上位 200 件のコメント表示する 500

[–]komandantmirko 878ポイント879ポイント  (50子コメント)

what?

i was promised children are making my shoes, not full grown women.

this is an outrage

[–]Marswhalbaconattor [スコア非表示]  (23子コメント)

Title Should read: "WHERE Nike shoes are made"

0/10 did not learn how to make Nike shoes.

[–]foggydogg [スコア非表示]  (9子コメント)

I'm impressed. I always thought my shoes were made by machines. I have a new respect for Nike and its hand-made products.

[–]200iso [スコア非表示]  (5子コメント)

Turns out a lot of things you'd think were made by machines are actually made by low paid humans because they're cheaper than machines.

I think Planet Money did an episode on this, but I can't seem to find it.

[–]RotorHeadz [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Maybe it's the same generation of kids that started the controversy but they're just adults now...not really...but maybe.

[–]McMalloc [スコア非表示]  (7子コメント)

I can promise you they are not beaten any less, does that make it better?

[–]_sosneaky [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

Kind of. Can you tell us another bedtime story uncle mcmalloc?

[–]McMalloc [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

You see those windows on the right? These peoples' parents, and their grandparents before them, jumped out of those very same windows. They go back generations.

[–]Ripsaw99 172ポイント173ポイント  (14子コメント)

...pretty much my office building without the drop down ceilings

[–]retroper 156ポイント157ポイント  (15子コメント)

How Nike nearly all shoes are made

[–]kelev [スコア非表示]  (12子コメント)

How Nike nearly all shoes everything you own are is made

[–]Bandits_Love_Shack 187ポイント188ポイント  (32子コメント)

How do you expect them to be made?

[–]FireButt [スコア非表示]  (19子コメント)

by machines. Machines controlled by children. Those children controlled by bigger machines. Those bigger machines controlled by one fat white guy living in Taiwan. That one fat white guy living in Taiwan being controlled by that one fat taiwanese guy in the US. That one fat taiwanese guy living in the US being controlled by Nike Corporate. Nike Corporate being controlled by Donald Trump. Donald Trump being controlled by Champ.

[–]Mzamike [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

So people with sewing machines. Is it supposed to be shocking because there are a lot of people and workstations or because they are not white?

[–]Peter_Nincompoop [スコア非表示]  (7子コメント)

I was hoping they'd be made "well", but experience tells me they're not. Shoes today are fucking garbage, and they fall apart far sooner than they should. Glue is no substitute for stitching.

[–]I_love_swiss_cheese [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Compared to what? I am pretty doubtful they were made better in 1990, 1980, 1970. And prior to the industrial revolution shoes were very expensive.

[–]ForumWarrior [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Also cobblers still exist. If people wanted to pay the same percentage of income for a pair of shoes that people used to pay a cobbler, I'm sure they could be made pretty damn good today.

[–]ElonShmuk [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

It sounds like you're just buying really cheap shoes, like generic box store brand shoes or something. My shoes tend to last me through years of abuse and when they do get replaced it's only because they're ugly from being so old.

[–]skoopydoo 373ポイント374ポイント  (50子コメント)

Is this supposed to make me feel bad? Because it doesn't

[–]AngryAnuses 149ポイント150ポイント  (43子コメント)

Yea it doesn't look bad at all, the working conditions look fine.

[–]tombuzz 92ポイント93ポイント  (40子コメント)

Not to jump in here on either side but yes physically this doesn't look bad. But working conditions also include what they get payed... Do they get breaks... Time off? How many hours must they work a week.. How long do they work at a time... Are their dangerously high quotas that can lead to injury... I think we are all willing to pay a few extra $ for ethically produced items but all that matters to every company is....... Increasing their share price....

[–]onlyacynicalman 130ポイント131ポイント  (19子コメント)

Unfortunately this photograph captured none of that

[–]ShutYourFaceJabroni 8ポイント9ポイント  (12子コメント)

Which is why it's ridiculous to say "oh those working conditions look fine". You don't see the working conditions.

[–]ballpitpredator [スコア非表示]  (3子コメント)

Well i was only given one picture...

[–]Peter_Nincompoop [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

How dare you come to reddit, look at a picture, and then act like you don't deserve to be scolded like a child.

[–]AudioPhoenix 11ポイント12ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well I think people usually think of children working in Nike factories and have an image of something like dirt floors and slave masters, so this isn't quite as bad.

[–]what_mustache [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

But you could take a photo of virtually any office in any country and ask the same questions.

[–]enjoytheshow 1ポイント2ポイント  (4子コメント)

I think we are all willing to pay a few extra $ for ethically produced items

All? Some people are. Nike would get loyal customers to stay but if they started charging say double for their shoes just so they could be manufactured locally or in more reasonable foreign working conditions, they would get a lot less people buying them. Some other company with much less ethical standards would just undercut them and take their lost customers.

Of course, I do think Nike has a lot of markup on their clothes that they have room to play with. No way a fucking dry fit running top should cost $50+ They could increase working conditions and increase price by <10% and still have nice profits. Problem is those profits wouldn't be as nice as they are now.

[–]Lumn8tion [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

Sure, they could afford to pay a decent wage with benefits to manufacture these shoes but it would have to come out of their profit which looks bad to the all mighty investors. They already see a profit and want more. Every quarter. Like u/mk0v said, s/he wouldn't pay more but may no't realize that $150 a pair is already a ridiculous amount to pay for a shoe. A price that could pay for a decent wage but cut into profits. How long does it take to make a pair of shoes? Let's say an hour. So even if they pay $75/hr (never) they still double their money. (I know there is more involved, just keeping it simple)
The fact is we're already paying the equivalent of a Union Made in America product.

TL;DR The problem with rich people is they can never be rich enough.

[–]mk0v [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

The issue is people buy Nike's, I'm sure for a similar cost or maybe 50$ more you could make shoes in USA that rival or beat the quality. I've got a Mission Workshop bag thats made in the USA that I love.

[–]gropingforelmo [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

My dad swears by New Balance 990s. Made in America, and super comfy. They're ~$150 a pair and look like dad shoes, but I almost bought a pair myself just because they're so well made.

[–]DhakaGuy [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I am guessing all of the answer to your questions are yes. Even though I do not know anything about this particular factory but I have seen a few of the mass produce garments factories. When an owner goes into this much of work of having a sustainable , worker friendly environment they do not skimp on worker wages, breaks et c.

[–]4e657264 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Nike in response to criticism in the 90's improved the conditions in their factories overseas and also started an organization to help other companies enforce standards when working through overseas contractors(most violations are through 3rd party contractors). They really don't get enough credit for this.

[–]Aussie_chopperpilot [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

How can you feel bad for kids that are learning a trade and have an income? I say nay.

[–]testudoaubreii 11ポイント12ポイント  (1子コメント)

Looks a lot nicer than some factories I've worked in in the US!

[–]pgcooldad 652ポイント653ポイント  (93子コメント)

Before this Nike factory, these people had no means to improve their life's, nor their kids. Within two generations, there will be many college educated people whose grandparents worked at these factories. This factory looks clean and well lit. You've never seen a foundry, steel mill, casting, or heat-treat factory in the USA have you?

Edit. To the naysayers of second generation gains. When I came to the USA in 1976 cheap things were made in Japan, then Taiwan, Mexico, China, Indonesia, now it's moving out of China into India and African could tries. Have these economies improved in the last 50 years? Absolutely, and every little bit counts.

[–]IIIIIIIIIIlIl 452ポイント453ポイント  (43子コメント)

OP never made any statement that this was bad somehow, they just said this is how Nike shoes are made, you came here with a presupposition.

[–]bcos4life 295ポイント296ポイント  (7子コメント)

I don't know, man. I kind of feel like the "Sweat shop indentured servitude" was implied. But you're right, no claim to it was made by OP.

[–]mycommentsaccount [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Yeah but why do we pay so much when they're made by little slave kids? What are their overheads?

[–]Peter_Nincompoop [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

The only implications here were supplied by yourself. If you saw this image and jumped to that conclusion, it's you that has the bias. Not trying to start an argument, just pointing it out.

[–]Mythic514 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

The person making a claim is the one who implies something. The person hearing the claim is the one who infers something.

[–]fedupwithpeople [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Ahh, thank you. Good to know I'm not the only one.

[–]Open_To_Suggestions_ [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

I started off with that train of thought until I zoomed in and noticed how clean that place is compared to my work!

[–]Matrillik [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

You're right, but this post is clearly going to inspire bad thoughts for anyone who has ever heard of sweatshops from their local news media outlet. This sort of thing has become embedded in the minds of the masses and I think it has become important to quash these kinds of misconceptions.

Good on you, /u/pgcooldad

[–]rblue [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I did as well, but the presupposition is based on other shit that's posted on Reddit, and the general vibe here.

[–]GODDDDD [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

I made that assumption because all we can see is people in a factory making shoes. It's a fairly uninteresting picture when there's no statement behind it

[–]Midianite_Caller [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Factory work anywhere is pretty dull, I imagine. Right, there's nothing in this picture that looks bad without further information about conditions and pay.

[–]FappDerpington [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

OP didn't make the statement, and I haven't read down the comments yet, but I'll guarantee you it's down there!!!

[–]ifuckwithpizzacrust [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Are you telling me that I got all heated and ready for the circle jerk for NOTHIN!? What am I supposed to do with this -----E !!!????

[–]Homerpaintbucket 28ポイント29ポイント  (4子コメント)

Within two generations, there will be many college educated people whose grandparents worked at these factories.

Only if they have a labor movement. It's not just industrialization that improves people's lives. It's better working conditions and most importantly better pay. Things sucked for most people during the guilded age.

edit; yup, I used the wrong gild. I'm leaving it so others can enjoy my misuse of the English language.

[–]crazindndude 8ポイント9ポイント  (0子コメント)

guilded age

Heh, if anything I imagine the guilds helped artisans and craftsmen improve their lot by organizing. Hell, guilds were probably the medieval precursors to unions.

Now, the Gilded Age on the other hand...

[–]toThe9thPower [スコア非表示]  (5子コメント)

Within two generations, there will be many college educated people whose grandparents worked at these factories.

I think that is a bit of a stretch. At the very least it is a completely made up claim that has no proof backing it up. Why do you say this? Because it happened in America? How is that proof it will happen for these people? I am not even saying it can't, but you made a bold claim that isn't backed up by anything.

EDIT: I definitely wasn't blaming Nike for this.

Here is my made up claim...

"These people will be disenfranchised and treated poorly for generations to come. They will work long hours for little pay, and while sadly this job will be amazing considering their location and other jobs available, they will still be essentially slave labor. It will continue because countries like mine greatly benefit from this cheap labor."

Now lets just see who ends up making the more accurate prediction.

[–]blazershorts [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Its happened in the US, UK, Japan, Korea, Taiwan, and a few more. Textiles are the how countries industrialize.

[–]ImThatMOTM [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

It will continue because china has very little regulation. I'm tired of the self-blaming masochistic attitude of western liberals, Nike didn't make the fucking laws. Yes, it is in Americas interest to outsource to China for relatively high-quality low-cost manufacturing - but Nike didn't force them into a position where these jobs are their best option. Nike gave them the best option in their atrocious situation.

[–]louiegumba 13ポイント14ポイント  (14子コメント)

First of all - no one said a thing. Those workers look like they are doing well. They are probably making little to nothing wages however.

More to your point about them not having jobs before us - That's a corporate free trade talking point. those poor people, let's give them more jobs from the U.S. so they can succeed and we can continue or slow, but accelerating slide into oligarchy.

Speaking as an American, this American company should have American butts in the seats. I will never understand how people get convinced like suckers that it's a good thing to let someone else have your job 5000 miles away for one tenth your wages so you can hit the unemployment line.

Despite the workers looking happy, there is a reason they are making shoes there. Because the labor laws are so nonexistent that these people might love in that same factory in small cages. They might work 16 hours a day. Then again they may not, the picture has no context. Maybe the company just wants to be nice to their workers and give out high paying livable wage jobs. I doubt it though.

[–]wellillbebuggered [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

My GF used to work in a factory like this in Thailand when she was younger. Workday was 10 hrs x 6 days a week. The girls slept in dorms of 60 people. 3 tier bunks around the room and lockers in the middle. $100 p/m. Rice was free. Pay for anything else. She left after 1 year as she felt she was going crazy, living hand to mouth. She got a job cleaning at a restaurant which was harder work but paid better and free food! Not all employers are bad however and this kind of work has improved the life of hundreds of thousands of people if they work for the right companies. Health and safety issues have always been a grey area in SEA but has improved over the last 10 yrs in most of these kind of factories.

[–]Matrillik [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I think the point of the comment was to avoid any misinterpretation that people may carry just from knowing all the previous sweatshop scandals.

[–]toga-Blutarsky [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Do you not understand just how expensive those shoes would be if they were made in the US? I'm a very liberal person and a big advocate for American manufacturing and labor unions but consumer goods that are mass produced are far cheaper when manufactured in other countries. Good luck being able to afford clothes and electronics built in the US.

[–]pefyeah [スコア非表示]  (4子コメント)

Do you like wearing shoes that you can afford, and still are durable enough to wear regularly? Well then, "American Made" is out of the question.

I've had first hand experience with the textiles business deference in quality and price when comparing domestic production versus international production. I helped a few friends start a snowboard clothing company called Grenade Gloves. First year we outsourced our production to China. Our second year, we built a small factory in Mammoth, CA. The product quality took a huge dive. Materials were more expensive, workmanship was a lower quality, and productivity was way down. After two more years, we shut down the factory, and outsourced back to China.

Unskilled American workers are lazy and expensive compared to their Asian counterparts. And it's very hard to make a profit and a solid product using American labor.

[–]MidEastBeast777 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Unskilled American workers are lazy

Fuck me if that isn't the truest thing I've read all day

[–]sighbourbon [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Within two generations, there will be many college educated people whose grandparents worked at these factories.

i'd love to see a source for this highly specific statement. i'd seriously be interested.

personally I'm curious about all the workers being female and the supervisors male. local cultural bias? Nike policy?

[–]kekehippo [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

Funny, because it doesn't work like that at all. As romantic as that sounds, these shops generally don't provide enough to give kids in those countries and education. Least not those who are doing the sewing.

How do I know this? My wife worked at a garment factory and the normal every day worker do not get paid very well.

[–]trecht 7ポイント8ポイント  (0子コメント)

Looks clean, well lit and pretty spacious, not as bad as I were made to believe

[–]smokyexe 12ポイント13ポイント  (1子コメント)

This is known, no? You guys haven't seen a factory before?

[–]PMmeYourNoodz 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Looks like a pretty well maintained production line.

[–]philsown [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Just as I suspected: In a FACTORY!

[–]rahtin [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Yeah, it's called a factory. We have them here too.

[–]DannoSpeaks 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

I can almost make out Frank and Mac behind the glass partition wall in the back.

[–]VusterJones 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

"My friend Joey sewed his hands together!"

[–]bogueart 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

So? what's the point here? that they have jobs?

[–]signaldistress 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

This is exactly how I pictured Nike shoes being made

[–]coswaldoobblepot [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Those "chairs", if you can even call them that, look incredibly uncomfortable.

[–]Chillindode [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Not nearly as much sweat as I was expecting

[–]efficiens [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

The outrage isn't the poor working conditions, but the fact that Nikes aren't cheap despite their low cost of production.

Also, does any factory look enjoyable?

[–]brownje04 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

I had the opportunity to visit a Nike Factory in Vietnam about 7 years ago during a study abroad in Asia. I was actually pretty impressed with the conditions (similar to this picture). While im sure we were probably taken to their best/nicest factory and fed a bunch of BS lines, I didn't think anything was any more degrading than a US factory. We also got to have a face to face with the Director of Marketing (IIRC) and she explained to us that these workers were paid I think ~$75 a week (I need to double check my journal) which was above the average in that country. Thus making these employees pretty well compensated among their peers. And basically that if it wasn't for Nike being in this part of town, these people would be in poverty. But again, who knows how accurate all of this was, it was still pretty cool to visit..... Now, a Chinese Steel mill on the other hand....

[–]juanlee337 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

so just like every other factory?

[–]plarpplarp [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

How dare Nike create job opportunities! The monsters!

[–]jordan460 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

This isn't how, this is where

[–]yesMDaware 2ポイント3ポイント  (17子コメント)

Alternate title: This is what work looks like if you aren't fortunate enough to have been born in a first world country.

[–]BeanerSA 61ポイント62ポイント  (3子コメント)

I'm sure a mass production facility in a first world country wouldn't look too much different.

[–]Bigmizar 18ポイント19ポイント  (1子コメント)

I've worked for a baby shoes factory in Quebec City and it looks a lot like this factory.

[–]thrush77 13ポイント14ポイント  (0子コメント)

I worked in a factory in the US, it looked very much like this except we stood all day.

[–]I_am_Bob 11ポイント12ポイント  (0子コメント)

Work in a foundry in the US, the Nike factory looks nicer.

[–]rblue [スコア非表示]  (2子コメント)

American here. Our local ALCOA plant is super old, and looks so much worse than this factory. I mean, pay is good and benefits are good, but if I showed a pic, removed the white people, added Asians, and told you this is how metal is formed in Thailand, there'd be some outrage.

[–]PandaBearShenyu 8ポイント9ポイント  (0子コメント)

You've clearly never worked in your life... go to any factory in wherever you live.

[–]Grippler 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

*and have no education

[–]agha0013 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Until we build machines that can spit out fully finished products with no human help, this is reality. Shoes need to be made by someone, and what with Western demand being what it is, it takes a LOT of people to make all the shoes the world needs, especially cheap ones.

Unless we want to go back to having our shoes custom made by they local cobbler, take weeks, cost hundreds of dollars, then this is the reality.

Some companies have really improved their working conditions, and new middle class societies are forming in developing nations thanks to factory work (that used to be done in North America for example)

The world is growing up, and eventually the playing field will be rather level. If that means reduced quality of life in North America and Europe to meet the rising quality of life elsewhere... well we had it coming.

If not, if somehow quality of life can come up to our level worldwide (which would be hard to do) then that'd be awesome, but I'm not holding my breath.

[–]dogfish83 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Brings new meaning to the slogan "just do it."

[–]tomparker 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Looks alot like how IT gets done these days. We're moving to the crowd.

What?

[–]kelev 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

*How everything you own is made.

[–]hannylicious [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

They're not going to make themselves...

[–]Pink-Flying-Pie [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

WHAT SHOES ARE MADE WITH A SOWING MACHINE BY WORKERS IN AN EASTERN COUNTRY? who would have thought that?!?!?!

[–]balloonman_magee [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Cool. Now put down the camera and get back to work.

[–]DelusionalX1 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Woman in the sixth row, fourth spot is forgetting to glue the sole on my current Nike Sweepers. Thanks, Chinese lady!

[–]arcadiajohnson [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Well at least they're all making a living wage

[–]electricoutlet2 [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

I bet if this were in the us we would work more hours now days.

[–]Mr_Claypole [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

If only we still had such manufacturing mass employment in the UK. We make hardly anything these days, our economy is propped up by international investment banking. If our financial sector all upped sticks to another country we'd be pretty fukked.

[–]JudasGoat82 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

That is a lot of jobs that america doesn't have.

[–]Mharkan [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Yup, just like everything else they make thousands and thousands of: they're made in a factory.

[–]donutcatz [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Three weeks ago people were bitching that robots were taking away jobs. People called me a monster for suggesting that replacing repetitive jobs was good, and would provide alternative work opportunities. Suddenly this thread, all sweat shop jokes.

[–]1violentdrunk [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Nice, I figured they were made by machines. For them to be handmade only increases their value

[–]ranak3 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Total employee payroll for the building: $43/day

[–]notarower [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

I visited one of this shops in Taiwan, it's really amazing seeing all those people laboring away elbow to elbow. And they're really efficient too, they have the whole process down to a science. A real marvel of capitalism.

[–]iams3cond [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

What? How dare nike employ real people instead of machines. This is an outrage.

[–]Ramza_Claus [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

That's why these shoes have: a bit of an attitude!

[–]Clevererer [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Haha that's what most open floorplan OFFICES look like these days.

[–]Kml0we [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

On the next episode of How Its Made!

[–]frankenham [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

I think I've discovered a worldwide solution to sweatshops-

air conditioners.

[–]WilliamMelvinHicks [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

For anyone interested in a deeper look into Chinese manufacturing, I highly suggest the documentary Manufactured Landscapes. It contains some excellent cinematography as well.

[–]nhingy [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

What is this doing here?! First Ed Sheeran liking music and now a picture of a factory?

TIL shoes are made in factories and Ed Sheeran likes rap.

I'm going to need to find somewhere else for my entertainment.

[–]scoldeddog [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Hummmm, they look older than I expected.

[–]jayhawkaholic [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

They make you jump higher.. when the sowing needle pierces your fingernail.

[–]LuolDengue [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Read "Smoke From a Hired Gun: A Critique of Nike's Labor and Environmental Auditing in Vietnam as performed by Ernst & Young" to realize the lengths Nike will go to protect its public image.

[–]daweasel [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Well, were you expecting something like this: http://imgur.com/N0MQsvY ? Because you'll have to pay much more to have shoes handmade by one man...

[–]Timbo925 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Now if they could make some Jordan 11 retro's I can buy at retail, that be nice...

[–]NewToUni [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Wait a minute. You mean the shoe elves don't sneak in at night and make the shoes? Or did you think that it was just one old guy making all these millions of shoes? Or all robots? I'm confused why this is surprising.

[–]Stoffel_1982 [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Looks like a highly productive environment.