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[–]Endorsed ContributorNeoreactionSafe 165ポイント166ポイント  (0子コメント)

This is an absolute breath of fresh air.

You have presented the advanced art of actual relationship with higher functioning adults of both genders.

This is the "end game" of the Red Pill process where you have complete mastery over your situation.

Excellent Post !!!

[–][deleted] 90ポイント91ポイント  (14子コメント)

A long-term relationship CANNOT be your end goal. You can only be OPEN to the possibility of having one.

The #1 mistake men make is not following this advice and then settling

[–]rpscrote 30ポイント31ポイント  (7子コメント)

it cannot be overstated how vitally important it is to pick the WOMAN and not the RELATIONSHIP

[–][deleted] 0ポイント1ポイント  (5子コメント)

Can you expend on that please? I don't understand.

[–]nuesuh 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

You don't start a LTR for the sake of starting one. You start a LTR because the woman in question is good enough.

"Remember, women are candidates applying to be your girlfriend. Don't just hire someone because you want the position filled. Make sure you vet your candidates fiercely and hire the right one for the job."

[–]Count_To_Five 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Not OP, but I think he means to choose the woman out of the sea of other options, but not necessarily the relationship.

[–]rpscrote 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

needing a relationship means you aren't okay alone, picking the woman necessarily means you have options and one of those options is being okay alone

[–]BlaiseD-Bertrand 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Avoid doing things for the sake of doing things, like getting into a LTR or even bedding a woman just because you can. Both men and women can be bad for "being in love with the idea of being in love." That is, they don't take into consideration the idiot who is the other half of the equation or just how shitty the relationship is despite both agreeing they love each other.

If your overall goal is to have a LTR then don't expect that any particular woman is the one. Setting your goal as having an LTR with a particular woman smacks of oneitis and is probably a decision made without enough evidence being on the table.

[–]Gierfarmer 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Far too many people are looking for the right person and not trying to be the right person.

[–][deleted] 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

The goal is happiness. A relation MAY BE, under CERTAIN CONDITIONS, a way to be a little happier.

It CAN NOT be a mean to achieve happiness.

[–]PlebDestroyer -5ポイント-4ポイント  (2子コメント)

I struggle to understand why I would even want one. Heck, even if the girl deserves it -- I don't HAVE to give her commitment, do I? It's like giving out scholarships; okay, you've earned one with hard work, but I'm sure the college would prefer you to pay them instead.

I'd rather be a player and never settle.

[–]MyFirstOtherAccount 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

Well then this post isn't for you...

[–]PlebDestroyer -3ポイント-2ポイント  (0子コメント)

I understand, but I'm trying to gain an understanding of why people would want an ltr.

[–]87GNX 17ポイント18ポイント  (1子コメント)

The comparison between a man's open-ness to a relationship and a country's open-ness to immigrants is hilarious, and right on.

[–]RedRisingHood 46ポイント47ポイント  (3子コメント)

From that point on, a woman must perform NON-SEXUAL services for you in order to advance in rank.

Brilliant - Laughed so hard

It's like training a pet puppy or commanding some fairly incompetent army cadets.

[–]Tidbitter 29ポイント30ポイント  (7子コメント)

Excellent read. I agree with all of it.

One note on the "withholding sex" part. My LTR is a shy (true) Asian girl. The thought that she might be starting her period is the only reason she has ever been hesitant to do the deed. I have no problem with that. I am not a fan of parting the red sea and I appreciate her respecting my stance (besides, she would never even suggest it. She feels very unclean during that time, which goes against her almost-clinical cleanliness).

But, it does bring up a topic I've thought about mentioning here before - and as a reminder to those starting out - that 1/4 of the times you first meet a girl, and she doesn't go to pound town with you, the reason might be that she's ragging and too shy to say anything.

Op, I'd buy you a drink if I ever met you for your time spent on your dead-on postings.

[–][削除されました]  (2子コメント)

[deleted]

    [–]fake7272 4ポイント5ポイント  (1子コメント)

    cold rejection literally means she wanted to turn you into a beta orbiter and is upset that you tried to escalate. one of my FWB does this to guys and when they initiate she is internally EMBARRASSED for them. this is obviously different if you already had physical contact, in which case cold rejection = loss of attraction

    [–]TRP VanguardHumanSockPuppet[S] 11ポイント12ポイント  (0子コメント)

    One note on the "withholding sex" part. My LTR is a shy (true) Asian girl. The thought that she might be starting her period is the only reason she has ever been hesitant to do the deed.

    Certainly. A single instance of reluctance to have sex does not constitute a decrease in frequency. In this case there's a reason for her avoiding sex, and once her period passes, it's back on.

    That's why you exercise careful discretion when deciding how to reward and punish.

    [–][削除されました]  (2子コメント)

    [deleted]

      [–]redpillerinnyc -2ポイント-1ポイント  (1子コメント)

      3 weeks? If a bitch doesn't put out by 2nd date, it's adieu for me. If a bitch doesn't put out by 3rd one, she's just not attracted to you.

      [–]unsure_RP_initiate 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

      2) A long-term relationship CANNOT be your end goal. You can only be OPEN to the possibility of having one.

      When you WANT a LTR, you place your focus on the idea of having a relationship rather than on assessing the > woman herself (which is what you should be doing). You become fixated on your fantasy relationship and you > selectively ignore the things happening right in front of you: her deep character flaws, her indiscretions, and the > red flags.

      Remember, women are candidates applying to be your girlfriend. Don't just hire someone because you want the > position filled. Make sure you vet your candidates fiercely and hire the right one for the job.

      I know I'm late to the game, but you must know how much this is hitting me as true right now.

      I got married 14 months ago with this basic mistake: getting married as an end-goal, compounded with the delusion that it didn't even matter who exactly the girl was, that I could grow with anyone so long as I set an example. This was extremely naive.

      I had fallen 'in love', and now I can feel myself falling out of love. And man - it fucking sucks. She can be so sweet sometimes. And she'll blow me almost whenever I want. But what does she do with her life? She works 20 hours a week and spends the rest of her day on Reddit, or otherwise screwing around. Somehow she cleans less than I do despite working 35% as much, and somehow she finds even less time than I do to pursue my goals. She is riddled with insecurities and needs to do a lot of growing up. It's terrible knowing that I'm going to divorce her at the end of our lease in 2.5 months, and I don't even have a special reason except that I want more than what she has to offer me.

      [–]TRP VanguardHumanSockPuppet[S] 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

      You'll notice that I omitted marriage entirely from the ranks. There is no level 4.

      There's a reason for that.

      Once you get married, you lose the ability to threaten a woman with demotion. When she becomes your wife, she steps outside of the reward/punishment scheme and she is no longer beholden to you.

      Your power comes from your ability to walk away.

      Remember that for next time. Never marry a bitch, NO MATTER HOW GOOD SHE IS.

      Because all it takes is for the hormones to subside for you two to become bored with each other. And then your real problems begin.

      [–]saltinado 61ポイント62ポイント  (41子コメント)

      The levels stuff was overboard, women aren't perfect, and they unintentionally and intentionally make mistakes. Try dialing that shit down a notch to deal with real human beings.

      [–]Cant_Tell_Me_Nothin 34ポイント35ポイント  (1子コメント)

      I think a lot of guys are here precisely because they followed this advice in the first place. They gave women too much benefit of the doubt under the excuse that "no one is perfect." It's true that no one is perfect, but it doesn't mean that you should keep highly imperfect people around to mess with your life. Sometimes you need stricter boundaries, or to actually cut people off.

      Giving a pass to intentional mistakes is the definition of being a pushover.

      [–]circlhat 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

      This, I always felt I was taking the easy way out and tried to improve myself, become a better leader, I always place blame on myself.

      This only band aids a huge gaping wound, for a time it will seem like things are fine, you will keep putting on band aids but the wound never heals.

      That wound is called obligation , you may think things is starting to improve but she is doing it out of obligation and is settling. If a women thinks she can find a better man do not stand in her way, because this is what it all comes down too.

      If you are the best she believes she can get she will not ever cross you, however it goes both ways, if you fail at being alpha you can never recover.

      I like the PUA concept, a girl decides if she will fuck you within the first 5 minutes, in that first 5 minutes you set the stage for the entire relationship.

      The deep meaning behind shit test, and the reason a girl refuses sex is because she believes their is a better guy out there and she will only have sex with you because she will try to settle, so I agree, cut her off, she was probably alpha windowed and you don't measure up.

      [–]Endorsed ContributorInvalidity 47ポイント48ポイント  (28子コメント)

      If you're going to treat another person as a real human being, you're going to hold them accountable for their actions. This levels thing makes everything seem autonomous, but in reality, it is providing the basis for accountability.

      The problem with most men is that they believe treating women as "real human beings" equates to treating them as though they are weaker and incapable of thinking clearly. That is true sexism and it is widely practiced amongst the male population.

      Women are real human beings and real human beings must be held accountable for their actions.

      [–]saltinado 35ポイント36ポイント  (14子コメント)

      Oh hell yes, don't be a doormat, but also don't demand perfection from an imperfect being. If a buddy cancels on you last minute, you don't cut him out of your life, you reschedule and move on like a not-OCD afflicted person. Treating someone like a real human being means expecting the best of them but forgiving stupid shit.

      [–]Endorsed ContributorInvalidity 31ポイント32ポイント  (12子コメント)

      You've got to understand that the while the first few instances of "stupid shit" may be incidental, if someone does something repeatedly, even if it has only ever happened twice, the fact that it has even happened means that the relationship (whether platonic or intimate) is headed in the wrong direction.

      If your girlfriend insults you even once, you'd have to believe that she has lost respect for you. If she openly flirts with another guy, forgiving her and trying to talk things out with her will not yield the desired results.

      Forgiveness is earned, not handed out freely. I understand that we want to be sensible people, but relationships should be handled critically by men. Your time and well-being are invested and if you're not getting the returns you expect, you are taking a big hit to your livelihood.

      [–]saltinado 25ポイント26ポイント  (5子コメント)

      I get where you're coming from, man, but there's this thing in psychology called the fundamental attribution error. It's when you see an action and then attribute the cause of that action to an internal rather than an external one. So if you get cut off at a light, you assume it's because the driver is a dick, instead of assuming he didn't see you because he was dealing with a crying baby in the backseat (or whatever).

      So you assume that when your girl insults you, it's because she didn't respect you, and she'll never respect you in the future. Okay, but what happened to cause that? Was it because you snubbed her last week? Was it because she got dumped on at work? There could be tons of factors. Don't put up with an abusive girl, but don't toss out a unicorn because you have paper thin skin and no sense of context.

      [–]Endorsed ContributorInvalidity 7ポイント8ポイント  (0子コメント)

      I've had girls say things impulsively to me when they've been emotionally driven to do so, but I've never personally encountered a moment when a girl would just insult me out of the blue, especially if she felt slighted a week or days prior.

      I've witnessed first hand other guys who are denigrated unexpectedly, even when they perform thoughtful gestures. These are the same guys who'd get shitted on for minor things and take the brunt of all the blame for anything a girl has a problem with.

      It's a slippery slope. When you tolerate such behavior, you're allowing for it to happen more and more. This is true of both genders, but more so with women because of how lenient society has become with female behavior.

      [–]TooMuchToDoo 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

      I don't think a girl insulting her SO fully fits the context of your first point, but I agree with your first argument. Mark Manson talks about this in Models, stressing that to be human means making mistakes from time to time.

      Sometimes events that transpire (that you're completely unaware of) are mentally affecting your SO and causing them to act in ways that you won't ever be able to effectively respond to, simply because you'll never fully know the cause of their actions.

      [–][削除されました]  (2子コメント)

      [deleted]

        [–]saltinado 4ポイント5ポイント  (1子コメント)

        Evolutionary psych and "the power of the situation" are two hotly contested counter influences. However, the general consensus is that the power of the situation almost always outweighs evolutionary psych. Stanford Prison Experiment, mate, check it out.

        [–]Patrick2787 -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

        I can't believe you went there lol. I watched that documentary, it really shed light on how a situation can alter an otherwise well adjusted, normal person's behavior. They had to shut it down after a few days...

        [–]Audunis 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

        I think the intentional or vindictive points should be without forgiveness. Even some of the unintentional ones, like flirting, that show a less than conscious losing of commitment to the relationship. But mistakes, even if they harm your authority (like the cancellation thing) can be forgiven. That's the divide I think we reach.,

        [–]ikeepthingsinmybutt 3ポイント4ポイント  (4子コメント)

        I honestly think the level system is a good abstraction but I think each situation is something that needs to be looked at and not judged by a points system some guy on the internet made up: different things work for different people. The level system is a good framework to think about the relationship, but I personally think a stern warning about behavior may sometimes be in order before instant demotion. To take an example from the OP: your girl gets blasted at your family reunion and makes a fool of herself and embarrasses you. Different guys in different situations might handle this differently: the 20 year old junior in college can demote her down to 0, no worries, he's got a campus full of poon to discover. The 29 year old who wants to have children before he gets too old might have a talk with her about appropriate behavior, and then deliver punishment based on her response (if she understands her actions and shows that she is repentant, less severe, if full hamstering ensues, hard demotion/next.)

        Don't get me wrong, some shit is unforgivable and cutting losses is essential, but mandatory sentencing for a lot of shit is counterproductive to a lot of goals you might set. For example, if everything up to that point had been golden in the 29 year old's example and they had been going stead for several years, it would be kind of retarded to just toss the bitch out. If she had a history of uncontrolled drinking/doing dumb shit while drunk, then she wasn't a fit mother anyways. But people can make mistakes, and I think how they react to your admonishments and how they handle responsibility being laid on them is very important in determining someone's character.

        [–]Endorsed ContributorInvalidity 9ポイント10ポイント  (3子コメント)

        The 29 year old who wants to have children before he gets too old might have a talk with her about appropriate behavior, and then deliver punishment based on her response

        Basically, you're saying that as men get older they have less options. That may or may not be true to some extent, since the younger guy might be in college and have more readily accessible women.

        However... an older man should realize that his remaining time is much more critical and that any screw ups by his partners should be met with even swifter and more definitive judgment.

        People CAN make mistakes yes, but as with both genders, one offense will generally lead to a second offense, which will probably lead to another.

        Generally speaking, if a woman respects you and is attracted to you, she won't risk doing anything stupid, especially if she knows that she has a weakness to such influences as alcohol.

        Would you forgive a woman who has never had a history of being drunk, who ends up having sex with a random guy she meets at a club? Assuming everything else is perfect. You probably would as would most guys... but in general, it's a bad idea.

        [–]ikeepthingsinmybutt 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

        Would you forgive a woman who has never had a history of being drunk, who ends up having sex with a random guy she meets at a club? Assuming everything else is perfect. You probably would as would most guys... but in general, it's a bad idea.

        Ha. Haha. No. Adultery is auto-nuke, I don't care if Jesus Christ himself comes down and tells me she is my soul mate and she'll never do it again.

        However... an older man should realize that his remaining time is much more critical and that any screw ups by his partners should be met with even swifter and more definitive judgment.

        I understand I might be working under the sunk cost mentality here, but I really can't imagine hard-nexting a perfect relationship over something that wasn't abuse, vitriolic disprespect, or adultery. I would at least attempt to correct other behaviors depending on, as stated before, how she responded to being told to take responsibility for her actions.

        I don't want to be 60 before my children can legally go to the bar with me, and if I have to do some work to correct behavior to ensure that, then so be it.

        [–][削除されました]  (1子コメント)

        [deleted]

          [–]Patrick2787 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

          I can really relate to this post. Good for you man :)

          [–]Senior Contributor: "The Court Jester"GayLubeOil 12ポイント13ポイント  (10子コメント)

          Well its a biological fact that women are weaker. Also anyone who watches Oprah or RomComs must be incapable of thinking clearly. Visit an all female space sometime, a gym an office and then tell me about equality.

          [–]kaiwanxiaode -5ポイント-4ポイント  (9子コメント)

          It is a mistake to think of women as 'weaker'. Physically yes women are weaker than men, this is indisputable, however we don't live in cave-men times where pure raw strength (with the exception of a few occupations) is necessary for success. We live in an information age, where women's ability to multitask and read emotions is often an advantage.

          [–]FerrusMan 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

          We live in an information age, where women's ability to multitask and read emotions is often an advantage.

          We may very well live in an information age, but male/female sexual attraction is still in caveman age.

          [–]Senior Contributor: "The Court Jester"GayLubeOil 10ポイント11ポイント  (5子コメント)

          Lol caveman times. If you belive in modern female strength I have an office full of crying and malingering women to show you.

          [–]TRP VanguardWhisper 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

          We live in an information age, where women's ability to multitask and read emotions is often an advantage.

          No one can multitask. Brains don't work that way.

          What people can do is rapidly task switch. Which is why people think women are better at it. Really what's going on is that they are doing simpler tasks, and more familiar ones.

          [–][削除されました]  (2子コメント)

          [deleted]

            [–]deathhand 30ポイント31ポイント  (0子コメント)

            Agreed, I think the main take away is that forgiveness shouldn't be dolled out like ice cream i.e. don't be a door mat.

            [–]1independentmale 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

            Absolutely. Each of us has to make this decision for ourselves on a case by case basis. To me, it all comes down to the overall value a person is providing to my life. Minor mistakes here and there are perfectly acceptable so long as the positives vastly outweigh the negatives.

            I'm very patient and forgiving, so everybody gets at least one chance to fuck up. It depends on the seriousness of the transgression, of course, but generally speaking I'm going to be quick to forgive. Make a habit out of it, however, and we're through. I've been used and mistreated in the past, I know what it looks like and I won't fucking tolerate it.

            So many people are afraid of confrontation, especially in relationships. Nexting people for little things because you don't want to deal with an uncomfortable conversation is not a long term strategy. Better to firmly, but unemotionally, state your position. "Your behavior this evening was embarrassing. I expect better of you. Don't let this happen again." If the bitch responds by arguing, screaming and so on, then demote and/or next. However, I've found when they really love you and are afraid to lose you, direct statements like this result in tears, apologies and make up sex.

            [–]RedRisingHood 17ポイント18ポイント  (2子コメント)

            I don't think it literally means she gets a badge and a title, it's a more a personal guideline to determine how much of yourself you give to her

            It's the same with your platonic male friendships, you know the guys you can rely on and who will stick by you, so you treat them differently

            [–]TRP VanguardHumanSockPuppet[S] 13ポイント14ポイント  (0子コメント)

            You got it.

            This isn't a game show. You will never tell your girlfriend what "rank" she's is, or that you're scrutinizing her efforts.

            This model is for you, to assist you in understanding the process and making sound judgements about how much time and effort to invest in a girl.

            Ideally, you should eventually develop a natural intuition for how to reward and punish a girl without having to think too much about it. It will become instinctive with practice.

            [–]Audunis 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

            For the intentional or vindictive categories one should cut her off. Unless she can prove there was an elaborate conspiring of events that led to that outcome. Which she can't.

            For the more psychological ones like flirting with another man she should be cut out.

            For the other indiscretions forgiveness can be earned. Especially when one considers that no man will be the perfect alpha provider, masculine leader at all times. If you make similar unforgivable mistakes she will cut you out because she has not been socialized to not follow her instincts like men have been. In absence of our gut it helps to have a rough model that can be adjust as OP said.

            [–]TRP VanguardHumanSockPuppet[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

            If you look at the way I broke down the penalty system, your concerns are already addressed:

            1. Only a long-term girlfriend can survive an intentional offense - and even then, she gets demoted to the worst possible state; a plate.

            2. No girl can survive a vindictive attack. Even a girlfriend gets the ejector seat if she dares disrespect you in company.

            [–]Audunis 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

            Well I am replying to Saltanado, but the forgiveness issue he brings up I think is for the more minor things like her not doing a job once. Less the issues you are referencing in response to me unless I misunderstand you.

            [–]TRP VanguardHumanSockPuppet[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

            I thought I was pretty clear when I said that this is a model for understanding sexual dynamics. In particular, I emphasized that readers should focus on the human interaction component when applying this strategy in the real world.

            Red Pill enclaves (like this subreddit) are the only safe spaces where sexual dynamics can be portrayed and discussed in such clinical detail. That's why we have our own vernacular and terminology, and that's why we write in the language of game theory while we're here.

            [–]TRP_Wingfoot 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

            Excellent post.

            Only suggestion I have is to explicitly state that a man must always be willing to walk away, and that comes with the territory of downgrading due to disrespect or fuck ups.

            I'm using this as a reference for my own situation. Thanks, /u/HumanSockPuppet !

            [–]WeAreHunted 5ポイント6ポイント  (4子コメント)

            In my honest opinion, anyone who follows this will never have a loving, successful relationship. What if we commit one of these consequences? What if we screw up one night, get completely drunk and kiss another woman in front of our SO? Are we to expect our SO to turn a blind eye to it?

            I just don't understand where the love comes in in this equation. If I treated my girl like this, she would leave my ass. I mean, what? I should've left her when she canceled on me for the FIF Concert because her mother died? That cost me a lot of money, and I was utterly miserable since she wasn't there. But based on your scale, she should be dropped to level 1 or 0! Dude, its flawed. Unless I am viewing this all wrong, please clear this up for me!

            [–]citidude1234 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

            That's why OP said his theory is malleable. In my opinion, regarding your 'love' statement, love should come naturally through the female making an effort so she doesn't fuck up. Clearly she isn't going to the concert if her mother died, but if she blew off the expensive concert to go out with her friends, then that's an intentional offense. What i think OP means by intentional offense is that she did something shitty to you for her entertainment/personal gain.

            [–]WeAreHunted -2ポイント-1ポイント  (1子コメント)

            Shouldn't we also make an effort too though? Like if she is putting in all of the effort, won't she get tired of it if I'm not giving any effort back?

            (Can you tell I am new to Red Pill? I really like the ideals, but some of them concern me a bit. I just want to understand so that I don't lose her by being a beta. I need to become the ultimate alpha, I've been used too many times by women in the past. I always fall into this one-itis pattern.)

            [–]1Zackcid 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

            First, guys and girls are NOT interchangeable. Your way of communication, as well as your standards cannot apply to both equally. We are not women, and they are not men. So don't act like we're the same.

            Second, this post assumes you've become a self-actualized Man. A woman would leave a boy immediately, as you say. But she won't leave a self-actualized Man just as easily. She depends on what he provides her with. She cannot replace him at the drop of a hat. Plus, if she's risen to the ranks of a girl-friend, you already know you've got something strong between the both of you.

            [–]BetaRecovery 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

            You guys are heroes of men. A beacon of light for lost men everywhere. Seriously, why is this not on the sidebar and how can we get it there?

            [–]neveragoodtime 10ポイント11ポイント  (13子コメント)

            Great fucking post. We need more like this. Reddit has this impression that we're all trying to pump and dump. The reality is most of us are looking for a decent fucking girl who can meet some basic expectations of respect. The fact that so many are ONS is a testament to how many of them fail this basic test. Where have all the good girls gone?

            [–][削除されました]  (4子コメント)

            [deleted]

              [–]neveragoodtime 1ポイント2ポイント  (3子コメント)

              I suppose you're right. There is no better teacher than experience. No amount of sidebar material could make up for that. Ironic, that the cock carousel the feminists carefully protect becomes the training ground for RP brothers. Brothers who won't LTR their skank asses. Their very existence sews the seeds of their own solitude and misery.

              [–][削除されました]  (2子コメント)

              [deleted]

                [–]neveragoodtime 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

                In other words, the one thing keeping women from making the harmful choice of riding th CC was the "patriarchy". A huge difference from the old days was that marriage existed to protect the husband and wife from these indiscretions breaking up the family. An unmarried woman couldn't prove another man's paternity and claim his resources, and a married man couldn't deny his paternity of his wife's baby.

                And on a side note, women who cheat wanted it kept secret. Women who were cheated with wanted it well known. Men didn't kiss and tell, so we ended up with the idea that men cheat more than women because women don't mind throwing stones from their glass houses.

                [–]unsure_RP_initiate 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

                Where have all the good girls gone?

                Sounds like women. 'Where have all the good guys gone'.

                [–]topredhat 12ポイント13ポイント  (0子コメント)

                This is very informative high quality post the redpill needs. You should start a post series if this get popular.

                [–]Moldy_Gecko 3ポイント4ポイント  (5子コメント)

                Now, how do you apply this to a marriage? I can't just next my wife...

                [–]sunwukong155 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

                Totally different ball game man. There is a lot of advice on here about what to do.

                [–]TRP VanguardHumanSockPuppet[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

                This strategy guide is not for married men.

                Your power comes from your ability to walk away. Once you get married to a bitch, you can no longer do that.

                You'll notice that I didn't include "marriage" in the ranks - there is no "rank 4", nothing above being a girlfriend. That was no accident.

                [–]wutangzus2002 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

                I am in the boat but even married there are certain things that will require you to act and in a sense put her in her place. Obviously you may have to be a bit forgiving, but at the same time she represents you now, so a failure on her part to uphold that is a failure to care about you. That is how I read it.

                [–]Moldy_Gecko 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

                My wife would be the ideal politician wife. She is great talking me up and shit when we are out... It's the home shit that I am slowly trying to recalibrate.

                [–]circlhat 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

                Once a girl has been demoted, her current level becomes the maximum level she can ever be. She can only climb the ladder as long as she is flawless in the execution of her womanly duties. Once she commits a serious offense, she is demoted, and she can never rise again.

                Damn dude, I need to implement this as it seems the only way to win the game at this point is not to play it.

                [–]MOTHERFUCKING_BOUNCE 3ポイント4ポイント  (2子コメント)

                If someone spends their time and effort to make you food or do you any sort of small favor, it doesn't matter if they burn it. A real man would say "Thank you" regardless.

                If nothing else, it makes you look good and forgiving and increases your reputation. But seriously, a gesture of gratitude is in order.

                [–]GuruDev1000 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

                That's exactly what the post said. Appreciating The effort

                [–][deleted] 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

                What if that's what I really want is an LTR? Does that make me beta simply because that's what I enjoy? It's not that I have oneitis I really just enjoy sharing my life with someone who is reciprocating.

                [–]TRP VanguardHumanSockPuppet[S] 18ポイント19ポイント  (1子コメント)

                There's nothing wrong with wanting a LTR. I want LTRs myself, which is why I went to the trouble of figuring all this out and turning it into a guide.

                But you must make sure that you vet your potential women carefully so that you find the right woman for the job. Like I said, you don't want to hire just anyone for the sake of having a LTR.

                A LTR should be a reward for a girl who has earned your trust and your effort.

                [–][deleted] 8ポイント9ポイント  (0子コメント)

                Makes sense, thanks for the reply.

                [–]Ithawashala 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

                As I begin my path down this road, I will use this post as one of many tools to understand what a healthier and more fulfilling male-female relationship should look like. Thank you

                [–]VincentVega92 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

                This is awesome. An actual formula for LTR's . Brilliant.

                [–]Forty_Deuce 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

                All I have to say is that I wish this kind of information was around 15 years ago. My 20's would have went by a lot smoother.

                [–]BlankSurface 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

                Excellent! Very well thought out post.

                [–]needmorefat 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

                You'll never find yourself in a situation where a girl is giving you gifts and cooking you meals, but NOT having sex with you.

                Nitpick - this isn't true, and if it's true for you, you're suffering from some degree of social isolation: every one of my inner circle (male and female) has either cooked me a meal or bought me a present at least once, and I for them as well.

                Which brings up an interesting point - There's an acquaintance -> friend -> InnerCircle scale which works very much the same way. You can be discerning with the inner circle or not, as you choose ... but don't be less discerning with your partners than you are with your friends, or you've set yourself up for disaster.

                One should strive to have at least two non-family InnerCircle members (but ideally you have 3-5) and a constant rotation of casual friends. Acquaintances are optional.

                [–]prettylogical 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

                The problem with the ranks is that they all presume sexual components prior to an LTR. Is this a necessary component for progress through the ranks?

                [–]getfat 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

                Great Post, I had two thoughts while reading.

                I would advise revising the portion regarding giving exceptions to anything that remotely was a relationship. Few women will accept permanent demotion and fewer men can pull that type of maneuver. It may appear extreme but it is designed for your benefit. Going back to familiarity is an easy trap to fall into. Be honest with yourself; Can you keep a proper mindset with a certain person as a plate? For these type of questions, I don't trust my own intuition and refer to my inner circle.

                Regarding offenses made by lower tiers. I would argue the respective level 0+1, shouldn't move after any offenses because these type of actions should be expected. There is a reason you were hesitant to promote these individuals. Either the product is unproven or you were aware of quality issues. This individual has not earned enough respect for promotion so why do you care.

                [–]C00l_Guy 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

                I'm thinking we need to get a best of collection going. This should be added.

                [–]Chuckwagon1645 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

                Once a woman is demoted they are incapable of redemption and honestly learning a lesson or is it just safer to assume it isn't likely to happen?

                [–]darthsmokey 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

                "hypergamy shows no mercy for the weak" I should make a frame for this quote.

                [–][削除されました]  (1子コメント)

                [deleted]

                  [–]circlhat -3ポイント-2ポイント  (0子コメント)

                  I will up vote you because I understand how you feel and you brought up society which is really our only excuse.

                  I don't want to be looked by women as a thankless utility to have the product of my labor stolen from me.

                  At this point you need to demand(not ask) for more, my relations took a 180 when I demanded more. I wasn't use to demanding, I was use too depending on myself for what I wanted.

                  Once I started demanding she cook,clean, and wrote a schedule she become much happier, she also does shopping and laundry and actually saves me money and time because I manage her right.

                  [–]goddafindbettername -2ポイント-1ポイント  (2子コメント)

                  A positively needed extension for TRP-Theory! Thank you sock :)

                  And, btw, the list would definitely benefit from adding "being way too late without notification" on fixated times as an unintentional (?) offense. Even though it should not result in demoting her, it still calls for some action.

                  As this very thing just recently happened to me with a fwb of mine, I decided to not let it slip and make it rather clear to her that she can stay wherever she wants if she plans to be late again without telling me. The result was a super-sweet submissive girl which was very eager to please me.

                  This should be of importance, especially for guys who tend to get soft after being with a certain girl for an extended period of time. If you decide not to let things slip, it will ultimately benefit you - even though it does not necessarily seem like it in the first moment.

                  Thanks again for your post sockpuppet, hope I added something useful for you guys.

                  [–][削除されました]  (1子コメント)

                  [deleted]

                    [–]goddafindbettername 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

                    I see your point! But as I tend to spin plates I prefer a rather clear cut approach to seeing each other, which comes down to "be at my place at 8". Helps a lot with drama etc.

                    [–]Endorsed ContributorTheRedPilsner 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

                    A girlfriend who drunkenly humiliates you in front of your friends at a party drops to 0, and she quietly disappears from your life.

                    Holy shit. Have you and I met before? The exact same thing happened to me with a girlfriend I had a few years back. I immediately dumped her. She begged me to take her back and I ignored her.

                    [–]N0TH4PPY -3ポイント-2ポイント  (0子コメント)

                    Without going into too many details about my life, I have to say that this post hit home run with me.

                    I have put it in my permanent collections of frequent readings so that I can internalize it and have it naturally part of me.

                    After reading it three times I have come to a realization: if you are one of those guys who enters a relationship as Alpha-like and slowly find yourself Beta, she played this very game on you.

                    Related reading from this sub: You can be the gatekeeper of both sex and commit... Or she can https://archive.today/PSoxT

                    [–]Lewisf1991 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

                    Pretty amazing model put into perspective. Only suggestion I have is that 2/3 ratio u suggested. I'm a little old school and agree with that ratio when it comes to favors and what not. But as a guy you always need to out do the girl in gifts and things along the lines of money.

                    Also for your topic in the beginning about girls being candidates that is completely true. I've learned from experience that you need to put the girl in check fast. You need her to know that she's luckier to have u then her even if u don't truly feel that way. I have a smoking hot girlfriend and thats one way of getting her don't chase be chased. My buddy just got out of a relationship and was a real bitch the whole relationship because he felt that he was so lucky to have her and basically praised her whenever she took a dump. The result was she walked all over him. Near the end i started giving him advice that he needs to take control and he tried but was to emotionally invested and the girl was so use to having control that they broke up when there was a struggle for power in the relationship.

                    At the end of the day...

                    Only rules that apply we don't cuff em let em fly If she thinks she's in for better things that bitch in for a surprise

                    [–]Senior Contributor: "The Court Jester"GayLubeOil 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

                    Quantifying relationships numerically feels pretty. Its like if my girlfriend gave me 1.5 blowjobs for every omelet I made her.

                    [–]TheEmperorIncarnate 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

                    Where have you been 8 years ago? Could've used your advise earlier. But thanks anyway, excellent and entertaining post.

                    [–]archaeopter 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

                    You'll never find yourself in a situation where a girl is giving you gifts and cooking you meals, but NOT having sex with you.

                    I have never in my life read such bullshit. This has literally happened to me a bunch of times.

                    One example: in college, there was a straight single girl who lived in the apartment next to me. She came over two or three nights a week to watch a movie; most of those times, she made us dinner together. I think I made a dinner for her like twice. She bought me gifts for two or three birthdays and at least two Christmases; one of the Christmases, she made me a handmade quilt depicting the logos of Chicago sports teams (I'm a Chicago-ite). I never had sex with her, ever.

                    Another example: there was a woman who worked in another building on the corporate campus I used to work on. She was also straight. She was also single. She made me batches of homemade cookies about once a month and invited me to her apartment for meals at least four times. On my last day at work there, she bought me a Macbook Pro as a "going away" gift. The only "gift" I ever remember giving her was a sandwich from the food truck in front of her building. We never had sex.

                    Those are just two examples out of many. I wound up marrying one that I was friends with in this way for more than a decade. Before we ever dated, she made me dinner countless times, bought me a bunch of gifts, made me an authentic kilt from scratch, drove a van five hours to help me move, etc., all before any sort of physical contact happened. How did that change? One day, she simply told me that she had been thinking about it recently and that I was just exactly the kind of person she wanted to date, so we tried it, and it worked well. I don't argue with her. I don't have shit tests with her. I have never gone through any of the horseshit with her, ever, that I read about other people having in relationships on here.

                    I don't know what kind of cesspool that you're going to where you dredge up only women who would never treat you like a human being unless you're boning them, but it's not my world.

                    [–]wtf-did-i-marry -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

                    This is a brilliant post. Butthurt neckbeards and legbeards will say "mah misogynyyy", but the uncomfortable truth is that women thrive in this type of environment. You'll get better results using positive reinforcement instead of punishment, but even that doesn't have to be done skillfully in order for it to work.

                    The key trait of the modern western woman is her absolute lack of concern for the desires of men.

                    Women are not alone in this. Beta males, your couples counselor, her parents, and probably even your parents will agree.

                    Don't get married, it takes away most of your power in the game.

                    [–]AlphaAccountant -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

                    Well done. Sidebar material.

                    [–]TheJohnDough -4ポイント-3ポイント  (0子コメント)

                    Very well thought out post. I actually like the way you make rules out of discreet things you see and this makes relationships and such a lot easier not only for the noobies but for some of the veterans as well.

                    [–]LostProsody -4ポイント-3ポイント  (1子コメント)

                    I use a tit for tit for tat system of reward and punishment. I'm very open about this and make any woman in my life read about the concept to understand it. This might work well w the above system if you are uncomfortable w immediate expulsion and prefer to let the person knowingly dig their own grave. Also look into variable ratios of reinforcement for rewarding good behavior. Good stuff OP.

                    [–][削除されました]  (1子コメント)

                    [removed]

                      [–]waynebradysworld -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

                      I enjoyed reading this while driving down the freeway at 79 mph

                      [–]ConfidenceMatters -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

                      I have levels within levels.

                      After level three, (most important and relevant), I introduce the levels beyond - Engagement and perhaps Marriage.

                      Engagement requires a level two to acquire an absolute perfect body with the utmost care of it, including best care of skin, hair, nails, curves etc etc.

                      She must also enjoy working out and eating healthy to the point it is embedded in her psyche forever.

                      She must also demonstrate control over her feminine impulses, such as controlling her need for testing my fortitude often, controlling her need to be sniping behind her friends'/people's backs for her ego, control over how much she wants to go on social media, and control over flirting in public (with or without me). Now since women are women, NO girl on earth today will be able to 100% suppress all of these things. They'll literally die. That's why it's best they keep it to an absolute minimum.

                      She must also be 100% cool with me playing my role as a Man. That means leading, ruling, flirting with other women of level 0 or 1 (in fact being ol with either one occasionally joining US), etc etc etc.

                      Failure to do any of these things and they simply do not advance further - instead greatly increases chances of demotion.

                      [–]OFF_THE_DEEP_END -4ポイント-3ポイント  (6子コメント)

                      Are we supposed to share these rules with the woman? It seems unfair to put someone in a game and not tell them the rules.

                      [–]Nullberri 7ポイント8ポイント  (1子コメント)

                      I don't see how this game is any different than what feminism did and they never issued us a handbook when the rules changed.

                      [–]OFF_THE_DEEP_END -4ポイント-3ポイント  (0子コメント)

                      That's what makes them shitty. Maybe it's a case of die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain.

                      [–]CrimsonDeep 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

                      It seems unfair to put someone in a game and not tell them the rules.

                      You try that and tell us how it turns out. We'll wait.

                      [–]FerrusMan 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

                      It seems unfair to put someone in a game and not tell them the rules.

                      What do you think men have been dealing with their whole lives? Women already know these rules, don't you know that?

                      [–]OFF_THE_DEEP_END -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

                      But I want to be fair. If having a LTR means becoming a liar, then I don't want it.

                      [–][削除されました]  (2子コメント)

                      [removed]

                        [–][削除されました]  (1子コメント)

                        [deleted]

                          [–]TRP VanguardHumanSockPuppet[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

                          Don't add to the noise. Just report them and move on.

                          [–]VoidInvincible -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

                          Love this. Just had a girl at level 3. However we're going through a rough patch.

                          [–]tedcase -24ポイント-23ポイント  (5子コメント)

                          Is it really necessary to call them bitches in the title? It's shit like that that gives trip it's bad rep.

                          [–]TRP VanguardHumanSockPuppet[S] 28ポイント29ポイント  (3子コメント)

                          Is it really necessary to call them bitches in the title? It's shit like that that gives trip it's bad rep.

                          /r/seduction cared about what people thought of them. So they changed little by little to make their sub more inviting.

                          Eventually, the women found their way in, and they too demanded changes be made to accommodate them, so that things aren't so "harsh". /r/seduction figured "Sure, why not? We've changed before"

                          And so ended their quality posts. They became a subreddit of sniveling feminist apologists who focus more on "making women feel good" than on conducting scientifically rigourous studies of seduction techniques.

                          We will not let girls into our boys club. We will not change for anyone. And we will make our language here too extreme for anyone to mimic comfortably while they try to ruin us from within.

                          We will keep this place too toxic to infiltrate.

                          [–]ModRedSovereign[M] 16ポイント17ポイント  (0子コメント)

                          I've left his post intact so that people can see your post. Tone policing is an automatic ban. We're not going to let this place go to shit from within.

                          [–][deleted] -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

                          That was a beautiful explanation. Sure shut that bitch up.

                          [–]CrimsonDeep 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

                          TRP is not going to change for the political narrative. Pack your bags and gtfo if you want to, bub.