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[Discussion] What happens when Rooney comes back? (self.reddevils)

BertrandRusDave が 投稿

I'd like to start by saying that I am huge fan of Rooney and I believe (while others don't) that he is almost always in the starting 11 not just because of his ability, but also because of his presence. However, seeing we've attained some sort of rhythm and consistency with our current line-up, who do you think should be dropped for Rooney, that is if he is to play at all?

Reading this article; http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2016/03/22/is-marcus-rashford-actually-quite-good/ , has convinced me that we've found something in a striker which Wayne lost a few years ago i.e, as the article so aptly stated, " that ability to pop up in the right place at the right time isn’t something you can coach."

Martial imo is one who has earned the right to be undroppable, he is just too good to leave out.

That leaves Lingard. While I am in agreement with a section of the users on this sub that believe Jesse isn't 'United quality' the fact that he's almost always contributed to the game in someway every time he starts warrants some sort of praise and respect for his position.

So, what do we do with Wayne?

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[–]Renevat 13ポイント14ポイント  (12子コメント)

Either Rashford gets dropped and Rooney becomes the striker, or Mata gets dropped and Rooney becomes the 10 (more likely in my opinion).

[–]thecricketnerdYoung 4ポイント5ポイント  (11子コメント)

Or Lingard's out (which I'd rather not happen) and Mata moves to the right again.

[–]RedDevil_BAMFManchester United -2ポイント-1ポイント  (9子コメント)

You'd rather not drop Lingard?! Especially for Rooney? Interesting.

It has to be Lingard for me. Honestly, is like to see Depay (or Herrera) get a run out even before Rooney returns at Lingard's expense.

[–]thecricketnerdYoung 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

More pace and consistency and helps out defensively, while with Mata the right wing can be a vacuum at times.

[–]LDN2016 4ポイント5ポイント  (7子コメント)

I'd drop Mata every time. Rooney's a better no. 10 and Mata's too slow and too much of a liability on the wing.

Plus out wide he doesn't play through balls, can't beat a man, doesn't make good runs to get on the end of passes, can't cross.

[–]danskzwag -5ポイント-4ポイント  (4子コメント)

Rooney rarely plays through balls, nearly all his passing is lateral, and never gets on the end of crosses

[–]LDN2016 5ポイント6ポイント  (3子コメント)

Rooney rarely plays through balls, nearly all his passing is lateral

same as mata

only difference is he's a huge counter attackin threat, more of a scoring threat, has a great long shot in him and distribution when he drops deep.

also doesnt lose the ball when heavily pressed or in dangerous positions like mata

also 10 times the defensive ability of mata.

gets on the end of crosses

youre right but much more than mata though

.

neither are good enough but rooney's the better of the 2 bad options.

[–]danskzwag -5ポイント-4ポイント  (2子コメント)

His distribution is average, he is not a counterattacking threat, his workrate has dropped massively since moyes season.

[–]LDN2016 5ポイント6ポイント  (1子コメント)

mata just does not compare for any passing longer than 20 yards. i've seen mata misplace passes over that distance so badly time and again.

rooney's distribution is still fantastic, i have no idea what you've been watching. he consistently puts 50 yard passes on a dime.

.

not a counterattacking threat

almost every one of our counter attacking goals have had him in the build up.

he's a shadow of himself but mata's just disgustingly poor at countering. this is not a is rooney good question.

this is a is rooney better than mata and the answer is overwhelmingly yes.

[–]DuhSpecialWaanScholes -5ポイント-4ポイント  (1子コメント)

Rooney has a poor first touch, poor dribbler and an inferior passer to Mata which are much more important attributes to an attacking mid.

[–]LDN2016 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

inferior passer to Mata

i don't buy this. mata keeps misplacing any pass over 20 yards and reacts too slowly. he'd rather get knocked over and lose the ball than attempt a difficult pass. i think rooney's overall distribution is miles ahead of mata.

poor dribbler

again, compare to mata. in the last 4 years i have never seen mata beat a man when dribbling. he might be the worst dribbler to play on the united wings in the last 3 decades. he simply is useless 1v1

Rooney has a poor first touch

absolutely.

but mata's touch is awful because of how one footed he is. when he gets it on the wrong foot he take s4 or 5 touches to set the ball before he'll pass and this kills the move. i'll take the occasional sloppy rooney 1st touch over the consistently frustratingly slow mata touch.

[–]SonnyisKing 3ポイント4ポイント  (2子コメント)

------------Schneiderlin----------Schweinstieger-----------

---------Lingard-----------Rooney-------Martial--------------

---------------------------Rashford-----------------------------

[–]Launch_a_poo 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

Don't want to be state the obvious but are we forgetting that we don't have to have a fixed starting XI. We can change from Mata and Schweinsteiger one game to Carrick and Rashford with Rooney #10 the next. No player is getting frozen out

[–]BertrandRusDave[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Depends really. If West Ham win the replay, we'll only have to worry about the Premier League so there wouldn't have to (and IMO we shouldn't in order to get some kind of starting 11 consistency) be too many rotations

[–]TudoorsYoung 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Van Gaal will most likely not drop Rashford, as he's playing well. Meaning, either Mata or Lingard get's the axe. I can see Lingard being dropped for games where it's going to be harder to break down the defense, and Lingard playing against Spurs, and Leicester.

[–]Idislikemyroommate 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I agree with how Lingard will be used. Against teams at the top he does well, provides us balance.

I do feel though that Van Gaal will use Rashford on the bench a number of times when Wayne is back to fitness. Rashford has done well but before his derby goal he was looking a bit non existent. I can imagine Van Gaal will want to protect him to an extent and use him a little more sparingly and not to let the hype overcome his true talent.

[–]elneebreMata 3ポイント4ポイント  (4子コメント)

Rooney will take Rashford's place and we'll be shit again

[–]Launch_a_poo 0ポイント1ポイント  (3子コメント)

Before the 1-0 City game we were still crap though

[–]elneebreMata -2ポイント-1ポイント  (2子コメント)

We'll probably be crap after too, we've only really played good games against poor opposition

[–]Kobe_AYEEEEE 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Except that is the exact opposite of what has happened

[–]DecentPerfctionist 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

That's just completely incorrect

[–]unusually_typicalFergie 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think it depends on how well Rashford plays between now and Rooney's return. If he has a dip in form he'll probably sit on the bench most games and Wayne will be the main striker. If he keeps banging them in from a central position then LVG has a much harder decision to make. I'd love to see Rashford and Rooney up front, with Rooney as a target man and Rashford playing off him. Martial could then play as a winger from the midfield, but my 442 mentality is dated, so that ain't gonna happen. Can't possibly have fewer than 5 midfielders, or the dogma police will come and shut down the club.

Seriously, though, I think a 442 with wide players would help us break down those teams that just park the bus, as we'd be able to stretch them more and would create room for the forward men. It's why we do so well against the top 6, and suck huge donkey balls versus everyone else. We can't cycle the ball fast enough out on the 25 yard line to create spaces against teams who pack the edge of their penalty box, but put the likes of Martial out on the wing and have them drop bombs into Rooney and Rashford and we'd fucking destroy them. They couldn't just sit back and counterattack once we become frustrated and lose our shape. We can always save our weak sauce variety of tika taka for teams that want to actually contest the midfield.

Whatever. I'll just go back to my armchair and cover my old knees with a blanket.

[–]alustgarten93Martial 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Hopefully it'd let us rotate a little more so that our guys aren't totally gassed during the last run of the season where every game is more significant than the last.

[–]azt95 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Best case scenario, a front 3 of Rooney (ST), Martial (LW), and Rashford (RW) with Mata/Lingard as 10. I believe this attack has enough pace and penetration to cause some serious damage against the opposition.

BUT it all depends on how Rooney is after his injury. If he continues his form before the injury, then we have a good chance of getting Top 4. If it's 2015 Rooney, then we're fucked cause knowing Van Gaal, he'll play Rooney ahead of Rashford anyway as "the captain shall always play" rule apply. Don't forget that it always takes Wayne sometime to hit his stride after an injury, something we can't afford at the moment.

[–]n4ggs 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Defensive mid.

[–]BigbuckyballRonaldo 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I would like to see Wayne used as a sub for Rashford or Mata but I feel since he is the captain, he will probably stroll into the XI. If that's the case I want to see Rooney up top with Martial on the left and Rashford on the right. Mata as a no.10. Lingard looked good on no.10 the other day so maybe we could sub Lingard in for Mata if things aren't working.

If Memphis impresses LVG on the training ground then I can see Memphis on the left, Rashford on the right with Martial up top and Wayne as a no.10.

I don't think either Martial or Rashford deserve to be dropped and I don't think LVG wants to drop Rashford either.

[–]yiyiyiyiHerrera 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

What will happen: Rashford gets dropped like a stone for Rooney

What should happen: Rooney should ride the bench until Rashford is tired/injured/out of form.

[–]FURyannnnScholes 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

Nah, what should happen is that Rooney should take over for Mata at the 10, which keeps Rashford in the squad.

[–]Zvcx 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

There is no chance rashford starts ahead of Rooney.

[–]KeKaRoNiJanuzaj -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

The fact that people are having dilemmas over such a thing brings tears of joy to my eyes, as it proves that we have good players in our attacking side.

[–]CalabriaStuCazzo -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

LVG should plop his arse on the bench. That's what should happen.

[–]Launch_a_poo -1ポイント0ポイント  (6子コメント)

Rooney's probably our best attacking player along with Martial and Mata. Rashford has been great in Rooney's absence but I saw people were calling for him to be dropped when they saw the line up vs City. Thankfully he scored and extended his run.

He's our captain and still our top goalscorer this year, should definitely be a fairly regular feature in our XI.

[–]danskzwag -1ポイント0ポイント  (5子コメント)

Hes not our best attacking player and has had a poor season

[–]Launch_a_poo 0ポイント1ポイント  (4子コメント)

Poor by his standards but he's still our top goalscorer and still one of our best players. I'd say only Martial is a better attacking player

[–]danskzwag 0ポイント1ポイント  (3子コメント)

rooney scored 5 goals in the whole of 2015 the fact that martial while confined to left wing prison , has the equal amount tells you everything you need to know

[–]Launch_a_poo 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

I'm not saying Martial should be dropped for him though. Just one of Rashford, Mata, Lingard. How do you justify any of those players starting over Wayne Rooney? Even on an off season he is still going to out score and out play all of them.

[–]danskzwag 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Rashford is in the right positions in the right time, rooney is nearly always dropping deep and disrupting attacking play , mata creates more and Lingard has a high workrate and good positional play

[–]BrendonAG92 -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

Mata most likely should, and will get dropped. In all honesty he's not a bad player, but I also am not sure he has a real future at the club. If the team's built around him, he is a very good player, and he could do pretty well for us, but he routinely disappears in games where we're down and out.

Rooney should in theory play quite well with a front three of Rashford, Memphis, Martial, or Lingard (any of those 4 in any of those three positions). He's much more positive in a counter attacking team as well.