todayilearned 内の BigHastyTurtle によるリンク TIL certain Native American tribes recognized a third gender separate from male and female. A two-spirit is one who's body manifests both masculine and feminine spirits simultaneously. They were often male and married other males but they weren't seen as homosexual among their tribe.

[–]saynotobanning [スコア非表示]  (0子コメント)

Bullshit. Plenty of societies did (and still do...) permit exactly this.

Name one. What were their names? We know this didn't exist in major civilizations because their registries or legal wording doesn't allow for it. For example, in the west, a lot of things had to change to allow gay marriage. If gay marriage existed in other civilizations we would see bureaucratic evidence of it at the very least.

A few had no concept of it whatsoever, plenty considered them to be 'holy people' (and if you think that meant they were ostracized and lived away from the tribe, you are sorely mistaken in the case of any and all north american tribes I've ever heard of)

Yes, "holy people" aka shamans were people who were kept separate from the society.

Half bullshit. AFTER they were christianized? Yes. Before? Fuck no.

Yes. Before yes. Once again, it's mostly white people making a mockery of natives and exploiting natives and their history.

the greeks and romans were entire empires comprised of smaller cultures organized into city-states each of which had vastly different character from the other.

So which subculture were you referring to when you said "ancient rome"?

Take the sacred band of thebes and tell me with a straight face that this is not a variety of officially sanctioned gay relationship; neverminding the complex relationship between legionares and their boys that persisted for pretty much as long as the empire had an army.

So pedophilia is homosexuality to you?

The 'chinese' did not even exist during any of these time periods.

It existed but not as it's current form. So stop with your fucking nonsense. Or do you want to go specifically to individual dynasty? When people talk of chinese civilization, it's similar to people talking about european civilization.

i'm willing to bet if the most specific term you can come up with to describe a culture from that region is 'chinese' you

I'm well aware of chinese history, the multiple chinese ethnicitites, the many chinese dynasties, so on and so forth. Which do you want to talk about?

What a fucking idiot. Because I called out your deranged bullshit, you are now arguing about chinese history/ethnicities? Grow the fuck up you dipshit.

WTF 内の springinslicht によるリンク Just another Chinese elevator

[–]saynotobanning -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

When will these fucking chinese learn english? Nobody can read gibberish. Can someone translate that gibberish to english so that we can understand what is happening. Thanks.

ShitWehraboosSay 内の Sid_Burn によるリンク "Sad to say, the allies were just as bad as the axis."

[–]saynotobanning -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

Japanese fanaticism and extreme reluctance to surrender don't real.

They were reluctant to surrender because they didn't want to get tortured, mutilated and killed.

"According to Mark Johnston, "the killing of unarmed Japanese was common" and Australian command tried to put pressure on troops to actually take prisoners, but the troops proved reluctant.[84] When prisoners were indeed taken "it often proved difficult to prevent them from killing captured Japanese before they could be interrogated".[85] According to Johnston, as a consequence of this type of behavior; "Some Japanese soldiers were almost certainly deterred from surrendering to Australians""

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allied_war_crimes_during_World_War_II

If you knew that the racist enemy was going to torture, mutilate and kill you, would you surrender? Of course not.

Do you know who the "unsurrendering" japanese surrendered to? The soviets in the beginning of ww2. Amazing isn't it?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battles_of_Khalkhin_Gol

It's almost as if the enemy will not torture, butcher and kill you, they are willing to surrender.

Also, given that the Germans killed ~60% or so of their Soviet PoWs, a far higher rate than any other nation,

To be fair, the soviets killed as high or even higher percentage of german POWs during the war. It's just that the soviets got a huge number of POWs at the end which skews the percentage down. For example...

"The German 6th Army surrendered in the Battle of Stalingrad, 91,000 of the survivors became prisoners of war raising the number to 170,000[6] in early 1943. Weakened by malnutrition and ill-equipped for the Russian winter many froze to death in the months following capture at Stalingrad; only approximately 6,000 of them lived to be repatriated after the war"

164000 out of 170000 POWs at stalingrad. More than 96% were killed. It was simply extermination.

Edit: In other words, everybody was naughty. As as robert e lee so elequently said: "It is well that war is so terrible, otherwise we should grow too fond of it.".

ShitWehraboosSay 内の Sid_Burn によるリンク "Sad to say, the allies were just as bad as the axis."

[–]saynotobanning -3ポイント-2ポイント  (0子コメント)

"he West German government set up the Maschke Commission to investigate the fate of German POW in the war, in its report of 1974 they found that about 1.2 million German military personnel reported as missing more than likely died as POW, including 1.1 million in the USSR."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_prisoners_of_war_in_the_Soviet_Union

The soviet union had about 3X the population of germany. Meaning 1 million germans = 3 million soviets.

We can do this all day and you know what conclusion we will draw? Everybody was fucking evil. Lives goes on.

todayilearned 内の BigHastyTurtle によるリンク TIL certain Native American tribes recognized a third gender separate from male and female. A two-spirit is one who's body manifests both masculine and feminine spirits simultaneously. They were often male and married other males but they weren't seen as homosexual among their tribe.

[–]saynotobanning -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

It's hilarious and sad when ancient cultures were less dickish about things like that than we are today.

Ancient cultures were a bit more dickish than we are. For example, no society allowed gay marriage. As for OP's topic, these people were viewed as "hermaphrodites/freaks/etc" who were separated from indian society and had to live isolated lives as shaman/etc.

ancient Roman

Ancient rome wasn't too kind to homosexuals. Don't get your facts from reddit.

Native American

Native americans weren't too kind to homosexuals either. They were shunned from society and had to live away from society.

and many others not only had homosexuals, or a rough equivalent, but were fine with them.

Wrong again. The ancient greeks, romans, chinese and nobody in between would have been to fond of homosexuality and would never have conceived of things like gay marriage.

ShitWehraboosSay 内の Sid_Burn によるリンク "Sad to say, the allies were just as bad as the axis."

[–]saynotobanning -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

Is different than 'both sides were equally horrible in their treatment of POW's', which you were arguing.

Brutal is brutal. One wasn't any more brutal than the other. Who were the worst? The soviets? The germans? The americans? The japanese? Go read what happened and I challenged you to show why one was "worse" than the other. You keep saying one was worse without any definitive proof. You just presume one is worse because of your own biases. But the damage/brutality/depravity was shared equally, especially when it comes to the treatment of POWs.

Like claiming that 99% of all Japanese POW's were 'tortured or killed' lmfao.

It is hyperbole, but it's closer to it than you think. For example, take the mariana island campaign.

Japanese Strength: 71,000 67,000+ killed ( Notice how it is 67K+... meaning it could be very close to 71K )

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mariana_and_Palau_Islands_campaign

So in that island campaign, MORE than 94% of the japanese soldiers were killed. That percentage is due to a "no prisoner" policy against the japanese. In a major battle, the wounded and surrendering soldiers make up the vast majority of the casualties. This means that the wounded and surroundering japanese were simply killed. And that is just one battle campaign. There were countless such campaigns as we moved island by island over the pacific towards japan.

"When Japanese remains were repatriated from the Mariana Islands after the war, roughly 60 percent were missing their skulls."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allied_war_crimes_during_World_War_II

Do you know what 60% of 67,000+ is? In just that ONE campaign, TENS OF THOUSANDS of japanese soldiers were mutilated. Think about that.

But whatever. All I do is provide source after source and all you do is just bullshit and just make shit up.

I'm not say the japanese were saints. They did bad shit too. My point is that EVERYBODY did equally bad shit to the POWs. Okay?

ShitWehraboosSay 内の Sid_Burn によるリンク "Sad to say, the allies were just as bad as the axis."

[–]saynotobanning -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

I can't say I agree with you about much of anything

What is there to disagree with? Everything I said is sourced historical facts. WW2 was brutal and neither side treated their POWs well. This isn't controversial and it isn't a secret.

But that's neither here nor there. We have business to attend to and I am glad I have your support. I feel at home here. I feel like I belong. Lets make me a mod.

ShitWehraboosSay 内の Sid_Burn によるリンク "Sad to say, the allies were just as bad as the axis."

[–]saynotobanning -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Thanks for the support. So far you and my biggest supporter /u/elos_ are all I have. Maybe if we can bring a few more to team saynotobanning, we might put enough pressure on the powers-that-be to make me mod.

ShitWehraboosSay 内の Sid_Burn によるリンク "Sad to say, the allies were just as bad as the axis."

[–]saynotobanning -4ポイント-3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Wrong again, you said they were equally bad in their treatment of POW's.

Nope. Not wrong. I even copied and pasted my entire comment on this submission. I'm not allowed to link it but it's one of the top level comment. Enjoy.

And I was replying to "Glorious Nippon did nothing wrong". So if the nips treated the POWs poorly as I said they did, then they did something wrong and hence his comment was a lie. TADA.

Design 内の thename226 によるリンク Japan's ketchup and mustard game is on point! (Found in /r/food)

[–]saynotobanning 1ポイント2ポイント  (0子コメント)

Good for you, now fuck off while I load mine up with everything from sourkrout and onions to cheddar and chili.

sauerkraut. But yeah, that's how I do it. Put it all on there and top it with ketchup and mustard and it's heaven.

ShitWehraboosSay 内の Sid_Burn によるリンク "Sad to say, the allies were just as bad as the axis."

[–]saynotobanning -4ポイント-3ポイント  (0子コメント)

Can I be a mod here? Think I've found a subreddit I can call home.

ShitWehraboosSay 内の Sid_Burn によるリンク "Sad to say, the allies were just as bad as the axis."

[–]saynotobanning -9ポイント-8ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yes, this did happen. Somehow that makes the allies and axis equal. #Weharboologic

It makes them equal in the poor treatment of POWs... What a fucking retard.

ShitWehraboosSay 内の Sid_Burn によるリンク "Sad to say, the allies were just as bad as the axis."

[–]saynotobanning -17ポイント-16ポイント  (0子コメント)

Wrong again retard. I said the many jews died. But the propaganda of the "holocaust" was created much later. Okay?

Two separate things.

ShitWehraboosSay 内の Sid_Burn によるリンク "Sad to say, the allies were just as bad as the axis."

[–]saynotobanning -13ポイント-12ポイント  (0子コメント)

I'm here retard.

Glorious Nippon did nothing wrong, was forced into war by filthy Gajin.

Wrong again. I said the allies and axis were both BAD...

ShitWehraboosSay 内の Sid_Burn によるリンク "Sad to say, the allies were just as bad as the axis."

[–]saynotobanning -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

This is what I said. We were talking about the treatment of the POWs. If you are going to deny that millions of germans and japanese POWs were killed in soviet, american, allied camps, then so be it.

" Sad to say, the allies were just as bad as the axis.

Hundreds of thousands of german soldiers starved to death in allied camps after the war.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Other_Losses

Of course the germans fared far better than the japanese who were brutalized out of racial hatred.

"American soldiers in the Pacific often deliberately killed Japanese soldiers who had surrendered. According to Richard Aldrich, who has published a study of the diaries kept by United States and Australian soldiers, they sometimes massacred prisoners of war.[87] Dower states that in "many instances ... Japanese who did become prisoners were killed on the spot or en route to prison compounds."[72] According to Aldrich it was common practice for U.S. troops not to take prisoners"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allied_war_crimes_during_World_War_II

"But the Japanese wasn't dead. He had been wounded severely in the back and couldn't move his arms; otherwise he would have resisted to his last breath. The Japanese's mouth glowed with huge gold-crowned teeth, and his captor wanted them. He put the point of his kabar [combat knife] on the base of a tooth and hit the handle with the palm of his hand. Because the Japanese was kicking his feet and thrashing about, the knife point glanced off the tooth and sank deeply into the victim's mouth. The Marine cursed him and with a slash cut his cheeks open to each ear. He put his foot on the sufferer's lower jaw and tried again. Blood poured out of the soldier's mouth. He made a gurgling noise and thrashed wildly. I shouted, “Put the man out of his misery.” All I got for an answer was a cussing out. Another Marine ran up, put a bullet in the enemy soldier's brain, and ended his agony. The scavenger grumbled and continued extracting his prizes undisturbed.[8]"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_mutilation_of_Japanese_war_dead

The pacific war was the first truly racist/racial war. Pretty much every japanese who was wounded or surrendered were killed. The GIs would walk through the battlefield and search for wounded japanese to torture with bayonets or just use for target practice. Pretty brutal stuff.

But as robert e. lee said "It is well that war is so terrible, otherwise we should grow too fond of it.".

Edit: I love that I'm being downvoted for providing historically accurate and sourced information in a history subreddit. Stay retarded reddit....?

ShitWehraboosSay 内の Sid_Burn によるリンク "Sad to say, the allies were just as bad as the axis."

[–]saynotobanning -9ポイント-8ポイント  (0子コメント)

He's literally saying China is a European state.

No I'm not jackass.

Oh and we can't say the Wehrmacht exterminated Slavs because there are still Slavs.

So no slavs exist? That's news to me.

HistoryPorn 内の harshit_khanna によるリンク German Prisoners of War (POWs), as they watch a footage shot at a German concentration camp. Circa 1945 [1210x937]

[–]saynotobanning -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

Okay, what was Belgium then? or the invasion of France? Or the invasion of North Africa? Or the invasion of other parts of Eastern Europe? Or the invasion of China? Or the invasion of the Philippines? Or the invasion of Korea? Or the planned invasion of the UK? or the invasion of Norway?

What does you comment have to do with what you responded to? Are you insane?

Most unsubstantiated claims, which is your M-O after all

It's basic knowledge you dumb shit. After all, britain was a major world power and an island nation. Japan saw some similarities and chose britain to model itself after.

"During the 1870s and 1880s, the Imperial Japanese Navy remained an essentially coastal defense force, although the Meiji government continued to modernize it. Jho Sho Maru (soon renamed Ryūjō Maru) commissioned by Thomas Glover was launched at Aberdeen, Scotland on 27 March 1869. In 1870, an Imperial decree determined that Britain's Royal Navy should be the model for development, instead of the Netherlands.[26]"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imperial_Japanese_Navy#British_support_and_Influence

HistoryPorn 内の harshit_khanna によるリンク German Prisoners of War (POWs), as they watch a footage shot at a German concentration camp. Circa 1945 [1210x937]

[–]saynotobanning -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

No, you basically copies and pasted ONE portion of the article that conveniently supported your view and ignored everything else.

Are you this fucking stupid. That's how you support your fucking argument? Have you ever written a fucking term paper?

You are using others work to help you, not doing any critical thinking yourself.

I'm providing supporting EVIDENCE you dumb shit.

Holy shit you are too stupid to exist.

And it was at this point I stopped reading and reported you the mods, good day

" Dropping nukes on two civilian cities makes one arguably one of the most evil perpetrators of war crimes.

Arguable, unless every bombing of every city is now a war crime..."

You were responding DIRECTLY to the part about nukes moron.

Honestly, you are too stupid to exist.

Report for what? SOURCING my argument? Providing evidence? Responding DIRECTLY to your comments? Grow up you dumb shit.

HistoryPorn 内の harshit_khanna によるリンク German Prisoners of War (POWs), as they watch a footage shot at a German concentration camp. Circa 1945 [1210x937]

[–]saynotobanning -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Except for the part where the allies didn't actually precipitate any invasions

Once again. WW2 started in europe because german and the soviet union invaded poland together. Okay?

Way more than 1% were sent to camps

2%?

the Germans were never able to full implement their plans thanks to Allied invasions that fredd the people they were attempting to eradicate

Allied invasions many years later?

Boxer Rebellion? We're talking about World War 2 here...

Are we? You seem to bring up anything and everything...

Also, not sure calling an invasion of a peaceful city where Japanese soldiers raped and then bayoneted pregnant women in their bellies "tame" is really appropriate

Just shows what a monstrosity the boxer rebellion was. The british and french would corner pregnant chinese women and bet on the sex of the fetus and carve open the pregnant women to settle their bets. The japanese modeled themselves after the british after all...

HistoryPorn 内の harshit_khanna によるリンク German Prisoners of War (POWs), as they watch a footage shot at a German concentration camp. Circa 1945 [1210x937]

[–]saynotobanning -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

How is that an insult?

Are you this stupid?

It's not, I literally described what you did. I

No you didn't. You accused me of deliberately trying to pass off someone else's writings as my own. That's not what I did. You know it. I know it. That's why you tried to conveniently ignore it up until now. So stop with your fucking nonsense.

No, again, I accepted that AMericans did some pretty bad things, but not to the scale of the Germans or Japanese

We are talking about allies and axis. They all did pretty shitty things.

Sure

Finally you are starting to see the light.

Arguable, unless every bombing of every city is now a war crime...

Yes, nuking every city is a war crime. What a fucking idiot.

Convenient how you ignore it when the Germans and Japanese do this

No they didn't. They didn't firebomb to wipe out entire city populations. Feel free to point me to ONE incident where the japanese or germans intentionally firebombed and killed tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians?

Was it systematic? I find that doubtful.

The truth is in the pudding champ.

HistoryPorn 内の harshit_khanna によるリンク German Prisoners of War (POWs), as they watch a footage shot at a German concentration camp. Circa 1945 [1210x937]

[–]saynotobanning -2ポイント-1ポイント  (0子コメント)

Yes, the Russians invited the Germans in, no way that they purposeply planned and staged a military invasion named "Operation Barbarossa"

You said intentionally slaughtered. There is a difference between WAR and what you are talking about. After all, if an invasion = genocide, ONCE AGAIN, the allies are guilty of that as well...

The ethnic poles and slavs that were sent to concentration camps would like to have a word with you

And the 99% of poles and slavs that were not sent to the camps? What about them?

Also, the Rape of Nanking would like a word when the Poles and Slavs are finished

Yeah, the japanese weren't saints but nanking was pretty tame compared to the suppression of the boxer rebellion by western powers...

HistoryPorn 内の harshit_khanna によるリンク German Prisoners of War (POWs), as they watch a footage shot at a German concentration camp. Circa 1945 [1210x937]

[–]saynotobanning -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

That was the fucking end goal of the plan.

No it wasn't...

So 90% of Polish Jews being killed is not "Poles being exterminated"?

Nope.

Over 10 000 000 Soviet civilians being killed through deliberate policies of extermination like the Barbarossa Decree and Generalplan Ost aren't extermination?

Nope. No more ten 10 million germans being killed was genocide.

NO IT WASN'T. HOW ARE YOU GETTING THIS NUMBER? WHERE? WHAT IS YOUR SOURCE?

Simple. EVERY ASIAN country except for japan was under european/american domination. The battles in singapore, indochina, indonesia, manchuria, etc were battles against THE BRITISH, FRENCH, DUTCH, RUSSIANS. Okay?

Japan had 51 divisions. 27 were in China

And most of those were in MANCHURIA defending against the SOVIETS. And japan's navies were busy fighting the europeans/americans. Okay? The vast majority of the fighting was done against europeans/americans.

HistoryPorn 内の harshit_khanna によるリンク German Prisoners of War (POWs), as they watch a footage shot at a German concentration camp. Circa 1945 [1210x937]

[–]saynotobanning -1ポイント0ポイント  (0子コメント)

They were literally Wehrmacht doctrines that said that soldiers were not only allowed to but expected to execute POW's on the spot.

And yet the germans had millions of soviet pows...

That there would be no legal recourse for them committing war crimes against POW's.

Same thing for the allies. Do you know how many americans were prosecuted for torturing, murdering and mutilating the japanese? NONE.

The cognitive dissonance it would take to whine that I'm not talking about POW's in one sentence and then in the next whine about genocides 500 years earlier is astounding.

You are the one bringing in irrelevant topics. I'm just responding to it.

Please keep the discussion related to POW's since you're so hard set on that.

Once again retard. I'm responding DIRECTLY to your comments. YOUR COMMENTS.

Uh, the war with Russia was over in a couple of weeks...

The battle with russia over manchuria was going on for DECADES. Go read up on the first russo-japan war.

You know, the war that had almost the entirety of the Japanese ground force fighting in it from 1937 to 1945.

You mean china, a country that was carved into spheres of influence by western powers? Is that what you are talking about?

As you can see, China is not in Europe or a European state.

No shit. But somehow, the british owned hong kong. Are the british chinese? The dutch owned indonesia? Are the dutch asian? The french owned indochina? Are the french vietnamese? The british owned singapore, are the british asian? The british owned india, are the brits indian? So on and so forth.

That's the point retard, china isn't in europe. Why is europe in asia?