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What's the problem with quarantines? (self.subredditcancer)

DancesWithPugs が 投稿

I am on board with free speech and letting people express themselves. I also oppose bigotry, bullying, and shocking people who don't want to be shocked. When I looked at the banned and quarantine lists in the sidebar they are mostly racist or gore subs. It seems appropriate to me to have a warning page as they do. No rights are violated and you are helping regular users avoid edgelords and hatemongers.

Now I can't understand why some subs are banned and some are quarantined for essentially the same kind of content. Meanwhile if your sub hates a group it's somewhat fashionable on reddit to hate, like straight white men, there is no quarantine warning. Obviously there is some bias and politics in choosing who gets banned, who gets a warning page, who gets unrestricted speech, and who gets to control other's speech. I just want some consistency.

Your thoughts are welcome.

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[–]peebo_sanchez 14ポイント15ポイント  (8子コメント)

I think Reddit has just got up its own ass and made a civil war. It's sjws vs free speakers. IMO people take this site way to seriously. I used to come here for humor, to bitch about movies, and to see videos about dumb shit that made me laugh. Now it's like you have to be p.c. on certain subs or you get banned, or you have to be against sjws or you are a shill. Both sides have good points but I also think both sides need to go outside more and be in the real world because all this garbage is just making Reddit shittier and shittier everyday.

[–]DancesWithPugs[S] 1ポイント2ポイント  (7子コメント)

I mostly agree. It's not just reddit though. I love a site called Popehat, and they talk about attacks on free speech across the country, and reddit is barely mentioned. It's not just SJWs either trying to restrict speech, there are conservatives and all manner of government employees calling for censorship.

At the same time I defend principles like free speech, I get annoyed at trolls that want to use the freedom they have just to piss off others. A civil society needs a balance of permission to be yourself and respect for others. I worry that is being lost.

I oppose the SJWs not only because their style is a bit cultish, but because they don't really want to get rid of prejudice...but rather tell you which targets are okay to hate. I think all bigotry is dumb.

At the end of the day it is your time, at least you can choose to unsubscribe from the more obnoxious places.

Edits for formatting and stuff.

[–]peebo_sanchez 3ポイント4ポイント  (6子コメント)

Exactly. I didn't agree with subs like fatpeoplehate or coontown but its they're right to do that. I just didn't go to that sub. I used to like to go to punchablefaces because there are alot of people that have faces you just want to punch, it doesnt mean you hate them or even know them, but the fact that sjws took it over just to troll was fucking stupid. I mean I got shit in /r/movies yesterday because I said some of the movies I liked as a kid are gay. So they labled me as a homophobe, which is funny because I am far from it. I just wish people would stop trying to stop subs they don't agree with. If you don't like it then don't go to it. I don't like neo Nazis so I stay away from them when I go to punk shows. I don't like feminazis so I stay away from them when I go to protests and festivals.I don't like furries so I don't go to their websites. It's that easy. I just don't get how people get so upset about shit on the internet.

Sorry about the giant paragraph I've been drinking and I'm on my phone so I don't care for proper sentence structure

[–]DancesWithPugs[S] 3ポイント4ポイント  (4子コメント)

Everyone must be the same person with the same values!

I am a huge fan of comedy, including material considered edgy or offensive. If we got rid of every objectionable joke or sensitive topic there would be nothing left to make fun of. I like movies. You're telling me we can't have tits and guns in an R picture because someone doesn't like it. Same with video games, art, philosophy... without free expression culture dies.

[–]peebo_sanchez 1ポイント2ポイント  (3子コメント)

I said in a thread earlier (I can't remember which one) but I said I think k its ridiculous how /r/movies gets mad at me for saying gay when they worship tarantino even though he says nigger in almost every dialogue he has in his movies. But its OK for him to do that because he's a "genius" even though I think he's a hack and just rips off grindhouse movie fight scenes and just adds shitty dialogue and feet to everyone of his movies. Yet I'm the homophobe for saying gay not in a derogatory sense or aiming it at anyone. 

I really just want people to leave the "I'm better than you because I'm so p.c." mentality out of discussions and just go back to talking about things instead of going around and brigading or doxxing people because they want to find something to bitch about and report so they can feel better about their shitty lives.

[–]DancesWithPugs[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

I gave up using the word gay like that when I realized it was hurting the feelings of people I care about. If you want to say it that's your business.

Usually the language police just like to dogpile, and they don't want to think about their own hypocrisy or how their attacks make people feel.

[–]peebo_sanchez 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

I say it as a way like saying stupid or retarded but apparently you're not allowed to say those either. I never use them in a sense to bring someone down. If I say this movie was gay that just means it was stupid to me. It's not like I say that movie was totally homosexual and likes to bang movies of the same gender. But people take it in different ways. I have plenty of gay friends who still say faggot and all that stuff. But everyone takes things differently I just wish people wouldn't be so sensitive about every damn word out there

[–]DancesWithPugs[S] -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

It would be nice if everyone had a thick skin and we could all joke around freely, but that's not the world we live in. Many people grew up severely bullied by peers, parents, or others and so they will always be sensitive to certain words and situations. The sensitivity can be a social barrier because if you are being consciously careful it is hard to also be relaxed and natural.

[–]swingmymallet 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Coontown had a lot of good information. Sure there were racist idiots, but there was also very intelligent people making very detailed and well made arguments

And there was some pretty funny jokes

[–]NechaevSurgeon General 5ポイント6ポイント  (18子コメント)

Aside from the email requirement, I don't have a major problem with putting a tier of ultra-offensive subreddits into a quarantine area.

The problem for me is in the selective enforcement of the system.

Take a look at /r/drawpeople and explain how it belongs in quarantine.

[–]Bojangles_Unchained 3ポイント4ポイント  (4子コメント)

Because /r/Quranimals needs an account with a verified email, but /r/ProlapseVille is fine and dandy. They also took away our custom images and ability to see the number of users out of spite. It's stupid.

What's wrong with just using NSFW for both?

[–]DancesWithPugs[S] -4ポイント-3ポイント  (3子コメント)

I am a firm opponent of Islam, but if you guys want to throw cultural / ethnic slurs around there will be reactive consequences. I think messages carry more weight when they aren't loaded with prejudicial tropes.

[–]Bojangles_Unchained 2ポイント3ポイント  (2子コメント)

But /r/ProlapseVille and fucked up porn subs like that are okay. Why does shit like that escape "quarantine" but a sub where we say "towelhead" doesn't? They're not trying to protect anyone from offensive content, they're trying to make the site less enjoyable for us evil racists.

[–]DancesWithPugs[S] -5ポイント-4ポイント  (1子コメント)

I guess the admins want to restrict certain kinds of intolerance and not others.

No matter how hard you try I'm not going to look at anuses or support racism.

You have a right to free speech, now please go do something productive with it. Linking opposition to Islam with racism isn't helping anyone or anything.

[–]GuyAboveIsStupid 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm not going to look at anuses or support racism

So don't subscribe to them? The quarantine system is retarded

[–]EugeneNix 4ポイント5ポイント  (1子コメント)

Problem with quarantine is that the extra stuff: removing css and pics, subscriber count, etc. Somewhat clever but a very dishonest way of social engineering the site to have a more twitter like userbase.

Get back to me when left wing hate subreddits get banned or quarantined.

[–]DancesWithPugs[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I think we're on the same page here.

[–]RandomExcess 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't typically visit those subs unless they make it to the front page so either way I am not affected in any substantial way.

[–]Ricwulf 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

I think it would be just how restricted it is. If it were simply having an additional warning saying "This is a quarantine sub! Are you sure you want to continue?" similar to the 18+ page, and they page was restricted from reaching the front page (EG restrict it to their corner, like a quarantine would be), then fine.

The issue is that the quarantine requires not only a reddit account, but an email validated account. I have no doubt that this is to put people onto a list. There is literally no other reason why that would be a thing.

The only subs that I would allow to be banned are ones that are illegal (Child Porn for example), or those that incite violence against other people (Not hate, but actual violence, even more so if it is planned there). Quarantine is a subjective thing, but if the Reddit majority want to hold a public vote for this of what should and shouldn't be quarantined, then I would be on board for such a system.

[–]DancesWithPugs[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yes I understand now why quarantines as implemented are questionable at the very least.

If it were up to me I would unban just about everything, with specific disclaimers on the rough or cruel subs. Instead of quarantines have warnings like, "This sub contains disturbing gore," or, "this contains racial slurs" etc.

[–]TRVDante 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

The only problem I have with quarantines is that the quarantined subs don't get CSS.

[–]PM_ME_DOGECOINS 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm against any kind of quarantines because it is the same as saying "hey, you're now responsible for my own emotions".

I don't give a shit whether someone is offended by something or not, this is not my problem, it is this person's problem and that person is the one who has to deal with it, not everyone else.

All reddit had to do was to give individual users an option to completely ignore chosen subreddits and have an option of warning an user when the user's trying to access it. Problem solved - there's no drama, no sides to choose, there's only you, your own beliefs and your own conscience. Not only that, it forces you to adapt and to take things less seriously.

But I suppose that's too much to ask of people who think that there's some kind of conspiracy against everyone who isn't white and male.

[–]videogameboss -2ポイント-1ポイント  (144子コメント)

i see the problem as two fold: the first is that there is a lot of valuable information and statistics on "racist" subreddits. the second is the collection of emails has no justification and could be misused.

[–]swingmymallet 4ポイント5ポイント  (143子コメント)

That info goes against the narrative.

Cant have that.

I just got banned from r politics for showing facts and stats and causing people to get red pilled

[–]TotesMessenger 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm a bot, bleep, bloop. Someone has linked to this thread from another place on reddit:

If you follow any of the above links, please respect the rules of reddit and don't vote in the other threads. (Info / Contact)

[–]NinjaNetizen -2ポイント-1ポイント  (8子コメント)

So, you are "pro free speech", but wish offensive things that YOU take offense to (edit: even if meant in satire - like /r/racoonsareniggers) to be quarantined. Yet things that indulge actual illegal activities like /r/incest, is completely ok?

[–]DancesWithPugs[S] -1ポイント0ポイント  (7子コメント)

Troll.

[–]NinjaNetizen -2ポイント-1ポイント  (6子コメント)

I am a troll. But at least I admit it. That's the point. We tried to be offensive, we did it on purpose. I was one of the first people in /r/drawpeople as well. You can't claim you want an honest intellectual discussion about quarantine subs when you are excluding the people who run them.

[–]DancesWithPugs[S] -1ポイント0ポイント  (5子コメント)

Whatever.

[–]NinjaNetizen -2ポイント-1ポイント  (4子コメント)

Awesome discussion we had here, glad you could be so open minded.

[–]DancesWithPugs[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (3子コメント)

You say you're a troll who wants sincere discussion. That doesn't make any sense, brah.

[–]NinjaNetizen 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

I say I am a troll, but Im willing to engage in sincere debate outside of character because you seemed to ask in earnest. consider it a type of personal AMAA

[–]DancesWithPugs[S] 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Okay then. My position after talking with you feisty people is roughly the same as when I started, but more precise now that I know how quarantines work. Warning pages should stay. Common decency does not need to trample on freedom, and neither should be neglected. Quarantines as implemented are not kosher, possibly draconian. I feel uncomfortable having you fuckers as strange bedfellows in my opposition to censorship, doxxing and shaming campaigns. I think trolls should get a new hobby that isn't based on mental cruelty. If they want to be dark and funny and juvenile off in their own little corner of the internet, so be it. You can't take the moral high ground or claim to have won the argument if you won't let your opposition speak. You write naughty words on the interwebs so I am not even going to bother formatting this comment. Put that in your pipe and smoke it.

[–]NinjaNetizen 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

firstly a spelling correction

doxxing

historically, it is spelled with one 'x'. this is a legitimate criticism, and you would do well to follow it from an internet citizens perspective. even the admins fuck this up. it's quite embarassing.

Warning pages should stay. Common decency does not need to trample on freedom, and neither should be neglected. Quarantines as implemented are not kosher, possibly draconian.

i agree with this

I feel uncomfortable having you fuckers as strange bedfellows in my opposition to censorship, doxxing and shaming campaigns. I think trolls should get a new hobby that isn't based on mental cruelty

i cannot fault you this, as i do it on purpose. you might find it funny if you knew me IRL. but it is not based on mental anguish, to try and illustrate from my perspective it is based on mental learning. "if you cant deal with this online, how will you deal with it when you find someone IRL?"

If they want to be dark and funny and juvenile off in their own little corner of the internet, so be it

i dont disagree, but people keep linking troll "hangouts", exposing them on purpose. if a troll tries to stay hidden and secluded, and some white knight decides it is their duty to show the world, who is at fault for showing the masses?

You can't take the moral high ground or claim to have won the argument if you won't let your opposition speak

most "troll" areas actually encourage their opposition to speak. notice how very few people are banned from here? they are tagged with their respective ideologies(simplified). this enabled trolls to practice, as it were.

Put that in your pipe and smoke it.

sober for longer than it takes to grow a child, but thank you for your offer