God. Then why is someone a traitor if they decide to change paths?

[–]BandarBrigade 0ポイント1ポイント  (32子コメント)

No it doesn't. Sikhism teaches that sant ka marg is the path to Waheguru.

I guess you come from a sikh background as well. But yes, you guys are traitors. Other people can be PC and tell you the right things. But I think it's absolutely pathetic that a sikh would become a muslim. Turn away from the truth all you want but the hyprocrisy of your community shows with how you think of and treat ex-muslims. well, whatever floats your boat.

[–]tearsandprayers[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (31子コメント)

You're entitled to your own opinion. I don't mind being called a traitor. I found the religion that helps me connect with God more, gives me guidance in every area of my life, and in general makes more sense to me. If that's what being a traitor means, then so be it.

What happened with Sikhs and Muslims in the past is unfortunate. The issue is though that the Mughals who were forcing Sikhs to convert were going against what is clearly written in the Quran, 2;256 "There shall be no compulsion in [acceptance of] the religion...". As a result, Sikhs now look at Islam as a horrible religion because of a select group of people who decided to go against what the religion preaches in the first place. You can't judge an entire religion just based on what some of the people do.

The SGGS says:

pg 142 - One who recognizes that all spiritual paths lead to the One shall be emancipated. pg 1083 - Practice within your heart the teachings of the Koran and the Bible

Can you explain these verses to me?

[–]BandarBrigade 1ポイント2ポイント  (7子コメント)

Hmmm, crimes and actions carried over the course of a hundred years, which culminated in the shaheedi of two gurus, the brutal executions of martyrs like Bhai Mani Singh, Bhai Sati Das, Bhai Mati Das, the char sahibzaade, and countless others as well two genocides (which reduced the sikh population by an estimated 30% each time) should not be characterized as the "actions of a few". There was also the repeated desecration of the harmandir sahib.

And let us not get into picking and choosing verses from the quran. I think you well know I could pick some out some ones as well.

[–]tearsandprayers[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (6子コメント)

I said the actions of some, not a few. I said it was unfortunate everything that happened, I in no way support those people's actions. They were going against the word of Allah swt. Regardless of what time frame it went on, it was against the word of Allah and that's what matters. Those were choices the individuals made, not something Allah told them to do.

It's not about picking and choosing verses, its about how can that verse mean anything else.

I'm not really interested in debating and I don't mean to diss Sikhism in any way. I didn't leave Sikhism to become a traitor, but I didn't feel the peace in my heart and soul when I was personally following it. Every person has the right to follow what they believe.

[–]rugjet 2ポイント3ポイント  (14子コメント)

I think you're cherry picking 2:256 from the Quran when it isn't the whole thing.

There shall be no compulsion in [acceptance of] the religion. The right course has become clear from the wrong. So whoever disbelieves in Taghut and believes in Allah has grasped the most trustworthy handhold with no break in it. And Allah is Hearing and Knowing.

2:257 - Allah is the ally of those who believe. He brings them out from darknesses into the light. And those who disbelieve - their allies are Taghut. They take them out of the light into darknesses. Those are the companions of the Fire; they will abide eternally therein.

So people who don't believe in Allah and believe in something else (idolatry, etc.) are going to burn eternally?

[–]tearsandprayers[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (13子コメント)

It's not cherry picking when the rest of the ayah doesn't contradict what the first part says.

As people, we are no one to judge who goes to hell and who doesn't, only Allah knows that. All we can do is follow the guidance that he has provided for us. In terms of idolatry, also known as shirk, it is the the worst sin a person can commit according to Islam.

[–]Singh_Q6 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Don't care if you follow Islam, but I wonder, how much did you know about Sikhi?

In regards to the bani.

Ang 142 - mistranslation.

Bani says ਰਾਹ ਦੋਵੈ ਇਕੁ ਜਾਣੈ ਸੋਈ ਸਿਝਸੀ ॥ Rah dovai ik janhai soee sijhsee

In the context of the pauree it is taken from, it is talking about the two paths ਰਾਹ ਦੋਵੈ rah dovai - those are, in simple terms, Naam and Maya.

ਇਕੁ ਜਾਣੈ Ik Janhai - know one (of these paths, Naam).

ਸੋਈ ਸਿਝਸੀ Soee Sijhsee - that one path lead to a successful (spiritual life).

Also may be talking about duality, one who sees the oneness beneath duality, beneath the ego, that path is the path to liberation and fulfillment.

Its not saying all spiritual paths lead to the One.

The next shabad is addressed to a Muslim and uses Abrahamic imagery.

This shabad is not saying follow those books. It is saying, have the remembrance of Waheguru and Naam within your heart and mind at all times. Make this teaching the aim of your life, make this the guidance of your life, just like a Muslim or Christian follows the Quaran and Bible as God's word.

[–]Admiral_Barbarossa 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

MashAllah akhi, may Allah guide you onto the right path inshaAllah.

[–]h4qq 0ポイント1ポイント  (5子コメント)

With all due respect, the SGGS says a lot, but the premise here is that it is accurate in what it is saying.

There are many authors of the SGGS (with no accurate record of who said what) and there is no prophethood, so claiming knowledge of what is the right path or any understanding of who God really is, exceeds the scope of Sikhi.

[–]Singh_Q6 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

LOLOLOLOLOL. I see you haven't read the SGGS, otherwise you wouldn't have such a misguided view.

How do we even know Muhammed wrote the Quran, when your own sources say it was made after his death? Some say there were multiple versions. So you can talk about being accurate, LOL. Also the seemingly contradictory verses of "hey no compulsion in religion" and "kill the non-believers". Muslims can talk about being accurate and understanding God.

Hundreds of authors? LOL WHAT?

The vast majority is formed up by the bani of the 6 Gurus.

Then you have the bani of 15 bhagats, 11 Sikh bhatts (bards) and 2 Sikhs.

Yes, hundreds.

If you're going to say shit, least be accurate.

Accurate record? Unlike you, we actually know our Gurus could read and write.

They checked over what was written and made sure it was correct. All shabads are clearly labelled with the author's name and the signature tells you what lineage they are from.

The Sikh Gurus use Nanak and the other authors use their own names. The headings of the shabads tells you who has written it and gives other information, like how to sing the shabad.

Also accurate record, we have records of who the bani was taken from and who's bani it is.

There is consistency in the message of SGGS. You can clearly understand what SGGS is telling you.

Also I can make shit up too. Muhammed changes his message so many times and also shit like Satanic verses! Wow, such consistency.

Least Sikhi kept it message consistent over 10 generations unlike Islam, couldn't even be consistent over one lifetime.

[–]h4qq 1ポイント2ポイント  (56子コメント)

He is a traitor.

Say it to me directly instead of saying it to others.

I have every right to believe as I choose, the only reason you feel that you are a victim of my "traitorship" is that for some odd reason you held/are holding the misconceived notion that you have any say in my relationship with God.

You never did and you still do not. It was my decision alone, with no influence from anyone.

No true sikh would become a muslim

Obviously, or else I would still be Sikh. This is not an insult to me at all, it just shows your ignorance of Islam, which I don't blame you for seeing as how it took me about 10 years of independent study to get to a point of understanding in order to overcome years of bias and indoctrination - yes, I said indoctrination.

Looking back, Sikhi was a stepping stone (and I meant that respectfully), in that in taught me the Oneness of God, which is the most fundamental concept that one should reflect upon and hold dear.

[–]BandarBrigade 1ポイント2ポイント  (55子コメント)

Yeah man, I will tell you that you are a traitor. It's nice knowing that our generation today is turning to the group of people that our shaheeds so readily stood up against.

But whatever dude, you do you. I don't need an understanding of islam considering I have studied it enough.

[–]h4qq 1ポイント2ポイント  (11子コメント)

the group of people that our shaheeds so readily stood up against.

Then you clearly have no idea who those people were if you are associating them with me, which is deeply disturbing.

I don't need an understanding of islam considering I have studied it enough.

No, you have not. You have not studied Seerah, you have not studied `aqeedah, you have not studied tafsir, and the list goes on, which are bare necessities to even approaching Islam. We are not talking about looking at a painting in a Gurudwara of how Muslims used to torture the Gurus or a Wikipedia page.

[–]BandarBrigade 1ポイント2ポイント  (9子コメント)

All I need to know is your history. Conquering, raping, killing is what it consists of. Look at the wipeout of Zoroastrianism in Iran. Look at the brutal invasions carried out in India.

You seem like a decent guy so I'm just gonna leave this here and not go any further. These are just my honest thoughts, not even trolling.

[–]h4qq 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

All I need to know is your history.

Beliefs are not bound by history, nor am I responsible for the actions of others, just like you are not responsible for the drunk uncle that beats his wife in the pind or gangs that murder and throw bodies in the Sutlej river - you wouldn't say that you are, we both know that.

You seem like a decent guy so I'm just gonna leave this here and not go any further. These are just my honest thoughts, not even trolling.

I appreciate that, thank you for the honest and straight forward discussion.

[–]Admiral_Barbarossa 0ポイント1ポイント  (5子コメント)

Look at the wipeout of Zoroastrianism in Iran.

Which voluntarily occurred over a period of 450 years (I'm part Iranian). If it was involving "raping, killing, forced conversions," it would've happened instantly. You should stay quiet and stop embarrassing yourself with this amazing amount of ignorance. Even the Mughals were very tolerant to Sikhs, whom they deemed ahl-ul-dhimmah, for most of their history. Your tiny religion wouldn't exist if not for the mercy of Islam.

[–]Admiral_Barbarossa 0ポイント1ポイント  (19子コメント)

Yeah man, I will tell you that you are a traitor.

But you'll never say it to his face. ;-)

It's nice knowing that our generation today is turning to the group of people that our shaheeds so readily stood up against.

/u/h4qq chose to worship the Lord of Existence instead of worshiping his ancestors as you beckon him to, among other things.

There are but two religions in the world, the worship of God and the worship of anything else (your ancestors, as you seem to be fond of doing without even realizing it).

[–]ChardiKala 2ポイント3ポイント  (10子コメント)

the worship of God and the worship of anything else

I agree, but may I suggest you abandon the double-think? I agree it is difficult to give up the traditions of your ancestors but anyone anywhere is always capable of elevating their understanding of God to the pinnacle of Ik Onkar and the same applies to you as well as all other Muslims.

I invite you to read the Japji Sahib commentary with an open heart and mind, because the importance of finding Truth is more important than the importance of following ancestral tradition, which is undoubtedly open to corruption.

[–]Admiral_Barbarossa -2ポイント-1ポイント  (9子コメント)

I agree it is difficult to give up the traditions of your ancestors

Don't lecture me on this, literally the only reason why you're a Sikh is because you were born to a Sikh family. I was not born to a Muslim family and chose Islam as the correct Path.

I'm not really interested in your unacademic banter/spamvideos. If you want to discuss something, I'm right here.

because the importance of finding Truth is more important than the importance of following ancestral tradition,

Exactly, which is why you should leave your ancestors' Sikh traditions and accept the religion of Allah .

[–]BandarBrigade 1ポイント2ポイント  (7子コメント)

Guy, I don't want to hurt your feelings but Islam is nothing special. It just copies what christanity and Judaism did and adds a few things. Go ahead and ban me if you want.

You guys talk up your religion all the time but I see nothing special. Jinns, not having dogs as pets for some reason, and other weird stuff. Apparently the almighty creator would have a problem if you owned a dog lol.

And yeah, I'm proud of my ancestors. Despite being outnumbered, they fought to the death for their religion and for their people.

Anyways, it was fun chatting with you. Don't want to take away your precious time by having to talk with a kaffir and non-believer like me

[–]Admiral_Barbarossa 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

Guy, I don't want to hurt your feelings but Islam is nothing special. It just copies what christanity and Judaism did and adds a few things.

Islam is just the worship of God alone. It's what Christianity and Judaism did until people like you decided to add in your own silly twists.

You guys talk up your religion all the time but I see nothing special.

That is because you are blinded by your kufr.

And yeah, I'm proud of my ancestors.

Good for you, I chose to not be proud of something I had no control over (my ancestors).

Apparently the almighty creator would have a problem if you owned a dog lol.

There's nothing wrong with owning a dog in Islam. It seems I am far more educated about Sikhism than you are about Islam, which isn't surprising. You should take your ignorance back to your circlejerk on /r/Sikhi.

Despite being outnumbered, they fought to the death for their religion and for their people.

My ancestors conquered your ancestors' entire country despite being outnumbered. Teehee.

[–]Admiral_Barbarossa 0ポイント1ポイント  (22子コメント)

our shaheeds

Even the language you use is plagiarized straight from Islam. "Shaheeds" lol. The irony is poetic.

studied it enough.

"Studied it enough" to not know anything pretty much.

[–]BandarBrigade 1ポイント2ポイント  (21子コメント)

kindly tell me what else I need to know? did your prophet not kill all males of a jewish tribe? Very kind and merciful, mashallah

[–]Admiral_Barbarossa 0ポイント1ポイント  (20子コメント)

kindly tell me what else I need to know?

There's tons to know! :-)

did your prophet not kill all males of a jewish tribe?

Absolutely, after they tried to genocide the fledgling Muslim community. :) What a great story of revenge.

Very kind and merciful, mashallah

There were actually 3 Jewish tribes who also tried the same thing, but he forgave all of them and simply told them to leave after surrendering their weapons when they were defeated. When the last one, Banu Qurayzah, tried it, enough was enough and the smack down was laid!

Subhan'Allah what a beautiful story, such glorious revenge.

;-)

[–]Admiral_Barbarossa -3ポイント-2ポイント  (14子コメント)

Sikhism was originally an Islamic heresy, Baba Guru Nanak even visited the Ka'aba. Later Sikh gurus revised your religion after the Mughals massacred many Sikhs, and thus the mythos of anti-Muslim dogma arose in your religion.

Be less mad. Thank you.

[–]BandarBrigade 2ポイント3ポイント  (13子コメント)

So? Why does visiting the Ka'aba make Guru Nanak Dev Ji a muslim?

You muslims along with some hindus try to each to us our own history lol. None of the gurus were hindus or muslims.

"Mythos of anti-muslim dogma" haha. Such things do not come out of thin air my friend. The blood of our ancestors has been spilled in the name of islam. From Guru Arjun Dev Ji all the way to partition in 1947, thousands of innocent sikhs have been butchered. Also might want to look at what your brothers are doing in the UK with their grooming gangs in relation to sikh girls. Should look around before calling us militant.

[–]Admiral_Barbarossa 0ポイント1ポイント  (12子コメント)

So? Why does visiting the Ka'aba make Guru Nanak Dev Ji a muslim?

Didn't say he was a Muslim, I would guess he was some sort of an apostate murtadd, but alas, due to later revisionism, it's probably too hard to construct an accurate picture of who the man truly was, other than the fact that he was obviously deeply influenced by Islam.

You muslims along with some hindus try to each to us our own history lol. None of the gurus were hindus or muslims.

I don't think I said they were Muslims, I said your religion is obviously deeply influenced by Islam, to the point where it was most probably a heresy, as some number of historians of religion believe.

"Mythos of anti-muslim dogma" haha. Such things do not come out of thin air my friend. The blood of our ancestors has been spilled in the name of islam.

So? The blood of my ancestors was also spilled in the name of Islam, seeing how I'm a Turk. But today, I'm a Muslim, wal-hamdulilah and if I could travel back in time, I would be the first to fight my own pagan Tengrid (native Turk religion) ancestors.

Also might want to look at what your brothers are doing in the UK with their grooming gangs to Sikh girls.

"Grooming gangs"? What?

[–]BandarBrigade 1ポイント2ポイント  (11子コメント)

What influence did Islam have on sikhi besides cutting off our heads? Explain please

A muslim of all should not talk about influencing another religion considering most of islam borrows heavily from Christian and jewish tales.

And good for you. Allah would be proud of you committing violence. I'm pretty sure you would also kill Guru Nanak for being a murtadd or whatever the hell that means.

Just google grooming gangs and sikh girls. Have fun exploring what your goody good muslim brothers are doing in the UK taking advantage of young girls

[–]Admiral_Barbarossa 0ポイント1ポイント  (9子コメント)

What influence did Islam have on sikhi besides cutting off our heads? Explain please

The Qur'an is mentioned/even quoted in the Guru Granth sab, you wear Turbans (a non-Indian phenomenon in origin), you have a strongly "non-polytheistic" (panentheistic) tradition despite being in India, your founder went on a "pilgrimage" to Islam's holiest site, the Masjid al-Haram.

A muslim of all should not talk about influencing another religion considering most of islam borrows heavily from Christian and jewish tales.

Islam does not "borrow" anything, it claims that it was revealed from the same Creator. No Muslim ever claims Islam was created ex-nihilo or that its symbols and mythos are completely devoid of references to any other religion.

And good for you. Allah would be proud of you committing violence. I'm pretty sure you would also kill Guru Nanak for being a murtadd or whatever the hell that means.

nah, i'd let my boy aurengzeb handle it

Just google grooming gangs and sikh girls. Have fun exploring what your goody good muslim brothers are doing in the UK taking advantage of young girls

Criminal delinquency has no place in Islam, so, whatever that "grooming" thing means, I don't really care because I'm not responsible for haram things other Muslims do, or even halal things. Peace.

[–]SERFBEATER 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

You guys make Islam and Sikhi look bad holy shit

[–]crusader786 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Alhamdulillah, can I ask what drew you towards Islam, what's your story?

[–]TheSereneSufi 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Wow, I definitely wouldn't have expected you to be a convert, and that too from Sikhism. We are lucky to have you as our mod