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A Potentially...Weird...QuestionOmni Advice (self.vegetarian)

-Admiral_Piett- が 投稿

I was vegetarian for 5 years and vegan for 1.5, but I became chronically ill and got anemia from said illness, as well as problems with other vitamins and protein and such. The doctors quite literally explained to me that if I wouldn't eat meat with iron as well as fish, I would make myself REALLY ill. After seeing my bloodwork (despite being with multiple dietitians who were guiding me with my vegetarianism), I realized that I had to choose. I felt awful, but I had to choose to start eating meat again.

I am still grappling with the guilt etc, though. So I was wondering if anyone had some good tips for continuing this humanely, as well as living the rest of my life humanely. I want to eliminate any other products or things that may be hurting animals. I already don't use animal tested products and get beef/chicken/fish raised in humane ways, I never leave leftovers of meat, I don't support companies that I know have animal cruelty, but I am worried that I may just be missing some things.

So if anyone has any tips, I'd be very appreciative. :)

Thanks! :)

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[–]munkijuice 7ポイント8ポイント  (4子コメント)

There's a woman where I live (N. Ireland) who connects consumers with ethically and locally produced foods. It's great and you can put in a monthly order for all kinds of food like cheeses, honey, fruit and veg (and meat and chicken etc., but I pay less attention to these as I am veggie) and then go pick up your box of treats, safe in the knowledge that it complies with my ethics. I wonder if you can find anything similar where you are?

[–]JasmineAllen 1ポイント2ポイント  (3子コメント)

Please tell me more!

[–]munkijuice 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Here, check it out sure: http://www.belfastfoodnetwork.org/portfolio-item/rita-wild/

[–]JasmineAllen 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Thank you, looks awesome. I'll remember to give the honey a try!

[–]munkijuice 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

P.S. I think it's a fantastic business model, and we're so lucky to have Rita, but maybe other places could/do similar? Her local honey changed my world.

[–]Hellishnoobvegan 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

Sorry, you must have tried everything, but if you don't mind, tell me more.

What supplements were you taking? What kind of food you usually ate when you were vegan? Do you drink tea or coffee during meals? What is the actual name of your illness?

[–]Elliotrosemary 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well avoiding dairy and eggs is a great way to reduce animal suffering. I'm not sure what to tell ya as far as buying meat, I would contact the farms themselves to ask specific questions that you're concerned with, but as far as I know, the most humanely and environmentally friendly meat is going to be around 20$ per lb. And can't be bought at most stores. But honestly the thing I would do in this situation is cut out dairy.

[–]Cerealcommavegetarian 10+ years 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

See if raising your own is an option. If you have an appropriately sized yard and there's no zoning restrictions, you can probably raise your own pig, steers, goats, chickens, or combination thereof. You can slaughter them yourself or probably find a butcher who could do this for you.

[–]Re_Re_Think 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

So I was wondering if anyone had some good tips for continuing this humanely, as well as living the rest of my life humanely. I want to eliminate any other products or things that may be hurting animals.

If it is feasible with your medical condition, still try to avoid eggs, poultry, and seafood when possible, as their production/harvest likely has the highest amount of killing/calorie provided.

There is a controversial possible exception to seafood, which is mussels and oysters.

Both are high in iron, cause relatively little environmental damage (because a large portion are farmed, rather than caught), and may possibly be among the only multicellular animals not able to sense pain.

Of course, overconsumption of anything can be bad, so understand as well that they can have relatively high cholesterol and heavy metal (in polluted areas) content.

[–]intangiblemango 4ポイント5ポイント  (2子コメント)

I am sort of nervous about posting this because I am not a vegetarian and I am about to give advice on buying meat on a vegetarian subreddit, but:

Do you have a local butcher? You can go in, talk to them, find out their suppliers, and tour their facilities. This may depend on where you live, but where I am, things I can buy from the butcher are all within a few hours of my home and I have only gotten enthusiastic agreement from local farmers when I wanted to check out their farms. At the grocery store, I can't track down the person who raised the animal I am eating. I don't know what life it lived--presumably a bad one. At my butcher, I can. It's a lot of work and it is expensive as shit, but where I live, at least, it's totally doable (if you have time and means). And, of course, you end up eating relatively little amounts of meat because everything is like a gazillion dollars a pound. (Although I assume you are already eating as little meat as possible while maintaining your health!) I want to do something similar with dairy and eggs but must confess that I haven't gotten there yet. (I did contact a local dairy who agreed to let me tour but they are three hours away and I haven't made time to visit yet...)

[–]cynicalfly 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

If you're on Long Island, NY USA and need eggs, I can help you out with that.

[–]GuineaPigOverlord 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Another option is a local farmers market. I've befriended some farmers there who raise their animals humanely and try to minimize the environmental issues. All the animals are free ranged and they rotate fields for the different animals, usually only feeding grains etc in winter. The price is obviously more than a grocery store but it's way better for the animals and the earth. And if consumed in the minimum quantities it shouldn't be that expensive.

One farmer even told me she didn't know for a long time there were other ways people raised animals (ie. Factory farms). And some farmers will cut you a deal! (I was buying some meat for my raw fed dog and cat and she gave me a huge discount, I didn't even ask).

Plus, at farmers markets you can find all kinds of fresh,local, inexpensive produce!

[–]whispers21vegetarian 4ポイント5ポイント  (22子コメント)

I would suggest only eating wild game. There is nothing humane about farm animals.

[–]Sparkykc124 3ポイント4ポイント  (21子コメント)

I'm curious why you'd say that. My mom has raised a couple steers for meat, they seemed very happy and she treated them well. Yes, they still must be killed and at a young age but so must game. I'm not sure how she was able to do it, one of the reasons I stopped eating meat was because I realized that I wasn't willing to take a life for food.

[–]whispers21vegetarian 2ポイント3ポイント  (20子コメント)

Because there is a difference in raising something for the explicit reason of killing it and hunting your own meat. I hate to compare animals to humans, but let's put it this way: Which is sicker? The serial killer who picks off random people on the street or the one who keeps them locked in the basement, dresses them up, brushes their hair, and holds conversations with them and then murders them?

Added: I'm sure your mom is a very nice lady, but that is basically the same argument for why people wanted to keep their slaves before the Civil War. Because they were humane slave owners, whose slaves were always happy.

[–]iheartdewey 2ポイント3ポイント  (7子コメント)

Keeping a human locked up in a cellar and psychologically torturing it is nowhere near as bad as raising a few cows on a small farm. When I was a child were hand reared an orphaned calf. He lived on our farm for years before dying of natural causes. He was well cared for and seemed happy. My parents still raise cows. They have about a dozen of them on their 30 acre farm. I keep chickens on my little farm too. I feed them and dote on them and have no intention of ever eating one, just collecting the eggs. I don't think that makes me as bad as Buffalo Bill. I agree 100% that factory farms aren't humane, but small farms where the animals are well cared for are great.

[–]whispers21vegetarian -2ポイント-1ポイント  (6子コメント)

Yeah, I'm going to go back to my slavery comment on this one. You are keeping creatures generally against their will. What, they have the right not to be killed but not the right to be free? That seems like a half baked philosophy to me.

[–]iheartdewey 0ポイント1ポイント  (5子コメント)

TIL I'm literally as bad as slave owners in the old south for having free range chickens.

[–]whispers21vegetarian -2ポイント-1ポイント  (4子コメント)

That isn't what I said. I'm trying to make a comparison that you would be able to understand. Instead of giving it some thought, though, you've decided to form ridiculous conclusions from my comment. Probably because you are now insecure about your ownership of other living beings and are immature with your convictions, therefore acting out in fear.

[–]iheartdewey 2ポイント3ポイント  (3子コメント)

I'm not insecure at all. And frankly I find it offensive and a slap in the face to descendants of slavery that you're making light of their ancestor's struggles by comparing the two.

[–]whispers21vegetarian 0ポイント1ポイント  (2子コメント)

Would you compare killing animals to murder?

[–]iheartdewey [スコア非表示]  (1子コメント)

No, I wouldn't. Same as I wouldn't call a cat killing a mouse murder either. Torture or cruelty? Maybe. It depends on the situation and how the animals were raised and killed. Humans are part of the food chain just like any other animal. The only difference is that most humans can lead perfectly normal healthy lives without consuming meat. There are exceptions though, like in OP's case. He can't live without meat, but he can at least make sure the meat he gets is as ethically produced as possible.

[–]Sparkykc124 4ポイント5ポイント  (11子コメント)

I don't agree with your comparison. The steers she raised were not locked up in a basement, though they were contained, and they were treated just like any rescue animal would be, or my pets for that matter. On the other hand, when you are hunting you are potentially sentencing the young offspring of your prey to death.

[–]whispers21vegetarian 2ポイント3ポイント  (10子コメント)

Well, I would argue that rescue animals and your pets are not nearly as happy as they would be in their natural habitat-- Or, for the instance of domesticated animals, not existing at all. The only exception to this rule are dogs.

[–]Sparkykc124 2ポイント3ポイント  (9子コメント)

Why dogs?

[–]whispers21vegetarian 2ポイント3ポイント  (8子コメント)

Dogs have evolved specifically as companions for humans. It is a very strange thing. They are actually happier living with humans than without. Which isn't something that you can say for any other animal.

[–]Sparkykc124 5ポイント6ポイント  (7子コメント)

Dogs have evolved specifically as companions for humans.

They have been bred that way, like most domesticated animals. If they have been bred for work they are happiest working, companionship included. Many breeds of dogs would likely not survive in the wild, the same could be said for most domesticated animals. I guess you have to draw a line somewhere. Happiness? I would guess that my SO's cat is much happier in her care than being in the wild, that could be said for many domesticated animals not raised for meat, including chickens and horses.

[–]whispers21vegetarian -3ポイント-2ポイント  (6子コメント)

There is a different relationship between humans and dogs and humans and other animals. For instance, your SO's cat would most definitely be better off in the wild. Cats don't do well in captivity, despite the 'fact' that we have domesticated them. Horses, as well, do much better in the wild. Chickens are about as stupid as stupid gets, so who knows if they understand the difference between being fenced in or not. You are right, dogs would not survive in the wild. Like I said, they are the exception to the rule. But don't make the mistake of believing that just because something wouldn't be able to survive without human intervention makes it okay for humans to intervene. Death/extinction is not the worst thing that can happen to a creature/species.

[–]iheartdewey 2ポイント3ポイント  (5子コメント)

Do you have any sources to back up your claims about cats being better off in the wild? Domesticated cats live longer and healthier lives than their feral counterparts.

[–]LivingInTheVoid 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

Why can't you take iron supplements instead of eating meat?

[–]Cerealcommavegetarian 10+ years 4ポイント5ポイント  (1子コメント)

Anemia with high ferritin - iron supplements could make it worse.

[–]TRIGMILLION 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

I've had anemia. I was told to take the iron supplements but they made me feel sick as hell. I ended up eating a ton of spinach and broccoli but that didn't do much. I added a couple cans of Ensure a day and that helped. Has a lot of iron but didn't cause the side effects.

[–]M4124124 -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

What exact disease do you have that you can't absorb plant iron? Have they checked that it is not another issue like internal bleeding?