Obama Flunks History at Cairo UAlmost every advance he attributed to the Muslims in his big speech should be credited to someone else.
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June 7, 2009 - 2:07 am
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In his speech to the Muslim world in Cairo, President Barack Obama claimed: “As a student of history, I also know civilization’s debt to Islam. It was Islam — at places like Al-Azhar University — that carried the light of learning through so many centuries, paving the way for Europe’s Renaissance and Enlightenment. It was innovation in Muslim communities that developed the order of algebra; our magnetic compass and tools of navigation; our mastery of pens and printing.”
Obama is not much of a “student of history” if he believes this. Almost every advance he attributes to the Muslims was due to someone else.
The non-Muslim Chinese invented the magnetic compass and printing (Gutenberg invented not printing, but movable type). The non-Muslim Hindu Indians invented algebra and the decimal numbering system. The non-Muslim European Christians invented the university.
I can’t address advances in medicine, but I have studied the history of astronomy and physics. The Muslims contributed nothing.
All modern physics descends from Galileo (1564 -1642); all modern astronomy from Copernicus (1473-1543). If you study Galileo’s works carefully, as I have, you see that he started with the achievements of the Greek mathematical physicist Archimedes of Syracuse (c. 287 BC – c. 212 BC). If you study Copernicus’ works carefully, as I have, you will see that Copernicus’ great book On the Revolutions is essentially a heliocentric re-working of the geocentric astronomy textbook by the Greek Ptolemy (c. 90 AD – 168 AD). Copernicus mostly used even Ptolemy’s data for the positions of the planets.
Note the dates for Archimedes/Galileo and Ptolemy/Copernicus. It is as if the Muslim world never existed. As far as their fundamental contributions to physics and astronomy, it did not.
If one reads history of science textbooks prior to about 1980, one will find very little mention of Muslim “contributions” to physics and astronomy. This is reasonable, because there weren’t any. In the past generation, however, political correctness has dictated that Muslims be given credit for discoveries they did not make.
Certainly, the Muslims were a conduit for the discoveries of others. The word “algebra” is indeed derived from an Arabic word. The books of Archimedes and Ptolemy used by Galileo and Copernicus were indeed translations into Latin from the Arabic. But let us never forget that Archimedes and Ptolemy wrote their books in Greek, not Arabic. They were Greeks, not Muslims.
Most of the names for the brightest stars are of Arabic origin, because the names of these stars given in Ptolemy’s textbook were never translated from the Arabic. But do you think that the Arabs were the first humans to observe Rigel and Betelguese, the first and second brightest stars in Orion?
The reason Muslims never developed fundamental physics is because the leading Muslim theologians declared the idea of fixed physical laws to be heretical. The Qur’an (verse 6:64) states: “The Jews have said, ‘God’s hand is fettered.’ Fettered are their hands, and they are cursed for what they have said. Nay, but His hands are outspread; He expends how He will.” The standard Muslim interpretation of this passage has been that there cannot be unchanging physical laws because Allah may change the laws at any moment. In 1982, the Institute for Policy Studies in Islamabad, Pakistan, criticized a chemistry textbook by saying: “There is latent poison present in the subheading Energy Causes Changes because it gives the impression that energy is the true cause rather than Allah. Similarly it is unIslamic to teach that mixing hydrogen and oxygen automatically produces water. The Islamic way is this: when atoms of hydrogen approach atoms of oxygen, then by the Will of Allah water is produced.” The implication is clear: next week, Allah may change his mind about water being a compound of hydrogen and oxygen. With this sort of worldview, how could one possibly be a scientist?
The cosmology of the Qur’an is obviously geocentric, and as a consequence, Al-Azhar University, which Obama singles out for praise in his speech, still teaches Ptolemaic astronomy.
There was one truly great “Muslim” physicist, the Nobel Prize winning Pakistani, Mohammed Abdus Salam. I put “Muslim” in quotes, because Salam belonged to the Ahmadi sect of Islam, a sect that accepts modern science. But in 1974, the Pakistani parliament declared the Ahmadi sect heretical, and its members are currently being persecuted in Pakistan. Contemporary Muslim historians generally do not list Salam as an important Muslim scientist. Had he remained in Pakistan, he quite possibly would have been killed.
During the Cold War, it was commonplace for leftist academics to attribute many discoveries to scientists in Communist countries, discoveries that had actually been made in the West. So now leftist academics attribute to Muslims discoveries that had actually been made by others.
I never expected to hear a president of the United States do so.
GIBBERISH
———
Indeed. One wonders at the sheer lunacy of living in a world where the fruits of mankind’s scientific endeavor are everywhere…and disbelieving in all of it.
Obama panders because that is what politicians do. .. Allah Akbar
GIBBERISH
———
Even if it’s true that the word ALGEBRA is derived from the Arabic Al-Jibr (meaning “transposition), it was the Persian Al-Khwarizmi (from whence we get “algorithm”) who first used the term.
Almost the entire “Arabic” scientific and philosophical “tradition” is fundamentally derivative from either the Greek or the Persian. This is also true to a great extent to the Arabic literary tradition and even the religious tradition.
The so-called “Arabian Nights” (actually, The Thousand and One Nights) has nothing to do with “Arabia”. The origins of this classic is in Persia (and ultimately in India).
Although many of what has come down to us of this work includes names of historical Caliphs (Harun Al-Rashid for example), there were later add-ons to the original text. Not only that but the “life” these Caliphs led in Baghdad was almost entirely based on Persian mores, tastes and traditions. The “connection” to the Arabian desert had long since vanished.
That is to say, much of the “Islamic greatness” during the Middle Ages is pure myth, fable and fantasy – and nostalgia.
Unfortuantely, most Westerners and particularly Americans fail to see any difference between “Persians” and “Arabs” or even Afghanis and Pakistanis. To most Americans, all these jailbirds are “the same”. That’s why it’s been so easy to hoist these fables on to Westerners as if they were true.
One of my favorite myths is that modern day Spanish has been heavily influenced by the Arabic language during the 700 years Arabic was in use in Spain.
This is completely untrue.
A close study of this subject will show that Spanish was barely touched by Arabic at the core.
It is true that many Arabic words entered Spanish during these Middle Ages, but they were specialized terms used in trades that no longer exist and have not existed for centuries (like alchemy, for example).
They no longer form part of the Spanish “word list” except in historical terms. No modern Spanish speaker would recognize them or know what they mean.
At the core level, Spanish was almost 100% immune from Arabic.
I know because I’m a fluent Spanish and Arabic speaker. I know of no single verb in modern Spanish that comes from Arabic (not even one !!!), no prepositions, no adverbs, only 1 or 2 adjectives and only a few nouns numbering no more than 50 or so THAT ARE IN COMMON USE. (yes, yes, alcohol comes from Arabic (altho it originally comes from Greek…did you know that? Bet you didn’t).
Therefore, to say that Arabic language, Islamic culture and so on had any but the most minimal impact on the development of Europe through the Rennaissance up until today, is, well, it’s laughable.
It all sounds nice, mysterious and nostalgic, but it is just not true.
From what I remember Muslims came up with the idea that dirt causes sickness. This notion is not correct, but the frequent washing was more useful than anything Europeans doctors did till the 1600 hundreds. Though I don’t know any any advances Muslims made in this area that was passed on to the west.
There is something that should not be ignored concerning Barack Obama’s historical illiteracy: he graduated from Harvard University. It’s about time more Americans realize the low ridiculously low standards of this vastly overrated academic institution. If Obama is supposedly one the winners—what are the losers like?
You never expected a President to denigrate his own country in order to embellish himself either.
This is a manifestation of the insecurity inside the man as he himself knows that he is a Pretender.
Once again, King Fraud’s amazing intellect begs the question: Is his biggest problem arrogance or ignorance?
At least Ronald Reagan knew the difference between being a B actor and governing the country. And he knew where one ended and the other began. He had actual, tested abilities and experience in BOTH. Soetero has abilities in neither and is getting his “experience” at our expense.
Soetero IS a Hollywood B movie with lousy writing and a very bad ending for the United States of America.
Can anybody else hear Rev. Wright echoing through Obama’s words?
Frank Tipler:
You’ve got too much free time in your hands.
Who cares?
Why am I not surprised that the self-proclaimed student of history is a shoddy student at best, getting most of his facts wrong in order to praise Islam. The President is nothing if not Politically Correct, and pumping up the historical credentials of “the Muslim world” is about as PC as you can get. He praises the tolerance of America for allowing Muslim women to wear the hajib, but doesn’t mention the subjugation of women in Muslim countries, where they have no choice not the wear the hajib. He says we can’t tell Iran that it can’t have nuclear power (the only kind of nuclear power Iran wants is the kind that comes in a bomb) but he has no trouble telling Israel that it must stop building settlements on the West Bank. All the while, people are telling The One how great and glorious he is, and he eats it up. What a phony jerk! The strength and weakness of democracy is rolled up into one sentence: In a democracy, the people get the kind of government they deserve. I only wish the American people deserved someone better than BHO.
#6. David Thomson:
“There is something that should not be ignored concerning Barack Obama’s historical illiteracy: he graduated from Harvard University. It’s about time more Americans realize the low ridiculously low standards of this vastly overrated academic institution …”
David, I believe more can be taken regarding the education of Obama than this. He was ‘elected’ president of the Harvard Law Review while attending law school. As he published no scholarly papers while attending serves to illustrate a left oriented bestowal of affirmative action election, much like November 2007. His educational shortcomings spill over to Columbia where he took his baccalaureate degree. He has demonstrated a severe lack of historical understanding coupled with incredible difficulties with mathematics.
Gee, with a recent high school graduate to send to university, are there any schools (Hillsdale notwithstanding) worth the expense?
Obama knows he bamboozled enough of the country to get himself elected. The pace and breadth of his lying and deception and thieving is without historic parallel. So what’s a few PC lies sprinkled around the world to propagate the leftist worldview? That ain’t nothin’ to him and he knows nobody will call him on it. He knows the state-controlled media here and the worldwide marxist media there cares not for the truth. It’s all about ideology and power.
We’re in deep doo-doo.
Hitler paved roads, and Mussolini made the trains run on time. Just like the Muslim world, and Mutual Funds, past performance is no indicator of the future.
Severing heads, arms, etc., the treatment of women, gays, Christians, Jews, etc.. That is the legacy of this cult.
vivo:
“Frank Tipler:
You’ve got too much free time in your hands.
Who cares?”
Are you a troll from the KOSby Kids or Huffy’s site? Or are you somebody worse? A squishy RINO who doesn’t think it matters that our President is either a psuedo-intellectual moron or a flat out liar (or both).
You may not care but I do. And I’m confident that a lot of other people in this country would care.
So, go back outside and play and let the grownups talk, okay?
wasn’t it the pagan Greeks who invented the university? Plato?
The problem with Obama is that he reads from the teleprompter what others have written – and he has no personal bonifides in research or common knowledge to realize that he is making himself look rather ignorant.
0 was also wrong in stating that Morocco was first in recognizing the United States. Barbara Tuchman wrote a book about a Dutch island being the first to recognize the country. It is entitled “The First Salute”.
“Can anybody else hear Rev. Wright echoing through Obama’s words?”
Man, talk about a brilliant insight. The Rev’s “preaching” is all over this melange’ of horse excrement. To give Islam the credit for legitimate study in the sciences and arts is a huge dishonor to the cultures and countries who did produce the intellects to develop these things.
It is also right up the alley of the fallacy of Black Liberation Theology, which has people believing Jesus Christ was a black man. Ridicule worthy if anything ever was. The saddest thing is, in discrediting the real discoverers, he (the Prez) not only disrespects them, but “us, U.S.” as Paul Harvey used to say. Us…U.S. Not so united, any longer.
How many more days of this numbskull’s administration? We’re doomed.
Oh, and Vivo…Latin for “within the living”…Ironic. I care, and you should too.
Mohammed’s biggest idea was to wed religious and military conquest into one entity. While other religions may have proved useful to spreading empire, Islam’s genius is to make it the one imperative. Plus they invented those wicked cool curved swords.
Sore-Toe-Ro didn’t get history wrong…not HIS version of it, anyway.
And let’s face it. Everyone here can know that the truth is different, but hey, you forget the first law of thermo-bloviation (aka the Washington, D.C., Premise):
A lie un-rebutted for 24 hours becomes the truth.
vivo:
Who cares?
Not nearly enough people. The emperor has no clothes. Stop emulating your hero, The Zero: don’t be a moron.
Without Islamic culture, the inventions noted by Obama may never have reached the West. Although China and Greece contributed some underlying knowledge, without Islamic centers of learning, the West would have lost all of these inventions to the dark ages. Islam made the Renaissance possible. Technicalities aside, Obama’s speech pointed out the basic truth that without Islam, the West would be vastly different, and intellectually impoverished.
Peace.
DS
10. vivo:
[Frank Tipler:
You’ve got too much free time in your hands.
Who cares?]
vivo, imbecil, estupido…
We care. You should too, but your little brain is not up to it.
Obama is an empty suit, a disgrace to this country.
I knew right away that some of his claims were ridiculous, especially the so-called Arabic numbers that have been used in India for thousands of years.
The Arabs and Muslim can’t even produce the arms with which they kill each other, nor a plane, a tank. They have invented nothing in hundreds of years of backwardness. The world is going around them in blitzkrieg fashion, and they don’t like it.
No mention by Barack Bin Obama about the daily atrocities committed in these God forsaken countries. The female genital mutilations, the beaheadings and beatings, the stoning, the throwing of acid on girls’eyes by the Taliban, the hanging of homosexuals. You, other liberals, and Fellow Travelers like Noam Chomsky, should live there LIKE THE PEOPLE THERE for a few months, and then comeback and tell us. Not in a Potemkin village, or some luxury hotel, like Shirley McLaine when she visited Mao, or Sean Penn, Robert Redford, Danny Glover, or Harry Belafonte when they visit that bloody murderer Fidel Castro.
No, live in Havana with the people and stay for an extended visit on Castro’s Gulag, you a.. h…,
#12 Terry
Have your graduate look at Grove City College. Great school. Tough to get in but they provide a REAL education for those get in.Incredibly low cost too. My two kids went there, both are on full scholarships in graduate programs(medicine, molecular biology)because they well prepared.
What David S wrights is accurate, while our forebears were taring down Roman ruins to build hovels, the Caliphate was preserving the knowledge of the past. As far as creating? Maybe not so much, but they did preserve much of what the rebirth of europe is based upon. That being said, Islam was at it’s most triumphant when it was MOST tolerant . . . Islam faltered and became corrupt when it became insular
The four centuries of ceaseless warfare between the Byzantine (Eastern-Roman) Empire and the Sassanid Persian Empire in the 6th and 7th centuries had weakened both empires. It was at this unfortunate juncture that the Muslim Arabs pounced on both empires in fourth decade of the 7th century (641 C.E.).
After their conquest of the Byzantine provinces of Jordan, Syria, Lebanon, and Palestine (today’s Israel), they invaded Egypt in December 641 C.E.
The persecuted Copts were the original inhabitants. Egypt, before the Islamic invasion was not an Arab country.
Many of us are under a mistaken impression that Egyptians are Arabs. Mohammed Atta, the ringleader of the 9/11 attacks who led a group of Arabs was an Egyptian. So also was the Cairo born Yasser Arafat, who deceived the world by posing as a Palestinian. Both these scoundrels certainly considered themselves to be Arabs, as do the millions of Egyptians today.
But little do they realize that apart from the few Arab invaders who traumatized Byzantine ruled Egypt in the 7th century, none of them are descendants of Bedouin Arabs. They descend from the Pharaohs (Firaun) who built the classic Egyptian civilization along the Nile valley in beautiful cities like Luxor, Memphis, Karnak and Thebes.
http://www.historyofjihad.org/egypt.html
Dare I say something is missing? The great Greeks, Persians, Romans did their work mainly in the period now know as B.C. (Before Christ). Islam did not come into creation until The Year of Our Lord 500 or there abouts. Things discovered prior to 500 A.D. cannot be credited to a movement that started after they were discovered. Unless you apply the Politically Correct formula; things did not happen unti the right group could claim them; should tht group not claim them the press will do it for them.
Islam was wealthy and rich when Europe was poor, true.
No mention of the continual aggression of Islam against Christian Europe, which was not reversed until the lifting of the siege of Vienna in 1683.
No mention of the massive slave trade of Christian slaves for the Muslim lands, which lasted for centuries. Slave ships even sailed as far North as Ireland. Cervantes was a slave for a while, for example.
Most Islamic scholarship was done by non-Muslims living under Muslim rule or my recent converts. Islam crushes free thinking.
Anybody who studies Islam, and especially its impact on the Europe, can only come to one conclusion: A disaster.
If Mr. Obama wants to use historical fictions to support a diplomatic mission, I’m willing to give him a pass. I don’t see much reason either to denigrate Arab or Islamic culture during an epoch known as the Age of Faith. It’s true that Christian monasteries preserved classical learning during the middle ages, but it’s not like Christian scholars (with a few exceptions) were doing any original thinking of their own.
I’m rather more interested in weighing Obama’s rhetoric in public against his tactics in private. It’s been reported by various CEO’s here at home that in private the president can be a bully. I can only hope that his tough guy side comes out when dealing privately with foreign enemies. I’m starting to see for the first time that perhaps our new president has at least one quality that could make of him a statesman. Does this mean I trust him? I’m totally opposed to his domestic agenda. But I’ll wait to judge his foreign policy on the success or failure of his actions. The rest it seems to me is “just words.”
David S. –Peace
Don’t you mean submission?
You cold-hearted neoneanderthals. Copernicus was a cultural imperialist, because he thought that his Polish heliocentrism was somehow better than Greek geocentrism. The Greeks put the earth in the middle, because the loved it. And Muslim science must have been great, because European Christians were bad people.
President Obama is no different from any other liberal Leftist: They rewrite the past to suit themselves. When rewritten, the new past is completely distorted as reality is turned upside down much like Alice in her adventures in Wonderland & Through the Looking Glass where logic is thrown to the four winds for madness.
Pandering does not make a good politician, but standing by one’s beliefs under any circumstances makes a good politician & good person. Obama has no mores & will reshape himself depending upon his audience.
I’m stuck on the algebra thing. After reading the article, I’m still not convinced. What’s the source?
(For those who want to know, I am a regular reader of PJM and have been since its founding).
More interesting, and completely verifiable, though, is the fact that there have been no advances from the Muslim world in the last 1000 years.
(I just want a president who tells the Saudis to kiss off.)
JCinOBX: I just posted your brilliant “thermal bloviation” remark on Twitter. Brilliant dude!
Yes, the Renaissance, the Age of Exploration, the Enlightenment, Freemasonry and the Industrial Revolution would have been impossible w/o the Islamic transmittal of knowledge. Islam conceived not only the idea of the university but Muslims first instituted tenure and the faculty lounge too.
This could be the answer to why Obama, his wife and Sotomayor are such angry people.It appears that they went to these prestigious Ivy League Colleges and came out with a less that great education.Obama knows nothing of history, his wife is so tee’d off she does nothing but sneer, and Sotomayer can’t read (her statements on the Constitution.).It’s going to be a long haul before things get better.
Student of history. The US has 58 states and the Japanese nuked Pearl Harbor. Priceless and useless.
A lot of Arab knowledge was passed from India by traders. The zero is the least of it, though most visible and universally acknowledged. In terms of universities (as we understand the term today), Takshashila (Taxila) started in 7c. BC. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Universities_of_India
Reply to 23. David S:
“Without Islamic culture, the inventions noted by Obama may never have reached the West. Although China and Greece contributed some underlying knowledge, without Islamic centers of learning, the West would have lost all of these inventions to the dark ages. Islam made the Renaissance possible. Technicalities aside, Obama’s speech pointed out the basic truth that without Islam, the West would be vastly different, and intellectually impoverished.”
What caused the Dark Ages? It was the conquests of the Arabs (Muslims) which destroyed so much of the classical world. Since they conquered Greek areas, it is no wonder that some lovers of learning translated Greek classics into Arabic – which would have been unnecessary had the Arabs not conquered Greek areas. When the Turks (Muslims) conquered Constantinople in 1453, the Greek scholars fled with their manuscripts to Italy.
Oh, please. The First or Medieval Renaissance of the 12th-13th centuries it’s true was sparked, in great part, by the capture of Moorish libraries in Spain, where classical writings survived in translation.
But the Second or Great Renaissance was sparked largely by Byzantine refugees from conquering Isalm, bringing with them the classical learning which Constantinople had never forgotten.
More to the point: we Westerners, descendants as most of us are from the hirsute Teutonic barbarians who destroyed the Western Empire, nonetheless never covered up our debt to the Greeks, Romans and others, nor falsely claimed those advances as our own. The Muslims in this regard are like the Soviets.
pres. Hopenchange-
America has over 7 million Muslims and is the largest Muslim country in the world!
Truth-
America has approx. 2.5 million Muslims but 7 million sounds much better in front of an Islamic audience.
Fake but Accurate.
I have a hard time buying into the argument that Islam ought to be given credit for preserving knowledge. The Arabs conquered peoples who valued learning. They allowed those people to continue with their pursuit of scholarly activities (mostly because they utterly lacked the cultural mechanisms necessary to run the civilizations they conquered). I suppose if the Arab armies had never conquered anyone outside of Arabia, it is possible that the centers of learning in Egypt or Persia or India would have fallen into backwardness like much of Europe did post-Rome. Then again it is possible that those regions could have advanced forward on their own. One can argue that we’re lucky that any knowledge survived the Islamic occupation. Despite having all this knowledge for hundreds of years, the Islamic world didn’t really make any substantial advances in any field, nor any great new discoveries. And yet, as soon as Europe awakens from it’s collective hangover, huge new strides are made in many fields. As backwards as they are, it isn’t a surprise that Pakistan, and soon, Iran, are the first Islamic nuclear powers, while the Arab world, despite all their money, cannot make such a breakthrough. It isn’t a surprise that China and India have rapidly advanced while the Arab world stagnates. Had the Arabs not had the good fortune of sitting on top of the largest oil reserves in the world, they’d be about where Mongolia is today. I will not buy into cultural relativism–their values as a culture are simply not compatible with modern civilization and are not compatible with advances in any area of knowledge or art. We need look no further than their continued insistence of taking away the rights of women–any culture that automatically removes half the population from making any contribution is handicapping itself from the start. There are plenty of other wrong headed ideas they subscribe to, but until they address that most basic problem, lets not hear anything about their contributions to the world.
So, the one is as much a “student of history” as he is a “constitutional lawyer”. He seems to have a very well rounded education.
24. MiamaMan writes:
“..Obama is an empty suit, a disgrace to this country. I knew right away that some of his claims were ridiculous, especially the so-called Arabic numbers that have been used in India for thousands of years.”
Miama, after reading (enduring) the flaccid rhetoric that he spews from the teleprompters onto his mystified audience, one is compelled to regard his butt-smooching platitudes as the modern-day equivalent of nascent PC speech like, “Ummm, some of my best friends are negroes.”
Ask any devout Muslim about the achievements of Muslims and you will get a similar list of dubious accolades. The only person who would spin these lies about the great accomplishments of Muslims is an idiot or another Muslim.
There have been a lot of lapses in Obama’s history. A few no one is talking about from this speech:
“In the middle of the Cold War, the United States played a role in the overthrow of a democratically elected Iranian
government.”
Never mind the details right Barack? Never mind Iran’s nascent ties to Germany before WWII, never mind that the Soviets and Britain invaded Iran during WWII, and there were Soviet as well as Western agents in Iran well after WWII – all trying to protect their own interests. Never mind that Dr. Mosaddeq demanded control of the military in Iran at one point, never mind that Dr. Mosaddeq resigned at one point. Never mind that Dr. Mosaddeq bypassed Iranian Parliament by conducting a national referendum to win approval for its dissolution. Never mind that Dr. Mosaddeq was supported by the Communist Party in Iran…..Those are little details that do not serve Barack’s purposes of belittling the United States and blaming our policies for all of the ills in the world today.
“For centuries, black people in America suffered the lash of the whip as slaves and the humiliation of segregation. But it was not violence that won full and equal rights.”
Well, the US Civil War did not win “full and equal” rights, but it certainly was violent, and it was a stepping stone for full and equal rights, and a bloody one as well. And so were the riots throughout the 1960′s for equal rights. Justifiably I add. But it is still shoddy history and the President should no better, and does, it’s just hard to kiss Arab butts with complete and detailed history of the United States.
And if you want more, check his remarks about “Andalucia and Cordoba”. He was just wrong by several centuries, and about several statements… It has ‘insulted’ and upset quite a few Spaniards
Thank you Frank Tipler. Your article is typical of what this wonderful site is capable of producing.
vivo,
Your cowardly surrender is noted.
What Bohemond said ….
Let us never forget that without the Islamic Caliphate, goats would not have survived in the numbers that now exist. Muslims, through their superior breeding methods, made it so the average goat thrives and grows on compact dusty un-arid soil. The next time you are in a cozy wine cave in the Loire Valley, sipping on fine red wine and nibbling on a plate of goat cheese, remember that.
Let’s face it: If Obama were a truly educated person, he’d stop pontificating and declaiming and expounding upon every subject that comes into his purview. The true mark of educated people is that they’re painfully aware of how little they know, of how far their ignorance extends, and of the infinitude of things they’ve never even heard of. Intellectual humility is what sets off educated people from know-it-alls.
Our president is a know-it-all. One of the best things he could do for himself and the American people is to restrict his appearances on TV. The constant stream of speeches and interviews — and his constant need for adulation — almost guarantee that he’ll deliver a constant stream of boners, blunders, and bungles. As Josh Billings, one of the sagest of all Americans, once said, “Silence is a hard argument to refute.”
Mr. Tipler’s post was a joy to read, not only because it’s beautifully written but because it’s written by a genuinely educated man. All the best posts on the internet do two things: they provide information and they provoke thought. Mr. Tipler’s does both. Thanks to Pajamas Media for printing it.
The black man invented the stop light! Read that and weep, whitey!!
Just as the Muslims erected the Abomination of Desolation on the Temple Mount in Jerusalem so the voters of the United States of America have placed the Abomination of Desolation in the White House, a liar in chief, an appeaser in chief or apologist in chief. The LIC says he’s not Muslim during the campaign but now he might as well be the defender of the Muslim faith for all of his words.
The effect of the Abomination of Desolation on Jerusalem was to leave it’s Churches and Synagogues empty for more than a thousand years turning the area into wasteland. How’s that for an historical accomplishment? The LIC left that off the list. What makes anyone think that the result will be any different this time? We are witnessing the systematic destruction of all that is American including the rule of law mostly derived from Anglo Saxon Law and Mosaic Law. Now of course the Christians and Jews must go, their traditional laws are antiquated and out of touch with today’s so called realities. Facts don’t matter to the LIC. What matters is how fast can he undo the work of our forefathers who are predominantly Christian and inspired by the Spirit of God to do great things.
Is Sharia Law the answer to our modern problems? No. This is all about the control of destinies and the desolaters never seem to realize that for them there is no way out. Their time has been fixed and there is no escape. Like fools on a stage running through the same act over and over again trying to get it right believing that this time things are different. In a way things are different now, because now there is no more time for fools. The clock has run out.
I’m surprised at the silence of China about these inventions. I thought they were proud of the Four Great Inventions, paper, gunpoweder, printing, and magnetic compass. The muslim world just appropriated two of the Great Inventions, and I don’t hear a peep. I’m really surprised about that.
Yes, I said, “muslim world”. I meant it, too. Over one billions, and not one muslim will point out the fact that muslims didn’t invent those things. I’ll admit, in their own homes they have different clothes, different foods, and different languages. But, when it comes to conquering other people, land, and ideas, they all march in lockstep.
I’m sure others have noticed this as well: Obama says he is a Christian, yet he never defends Christianity,says America is not a Christian nation, says that America would be one of the largest Muslim nations,endlessly extols the virtues of Islam, barely criticizes the atrocities committed in the name of Islam, takes a hard line towards that “oppressor nation” Israel,boasts of his Muslim roots,the list could go on. A Muslim’s first loyalty is to his religion.
When one is venerated as The One, all manner of outlandish proclamations are possible. Hence, Muslims are the new inventors of things once attributed to its real inventors, but no longer are.
Obama is not only the Commander-In-Chief, he is the Revisionist-In-Chief.
In the same vein, he was able-with a poker straight face, and at times a wagging finger-to declare that Islam is a religion of peace, and that Islam is not at war with the west.As if.
Further, it is an open secret that getting into Harvard is the hard part. (As for our Dear Leader, there are serious indicators that he needed Saudi help to gain his hallowed entrance, but I digress)However, once admitted each and every student can take as many fluffy, ridiculous courses, yet still garner that coveted degree. In fact, the profs inflate the grades to such a ridiculous degree, that high school is where the real heavy lifting took place for most of these students.
As a matter of record, true scholarship is really accomplished across the Charles at MIT.Now, I know that Harvard snobs poke fun at the nerds across the river, but the fact of the matter is that most of them would collapse under the rigorous weight of an MIT workload.
Whereas MIT & Harvard students are allowed to cross register, I know that my son sought relief from a crushing workload at MIT by taking a humanities course at the venerated Harvard.
Therefore, the next time one opines about the brilliance of The One, trotting out his Harvard pedigree, and his mid college acceptance to Columbia, I defy them to state that he would have survived at the powerhouse across the river.
No wonder he flunks history,having been subjected to Columbia indoctrination & then Harvard fluffery, albeit at its law school, where activism via the law trumps legal precedent.
The title of this chapter from the online essay series “Islamic Expansion and Decline” says it all:
http://islamicexpansionanddecline.blogspot.com/2007/04/chapter-11-parasitic-civilization.html
Myth of the Western Debt to Islam
A persistent misconception, the debt western science and scholarship owes to Islam, has afflicted historians for many years, although never more so than at the present time. The historian Herbert Muller, writing at a time when academic candor was still common, debunks the belief in the preservation and transmission of science under Islam, as well as a few other widely cherished myths.
For the sake of understanding … I should say flatly that these high-minded apologists for Islam are talking about a fiction or a dream. The religion preached by Mohammed, and thereafter practiced in his name, is quite different from the Islam they describe. The prophet had nothing of the scientific outlook, and demanded absolute obedience to the law that he alone laid down. Islam never produced a democracy or a state in which the people were actually sovereign. In all states, past and present, economic inequality has been glaring. Its holy wars fought on principle, its degradation of women, and its formal acceptance of slavery make nonsense of its theoretical principle of equality, or any profession of universal human brotherhood.[91]
Other historians and philosophers echo Professor Muller’s viewpoint. Charles Burnett writing in The Cambridge Companion to Arabic Philosophy refutes the belief that it was the Arabs who re-transmitted Plato’s Republic to Europe. “The Republic of Plato, though translated into Arabic, was not subsequently translated into Latin.”[92] Frederick Copleston in his History of Philosophy says that “it is a mistake to imagine that the Latin scholastics were entirely dependent upon translations from Arabic or even that translation from the Arabic always preceded translation from the Greek.” Moreover, “translation from the Greek generally preceded translation from the Arabic.”[93] Another historian of philosophy Peter Dronke concurs:
Note that Latin versions of a number of learned Greek works (Euclid, Ptolemy) came through translations from the Arabic; most of the works of Aristotle, however, were translated directly from the Greek, and only exceptionally by way of an Arabic intermediary…translations from the Arabic must be given their full importance, but not more. Another confirmation comes from Dod, according to whom the following were first translated from Greek: Categories, De interpretatione, Prior Analytics, Posterior Analytics, Topics, Sophistici elenchi, Physics, De generatione et corruptione, Meteorologica (Book IV), De anima, De sensu, De memoria, De somno, De longitudine, De inventute, De respiratione, De morte, De animalibus (De progressu, De motu), Metaphysics, Nicomachean Ethics, Eudemian Ethics, Politics, Oeconomica, Rhetoric, Rhetorica ad Alexandrum, and Poetics. Only the following were first translated from Arabic: De caelo, Meteorologica (Books I-III), and De animalibus (Historia, De partibus, De generatione).[94]
Furthermore, as Franz Rosenthal points out, many of the works translated from the Arabic were not the work of Muslims. “Aristoteles latinus” by Bernard Dod, a chapter of The Cambridge History of Later Medieval Philosophy, provides a comprehensive list of medieval translations of Aristotle from Arabic into Latin, none by Islamic scholars—unless by “Islamic” one means “Christian or Jewish.”[95] Indeed, in Islamic Spain it was Jewish scholars who were instrumental in translating Greek knowledge into Latin.[96] Carson sums up the reality of the translation process as follows:
So the great rescue of Greek philosophy by translation into Arabic turns out to mean no rescue of Plato and the transmission of Latin translations of Arabic translations of Greek texts of Aristotle, either directly or more often via Syriac or Hebrew, to a Christendom that already had the Greek texts and had already translated most of them into Latin, with almost all of the work of translation from any of these languages into any other having been done by Christians and Jews and none of it by Muslims.[97]
Moreover, the most important preservers and transmitters of classical knowledge were not Muslims, or even dhimmis working in Muslim lands. While much has been made of Muslim Spain as a transmitter of ancient Greek knowledge to the West few have remarked on how the Byzantines transmitted Greek knowledge to Muslims and non-Muslims alike. The 11th century Byzantine scholar Psellus “remarked at the height of his career that Celts, Arabs, Persians and Ethiopians came to Constantinople to hear his lectures.”[98] And it was these same Byzantines, who at the time of the tragic destruction of their city, brought this knowledge to the West. As the famous historian Steven Runciman observes:
…these refugee Greek scholars … took trouble to collect and copy the Greek manuscripts that Byzantium had preserved. … It was from these scholars… that the men of the Renaissance learnt most of their philosophy. … They conserved ancient books … and transmitted what they had conserved for the benefit of European civilization.[99]
Here are the Muslim medical contributors. Dr. Ayman Al-Zawahiri , (a surgeon by night, his day job is mastermind of al Qaeda “operations”)
Dr. Abu Hafiza, (a psychiatrist from Morocco who provided “counseling” to the 9/11 bunch)
Dr. Abdel Aziz Al-Rantisi ( the unlamented late Hamas leader who was a pediatrician)
Dr. Mahmoud Al-Zahar (a surgeon who also does “operations” for Hamas)
Dr. Fathi Abd Al-Aziz Shiqaqi, (another pediatrician and founder of Islamic Jihad)
the late (too late) Dr. George Habash (founder and chief of the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine, another pediatrician whose work for kiddies included bombing a school bus loaded with them)
Dr. Wadih Haddad who was (second in command to Habash in the PFLP) to say nothing of the dozens of docs who were involved in terrorist plots in England and the US
On the other hand there appear to have been Muslim contributors to medicine.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_medicine
Crediting Islam and Muslims for the discoveries and innovations of Western civilization is akin to crediting a thief for “earning” the stolen loot he has amassed. The various putative “Golden Ages of Islam” (invasion of Spain, invasion of Persia, invasion of India, invasion of Byzantium), can all be better understood as the heinous looting of superior civilizations by an inferior terroristic one. These “golden” periods only lasted as long as the accumulated stolen treasuries and treasures of those non-Islamic civilizations lasted. Once the loot ran out – Islam universally foundered and left behind the shattered husks of former (pre-Islamic) greatness.
To see what Islam truly did to those former great civilizations, at least those which were unable to eject the cancer of Islam (Spain, for example) one needs only to look at festering sewers such as Iran (formerly Persia), Turkey (formerly Byzantium), or India. THAT is the legcay of Islam.
Today the enemies of the West include Leftists and Muslims. Together they perpetrate the lie of Islamic contributions to science, Islamic Golden Ages, and Islamic peacefulness and tolerance to forward their respective efforts to subvert, defame, and ultimately destroy the Western edifice. Obama is their greatest achievement and their greatest proponent.
But who invented the WMD?????
Basically Islam took knowledge from
conquered civilizations and now takes credit
for inventing it. If they preserved some
of it they certainly did not utilize it
effectively.
Also ignored is the role of Constantinople
as a repository of ancient knowledge in the
Eastern Roman Empire that lasted until
the 15th century. Much of what the Muslims
now take credit for arrived in the West
through refugees of the Islamic violence
against that entity.
Maybe Obama should thank them for destroying
Constantinople and also for totally destroying
the library at Alexandria. Yes they did!
Also remember Greek was the language of
Byzantium. Once Islam becomes dominant
stagnation follows.
From the article: “The implication is clear: next week, Allah may change his mind about water being a compound of hydrogen and oxygen. With this sort of worldview, how could one possibly be a scientist?”
..from a Professor of Mathematical Physics, the author of “The Physics of Immortality” and “The Physics of Christianity”. The latter of which carries the following editorial review on Amazon:
“After a cogent description of modern physics, Tipler embarks on a crusade to prove that God exists, that miracles are physically possible and the virgin birth and the bodily resurrection of Jesus do not defy scientific laws. The author’s arguments are somewhat intriguing—his knowledge of science seems exhaustive and this may attract other scientists to consider the importance of religion. Many of his theological insights, however, are problematic. Dubbing Christianity a “science” does not automatically make it so, and Tipler seems to dismiss the centuries-old importance of the apophatic tradition in Christianity, that is, approaching the mystical nature of the Divine by positing what cannot be said about God. Tipler’s interest in integrating science and religion is noble, but his method is uneven.”
Don’t get me wrong, I’m sure this makes complete sense to the author and several Christians. Struck me as funny.
Why does this guy think he can just say something to any group that he speaks before and really just make stuff up. Like the 58 states he spoke of in the campaign, and save or create such and such number of jobs. None of it make sense and it is as though he just pulls number out of thin air and presents them as the truth. Does he not know or even care that what he says can be checked pretty fast?
I do not understand how his poll number could be as they are, which are down over 1.2 percentage points in the last few days. It could be that people are finally seeing him for the liar that he is.
C’mon, we all know the muslims invented the
- “journalist slit-throat”
(that is a radical improvement over the journalist-to-Siberia of the commies)
- women’s ‘amputations’
(that is a radical improvement over generic sexism)
- silent holocaust i.e., attacking Israel from four sides and then complaining about Israel’s …survival
(that is an improvement over generic anti-semitism)
- masked invasion (migrating to the West by the tens of millions and then complaining for the West’s …racism)
and, most importantly, they improved the Gott mit uns (God is with us) etched on the German Army belt buckles by introducing the
- portable allahu akbar, that can be delivered together with car-bombs, planes, buses, pizzerias, in an EXPLOSION of theoretical theology.
Thank you for the opportunity to comment.
I don’t expect the president of the U.S. to be an expert on Islamic history. All George W. Bush knew was that it was a “religion of peace.” Obama told a speechwriter to find complimentary things to say about Islam so he’d get a better reception for non-groveling parts of the speech.
I excerpt the news for my husband, who doesn’t read newspapers. I told him Obama had made a speech “to the Muslim world.”
“Did he say it was a religion of peace?” he asked.
“Yes. And they invented algebra.”
“Won’t that make American kids hate Islam?”
What is true is that the Islamic world helped keep alive certain bodies of knowledge. It was not just the Muslims, but the Hindus, the idependent monastries of the Celtic Christians in Britain, Ireland and Western France, the coptic Christians of Egypt and Ethiopia, the Nazarenes of Armenia and of course The Jews that kept alive mathematics, art, history, the healing arts, the natural sciences.
Most of what Obama credited the Muslim for was actually around before Islam came on the scence. But let’s be fair, at least the Muzzas saw the value of those things. The mainstream Christians would have destroyed all knowledge (they burned the library of Alexandria, the greatest repository of literature in the ancient world because it contained stuff that “was not of God”) The real forces for darkness in this world have been The Roman Empire and Roman Catholic / Protestant Christianity, the Romans because they were control feaks and the Chistians because they knew the value of keeping their congeregation in ignorance.
So yeah, Obama is an imbecile when it comes to history but no more an imbecile than many people. History just isn’t taught properly any more.
All Bush said was what his wahhabbi masters told him to say. After all, by Bush’s admission, all that matters in politics are:
- Money (Saudis have plenty of that).
- votes (Americans can be fooled out of their votes).
So, after the elections, Americans were no use and what better to sell America to those who matter:
- Al Sauds for funding his failed businesses.
- Corporations for dunfing his campaigns.
Notice Bush did no tbreath a word about immigration until he got elected.Right after winning the election, Bust started ramming the ‘Guest Worker Program’ down America’s thorat, making sure that the southern borders were open for his campaign-financers to use the cheap illegal-immigration labor. Ofcourse, Bush connieved with a few lies that Americans lapped up:
- Mexican family values.
- Jobs Americans don’t do.
All Bush was doing was to pay back the corporations who financed his campaigh. So what if he had to grant immunity to a mexican drug-dealer to prosecute deligent border patrol agents?
Oh, and so what if a few lies about WMDs can eleminate Al-Sauds enemy? So what if it costed American billions of tax-dollars/American blood and lives?
Again, you see, all that matters in politics are:
- Money.
- Votes.
it’s 2012 for the rest of us- what year are you living in?
Is Bush running for Prez again? I must have missed that
Addition to the list of non-inventions of Arab Muslims that President Obama mentioned as their inventions: the pen. The pen is thousands of years old, used to write on papyrus (from pre-Islamic Egypt) and parchment. No one knows who invented it. Did Obama ever read any of the Greek classics – Homer’s Iliad, the dramas of Aristophanes, Aeschylus, Euripides, Sophocles, the philosophical works of Plato, Aristotle, et al? How were they written down?
This man is an embarrassment to the nation. Right before the world we have laid bare the core corruption of educational standards of Columbia University and Harvard University. And it is disastrous that we are enacting, on the world stage, the kind of “self-esteem” regimen that is well entrenched in our public education system. Specifically, we are trying to build up the self-esteem” of the Muslims by falsely attributing to them accomplishments that are not theirs – much as the educators in our school systems do to the kids in their charge. And what have been the fruits of this ridiculous philosophy inside our own country? Two generations of kids who feel entitled to certain rewards in life without properly earning them. It makes them aggressive and narcissistic. It institutionalizes their behavior and incompetence.
No mention from Obama of the flourishing trade in black slaves which existed for centuries before Britain and America put a stop to it? Come to think of it, is there any recorded case of a leftist “academic” criticizing either the African or Muslim slave trade, which was comprised of everything from indentured servitude to hard labor to child sacrifice? Or will such cultures only ever be praised for their dubious “contributions” to the world?
yes, Obama graduated from Harvard. Affirmative action, What else do you need to say. From whatI read he was an underachiever in high school. Didn’t Bush gradaute from Yale. a prestigious school and that proves your alma mater does not reflect your intellect. Obama’s deviation from intellect is obvious in his saying we are no longer just a Christian but also may also be one of the World’s largest Muslim nations. First of all, we were never just a Christian nation. In spite of the dipping in vats of Indian children to rid them of their parasites and sending them to boarding schools to become as the Christians viewed it, humanized, we were still fighting a war with non Christians in the alte 18OO’s Immigrants have brought their ideologies with them from with Asia (China) since our nation was in it’s infancy. Wasn’t New York the site of both many Chinese laundries and street gangs. Of course we have never been just a Christian nation, but what has become of majority rules. If Obama believes what he proclaims then why didn’t he nominate a qualified Muslim female to the Supreme Court. Shouldn’t our high court consist of justices that represent all the people. When Sotomayor is seated we will have five Catholics (Christians ) on the high court. That is enough to prove to me we are still a Christian nation. Obama is a man of eloquent words and when people listen to his spin facts are irrelevant it seems. Of course, if we let it be sublimally suggested and people scarf it up maybe we will be converted to a Muslim nation where the ideology not the majority rules. In that sense maybe we “could be” (become}one of the world’s largest Muslim nations.
There is the apparent assumption running through this thread that the period between the fall of the Western Roman Empire in 476 AD and the rise of Medieval Europe in the 12th-13th centuries was one of unmitigated barbarity with a loss of most if not all classical knowledge in western Europe; that a reboot of civilization awaited the reintroduction of classical knowledge preserved in the Islamic east.
The Eastern Roman, or Byzantine, Empire centered in Constantinople remained a repository of classical knowledge until its fall in 1453. The Church, western and Orthodox, with its monastic tradition, remained a repository of classical knowledge through this entire period. In other words, the knowledge was always there and little if any was actually imported from the Islamic east that wasn’t already there. What was lacking in this period was the settled civil society which finally took root in the western half of Europe in the 12t-13th centuries which would capitalize on the knowledge never really lost.
Preservation of classical knowledge by the early Islamic world is properly lauded. The assertion that the rise of Western European civilization is predicated on preservation of knowledge by Islamic scholars is dubious.
Muslim control of a society is guaranteed to halt progress and punish most attempts to advance. Giving them credit for contributions they did not make is no different than giving them nations they did not found or develop, giving them status in the financial world by virtue of oil they did nothing to find or to create the means and methods of recovering it. Basically, the Muslim world exists only on what it has been given by others or stolen from others as the Somali pirates now show. Islam has always supported the idea of piracy and robbery from those who are not Muslim. Giving them credit for being anything other than brigands and barbarians is proof that there are is no longer a majority of true scholars within academia. Instead, it’s populated by those who for the most part can do nothing else, and for the most part badly want to punish those who succeed just as Islamic doctrine and society does.
A large part of the anger and hatred of the West has less to do with their Islamic beliefs since it’s mainly hatred of those who dare show the world that Islamic nations are now and always have been backward an proud of it.
Regards
With all the wisdom attributed to Muslims by Obama, it is quite likely they will comprehend the use of toilet paper (rather than one’s hand) by no later than the end of the present century.
Holly Crap – what would you expect. The speach wasn’t intended to be a history lesson. I was intended to open a dialog with the people. What would you have the man do – insult them???
“As a student of history”: scholars produce citations and evidence in support of positions they assert. In the President’s case there are none. We are to take him at his word, because he said so. Scholars have a term for such conduct. “Ipse dixit”; which means, It’s so because I said so. In the same manner he is trampling on consitutional safeguards without any recognition But he “taught constitutional law” at Harvard. His knowledge of history is as seriously and dangerously flawed as is his knowledge of constitutional law. His nominee for the U S Supreme court has been chosen for her “empathy”, “a wise Latina woman” but hardly for her knowledge of the United States Constitution, the founding document of the United States of America. President Obama is conducting himself not as a president of a constitutional republic, but rather as the embodiment of executive, legislative and judicial power rolled into one. He is intolerant of any view other than his own.
Thanks, Dr. Tipler. It is hard enough to teach kids about science without having to carry the extra baggage of political re-education, too.
“Obama Flunks History at Cairo U”
Pretty much everything he said falls into one of two categories.
1. Bald-faced lie.
2. Gross distortion.
But, hey, he’s a liberal Democrat. That’s what they do.
The Allies removed the Shah in WWII because he was pro-Nazi… then the various factions inside Iran went at it with the Communists nearly coming to power and the Shah’s son was re-installed at the head of government.
That was a re-installation of the ‘traditional’ government in the Cold War.
Aren’t we supposed to respect those?
Dear President said we can’t ‘impose’ democracy!
Yup! So what’s the complaint about post-WWII re-installing the Shah, then?
Iraq, OTOH, went from province of Empire to province of Empire to general mess with appointed rule to one-party rule to strong man rule to dictatorship and can’t be said to have a ‘traditional’ government type from that. So the people voted on what they wanted… if they don’t want it they can also vote it out.
And which one do we hear about with the complaints of democracy? Iran!
And which do we hear about ‘imposed democracy’? Iraq!
Way to twist history, Mr. ‘student of history’ President Obama!
What always chaps my rear is when Muslims are credited with “preserving the light of learning” during the so-called Dark Ages (a term which many real historians are now reconsidering)
The story painted is that learning was completely lost in stupid Christian dominated Europe and, apparently, that people rooted around like animals, dressed in animal skins grunting at one another until the Muslims invaded Spain and raised up learned Christians who then spread the “light of learning” once again in Europe. According to this story we owe all of our progress in science and learning to the Muslims. If it hadn’t been for them, we would still be living in caves thanks to ol’ anti-learning Christianity.
But…it was in fact Christian monks who valued learning so much that they preserved countless priceless texts from classical times. All through the so-called Dark Ages, Christian monks copied those texts and taught others how to do the same. Many, if not all, were literate and were also scholars. Christian schools, whether attached to cathedral or monastery taught reading and writing to boys of all classes and backgrounds (although education was obviously far from universal)
Long story short, Christians preserved the light of learning on our own quite well without any Islamic contributions. Did Muslims make contributions? Yes. Are they due all the credit? Hell no.
Conversely, what happened to Islam’s so-called Golden Age once all the classical learning had been obtained and the learned pre-Islamic cultures of Byzantium, Persia,and India were used up an thrown away and their populations reduced to pathetic remnants. The light of learning went completely out just like a fire goes out when all the wood is gone.
And what about tolerance. In spite of many attempts to eliminate minorities in Europe no pogrom was ever pursued to the point where Europe was denuded of all its minority groups. There has never been a point in our history where Jews have not lived in substantial numbers through out the continent. Same for other minorities. And yet it is only Muslim lands where almost perfect homogeneity has realized, where Jews can be counted on hand and where Christians measure in fractions of a percent of the population. In the mean time it is only in Christian dominated lands where minorities enjoy true equality as opposed to some kind of tenuous tolerance.
So bullshit, Barack. Way to kiss the ass of these cretins and puff them up even more with hot air.
If you include Muslims who tend to take their religion a smidgen further than moderates, Barack could credit them for items such as clothing accessories, like the halter bomb and the suicide belt.
They also invented headless videos.
Rape rooms.
Mass anti-cartoon demonstrations.
Slovenliness.
Sherab (67)
Should have read your comment before writing mine. Sorry.
We don’t know how to convert idiocy into electricity, at least not in the western tradition, but the process by which a critical mass of idiocy can be converted into tyranical power has been known for some time. It may not be just to credit Islam for this breakthrough, but they are well practiced nevertheless.
The rise of Obama to the US presidency could well be the logical ramification his election to the presidency of his Harvard student class. Political correctness was always the key to political disaster, but we had to wait for Obama for the linkage to become obvious.
We are going to either prove or disprove, experimentally, the first corollary of the thermobloviation principle, which says: Any burst of hubris not estinguished in 4 years or less qualifies for catastrophic status.
#63 – who invented the WMD?
i’d like to second that heheheheeh
I didn’t see anyone talking about the intelligence of our last president. In addition, is it UN-AMERICAN to bash our president? IF SO, then most of these comments are UN-AMERICAN. I am happy that OUR president seems not to be petty but see that there is a bigger picture called the WORLD.
“But who invented the WMD?????”
That in fact, perhaps we can attribute to the Muslims. One of the first and successful uses of biological warfare was at the siege of Caffa, in 1346. The Muslim army had been hit with the Black Death. They used trebuchets to hurl diseased bodies into the walled city. Those in the city became infected as they tried to dispose of mountains of bodies, and many fled by ship to Europe, providing one route for the disease to enter Europe.
I don’t know one from another. But Obama is quoted here:
“As a student of history, I also know civilization’s debt to Islam. It was Islam — at places like Al-Azhar University — that carried the light of learning through so many centuries, paving the way for Europe’s Renaissance and Enlightenment. It was innovation in Muslim communities that developed the order of algebra; our magnetic compass and tools of navigation; our mastery of pens and printing.”
The top four definitions of develop from Dictionary.com is this.
Develop:
1.to bring out the capabilities or possibilities of; bring to a more advanced or effective state: to develop natural resources; to develop one’s musical talent.
2.to cause to grow or expand: to develop one’s muscles.
3.to elaborate or expand in detail: to develop a theory.
4.to bring into being or activity; generate; evolve.
Then Tipler charges of Obama that…
“Almost every advance he attributes to the Muslims was due to someone else.
“The non-Muslim Chinese invented the magnetic compass and printing (Gutenberg invented not printing, but movable type). The non-Muslim Hindu Indians invented algebra and the decimal numbering system. The non-Muslim European Christians invented the university.
“I can’t address advances in medicine, but I have studied the history of astronomy and physics. The Muslims contributed nothing.”
Again, I’m totally ignorant to what the Muslims actually did or did not do, but Tipler argues that Muslims did not invent or discover things that Obama merely said were developed by them. If this is true, then Tipler seems to be suggesting that Obama flunks history because Tipler himself does not understand what the word “develop” means.
I’m no classicist (Physics, Engineering) but Thomas Cahill’s well regarded and very readable best selling book “How the Irish Saved Western Civilization” is authoritative and well documented. It mentions noting about Islam saving the great works of the ancient world, but credits monks on the Irish coast.
This is corroborated by the unforgettable first chapter of Kenneth Clark’s (of BBC and PBS fame) book/video series “Civilization” vividly called “The Skin of our Teeth” depicting exactly the same conclusion – The ancient world was passed to the modern world by the scribes of Ireland.
Finally in the “How Should We Then Live?” book/video series by Christian apologist Frances Schaeffer, the catalog of early universities emerging in the 13th century (the end of the middle ages) were in “Paris, Orleans, Toulouse, Montpelier, Cambridge, Oxford, Pauda, Bolongia, Naples, Slalento, Salamanca, Coimbra, and Lisbon.” (Pg 51) None of these are remotely in Islamic lands. Dante (of the “Divine Comedy”, written in Florence in 1320, depends heavily on classical sources) , Petrarch (1370), Boccacio (who translated Homer in 1360) and the rest who popularized or translated the classics in these pivotal years were not Muslims, but Italians, French, and British.
It is interesting that the year the Italian Columbus was dispatched from the Spanish court to find a trade route to the Indies was the same year that Islam was finally driven from Spain by the fall of Grenada at the hands of Queen Isabel of Castile and her husband Ferdinand of Aragon. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Spain
Due to the recent Olympics, their “Four Great Inventions” claimed by China (paper, gunpowder, printing and the compass) are known to the whole world and widely acknowledged. It is an affront to that great country and an obvious fabrication to now claim half of them (compass and printing) for Islam, as our President has done.
The darkness of the middle ages resulted from several influences impinging on the once noble Roman Empire, including internal decadence, and Islamic, Teutonic and Nordic conquerors who divided up the empire.
Islam still attempts to return any society it conquers to 7th century desert nomadic life and law. These are in sharp contrast to the ideas of classical Greek and Roman civilization. Muslims would have no incentive to preserve a culture they despised, and, indeed, history shows clearly Islam did all within its power to demean and destroy classical and Christian culture, just as it does to this day.
My concern is not that a few details may be wrong in Obama’s message, but these wholesale, easily checked, and blatant fabrications undermine the overall credibility of our President, and by implication, of our country. This wholesale rewriting of history, thereby destroys our reputation for veracity in all of our communications, be it in treaty, business contract or law. It advertises to all that we are in for a time of “living law” in which we rewrite contracts as it suits us. But in doing so, we also invite duplicity in our partners and anarchy in our own society. But maybe that is the hidden object of Obama’s exercise.
15. Tim:
“You may not care but I do.”
Good for you.
19. Richard:
“I care, and you should too. ”
Point taken. The damn speech was aimed for Muslims, they don’t care for alleged inaccuracies.
22. Khiri:
“Who cares?
Not nearly enough people.”
Reality strikes.
24. MiamaMan, miasmaman:
Low class cuban reject still showing the Batista fangs so no decent Republican would give him a job.
68. Joanne Jacobs:
“I don’t expect the president of the U.S. to be an expert on Islamic history. All George W. Bush knew was that it was a “religion of peace.” Obama told a speechwriter to find complimentary things to say about Islam so he’d get a better reception for non-groveling parts of the speech. ”
There you have it folks.
way too much comment on an ignorant jackass. surrounded by the most incompetent group of people he could find.
The thug-in-chief sounds like he got his schooling in a public school. I teach history in a public school and most of the time I feel a need to regurgitate anything in my stomach. I never attended public schools so when I started teaching history there it was a cultural shock to say the least.
Since we are not privy to his years at Columbia U. and Harvard U., it is absurd to claim him as being intelectual let alone intelligent. If he wasn’t so dangerous he would be a crude joke. As an American I feel shame that this pretender with his racist ugly wife is in the WH.
Since when is the job description of POTUS to defend Islam, the vile cult? Only muslims do that.
But the Russians invented baseball.
Historical revisionism is the reinterpretation of orthodox views on evidence, motivations and decision-making processes surrounding an historical event. The assumption of the revisionist is that the interpretation of a historical event or period as it is accepted by the majority of scholars (or Pharoah Obama) needs a significant change.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historical_revisionism
Folks: All that Obama is doing is engaging in revisionist history. By attributing the advances to Muslims and Islam, he is a)assuming no one else knows history and b)if they do, he is attempting to alter their view of the present, hence influence the future.
End state: If Obama can succesfully elevate Islam and Muslims to loftier and more successful positions than they have historically held, then, going forward, they will begin to seize upon their realized goals of the present since they can build upon their (revised) successes of the past. Obama is setting Muslims up for success. One would ask why….?
#88 AJ:
He may realize there is something called the “WORLD” out there, but it sure wasn’t “THE WORLD’ with it’s hand upon the Bible in January swearing to protect and defend the Constitution of the US against ALL enemies, foreign (or of the WORLD) and domestic. Seems to me, it was Obama….
If he wants to be such a great guy to the world—let’s let him go to the UN, because they sure have THE WORLD’s best interests in mind.
#19 Richard: You’ve hit the nail right on the head! Black Liberation Theology (BLT) is essentially a pseudo religious faith drawing its inspiration from Marxism and Islam with a heaping helping of anti-white racism. Who can doubt that Obama is really a devotee of this vile perversion of faith?
His actions speak volumes; the collectivization of our economy has Marxism written all over it, and his fawning tributes to Islam walk all over our European heritage by following the BLT dogma attributing all positives to Islam and all negatives to Judeo-Christian culture.
Obama runs around the world begging forgiveness for (White) Americas past sins, and telling everyone things will be different now that he (Black America) is in charge, while in the same breath blaming (Jewish) Israeli intransigence for all of the problems in the Middle East.
It’s like his teleprompter sermons have been written by Jerimiah Wright himself, eh? Can ahh gits a Amen!
But let’s be fair, at least the Muzzas saw the value of those things.
Yeah, they saw so much value in them that they called the entire history of the world before the “revelation” of Islam “The Age of Ignorance” (Jahilyyah).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jahiliyya
You have a problem :
Your President is a narcissist and that is dangerous for USA and perhaps all Western countries.
The moral-equivalencers do not comprehend that the Muslim faith is centered on the “truth” that the Quran is the ONLY source of all knowledge, all learning, all instruction, all understanding, whether scientific, managerial, legal, political or personal. “Everything you need to know and to guide your life, public or private, is in this book” the immam informed me as he placed his hand on it. He believes it literally and implicitly.
And it is immutable, unchangeable, beyond argument or discussion. It is the Islamic Constitution, Bill or Rights, rule book, the sole text book for education, for administering a nation, for a judicial system. This belief is not just for radicals, but for “moderates”. All Muslim live their life with the threat of the Great Day Of Judgment, when they will be culled on the basis of their deviation from the Book, hanging over their head.
Of course they believe what Obama credited them for. They believe that Allah, and the Quran, aare responsible for all human acievement. The same immam iformed me that “Without the Quran we would never have placed a man on the moon, or have any computers”. Anyone who believes that you can engage in rational dialog on foreign relations, or sway the thinking of the “Muslim World” by the magic of his singing, is seriously delusional.
Delusion, combined with ignorance and overwhelming hubris. What a great parlay for a President.
Bob #91,
We have arrived at this moment because European “intellectuals” engaged in revisionism of history and culture (for ideological purposes) and then cross-fertilized this degradation across the Atlantic to our universities and education system. That is why he is able to get away with this nonsense. Too many in Europe and America have not the store of knowledge to be able to penalize him politically for this shameless dhimmi behavior. In fact, he does not even know what a dhimmi is. Most of the population does not know what a dhimmi is.
But for 1400 years Christian and Jewish dhimmis know what that means.
I do not believe that Obama is either stupid or evil. When it comes to foreigh policy, he is simply and dangerously misguided. Like Jimmy Carter and other liberals of similar ilk, Obama is so supremely arrogant that he refuses to allow the facts and the lessons of history to alter his ideologically derived world view. He has done little to win the respect of muslims with his soaring oratory, but he has done much to earn their scorn. The culture of the muslim world despises weakness in all its forms.
I think non muslim Koreans might argue that they invented printing before non muslim Chinese.
Mr. Tipler claims that Muslim scientists have contributed nothing to many important scientific fields. This is not true, since many leading economists, astronomers, physicists, and physicians, etc in this country and around the world are Muslims. Nobel prizes are usually awarded several decades after the publication of the research that earned them, and it wouldn’t surprise me if many winners in those fields in the future turn out to be Muslim.
It’s also besides the point, in the sense that acceptance of science has nothing to do with religion. If you believe the polls, only 45% of Americans accept the scientific explanation for biological diversity, that is, evolution. The remainder don’t know, are convinced the planet is only a few thousand years old, or believe in a weird, un-scientific concept called “intelligent design”. Say all you want about intelligent design’s merits, but the bottom line is that none of its claims are testable, and so it is therefore not an alternative scientific theory to evolution. That is, it isn’t science. In some of our own states there is a move to “teach the debate” between the two “theories”. This is ridiculous, and it shows a complete ignorance of what science is. Evolution is indeed “just a theory” that could be disproved with a few key discoveries; but intelligent design isn’t even a theory. I would add to this point that if it weren’t for the immigration of many scientists to this country [many of them Muslim by the way], we would not have the great lead in biotech, engineering, IT, etc that we do.
Finally, before we bash Muslims during their “golden age” for having merely kept alive the wisdom of the Greeks, rather than come up with it themselves [still no mean feat], we should take a look in the mirror. What was the West doing while the Muslims were inventing, or at least refining, things like paper, ships, astronomy tools like the astrolabe, and spectacular irrigation systems? We were writing on animal skins, fighting each other over tiny bits of land, and doing very little navigation. The Muslims practiced religious toleration, and although there were indeed massacres of Christians and Jews in Muslim territory, it was the official policy of Muslim rulers to give certain privileges to them. The same could not be said in Europe, which was subject to the Inquisition for all of the Middle Ages. So while they may look backward and unimportant to science now, we weren’t much better just a few centuries ago.
Finally, I find it amusing that Mr. Tipler, who is a mathematician, does not bother to explain the significance of algebra [as well as the number 0, another Arab invention, and their highly efficient numeral system, which we still use today] to many of the discoveries made by Western scientists like Kepler or Newton.
I suggest that Mr. Tipler has approached this essay in a decidedly un-scientific manner: he started with the axiom that Muslims are a violent, apeish people uninterested in thinking for themselves, and sought to spin the historical facts, which are far more complex [and, for the record, favorable to Islam] than he acknowledges, in order to make a broader political point; namely, that Obama is bad at history, that leftist academics are self-hating Westerners, and that Islam is for losers. To be sure, Obama is not above criticism, since he does the exact same thing. But Obama is a politician, a profession that I consider slightly less honest than that of Bernie Madoff’s accountant. Mr. Tipler, on the other hand, is a professor at a well-known university. This kind of crap is not worth his time, and the fact that he found the time to write this makes me think he must not have many great paper ideas in the pipeline.
Tipler:
Does anyone but the wingnuts really care what you think?
#100: Vivi in Denmark
“Your President is a narcissist and that is dangerous for USA and perhaps all Western countries.”
Thanks Vivi–tell us something we don’t know.
President Obama’s attribution of advancements in science to a religion is absurd. Religion is the very anti-thesis of innovation and progress. Algebra and astronomy have as much to do with Islam, if any at all, as Heisenberg’s uncertainty principle or Schrödinger’s Cat has to do with Nazism. I have more on this in my post God, King, and Science.
Well, thank you Professor Tipler, for setting me straight on those stupid Arabs and other assorted Muslims. For far too long I have labored under misapprehensions fostered by such “leftist academics” like Fernand Braudel (obviously French and we know what that means, right?):
“In trigonometry the Muslims invented the sine and the tangent. The Greeks had measured an angle only from the chord of the arc it subtended: the sine was half the chord.” (Mohammed Ibn-Musa) “published in 820 an algebraic treatise which went so far as quadratic equations: translated into Latin in the sixteenth century, it became a primer for the West. Later, Muslim mathematicians resolved biquadratic equations.
“Equally distinguished were Islam’s mathematical geographers, its astronomical observatories and instruments (in particular, the astrolabe) and its excellent if still imperfect measurements of latitude and longitude, correcting the flagrant errors made by Ptolemy. The Muslims also deserve high marks for optics, for chemistry (the distillation of alcohol, the manufacture of elixirs and of sulphuric acid) and for pharmacy. More than half the remedies and healing aids used by the West came from Islam…. Muslim medical skill was incontestable. The Egyptian Ibn al-Nafis – although his findings remained unused – discovered the pulmonary circulation of the blood three centuries before Michael Servetus and long before the later discoveries of William Harvey.”
(A History of Civilizations)
And some crazy American named Daniel J. Boorstin:
“Al-Kindi (813-873), sometimes called the first Arab philosopher, developed the notion of rectilinear rays traveling from the illuminated object to the eye. The pioneer experimenter was Alhazen (Ibn al-Hytham, 965-1039), who carried further the idea, not yet accepted by Christian philosophers, that vision was the product of an agent wholly external to the seeing eye. He went further to develop the notion that the rectilinear rays emanated from every point on an illuminated surface. He(…)noted the persistence of images on the retina, and began to treat the eye as a piece of optical machinery.”
(The Discoverers)
What drivel, huh?
Davis S and others.
Europe didn’t nedd Isklamic culture to get the culture and sceiecne from the Greeks. 90% of tyjhe transmission was made through the Byznatine empre or through translations made directly from Grek to Lation in western abbeys. Only obscrurea and realtively unimpodrtant texts who had nver been widepserad the Islamic connection was ever needed. Abnd to begin with goinfg from Grek to Arabic (az languyage with very different semantics) then to Latin caused huge distportions. Also neraly all the translation work made in the “Islmamix Golden Age” was made by Assyrian Christians
So the trutrh is that without Christian culturee because may of itrs funfdamental texts were in Greeks, teh Church was ever interested in Grek texts) Europe would have forgotten its Greek heritage.
Nobel prizes are usually awarded several decades after the publication of the research that earned them, and it wouldn’t surprise me if many winners in those fields in the future turn out to be Muslim.
You might be the only person who isn’t surprised.
as well as the number 0, another Arab invention,
This lie again?
While Arab civilization itself is worth zero and so they might have discovered it through reflecting on their own value, they did not, in fact.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/0_(number)
The concept of zero as a number and not merely a symbol for separation is attributed to India where by the 9th century CE practical calculations were carried out using zero, which was treated like any other number, even in case of division.[7][8] The Indian scholar Pingala (circa 5th-2nd century BCE) used binary numbers in the form of short and long syllables (the latter equal in length to two short syllables), making it similar to Morse code.[9][10] He and his contemporary Indian scholars used the Sanskrit word śūnya to refer to zero or void.
10. vivo:
“Frank Tipler:
You’ve got too much free time in your hands.
Who cares?”
That poopy diaper making you cranky, vivo? Tell Mommy it’s time for a change.
I’m surprised The One didn’t credit the invention of flight to the Muslims; you know, talk about how they used to hang glide off the pyramids back in 4,000 B.C.
Blech. And nobody’s going to call him on it. That’s the saddest part. How about a headline “OBAMA FLUNKS HISTORY” on the cover of Newsweek and Time?
Yeah, right.
The Arab world HAS contributed many things to what I’d like to refer to as modern knowledge–as did the Romans and the Greeks and the Egyptains and the Chinese. To discredit any of these civilazations would be a crime. I have done research on both the Muslim world and the christian world from a varies number of sources, keeping an open mind and shelfing my faith aside (whether it be Christian, Muslim, or Jewish). I’m very dissapointed at some of the comments posted here…before pointing out the negative side of the muslim religon (i.e, restiction of women rights, hanging of homosexuals) one must actually have a basis on which they put their arguments–for both Christianity (certain sects) and Judism (orthadox or hasidic) both have constrictions for women. I’ve seen people with crosses hanging in their cars yelling vulgarities at openly gay and lesbian couples in the street. I’ve known Christian people to openly hate Jews. Amazing? Think that I’m telling lies? Surprised that feelings of hate and intolerance to other races, sexes, and religons are not exclusivly reserved in the Mulsim religon?
Really, the hypocrisy is amazing to me. What ticks me off is that I came here to discuss the truth in Presdient Obama’s words in the University of Cairo… I didn’t expect to find hateful comments full of ridicule and slander a religon, most of them which are based on media influence and public opinion. Its a pity, really…
Whatever Muslims may have contributed in the past, it doesn’t make up for the oppression and failure of the countries where it is in the majority today. Terrorism today cannot be excused or mitigated by past contributions from Muslims in the past. Obama whitewashed or completely overlooked the true nature of Islamic extremism, we are going backwards.
Al-kindi was apparently the first and last Arab philosopher. What a monumental achievement for a culture. To produce one philosopher worthy of the name.
“There was one great exception to the general rule that philosophy and science was the domain of the non-Arabs. This was Al-Kindi whose “pure Arabian descent earned him the title ‘the philosopher of the Arabs’, and indeed he was the first and last example of an Aristotelian student in the Eastern caliphate who sprang from Arabian stock.”[26] The acclaim Al-Kindi received from his fellow Arabs highlights the paucity of noteworthy philosophers and scientists of both Arab stock and Muslim religion.”
In actuality, all the Arab Muslims cared about was arguing about their oh-so-awesome religion and language (apparently they weren’t even that adept at the latter):
“The subjects dominated by Arab Muslims were specifically those that related to the Arabic language and the Islamic religion. Theology, jurisprudence, philology and linguistics were “those intellectual activities evoked by the predilections of the Arabs as Arabs and Moslems.” The scholars in this field were mostly of Arab descent “in contrast to the physicians, astronomers, mathematicians and alchemists … who were of Syrian, Jewish or Persian origin.”[24] Even so, the great theologian al-Bukhari was a Persian, while the founder of one of the four orthodox Muslim schools, abu-Hanifah, was the grandson of a Persian and presumably non-Muslim slave. It is also “noteworthy that many of the pioneering grammarians of the Arabic language were themselves non-Arabs.”[25]”
http://islamicexpansionanddecline.blogspot.com/2007/04/chapter-11-parasitic-civilization.html
Ian Thorpe (69):
Actually, nobody knows who actually burned the Library. Odds are pretty good, however, that it was the Muslim Calif Omar.
“I never expected to hear a president of the United States do so.”
You still haven’t. Barry is an Usurper, not a President. He sits in the oval office illegally.
Yea; This is Obama’s World Dtupidity Tour!
#85 Rachel Peepers
No problem.
Great minds…
Thank you for the opportunity to comment.
Allahu akbar ! (training for the next three and a half years of islam, OOOOPS !, I mean “change”)
Rashputin (76):
For a good explanation of why this is so, read “The Arab Mind: by Raphael Patai. It’s a scholarly work, in its third edition, and goes into detail what drives Muslim culture, society, and ways of thinking. (He also explains why one must carefully differentiate between Arab culture and Muslim culture, although the former heavily influences the latter).
It is very difficult for people coming from the Greek-influenced West to fully understand the way that Arabs think. Two aspects must be understood. First, the ideal Arab way of life is to be a king. No protestant work ethic here, every Arab (male) desires to be boss and order other people around. Their concept of time makes the Mexican “Mañana” look positively workaholic. Secondly, there is the concept of fate: “Allah Akbar” = as God wills. There is no sense of responsibility for one’s fellow human; no urgency to better your own lot in life – by working for it, anyways; no mercy for those less fortunate than you.
Bob (91)
Well said.
An interesting note: I forget where, but one source that I read recently pointed out that the Catholic church didn’t persecute Galileo because they were anti-science. Rather, the political facet of the church (at that time the R.C. Church was as powerful as any state) had adopted Ptolemaic astronomy as the “official” scientific worldview. Galileo just wasn’t PC.
#6 David Thompson
If Obama is supposedly one the winners—what are the losers like? Ted Kennedy
John Pagey (87):
Well, actually, it was probably Alexander the Great, but the Muslims certainly used their share of biowarfare. I remember one episode where the Romans used poisonous fumes (blown in through a tunnel) to take a fortification, but it was probably the Germans that invented the battlefield use of poison gas. And, of course, we invented the nuclear weapon.
However, I might point it, it was Europe and the U.S. that also first outlawed the use of two of the big 3 WMD technologies in warfare and have constrained the third.
JP (90):
In the context of science and engineering, “develop” typically takes the fourth meaning: “to bring into being or activity; generate; evolve.“. Given that the Muslims actually originated very little, neither did they build on what they appropriated, the use by Tipler seems appropriate.
Muslims did invent the Flo-Bee, and the Sham-Wow, yes? Oh, crap, that was the Germans? Well, how about the Ronco Tomato Slicer? The Spray-On Bald Spot Remover? Fake dog balls (nudicles)? Nope. Hrmmm…well, they did do good with the goats, eh?
What the Muslims have really been good at is exploiting (who else?) the Jews in their midst.
Qur’an (verse 6:64) states: “The Jews have said, ‘God’s hand is fettered.’ Fettered are their hands, and they are cursed for what they have said. Nay, but His hands are outspread; He expends how He will.”
Indeed, one of the Psalms includes the line “hok natan v’lo ya’avor” – roughly translated “He has given us laws [of nature] which are not transgressed.” And over the years, Jews have been inspired to understand the works of His hands, to better serve as a partner in Creation.
So who’s right? Total Nobel Prizes in Chemistry, Physics, Economics and Medicine earned by Muslims: 2. (Even Israel has earned more.) Total Prizes earned by Jews: too numerous to keep count.
Mara S. (113):
You miss the point, Mara. The issue is Obama’s giving the Muslim’s credit for achievements that they did not, in fact, make. As other’s have pointed out, every achievement that the President listed was, in face, due to others.
90. JP:,
Read definition #4 again. “4.to bring into being or activity; generate; evolve.” So, one meaning for “develop”, is to bring into being. Hope that helps.
Regarding #23 David S: Engaging in alternative history is a cool pastime. Have you every considered what the world would be like had Islam not gain it current prominence? Or if Muhammad had not been born?
“The books of Archimedes and Ptolemy used by Galileo and Copernicus were indeed translations into Latin from the Arabic.”
By Arabic-speaking Arab Christians, not Muslims.
The Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle has a lot to do with Nazism, specifically its downfall. See, Dr. Heisenberg, famous for his uncertainty principle, single handedly prevented the Nazis from obtaining a nuclear weapon by convincing them that it wasn’t viable. Since he was a respected quantum physicist, people believed Dr. Heisenberg when he said an atomic bomb couldn’t possibly work, even though his calculations were off by an order of magnitude.
vivo – I know you’re better than this. If Bush had said such crazy things, would you have been so complacent? Really? If the media had given Bush a free pass for saying these things, how would you react? Since it’s your guy, well, it’s no big thang. Shame on you. You have to demand better from your guys. Obama embarasses the Dems and the U.S.A. As Dole quoth, “Where is the outrage?”
“The mediating function of the Eastern Christians was particularly important in the large translation movement of the 9th and 10th centuries. Syrian Christians translated Greek manuscripts on logic, medicine, and philosophy into Syriac, and then translated those from Syriac to Arabic. Of the Arab philosophers and logicians none most likely knew Greek directly, so they depended on these Christian mediators.”
Versteegh, “History of Arabic Language Teaching” in the collection, Handbook for Arabic Language Teaching Professionals in the 21st Century, p.6., Eds. Wahba, Taha & England.
#6 David Thompson:
D’OHbama got his undergraduate degree at Columbia University.
His Columbia undergraduate thesis has never been made public. Wouldn’t you love to read it?
D’ohbama got his law degree from Harvard Law.
#59 Adina Kutnicki:
As a Class of ’79 MIT graduate (who declined Harvard to attend MIT), I can assure you that Harvard and MIT are on the same (north) side of the winding Charles River.
Also, my completely unbiased analysis is that the intellectual rigor of MIT’s undergraduate program is about ten times that of Harvard! Congrats to your son.
Just to add, it’s true that there were some great Arabic intellectuals. However, it’s very interesting to read what the Saudi scholar Buleihi said recently. His comments in an interview in the Arabic liberal magazine Elaph make for riveting reading. The MEMRI site recently translated some highlights [special despatch 2332] but if you read Arabic, the original elaph interview is much longer and very interesting. Here’s a crucial section that is relevant to this thread (copied from MEMRI):
“‘Okaz: “Some Western thinkers wrote that Western civilization is an extension of previous civilizations. How can you, a Muslim Arab, deny this?”
Buleihi: “When we review the names of Muslim philosophers and scholars whose contribution to the West is pointed out by Western writers, such as Ibn Rushd, Ibn Al-Haitham, Ibn Sina, Al-Farbi, Al-Razi, Al-Khwarizmi, and their likes, we find that all of them were disciples of the Greek culture and they were individuals who were outside the [Islamic] mainstream. They were and continue to be unrecognized in our culture. We even burned their books, harassed them, [and] warned against them, and we continue to look at them with suspicion and aversion. How can we then take pride in people from whom we kept our distance and whose thought we rejected?…
“As for the question of cultural development, there are two approaches. According to one approach, civilization is the product of a cumulative process. However, this approach is contradicted by the facts of history. According to the other approach, a quantitative change does not become a qualitative one, except through an extraordinary leap. This is the correct compelling approach, which I adopt. Quantity cannot possibly turn into quality spontaneously. …
“The only civilization which possesses the ingredients of perpetual progress is Western civilization, with its Greek foundation and its amazing contemporary formation. … Western civilization believes that it is impossible to possess absolute truth and that human perfection is impossible, so man must strive to achieve it while recognizing that it is impossible to reach. Thus it is the only civilization which is constantly growing and constantly reviewing and correcting itself and achieving continuous discoveries. …”"
“Again, I’m totally ignorant to what the Muslims actually did or did not do, but Tipler argues that Muslims did not invent or discover things that Obama merely said were developed by them.”
That would be a great criticism, except Muslims had basically nothing to do with advances in pens, magnetic compasses, or printing.
Muslim didn’t invent those things, and they also didn’t develop someone else’s invention, at least in those cases.
Tipler is wrong about a few things. For example, Gutenberg did not invent movable type. The Chinese appear to have come up with that idea.
Obama, OTOH, is wrong about pretty much everything, and his claim to be a student of history is absurd on its face. His idea that the handful of innovations Muslims came up with over a period of centuries, paved the way for the explosion of ideas, and inventions that came out of the Christian West in the post-medieval period is a lot of fatuous nonsense.
“As a student of history, I also know civilization’s debt to Islam. It was Islam — at places like Al-Azhar University — that carried the light of learning through so many centuries, paving the way for Europe’s Renaissance and Enlightenment.”
Hogwash. About the only thing Muslims came up with as far as universities go is the idea of awarding formal degrees. That’s an idea that appears to have actually originated from Islamic civilization.
However, that’s a pretty minor innovation.
There weren’t too many universities in those days, but the universities at Constantinople and Salerno were around long before Al-Azhar University was formed, and those universities were, of course, created by we primitive western Christians. As a matter of fact, both those universities existed in some form, before there was any such thing as Islam.
From the Wiki article on the university at Salerno…
“The barbarian invasions following the fall of the Roman Empire caused the last doctors from Velia to move to the neighbouring city of Salerno. The philosophical and scientific tradition of medical studies carried on there, in the form of a free and autonomous guild of erudite men, a College of masters, which became the first nucleus of the Salernitan Studium, later to be used as a model for other European universities.”
“The Salerno Medical School reached the height of its glory between the 10th and 13th centuries, especially due to the contribution of Alphanus of Salerno and Constantine the African, who deemed Salerno worthy of the name of “City of Hippocrates” (Hippocratica Civitas), after the well-known Greek physician and mathematician.”
“People from all over the world came to the Salerno School, sick people hoping to recover, or apprentices wishing to learn medical skills. Its fame became international, as proved by historiographical testimonies as well as the Salernitan manuscripts present in many libraries in Europe.”
“The School kept the Greek and Latin medical heritage alive, combining it harmoniously with the Arabic and Hebrew traditions. This combination of different cultures led to a wider medical knowledge and is illustrated by the legend which credits the foundation of the School to four masters: Helinus the Jew, Pontus the Greek, Adela the Arab, and Salernus the Roman.”
“In the School, besides medicine, which was studied and practised by women too, philosophy, theology and law were taught.”
Little Barry is spewing some pretty standard anti-western propaganda (the basic idea is: if it weren’t for the Arab imperialists we’d still be in the dark ages), but that’s all it is. Propaganda. It’s total nonsense.
Sine is half a chord? Do these knuckleheads quoting this gibberish have the foggiest idea what any of this means?
read “The Arab Mind: by Raphael Patai.
One of the problems is that today’s generation of scholars is influenced by the PC school of thought that basically “argues” that any work published before the publication of Said’s “Orientalism” is fatally flawed. There has been some significant push-back against this view, but it still predominates in Arabic Studies programs around the world.
One might be able to pick some nits with Patai, but he hits upon some of the major points in his work. One thing you didn’t mention that he definitely focuses on is the role of the geography of Arabia in the forming of the Arab culture. The desert looms large in the day-to-day reality of Arabs and their harsh nature matches the harsh landscape.
Such an advanced civilization and they couldn’t even figure out how to solve their main problem: clean drinking water.
“I am a student of history” is one of those things, like saying “I have a sense of humor”, that is rendered untrue the moment one says it about oneself.
Good old Barak. He’s really only a student of himself, and every speech is really about him. I’m surprised he was willing to even give the Muslims credit. His first draft probably said “I invented algebra”.
As Bugs Bunny would say, “what an ultra-maroon”.
#106 The Shadow:
Tipler:
Does anyone but the wingnuts really care what you think?
Wow! troll so lets have YOUR version of History so we know you have an education and can coherently refute what Tipler wrote.
133. Marc Malone:
“I know you’re better than this. If Bush had said such crazy things, would you have been so complacent? Really?”
Yes, if he was trying to politely reach Muslims, the details don’t matter. Nobody is paying attention to the details, the message is what’s important. But like I said, “Tipler: You’ve got too much free time in your hands.”
Islamic architecture would have been worthy of a mention by Hussein Obama. However, that skill seems to have been lost, judging by how ugly modern mosques are. One good thing Spain got from the Islamic Occupation.
This guy is a buffoon, a very dangerous buffoon.
Are you still glad that you voted for Obama?
Yes, if he was trying to politely reach Muslims, the details don’t matter.
So lying is a good idea.
Nobody is paying attention to the details, the message is what’s important.
The message is keep lying about Islam.
Hey Kapil @ #70, you had a typo in your post.
You kept typing B-u-s-h. I’m pretty sure you meant to type O-b-a-m-a.
Tripler and the rest of the wingnut’s starting point is they hate Obama – He is black and uppity! It sticks in their craw that the majority of Americans voted for him and still support him. When you start from a biased position you interpret everything through that prism. The speech was not suppose to be a history lesson. It was suppose to be a speech to try to find common grounds with Islam, to hold America up as the beacon of hope and to speack over the heads of the govermnments to the people.
I can only imagine the dammage that would have been done if Tripler or the other wingnuts had crafted a speech. This column and the wingnut responses are the very reasson that you are such a small minority in the US today. Keep it please. It helps us elect representatives who are responsive to the beliefs of the rest of the citizens
Me (#120″
‘scuse me, that should be “inshallah”.
Dave Surls (137):
Depends on how you define it. The Chinese used woodblock printing, but Gutenberg developed cast-metal, mass-produced lead type and the printing equipment and processes to go with it.
vivo@ 142 says “Yes, if he was trying to politely reach Muslims, the details don’t matter. Nobody is paying attention to the details, the message is what’s important.”
Translation: “An enemy who has sworn to kill you will decide he likes you if you lie in a condescending manner about his accomplishments.”
You’ve just reached a personal all-time low in your ongoing quest for absolute moral bankruptcy. Congratulations.
If it wasn’t for Westeners, Arabia’s oil would still be in the ground.
The Shadow (148):
It doesn’t occur to you that perhaps Obama could simply be wrong? We’re not drones, you know, always agreeing with the President simply because of his office, or because he’s a charismatic guy. Perhaps – just perhaps, mind you – we disagree with him because we have studied history and cultures and have come to the conclusion that his approach will lead to really, really bad things in the future.
#55 ricpic – Man, let go of the racist attitude. You would do much better to educate us, rather than try to insult. And you would do better to use Mr. Morgan’s example to strive to make your own life better instead of dwelling on obstacles. He obviously had many and yet they did not stop him from applying himself and contributing.
I’m sure that black history has been wrongly reported through racist intent. With documentation and research, the story can be told more accurately.
http://inventors.about.com/od/mstartinventors/a/Garrett_Morgan.htm
“Garrett Morgan’s hand-cranked semaphore traffic management device was in use throughout North America until all manual traffic signals were replaced by the automatic red, yellow, and green-light traffic signals currently used around the world. The inventor sold the rights to his traffic signal to the General Electric Corporation for $40,000.”
#55 ricpic
was this Garrett guy a Muslim? if not what does an American black man inventing things have to do with the topic? nothing just an excuse to ———> cry racist
so we have an article rebutting lies told by Obama about Muslims and we get:
build a strawman burn it down
change the subject
call names and oh yeah
racist
Paul of Alexandria (120)
Thanks for the suggestion, I ordered it and am looking forward to reading it.
Regards
I wanted to like this article, and refer it to others, but it felt rushed and disorganized, and lacked sufficient detail even for a good column.
Since you can’t count on people having a solid background in intellectual history–not even in people of so-called “good education”–there is a real need for this.
I also wanted to see a few books recommended or perhaps a few websites.
Is it surprising, though? O’ has a kid writes his speeches. O’ then plugs into the teleprompter. Just hit ‘play.’
The Shadow doesn’t seem to understand that the “beliefs” of so many citizens are shaped by erroneous information peddled by historical dimwits who occupy important positions in American society. As a result, when you make up more nonsense so that you can pander to people who are already ill-informed, you only make the situation worse. Beliefs are not necessarily a good thing. The complaint with Obama isn’t that he is uppity, but that he’s a arrogant and stupid, a particularly lethal combination. What’s really on trial here is the wholesale BS that has been dished out by a leftist intelligentsia that’s not very intelligent, but stakes out positions based on race and cultural pandering, not empirical truth.
@33. WWL:
Don’t you mean submission?
You don’t know the difference? More’s the pity.
Peace.
DS
Look at David’s blog- a truly delusional piece of crap- of course he is here defending Obama and revisionist history- he attempts to write it himself- I would laugh but when I see Jews who are so duped by dumb it makes me sad.
…………………………..
“The reality is that this country was founded by leftists, and all of the greatest accomplishments the USA can boast of belong to the socialist impulse.
Conservatism achieves nothing worthy of emulation, while progressives have given the world representative government and all the benefits of scientific thought.
If you like breathing clean air, having the right to vote, and enjoy the concept of the weekend – thank a leftist.”
………………………………………
Yeah thank the leftists who massacred your grandparents parents in Russia or Germany. *(&)^*(&^)(^
Both Professor Frank J. Tipler of Tulane University, author of this article, and most of the commentators would do well to study the life and work of an Arabic and Islamic scholar, William Montgomery Watt, who died at 97 in 2006.
[see http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/obituaries/article1288601.ece
In this obituary in "The Times of London," Watt's 60 years of scholarship
is summarized, and the critical heart of his life's work is published at age 64:
"[Watt] then studied the internal dynamics of Islam, and the result was his best book, The Formative Period of Islamic Thought (1973), lengthy, densely argued and an unsurpassed synthesis of our knowledge of the first three
centuries or so of Islam, when the faith was still vigorous, open to new influences and able to absorb them without compromising its central message.”
You may also find his obituary in “The Independent” to be a good overview:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/obituaries/professor-w-montgomery-watt-423394.html
“Long before the recent wave of Islamophobia in the West, Watt advocated dialogue with Muslims, not demonisation of them. He doubted the appropriateness of conversion and felt that those of all faiths should collaborate in friendship to stem the tide of materialism and secularisation. Unlike certain Orientalist scholars of previous generations, Watt was indeed convinced that the Koran was divinely inspired and that Muhammad received true religious experiences directly from God. Watt roundly condemned those in the West who sought to perpetuate scurrilous medieval misconceptions about the Prophet of Islam.”
Mohammed (if he really existed) was a homicidal maniac given to flights of fancy and delusion. The Koran is a work of lunacy and evil. It is nothing more than training manual for conquest and despotism. Enlightenment does not factor, only cruelty and subjugation to those that fail to submit. It is no more a religion than communism. There is no spirit of kindness or community except for the “believers”. All else beware. Don’t believe it? Look around.
Most of the comments were as every bit enjoyable as the article. But some, the incorrigible, bitter to morals and standards, now the followers of their Dear Leader, living on the opium of utopia – but always at war with reality – continue to clutch straws.
Islam could not have more destruction in its wake if it tried. But what is that to a Lemming?
Dear Lemmings, like all the lemmings already dead and gone, keep marching on, you are onto something. Who knows, you may yet discover Shangri-La! Or something.
“Depends on how you define it. The Chinese used woodblock printing, but Gutenberg developed cast-metal, mass-produced lead type and the printing equipment and processes to go with it.”
All I know is what I read in good old wikipedia…
“Movable type is the system of printing and typography that uses movable components to reproduce the elements of a document (usually individual letters or punctuation). The first known movable type system was invented in China by Bi Sheng out of ceramic between 1041 and 1048 AD. Metal movable type was first invented in Korea during the Goryeo Dynasty (around 1230). This led to the printing of the Jikji in 1377 – today the world’s oldest extant movable metal print book…”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Movable_type
Unless they have their information wrong, I think you would have to say that the Chinese came up with the idea of movable type printing.
Obama is so over his head. His pandering to Muslims is minor compared the destruction and bankruptcy of our economic system. America must learn not to look beyond speeches and elect people with true skills. This idiot Obama is making the idiot before him (Bush) look smart.
151. Saltherring:
“Congratulations.”
Thanks
As Obama stammers and studders to come up with the politically correct word he often forgets the message…so he rambles.
As I listen to his words I often wonder where he was planning to go with some of his statements.
When George Bush did similar it was in the headlines.
In my opinion we had better start asking some questions.
166. theresa m wrote:
In my opinion we had better start asking some questions.
Peter writes: Most of us are. Unfortunately the Dinosaur Media (purposely) is not doing its job and passing those questions along to the people who can answer them.
what can you expect! muslims believe that alexander the great, jesus, moses, David, solomom, Adam etc, were muslims!!!
Narrated Anas: Some people from the tribe of ‘Ukl came to the Prophet and embraced Islam. The climate of Medina did not suit them, so the Prophet ordered them to go to the (herd of milch) camels of charity and to drink, their milk and urine (as a medicine). They did so, and after they had recovered from their ailment (became healthy) they turned renegades (reverted from Islam) and killed the shepherd of the camels and took the camels away. The Prophet sent (some people) in their pursuit and so they were (caught and) brought, and the Prophets ordered that their hands and legs should be cut off and that their eyes should be branded with heated pieces of iron, and that their cut hands and legs should not be cauterized, till they die. Sahih Al-Bukhari Vol. 8, Bk. 82, No. 794.
imagine jesus telling his followers to hunt down sheperds and kill them!!
THE OBAMA ADMINISTRATION IS ALL ABOUT SPIN
The ends justify the means. Just ask Al Capone.
http://greensrealworld.blogspot.com/2009/06/obama-administration-masters-of.html
Thomas Cahill wrote a book (‘How the Irish Saved Civilization’) in ’95 that makes a great case for at least a large portion of the otherwise ‘lost knowledge’ from classical eras being preserved by monks and scholars mostly untouched by the troubles that existed in continental Europe during the Dark Ages. Whether the Caliphates stored such knowledge or not is immaterial since they weren’t the ones to reintroduce the world to it.
Obama is trying to flatter the audience; I agree with that one hundred percent. To do that, what did he have to say?
“As a student of history, I also know civilization’s debt to Islam. It was Islam — at places like Al-Azhar University — that carried the light of learning through so many centuries, paving the way for Europe’s Renaissance and Enlightenment. It was innovation in Muslim communities that developed the order of algebra; our magnetic compass and tools of navigation; our mastery of pens and printing.”
Notice he uses the term Islam (which is the Muslim equivalent of Christendom) and he says “Muslim communities”. Were any of those advances located in Muslim communities? Does anyone know? Also, within my school’s physics department, “develop” means to build upon, since even new inventions were developed from ideas that were, in whole or in part, due to others. Okay, so has any Muslim or anyone in the Muslim community made any advance in the sciences?
Tipler says:
“I can’t address advances in medicine, but I have studied the history of astronomy and physics. The Muslims contributed nothing.”
I was a bit shocked to find several pages on Wikipedia (search for Islamic science, physics in medieval Islam, or Islamic Golden Age) accounting for advances in various fields of physics (optics, theoretical and experimental physics, mechanics, astrophysics, magnetism). One guy did develop the compass dial (a sort of sundial+compass combination). There were advances in mathematics (not just algebra). I was surprised to learn that the first known “proof by induction” came from a Muslim mathematician.
Now, I’ve always considered Wikipedia to be a dubious source of information, so my impression could all be wrong. But seeing as how a Muslim scientist Ibn al-Haytham(965-1040) is considered “the father of modern optics” and a “pioneer of the scientific method”, I conclude that Tipler—who says he has “studied the history of astronomy and physics” and that “Muslims contributed nothing”—can receive no mark above Obama’s failing grade. (Unless he attended Harvard, in which case he may receive an A.)
I think in some instances he was erring in referriing to some advances to the Muslim world. More appropriate would be the Arab world. Consider Mesopotamia, Babylon, the Baalbeck Terrace and the Sumerians. Iraq was the cradle of some of the oldest known civilizations know to man.
#171 JP – Don’t think that a “public” forum like Wikipedia can’t have it’s own agenda. Many groups have a vested interest in rewriting history in their favor. I always take their (Wiki’s) “facts” with a skeptical grain of salt. I would suggest “more extensive” investigation before criticizing the author.
JP,
Yes, develop can mean “build upon”. For example, “Muslims developed The Temple Mount in Jerusalem by slapping a mosque on top of it.” That sentence is correct. But, did they really develop it, or try to take it over and claim it as their own ?
” The mainstream Christians would have destroyed all knowledge (they burned the library of Alexandria, the greatest repository of literature in the ancient world because it contained stuff that “was not of God”) The real forces for darkness in this world have been The Roman Empire and Roman Catholic / Protestant Christianity, the Romans because they were control feaks and the Chistians because they knew the value of keeping their congeregation in ignorance.”
What are they teaching them in those schools nowadays?
The Library at Alexandria was burned by Caluiph Omar. The Romans themselves were engineers, and very good ones; but many of the Greek theoretical advances came under Roman rule, since the Romans were sensible enough to encourage them. And the slander against the Church is just obscene: the Church was the font and focus of scholarship in medieval Europe, the founder of universities and the sponsor of monasteries, the only places where scholars could earn bread and board for book-learning. There is unfortunately a popular parody of the Church sprung up from the Galileo case- representative only of a perverse turn in European history, when G. ran afoul of Counter-reformation politics.
And the Inquisition didn’t even exist through most of the Middle Ages.
————
venividivici:
Excellent post. To which I would add a recommendation of the works of Bernard-Henri Levy.
_____________
Not mentioned anywhere here is the cataclysim of the 13th Century, or “what have the Muslims done for us lately?”
The first few Islamic centuries did see a certain tole3ration (and occasionally encouragement) of intellectual inquiry, of scholarship and creative art, and some of those individuals have been mentioned above.
But then came Al-Ghazali. Thanks to his work in the 12th Century, “the door was shut” on Muslim scholarship. Henceforward, all knowledge was to be found in Scripture; itjihad or individual inquiry was banned; science and philosophy were snuffed out.
And even those who claim that the Muslim world was responsible for certain advances will have a hard time finding *even a single one* from the last seven centuries.
Professor of Mathematical Physics, but pretty much an ignoramus about history. Either that, or you are just a liar. Its not surprising you provide no citations for your proclamations.
Abu Ja’far Muhammad ibn Musa Al-Khwarizmi
http://www.stetson.edu/~efriedma/periodictable/html/Am.html
His treatise on algebra, Hisab al-jabr w’al-muqabala, was the most famous and important of all of al-Khwarizmi’s works. It is the title of this text that gives us the word “algebra” and, in a sense that we shall investigate more fully below, it is the first book to be written on algebra. In al-Khwarizmi’s own words, the purpose of the book is to teach:
what is easiest and most useful in arithmetic, such as men constantly require in cases of inheritance, legacies, partition, lawsuits, and trade, and in all their dealings with one another, or where the measuring of lands, the digging of canals, geometrical computations, and other objects of various sorts and kinds are concerned.
This does not sound like the contents of an algebra text, and indeed only the first part of the book is a discussion of what we would today recognise as algebra. However it is important to realise that the book was intended to be highly practical, and that algebra was introduced to solve real life problems that were part of everyday life in the Islam empire at that time.
After introducing the natural numbers, he discusses the solution of equations. His equations are linear or quadratic and are composed of units (numbers), roots (x) and squares (x2). He first reduces an equation to one of 6 standard forms, using the operations of addition and subtraction, and then shows how to solve these standard types of equations. He uses both algebraic methods of solution and the geometric method of completing the square.
Al-Khwarizmi continues his study of algebra by examining how the laws of arithmetic extend to an arithmetic for his algebraic objects. For example he shows how to multiply out expressions such as (a + bx)(c + dx), although we should emphasise that al-Khwarizmi uses only words to describe his expressions, and no symbols are used.
The next part of al-Khwarizmi’s Algebra consists of applications and worked examples. He then goes on to look at rules for finding the area of figures such as the circle, and also finding the volume of solids such as the sphere, cone, and pyramid. This section on mensuration certainly has more in common with Hindu and Hebrew texts than it does with any Greek work. The final part of the book deals with the complicated Islamic rules for inheritance, but require little from the earlier algebra beyond solving linear equations.
Al-Khwarizmi’s algebra is regarded as the foundation and cornerstone of the sciences. In a sense, al-Khwarizmi is more entitled to be called “the father of algebra” than Diophantus because al-Khwarizmi is the first to teach algebra in an elementary form and for its own sake, while Diophantus is primarily concerned with the theory of numbers.
Al-Khwarizmi also wrote a treatise on Hindu-Arabic numerals. The work describes the Hindu place-value system of numerals based on 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, and 0. The first use of zero as a place holder in positional base notation was probably due to al-Khwarizmi in this work.
He also wrote an important work on astronomy, covering calendars, calculating true positions of the sun, moon and planets, tables of sines and tangents, spherical astronomy, astrological tables, parallax and eclipse calculations, and visibility of the moon. Although his astronomical work is based on that of the Indians, and most of the values from which he constructed his tables came from Hindu astronomers, al-Khwarizmi must have been influenced by Ptolemy’s work too.
Al-Khwarizmi wrote a major work on geography which give latitudes and longitudes for 2402 localities as a basis for a world map. The book, which is based on Ptolemy’s Geography, lists with latitudes and longitudes, cities, mountains, seas, islands, geographical regions, and rivers. The manuscript includes maps which on the whole are more accurate than those of Ptolemy.
A number of minor works were written by al-Khwarizmi on topics such as the astrolabe, on which he wrote two works, on the sundial, and on the Jewish calendar. He also wrote a political history containing horoscopes of prominent persons.
Hot Lunch,
You’re not very good with reading comprehension. The focus of Mr. Tipler’s article was on astronomy and physics. Your reply is mostly about algebra. He may have done a lot of work, but Al-Khwarizmi still didn’t invent algebra. Oh, about the astronomy, did you even read what you quoted ?
“Although his astronomical work is based on that of the Indians, and most of the values from which he constructed his tables came from Hindu astronomers, al-Khwarizmi must have been influenced by Ptolemy’s work too.”
OMG, how ignorant you Americans are!!
btw I read someone say that the moors ruled spain/portugal 700 years? it’s actualy 800 year 700 years is of southern france wich they ruled and they ruled over sicilie why do you think they have arabic looks? anyway,
It’s well known in europe that in the time of after the dark ages there was a hunt on knowlidge, and yes when your ancestors were still killing and raping eachother after the roman fall, the muslims had universities and they were washing themselfs (with SOAP wich is btw also a arabis discovery).
You should watch the document about the Al Andaluse:
http://video.google.nl/videosearch?q=al+andalus&hl=nl&emb=0&aq=0&oq=al+anda#q=moors+in+spain&hl=nl&emb=0
http://video.google.nl/videosearch?q=al+andalus&hl=nl&emb=0&aq=0&oq=al+anda#
“”Barack Hussain Obama wants us to ……
1) Understand and Respect all FATE and all MANKIND.
2) Study and Understand ISLAM.
3) Believe in EQUALITY, Stop PREJUDICE.
3) Understand and Respect all CULTURE and TRADITION.
4) Know HYPOCRITES and fight ENEMIES of mankind.
5) Open beautiful HEARTS and close dirty MINDS.
6) Stop NUCLEAR WEAPONS, help the ENVIRONMENT.
7) Try not to KILL but learn how to LOVE.
8) Accept the Right of ANIMAL, CHILD, WOMAN AND MAN.”
Yeah he is EVIL!! woow
even today the best discoveries aren’t made by you White folks, the blacks in america have invented stoplights, elevator…
Derek. I appreciate the fact that you’re very stupid.
172. Pat J wrote:
I think in some instances he was erring in referriing to some advances to the Muslim world. More appropriate would be the Arab world. Consider Mesopotamia, Babylon, the Baalbeck Terrace and the Sumerians. Iraq was the cradle of some of the oldest known civilizations know to man.
Peter writes: yes, great civilizations that were later conquered and overrun by Islam, which refuses to abandon the 7th century.
People do this all the time, but all muslims are not arabs and all arabs are not muslims. Iranians are NOT arabs, for example. The question is does any of this stem from the muslim religion? Unlikely. Is he talking about arabs when he says muslims?
The comments that a black person invented this or that is completely off the point. Who cares? Irrelevant to the issue. We do know that the issue of black slavery to the in North America could not have happened without help from blacks in Africa. Everybody is guilty on that black and white. African and European.
The point is Obama is confused or a liar – take your pick.
It is no surprise that obama has no grasp of history. The purpose of “higher education” as was experienced by obama is not so much to become educated as to become radicalized and indoctrinated. Read “One-Party Classroom”. The course descriptions, reproduced verbatim from the catalogs of the various “universities” are worth the cost of the book in pure comedic value.
Great article by Frank J. Tipler. It is quite a coincidence that I published similar observations on the same day on the Newsvine:
Does President Obama need to get his historical facts right?
News Type: Event — Sun Jun 7, 2009 5:48 PM BST
Obama’s overgeneralizations are a dangerous precedent: Algebras and magnetic compass plus paper came from cross fertilization of Islamic societies with the sub-continent and China. An American president has to be careful with reference to history. Giving credits of accomplishments without highlighting the cause will further add to moans and groans of a society that fails to understand the reason of its continual decline in the field of intellect for last 1000 years.
One needs to appreciate the influence of the Indian subcontinent on the course of sciences and intellect of renaissance. The Indian subcontinent export of the ‘mastery of mathematics’ through Nasir al-Din al-Tusi, Mo’ayyeduddin Urdi, and Ibn al-Shatir helped like a catalyst to expedite the imminent dawn of reason-based enlightenment in Baghdad and Cordoba. That was cut short in its infancy by the intervention of dogmatic idea that any knowledge outside the book of God is irrelevant. Reason, logic, and rationalism were sacrificed at the altar of dogma and incoherence of philosophy. Dogma and clergy reigns supreme across the crescent of instability. The message of connectivity with the world and cohabitation with great cultures, due to which the Golden age of Islam flourished, was lost to winning hearts and minds by short term political overgeneralizations.
Decline of the Islamic golden age was due to supremacy and ascendancy of dogma over rationalism – for example, the lack of separation between faith and reason – that is why the Muslim Arab world fell into scientific slumber just as the Christian world woke up. Internecine wars, infighting and murder of rationalism were the main causes for the decline of Islam. It is often disputed why Muslims being 19.6% of the world’s population, i.e. 2 billion, only have three Nobel laureates in Science and literature, whereas Jews being only 0.2% of the world’s population, i.e. 14.1 million, have received 122 Nobel prizes in science, economics, medicine and literature. This is the exact challenge the Islamic world faces today, this was the point that needed to be made.
The truth about indifference towards great thinkers within Islamic Diaspora is chilling. The reason why ‘Ibn Khaldun,’ ‘Al-Muqaddimah’, or ‘The Introduction,’ is not part of madrassas’ syllabus, or why in the world of Islam no one reads or talks about Al-Farabi: ‘Kitab al-musiqi al-Kabir’, or ‘The Great Book of Music,’ or Al-Firdawsi: ‘Shahnameh’, or ‘Book of Kings,’ or Ibn al-Jubayr, ‘Rihlat Ibn Jubayr’, or ‘The Travels of Ibn Jubayr,’ Jabir Ibn Haiyan, Khawarizmi, Abu Yousuf Yaqub Ibn Ishaq al-Kindi, Omar Khayyam Al-Farabi, Averroes and others, are little known to the faithful. Most of them were termed as heretics. I wish Obama would have given the true credits to great scientists and free thinkers of Islam and traced the history little deeper.
One Ummah ‘Obama’ refers to only exists in the minds of Hizb ul Thareer or the ultimate faithful; otherwise there are 1000 divides within the Islamic world. The mother of them all is the Shiite-Sunni divide that extends to in the shape of two camps – the Iranian and Saudi ( a 700 million/300 million divide on global Islamic populations basis); next, the Sunni internal divide between Wahabbi hardliners and Wahabbi softliners, this sits above the divide between Hanifites and Malikis that extends between sub-continent Muslims. The terror prone Asir region is cast solidly in the first divide whereas Taliban are the product of desert Islam with connections to the hardest of the ideological schools under Salafis.
Now to portray Darfur and Bosnia in one line is a great argument, yet a poor one. In Darfur, Arab descended Sudan’s Al-Bashir is behind the ruthless murder of his own black indigenous Muslims; in Bosnia it was strife between Serbs and Muslims, both Slavs but ideology divided them. The revenge of Ottoman rule was taken from the rich farmers and land owners who historically benefited from the Ottoman rule.
These colours are important to learn, yet for Obama to try to sew a rainbow all under one tabernacle is far bigger and much more complex a challenge. The political demands at the seams of Islamic majorities are clear; in Palestine the Hamas wants no Israel, in Saudi Osama wants no Sauds, in Hijaz they want no Sauds, in Iran they want the promised one to conquer regions for which they have been promised by Allah and restore the Ahl-e-Bait, that is the house of Banu Hashim, to its equitable place. The nuke option for Iran is no way acceptable to Saudis as well as Osama. Khomeini’s Islam is a far away call from Islam that Abdul Wahab practiced. Iraq has its own sectarian problems alongside the Kurdish issue.
http://iqballatif.newsvine.com/_news/2009/06/07/2905355-does-president-obama-need-to-get-his-historical-facts-right
Appeasement without facts is duplicity. Political Islam absolutely needs lectures on accommodation with the world and lot more freedom and tolerance. Our pains are common, our diseases are common so is our heritage, in the name of ‘cultural independence’ religions and states cannot be made to take the freedom of thinking away, that was the cause of 911 and if this appeasement continues and moral equivalence is provided as a shelter more 911 shall happen.
When facts are wrapped in hyperbole and rhetoric like we saw in Cairo, we have an obligation to tell ‘conscious of people’ that these are exercise of ‘global electioneering’ and mass branding of intellect means nothing if the aim is to make everyone happy.
The policies since 911 have continued but wrappings are being changed as polite, yet we all know that without elimination of hyper-orthodoxy on all side of religious divide we as mankind are doomed.
23. David S:
Without Islamic culture, the inventions noted by Obama may never have reached the West. Although China and Greece contributed some underlying knowledge, without Islamic centers of learning, the West would have lost all of these inventions to the dark ages. Islam made the Renaissance possible. Technicalities aside, Obama’s speech pointed out the basic truth that without Islam, the West would be vastly different, and intellectually impoverished.
Peace.
Yes, the arab muslims did not create any of that, but certainly they kept and transmitted the knowledge the West had lost: that is their merit. And that’s not a small one. Obama should know better. By claiming the muslim world invented and discovered that, he does a misfavor to those people and makes a fool of himself.
The one who would flunk history is Frank J. Tipler, not Obama. If Tipler thinks being a “professor” of mathematical physics somehow makes him a qualified student of history, then he is wrong. I have studied the history of mathematics, and if my professor who taught me the history of mathematics ever read the nonsense being posted here by Tipler, he’d probably laugh at Tipler’s ignorance of history.
["Obama is not much of a “student of history” if he believes this. Almost every advance he attributes to the Muslims was due to someone else."]
Obama never even claimed that Muslims “invented” anything, but merely stated that they “developed” those things. Learn the difference.
["The non-Muslim Chinese invented the magnetic compass and printing (Gutenberg invented not printing, but movable type). The non-Muslim Hindu Indians invented algebra and the decimal numbering system. The non-Muslim European Christians invented the university."]
Gutenberg invented the movable type? Who are you kidding here? It was the Chinese who invented the movable type and the Koreans who invented the metal movable type, not Guttenberg. Granted the Muslims were only responsible for transferring printing and possibly the compass from East to West, but if you think Obama is bad enough for claiming that Muslims merely “developed” them, then you’re even worse for claiming that Europeans “invented” them. As for algebra, the Hindus did make important contributions to the subject, but it was Muslims who founded algebra as an independent discipline, developed the methods we use today to solve algebraic equations, and advanced the subject far more than any civilization before them. As for universities, the University of Al-Karaouine (founded by a Muslim woman, in fact) and Al-Azhar University were founded centuries before the first universities in Europe.
["I can’t address advances in medicine, but I have studied the history of astronomy and physics. The Muslims contributed nothing."]
Completely and utterly wrong. Again, just because you teach the subject, that does not make you an expert on the subject’s history. Ever heard of Ibn al-Haytham, otherwise known as Alhazen? Or what about Avicenna, Biruni, al-Tusi, Ibn al-Shatir, and many more Muslim physicists and astronomers? If you don’t even know who these men are, then your ignorant claims like “Muslims contributed nothing” mean nothing.
["All modern physics descends from Galileo (1564 -1642); all modern astronomy from Copernicus (1473-1543). If you study Galileo’s works carefully, as I have, you see that he started with the achievements of the Greek mathematical physicist Archimedes of Syracuse (c. 287 BC - c. 212 BC). If you study Copernicus’ works carefully, as I have, you will see that Copernicus’ great book On the Revolutions is essentially a heliocentric re-working of the geocentric astronomy textbook by the Greek Ptolemy (c. 90 AD - 168 AD). Copernicus mostly used even Ptolemy’s data for the positions of the planets."]
Wrong again. Ibn al-Haytham, or Alhazen, was developing an early form of experimental physics for his work in optics centuries before Galileo did the same for mechanics. Alhazen is now rightly regarded as the “father of optics” and is credited for developing the scientific method. Alongside the scientific method, even Galileo’s own theories in mechanics were strongly influenced by the theories of Islamic philosophers like Avicenna and Avempace. As for Copernicus, his heliocentric model was virtually identical to Ibn al-Shatir’s geocentric model but simply reversed to make it heliocentric. Copernicus also employed the Tusi couple and Urdi lemma (both developed by Muslim astronomers) for his model. Without the original contributions of Muslim astronomers/physicists/philosophers, the work of Galileo and Copernicus would never have been possible. As for Ptolemy, he was more likely a Hellenized Egyptian rather than a Greek. Again, crediting Europeans for the achievements of others (i.e. Chinese and Egyptians) isn’t helping your anti-Islamic agenda at all.
["Note the dates for Archimedes/Galileo and Ptolemy/Copernicus. It is as if the Muslim world never existed. As far as their fundamental contributions to physics and astronomy, it did not."]
That comment alone shows how ignorant you are of medieval history. Not only are you ignoring the work of Muslim scientists and philosophers during that time, but even the work of Christian European scientists and philosophers. The work of Galileo for example would never have been possible without the theories of John Philoponus or Jean Buridan, or the work of Roger Bacon (who introduced Alhazen’s scientific method to Europe).
["If one reads history of science textbooks prior to about 1980, one will find very little mention of Muslim “contributions” to physics and astronomy. This is reasonable, because there weren’t any. In the past generation, however, political correctness has dictated that Muslims be given credit for discoveries they did not make."]
Or rather, you are just bitter about the fact that your cherished traditionalist Eurocentric version of history is no longer accepted by a majority of historians. This is reasonable, because there are still millions of scientific Arabic/Persian/Chinese/Indian manuscripts waiting to be discovered in manuscript collections across the world. As time passes, it only makes sense that we will discover more about the contributions of those civilizations. As for “political correctness”, don’t even get me started on that ridiculous term. It’s a concept that doesn’t even exist as far as I’m concerned. And stop trying to drag politics into the discipline of history. History should be studied for its own sake, not for the service of politics. While Obama can also be criticized for this to some extent for re-wording historical facts for a political goal, you are even worse for actually changing history for the purpose of your political agenda.
["Certainly, the Muslims were a conduit for the discoveries of others. The word “algebra” is indeed derived from an Arabic word. The books of Archimedes and Ptolemy used by Galileo and Copernicus were indeed translations into Latin from the Arabic. But let us never forget that Archimedes and Ptolemy wrote their books in Greek, not Arabic. They were Greeks, not Muslims."]
Again, Ptolemy was more likely a Hellenized Egyptian rather than a Greek.
["The reason Muslims never developed fundamental physics is because the leading Muslim theologians declared the idea of fixed physical laws to be heretical. The Qur’an (verse 6:64) states: “The Jews have said, ‘God’s hand is fettered.’ Fettered are their hands, and they are cursed for what they have said. Nay, but His hands are outspread; He expends how He will.” The standard Muslim interpretation of this passage has been that there cannot be unchanging physical laws because Allah may change the laws at any moment. In 1982, the Institute for Policy Studies in Islamabad, Pakistan, criticized a chemistry textbook by saying: “There is latent poison present in the subheading Energy Causes Changes because it gives the impression that energy is the true cause rather than Allah. Similarly it is unIslamic to teach that mixing hydrogen and oxygen automatically produces water. The Islamic way is this: when atoms of hydrogen approach atoms of oxygen, then by the Will of Allah water is produced.” The implication is clear: next week, Allah may change his mind about water being a compound of hydrogen and oxygen. With this sort of worldview, how could one possibly be a scientist?"]
Not only are you are extending a single present-day Muslim interpretation of science across the entire Muslim world, but across the whole of Muslim history too? Muslims in Pakistan do not share the same opinions as Muslims elsewhere, nor do Muslims of today share the same opinions as Muslims of the Middle Ages. Your presentist approach to history would immediately fail you as a student of history.
["The cosmology of the Qur’an is obviously geocentric, and as a consequence, Al-Azhar University, which Obama singles out for praise in his speech, still teaches Ptolemaic astronomy."]
That proves nothing. Most universities in the world teach Ptolemaic astronomy as part of the history of astronomy. There is nothing “backwards” about teaching a historical system of astronomy.
["There was one truly great “Muslim” physicist, the Nobel Prize winning Pakistani, Mohammed Abdus Salam. I put “Muslim” in quotes, because Salam belonged to the Ahmadi sect of Islam, a sect that accepts modern science. But in 1974, the Pakistani parliament declared the Ahmadi sect heretical, and its members are currently being persecuted in Pakistan. Contemporary Muslim historians generally do not list Salam as an important Muslim scientist. Had he remained in Pakistan, he quite possibly would have been killed."]
Oh really? There are millions of Muslims, expecially Pakistanis, who proudly proclaim Abdus Salam as one of their own.
["During the Cold War, it was commonplace for leftist academics to attribute many discoveries to scientists in Communist countries, discoveries that had actually been made in the West. So now leftist academics attribute to Muslims discoveries that had actually been made by others."]
I have seen some academics who exaggerate the contributions of Muslims, but completely ignoring them altogether (like what you have been doing) is a far worse example of “history in the service of politics”.
["I never expected to hear a president of the United States do so."]
Again, learn the difference between “developed” and “invented”. Obama was clearly being careful with his wording there.
say what you want. the “right” made too many ridiculous mistakes and has us all looking stupid. while i agree this needless humiliation may be the manifested end of our time, no one can say we don’t deserve it. we elected him, after all. he’s the icing on the cake after the last 30-40(+) disgraceful years. maybe if we the people of united states of america make it through this admin we’ll be a little wiser and have our heads on our necks when choosing various candidates (seats of power). and that goes for “both” (all) sides of the political spectrum. no more garbage interests, either. that needs to end. otherwise, we go the way of the romans at the end of their republic. and history does not look kindly on that particular decision.
When I went to school in the U.S. the teachers always stated Arabic numerals , never mentioned Hindi numerals. I learned that by using Microsoft Office. Of course, I was in primary school 40 years ago. Is it possible that the seed of astronomy was planted through the Muslims who recognized lunar months to note a year. The Chinese call each month an animal name, maybe because they needed an Abacus to keep count.
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For folks like David S @ #23, who leave out information either due to ignorance or on purpose:
http://www-history.mcs.st-andrews.ac.uk/history/Projects/Pearce/index.html
Al-Azhar University — that carried the light of learning
Oh yeah they still carry that light as the world’s leading exporter of Jihad-Think
funny how Dem’s hear every dog whistle from an R- but are unable to hear these megaphone shouts