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Naughty America's response to why Bitcoin subscriptions are 66% more expensive than Credit Cards... (i.imgur.com)

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[–]NimbleBodhi 176ポイント177ポイント  (22子コメント)

Ha! I suspect the real reason the credit card rates are lower is because they want to encourage that payment method since they can automatically charge you each month, which they wouldn't be able to do with Bitcoin.

[–]FaberfoX 63ポイント64ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yes, this is the real reason. That's why porn affiliate programs can pay you more than a month's fee for each subscriber you bring in. The most important metric for a site is the average retention, for decent sites this is between 2.5 and 3.5 months.

[–]CAPEREADER 21ポイント22ポイント  (1子コメント)

Good point! With Bitcoin no recurring billing, which is not what they want. They really hope you forget to cancel at the end of the month, so they can bill you again.

[–]idiotdidntdoit 6ポイント7ポイント  (0子コメント)

which is another reason i love bitcoin.

[–]dryg 13ポイント14ポイント  (1子コメント)

When MetArt started accepting litecoin they had a promotion in r/litecoin and answered some questions. They said preferred it over cards since the lack of transaction costs and no possibility of chargebacks. Though I don't know if their prices are any different.

[–]kisuka 2ポイント3ポイント  (4子コメント)

Coinbase has a recurring billing option though o.O we use it at www.fakku.net

[–]ed19 0ポイント1ポイント  (3子コメント)

How is that possible?

Unless specifically only coinbase users and not bitcoin users

[–]kinyutaka 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well it's a coinbase thing.

[–]kisuka 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

Specifically only Coinbase. It'll pull funds out of ur coinbase for the rebill, if it doesn't have funds it'll throw an error. after 3 errors it then cancels automatically / pauses it.

[–]dublbagn 13ポイント14ポイント  (8子コメント)

or...that accepting a "currency" that fluctuates so rapidly can greatly affect what you make.

[–]masterzman 33ポイント34ポイント  (4子コメント)

Not sure why someone would down vote instead of taking the time to respond to this statement. W/e its reddit.

Anyways, when it comes to merchant acceptance in the bitcoin realm, alot of merchant companies such as Bitpay actually 'cash out' your bitcoin at the time of sale at the current exchange rate. If you take a bitcoin payment worth $10, you see $10 cashed out into your bank account for that transaction. This is a very very common option.

[–]thordsvin -3ポイント-2ポイント  (2子コメント)

If you take a bitcoin payment worth $10, you see $10 cashed out into your bank account for that transaction.

Not anymore. They all charge fees now because they're all running out ActualMoneytm

[–]Brizon 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yes, Coinbase will charge you 1% transaction fees... after you make $1,000,000 in sales.

[–]protestor 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Hey, credit cards charge higher transaction fees.

[–]Zarutian 9ポイント10ポイント  (1子コメント)

humm... if it fluctuates steadily at say 50 Hz then would it be virtually stable?

[–]zcc0nonA 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

But if they are using an intermediary they get the cash value at the time everytime.

[–]Bitcoinopoly 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

We need to get payment channels working in order to do recurring transactions.

[–]PoliticalDissidents 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Some sites offer year round payments to make up for this though. A discount would work quite well in Bitcoin for long time because porn sites pay higher processing fees on credit cards than other sites due to higher charge back risk.

[–]Bit_to_the_future -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

So CC are kind of like the sketchy way to pay for porn. Wait one damn minute...the bitcoin CEO an main stream media need to know about this before bitcoin loses market share. #Economy'sofscalewillprevail

[–]oupin 18ポイント19ポイント  (4子コメント)

this business lives on recurring subscriptions - you offer a low monthly price and then automatically renew it forever.

You can't do the same with Bitcoin, users have to initiate the payment every month themselves - great for users, bad for the porn business. that's why you get a higher membership price.

[–]gynoplasty -1ポイント0ポイント  (3子コメント)

I think you can do that through coinbase.

[–]neonzzzzz 8ポイント9ポイント  (2子コメント)

That will mean "accepting Coinbase" not "accepting Bitcoin".

[–]gynoplasty 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

Last time I checked coinbase was an option for people who want to accept bitcoin payments. Just like bitpay or many other payment processors.

[–]i_can_get_you_a_toe 30ポイント31ポイント  (47子コメント)

Ask them why you're gonna get your porn from torrents from now on.

[–]A__Random__Stranger 28ポイント29ポイント  (0子コメント)

That would be a hilarious response to that asinine email

"Your material costs 100% less through torrents.

Thanks,

Your former revenue stream"

[–]rydan 1ポイント2ポイント  (33子コメント)

I'm going to steal your stuff because you charged me more to use bitcoin?

[–]_supert_ 12ポイント13ポイント  (13子コメント)

Fun fact: Porn is not copyrightable in Germany, as not a 'useful art'.

[–]incorrectlyapplied 4ポイント5ポイント  (1子コメント)

Any official German sources stating this?

[–]Halfhand84 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Any official German sources stating this?

No, they're all too busy fucking off camera.

[–]BlacknOrangeZ -3ポイント-2ポイント  (10子コメント)

You're in the wrong sub if you think it's ok to do something wrong just because an arbitrary law happens to permit it.

[–]XMooseThrowaway 7ポイント8ポイント  (4子コメント)

I'd say online piracy is morally ambiguous at worst.

[–]BlacknOrangeZ 0ポイント1ポイント  (3子コメント)

It's a little bit difficult. If someone creates digital content to market as their product, then I don't think you have any right to use that if you are unwilling or unable to pay the requested fee. You could definitely argue, however, that it gets a bit morally unclear when, due to geoblocking for example, a willing consumer is not permitted to transact with the creator. On one hand, the product is not for sale in the region, the seller hasn't really lost any potential income from that piracy and is probably completely unaware and unaffected. On the other, you've still gained from their creative endeavour and avoided paying them for that with the convenient excuse that you can't; what right do you have to profit from them against their will?

And though I was speaking in vague terms, I was replying to a specific example. If someone produces porn and distributes it freely as art, then fair enough. If someone produces porn as a marketable product, then I'm not sure you have any right to pretend that just because you live in Germany you can ignore their pricing, costs, and intellectual property rights to claim their product for "free" due to some arbitrary state categorisation of their product.

[–]Brizon 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'd assert that intellectual property has no real basis in reality and therefore people have no real claim to their creation besides in some made up capitalistic construct. I don't see the immorality here.

[–]theswapman 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

You're the one in the wrong sub, pal. Information and knowledge should be free and open to all.

and why don't you stop being such a humongous smug hypocrite talking about how unjust "arbitrary state laws" are and then citing

intellectual property rights

which are just arbitrary state laws, as a valid reason for copyright nazis to use state violence to coerce consumers

[–]BlacknOrangeZ 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

So how is a company that makes games supposed to survive?

How would we get Hollywood blockbusters if producers can't charge a dime for the film they've invested $50m to create?

Where is the incentive for Apple, for example, to create the iPhone if Chinese factories will simply copy the software onto their generic identical replica and openly market it for 1/10th the cost?

What would be the point of R&D in medicine, technology, science, entertainment, etc if there are a dozen competitors looking over your shoulder waiting for the moment you have a breakthrough so that they can benefit from your extremely expensive investment. Do you have any idea how quickly and completely that would destroy innovation in all of those industries?

If people make a porno to sell it, to cover their production costs and hopefully even profit, then they have every right to. It's their work, that's the deal, that's fair. If you want to view it, then pay the fee. If you don't want to view it, don't pay the fee; if you don't want to pay the fee, don't view it. If some 3rd party authority announces that all porn is now free, does that make it ok to benefit from that person's work without paying? What right does that authority have to make such a ruling?

Maybe I am in the wrong sub. I thought there was a significant proportion of libertarian/anarchocapitalist types here.

[–]Kaell311 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

I wasn't aware we had established the perfectly moral copyright laws. Tell me, which country if any had it right? And why are the others choosing to be morally wrong?

[–]Explodicle 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Since copyright is a moral right and not arbitrary itself, for how long is one entitled to it? Are only governments justified in doing something about it?

[–]lechango 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

You're in the wrong sub if you think it's wrong to do something just because an arbitrary law happens prohibit the sharing of certain bits and bytes.

[–]esterbrae 1ポイント2ポイント  (1子コメント)

You're in the wrong sub if you think it's not ok to do something good just because an arbitrary law happens to prevent it.

[–]BlacknOrangeZ -3ポイント-2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Agreed. If this was meant as a counter argument, you'll have to explain how.

[–]A__Random__Stranger 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Steal it? Is he going to break into their office and swipe their drives, or do you just not understand the difference between copyright infringement and theft?

[–]i_can_get_you_a_toe -4ポイント-3ポイント  (17子コメント)

Oy vey, a porn company will lose a few cents, it's gonna be the end of the world, let me get my fucking violin.

[–]ToroArrr -5ポイント-4ポイント  (0子コメント)

Torrents? What are you old? Its all about the pornhub

[–]brokedown 135ポイント136ポイント  (23子コメント)

If you're dumb enough to pay for porn, you're dumb enough to believe that answer.

[–]UnfilteredGuy 19ポイント20ポイント  (12子コメント)

Bitcoin is actually more expensive but only in the holistic sense - i.e. when you add up both buyers' + sellers' cost. But definitely not 66% more expensive.

Does anyone know who their bitcoin payment processor is?

[–]rydan 23ポイント24ポイント  (8子コメント)

Netteller would be my guess. They were charging 5% for bitcoin which coincidentally is 66% higher than 3%.

[–]elan96 10ポイント11ポイント  (7子コメント)

Neteller doesn't process bitcoin payments. They just allow you to deposit to your Neteller wallet with it.

Also, the card industry often charges porn companies closer to 5%

[–]Sexy_Saffron 17ポイント18ポイント  (6子コメント)

I pay closer to 20%, and that's a good deal compared to most :(

Source: I work in the adult industry.

[–]ultimatepoker 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

Do you split first use and second use of cards between different MIDs? Or do you leave that all to your PSP?

[–]Sexy_Saffron 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

I don't handle any of that myself, CCBill takes care of it :)

[–]ToroArrr -3ポイント-2ポイント  (3子コメント)

Still waiting on you to take a bbc in the ass

Edit: i got some bits ready for that :)

[–]Sexy_Saffron 4ポイント5ポイント  (2子コメント)

Sure thing, send me 21 million bitcoins and your wish will come true lol

[–]honey_pie 9ポイント10ポイント  (0子コメント)

I mean, if you had all 21 million they would be literally worthless.. sooo...

[–]ToroArrr 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

21 million satoshis!

[–]spappletrap 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

Seems like if you include the cost of learning how to deal with it, and the volatility, you can see why someone would charge extra. It's convenient and anonymous for you, but not a lot of companies want to mess with it.

[–]Explodicle 0ポイント1ポイント  (1子コメント)

BitPay/Coinbase eliminate both of those problems.

[–]python88 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

the highest quality porn i've ever had was a paid site; videobox, is there anything like that available for free? I don't like having to worry about dodging viruses while browsing..

[–]GrixM 7ポイント8ポイント  (1子コメント)

What an ignorant comment.

[–]dejayskrlx 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

You just try finding 180 degree 3d vr movies that are both free and good.

[–]kn33 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

But bruh. All the best VR porn is paid

[–]glidingclyde 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Someone has to pay the girls.

[–]PoliticalDissidents 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Batch videos of some fetishes are hard to find for free.

[–]olliec420[🍰] -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

right haha

[–]NiggaWeMadeItOhShit 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yes, because not paying people for their work is cool. 'Dumb people' are paying for your free shit, so at least show some decency.

[–]justarandomgeek 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

Per-transaction, their costs for bitcoin transactions may actually be higher because there are so many fewer of them, and they generate comparatively much more support work (answering these emails). Not 66% higher, but it wouldn't surprise me if it's 20% or so more expensive for them

[–]coinx-ltc 5ポイント6ポイント  (5子コメント)

Bitcoin has a problem with recurring payments. Merchants loose a lot of customers if they have to pay consciously every month (other than with automatic cc payments).

[–]Subtlequestion 7ポイント8ポイント  (1子コメント)

You mean merchants don't get to continually charge people for a service they're no longer using? I feel horrible for them...

[–]kynek99 2ポイント3ポイント  (1子コメント)

accept when the service is hacked and all user date including credit cards is publicly accessible.

Bitcoin is a push system, and that's a benefit.

There are multiple services online you can set automatic payments. Once everyone figure out how to use bitcoin, they will be more happy with in then credit cards.

[–]Zarutian 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

accept? you mean except?

[–]neonzzzzz 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

It's not a problem. It's one of the main features. From the customer's perspective. Push transaction vs Pull transaction.

[–]SundoshiNakatoto 9ポイント10ポイント  (3子コメント)

Like just a dumb support person?

In any case: Coinbase, bitpay, coinkite, etc PLEASE have your team talk to them.

[–]Northern-Boy 15ポイント16ポイント  (2子コメント)

BitPay just fired the person responsible for browbeating porn sites.

[–]Fruhmann 7ポイント8ポイント  (0子コメント)

No wonder. They're beating the wrong body part.

[–]paulmadore 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

lmao

[–]BigBlackHungGuy 9ポイント10ポイント  (2子コメント)

Bitcoin doesn't work for a "subscribe and forget" model.

How about charging a yearly fee or use a "buy credits" model?

[–]thefuture420 5ポイント6ポイント  (0子コメント)

Seems like a solid model. Bitcoin allows companies to charge users on a per use basis. They could sell movies for .$05 a piece. I'm sure a ton of people would be interested in that. Hell I might actually pay for a HQ movie every now and then if that was an option

[–]starboard_sighed 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

or what seems like the obvious solution to me: allow them to have a little wallet on the service's site that they can load up when they feel like it, and charge that wallet.

[–]GottlobFrege 9ポイント10ポイント  (2子コメント)

They might have had to hire an employee specifically to build and manage their bitcoin process. It is possible they aren't lying, guys.

[–]Helvetian616 9ポイント10ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yes, someone may have made this calculation, but it's stupid to try to recoup costs in this manner as it diminishes the chance of recouping these costs.

[–]mustyoshi 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Sshhh, don't use that kind of logic around these parts.

[–]nativeofspace 7ポイント8ポイント  (2子コメント)

Wait.. people actually pay for porn?

[–]shludvigsen 18ポイント19ポイント  (0子コメント)

Wait.. pornstars actually get paid?

[–]Brizon 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

One time I ever paid for porn was for VR porn with Bitcoin.

http://virtualrealporn.com/

[–]LukinLedbetter 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

Who the hell pays for porn anyway?

[–]AstarJoe 1ポイント2ポイント  (2子コメント)

What are they smoking because i want some.

[–]nativeofspace 4ポイント5ポイント  (0子コメント)

Well it's basically just weed but it costs 66% extra, leaves you feeling even more confused and with no weed.

[–]tasmanoide 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

They don't receive enough blood in their heads.

[–]A__Random__Stranger 3ポイント4ポイント  (1子コメント)

Paying for porn is like buying bottled water.

That said, what a bunch of stupid clowns.

[–]Matuas_D 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

no more porn from them then...

[–]futilerebel 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Um... no.

[–]fan92 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

ask to prepay for the year (or 6 mos) w/ btc, at the cred card price.

[–]bitsandmore 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Huh?

[–]CAPEREADER 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

How do you pay more using Bitcoin than a merchant account? WTF?

[–]mkoxbg 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

There was a service. Bit bucket or something like that. You would still have to chose to send your years worth (any anything you wanted to program it to do) of bitcoin there, then it would auto pay monthly.. Not sure if it adjusted with the exchange rate. You could also withdraw your funds anytime in the middle I think.

[–]CryptoEra -2ポイント-1ポイント  (2子コメント)

LOL, straight up liars. Gotta love that.

[–]qawsed123456 3ポイント4ポイント  (0子コメント)

It's actually very plausible that it costs more.

After all, you have to split the fixed costs and setup costs, not to mention the transaction costs with the small amount of bitcoin users on that site.

[–]A__Random__Stranger 2ポイント3ポイント  (0子コメント)

What do you expect from a company that specializes in ass-fucking?

[–]BigBlackHungGuy 0ポイント1ポイント  (0子コメント)

This may be a guess, but I'm not sure they're doing it right.

[–]88bigbanks -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

Time for round a million of actual businesses sharing their actual experience with accepting bitcoin then the bitcoin community claiming that couldn't be true.

[–]idiotdidntdoit -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Are you kidding me?! But hey... Naughty America here i come!