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Nubsly-Wildcard Game Moderator[M] が 2時間前 投稿
残りのコメントをみる →
[–]LommyGreenhands -29ポイント-28ポイント-27ポイント 1時間前* (68子コメント)
As many awesome things as you guys continue to constantly do, I find myself regularly confused when Friday's patch still hasn't hit on Sunday afternoon. With all of the things you guys are awesome at, and all of the awesome team members you have, don't you think you could work a little harder on your timeframes? I don't even mean push it out faster, I mean just stop telling us it will be done multiple days before it is.
I'm sure my post comes off as whiny and demanding. I would probably see it that way, but I feel like this has happened enough times to where even you guys would be like "You know, maybe we should start giving ourselves a few extra days instead of scheduling patches incredibly far in advance only for it to be nowhere close when the deadline hits?"
Edit: The circlejerk downvoting in this subreddit is crazy guys. Take a step back and realize how dumb you have to be to try and silence logic geared at improving the community.
[–]Dregoran 17ポイント18ポイント19ポイント 1時間前 (67子コメント)
They stated long ago they would probably never hit a deadline on time. ETA's are just that and people need to stop taking them as fact. Early access has been around long enough for people to know that game development rarely works out as planned time frame wise. When has a game ever been released on time, any patch in any game ever been released on time. Hell half the time WoW, a very well established game has their patches delayed still and they aren't early access.
[+]LommyGreenhands スコアが基準値未満のコメント-14ポイント-13ポイント-12ポイント 1時間前 (66子コメント)
ETA's are just that and people need to stop taking them as fact.
What are you even estimating though? Don't you try to estimate correctly? Isnt that the point of estimating? If a team scored 100 points 100 games in a row, wouldnt it be bad form to estimate that they would score 500 points in the next one?
Or, if it took you 10 minuts to walk to the store every day, wouldnt it make sense to estimate that your walk will take about 10 minutes? Instead of 3?
[–]Dregoran 3ポイント4ポイント5ポイント 1時間前 (21子コメント)
You can't compare estimating walking time to coding/development.
So you take your normal walking path, uh oh it's a long ass train. Your 10 minutes just turned into 15-20. Now imagine hitting 7 or 8 or 10 of those trains in a row cause you're sleep deprived and out of your mind trying to push content for the masses.
[+]LommyGreenhands スコアが基準値未満のコメント-15ポイント-14ポイント-13ポイント 1時間前 (20子コメント)
Now, imagine that happening every single time. Wouldn't you start to plan for it?
I get it, I'm not going to convince you even with solid logic and there is no room for developer criticism on this subreddit.
[–]GravGunner 1ポイント2ポイント3ポイント 1時間前 (1子コメント)
But for how many trains are you going to plan? You don't know their schedule, and every time they vary in length. Also, there is an unknown amount of time to go around it.
[+]LommyGreenhands スコアが基準値未満のコメント-6ポイント-5ポイント-4ポイント 1時間前 (0子コメント)
But we do know their schedule. Thats the point.
[–]DeedayFace 3ポイント4ポイント5ポイント 1時間前 (13子コメント)
Wouldn't you start to plan for it?
And you can't?
You're the person who can go about your life under the assumption that patches are going to be late. It's a simple thought.
They're the ones who actually have to make the call. They're the ones actually working in the office and have to make a call only to have a tester find something big at the last minute. Before you get all pissy, could you maybe try putting yourself in the shoes of the guy trying to give an accurate call and every goddamn time something comes up that's out of your control and then a bunch of people on the internet get all bent out of shape and attack you over it.
There are much more deserving people to channel angst toward. Shit, there are much more deserving game developers to channel angst toward. Many, many of them. This is one little $30 video game with some of the most consumer friendly developers in the industry right now, that in twenty years you're going to forget you ever even played, and a patch has been delayed by two days and people are getting all offended and salty at these developers.
FFS be an adult and deal with it. Anyone pissy with these developers is just ignorant. They respond at length to posts left and right in this subreddit. Many additions to the game were pulled directly from this subreddit. It's not that people crucify anyone who criticizes (I myself posted the other day pointing out how they broke the gorilla throw) it's that there are more and more people on this subreddit who can't handle controlling their emotions when they get frustrated and rather than provide constructive criticism they get all hostile and salty. I've been seeing more and more posts include things like "the devs obviously don't care about this" or threats about how many people they know are going to quit if X isn't fixed right now.
Good criticism is well received and supported on this subreddit. Salty, butthurt criticism can be met with contention sometimes, yeah. If you feel like no one on this subreddit wants to listen to your criticisms it's likely your problem and not everyone else's.
[–]LommyGreenhands -4ポイント-3ポイント-2ポイント 59分前 (12子コメント)
Tldr
I started to read and respond to this before realizing that given my OP, you are hands down the most brown nosing bandwagony circle jerker I have ever seen. I hope your life gets better.
[–]DeedayFace 1ポイント2ポイント3ポイント 54分前* (11子コメント)
Works for me. It's clear enough that you've got nothing with what we already have right here.
Have fun criticizing software developers who make games.
[–]LommyGreenhands -3ポイント-2ポイント-1ポイント 51分前 (10子コメント)
I am not even convinced that half of you speak English as your first language.. You guys keep saying shit that given the context makes no sense.
"Youve got nothin with what we already have here"
wtf was I supposed to have? I asked developers to push back their deadlines because they always miss them and you wrote an essay about a bunch of shit that is completely unrelated to me just to jerk off the developers.
u dum.
[–]DeedayFace 1ポイント2ポイント3ポイント 38分前 (9子コメント)
Have you really not heard the phrase "you've got nothing" before?
Also, that actually had everything to do with you. When you cried about how people regularly disagree with your opinions
there is no room for developer criticism on this subreddit
I assumed that meant you regularly run into people who disagree with your opinions and instead of rethinking them or admitting that people can think different things you get all defensive and go "well everyone here just hates criticism" in an attempt to convince yourself that the people who disagree are inferior.
[–]Dregoran 0ポイント1ポイント2ポイント 1時間前 (1子コメント)
I'm saying you can't estimate how many errors there will be because it's not the same thing every time like taking a walk is. So the only option would be to not estimate at all, or over shoot it by a week or two just to be safe. I'm not trying to take away your opinion or say you aren't allowed to be frustrated. Just trying to point out the other side of things. Not trying to be hostile if it came across that way =).
[–]LommyGreenhands -4ポイント-3ポイント-2ポイント 1時間前 (0子コメント)
I'm not trying to be hostile to you either, and I certainly didnt want to attract the circle jerk mob, hence all of the "devs are awesome" I added into my OP.
So the only option would be to not estimate at all, or over shoot it by a week or two just to be safe.
The thing is, every major patch is 2 days late. Its not like we are looking at all of these random numbers and having trouble to make sense of the data. When they announce a major patch, we know it will be between 24 and 48 hours late. There is very little guess work to be done. Logic says that if you are constantly 48 hours late you should push your deadline back 48 hours to begin with.
[–]Arsenic_Touchcorelegion.org -2ポイント-1ポイント0ポイント 1時間前* (1子コメント)
You're not allowed to criticize the developers at all according to some people in this subreddit. Either because they update so often that makes them exempt from never meeting a time table or because it's early access so shit happens. Continue to voice your displeasure and ignore the white knights trying to antagonize you, you have every right to complain when the developers are doing something wrong regardless of what they're doing right.
see? they're already downvoting. Thanks for proving my point.
[–]LommyGreenhands 0ポイント1ポイント2ポイント 1時間前 (0子コメント)
Its insane man. My post compliments the developers and offers them the ability to be better received by the community and that is still seen as a negative.
[–]NukeLaCoog 1ポイント2ポイント3ポイント 1時間前 (4子コメント)
I look at those scenarios a different way. A team scores 100 points 100 games in a row then they estimate they will score 500, I do not expect them to reach that mark. If someone has a 10 minute walk every day and they estimate it will take 3 then I know not to expect it.
Wildcard nails ETA's less than 10% of the time, therefore I never expect to see a patch delivered within 12-24 hours of the target. I can't make them change the way they do things so I just have to manage my own expectations. To most, ETA means Estimated Time of Arrival....to me it means Earliest Time Available.
[–]LommyGreenhands -1ポイント0ポイント1ポイント 1時間前 (3子コメント)
I can't make them change the way they do things so I just have to manage my own expectations.
Wouldnt it make more sense and be way more logical for the company who is making up the deadline in the first place to just be more accurate? I mean I get what youre saying but the idea that they are incapable of extending their deadlines BEFORE failing to meet them is just insane. It follows no logic.
Thats like planning your walk to work to include walking past heated doorways to stay warm instead of just wearing a coat.
[–]NukeLaCoog 1ポイント2ポイント3ポイント 41分前 (2子コメント)
Sure, it would be great if they did that. You, me and everyone else has no control over that. They have already explained this multiple times. Their ETA is when they hope to get it out and that will not change. They will continue to miss that target (not a deadline). You can use "logic" to take responsibility for your own happiness or you can bash your head against a wall demanding that they conform to your logic and make you happy.
[–]LommyGreenhands -3ポイント-2ポイント-1ポイント 38分前 (1子コメント)
Its not conforming to "my logic." It is just logical. For everyone. It just makes sense. The only thing making me bash my head against the wall, truly, is how hard this is for you guys to grasp.
The idea that they are making a target in order to miss it on purpose is just dumb. There is no other way to explain that, and I highly doubt you could find a developer quote saying that they intentionally make their deadlines too short to achieve.
[–]NukeLaCoog 1ポイント2ポイント3ポイント 20分前 (0子コメント)
I dont know why it is too hard for you to grasp. They aren't getting it out at the earliest time they hoped to. If you have paid attention to the patch notes over the last few months, every time they miss these targets the patch notes grow. Whether it is them adding more stuff or fixing bugs. Take the current one for example. Their target was Friday. They had 6 items on that list and it has now merged with the intended 215.5 and there are an additional 10 items.
I don't know where you got the idea they set targets to miss them on purpose, maybe you didnt understand me. They set their ETA's with a goal to hit them. My experience says they rarely hit them, but they stated they will not stop aggressive targets and they will not stop giving us ETA's.
I don't like it, but I have learned to deal with it. It is a heck of a lot better than complaining about it on forums and getting frustrated with people who don't feel the way I do.
[–]A_Quiet_LurkerDream game achieved 3ポイント4ポイント5ポイント 1時間前 (25子コメント)
A lot of things can happen to delay something, coding is no exception. The ETAs for the patches are when the devs think they will be able to push out the patch. Maybe they found a bug, maybe there's something with the new codes that doesn't work well with the live game.
Taking your walk to the store example, what if the road you normally take was blocked off for construction? What if you forgot your wallet?
[–]LommyGreenhands -4ポイント-3ポイント-2ポイント 1時間前 (24子コメント)
I feel like you guys are missing the point here. The answer to your questions is, it would take longer than I planned for. BUT WE ARE PAST THAT POINT. They forgot their wallets 10 times and the road was blocked 10 times. Now we are to the point where more often than not the road is blocked and we dont have a wallet. Why not start planning for that?
I'm not even being unrealistic and asking for it to be done. I'm not asking them to avoid the construction or to remember their wallet. I'm asking them to consider the fact that they always forget their wallet and there is always construction.
[–]Peach774 2ポイント3ポイント4ポイント 31分前 (1子コメント)
Dude, this update is the biggest ever. They are adding more creatures at once than any other update, they are adding not one, but two new biomes and they are adding tons of other things. They attempted to get it out by friday, they said it is gonna come out today, which is still sunday. I'll wait as long as it takes, if you want a crashy broken version than you are playing the wrong game, the devs aren't stupid.
[–]Kingsgirl 1ポイント2ポイント3ポイント 39分前 (11子コメント)
Nubsly was offline for less than 5 hours last night dude. He's not even a coder - you think they're not working crazy overtime right now? They probably are giving themselves more and more time (longer estimates) each go around, but the longer something looks like it will be delayed, the longer hours they work, the more likely they are to make mistakes which when found will add even more time to the release. How do you not get that? I only code tiny stuff for fun and holy jesus, finding bugs in the code is hell. Now, going through millions of lines of code? Realising your new script actually broke super important physics from the earliest parts of the game? Dang dude, there's a lot and their best estimates keep falling short of the time they will need. Also keep in mind that this is Wildcard's first game, so all of this is new to them. They aren't some seasoned and gleaming mechanical monstrosity turning out soccer manager game after soccer manager game.
[–]LommyGreenhands -3ポイント-2ポイント-1ポイント 36分前 (10子コメント)
Honestly how dumb do you have to be to pull that from my post? I am literally asking nothing other than for them to change the way that they make deadlines. You guys make my brain hurt.
[–]Kingsgirl 0ポイント1ポイント2ポイント 30分前 (9子コメント)
No, all you keep saying is "YOUR ETA IS NEVER RIGHT SO MAKE IT LONGER" which is LIKELY what they are doing, but still falling short because
[–]LommyGreenhands -4ポイント-3ポイント-2ポイント 27分前 (8子コメント)
You are honestly challenged if you think I'm asking them to "release things on my schedule." Holy shit. Learn to read.
[–]Kingsgirl 0ポイント1ポイント2ポイント 21分前 (7子コメント)
wtf was I supposed to have? I asked developers to push back their deadlines because they always miss them
You are asking for them to stick to arbitrary deadlines, so yes. It is you asking for releases to happen on your schedule.
[–]Heavierthanmetal 0ポイント1ポイント2ポイント 38分前* (9子コメント)
Have you ever tried to code something with even one hundredth of the complexity that adding a boatload of content to a live game with thousands of players entails? It's not exactly comparable to a basketball game or forgetting a wallet. Its more like areospace engineering- no, really- Every new feature must sync and smoothly interface with every existing feature in every way possible to not impinge the current gaming experience.
Every new feature or even bugfix has a hundred considerations that may not become apparent until something breaks. On top of that players will find exceptions to each scenario that is tested due to the emergent behavior of so many interacting systems inherent in a game with such an open ended user experience. When a bug is identified then the goal becomes finding why and fixing it completely and quickly without breaking something else. On a weekend. The fluid experience of a game is an illusion that belies a vast complexity of interacting systems. Like adding a new wing to an airplane while its flying or working on a car's engine while driving it! Give the challenges facing the devs some respect! They are scrambling around the clock to make some complicated magic from scratch for the 30 dollars you sent them weeks ago.
[–]LommyGreenhands -4ポイント-3ポイント-2ポイント 38分前 (8子コメント)
Totally, so why not give yourself some more time? Holy fuck you guys have trouble reading.
[–]Heavierthanmetal 0ポイント1ポイント2ポイント 22分前* (7子コメント)
Youre saying why dont they give themselves more time on their ETAs. I read that and I'm saying that it's really hard to make a correct estimate on this stuff because its harder than you think. For example, say you add 5 more days to the estimate and get deeper into checking it and now you're essentially performing next weeks bugfixes while people whine about no new content updates. It's a balancing act- Take too long and people lose interest. Do it too fast and big bugs emerge. Not to mention the whole time new bugs are found. Because the situation is always evolving, its hard to estimate it accurately. That is how software engineering always works man.
[–]LommyGreenhands -3ポイント-2ポイント-1ポイント 16分前 (6子コメント)
They miss by 2 days every time. Honestly at this point it is insulting to both of our intelligence for anyone to say that it is hard to make a correct estimate. Holy shit you guys live with blinders on.
[–]Heavierthanmetal 1ポイント2ポイント3ポイント 15分前 (5子コメント)
Okay now youre just being a little bitch, getting personal and whiney.
[–]arcanix93 1ポイント2ポイント3ポイント 1時間前 (12子コメント)
Or you could just shut up and wait for the patch to hit when it hits or does your life revolve around this game? Go outside for a while, then come back and if the patch isn't out go outside again.
[+]LommyGreenhands スコアが基準値未満のコメント-13ポイント-12ポイント-11ポイント 1時間前 (11子コメント)
Man, what a douchey and uneducated way to come into a conversation where you're trying to prove the other person "lacks a life". I hope your day gets better.
[–]arcanix93 -2ポイント-1ポイント0ポイント 1時間前 (10子コメント)
I'm sorry that i'm sick of you crybabies. I'm sure the devs do their best, so you could act like the educated and "non-douche" one and move away for a while and wait for the patch to hit.
[+]LommyGreenhands スコアが基準値未満のコメント-8ポイント-7ポイント-6ポイント 1時間前 (9子コメント)
You don't have to apologize, just take a step back and realize that:
On sunday afternoon, youre sitting at your computer complaining about the conversation topics that other people on the internet choose. In order to convey your distaste for their conversation, you lash out and tell them they are no life losers. While you sit at your computer and complain about their conversation choices. On a Sunday afternoon. While calling them names and telling them to go outside. On a Sunday afternoon.
Try to examine that from a non personal standpoint for a minute and youll probably see what I see.
[–]arcanix93 -2ポイント-1ポイント0ポイント 1時間前 (8子コメント)
I think you need to take a step back and realize that this isn't a deadline. The devs don't own you to be on time or to post the perfect ETA and always or ever respect them. They do a lot more than most of the devs that work on games(especially the early access ones) and when you come out crying about them being late, i have a hard time taking you seriously.
Btw, i doubt that i called you anything, but you're adorable. Move along Gandhi. I'll take a look at my life tomorrow.
[+]LommyGreenhands スコアが基準値未満のコメント-10ポイント-9ポイント-8ポイント 1時間前 (7子コメント)
Youre too young to try to argue man. You'll see what I mean in a few years.
[–]arcanix93 -2ポイント-1ポイント0ポイント 1時間前 (6子コメント)
haha ok Gandhi... adorable
π Rendered by PID 32638 on app-01 at 2015-09-27 20:27:34.014476+00:00 running 72eab47 country code: JP.
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